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Are 'Nudging Technologies' Ethical?

An anonymous reader writes "Researchers are debating the ethics of so-called 'nudging technologies' — ambient technology systems designed to shape or influence human behavior, such as an installation which encourages people to take the stairs rather than the lift by using hanging colored balls to represent stairs vs lift usage. A researcher on the project said: 'Most people, when we asked them, "Do you think this has changed your behavior," they said no. But the data showed that it had actually done that.'"

40 of 227 comments (clear)

  1. advertisements by cheeks5965 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Isn't this the goal of advertizing? To change people's behavior without them realizing it's being changed? Now we'll have all sorts of subliminal installations guiding us to the desired purchases.

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    1. Re:advertisements by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I actually don't allow advertising crap to influence me... Advertisements just make my life easier to find things I am interested in.

      *Smirk*

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      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    2. Re:advertisements by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      There's a BIG difference between a Porsche Carerra R and a Chevy

      I'm not talking about the build quality or the quality control or anything that can be measured.

      I'm talking about the visual design. Why do you prefer the visual design of a Porsche Carerra over a Chevy Malibu? Do you believe a Porsche Cayenne has some inherent visual qualities that make it superior to an, I don't know, pick some Hundai SUV.

      The reason we believe one is more "beautiful" than the other is because a certain standard of beauty has been planted in us by marketing.

      Back in the last century, the major auto companies would change the visual style of their automobiles every few years. One year it would bulbous. A few years later sleek. Then fins, then boxy, then bulbous, then curvy, then lozenge-shaped, rinse, repeat. Our concept of beautiful car would change because marketing would convince us so. And the car from four years ago that looks so beautiful now looked ugly as a girl from Manitoba.

      Years later, we look back and see beauty in what we discarded as ugly. A 1960 Cadillac Coupe DeVille is stunningly beautiful today, but in 1976 you'd be embarrassed to drive one (unless you were 20 years old driving your dad's old car in which case you thought it was the coolest thing rolling).

      Our standards of beauty are now set by marketing agencies working on behalf of their corporate clients. And nobody, not one person, is immune.

      There are people who insist that they are not affected by advertising, but they always - every single time - turn out to be no more immune than the average person. Sometimes more so because of their arrogance.

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    3. Re:advertisements by BornAgainSlakr · · Score: 2

      You know, your point that everyone is influenced by marketing is well-taken, but your examples are horrible.

      Do you think the iPhone has a more attractive design than another smartphone? Yes, I do. And your point? You cannot possibly believe that attractive design is based solely on marketing. For starters, Apple's marketing of the iPhone has exclusively focused on usability from day one. Every commercial for the iPhone and iPad has this premise: show what you can do with the device. It looks sexy in the commercials because it is sexy. The D&AD folks didn't give it a black pencil because of Apple commercials. Regardless of what you think of the iPhone from a technical standpoint, it did reboot the smartphone and deserves design accolades. However, you could ask: "Do you think Apple invented the smartphone and tablet computer?" That question would show how effectively Apple marketing is on most people.

      Do you think a Lexus or Porsche has better design than Chevy? Which Lexus, which Porsche, and which Chevy? Porsche design is boring and uninspired. The Lexus IS 300 had some inspired design, especially the chronograph instrument cluster, but the Lexus SC is ugly as sin. The Corvette is always beautiful if you ignore the 80's and 90's, but the thin plastic bits on newer models that flex in a stiff breeze sort of ruins it a little. I can guarantee that I have been exposed to the same amount of Lexus, Porsche, and Chevy marketing as any five other random guys and we could spend the next decade debating the merits and flaws of all three car makers.

      You could ask a question about car quality and innovation, but that would be a dumb question too since you are comparing a car maker that mostly caters to the low- to middle-end versus two car makers that cater to the high- to super-high end. Yes, all three have had quality issues, but you can't compare a plastic econo-box to a $30k+ luxury sedan or a $75k+ sports car made for the unlimited speed sections of the Autobahn. Hell, even the Corvette is, overall, of a lower quality than similar sports cars with the same price despite some impressive technical innovations Chevy has achieved in the Corvette over the decades.

      Why is "shiny" and "hard" considered superior to "matte" and "cushy" in handheld communications technology? Why is aluminum and glass better than plastic? Why do you think one "feels better" than another? Why do you assume people unquestionably do not like plastic? Plastic doesn't have to look like crap; the iPhone 3G and 3GS were made with semi-gloss plastic backs that had a cushy feel (also, the back of the iPhone 1 was matte, not shiny). They still looked great. Saturn did a really good job of designing good looking cars. They were definitely not as sexy as any Nissan Z or a 60's Corvette, but they were good looking cars that also happened to appeal to a lot of people. Any stigma attached to plastic is basically rooted in it being the material of choice when you want to make something cheap. As a result, plastic is associated with a lot of cheaply built, generic looking, disposable things.

