Note To Cheaters: Next Time Hire the Brains

An anonymous reader writes "A man and his accomplice are accused of cheating on a Medical College Admissions Test (MCAT) by using a wireless pinhole camera and cellphone to send realtime images of the exam questions to a team of people supplying the 'correct' answers. One problem: the 'answer team' was tricked into the job by being told they were taking a test to qualify them as MCAT tutors. There were several clues the 'tutor exam' was bogus, including the poor quality of the images of the questions. Suspicious, the 'answer team' discovered the real MCAT test was occurring at the same time. They started feeding wrong answers to the accused cheaters and called campus security. The two accused cheaters now face several charges as a result."

Comments

Criminal Charges?

[Anonymous Coward]

Since when does cheating on an exam result in criminal charges????

Re:Criminal Charges?

[enderjsv]

Could be fraud charges related less to them cheating, and more to them duping people into thinking they were applying for a job. But I'm not a lawyer.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[knotprawn]

Oh that's because they were using an i-Phone

Re:Criminal Charges?

[pclminion]

Since when does cheating on an exam result in criminal charges????

Next time a "doctor" is about to put you under and saw through your sternum to operate on your heart, ask yourself the same question.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[syousef]

Since when does cheating on an exam result in criminal charges????

Since it could put lives in danger. Cheating on an exam for a pilot's license for instance would get you into similar trouble. (So could lying about your current qualifications as a pilot or experience). That's a glamorous example but basically any specialized job which requires qualifications, if you lie about them, could land you with a criminal record. And it makes sense. You don't want someone not qualified as an engineer designing a bridge. You don't want someone who doesn't know what they're doing with gas pipes installing a gas water heater. The potential for death and injury is just too high.

The only difference in this case is that it's a college entrance exam, not one for getting accredited or qualified, as others have pointed out. Still, I don't think someone cheating to get in is going to go straight and stop cheating once they are in.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[PPH]

Oh that's because they were using an i-Phone

It was a pin-hole camera, not a pin-head camera.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Velex]

Next time a "doctor" is about to put you under and saw through your sternum to operate on your heart, ask yourself the same question.

I hope if I get to that point (heart problems run in my family) I've another citizenship besides USA in a country that doesn't try to shoehorn capitalism into medicine.

After working at an answering service for 5 years, I've learned that doctors in the USA at least are duplicitous, technically inept (as in can't understand their pager doesn't work when turned off), and willing to lie left and right just to get a small discount on their bill. I've stopped going to my doctor altogether because the board of directors at the affiliated hospital let us know that it might not be safe to be a patient of one of their doctors any more over a billing dispute.

I have less respect for doctors than I do lawyers, because at least the lawyer clients have some basis for an argument when they dispute their bill. All doctors know are cuss words, and I intend to drop my health insurance next open enrollment period because I'm sick of subsidizing these pigs.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Mashiki]

This being Canada, and all that. We take a very dim view of this type of stuff. So cheaters beware, you will be criminally nailed to the wall for it.
Ala:

404. Every one who falsely, with intent to gain advantage for himself or some other person, personates a candidate at a competitive or qualifying examination held under the authority of law or in connection with a university, college or school or who knowingly avails himself of the results of such personation is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction.

Summer conviction means 2 years or less.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Oxford_Comma_Lover]

Having Insurance is like winning a battle in which many people die: it's worse than almost anything, except for losing one/not having insurance when you need it.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Oxford_Comma_Lover]

Nah--From TFA: each facing six charges including theft, unauthorized use of a computer, using a device to obtain unauthorized service and theft of data.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Anonymous Coward]

there is a reason the rich from other countries come here when they want a complex heart surgery.

So they only have to wait 3 days instead of 10?

Try comparing the billing you get for any procedure to that of someone who is not insured.

Sure. My wife went to the emergency room recently with a severe allergic reaction. They thought we were uninsured and sent us the full bill, which was $530. When they found our we had insurance, they billed our insurance company $3400, of which they paid $1100.00, and now the hospital want a $100 deductible.

