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60% of AOL's Profits Come From Misinformed Customers

satuon writes "Ken Auletta's big New Yorker piece on AOL (subscription only) this week revealed an interesting detail about the company's inner workings. According to Auletta, 80% of AOL's profits come from subscribers, and 75% of those subscribers are paying for something they don't actually need. According to Auletta: "The company still gets eighty percent of its profits from subscribers, many of whom are older people who have cable or DSL service but don't realize that they need not pay an additional twenty-five dollars a month to get online and check their e-mail. 'The dirty little secret,' a former AOL executive says, 'is that seventy-five percent of the people who subscribe to AOL's dial-up service don't need it.'"

33 of 301 comments (clear)

  1. My grandmother is one of them... by rwa2 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Who are the other two? And particularly the person who actually NEEDS AOL?

    We've tried, and she actually understands. But she's hooked on the "experience". Maybe she just likes some disembodied voice telling her that her internet is up or down.

    Well, maybe it will go away once she starts using a smartphone and starts uploading all her stuff into the cloud. That doesn't seem like a very compelling argument we have to make to her, though.

    1. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by vlm · · Score: 5, Insightful

      And particularly the person who actually NEEDS AOL?

      I was also bit mystified by the 25% actually needing it.

      It seems to be insurance.

      Can you absolutely 100% guarantee that your hotel or conference center will have a phone line to dial up and check your email etc when business traveling? Yeah, pretty much. Thats right up there with "having sheets" or "has HVAC" or "has electricity".

      Can you absolutely 100% guarantee that your hotel or conference center will have WORKING wifi? Well, err, ... um... Yeah maybe 90% but can you financially afford to take that chance for only $50/month to AOL?

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    2. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by T-Bone-T · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Some people live in the boonies and can only get dial-up. Wireless ISPs are moving in to many places now, though. I have relatives that live in the middle of nowhere and have internet options now that are at least as fast as I do in the big city.

    3. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by gmack · · Score: 5, Informative

      Don't forget that the people who you call to disconnect your service get payed a commission on every customer they get to stay and those people will say anything to get you to reconsider even if it's completely untrue. You might also want to keep in mind that their disconnection process was actually the subject of a lawsuit that involved the Attorney Generals of 48 states.

    4. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by Mousit · · Score: 4, Informative

      The worst part of all is she doesn't even have to lose her "experience" to get off dial-up.

      AOL has a FREE level of service under their "AOL for Broadband" setup, and you can convert existing dial-up accounts to it. I did this for my grandmother. She was on AOL Dial-up for years and years (she actually used it though, because in her area broadband was unavailable until late 2008). Finally DSL became available and she was happy to jump onto it (finally she could watch those videos the younger grandkids send). So I helped her convert her AOL Dial-up to a free AOL for Broadband account. She kept her e-mail address (and all the remotely stored e-mails), kept her links and shortcuts.

      In fact, she kept everything, because you can still use the AOL Client to connect to a AfB account. It just doesn't dial anymore, it merely connects to the account over your existing broadband.

      In effect, her "experience" literally did not change. She still loads up the AOL Client, and accesses everything through it. She lost nothing (the free AfB accounts do lose some services compared to paid, but nothing she used or was even aware of). The only difference is now she has 15x the speed of dial-up, and she pays $15/mo for it instead of $25.

      Plus I got her a wireless router so she can use her laptop away from the phone line, which to her was probably the most glorious thing of the whole change. :)

    5. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      Alright! I knew "Apropos-of-nothing-Ubuntu-post" Guy wouldn't let me down!

    6. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by sconeu · · Score: 4, Interesting

      A few years back, my mom got DSL. I told her to drop her paid AOL subscription and just use their free service. She asked me to call AOL and do it for her.

      I was prepared to spend an hour saying "please cancel the paid service" over and over and over.

      I was shocked. It took me 5 minutes on the phone. Then, when I wanted to call back to confirm something, an automated voice told me that the account was on the free service, and customer service would cost me -- did I want to continue?

      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
    7. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by roc97007 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yes but... there are less expensive options for dial-up than AOL. I think the point is that the people in question don't realize that all the "extras" they're paying for are available for free with any internet connection.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    8. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by bmo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The privacy issues with Facebook are similar to Usenet.

      You put it out there, and it's out there forever.

      If you treat Facebook like a webified Usenet or public listserv, you have no problems.

