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US Seeks Veto Powers Over New TLDs

suraj.sun writes "The Obama administration is quietly seeking the power for it and other governments to veto future top-level domain names, a move that raises questions about free expression, national sovereignty, and the role of states in shaping the future of the Internet. At stake is who will have authority over the next wave of suffixes to supplement the venerable .com, .org, and .net. At least 115 proposals are expected this year, including .car, .health, .nyc, .movie, and .web, and the application process could be finalized at a meeting in San Francisco next month."

29 of 220 comments (clear)

  1. Governments love power by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There is no surprise that Obama wants this power.

    It's just the thing they do. All governments and all people who lead them lust for power. Obama is no exception.

    Think about it: if you are a politician and aren't crazed with power-lust, you will be crushed by another politician who is. So we have a system where only the most maniacal, greedy, authoritarian-minded can get into power. Democracy? Ha.

    1. Re:Governments love power by sznupi · · Score: 3, Interesting

      People want their government to have power of pushing things... which said people want.

      In the submission, linked below TFS, there's a mention of efforts for ".gay" TLD - many groups in the society would just love to block it. And many nations (and why it didn't make it to /. story, anyway? ;p )

      --
      One that hath name thou can not otter
    2. Re:Governments love power by FuckingNickName · · Score: 2

      There is no surprise that a human wants this power.

      It's just the thing they do. All social groupings and all people who lead them lust for power. Obama is no exception.

      Think about it: if you are a member of a group and aren't crazed with power-lust, you will be crushed by another member who is. So we have a system where only the most maniacal, greedy, authoritarian-minded can get into power. Democracy? ...

      ...well, at least it exists for government. Its detractors will insist that people are stupid or misled, because they cannot stand facing up to the fact that - for the vast majority of people - what we have today is more than good enough.

    3. Re:Governments love power by WrongSizeGlass · · Score: 2

      As an American I'd like to defend this policy, um, but I can't. WTF? Hmm ... I wonder if we can get .gov to transition over to the newly proposed (as in right here, right now) .wtf TLD?

    4. Re:Governments love power by JackieBrown · · Score: 3, Interesting

      THIS is why the US is supposed to have separation of powers (federalism) between the Member States and the Union government, so no one maniac can become too powerful, but over time many of us have forgotten that basic principal

      The term "state rights" is unfortunately now invokes the American Civil War.

      We have seen this with health care, immigration, and numerous other issues. It is easier to scream racist than to actually deal with the issue or to even debate who should deal with the issue.

      The other problem is people live in the moment. Bush got a lot of flack for not sending the troops immediately during Katrina. They felt that he should have bypassed the governor who was moving to slow. All the people whining at the time did not bother to think of the implications of the Executive Branch deciding on its own to invade (sorry - assist with keeping order) a state. While it may have been a good idea at the time, the precedent it would have set would have been terrible (same with the patriot act - useful at the time but something we will never be rid of now.)

    5. Re:Governments love power by brainboyz · · Score: 2

      For some reason the idea of nsa.wtf makes me giggle.

    6. Re:Governments love power by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 5, Informative

      There is no surprise that Obama wants this power.

      Except, of course, the summary was completely wrong and it is a proposal to spread out power among more nations and provide a place for an international consensus as opposed to a power grab by a single person or government. Now don't you feel silly for having wasted a perfectly good "power corrupts" speech?

    7. Re:Governments love power by BetterSense · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I agree completely, and I wish people would catch onto this already.

      A corporation's only drive, and reason for existing, is to increase its profits. Any services, offers, or goods that a corporation provides to you, are only provided if it increases the profits of that corporation, never because the corporation wants to actually help you out. Corporations never, ever do anything because they like you, or because you are a nice person. If they say that they care about you, it's only so that they can maintain a good company image which again, leads to more profit for them. All dealings with a corporation have to be put in the perspective that there is only one thing that matters, ultimately...the bottom line. Failure to understand this makes you a sucker, and corporations love suckers.

      In a similar way, the main motivating factor of government is to increase its sphere and scope of its authority, power and influence. That's it. Everything it does, it does in the quest for more power and authority. Any supposed benefits to you only exist if they help the ultimate goal of increasing government's role in your life, and increasing the size, authority, scope, and power of the government. The government never, ever does anything because it likes your or wants to protect you the way your parents might, for example.

