Ask Slashdot: Data-Only Android For Development?

UrbanaMan writes "I am about to start developing Air and Flex apps for Android and need a smartphone to use for debugging. I want to be able to carry on working in the UK as well as in the US. I don't need to use the phone, so I am looking for an unlocked phone that can be used on pay-as-you-go data plans on both sides of the Atlantic. For app testing I need Flash Player (plus a processer pwerfull enough to support flash), a reasonable amount of memory, GPS, WiFi, Bluetooth, camera and USB (inc charging) and Android 2.3 or later. Are there any such phones/deals available for non millionaires?"

Comments

Don't you want...

[blair1q]

...a Lore, too?

Re:Don't you want...

[KBentley57]

Might as well beta test your apps on a B4 unit.

Re:Don't you want...

[Anonymous Coward]

Apparently the B4 units are flash upgradeable, too.

Re:Don't you want...

[cayenne8]

Just curious.....is there not an emulator out there developers can use?

I thought I'd heard that there is one for the iphone...is there not one for Android too?

I'd have just assumed there was one (or more)....?

Re:Don't you want...

[julesh]

Emulators will only get you so far. Emulators running on a typical PC don't have multitouch input, can't connect to the cellular network (except very rudimentary test features), and are somewhat slower than actual devices. Some things, you have to test on real hardware.

Re:Don't you want...

[Anonymous Coward]

somewhat slower than actual devices.

Eh, or faster. Which is worse, really. The android emulation also didn't have speed control when I last tried it, it was just impossible to adjust it to a particular speed (that may have changed, we're talking years ago now).

Flash

[Nerdfest]

Dude, the Flash thing was just to annoy Jobs, you're not supposed to actually use it.

Re:Flash

[blair1q]

He flashy-thinged Steve Jobs?

(man, i am stuck in a movie-reference rut today)

Re:Flash

[ItsLenny]

I second that.. use HTML 5 or native android app development (depending on what you're trying to do). Flash will be dead soon air / flex might live on, but I doubt any of those will be viable in the long run...

Re:Flash

[KZigurs]

+5 funny? This should be +5 Observant!

Re:Flash

[naz404]

The BIIIIIIIIIG advantage over Flash SWFs /AIR apps is that your entire app can be put into a single neat bundle. Can't say the same for Javascript + CSS + Canvas. Sound on HTML5 is pretty screwed up too.

Anyway, Flash/AIR is the way to go right now if you want to target multiple platforms at relatively low cost/time/manpower. Flash & AIR run on: Windows, OSX, Linux, Android 2.2+, Blackberry Tablet OS, Apple iOS (as a native app via the iOS packager). Native will give the best speed, but if your speed requirements aren't so stringent, Flash/AIR will get the job done.

Oh, Lenny, you've got your techs confused. AIR != Flex. Flex is an Open-source framework that will allow you to publish SWFs or AIR Apps via MXML + Actionscript 3. AIR = more like Flash taken out of the browser sandbox & given native desktop hooks. Sounds like you're part of the "bashing stuff I haven't even touched yet based on FUD" camp.

Don't kid yourself. The face of the web is ruled by designers, not coders. Until WYSIWYG tools that make animation of UI interfaces/objects easy for non-coder designers become ubiquitous, Flash ain't going to die anytime soon. (*note: Adobe now has a Flash .FLA to HTML5 export in beta at the labs right now)

Re:Flash

[asdfghjklqwertyuiop]

The BIIIIIIIIIG advantage over Flash SWFs /AIR apps is that your entire app can be put into a single neat bundle.

Why is that such a big deal?

Re:Flash

[naz404]

Why is that such a big deal?

Try selling apps on stores.

Re:Flash

[ItsLenny]

No confusion here I know the difference between air and flex and have developed several things in each, but thats for the correction. I didn't mean air / flex as if they're one thing. I meant it as in they will both live beyond "flash" but will both die eventually. Also, who cares about packaging when the HTML 5 / JS / CSS lives on the web server.. to the end user it's a single thing. Finally, he said nothing about wanting cross-platform support. In fact, he seemed to emphasize that he was developing for android specifically

Re:Flash

[asdfghjklqwertyuiop]

Not sure why I would sell a web app on an app store.

Re:Flash

[Anonymous Coward]

FUCK YEAH! Thank you, somebody gets it. Fuck Apple for no-flash, but let's never forget: fuck Flash.

Re:Flash

[iluvcapra]

Did you ever flashy-thing me, K? Did you ever flashy-thing ME?

Re:Flash

[Anonymous Coward]

$$$

Re:Flash

[oliverthered]

Flash a mac?

Re:Flash

[AvitarX]

Works fine in Chrome.

Re:Flash

[Anonymous Coward]

Most people don't realize flash is heavily used in conventions, b2b, tablet-based sales aids and all RIA that require heavy GUI. Try building a web replica of inDesign or photoshop with javascript + html.

Flash already has the capability of native speed video (as of 10.2) and improved GPU acceleration; Flash 11 (currently an incubator build) has an OpenGL/Direct3D API and from the looks of it it's better than Unity3d's.

Flash is very very good at Rapid Application Development, and in interfacing with Adobe's other products. I've built systems that automate assets based just on naming conventions and context, allowing a jr designer to build fully interactive pages without the need of having a programmer even look at it. The cost advantages of Flash are tremendous in a number of cases. Accessibility is becoming much more important as smart mobile devices continue to be spread to the masses, but don't forget that Flash's web presence is but one arm of its use (in addition to what I've listed it's used to make all kinds of prototypes -- games, presentations, convention ideas etc). Even if it disappears off the web entirely, it will still be doing just fine.

That said, I like Apple - hell, I'm an ipad developer.

Re:Flash

[alostpacket]

Speaking as somine who did about 10 years of Flash Dev prior to Android I can assure you that Flash wont die any time soon. And that's a good thing. It's a very good technology that has a few drawbacks due to being controlled by a singular company. Those drawbacks have been loudly trumpted by its critics. It also has a bad rep because of its use (abuse) by advertisers who are already happily abusing HTML5. Nevertheless the core technology of Flash, the event based scriping language, and vector rendering engine, are top notch.

Still, Flash isn't quite the best tool for the job on Android -- but that could easily change as phones get faster. ActionScript is a wonderful language and has many advantages over Java (and many limitations, being a scripting language). But it is much nicer than JavaScript to work with.

My advice would be to learn Java. Syntactically they will feel very similar but there will be a few potholes along the way. For performance he'll need to understand multi-threaded programming anyways.

When it comes to getting a phone, I'd say a Nexus One, (like others have said), will pop up on ebay a lot and be great dev phone. But really any phone will do if he's going WiFi-only.

Re:Flash

[GreyLurk]

Flex is just a set of Libraries and an XML syntax for ActionScript bytecode. In other words, Flex is built on top of Flash, so it can't really outlive Flash.

Re:Flash

[SheeEttin]

Anyway, Flash/AIR is the way to go right now if you want to target multiple platforms at relatively low cost/time/manpower.

Sounds exactly like Java. (And we know how Slashdot feels about Java.)

Re:Flash

[i-linux123]

As a developer I'm sure you enjoy it, everyone has some obscure niches, but what about the users? Why do WE have to suffer? To the users, flash is dead.
It might not be slow in execution speed when doing some arithmetic, but flash is the only thing we really hate having to run on ANY device. Firefox, Symbian, Android, Maemo, Chrome, Windows, Linux, you name it, flash will crash it. (several times a day, and/or make it painful on each execution.).

The ONLY situations where a user will run flash instead of an alternative is when the user is either a) A computer beginner and can't tell the difference between slowdowns and a virus, b) There is no alternative non-flash app, and c) It doesn't say anywhere it is flash, before purchase. Almost any competent computer user that knows what flash is will try to avoid.