If you think private insurance is a sane way to pay for health care you are a fucking moron.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Alien Being]

It's more abhorrent since it's a medical test. I had the recent displeasure of working in an IT job related to med schools. From the bits and pieces that I saw of the more promising applications I processed, I'm truly horrified by the entire "profession". How could someone have such good college transcripts and MCAT scores yet write such stupid essays, I wondered? This explains a lot.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[kcitren]

I hope if I get to that point (heart problems run in my family) I've another citizenship besides USA in a country that doesn't try to shoehorn capitalism into medicine.

What does a capitalist vs socialist economy have to do with how to test and qualify doctors?

I've stopped going to my doctor altogether because the board of directors at the affiliated hospital let us know that it might not be safe to be a patient of one of their doctors any more over a billing dispute.

If this is true, then you should publicize this behavior. Treating a patient differently, especially if, as you said, in a dangerous manner, based on who they work violates the rules of ethical behavior and codes on conduct.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Alien Being]

Yep, and due to our horrible system we are attracting the very worst of them. MD means nothing to me anymore. They're the sleaziest of them all.

Here in Massachusetts, where we have some of the finest medical schools, we are legally obligated to buy their shit. Mitt Romney is now trying to explain why that's right for MA but wrong for the nation.

Doctor, heal thyself.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[FiloEleven]

I've been looking for that statute for years, but every time I thought I had it the only message was "Not Found"!

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Anonymous Coward]

Next time a "doctor" is about to put you under and saw through your sternum to operate on your heart, ask yourself the same question.

I hope if I get to that point (heart problems run in my family) I've another citizenship besides USA in a country that doesn't try to shoehorn capitalism into medicine.

After working at an answering service for 5 years, I've learned that doctors in the USA at least are duplicitous, technically inept (as in can't understand their pager doesn't work when turned off), and willing to lie left and right just to get a small discount on their bill.
I've stopped going to my doctor altogether because the board of directors at the affiliated hospital let us know that it might not be safe to be a patient of one of their doctors any more over a billing dispute.

I have less respect for doctors than I do lawyers, because at least the lawyer clients have some basis for an argument when they dispute their bill. All doctors know are cuss words, and I intend to drop my health insurance next open enrollment period because I'm sick of subsidizing these pigs.

Boy, if you think doctors are inept now, wait until the bureaucracy takes over. Nothing spells incompetence like a bureaucrat. If you think medicine is a bad example, look at cars. Compare cars made by governments (Communist countries) to cars made by private citizens (capitalist countries) and tell me which one is more reliable, more efficient and safer? Now, ask yourself if you want your doctor to run like a Toyota or a Moskvitch.

There is a big difference between cars and medical care: You can figure out which car is a better buy. You can't figure out which doctor is a better doctor before you agree to pay them. Google "kenneth arrow healthcare" to see the seminal paper on this topic.

Every industrialized country other than the US has a solution to this: Experts who understand medicin evaluate medical procedures and outcomes per-doctor, and administer the medical system to do what individuals would do if they had better information. This leads to better outcomes at a lower cost. If you believe that the government can't do this, then please explain how 35 of them have outdone the US market-based system year after year for several decades.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[dgatwood]

It's more abhorrent since it's a medical test.

No, not really. If this were an exam that you take on the way out of med school, then yes, it would be more abhorrent. On the way in, all it does is mean that some people who shouldn't have been admitted will waste a whole lot of money unsuccessfully trying to pass classes that they weren't really ready for.

I'd expect that anybody who couldn't take the MCAT and do well on his/her own would wash out of med school anyway. It's not like you can keep up that sort of charade all the way through med school. When the prof asks you questions in class and you show a complete inability to think on your feet, when you can't pull off the most basic tasks during lab sections, or when you prove completely inept during your residency, they're gonna know that you're not cut out for a career as a doctor.

Basically, cheating works until you get caught. If you keep cheating, you will eventually get caught. The severity of the punishment tends to be directly proportional to how long you went without getting caught. Therefore, cheating is something that only a moron would do for very long. Ignoring the ethical question for a moment, this means that it can only be useful as a way of getting past some seemingly impossible hurdle like getting a near-perfect score on the MCAT so you can get into a top-tier medical school instead of having to settle for a lesser school.