      I've heard smart but naive people puzzle over why the government maintains the current income tax system when it could switch out to any number of revenue-neutral taxation schemes that would be much more efficient. There is no need to be puzzled, though, the answer is obvious...the current system of taxation aids the government's ultimate goal of extending the scope of its authority and influence. I have heard smart but naive people wonder why the government doesn't cut taxes to help the economy instead of 'stimulus' efforts that go to special interests, when it's pretty clear that lower taxes stimulate an economy. There is no need to puzzle, though, if you simply have the proper perspective on government and what it is. I have heard smart but naive people puzzle endlessly over why marijuana is illegal even though it's relatively harmless. I have heard smart but naive people wonder why we don't use alternate voting systems that are provably more efficient. It doesn't matter the issue, right, left, any aspect of government all of a sudden makes sense once you realize that the status quo is the way it is because it causes an increase in the size, scope, and authority of the government.

      It seems that most adult people, at least all but the most naive, understand that corporations' main motivating factor is to increase profits; many of those same people haven't put the government in the same realistic perspective.

    8. Re:Governments love power by dieth · · Score: 2

      That would require that the all Americans pull there heads out of their ass, and then get a proper education, so you can wait eternally for that to happen, or just wait for when China wakes up and bitch slaps them into the dark ages.

    9. Re:Governments love power by sznupi · · Score: 2

      it would make it way too easy to filter out materials for the gay community

      How polite of them, isn't it?

      --
      One that hath name thou can not otter
    10. Re:Governments love power by Aryden · · Score: 2

      Apparently you do not actually know as much about "The War between the States" as you would like to think you do.

      1) Several northern states not only allowed slavery, but endorsed it to lower manufacturing costs.
      2) Slavery did not enter into the war as a political objective until Lincoln realized that France, England and Germany were assisting the southern states to the extent of nearly entering the war themselves. England, France and Germany were providing arms and munitions to the southern armies, along with advisors, and France was running the northern blockades to import supplies to them.
      3) The "State's Right's" issue was based on the fact that the southern states were selling tobacco, cotton and other trade goods to England and France, who were then reselling the goods back to the northern manufacturers at a marked up price. The northern manufacturers cried to the federal government to intercede and force the southern states to sell first to the north, which was less profitable. Thus they refused and threatened to withdraw from the union if the federal government tried to force them.
      4) The Emancipation Proclamation was issued in 1863, 2 years into the war, NOT at the onset as most think. The reasoning behind the Proclamation was not to persuade more Americans to side with the north, but to force Europe out of the war since slavery was anathema in western Europe. And it worked.

      It's thoroughly amazing how much people still do not know the correct versions of history. I have a very good friend from New York that moved here to Atlanta a few years ago. Until recently, he was under the impression that the south had started the war by invading the north and attempting to overthrow the government. This theory was backed up by one of his history books that he had from school. He was very surprised to learn that Robert E. Lee Sat on the border of D.C with the Army of Northern Virginia declining to invade D.C. in hopes that he could negotiate with the federal government to cease their aggression towards the Confederacy. He was also amazed to find out that, "That damn racist" as he termed Lee, was actually Lincoln's first choice to lead the armies of the north. Again he was amazed to find out that one of the reasons that the south was still behind the times in regards to infrastructure was due to huge swaths of the south being razed to the ground on Sherman's march to the sea.

  2. OpenNIC by ChasmCoder · · Score: 5, Interesting
  3. Re:Dear US Government, et. al. by The+Moof · · Score: 2

    You do not represent the interests of the world population

    They rarely represent the interests of their own population. Do you think they care?

  4. Re:Dear US Government, et. al. by wizkid · · Score: 2

    You do not represent the interests of the world population

    They rarely represent the interests of their own population. Do you think they care?

    But they always represent the corporations... Especially the ones padding there un-audited re-election campaigns.

    --
    I take no responsibility for what I say. Even though I'm never wrong :)
  5. Dear Mr. Obama by Gripp · · Score: 2, Insightful

    of all of the massively important/pressing issues, why are you putting so much energy into ruining one of the few things left that are actually free?