Even Adobe has given up on the flash runtime, and is neglecting it as evident by the snail-paced progress in fixing a few bugs here and there every few years.

Re:Flash

[killkillkill]

has a few drawbacks due to being controlled by a singular company.

That seems to me like a drawback in itself.

Re:Flash

[Anonymous Coward]

It's trivially easy to put a web app into a UIWebView on i.* devices or android.webkit.WebView on android devices. So flash's BIIIIIIIIIG disadvantage is the bundle can't go on the iTunes app store whereas contrary to your claim web apps do. So thank you, come again.

Re:Flash

[dudpixel]

Not sure why I would sell a web app on an app store.

how does 'free advertising' sound to you?

Re:Flash

[exomondo]

The ONLY situations where a user will run flash instead of an alternative is when the user is either a) A computer beginner and can't tell the difference between slowdowns and a virus, b) There is no alternative non-flash app, and c) It doesn't say anywhere it is flash, before purchase.

Your options suggest you think Flash is never faster than any alternative...which of course is not true.

Re:Flash

[froggymana]

Anyway, Flash/AIR is the way to go right now if you want to target multiple platforms at relatively low cost/time/manpower.

Sounds exactly like Java. (And we know how Slashdot feels about Java.)

Its terrible? Unless it has to do with Android, then its the best thing since bag phones!

Re:Flash

[Draek]

As a developer I'm sure you enjoy it, everyone has some obscure niches, but what about the users? Why do WE have to suffer? To the users, flash is dead.

What in the almighty heavens are you smoking? Flash has a higher penetration rate than freaking Windows, and outside of a few geeks here at Slashdot and the odd Apple cultist or two, people are pretty damn happy with it.

Now, being one of the aforementioned geeks I don't hold much love for Flash myself, but I also don't pretend my opinion is anywhere near universal. Flash is very much alive, and we won't be getting rid of it any time soon regardless of what Your Holiness Stevie may say about it.

Re:Flash

[Hognoxious]

Wouldn't it be possible, at least in theory, for Flex to produce bytecode targeted for a different VM?

Re:Flash

[datapharmer]

hahahaha. I made that mistake. Installed flash, and it worked so well I had to add a mile long hosts file just to eliminate the ads on my phone!

Re:Flash

[Ash Vince]

The BIIIIIIIIIG advantage over Flash SWFs /AIR apps is that your entire app can be put into a single neat bundle.

Why is that such a big deal?

One reason is that it makes it harder for someone to steal your code. With HTML5 it is all open source as you end up doing your logic in JavaScript. With flash you get to keep your code locked away from prying eyes in actionscript that is precomplied into a BLOB. Open Source is all very well, but some people actually want to write closed source applications.

Re:Flash

[M. Baranczak]

In theory, practice and theory are the same. In practice, they're not.

Sure it's possible, but I doubt it'll happen. It'd be a huge project, and I just don't see why anyone would need it that bad.

Re:Flash

[GreyLurk]

Sure... That's what some of the Flash->HTML5 converters are doing (though they're going through the intermediary of AS3 bytecode). The thing is that the Flex class library directly inherits from the Flash class library, so re-implementing on another platform would require a ground-up reimplementation of the entire windowing library on any existing stack (Java, .Net, etc...) So it's not really feasible to "port" Flex to another language/platform (though SIlverlight is a reasonable knockoff on the .Net stack).

Re:Flash

[tlhIngan]

One reason is that it makes it harder for someone to steal your code. With HTML5 it is all open source as you end up doing your logic in JavaScript. With flash you get to keep your code locked away from prying eyes in actionscript that is precomplied into a BLOB. Open Source is all very well, but some people actually want to write closed source applications.

Aren't there tons of Flash decompilers out there? Last time I checked 'em out, I used it to grab URLs and stuff from the crap it downloaded. And in any case, I had full reign over the assets in the SWF file.

Re:Flash

[Anonymous Coward]

FUCK YEAH! Thank you, somebody gets it. Fuck Apple for no-flash, but let's never forget: fuck Flash.

This thread of comments just made my day.

Re:Flash

[Anonymous Coward]

This is /. There is no fucking. I do not even know what your post means.

Re:Flash

[Hognoxious]

In theory, practice and theory are the same. In practice, they're not.

Never heard that one before. You're 100% right. In theory you could compile Python or C**** (I will not utter it here) to run on the M$ DLR. But in practice that would never happen, absolutely not, no way

I just don't see why anyone would need it that bad.

Yeah, there's obviously no advantage in having a standardised runtime engine. Must be why no such thing exists.

Why not a tablet?

[CannonballHead]

... seems data-only apps and tablets seem to go well together, since tablets aren't phones and usually have non-3G options...

Re:Why not a tablet?

[compro01]

AFAICT, most non-3G tablets also lack the GPS he desires.

Though he can hook a GPS in via bluetooth, but I'm not sure if that works the same way as a built in unit as far as software and compatibility is a likely issue.

Re:Why not a tablet?

[CannonballHead]

Hum. You get bonus points for reading the question before answering. ;)

Re:Why not a tablet?

[isopropanol]

Viewsonic ViewPad 7 seems to be the ticket. It's got everything, and only comes unlocked. Except the Android is 2.2. Not sure about the CPU speed to run flash either.

Re:Why not a tablet?

[AVryhof]

There are apps that "fake" the GPS in the Android Market Place.

http://www.androidzoom.com/android_applications/gps%20fake

I use it on my Archos 28 for developing HTML5/Google Location API pages for mobile devices.

As for tablets, the Archos 32 is a good choice. The only reason I got the 28 is because the 32 wasn't in stock when I went to buy it.

If I was more patient, I would have gotten it off Amazon

http://www.amazon.com/ARCHOS-32-3-2-Inch-Touchscreen-Android/dp/B003X26VNM/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1300874100&sr=8-2

Re:Why not a tablet?

[compro01]

That app looks useful. I recently bought an archos 32 myself, mostly as a ebook reader and video player. Works quite nicely, though I think I would have bought the 43 if I had the money, due to the expansion ability and larger screen (the 32 is a bit tricky to use without a stylus thanks to my large fingers).

Craigslist

[scot4875]

If you can get by with wifi-only for your data connection, just grab whatever phone you'd like off of Craigslist. I'm currently debugging with a Hero and an Evo that aren't tied to any plan, and rarely leave my desk.

Also, the emulator works for debugging the vast majority of the time, and gives you access to whatever networks the host is connected to.

--Jeremy

Re:Craigslist

[ironjaw33]

I second WiFi only as well. I've used an ADP 1 (G1) and Nexus One for development purposes with no voice or data plan. I'm not sure why anyone would want a data plan just for development. I've even done some work on a location-based app extending the Maps API and even though I don't have WiFi everywhere I go, I can still collect a GPS and sensor trace to use with the emulator.

Re:Craigslist

[wesborgmandvm]

I want to be able to carry on working in the UK as well as in the US. I don't need to use the phone, so I am looking for an unlocked phone that can be used on pay-as-you-go data plans on both sides of the Atlantic.

What is the best as-you-go data plans on the US side? anything better than link: http://www.virginmobileusa.com/cell-phone-plans/beyond-talk-plans.jsp

Re:Craigslist

[certron]

I purchased a G1 from eBay and was lucky enough to get an extended battery (but not the back cover) and I successfully used it for wifi-only development for about 1.5 years. It worked out pretty well, the keyboard held up during that time, and aside from the slower processor speed, I was able to do what I wanted to do without much issue. The GPS acquisition time was much slower than my then-gf's MyTouch 3G, but I suspect the better hardware as well as some hints from the cell signal were responsible for that.