So basically, it's not very likely that this would have any real negative impact on the quality of medical care (beyond the question of whether you'd want somebody with such poor ethical judgment taking care of you). And ironically, it might actually improve medical care if the lesser students went to the better schools and vice versa. In short, the only people who are really harmed by this are the other people taking the MCAT, who are competing against these alleged cheaters for spots in specific medical schools. This is not to say that the behavior is excusable, just that it is no more abhorrent than cheating on a GRE, an SAT, an ACT, or any other school entrance exam.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[wisty]

* Basically, cheating works until you get caught. If you keep cheating, you will eventually get caught. *

Not true. Lots of people cheat through a large swath of uni.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Alien Being]

If the cheaters get in then honest students are kept out.

I can't understand why anyone would try to rationalize this type of bullshit.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[wisty]

Boy, if you think doctors are inept now, wait until the bureaucracy takes over. Nothing spells incompetence like a bureaucrat. If you think medicine is a bad example, look at cars. Compare cars made by governments (Communist countries) to cars made by private citizens (capitalist countries) and tell me which one is more reliable, more efficient and safer? Now, ask yourself if you want your doctor to run like a Toyota or a Moskvitch.

Compare the roads built BY communist countries (dictatorships) to the roads built BY capitalist (democratic) countries.

Both have bureaucrats building the roads. But democracies seem to build very good roads (generally speaking).

Re:Criminal Charges?

[ArcherB]

Your simplistic world view betrays your ignorance and lack of intelligence.

And your response lacks any supporting statements whatsoever. It contains exactly as many facts as the tried and true "I'm rubber, you're glue..." argument.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Anonymous Coward]

Of course he's implying that. Because absolutely anything at all run by the gubmint automatically sucks.

What we need are two-fisted Randian Objectivist doctors! Who'll only help you if you're a benefit to society! No pesky 'ethics,' show your sawbones the money or you're just worm food. Forget about 'malpractice,' if a doctor keeps having patients die on him then people will stop going to him. /sarcasm, but do I really need to include the tag?

Re:Criminal Charges?

[davester666]

That had to be easy work.

if (parents net work > $2,000,000)
    accept 'donation' to school and accept application
else if (randomly pick 1 in 10 application)
  accept application and give scholarship
else
  reject application
end

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Your.Master]

Wait, so in 2004 amid shart increases in revascularization in both Canada and the US, the US had a narrow (statistically significant, but narrow) lead in 5-year mortality after heart disease, and that's the deciding factor for which healtchare system is best?

When the US has declined in revascularization since then (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3072819/) and Canada has increased (http://www.qualitymeasures.ahrq.gov/content.aspx?id=15079&search=Aortocoronary+bypass+for+heart+revascularization%2C+not+otherwise+specified)?

Now, that doesn't necessarily mean the US was wrong to decrease its rate. The optimum might have been in the middle, or there might be some better new method.

But it's easier to say "go to Japan or, failing that, France":

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_hea_dis_dea-health-heart-disease-deaths

(note the US has more than 10% higher fatality than Canada in that graph...).

I can't speak to that Daily Mail article, but it's of an entirely different calibre than your other evidence.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Zenin]

Flawed analogy.

Capitalists didn't make cars safer...bureaucracy (safety regulation) did. Capitalists fought safer cars at every turn and still do today. Seat belts, air bags, crumple zones, mandatory safety tests, etc, etc, etc. All of it pure government bureaucracy keeping you and yours safe on American highways.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[jjohnson]

So explain why the first world countries with universal health care run by the government in some fashion all have life expectancies two years greater than Americans, and do it at 55% the cost.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[harrytuttle777]

I've another citizenship besides USA in a country that doesn't try to shoehorn capitalism into medicine.

You make the mistake common mistake in believing that business wants capitalism. Nothing could be further from the truth. Capitalism is a system where ruthless competition between suppliers creates a system where the best quality goods and services are delivered for the best possible cost to the consumer. What business (what medicine has become) wants is protectionism. They want a monopoly and a guaranteed source of income without having to compete.

In the USA, between the lawyers, and HMOs and AMA, we have a defacto socialized system. The consumers no longer pay for their bill, and hence Adam Smith's invisible hand has not worked in many a year. You are not paying your doctor directly. It has to go through a handful of billing professionals first. e.g. Medical data entry clerks, HMO, Malpractice, etc. before it gets to the doctor. You are no longer the customer; the HMO is.