      0. My profile is nearly blank. The day of my birthday is there, but not the year. No address. No school. No work. Nothing identifying me.
      1. I don't use my real name. Facebook thinks I'm a Siberian Eagle Owl.
      2. I don't use any third party applications - if you take the time to read the privacy flags on the application, you quickly decide you don't want Farmville or whatever it is.
      3. I block all third party application notices sent from friend accounts on sight.
      4. I have the privacy settings to "friends only"
      5. I only "friend" meatspace friends. I'm not one of those people who build up armies of so-called friends because I need them for "Mafia Wars".

      That's it. And I enjoy it as a result. While Facebook mines my data for itself (I deep six the ads to 0.0.0.0 too), nothing else mines my data, unlike Usenet which is still trawled every day by spammer address harvesters and you can still find stuff by me from the mid '90s through DejaNews/GoogleGroups. If you don't know me on Facebook, you see nothing on it.

      And thus, the time sink nature of Facebook also goes away. I check it about the same amount as I check my mail. My time sink is IRC.

      So anyway, that's my Facebook Safety lecture. My policy seems to work well.

      I think that if everyone did as I do on Facebook, it would go dark.

      --
      BMO

    9. Re:My grandmother is one of them... by interkin3tic · · Score: 5, Funny

      Who are the other two? And particularly the person who actually NEEDS AOL?

      There's plenty of reason people would intentionally subscribe to AOL

      -Convinced that they are supporting America by paying to AOL
      -Own stock in Time Warner and want to make sure stories like these aren't "100% of people subscribing to AOL are doing so on accident"
      -Only buy newspapers 10 years too late and don't realize AOL isn't the current hottest thing
      -Collected 2 tons of the free subscription discs and are still coasting off of free trials
      -Like chatting online with other people who are equally dumb
      -Perfected a keylogger that spreads through AOL 12 years ago, too lazy to make a new one
      -One of the only online services that still supports windows 98, and why would I upgrade from windows 98?
      -Doing it "ironically"
      -Nostalgia
      -Free subscription to Time or some other magazine/news service that for some reason is still associated with AOL
      -Hipsters convinced it will eventually cycle back through to being the next big thing again, want to be able to say they were there before it was cool again
      -Schizophrenia

  2. Inertia by Craig+Maloney · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So, essentially the bottom line of AOL is bolstered by "inertia"? Is there a compelling reason why someone hasn't told the investors and / or the people getting bilked?

    1. Re:Inertia by Foobar+of+Borg · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So, essentially the bottom line of AOL is bolstered by "inertia"?

      Works for the RIAA. Actually, truth be told, this is how a lot of out-dated behemoths stay in business.

    2. Re:Inertia by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      > Yeah, right after we get rid of Microsoft, whom has the same business model.

      "Whom" is not a fancy way of saying "who." It has a grammatical part to play.

    3. Re:Inertia by tunapez · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I've told them until I am blue in the face!

      The AOLers cannot grasp the concept that they can retain their email addresses without paying for the unnecessary services. We've even downloaded their emails and contacts, opened IE and FF without AOL but they still don't believe. MSNers are no different. They are all the 60yo+ crowd who got online with the dial-up services and believe they still need these portals to get online with their Comcast/Cox/Qwest hi-speed. It doesn't help that the AOL operators outright lie to them about the necessity of the service.

      --
      Imagination drew in bold strokes, instantly serving hopes and fears, while knowledge advanced by slow increments...
    4. Re:Inertia by Hogwash+McFly · · Score: 3, Informative

      Many wet-shave hobbyists swear by traditional double-edged and straight razors, and use soaps or creams with shaving brushes as part of the process (Badger & Blade is a good resource for learning more). It helps to take your time and treat it as a pampering ritual to be savoured and and not a chore. Good preparation is part of it. I've just started using traditional soap pucks and a badger brush and it's made me look forward to shaving now, although the razor I received as a gift with the brush set takes only Mach3 heads so I'm yet to use a double-edged safety razor (I don't think I'd ever have the balls and patience for a straight). The Mach3 is a reasonable enough shave, but the refills are expensive and it's disingenous to think that Gillette can keep topping it and their current offerings forever. Will they reach a pinnacle cartridge and just stop, saying it is the best they can do and no razor will be perfect? I doubt it.