The only problem I had was that my particular device (or the way I did it) wasn't quite compatible with the CyanogenMod Froyo firmware and was unstable, froze and/or crashed a lot. I'd give it another try but I can't make it boot and haven't been back to the recovery console since I bought my G2 (soon to be AT&T-Mobile, grumble).

Nexus S

[SoftwareArtist]

Sounds like you're describing a Nexus S. The only part I'm not sure about is whether you can use it as a phone in the UK. In the US, it should work fine with T-mobile's pay-as-you-go plans.

Re:Nexus S

[aitan]

A Nexus one will be quite cheaper

Re:Nexus S

[ryan420]

The current model of Nexus S should work fine in the UK, since it has a GSM radio. I would second this recommendation. If you wanted to save a few bucks, you could also pick up a used Nexus One on swappa or ebay. Both Nexus phones are unlockable, meaning they are not locked to a specific carrier AND you can unlock the boatloader and install custom roms, radios, kernels, etc.

Re:Nexus S

[teh31337one]

And quite a lot crapper. shitty touch sensor and GPU on Nexus One really let it down.

Re:Nexus S

[teh31337one]

If you want it to work for data in the UK, get a Nexus S from the UK, and use it on *shudder* AT&T in America. You'll only get edge speeds on T-mobile in America, and if you get the T-mobile one, you'll only get 2g speeds in the UK, no 3G.

Re:Nexus S

[Bluecobra]

This is false. I own both a HTC G1 and a Samsung Vibrant which both have the US T-Mobile 3G frequencies and I had no problems using T-Mobile's prepaid 3G network in the UK. The only caveat is to make sure that the phones are unlocked so they will accept a UK SIM card.

Re:Nexus S

[teh31337one]

UK uses 900 and 1800 MHz frequencies for 3G data, Tmobile use the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band. Your Vibrant worked because it can use 1700 / 1900 / 2100 bands.

Re:Nexus S

[Tumbleweed]

Good thing he specifically said he didn't want to use it as a phone, then, eh?

Re:Nexus S

[Samah]

And quite a lot crapper. shitty touch sensor and GPU on Nexus One really let it down

Indeed, and this is the reason I'm graveyarding my N1 for a Desire HD. Developing multitouch games on a quasi-multitouch device is unfortunately unacceptable. The 3G reception on the N1 is also abysmal.
http://androidandme.com/2010/03/news/is-multitouch-broken-on-the-nexus-one/
(Link seems to be down at the moment)

Re:Nexus S

[FlatEric521]

This is false. I own both a HTC G1 and a Samsung Vibrant which both have the US T-Mobile 3G frequencies and I had no problems using T-Mobile's prepaid 3G network in the UK. The only caveat is to make sure that the phones are unlocked so they will accept a UK SIM card.

That is the same I experienced with my G1, but I used a prepaid O2 sim. Most smartphones these days seem to be quad-band GSM, so 2G/EDGE should work anywhere in the world. While it is true that T-Mo uses 1700/2100 for UMTS in the US, most of their phones can support running 2100 only. I checked before I went in Dec. 2010 and found that nearly all the UK carriers use 2100 in some capacity. I was there for nearly three weeks and had 3G indicated while I was in more populated areas.

Re:Nexus S

[teh31337one]

They hacked a single touch sensor to be dual touch. It works for pinch to zoom, but it's pretty shitty. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MLUmJL_Px0

Newer phones like Galaxy S, Desire HD etc have proper multitouch. Galaxy S multi-touch (and Nexus S) supports 10 finger detection (with some hacks to enable it in the kernel and framework)

Re:Nexus S

[SoftwareArtist]

But he did say he wanted cellular data access. Perhaps I should have said "cellular access" instead of "use it as a phone".

Re:Nexus S

[zill]

...Galaxy S multi-touch (and Nexus S) supports 10 finger detection (with some hacks to enable it in the kernel and framework)

I have polydactyly, you insensitive semiconductor designers!

Re:Nexus S

[Threni]

What hacks? Android supports hundreds of fingers. If anything is hacked it's the shitty firmware/drivers in some phones.

Re:Nexus S

[Samah]

What hacks? Android supports hundreds of fingers. If anything is hacked it's the shitty firmware/drivers in some phones.

No, it's the physical screen.

Re:Nexus S

[jrumney]

UK uses 900 and 1800 MHz frequencies for 3G data

UK uses 2100MHz for 3G data. 900 and 1800MHz are the GSM bands.

Re:Nexus S

[teh31337one]

Exactly. The sensor used in the screen is a single touch capacitive sensor. Android supports multi-touch, but the Nexus One / xperia x10 / HTC desire harware doesn't.

Re:Nexus S

[Homburg]

Interesting. I have a Vibrant that runs on T-Mobile's US network, and I could only get 2G/EDGE while I was in the UK recently. Perhaps that was because I was in rural areas most of the time, or maybe for some reason Orange's 3G network (which I was trying to use) doesn't work with the phone.

Re:Nexus S

[FlatEric521]

UK uses 900 and 1800 MHz frequencies for 3G data

UK uses 2100MHz for 3G data. 900 and 1800MHz are the GSM bands.

1800 MHz is UMTS Band III and 900MHZ is UMTS Band VIII, see UMTS Frequency Bands. While they are more commonly GSM bands, they can be used for UMTS (3G) data.

That being said, its my understanding that Band I (2100MHz) is far more widely deployed throughout the UK (and the rest of Europe). In the US ATT uses UMTS Bands II and V (1900 & 850), while T-Mobile uses UMTS Band IV (1700/2100). From what I can tell, most (if not all) T-Mobile phones sold in the US are actually Band I/IV phones, allowing them to run on 2100MHz networks in the UK and other locations in Europe. An ATT phone without Band I capabilities would likely have no 3G in large parts of the UK.

Re:Nexus S

[dakameleon]

The iPad goes to 11.

Re:Nexus S

[jrumney]

Yes it's theoretically possible and allowed for in the UMTS specifications, and the ITU has allocated those bands for "mobile telephony use" without limiting which technology, so eventually they may be used when the GSM networks are switched off - though by then the networks will more likely be looking for bandwidth to deploy LTE. But the statement I was responding to was specifically about the current usage in UK.

Re:Nexus S

[jrumney]

OK so I missed last week's announcement by O2 that they have already started moving their 900MHz allocations to UMTS.

Re:Nexus S

[exomondo]

Exactly. The sensor used in the screen is a single touch capacitive sensor. Android supports multi-touch, but the Nexus One / xperia x10 / HTC desire harware doesn't.

The nexus one can do pinch-to-zoom so of course it supports multitouch.

Re:Nexus S

[Samah]

The nexus one can do pinch-to-zoom so of course it supports multitouch.

The hardware on the Nexus One was not designed with multitouch in mind. There was a firmware hack released that changes the way it reads the touchscreen hardware, such that it can "sort of" detect two touches. This hack fails when X and Y axes align, and it often loses track of which coordinates belong to which touch. Pinch zoom works because you're not generally pinching exactly down the axes.

Re:Nexus S

[exomondo]

The nexus one can do pinch-to-zoom so of course it supports multitouch.

The hardware on the Nexus One was not designed with multitouch in mind.

The clearpad 2000 in the nexus one was designed to be able to do multitouch, but only 2 fingers, and yes you're right it doesn't do them particularly well.

Re:Nexus S

[gl4ss]

the guy is an idiot, or was asking this just to post his ref links to places like expansys(.com or co.uk or wherever he is).
I mean, a simple bing/yahoo/goduckgo/google search would have netted him a zillion devices to choose from ranging from 150 to 700 unlocked, the information about the networks used in these countries is out there too.

zte blades break. just a friendly warning(roll with stock fw for a while to check mechanical problems regardless of what you choose though).

