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AT&T To Introduce Broadband Caps

rekenner writes "In the upcoming weeks, AT&T customers are going to start receiving notices that their broadband services are going to have a monthly cap, starting in May. DSL users will have a cap of 150 GB per month, while U-Verse users will have a more 'generous' cap of 250 GB per month. However, unlike other caps, it won't be until your third month of overage, on the life of the account, that you'll be charged an overage. Thanks, I guess."

34 of 538 comments (clear)

  1. What's average Netflix datarate? by KillaBeave · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What's the average Netflix data rate? That couldn't have anything to do with this now could it ...

    1. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by XiaoMing · · Score: 5, Insightful

      On the bright side, since so many companies (Netflix, Google, youtube, any "cloud computing" company with large data usage etc.) have built their business model around the assumption of easily available and cheap bandwidth, we might start seeing companies (i.e. entities with real money and legal power) suing each other to keep internet neutrality, rather than ordinary citizens trying to push it through representatives that still think it's got something to do with their household plumbing. Or if not, at least it'll give up-and-coming broadband providers a better business justification to invest in their own infrastructure.

      Fingers crossed that we're a step closer to opening up the relative crap-opoly that is ATT/Comcast in so many regions of this country.

    2. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by TyIzaeL · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I'm sure it's no coincidence that AT&T's own U-Verse TV service is unmetered.

    3. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by XiaoMing · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I meant that the newer companies would be utilizing the judicial branch of our government more, rather than the (often intentionally) uninformed and ineffective legislative branch to address this issue.

    4. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by Lord+Bitman · · Score: 4, Insightful

      A cap is network neutrality.
      Because they can't say "You can only use Netflix if you pay us a fee", they'll instead put a blanket cap on usage.

      And that's exactly as it should be.

      --
      -- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All
    5. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by eobanb · · Score: 5, Insightful

      AT&T U-Verse traffic is not included in the cap. Since video is by far one of the most bandwidth-intensive type of data online, essentially this is a cap on all services competing with U-Verse: iTunes, Netflix, Hulu, MLB.tv, you name it. Get real. This is in no way, shape, or form, network neutrality.

      --

      Take off every sig. For great justice.

    6. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Possibly because this isn't really about bandwidth.

    7. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by Amouth · · Score: 4, Informative

      From TFA: "and that AT&T U-Verse TV service won't count towards the GB cap"

      so UVERSE is NOT included in the cap.. this is them using their monopoly to disadvantage competition this is ripe for an antitrust suit..

      I'm waiting till i get their letter and the in flyer that still says "unlimited" and get them to put a definition on it and make a daily task to bitch and moan that if they are capping they can't advertise it as unlimited.

      --
      '...if only "Jumping to a Conclusion" was an event in the Olympics.'
    8. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by jeffmeden · · Score: 4, Insightful

      But Uverse video is NOT delivered the same way as Netflix, iTunes, and the rest... It's not competition; Uverse programming is "broadcast" in a very traditional sense, you watch what's on the stream coming down the pipe and while you have control over *your* stream you have little/no control over all the streams of content coming from the very center. They distribute a LOT of hardware and connectivity to make that all possible, and while I am not trying to defend them or over-hype their service, it is really fundamentally *not* just another source of IP information.

      Netflix, hulu, and the rest need to realize that IP unicast from a central hub for TV programming is fundamentally flawed, and start aggressively peering with service providers like AT&T to get a content source *inside* the network where it won't be capped (and where, conveniently enough, its VERY VERY efficient since it saves gateway bandwidth for unique data services that actually NEED it.)

    9. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by hairyfeet · · Score: 3

      What magic service is this? The vast majority of us have ONE source for broadband, if you're VERY lucky two. In my case it is Cox (very appropriate name BTW, as they so love to be dicks) or...AT&T. Yep, lot o' choice there baby!

      BTW everyone seems to be missing a VERY important point: Their prices for going over are specifically designed to punish you so you keep their video services instead of their excuse of paying for bandwidth. For example last I checked a Gb of bandwidth on the backbone was something like 4c, how much does Cox charge if you go over your 36Gb! bandwidth cap? $1.50 per Gb. Hell dope dealers can't make that kind of profit!

      That price is simply to punish you so you stay with their video offerings (hell like you have a choice, in my area they won't even sell you a connection without taking at least basic cable) and since NONE of their offerings come under the cap ALL of these ISPs need to be hit with antitrust NOW. Because if you think 150Gb is generous look at my 36Gb cap and know that if people don't stay with the ISPs video offerings that WILL be the cap in the future. Just enough to let you check your mail and watch a couple of vids before getting slammed with insane overage charges.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    10. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by johnny+boy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You're arguing semantics. You apparently haven't been seeing the commercials about getting movies /before/ Netflix through U-Verse. U-Verse competes with Internet video services. They provide a mix of free samples and paid downloads on demand.