      --
      Mother, do you think they'll like this sig?
    5. Re:Inertia by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yeah! You tell whom!

  3. Debunked by maeka · · Score: 4, Informative
    1. Re:Debunked by timeOday · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That shows 43% of their revenues coming from subscriptions. The article says 80% of profits come from those revenues. Does the 10-Q you linked contradict that? I would guess the accounting rules for deciding which profits come from which revenues are complicated, since it seems like a nebulous question.

  4. Todo: Get your granny's AOL login by SchizoDuckie · · Score: 5, Informative
    Time for ./'ers to step in and save their grandparents some money:

    How to Cancel an AOL Dial-Up Service By Stacey Price, eHow Contributor
    Canceling your AOL account is a simple task that can be done over the phone or online. With the integration of AOL's free web-based email service, you can cancel your dial-up service and still enjoy some of their features by converting to a free AOL account if you have an Internet connection.
    Instructions
    Things You'll Need:
    • Account information
    • Answer to your security question
    • Phone number
    1. Go to http://bill.aol.com/
    2. Sign on with the primary screen name that you created when you registered your AOL account. Type the answer to your account security question and click "Continue."
    3. Click "Cancel my billing" in the right panel under the "I want to" heading.
    4. Click "How do I cancel my paid member account or convert it to a free member account" in the right panel, under "Frequently Asked Questions."
    5. Follow the on-screen instructions to send the cancellation request. It can be done through an electronic cancellation request online, by fax or mail.

    Tips & Warnings

    --
    Quack damn you!
    1. Re:Todo: Get your granny's AOL login by Capt.+Skinny · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I took cancellation calls as a customer service rep for a few months. Most of the time I sympathized with the customers who wanted to cancel and clearly would not be swayed by the scripted "save" offers I was required to make. But when customers started cursing or being rude, I was only too happy to continue with my script and take my time with it. And after speaking with some especially rude customers, I accidentally checked the "free-for-three-months-then-begin-charging-again" response instead of "cancel". Oops.

    2. Re:Todo: Get your granny's AOL login by Mandatory+Default · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You think that's pretty funny, don't you? I say it's pathetic and I hope your karma catches up to you in a big way. I talk to those AOL customers every day. Many of them are senior citizens. On average, they aren't well educated, and they don't have a lot of money. For some of them, $25 a month is a lot of money. So while you laugh your way to the bank with your paycheck, your health insurance, and all of the other benefits, remember that the people you are screwing are the ones that funded that paycheck, and the reason they are so angry in the first place is because of the way they've been treated by AOL customer service reps.

    3. Re:Todo: Get your granny's AOL login by kbolino · · Score: 4, Insightful

      He who pays the piper calls the tune.

      The employee is paid by AOL, not by AOL's customers; by preventing them from being able to cancel, he is in fact preserving the revenue that is necessary for his job to continue. Vicious cycle, and all that. Of course, this makes him a robot rather than a human, but I don't see you offering to provide him with an alternate source of income.

      [substitute the appropriate pronouns as you see fit should Capt. Skinny not be male]

  5. People are creatures of habit by Ritz_Just_Ritz · · Score: 3, Interesting

    It took me YEARS to wean most of my AOL using friends/relatives off of AOL. Once something winds up getting "automatically charged" on their credit card every month, a lot of folks are just too lazy to change. None of them were using any of AOL's "value added services" and it was just an email application for them. Most of them already had high speed internet from their cable company or a telco DSL line already. They're all using gmail now.

  6. Where are the lawyers? by pz · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Sounds like a class action lawsuit to me.

    No, I'm being serious. This is an abusive business practice. In financial circles, similar actions to intentionally mislead clients, especially elderly ones, especially by omission of whether a particular service is needed or not, is a very big deal and results in loss of license to the sales agent and potentially punitive action by the SEC to the employing firm. The scales of money are different, but the sleazy flavor is the same.

    --

    Put my fist through my alarm clock with its ding-dong death inside my ear. - The Blackjacks.
    1. Re:Where are the lawyers? by LibRT · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You must be kidding. If I sell you a screwdriver, am I under any sort of obligation to determine whether in fact you require a screwdriver, and if so, that the screwdriver you are considering purchasing is the appropriate one for your purposes??? And why "...especially elderly ones..."? Give your head a shake - adults can make their own decisions on how to spend their money, even when those decisions are not to your liking.