Re:Nexus S

[ConfusedVorlon]

You can use a Nexus S as a phone in the UK.

You can even buy it in the UK, though it is cheaper if you get it from Best Buy in the USA

Re:Nexus S

[teh31337one]

Well, whatever it is, the Nexus One isn't good at doing multitouch dual touch.

Re:Nexus S

[Threni]

It's not as simple as that. There are different levels of multitouch support for Android. You can detect pinching on many phones but not independent tracking of those two fingers so, for example, you cannot rotate maps on the Desire. You can on the HD, as they use better screens/firmware (ie they support `mutitouch.distinct` and not just `multitouch`.)

Re:Nexus S

[MikeBabcock]

The Nexus One would work fine for these purposes as well.

Re:Nexus S

[petman]

There's nothing wrong with the touch sensor on the Nexus One, except when it comes to multi-touch. Anyway, since the OP is developing AIR and Flex apps, multi-touch and GPU performance are irrelevant, so a Nexus One would be quite sufficient, I think.

Nexus One?

[Anonymous Coward]

Uh....Nexus One from ebay? Lots of T-Mobile users in the USA are likely to be listing them soon...

Re:Nexus One?

[Anonymous Coward]

+1. I just picked up a Nexus One on eBay purely for Android development, $300. I just use Wi-Fi. Works great, and the emulators should be fine for testing other screen resolutions/etc.

Emulator

[ThurstonMoore]

It looks like the Droid SDK has an emulator. http://www.brighthub.com/mobile/google-android/articles/66317.aspx

Re:Emulator

[Anonymous Coward]

Android. It's fucking called Android.

Droid is a brand name for a number of Android-based smartphones sold in the US of A by Verizon Wireless.

Re:Emulator

[Gondola]

The emulator also runs like a piece of frozen dogshit. Its speed is horrible, and should not be used as any indicator of performance.

Additionally, it cannot emulate (without a LOT of effort) any of the specialized sensors like accelerometer, multitouch, GPS, and so on.

Re:Emulator

[Man Eating Duck]

Android. It's fucking called Android.

Droid is a brand name for a number of Android-based smartphones sold in the US of A by Verizon Wireless.

The above post was brought to you by Mr. Hyde and Dr. Jekyll.

Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[Anonymous Coward]

Just get any GSM handset with Android 2.3 and you'll be fine.. Probably cost you 400 bucks on ebay or go somewhere in eastern Europe and get one..

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[teh31337one]

Pretty much this. From the main manufacturers, you have:

HTC

- Desire S (desire HD/Z/ incred. S will get Gingerbread soon)

Samsung

- Galaxy S2 or Nexus S.

Sony Ericsson - Xperia play/neo/arc.

LG, Motorola etc don't have any 2.3 phones announced/on the market yet. If you want working 3G in the UK, you should get a *shudder* AT&T phone because they have the correct bands to work in the UK/Europe

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[teh31337one]

Urgh, slashdot really fucked up my formatting ._.

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[rrossman2]

I've played around with the Samsung Galaxy S GT-i9000 a lot, and have tried a few different firmware options (both stock as well as homebrew/hybrids).

I noticed a few weeks ago SamFirmware.com shows 2.3.2 in the European firmware section..

I9000XWJV1 ## 512.PIT Version 2.3.2 2011 February DOWNLOAD 1 file select NO .PIT

I haven't tried it yet myself, as I"m using a hybrid with a US (Rogers Canada) based modem since it covers the frequencies I need, but I'm curious what the 2.3.2 holds. If it's an option, you could most likely pick up a GT-i9000(x) phone and use Odin to dump the 2.3.2 Euro firmware on and roll from there.

The (x) is because there's a few variants.. mine is actually the GT-i9000T which is a latin america based version that Immix Wireless sells (front facing camera instead of a flash on the rear facing camera). There's also a 9000B in the Mexico area, straight 9000's, 9000M's, and I'm not sure which others exist.

Link with some info:
http://www.samfirmware.com/apps/blog/entries/show/6282349-android-2-3-2-leaks-for-galaxy-s-

The market has been hit and miss for some people after the update.. but according to that post if you root the phone the market works fine if it hadn't before.

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[teh31337one]

I don't even know where to start. samfirmware doesn't know what he's on about, market has been working fine from whenever it was Google flipped the switch on the buildprint. The 2.3.2 ROM is decent, but not really ready for day to day use. The memory settings aren't set out correctly. so it doesn't quit out of applications when the memory is needed, leading to your phone crawling when it hits around 30mb RAM left. Apart from that, there are other problems like random reboots, and the phone not waking from sleep. These issues will be ironed out when the update rolls out. (probably android 2.3.3)

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[afidel]

I guess my question is why is he debugging on a Gingerbread phone when the *vast* majority of devices on the market are on 2.1 or 2.2?

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[teh31337one]

Lots of API changes in android 2.3

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[Anonymous Coward]

No U.

Lrn2Preview, assbutt

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[rrossman2]

it wasn't on samfirmware that the market working deal was listed.. that was on XDA-Developer forums where that's talked about.

Re:Any Android 2.3 on GSM

[teh31337one]

samfirmware said on twatter that market wasn't working, but I digress. Market started working a bit after it was leaked. The leak is promising though. They decided to take a short cut, and just branched the Nexus S code :-)

Nexus S?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's unlocked, GSM, and has all the features you list.

Of course!

[Anonymous Coward]

For app testing I need Flash Player (plus a processer pwerfull enough to support flash), a reasonable amount of memory, GPS, WiFi, Bluetooth, camera and USB (inc charging) and Android 2.3 or later. Are there any such phones/deals available for non millionaires?"

Of course! They're all like that! Fragmentation is just a myth!

dev phone

[Anonymous Coward]

Two words: Developer phone.
Seriously though why do you need data from a carrier instead of just wifi?
That said, developer phones are GSM, just get a month to month plan for said phone off contract.

Re:dev phone

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

Seriously though why do you need data from a carrier instead of just wifi?

Why doesn't it make sense to test the phone under the conditions your customers will likely use it under? If his flash game takes too long to load, he's not going to know that using wifi.

Re:dev phone

[Anonymous Coward]

Because bandwidth is extremely variable?
Numerous people, including the one you replied to already suggested an off contract plan with a developer handset anyway.
AT&T Nexus 1 is probably best since Nexus S, at least in the US is T-Mobile which uses different frequencies than the rest of the world for 3G.

Re:dev phone

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

Because bandwidth is extremely variable?

Uh that's not a reason to use wi-fi, that's a reason to test using an actual cellular signal.

Re:dev phone

[Anonymous Coward]

No, that really is an excellent reason to test with wifi.

Configure your home network to bandwidth cap at whatever you want to simulate and you can get it to perform better or worse than your local area.

Flying all over the world with an international phone to test it in different locations is a horrible idea compared to properly simulating it.

If you are on a real cell network, you don't have access to increase or decrease the bandwidth.

Re:dev phone

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

Configure your home network to bandwidth cap at whatever you want to simulate and you can get it to perform better or worse than your local area.

Right. It's not just bandwidth caps, it's drop outs, changing conditions, etc. Sorta like you'd get if you walked around your neighborhood or town or whatever and tried it out.

Flying all over the world...

I said nothing like that.

Nexus S

[krazed]

http://www.google.co.uk/nexus/#

100s have it already

[Anonymous Coward]

> Are there any such phones/deals available for non millionaires?"

Yes, the mobile phones of telco executives. Thanks to them avoiding being non millionaires, you need to keep on searching.

Developing Flash "apps" for a phone, eh?