I have said it before, but was called a fagot for saying it, but I will saying it again. The only hope for the USian medical system would be to abolish the AMA, Malpractice, and the HMOs. Let patients pay for their own medical care out of their pocket. If they can't afford it, the hospitals can work with the families to work off the medical bill, or some other arrangements could be made. This is how it used to be done.

It is totally incomprehensible that a trip to the hospital in an ambulance will cost you over 1000USD. The current system can not continue to work much longer.

  No Obama care (as much as I respect our president) will not fix the problem, it will only make it worse, and legally guarantee a monopoly for the HMOs.

I've stopped going to my doctor altogether

At least you have taken a sensible coarse of action. If you do not like your doctor go to another. That is real capitalism at work.

I have been living without medical insurance for a couple years now. It is possible. I tend to watch what I eat more closely, and try to live healthier because I do not have the socialized safety net of my HMO. Sure if I get in an accident, or get a heart attack, I will die, but hasn't it always been the case?

-The writer of this post is a fagot.

-Sincerely the AMA.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[PitaBred]

He's not condoning it. He's simply explaining that the post he is replying to doesn't have a valid concern and why, not saying people should cheat at anything. A car traveling at 60mph is a completely different situation when it's traveling toward you at 60mph. The GPP is saying the car isn't really coming at us at 60mph.

Reading comprehension FTW for both you and whoever modded you up.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Vintermann]

Communist countries sucked at stuff like building cars, but they had excellent scientists, doctors, and performing artists. To take the space race as an example: how do you think the Soviet union got the first satellite, the first man in space, the first unmanned orbit around the moon and return to earth, and the first unmanned mood landing, despite the unquestionably inferior economic infrastructure?

I'll tell you why, though it's rather obvious. People in these professions are strongly motivated by things beside economic success. And when economic success isn't really available as a goal, those motivations which you could give yourself (intellectual achievement, helping people and earning their gratitude and admiration, expressing yourself artistically, becoming "People's artist of the Soviet Union", "Hero of the Soviet Union" and the various other medals and awards they offered) become all the more important. It was the boring jobs the poor Soviet citizens sucked at - which unfortunately for them also include some damn important jobs.

Doctors in the wealthy world are inept now (despite their awesome infrastructure, enabled by us hordes of money-motivated individuals willing to do the drudgework to supply them with their tools) because they're not allowed to do what they want to do - help people. The business venture model of medicine is totally worshipped, so that a doctor becomes a conveyor belt-like producer of medical "services", five minutes per patient, I mean CUSTOMER, to follow the script slavishly, and always check the patient's insurance before deciding how and whether to help him.

Worship of business model-thinking is also endemic here in countries with so-called "socialist" countries. It's just that instead of checking the patient's insurance, overcharging and using the minimal amount of time, it's filling out the right kind of forms at every opportunity to make your administrator look good and secure funding, and then using the minimal amount of time.

> Now, ask yourself if you want your doctor to run like a Toyota or a Moskvitch

Funny you should mention Toyota. The success of Japanese cars owed a lot to Edward Deming, a business theorist who was as much a paternalist as a capitalist, and emphasized motivations beside money (in particular, pride in the quality of your work). In short, he tried to give assembly-line producers the kind of motivation doctors, scientists and performing artists already have. The Japanese embraced him, his American countrymen rejected his theories as sentimental, un-capitalistic nonsense (until they were forced to change, since everyone bought superior quality Japanese cars). Deming's theories are now mis-applied in education and medicine and responsible for a lot of the mess there, because the current generation of administators refuse to see how different those domains are from assembly-line production.

As witnessed by you, since you compare the working of a doctor to that of a car engine.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[cowboy76Spain]

Yeah... Car makers in the more capitalist countries have done so well that they have needed to be bailed out with public money

Damn socialists! USA! USA! USA!

Re:Criminal Charges?

[maxwell demon]

Of course, in reality the insurance's bet is more like: Either nothing bad will happen, or they will find a way to claim that the bad thing that happened is not covered.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[TheRaven64]

Sure, because ability to work a pager has a great deal to do with providing successful medical care.

Have you been in a hospital in the last 20 years? On a typical day, a doctor (even a GP) will be expected to use dozens of pieces of high-tech machinery. Of these, the pager is the least complex...

Re:Criminal Charges?