      It doesn't matter if they deliver it by carrier pigeon, fleet of station wagons or multicast over twisted pairs of copper. They are providing the same demand based service in addition to their broadcast streams.

      Not that it matters, but they also push a DVR service as well that can stream from a central DVR to STBs (setup-top box). The DVR's search feature integrates the broadcast lineup (so you can record it) and on demand offerings (so you can buy it).

    11. Re:What's average Netflix datarate? by Zenin · · Score: 5, Insightful

      A) None of the major IP video services use a single hub. They all run through massive proxy systems like Akamai. Content already lives very close to its end point.

      C) AT&T isn't much more "inside" their own network then the likes of Netflix and Hulu already are via Akamai and such.

      B) You can't get "inside" AT&T's network in the way you're talking about, at least not without paying extremely huge fees to AT&T that'd verge on a protection racket. And again, the difference isn't technically much different then what the major video streaming companies are doing today via Akamai. There is no big win there; The REAL issue is the last mile, which is exactly the same for AT&T as it is for Netflix et al.

      AT&T isn't doing this to encourage competition to move to more efficient methods, nor are they doing it to address their own peering costs (already bought and paid for). It's an overt move to use their position as bandwidth provider to promote their content business...by disenfranchising the competition.

      --
      My /. uid is better then your /. uid
  2. And once again... by Moryath · · Score: 4, Informative

    the consumer gets screwed.

    "Caps" are the worst way of doing business, designed to cover the fact that they engaged in blatant false advertising.

    1. Re:And once again... by Moryath · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's not the magnitude of the cap. It's that bandwidth - which is a momentary capacity, not a "month cycle" capacity - is being charged that way.

      This ain't electricity or water, where there is a certain central pool quantity to draw from. It's on or off.

      Add to this the fact that NONE of these dishonest fuckers in these companies give you a good way to track "usage", and it gets worse.

      Add in the fact that they are all doing this not to "manage slowdowns" but instead to try to push people back into buying "on demand TV" and "premium cable TV packages with rental DVR" and it's clear: this is not what they say it is. This is pure greed on their part.

    2. Re:And once again... by mlingojones · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It's not the magnitude of the cap. It's that bandwidth - which is a momentary capacity, not a "month cycle" capacity - is being charged that way. This ain't electricity or water, where there is a certain central pool quantity to draw from. It's on or off.

      What would the solution to this be? A variable cap that changes based on how busy the network is?

      Add to this the fact that NONE of these dishonest fuckers in these companies give you a good way to track "usage", and it gets worse.

      FTFA:

      Customers will be able to check their usage with an online tool, and get notifications when they reach 65 percent, 90 percent and 100 percent of their monthly rates.

      So they're absolutely providing a way to check usage. The jury's out on whether or not it's a "good" way, but seeing as you haven't used it you are in no way capable of making that judgement.

      Add in the fact that they are all doing this not to "manage slowdowns" but instead to try to push people back into buying "on demand TV" and "premium cable TV packages with rental DVR" and it's clear: this is not what they say it is. This is pure greed on their part.

      Now you're just making things up. It doesn't mention that anywhere in the article.

      There is a finite amount of bandwidth. The options that have been presented to solve this problem are traffic shaping and capping, so please either throw your towel in with one of those or propose another idea.

    3. Re:And once again... by Shompol · · Score: 5, Informative
      Let's say the advertised speed is 15 Mbps = 15 megabits per second.

      150,000,000,000 GB * 8 (bits/Byte) / 15,000,000 (bits/s) / 60 (sec/min) / 60 (min/hour) / 30 (days/month)= 0.74 hours a day

      Thus, you can only use the advertised speed for no more than 45 minutes a day, given you do not use the internet at all during the remaining 23.26 hours.

    4. Re:And once again... by pla · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So then how, as a YouTube user, do I get original videos that my team has produced and uploaded into "on demand TV" and "premium cable TV packages with rental DVR"?

      Silly consumer - You don't.

      We all need to learn to ignore that whole YouTube fad thing and come to terms with the fact that only big Hollywood money can make "real" content. Just sit back, relax, have a can of government-permitted intoxicant, and watch whatever your push-content provider has decided to make available to you.

    5. Re:And once again... by dnahelicase · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Add in the fact that they are all doing this not to "manage slowdowns" but instead to try to push people back into buying "on demand TV" and "premium cable TV packages with rental DVR" and it's clear: this is not what they say it is. This is pure greed on their part.