[Anonymous Coward]

Developing Flash "apps" for a phone, eh? Here's a quick set of instructions:

- buy shotgun and ammo

- load shotgun

- insert in mouth

- pull trigger, repeat as needed

Seriously, I can't think of anything more suck-tastic than Flash apps on a phone. Piss-poor battery life, miserable performance and a UI that'll probably still think there's a mouse around...

Re:Developing Flash "apps" for a phone, eh?

[Bobfrankly1]

Developing Flash "apps" for a phone, eh? Here's a quick set of instructions:

- buy shotgun and ammo

- load shotgun

- insert in mouth

- pull trigger, repeat as needed

Seriously, I can't think of anything more suck-tastic than Flash apps on a phone. Piss-poor battery life, miserable performance and a UI that'll probably still think there's a mouse around...

Steve, the nurse said you need to get back in bed for your sponge bath...

Re:Developing Flash "apps" for a phone, eh?

[Anonymous Coward]

So you are coming out in support of flash apps on phones?

That's umm interesting.

Think what you want of Jobs, Flash needsnto die, the sooner the better.

Re:Developing Flash "apps" for a phone, eh?

[Bobfrankly1]

Actually, flash works great on my ipod touch. Non apple browser, yet able to navigate some of the flash sites that were inaccessible in Safari. The difference in battery life? Maybe I lose an hour compared to Safari use, but nowhere near the doomsday situation the anti-flash mob portrays. Flash doesn't need to die, and it tends to advance faster then the HTML specs. It's not the best choice for everything, but it does have it's place.

What do you mean by non-millionaires?

[The End Of Days]

What do you mean by non-millionaires? I get the whole populist concept that you should be able to get anything you want for free just because you want it, but there are costs involved in producing high end phone hardware that don't just vanish because of the ethics of those who don't like paying for stuff.

Re:What do you mean by non-millionaires?

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

What do you mean by non-millionaires? I get the whole populist concept that you should be able to get anything you want for free just because you want it...

Or maybe he just wants to make a minimal investment. It's nice to know that wisdom is a trait of people with a sense of entitlement.

Re:What do you mean by non-millionaires?

[Fred Ferrigno]

I took him to mean that he'd be willing to forgo certain "high end" features, invest time looking for a good deal (no one said "free" but you), and put in effort making up for any shortcomings. A millionaire might not be willing to make those trade-offs.

Anyways, capitalists are usually the ones who say ethics doesn't apply to commerce. The "fair" price is whatever the market will bear, by definition.

Re:What do you mean by non-millionaires?

[Vectormatic]

he "needs" a cpu powerfull enough to handle flash (good luck with that, intel just barely manages to make those) and android 2.3, that pretty much screams "high end android device"

Prepaid data in the US

[Anonymous Coward]

I have looked... and looked... and looked. As far as I have been able to tell (in Seattle, WA) there are no options for prepaid data in the US. Period. Good luck though.

Re:Prepaid data in the US

[ItsLenny]

Have you looked at virgin or cricket? .. i KNOW virgin has coverage in Seattle.. not sure about cricket

Re:Prepaid data in the US

[mspohr]

T-Mobile and ATT both have prepaid data.

Developer Nexus One

[Anonymous Coward]

The developer Nexus One is unlocked. You can slap different SIM cards in it when you are over seas and you need cellular data access. It also runs 2.3.3 (the Nexus S, which might also be an okay choice was the only device to run 2.3.0-2.3.2 with a stock ROM.)

The nice thing about the Nexus is you don't have to fight it to get root, or unlock. Also, it is easy enough to have ROM backups for 2.1 up. Which gives you an option of testing on older versions, should you need to.

I have personally used my Nexus One around both Europe and Japan, with no problems.

Consider a contract

[xaxa]

Personally, I bought my HTC Desire from e2save since I worked out it would cost about the same as buying the phone and using pay-as-you-go (£20/month × 24 = £480, but the phone alone cost about £380 at the time).

the purpose of flash on android

[Anonymous Coward]

The purpose of flash on Android is so that you can port existing flash apps to Android with ease. If you want to make Android apps, learn java.

Re:the purpose of flash on android

[Anonymous Coward]

What idiot moderator modded this redundant? This is the only post that even uses the word java at the time I am reading this. The closest is someone who said javascript. Just use the search function built in to your browser.

GSM phone with Cricket or Virgin

[ItsLenny]

The phone doesn't matter just make sure its GSM... You can use Cricket Wireless or Virgin in the US.. not sure about Europe. You might need 2 sim cards / providers to avoid paying "roaming" .. but Virgin and Cricket both offer unlimited data plans in the US. I know Virgin is in the UK too their "unlimited" data plans start at only $25/ month .. it'd probably be your best bet.

Re:GSM phone with Cricket or Virgin

[Anonymous Coward]

Virgin does GSM in the US? Might want to double-check -- I seriously believe they're CDMA only in the USA, and that seems to be what virginmobileusa.com says, too.

But hey, I'd LOVE to be wrong.

Re:GSM phone with Cricket or Virgin

[SighKoPath]

Virgin and Cricket are both CDMA. A GSM phone won't work there.

T-Mobile G2X

[King InuYasha]

I'd recommend the T-Mobile G2X, it works world-wide since it supports UMTS 850/1700/1900/2100 and GSM 850/900/1800/1900. If you buy it for the full price, you can get it unlocked immediately. It's a powerful dual core phone that runs near-stock Android, which is perfect for development!

Re:T-Mobile G2X

[teh31337one]

It's on 2.2.2, not gingerbread

Re:T-Mobile G2X

[JonySuede]

you want to test on devloppement code on crappy phone, To better optimize your apps and to make them compatible with more handset. Please don't make Wirth's law happen more rapidly.

Re:T-Mobile G2X

[King InuYasha]

Ahh, but if you don't optimize for multithreading, then apps on dual core phones suffer a lot. However, optimizing for multiple threads does give performance benefits on both single and dual core devices.

Re:T-Mobile G2X

[King InuYasha]

It'll get Gingerbread fairly quickly, since it is running near-stock Android. Plus, I'm sure someone will cook up a Gingerbread ROM for the G2X in the meantime.

Re:T-Mobile G2X

[teh31337one]

Depends on a whole bunch of things. G2 is running stock android, but it doesn't have gb yet. OEM customisations aren't the only reason for slow updates.

Re:T-Mobile G2X

[King InuYasha]

HTC said the Desire Z family in Canada, America, and Europe would be getting Gingerbread in June or July. I expect that the G2 will get it quicker than that because the G2 does not use HTC Sense.

Re:T-Mobile G2X

[teh31337one]

But sense isn't the issue. They've got sense up and running on android 2.3 - Desire S has it.

Check the support phones on Cyanogen Mod forums.

[Pengo]

There are almost no phones that are affordable running 2.3.

I do development and use a unlocked Incredible on Verizon, but it's not activated, I just have it using WiFI.

On the road my kids can use it as a portable game device, i have a hotspot 3g card so the phone works as a phone, even when roaming.

I paid less than $200 in a local paper to get the phone, it was in perfect condition and runs fine. I actually enjoy that phone so much with Cyanogen i'm tempted to use it in place of my iPhone (also on Verizon).

I personally would never buy any Android phone that wasn't supported by the Cyanogen developers. (I'm looking at you boot-locked Motorola!) :)

Flash is the problem

[rickb928]

Needing flash means you need a current phone and / or tablet. $$$

Re:Flash is the problem

[guruevi]

Needing Flash means you need a freakin' supercomputer these days. I haven't got a reliably working Flash on any mobile device and I've had them all - Nokia Nxxx series, Android, hacked iOS, Windows Mobile. Flash is just a piling heap of trash on non-desktop Windows. It kills your multitasking, it kills your battery, you end up killing your browser process most of the time because you can't wait for it to load.