[delinear]

I can't speak to that Daily Mail article, but it's of an entirely different calibre than your other evidence.

The fact that it's from the Daily Mail speaks for itself. The ... I'm loathe to call it a "newspaper" ... has a certain reputation for panic-inducing sensationalist right-wing stories and a political agenda which lends itself nicely to criticism of the National Health Service. I'm not saying their story was definitely wrong, but I'd give it a lot more credence if it was cited from practically any other source.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[Zargs]

The bankers cheated, the man in the street guys got caught instead of them, now, with the aid of government bailouts, you're paying for them cheating while they, the financial guys wallow in the dirty money that they're still making - extrapolate that to any other form of cheating. the only time professionals get censured is when they get caught stealing from their professional associations

Re:Criminal Charges?

[jefe7777]

Basically, cheating works until you get caught. If you keep cheating, you will eventually get caught.

And then they get out into the job market, excel at fucking up a lot, and eventually find themselves a lucrative career in management.

Fixed that for ya.

Re:Criminal Charges?

[jjohnson]

Canada has a life expectancy 2.5 years greater than the U.S. We have more smokers per capita, five times the number of donut shops per capita, and a province representing a quarter of our population who thinks a good meal is a plate french fries covered in cheese curds and gravy. I don't think you can say that Canadian lifestyles are significantly different from American ones in a way that accounts for that big a gap.

And there's more to health care costs than the efficiency of health care.

Yes: There's the fact that as a portion of health care dollars spent, the U.S. spends almost twice as much as Canada on administrative costs (28% vs. 16%, last time I checked).

The charges are bullshit.

[pclminion]

According to documents filed in provincial court in Richmond, B.C., Josiah Miguel Ruben and Houman Rezazadeh-Azar are each facing six charges including theft, unauthorized use of a computer, using a device to obtain unauthorized service and theft of data.

THESE are the charges? How about "conspiracy to commit murder," or "reckless endangerment?" These are the people who will be our medical doctors?!

Re:The charges are bullshit.

[Anonymous Coward]

The MCAT just gets you into med school. It's basically a college's way of weeding out people out that aren't worth their time. The MCAT isn't what gets you your license to practice medicine.

Of course, I agree that I wouldn't want such a person being my physician.

Re:The charges are bullshit.

[Opportunist]

"Oh, I really wanted to learn when I am accepted, honestly, I just wanted to cheat to get in and THEN I start to learn for real"

Sorry, but do you really expect someone who cheats for an admission test to stop there? They don't have the knowledge and skill to start a curriculum, how do expect them to pass without continued cheating?

Re:The charges are bullshit.

[Anonymous Coward]

Doctors are abusive, neglectful cheapskates. I've been told by the board of directors at a local hospital that it's not safe for me to go to their hospital any more over a billing dispute. If I ever have to deal with a doctor again, I'll be calling my lawyer, because after the threats I've received (on recordings I'd subpeona), I think it'd be easy for me to win malpractice against any area hospital.

One, and only one, of the following is true:

1) Absolutely all people everywhere of the same profession are identical in every way, and therefore the general conclusions about doctors you've drawn from your specific experience with one hospital are valid.
2) You're a moron.

Re:The charges are bullshit.

[Ruke]

You can't make "suspected future intention to cheat on a licensing exam" a crime. The unauthorized use of a computer doesn't even make any sense, as well as using a device to obtain unauthorized access to a service. I'd be interested to see if they can make "theft" stick: the tests usually come with boilerplate preventing you from making unauthorized copies, but seeing as they paid for the test and were given it freely, that probably doesn't apply. The tests do usually come with boilerplate saying you can't make unauthorized copies, but that'd fall under contract violation, which is a civil violation, not criminal.

The thing is, they cheated, but that's not really illegal. It's wrong, but not illegal. They didn't endanger any lives; sure, they might have at some point, but they didn't actually do anything yet. They shouldn't be allowed into medical school, they should never be doctors, but they shouldn't be arrested.

Re:The charges are bullshit.

[hedwards]

This is less about a barrier to entry than it is about ethics. They need to weed folks out in some fashion and I for one wouldn't want somebody that was willing to cheat on an exam to get an artificial boost into med school. On what basis would you suggest that the individuals would stop there?

Re:The charges are bullshit.