      Now you're just making things up. It doesn't mention that anywhere in the article.

      There is a finite amount of bandwidth. The options that have been presented to solve this problem are traffic shaping and capping, so please either throw your towel in with one of those or propose another idea.

      Oooh ooh! Pick Me! I know!

      Another option would be to have more options!

      Since ATT is only able to provide service because they have used publicly owned throughways and have been given permission to sell me service, we could allow more people to provide service!

      We could allow co-ops and startups to lease/buy/build lines and improve our networks!

      Heck, we could even use that bandwidth that they took from TV providers (remember that?) and use it for broadband wireless with open networks like they said was going to happen!

      It seems there are a lot of options besides bandwidth capping, traffic shaping, and anti-competitive practices. We just don't use them.

      As a sidenote, HR 607 would take the D-Block of frequencies and instead give them to emergency response/public safety people. Sounds good right? Well, they don't need it, and it keeps it away from what it was taken for (which helps these same ISPs) and proposes to take away the 70cm band from Ham radio operators - which would really impair public safety in the event of a true emergency.

  3. 90/150 by april21wed · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I noticed yesterday that I had been downloading about 3 GiB yesterday. I was mostly just listening to last.fm through rhythmbox. So if I used that much every day (on average), I would use about 30*3=90 GiB a month. That's a tad too close to the cap, I think.

  4. I wonder.. by craftycoder · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Why did AT&T bother to put fiber all over town for it's customers' if they don't want us to use the bandwidth? They are Ma Bell, do they really have a shortage of bandwidth?

    1. Re:I wonder.. by TyIzaeL · · Score: 4, Insightful

      According to TFA, U-Verse TV will not count towards the bandwidth cap. This strikes me as a wee bit anti-competitive.

  5. allowed rate by sneilan · · Score: 5, Informative

    (150 gigabytes) / (31 days) = 58.7240143 kBps
    (250 gigabytes) / (31 days) = 97.8733572 kBps
    That's some bs.

    --
    "I like it when the red water comes out.."
  6. Why do you tolerate this? by mikael_j · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I just don't understand why americans tolerate ISPs enforcing ridiculous caps. From a swedish perspective it seems kind of backwards, I don't really know of any ISPs here that have caps and it really seems like a concept take from the early days of consumer broadband (mid-to-late 90s there were a few swedish ISPs that tried the whole thing with caps but they were pretty much forced into obscurity since most ISPs didn't cap).

    --
    Greylisting is to SMTP as NAT is to IPv4
    1. Re:Why do you tolerate this? by Colonel+Korn · · Score: 5, Informative

      I just don't understand why americans tolerate ISPs enforcing ridiculous caps. From a swedish perspective it seems kind of backwards, I don't really know of any ISPs here that have caps and it really seems like a concept take from the early days of consumer broadband (mid-to-late 90s there were a few swedish ISPs that tried the whole thing with caps but they were pretty much forced into obscurity since most ISPs didn't cap).

      Even major cities in American typically have only 2-3 available internet service providers, and they tend to implement very similar metering policies at roughly the same time, so there's no easy alternative.

      --
      "I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
    2. Re:Why do you tolerate this? by Nyeerrmm · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Its because there are certain American's (who happen to be a large voting group) who confuse the idea of a competitive market with laissez faire capitalism.

      This leads to the twisted logic that because competitive, free markets bring efficiency, lower prices, and innovation, any regulation of private enterprises is bad, even if there is barely a market due to government sanctioned monopolies.

  7. Lucky Me! by Mooga · · Score: 3, Informative

    I recently switched to Comcast Business Class to avoid the bandwidth caps since my family and I use Netflix, Hulu, and other streaming services quite often. I actually almost switched to U-Verse because they offered a better cable deal and unlimited bandwidth... Guess not any more!

    --
    ~ Mooga
  8. 1.8 GB per movie by tepples · · Score: 5, Informative

    What's the average Netflix data rate?

    On Xbox 360, 1.8 GB per movie (source).

  9. Re:what is to be done? by bmo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    False dichotomy.

    There is a third answer: The people who supply the pipes keep up with the current state of the art. They are not doing so. They are not reinvesting in their infrastructure and the result is lesser quality and rationing.

    Frankly, what the telecoms charge for overages on caps is highway robbery. It has been demonstrated that it's simply cheaper to send a SSD via snail mail and *destroy the drive* after than it is to go over the ridiculous caps that are appearing in Canada. And we're starting to see this in the US as TFA indicates.