  6. Re:What?!? by croddy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Clearly someone needs to be in charge of new TLDs. I mean, seriously, we've got .jobs, .mobi, .museum, .aero, .info, .biz? For fuck's sake, when will this shit stop? My main concern with the plan here is that there's no way Obama is going to rule over TLD approvals with an iron fist. He's probably going to fucking allow some new TLDs. We need someone with some fucking balls, someone who will go through the whole goddamned queue and stamp DENIED. DENIED. DENIED. DENIED on the entire stack and then shit on it before delivering it back to the applicants.

    Seriously. We were fine with .com, .org, .net, .mil, .gov, .edu and a bunch of country codes. If you want a new TLD, it had better be a goddamn country code or I don't want to even hear you fucking talk about it. Take your stupid industry-specific vanity TLD bullshit and do us all a favor and shut your fucking hole. Forever.

  7. How about no new TLDs? by davidwr · · Score: 3, Interesting

    A "fairer" idea: Stop issuing new non-country/U.N. TLDs.
    Put everyone on notice that if they register a NEW 2nd-level non-country domain name now (foo.com) it will be revoked in 10 years. Give existing domain owners a little longer - say, 15-20 years - to retire existing domains. Reserve .com.us, .edu.us, etc. for anyone with an existing or new .com, .edu, etc. for the next 20 years.

    People won't like it but at least it will end the bickering.

    Now, as for new 2nd-level.us domains, the USA can do that without stepping on other countries sovereignty and they can make whatever.cc without stepping on America's.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
  8. Re:Wow... by SuricouRaven · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The social conservatives didn't think porn would go away if they opposed .xxx. They were just afraid of 'legitimising' it - .xxx would have created a place for porn, while the social conservatives held that porn should have no place at all.

  9. .crap by kelemvor4 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Hopefully my suggestion for a new .crap tld that can be forced upon websites without the owner's consent will be implemented.

  10. Why? by atomicthumbs · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Why do we need more TLDs? .museum, .name, .aero, .biz, etc. already seemed like they were pushing it.

    --
    http://pinopsida.com
    1. Re:Why? by Tom · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why do we need more TLDs?

      Because then you can sell all the same names again.

      --
      Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
  11. That is a false choice by SuperKendall · · Score: 2

    The increase in power of the state (with technical solutions to oppress dissent) was inevitable.

    That's where you are wrong. The increase of the power of the state is never inevitable, and can be pulled back. Tunisia has already done so.

    You don't need to go to those extremes though to pull back state power. In the case of the U.S. that means voting for people who want to cut the budget because the less money the government has, they less power they wield. It's why voting for people who believe in power being in the hands of the states is better than those wanting the federal government to run things, because the more locally power is concentrated the more obvious abuses will be.

    I agree with your assessment that the current direction is one of state + corporations running things. So take away federal power and the pairing will naturally dissolve. Few giant corporations can actually stand up under their own weight and bloat without being propped up by government, so we should let those companies unable to stand without public help die so that a new forest of companies can emerge from the ashes. Preserving the cycle of competition is far more important than preserving any one company.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:That is a false choice by SuperKendall · · Score: 2

      And who exactly is that?

      Rand Paul for one. Any Tea Party supported candidate would probably do as well (there are more than two of them). Some Democrats feel that way as well, since traditionally Democrats were not aligned with big business, that happened mostly in recent decades...

      If you honestly believe Tea Party candidates want to cut the budget (as in, cut the budget, period, end of story) then you are living in a fantasy world.

      Since they are actually proposing budget cuts and even debating raising the debt cap, I'm living the dream I guess.

      If you aren't willing to support someone who claims to want to do what you want, if you aren't willing to give those people a chance to prove they will do what they say they want to - then you'll never get anything you want. You are buying into the lies you have been told regarding the Tea Party, put forth by those that do not want to see a reduction in federal power.

      The fact is that a large majority of the U.S. wants spending cuts, yes even if it affects some services they use. If you have even a small number of people in the government dedicated to that task then they can have a disproportionate effect because the more wishy-washy politicians will be inclined to go along.

      If you don't thing true change is possible then go curl up in a corner and let the rest of us work it out. After all, as far as you are concerned nothing can go right anyway.