[91degrees]

Ouch! Those are trumped up charges. Nothing was taken (especially with the intention of depriving someone else of it), the computer use was authorised by the owner of the computer. No "service" was obtained, and I don't now about theft of data, but would assume that's a lot more specific than illicitly attaining any information.

Sadly it seems that there's no law that covers this. Perhaps there should be one but unless there is the law has it that no crime is committed.

Re:The charges are bullshit.

[Ruke]

Neither of those things are recognized as crimes, and neither of those things are the crimes that the student was charged with.

The first case is simply ridiculous; the MCAT isn't an admission exam, it's closer to the SAT, where you take the test and are given a score on a scale up to 45. Medical schools then look at that score, in conjunction with other things, when deciding whether to admit you. Secondly, admission to a school is nothing like intellectual property, other than the fact that neither is a physical object. Thirdly, when applying to a school, you specifically waive the right to sue them over their selection methods (other than those which are federally protected, such as race, age, gender, etc.)

Cheating is almost definitely against the TOS they signed. However, contract violation is not a crime, it's a civil matter, so you can't be arrested for it. Similarly, contract violation is never something as obtuse as "unauthorized access to a computer system."

No one is saying that what they did is okay. No one is saying that they shouldn't be punished within the system that they cheated. However, cheating is not a crime, and it's ridiculous to insist that someone should face criminal punishment for failing to follow a private organization's rules, which have not been given the consideration and due process that actually laws carry.

Wrong Line of Work

[Nefarious Wheel]

I think the cheaters probably have a much more rewarding career ahead of them with an organisation such as the CIA or ASIO.

Re:Wrong Line of Work

[hedwards]

Indeed, the CIA actually wants people that know what they're doing. They'll train agents on any cheating and trickery that's necessary to do their job, but most agents don't need that type of thing for their jobs. The CIA employs a surprising number of people in support roles doing things like analysis.

Re:Wrong Line of Work

[bosef1]

Would that involve promotion as GLG-20 field agents?

Re:Wrong Line of Work

[rhook]

Spies, like us?

so much trouble

[theCat]

That was a really elaborate ruse. With that much free time to cook up something like that, you'd think they could ... oh I don't know ... maybe just study for the test?

Or maybe the cheaters were just working up a movie script idea. Do a few months in the slammer, sell the rights, then buy a really good test tutor for next time.

Re:so much trouble

[Ruke]

The MCAT is incredibly difficult. If you don't know the answers, there is very little room to use your multiple-choice-guessing skills like you were able to do on the SAT. Someone who - let's be realistic - probably cheated their way through their undergrad has just about zero chance of getting a score good enough to get into any medical school.

I don't know what the moral here is, though. Cheaters never prosper? That can't be right... Cheaters seldom prosper? No...

Ah: When cheaters fail, they do so spectacularly.

Re:so much trouble

[demonlapin]

The secret to a good score on the MCAT is to ignore verbal (everyone does very well, so the difference between an 11 and a 14 is not how many you answered wrong, but which specific question you got wrong) and know chemistry and physics cold. The Physical Sciences is nothing but chem and physics, and Biological Sciences includes organic.

Yeah, if you're dead-set on a top-ten school, the mid-30s score might not cut it, but it will get you into one of your state's allopathic schools - and unless you are sure you want an academic career, where you went to school matters far less than what your Step 1 and 2CK scores are when it's time to find a residency.

Quite Scary Actually

[casings]

The only reason they were caught is because those helping weren't in on it. That's a very scary thought, because I'm sure for the right price, this could very well be done.

Re:Quite Scary Actually

[bughunter]

Aye, similar to my reaction, which was, "The real story here is that there is a market for this kind of cheating assistance. How many unqualified people have made it past MCAT screening this way? Have any of them provided care for me or my loved ones?"

Immediately thought of Ender's Game

[amarkham]

The real question is what opportunities lie in leveraging an Ender's Game-like approach to solving problems. Obviously cheating on tests is one of the, what about productive approaches?

If you cheat in engineering or medicine...

[bmo]

...or chemistry, or pharmacy, or anything else dealing with human lives directly or indirectly at the end of the chain:

You don't belong in the profession.

You are going to kill people. No question. Someday you will kill someone with your incompetence.