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    4. Re:advertisements by Grishnakh · · Score: 2

      Wrong. It depends a whole lot on your budget, and what things you value.

      If you value having a super-fast car at any cost, you're going to get a Porsche (or better yet a Lamborghini, Ferrari, etc.). If you value having a car nearly as fast as a Porsche, but with a much crappier interior, but at a much more modest price because you're on a budget, you'll get a Corvette. If you value having economical transportation (since $60k might be "modest" compared to a Porsche 911, but not compared to a normal car), you might get a more run-of-the-mill Chevy instead, such as the under-$20k Cruze, but you certainly won't be winning any races with it.

      If your goal is to have economical transportation, then the Chevy is "better". If your goal is to have a nice luxury car, the Lexus is "better" (there's no way a $15k Chevy is as luxurious as a Lexus). If your goal is to show off with a super-fast sports car even though you can't legally drive it at a decent speed in this country, the Porsche is "better".

      It's all a matter of priorities. Marketing, no matter how clever, is NOT going to change your priorities. I don't care how clever some commercial is, it's not going to convince some rich dude to trade in his Lambo Gallardo for a Chevy Aveo. It's sort of like hypnotic suggestion. Go talk to a professional PhD psychologist about hypnotism, and they'll tell you that while you can sometimes put people into trances and get them to tell you stuff, you simply cannot get them to do stuff that is against their values. For instance, you could hypnotize some woman, and then try to get her to do or say something sexual in a trance, but if she's a total prude (and it's not just an act, she really believes that way), she's simply not going to do it in the trance. It's the same way with advertising. They can "nudge" you one way or another perhaps, like getting you to consider car model Y instead of its very similar direct competitor model X, but if you're like me, for instance, and hate SUVs, no marketing in the world will convince you to sell your small car and buy a Hummer.

    5. Re:advertisements by LordLimecat · · Score: 2

      Today, the techniques are far more sophisticated, to the point where it is pretty much impossible to resist.

      Surely a statement that bold requires a source or study. I dont find it impossible to resist; my TV intake consists almost exclusively of netflix, and the normal TV I DO watch tends to have advertising that I dont find it hard at all to resist.

      Im sure you could respond "oh, but you ARE affected"; but again, I would expect you to have something more than gut feeling backing up your statement.

    6. Re:advertisements by Culture20 · · Score: 2

      Why is "shiny" and "hard" considered superior to "matte" and "cushy" in handheld communications technology? Why is aluminum and glass better than plastic?

      Humans have liked shiny and hard for thousands of years, else precious metals and gemstones would have been worthless until the industrial age, when uses for highly ductile metals and abrasive diamond dust were discovered.

    7. Re:advertisements by smellotron · · Score: 2

      There's probably an entire department at the biggest agencies that target the macho geek demographic so they can sell them Leatherman multi-tools.

      No fucking doubt. And?

      And a Leatherman is a nice fucking multi-tool to have around. Mine has lasted for almost a decade now, and it gets weekly use.

    8. Re:advertisements by noodler · · Score: 2

      If people tell each other that they "represent a grey ball" if they take the elevator then the information system is not subliminal in any way.
      In fact, these bright students are researching the influence of signs like "please take the stairs" on people. It's just that the language of the signs is a bit obfuscated.
      But i don't think anyone will misunderstand the 'nudge' of a trail of lights pointing you in a certain direction.

      Honestly, I think this is just one big excuse to play around with cool stuff.
      Any of these 'games' could have non-electronic counterparts that would give the same information (and presumably influence the behavior in a similar manner).
      And there is no mention of the 'play' element.
      The fact that people will (and of course they will) make a game out of it amongst themselfs.
      I've seen this happen over different subjects in the past, none of which included technology in any way.

      So i think they are needlessly mixing in the notion of technology into what is a social process that will work with or without gadgetry.
      And despite the article mentioning some discussion about ethics there is no mention of it being a research goal in any way.

      I mean, this is nothing new, is it?
      Sensors prompting you about your posture?
      Come on. How is this different from any other behavioural feedback system?
      Games have been doing it for decades.
      It's your environment giving you extra information about you.
      In nature it's nothing new, think of the color of wasps and bees. Think of the colors and smells of flowers.
      Signaling is a basic tool in nature and humans are no exception.
      The basis for such behavior is not technology.
      Any informational system will have this kind of influence on humans.
      And using technology for signaling is nothing new as well.

      I don't see anything spectacular here to justify a news article about it.
      In fact, i'm a bit disappointed by the level at which this research is conducted.
      There must be better and more interesting uses, by now, for social/informational feedback systems.

    9. Re:advertisements by Frnknstn · · Score: 2

      Advertising is even more pervasive than you say: even magpies prefer shiny coins to dull ones. Guess that proves that advertising if for the birds.