Orange San Francisco plus Cyanogenmod for 2.3

[Anonymous Coward]

In the UK, get a PAYG Orange San Francisco (ZTE Blade) for 99 pounds, unlock it, install Cyanogenmod version of Android 2.3, pop in a SIM from giffgaff for 10 pounds a month. That's the UK part done.

Comments above mention Cricket Wireless or Virgin for a US SIM.

Re:Orange San Francisco plus Cyanogenmod for 2.3

[arkhan_jg]

They're now shipping a new variant of the san francisco (silently) that has a different screen on it. Which screws up cyanogenmod as the touchscreen driver doesn't work for the new screen; and if you didn't take a back up of the original firmware, putting the published orange firmware back on it has the same problem, as it's for the old variant also.

Still a great phone for the money, especially once unlocked for free, but my mate got bitten by this last week. Fortunately, he backed up his original firmware.

orange sanfrancisco/zte blade £90 the cheap

[Anonymous Coward]

In the Uk all the cheap people get orange san francisco phones. A rebranded zte blade. Then you flash it with a generic android rom to remove all the orange stuff and you have an unlocked android phone with the latest software. Low resolution but large 3.5" capacitive screen and all the gadgets if only 600mhz. But at £90 on payg what do you expect? Basically it ticks all the boxes of the more expensive phones.

For data in the uk t-mobile will do six months of internet access for £20 on payg, or you can get a three months/3gb sim card on three for about £7 on ebay.

In the USA I think you are stuffed, there are not any cheap data options. Or at least I could not find any when I visited. But it is triband so should in theory work.

Target Market

[Anonymous Coward]

Is OP planning on releasing any of this development as products to any marketplace?

If yes, OP is seriously limiting their pool of potential customers. Might as well sell software for WebTV...

Galaxy Player

[vgerclover]

What about the Galaxy Player?

It's pretty much a Galaxy S without the phone guts. Sadly, it hasn't come out yet, and it will come out with FroYo (although they have stated that, just as the Galaxy S, it will get Gingerbread).

Nexus One

[Anonymous Coward]

I bought a Nexus One phone direct from Google. It comes unlocked and it is pretty fast.

AT&T used to have a data-only plan but not any

[Anonymous Coward]

This is useless to you now, but: Way back, once upon a time (aka last June), AT&T offered unlimited smartphone data plans with no free minutes ($0.40/minute if you used it as a phone, with $0.30/SMS). The plan cost $30 or $35/month, I don't exactly remember.

It was an undocumented plan that you could only get by going to a badly hidden part of their website--retail store workers knew nothing about it and would actually get upset when I'd bring the phone in for service. So for about a year, I had a $30/month unlimited data-only 3G Nokia E71x with a SIP client and Fring.

That plan isn't offered anywhere anymore, and I've since switched to Verizon, but if you can find someone who still is grandfathered in, punch them in the face and take their SIM and you've got a chance.

I remember when poking around for similar plans, a Verizon retail shop said they had a $50/month data-only plan for the deaf, but--well, you had to be deaf. And I think that's gone too.

Just get an Android tablet

[tylersoze]

That's what I did. I bought a super dinky POS tablet for $82 off of newegg just to have something to develop on since I could care less about actually using the thing. Since I'm primary an iPhone developer and user, it was a good way to get my feet wet. Personally I find it a horrible platform, but if my client's want a version of their mobile app I'll just slap something together with a cross platform API.

Re:Just get an Android tablet

[Anonymous Coward]

Your seriously saying it's a horrible platform after only trying it on an 82 dollar tablet? Are you sure this couldn't have to do with the underpowered processor, the lack of the market app and a restive touch screen and an ancient version of Android?

Re:Just get an Android tablet

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't know tylersoze, but assume he's not completely braindead, when he says "platform" he just might mean that. Maybe he's not judging the platform by the user experience by the tablet which he acknowledges as "a super dinky POS", and specifically said he could[n't] care less about using it.

Maybe he thinks the dev tools suck, maybe he thinks the APIs suck, maybe he thinks the whole "run everything in a VM/JIT, it won't bother performance" approach sucks.

But now he knows you suck, since you think he needs a market app to test his own apps, can't tell the difference between "restive" and "resistive", and can't seem to comprehend what you're replying to.

What about Arm V7?

[rsilvergun]

If you want to do fancy apps you need the V7 (aka Cortex) processor, and most of the cheap stuff (like the phones from Virgin Mobile & Cricket) are the V6 processor (Arm 11). Anyone know a cheap V7 device?

Re:What about Arm V7?

[Svartalf]

Nook Color: 7" tablet reader with an OMAP3 at 800 MHz and can boot Honeycomb and Froyo off of a microSD.

Re:What about Arm V7?

[rsilvergun]

$270+ is kinda steep... Plus you've got to rely on rooting the tablet, and you never know when Barnes & Noble will fix the root exploit that lets you run whatever you want. This looks nice, but I've yet to read anything good about sub $200 tablets :(... Plus I'm not sure if the Marvell Aspen CPU is the right kind of ARM chip.

Re:What about Arm V7?

[ajlitt]

The "exploit" is that the CPU boots form the microSD slot (and USB) before it boots the embedded flash. This is a hardware configuration setting and can't be changed by software.

Unless B&N hires ninjas to break into people's houses and swap out all the existing Nook Colors, you're safe buying one now.

A Processor Powerful Enough To Support Flash?!?

[macs4all]

I'm sorry; but you just reduced your mobile device purchasing options to ZERO with that one spec.

Why don't you try learning to really code, instead.

Re:A Processor Powerful Enough To Support Flash?!?

[quenda]

He did not say it had to run all flash apps, just his own. Maybe they are not CPU hogs?
The old n800 tablet ran flash years ago on an ARM that must be dead slow by todays standards.

Re:A Processor Powerful Enough To Support Flash?!?

[Ash Vince]

I'm sorry; but you just reduced your mobile device purchasing options to ZERO with that one spec.

Why don't you try learning to really code, instead.

Lol, A guy called Macs4all slagging off flash :)

The guy wants to do Android development so you have nothing useful to contribute to this thread. Please go elsewhere.

Re:orange sanfrancisco/zte blade £90 the che

[rsilvergun]

Yeah, but isn't it the V6 processor? There's tons of stuff that won't run on that :(. You need the V7 (Cortex) processor to do cool stuff. I want to port my Firefox Plugin, but I can't afford a $200 phone + $100/mo + 2 year lease (I don't care what they call it, with those cancellation fees it's basically a lease).

The ARM tablets I've seen are either really, really expensive ($500+), or they're running the V6. I don't think there is a cheap alternative for Android hobbyist dev.

Re:Check the support phones on Cyanogen Mod forums

[rrossman2]

I posted this above, but I'll post again:

I've played around with the Samsung Galaxy S GT-i9000 a lot, and have tried a few different firmware options (both stock as well as homebrew/hybrids).

I noticed a few weeks ago SamFirmware.com shows 2.3.2 in the European firmware section..

I9000XWJV1 ## 512.PIT Version 2.3.2 2011 February DOWNLOAD 1 file select NO .PIT

I haven't tried it yet myself, as I"m using a hybrid with a US (Rogers Canada) based modem since it covers the frequencies I need, but I'm curious what the 2.3.2 holds. If it's an option, you could most likely pick up a GT-i9000(x) phone and use Odin to dump the 2.3.2 Euro firmware on and roll from there.

The (x) is because there's a few variants.. mine is actually the GT-i9000T which is a latin america based version that Immix Wireless sells (front facing camera instead of a flash on the rear facing camera). There's also a 9000B in the Mexico area, straight 9000's, 9000M's, and I'm not sure which others exist.