      --
      "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  12. Read TFA Carefully, Summary is Misleading by TheSpoom · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The Obama administration is proposing (PDF) that domain approval procedures be changed to include a mandatory "review" by an ICANN advisory panel comprised of representatives of roughly 100 nations. The process is open-ended, saying that any government "may raise an objection to a proposed (suffix) for any reason." Unless at least one other nation disagrees, the proposed new domain name "shall" be rejected.

    This would create an explicit governmental veto over new top-level domains. Under the procedures previously used in the creation of .biz, .name, and .info, among others, governments could offer advice, but the members of the ICANN board had the final decision.

    If you didn't already know, ICANN is under contract to the United States government. So Obama's policy would effectively globalize the approval of new TLDs, in effect giving the US less power.

    And if the story is to be believed, a TLD is only automatically rejected if one or more countries object and no countries disagree. If countries disagree or cannot form a consensus, the TLD isn't automatically rejected. Or specifically, from the PDF:

    String Evaluation: The GAC advises the ICANN Board to instruct ICANN staff to amend the following procedures related to the Initial Evaluation called for in Module 2 to include review by governments, via the GAC. Any GAC member may raise an objection to a proposed string for any reason. If it is the consensus position of the GAC not to oppose objection raised by a GAC member or members, ICANN shall reject the application. (Note that the application fees should be refunded to the applicant).

    Explanation: This proposal meets a number of compelling goals. First it will diminish the potential for blocking of top level domain strings considered objectionable by governments, which harms the architecture of the DNS and undermines the goal of universal resolvability. Second, affording governments the opportunity, through the GAC, to advise the ICANN Board that there is consensus GAC advice regarding particular proposed strings that should not be processed is supportive of ICANN’s commitment to ensure that its decision are in the global public interest.

    (Emphasis added.)

    So, in effect, it's creating an international body where members can object, but other members can block an objection. To my understanding, that's pretty much the opposite of veto power, and it's certainly not a US government takeover of DNS TLDs (in as much as they didn't own the process already).

    Really, it all depends on how much faith you have that the other, saner countries will block objections instead of being pussies.

    --
    It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
    - E. Debs
  13. There is a solution by karl.auerbach · · Score: 2

    It is merely a religious dogma that the internet requires exactly one domain name root.

    One way to fight censorship of domain names is to have multiple roots.

    It would be bad to have multiple roots that lead to different answers to the same query.

    The solution is to have *consistent* but multiple DNS roots. That way any censorship could be obviated simply by users (or their ISP's changing to an uncensored root.)

    The definition of "consistent" makes a difference. Some define it as being absolutely the same. I give relax that a bit to say that if a top level domain (TLD) exists then it must have the same contents in all roots that carry it, but that not all roots need carry every TLD.

    (If TLDs have disputed contents than I claim that they are tainted goods and that any self-respecting root operator ought to put a pox on both their houses and carry none of the disputants' versions.)

    A side effect of this approach is that, like TV channels fighting for space on cable and satellite provider's, new TLDs can arise and fight for visibility and user share without the need of a centralized authority such as ICANN.

    There will, of course, be situations in which abc.example won't resolve in a root that doesn't carry .example. But progress is never perfect - look at the way the telephone system collapsed with the introduction of the touch pad and the revolutionary '#' and '*' keys.

  14. Re:What?!? by croddy · · Score: 2

    It's mainly a scam to increase revenue for registrars by getting people to buy $TRADEMARK.foo and $TRADEMARK.bar when they only really want to use $TRADEMARK.baz. And the recent proliferation of stupid TLDs has no positive benefits.

  15. Re:Dear US Government, et. al. by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 4, Informative

    You should know by now the title and summary are usually wrong. The proposal is that veto power be given to an international review board made up representatives of at least 100 nations. So what is proposed is exactly the opposite of what you seem to be complaining about. This is spreading out the power to make decisions about new TLDs among many nations to make sure the interests of the world are represented.

  16. Dear America by captain_dope_pants · · Score: 2

    Fuck off.
    That is all.

    --
    while (true != false) process_more_stupid_code();
  17. Re:At least they're being coy about it... by nomadic · · Score: 2

    Someone else pointed out how you misunderstood the article, but I have a separate point: I am sure you agree at one point the United States had ownership rights to the internet. My question is at what point, and on what rationale, did they lose those ownership rights? When the first country accepted the US's offer to be let onto the network? After a certain saturation?