    We here in the US threw tons of money at the broadband providers during the Clinton administration and all they did was give it out to their shareholders. They continue to refuse to reinvest, and prefer to kill the goose for short term gain. We are falling behind Europe and Asia in terms of broadband, and will soon be a backwater similar to Africa if the telecoms get their way.

    This is what you get when you utterly refuse to regulate once the telecoms become regional monopolies or duopolies. There is no more competition, so the raping of the customer goes on.

    --
    BM

  10. This isn't about bandwidth, it's about usage by ThomasBHardy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Here's the thing, ATT will be capping the bandwidth of "Internet" usage. This is separate from the usage of the streaming HDTV signal that ATT provides to U-verse customers. One could run the TV streaming 24x7 and record 4 shows at once and run many times the bandwidth cap and there's no cap or additional fees. The issue lies in what you do with your computers. They are basically coming out and admitting that it's not a bandwidth issue, it's a services issues. ATT wants to own parts of what you do such as cloud gaming services and video streaming services. When you use their services they can be exempted from the caps, thus crushing competition like Netflix or Hulu. This isn't about bandwidth or caps or infrastructure, It's about greed and it's about net neutrality. Does anyone find it coincidental that this comes the week after the FCC net neutrality rules got struck down?

    --
    Warning: Teh poster of this messaeg is lysdexic
  11. The truth of the matter by Charliemopps · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Usage caps do absolutely nothing to limit the amount of data your customers use. ISPs problems arise when a large portion of their customers use their cap at the same time... usually around 6-8pm. The rest of the day the ISP is idle for the most part. The people hitting caps like this are doing so because they are using their connection 24hrs/day. ALL ISPs in the US throttle peer to peer traffic, even if they don't admit it. So these people are already slowed way down during this peak period. So why are they doing it? New fees, plain and simple. It's the equivalent of credit card overages.

  12. Let them know the customer is the boss! by time$lice · · Score: 3, Interesting

    It simply makes no sense imposing data caps these days. Think about how much more data you use than you did just a few years ago - Streaming services (Netflix, Hulu), digital distribution (Steam, D2D, Amazon), general content, etc.

    Time Warner tried this in Austin a couple years ago and it backfired on them. They lost a load of customers. I actually switched to U-verse because of it. They ended scrapping the whole idea. This is their chance to shine and announce: "no data limits" "we miss you come back and enjoy all the Internet" As far as the whole "98% of users won't be impacted by this change" BS... I'm going to call BS on that and go a little further. Even if people don't hit the cap, they like having the unlimited option available. Example: If my hard drive crashes, I have over 300GB of games to download from steam. And that's only the ones I'm currently playing!

    Call them and complain (be firm but be nice). I called and got disconnected the first round after a 5 minute hold. The second time when the automated system asked why I was calling I said "I'm pissed off!" I was immediately connected to a rep! The rep said he didn't know anything about it. His supervisor said the same thing.

    And if they still go through with this crap - switch. Vote with your wallet folks!

  13. Re:Net Neutrality?!? by TheEyes · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What's this got to do with Net Neutrality? It's throttling back traffic and charging for overage - it's a Business Model - not entirely unlike how they charge for Long Distance.

    It's Net Neutrality because they are not throttling or capping their own competing services, while they are capping Netflix. AT&T has just announced that they, like Comcast, are the gatekeepers of the Internet, and have free reign to control how much you say, who you say it to, and where your information comes from.

  14. The same can be said of cable tv providers by name_already_taken · · Score: 4, Insightful

    AT&T U-Verse traffic is not included in the cap.

    AT&T not counting their U-Verse video traffic is effectively the same as Comcast not counting their video bandwidth too. It doesn't matter if the service provider delivers their own video content via IP multicast (U-Verse), RF (Comcast) or discs strapped to trained pigeons.

    Any download cap by any ISP who also provides video service is anti-competitive.

    --
    Putting moderation advice in your .sig lowers your karma!
  15. Re:Slippery Slope? by pla · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Depends on how many can and do vote with their feet. If a lot of AT&T people leave, AT&T might rethink the policy. Likewise if a cable ISP or whoever else is getting a lot of people from AT&T because of the cap, they might think long and hard before putting in such a cap themselves.

    If - And I mean that as a really big "if" - You have the great fortune of having more than a single broadband ISP in your area, you might choose to switch between them when one misbehaves. When both demonstrate the same contempt for their customers, what then? Go back to dialup, crippling yourself just to teach 'em a lesson?

    Market pressure only works when you actually have something resembling an open marketplace. When only two long-entrenched players offer what you need, they just take turns seeing who can screw you harder.