Link with some info:
http://www.samfirmware.com/apps/blog/entries/show/6282349-android-2-3-2-leaks-for-galaxy-s- [samfirmware.com]

The market has been hit and miss for some people after the update.. but according to that post if you root the phone the market works fine if it hadn't before.

Check out the Archos stuff

[Anonymous Coward]

I use an Archos 32... no GPS... but they have other options that DO have GPS, most starting at around $200 new. Might not do everything you want, but they doth rox much

Re:orange sanfrancisco/zte blade £90 the che

[rsilvergun]

DARG! I hate replying to my own posts, but I should have mentioned, if you're in the United States Virgin Mobile has a $25/mo + Tax Android with a V6 process here. The Freescale A Pad has all the specs you could ask for and a bargin price, but I've heard bad, bad things about the build quality...

Dream for not Millionaires...

[Anonymous Coward]

A Dream / G1 should do the trick. Can boot from Android 1.0 to 2.3.3...
So you can boot any version of Android you like and ...multi-test your apps on different versions too :-)

A bit laggy with the 2.3.x but still, you can use it for development.
Cheap enough too.

Re:Dream for not Millionaires...

[rickb928]

I've got two Dreams, both running 2.2.1, and that means no Flash. And the chipset won't do Flash. So if the OP wants Flash, he don't want a Dream.

I'm not sure I can run 2.3 well at all, so I haven't really tried. Maybe a MT3G would be a cheap play, but again no Flash.

a easy to modify great to develop for device

[Anonymous Coward]

Tmob g2 aka htc vision aka desire Z

Wi-Fi only works for me.

[GrantRobertson]

Agreed
I dropped my Verizon contract and went back to Sprint because I couldn't afford the data plan any more. (Yes, I saved money even after paying the $150 contract breaking fee.) Ever since, I've been using my Droid doing all the same things I used to do before - except talking on the phone - as long as I can get a Wi-Fi connection, which is just about everywhere I go. Heck, I could never use the thing outside anyway because the screen is awful for reading in sunlight. So, in the end, I am getting just about the same functionality without paying for a data plan.

get a used one with a bad ESN

[Anonymous Coward]

Used verizon or sprint phones that have been "blacklisted" due to having a bad ESN (usually due to failure to pay the bill) go for far under value, on top of the discount you'd be getting for buying used. You could probably grab a HTC Incredible for under $200. You can't activate it with Sprint/Verizon, but that doesn't affect wifi use.

HTC Leo\HD2

[Anonymous Coward]

Why not an HTC Leo\HD2? It's easy to get it to run Android, it's fast, has a big screen, and all the Android builds are pre-rooted so you don't have to fight with it.

Air + Flash + mobile

[Anonymous Coward]

Why does this sound like a train wreck waiting to happen?

Cheating at Halo 2

[tepples]

Remember the days of Microsoft Halo 2 and "standbying"? You can simulate a dropout by hitting the standby button.

Re:Cheating at Halo 2

[Anonymous Coward]

Remember the days of Microsoft Halo 2 and "standbying"? You can simulate a dropout by hitting the standby button.

That's simulating a sudden power outage in the cell tower, that's not simulating how cell phone data travels.

You guys are funny.

B: "You should test your raincoat by jumping into a pool!"
A: "Err all my clothes etc will get wet no matter what, that's not what I'm testing."
C: "Wear a diver's suit under it!"
A: "Then I'll never see how wet my clothes will actually get. Why can't I just take it outside when it rains?"
D: "That's stupid! My suggestion is way better!"

Swappa?

[gollito]

You might find something reasonably priced at Swappa

Not exactly what you're asking for...

[amateurhr]

But I thought I would offer up this link:
http://www.mobilexweb.com/emulators
HTH
FWIW - 1st /. post :)

Android phone

[woboyle]

I have an almost unused Nexus One that is unlocked. It is tuned for T-Mobile. I had to get one tuned for AT&T, but still have the original that Google gave me at last year's Linux Collaboration Summit. I only used it for about 2 months. You can send me a private message about this if you are interested.

Nexus One

[Redlazer]

Nexus One. Get a used one if you want it cheap.

Foolish.

[Anonymous Coward]

“I am about to start developing Air and Flex apps for Android.” The platform you are targeting has full HTML 5 capabilities. HTML 5 supersedes Flash. What could possibly compel you to use difficult APIs on that slow, archaic platform when there are numerous alternatives that are far better suited to developing touch applications? Sorry, but you are really dumb.

Re:Foolish.

[Anonymous Coward]

Difficult APIs on slow archaic platforms sounds precisely like a description of JS + CSS on a browser. When was the last time you ever used Flash?

Samsung

[Brian Feldman]

I'd go with an unlocked Samsung Nexus S.

Touch Revolution

[Anonymous Coward]

These guys make 7" and 10.1" Android Development kits. Comes with Android 2.2 including full sources
www.touchrev.com The product is the Nimble and they sell it as a development kit for either $2000 or $2500.

Expensive but very sweet.

Ebay

[GWBasic]

There are a lot of free Android phones given out at Google conferences, and people sell their old ones. Just check eBay, and if you're buying international, check with the seller to make sure he or she is okay with shipping overseas.

Problem: Solved - Buy a G2

[Laebshade]

Buy a G2, root/unlock, install Cyanogenmod 7.0 (Gingerbread/2.3), or any one of the other Gingerbread ROMs. You can buy a G2 from here: http://swappa.com/buy/htc-g2-t-mobile - there's currently six listings, from $335 to $410, and all of them are rooted. The phone should work in the UK, too.

I have the same phone, running CM 7.0 (nightly 38), and I love it. I had the original G1 until recently, and it's a night and day difference. I firmly believe the G2 will suit your needs and more.

Adobe is behind

[Anonymous Coward]

I sure hope that Adobe can get the AIR apps working on the iPad/iPhone/Android devices properly. Right now it requires the latest and greatest of everything and feels quite buggy on Android. I dropped it when I realized the iOS devices had to be jailbroken, not sure where Adobe is now with it.

Instead I went with Sencha Touch. I was new to ExtJS and picked it up in a few days. Allows for custom interfaces and/or a native look, plus it's GPL which is always refreshing. It's easy to add into the app store (with phone gap) or even easier to deploy via downloading from the webpage itself.

By the way, the Flash to HTML5 is a great idea but basically vaporware at this point. It exports images... I've been doing with SWF decompilers for quite some time now...

Re:Check the support phones on Cyanogen Mod forums

[Necron69]

Ignore new phones and get just about any Samsung Galaxy-S/I9000 phone off eBay. The Cyanogenmod guys have a quite usable port of Gingerbread 2.3.3 ported from the Nexus S now. It isn't quite mainline yet, but it works great:

http://forum.cyanogenmod.com/topic/17020-all-models-cyanogenmod-7-for-samsung-galaxy-s-phones-build-20110303/

My hope is that since the Nexus S is so new, and the Galaxy-S phones are nearly identical hardware, I'm now good for another couple years of Android versions. I've never been happier with my Captivate. Best phone I've ever had!

- Necron69

Europe--easy, US--hard

[t2t10]

Any international GSM phone will work on pretty much any prepaid plain in most EU countries. You can get really cheap plans and pay by day or month.

In the US, that's a different story. AT&T has a prepaid GSM plan, but you pay $20 for 100 Mbytes and 30 days limit. For that to work, you need a phone that's compatible with AT&T's frequencies. T-Mobile has no usable prepaid data plan. Sprint, Verizon, MetroPCS, and Virgin Mobile use networks that only work in the US.

Your best bet is to get a European Android phone (whichever you like, you can get a cheap one starting at around EU 150), use it in Europe with a prepaid plan, and in the US over WiFi.

Or just get two phones. Virgin Mobile has a decent prepaid plan, but the Android phone is Virgin Mobile only (it's also cheap: $150 unlocked, no contract).