--
BMO

Re:If you cheat in engineering or medicine...

[sulfur]

What qualifications are required to get into the military? I don't think they are comparable to either PE or M.D. (and thus may not induce cheating), yet military personnel in some cases may have more potential of killing "wrong" people.

Re:If you cheat in engineering or medicine...

[bmo]

As if the military gives cheating a pass.

They know *exactly* what cheating gets you - dead friendlies.

You cheat on an exam at a military school (electrician school, etc) and the consequences will be quite severe.

The last thing the Navy wants (for example) is an electrician's mate on a submarine that cheated on his exams.

Try dishonorable discharge, after serving time.

--
BMO

The MCAT is crap

[damn_registrars]

Pre-med students spend their undergraduate days obsessing over that test, learning how to memorize and regurgitate - but not comprehend - information for it. Pre-med students don't care whether they understand the material they take in school, as long as they pass the MCAT and pull the GPA that they need for the med school they want to go to.

This is not the way we should select who our new doctors will be. We are screening for automatons when we should be screening for thinkers. Cheaters like this are exactly what the MCAT is pretty well looking for - people who will do just the right amount of work to pass the test, without bothering to comprehend the information that it is supposed to be testing people on.

you forgot

[publiclurker]

3) since he pissed his doctor off, nobody will renew his anti-psychotic medication.

Re:good for them!

[jandrese]

You had a moral objection to studying?

Screening for appropriate skills

[Anonymous Coward]

Although I don't entirely agree that MCAT is just testing regurgitation (it's much easier to learn everything on the test if you understand everything than if you just use brute force memorization), I don't agree with your concepts of what's necessary for being a doctor.

Doctors don't need to be "thinkers", most doctors really do need to be automatons based on all the research done by others. Their ability to remember the variety of possible diagnoses and use various data points to determine the most likely one is paramount. Doctors for the most part don't really need to be innovating and thinking in creative ways.

Note: I'm not saying what doctors do isn't useful or hard, I'm just saying that deep critical thinking isn't a a primary necessary skill.

Interesting, but suspect...

[Mathinker]

The abstract of the article about Canada doesn't say anything about how they corrected for the fact that many more poor Americans wouldn't be good subjects for a clinical trial since they are just not being treated for their health problems (as noted in the UK article: "Just 9 per cent of low income homes say they have unmet care needs, compared to 52 per cent in the U.S. and 24 per cent in Germany.")

Or were you assuming that this selection bias would actually make the results more accurate for someone who regularly reads Slashdot? This, ironically, could very well be the truth....

Oh, and BTW, invariably after anyone posts an article from The Daily Mail, a bevy of UK Slashdotters point out that its standards of journalism aren't exactly stellar. Doesn't necessarily mean the information is wrong, but.... I'd double check it before using it for a serious personal decision.

Re:abhorent

[TaoPhoenix]

Taking my cue from the summary, you might be missing the "brains" axis.

I think that cheating is very high up on the abohorrent list ... because "done right" it grows epic. The media likes to parade the dumb cheaters as a cheap schadenfreude ad-click generator. The smart cheaters blend it in better. So in your examples, the never did want to be a doctor - he just needs his degree to become a senior med insurance adjuster. His knowledge is good enough to know the vocab, and then using power plays he gets to cheat some more, Robin Cook style with his cohort in Pharma.

Re:good for them!

[mysidia]

You had a moral objection to studying?

Studying is no guarantee of a decent GPA, and you can get a crappy GPA even if you have good mastery of the material, due to insane testing practices of profs, or simple disagreement, or the profs' unwillingness to be proven wrong, even when they are completely utterly in error, and you have a memorized citation of high quality, to prove it.
In college, I endured a crappy GPA of approximately 3.7 many semesters, despite ample study.

ThorGod's experience is not hard evidence that he's an idiot. Grades do not always come from a good measure of skills/knowledge regarding a subject. Tests are often flawwed; they are either too simple, and fail to completely test what is meant to be learned -- or they are too elaborate in professors attempts at being "cute" or "creative", and the test winds up including/requiring something way beyond the subject matter taught.

Re:Quack alert

[Xenna]

Allopathy (as in 'allopathic schools') is a derogatory term used by purveyors of 'alternative' medicine (or quacks) to describe evidence based main stream medicine.