    2. Re:Where are the lawyers? by justinlee37 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This is more like if I come into your hardware store and say "I need to drive this nail into this board and I have a hammer, do I need anything else?" and you tell me that I need to buy a screwdriver and 10 lbs. of bark chips as well.

      Apparently some people have been calling AOL and asking if they still need a subscription after getting a new internet connection, and the operators are lying to them and saying they do. That sounds pretty sleazy to me.

  7. Same thing with earthlink by goombah99 · · Score: 5, Informative

    I found my mother was being billed $50/month by earthlink even though she had service through another ISP. The phone number earthlink claimed they were providing service to was not only in another area code but did not even exist in that area code. When I complained to earthlink that they had stolen thousands of dollars from her over the years they just said "Earrthlink is not a usage based service". Of course not, especially when they supply service to telephone numbers that don't exist.

    It get's worse. actually. I had canceled her service. but it turns out they called her back aftrwards and asked if she was unsatisfied and would she like to continue the service. They then told her that given her usage patterns they reccomended she buy extra space! Extra space on an account that she could not even use if she wanted to.

    Never got any money back. Thieves. Boycott Earthlink.

    --
    Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
    1. Re:Same thing with earthlink by hedwards · · Score: 4, Informative

      What you do in cases like that is report it to the Attorney General's office. While they can charge you whether or not you're using it, they can't generally charge you for something that you can't possibly use and definitely not without proving that it was signed up for by the party paying the bill.

    2. Re:Same thing with earthlink by Bryansix · · Score: 4, Informative

      Call the Attorney General for sure. But also call the credit card company and tell them the charge has been fraudulent the whole time. At least they will credit back the last month but possibly more.

  8. Re:If 75% of subscribers don't need it... by jcwayne · · Score: 5, Funny

    He'll be okay.

    --
    Failure to follow this advice may result in non-deterministic behavior.
  9. doesn't surprise me in the least by v1 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    seventy-five percent of the people who subscribe to AOL's dial-up service don't need it.

    Many dozens of times I've seen customers come in that are using AOL with their DSL. I don't see it so much with cable because the majority of people using AOL are using it because cable isn't available to them, they're too far from the city, but DSL is available and they've had it for years. Many of them signed up for their DSL (service by Qwest, formerly AT&T) through AOL and don't even realize it's not AOL providing it.

    So I ask them why they are still using AOL, and it quickly becomes apparent that they believe that AOL is the internet. I'm able to reason with some of them, but even a percentage of those still want to keep AOL because they're comfortable with it. Me personally, having to change my email address would be the big problem. But last I checked, AOL reduces your charges down to something like $9.99/month if you just want to keep email and not have the rest of their service such as dial-up. But even when I explain this to them, many are just not interested in it. Many years ago when I quit my dialup, I switched to my isp's "email only" plan for that same amount and kept it for about 6 months, and it made the transition to cable a lot smoother for me.

    I try to explain it to them, how using a local email app on your computer makes things like managing attachments so much easier, but a lot of these people just aren't interested in anything making their computer use unfamiliar again even if only for a brief time. They're in their secure zone and don't want to leave. Only just this year I finally got my next-door neighbor to drop AOL after showing her just how much easier it was to email photos from her new digital camera using a local email app.

    And I'll just toss it right out there - they're all old people Every last one of them. So eventually AOL's user-base is going to literally die off.

    --
    I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
  10. Inevitable When You Shrink By 90% by careysub · · Score: 4, Insightful

    AOL has claimed in the past that its subscriber base hit 30 million, this was probably somewhat exaggerated (rounding up a couple of million) but taking them at their word their subscriber base is now something like 3.3 million. Not quite 90% yet, but they have been losing at least half a million per quarter so we are only a couple of months out from that mark.

    Any mass auto-billing subscription service that is going to have some fraction of subscribers who are inappropriately signed up through ignorance or error. On your way down to zero again it is inevitable that you will reach the point where these are essentially your only remaining customers. Approaching the 90% decline point, AOL clearly reached that stage some time back.

    I await to see how AOL will arrange to screw their last few customers when the service is finally shut down.

    --
    Starships were meant to fly, Hands up and touch the sky - Nicky Minaj
  11. The Real News Here by monoqlith · · Score: 3, Funny

    AOL still makes profit.