Nook Color?

[lars_boegild_thomsen]

I know the original post said GPS and Camera, but apart from those two the perfect bet would be a hacked Nook Color :) List price of USD 249 but was sold on eBay for 199 and it runs Android 2.1 (eclair), 2.2 (Froyo) and 2.3 (Gingerbread) just fine and flash 10.2 in the last two of these.

device anywhere

[phantomfive]

Device anywhere allows you to rent time on basically any phone you want, and they have data center in different countries on different carriers. You might consider testing your app out first on an emulator, then when it is pretty much working, rent some time on DeviceAnywhere's phone system, to easily try different configurations of carriers/models/countries. Here is the link, it may or may not be something that works out for you, but you should be aware of it anyway.

Disclaimer: I am currently doing some work for DeviceAnywhere.

Re:device anywhere

[phantomfive]

Oh, BTW, please don't think that my sig is referring to my current company! :)

(if you are wondering, it is mainly referring to the android framework and kernel additions, which are hopelessly under-commented)

What about the obvious choice?

[loosescrews]

The GSM Nexus S comes to mind. It has Android 2.3, GMS support (should work in both the US and UK), and one of the fastest ARM A8s available. It costs $529.99 at Best Buy. I don't think that is millionaire class spending, but I guess the definition might vary a bit. GSM pre-paid data should be available in much of the world.

Et Tu, Machina?

[Zephiris]

"I don't need to use the phone, so I am looking for an unlocked phone"
Well, there's your problem right there.

Also, the android SDK has emulators for all of their phone API levels. If you're planning to get a phone, "but not a phone", it would obviously be cheaper to use that, especially if you aren't planning to use any sort of advanced features (like for 'flash'). You could then just ask someone you know to test things on their phone to make sure it looks like what you see on the SDK.

Otherwise, if you're looking for a phone...that can make phone calls, I hear that Android and iPhone are actually pretty bad at it!

Nexus S or Nexus One

[Anonymous Coward]

Nexus S (or the N1). It's sold unlocked out of the box and is a stock Android experience. No need for nefarious exploits to root it - the bootloader is unlocked, and you get root access by typing 'fastboot oem unlock' in a shell somewhere.

I recently had a friend buy one for me in the US and ship it to New Zealand for me. It worked straight away, even on 3G.

ZTE Blade??

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you UK based? Then Orange San Fransisco (ZTE Blade) for less than GBP100 on PAYG. Lots of community support. Comes with 2.1 but 2.2 and early 2.3 available:

http://android.modaco.com/content/zte-blade-roms-rom-customisation/332509/rom-cyanogenmod-7-for-zte-blade-san-francisco-v7-0-0-rc1-02-16-2011/

Archos

[Lozrus]

Archos have a range of tablets at good prices. Just be careful if you're doing UI work, because the smaller models have a resistive touch screen. But pretty much all Android devices can function without a SIM anyway.

Pay as you go deals in the UK

[Anonymous Coward]

PAYG deals for data in the UK are pretty snazzy. Everybody offers freebies whenever you top up.
Top up £10 with Vodafone and you get 300 texts, 500mb of data, and £10 to use on calls / whatever.
O2 offer the same deal but with unlimited wifi through BT Openzones.
SIM cards are free with both.

Orange San Francicso PAYG at £120, use Cyano

[Anonymous Coward]

It's actually a ZTE Blade, which runs Cyanogenmod fairly smoothly, has a nice 800x480 screen, and a pretty rubbish camera.

Zii?

[Drethon]

The Zii devices look interesting to me: http://www.zii.com/Technology/HardwarePlatform/ZiiTrinity

However I think they may be more focused on low level development when it sounds like you are more after app development. Also I haven't looked much into them but I don't know what networks they will run on if any...

If you're in the UK...

[Anonymous Coward]

... and travelling to the US, you might have a hard time finding a pay-as-you-go SIM card in some places. Be creative. Where there is no AT&T or T-Mobile presence, I have still found cheap AT&T and T-Mobile pay-as-you-go phones at Target, CVS Pharmacy, and gas stations. These can be cannibalised for their SIM cards.

Don't get Verizon, Sprint, TracFone, Virgin Mobile, Net10, Alltel or anything else. Those are CDMA, not GSM. This works with AT&T GoPhone and T-Mobile To Go only.

Get a top-up card as well (because you won't get to use the free minutes that come with the phone). DO NOT turn the phone on. Take out its SIM card, put it in your phone, and activate it using the instructions provided.

Do your own research

[Anonymous Coward]

Seriously, check out http://www.google.com/phone and check it out yourself. They'll post anything on slashdot now-a-days it seems.

Don't bother with 3G

[jonescb]

I don't know why you'd want to have 3G in the US and in Europe, but there are zero pay-as-you-go 3G data only plans. Perhaps there are in Europe, but nobody will sell one in the US. If you want 3G you have to pay for voice and text as well; however, T-Mobile will probably sell you that without a contract at least. Secondly, I'm fairly certain that the frequency for 3G is different in Europe than in the US. T-Mobile and AT&T have incompatible 3G frequencies, and both are incompatible with what's used in Europe. Just save yourself the trouble and use Wifi.

millionaire

[nwmann]

dude i sling burgers around a restaurant for a living, supporting my wife and child... and i can afford a high end android phone for myself and wife... if you are developing for this platform just man up and shell out... it doesn't take a millionaire to buy one.

Orange San Francisco (a.k.a ZTE Blade)

[Karem Lore]

Get an Orange San Francisco PayG phone (circa £99), pay $5 to get it unlocked online and then use ROM Manager to install the Cyanogen 7 RC2.

total cost to you: approx £120 tops.

unlocked, poor condition

[Anonymous Coward]

cex.co.uk have unlocked HTC Desire in poor condition (scratches etc) for £185.
HTC will be pushing out a 2.3 update in the next few weeks.

T-Mobile Comet

[Anonymous Coward]

My fiancee and I both have T-Mobile comets on pre-paid plans. She got hers from Amazon. They're also available from Newegg. I got mine at a local Radio Shack.

I love this thing. I got the phone for $100 after prepaying $30 in airtime.

Device Anywhere - http://www.deviceanywhere.com/

[zcold]

This company will let you remote into android phones and other devices to run and test your software. http://www.deviceanywhere.com/

Maybe the open dev environment PandaBoard?

[Anonymous Coward]

UrbanaMan, have you looked at PandaBoard?
http://pandaboard.org/
For $174 you get a dual-core 1.2 GHz processor
that runs Android and Linux, with connectors for
Bluetooth, HDMI, USB, ethernet, and so forth.

Archos?

[Anonymous Coward]

Get one of the new Archos. I have the 32, but if you can afford the 43, buy that one. It's about $200 and has most of the features you are looking for in an iPhone comparable screen size. The 32 (and surely the 43) is extremely lightweight. I'm not sure if the 43 has GPS, but you could always use an external one.

For phone functionality, you'll have to use something like SipDroid.

G1 never dies

[Ragica]

I got an old G1 online for less than $100 (including shipping). It is a bit slow, but still quite functional, unless you want to be running processor intensive games like Angry Birds. I have around 100 apps installed that run fine. The thing is jail broken, and has a cyanogen mod installed (SparksMod currently). And I actually use it for my primary mobile phone -- with no data plan (because I refuse to be gouged any further by our Canadian oligopolies)... wifi is good enough for me. And I'm loving the 4 row physical keyboard.

Try www.letstalkphones.us

[Anonymous Coward]

This site offers unlocked phones. Just choose this option at check out. This online store also offers prepaid international card allows you to take your GSM mobile phone overseas, without incurring high roaming charges. Here is that link: http://riveroffers.com/prepaid_cellular.html?crid=173265