      Okay, seriously, you are overstating your point. You are ignoring our innate sense of taste, which affects our opinion of design and utility. You are also ignoring the fact that it is our culture, not advertising, that informs most of our purchasing choices. Yes, advertising influences culture, but it is just one input in the massive machine that is society.

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    10. Re:advertisements by GameboyRMH · · Score: 2

      Cayenne? That car's an ugly fucker, and not the only one Porsche makes. Most of their other current cars are "just OK." The only one I like the look of is the 918 Spyder, which isn't even in production yet.

      Styles do go around and I don't like all of them. I hate bulbous cars, and I think Chris Bangle started that in the early 2000s, with the rest of the industry copying the Emperor even though he was wearing no clothes - although increasing safety standards played a part too.

      Since I was a kid, the cars I've found good looking have never really changed. Apart from maybe some silly Hot Wheels cars I thought were cool as a kid and realize are silly now, I've always liked the same cars, mostly those with '70s or mid '80s-early '90s styling, although I also like some of the recent cars and concepts that copy the styling of 2000s sportbikes, like the new Mazda3, Evo 10 and Kia Koup (which would all be very good looking cars if they were more compact - they have good styling but are too "bloated") and the Toyota FR-S 2 (Scion FR-S) concept, which I might buy if it makes it to production with good specs (especially the low weight they've been promising).

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    11. Re:advertisements by LordLimecat · · Score: 2

      Im not sure where to begin with the odd mix of fallacies and flaws in your post. You beg the question, claim to have knowledge without demonstrating a source (how do you KNOW that it has a probability of 1.0?), and act like you can exhaustively prove something outside the realm of logical reasoning-- as if empirical evidence could EVER prove something with a "probability of 1.0".

      my lamp's light should ever fall upon the person who is completely unaffected by modern marketing

      Ah, but you wont-- you are using some odd type of reasoning where you have declared that all are affected, and those who claim not to be affected are even more affected, and that because all are affected they are unable to see it-- and all this, because you have declared it so. Having never met me nor knowing anything about my preferences, you had immediately declared that I am nevertheless affected; how then could anyone convince you otherwise?

  2. Is this actually a question? by RoverDaddy · · Score: 3, Informative
    It's not even really a question in the study being described. From TFA:

    "There's lots of discussion about nudging technologies - whether it's ethical, whether it's not - but people still get to choose,"

    There, that's as much as TFA talks about ethics.
    How about asking whether -advertising- is ethical? At least these 'nudging technologies' are intended to -help- the person affected.

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    RETURN without GOSUB in line 1050
    1. Re:Is this actually a question? by geekoid · · Score: 4, Insightful

      To be pedantic, Those nudging technologies are being used to help people..but they could also be used for many things. They're tools.

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      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    2. Re:Is this actually a question? by jmorris42 · · Score: 2

      > How about asking whether -advertising- is ethical?

      Exactly the right question. Strip away the tech angle and this is just basic marketing being practiced. And that ship has sailed, for good or ill we aren't getting rid of advertising and marketing... even if it were possible to do so.

      > At least these 'nudging technologies' are intended to -help- the person affected.

      Said he who considers himself superior to the lesser beings being nudged. I'll be the judge of what is good for me and you figure out what is best for you. Now toss me another Brawndo will ya.

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      Democrat delenda est
    3. Re:Is this actually a question? by hardwarejunkie9 · · Score: 2

      Advertising *is* nudging, no question. It frequently manipulates decisions instead of persuading.

      --
      I like losing arguments, it just means that I can take your point and make it my own.
    4. Re:Is this actually a question? by jmorris42 · · Score: 2

      > But if there's a simple nudge that helps people eat more vegetables and less sweets,
      > then who can honestly be against that.

      I'm all for people making the argument you should eat more vegetables, hell if I'd eaten a few more and chugged a few less Cokes I might not have been diagnosed with diabetes this month. We should be openly debating ideas. Where I get creeped out is when the do gooders don't want to reason anymore, they want to do the jedi mind trick. Same for marketers who don't do straight up ads extoling the product, they do these brand identity ads that slither into yer mind while you aren't paying attention. What especially sucks is that stuff actually works and not just on 'weak minds' but even stronger ones if you aren't alert and watching for the crap, which was what the Brawndo reference was about. Even if you think you are too smart to fall for that marketing hooey you will probably fall for one you didn't notice and wind up not only drinking Brawndo but using the slogan in ordinary conversation.

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  3. Influence is a tool... by darkwing_bmf · · Score: 3

    ...that can be used for good or for evil.

  4. So first we have the "poke"..... by Jailbrekr · · Score: 2

    and now we have the "nudge"? Whats next, the "bitchslap"?

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    1. Re:So first we have the "poke"..... by blair1q · · Score: 2

      No, the sarcastic reply.

  5. Marketing packaged into a PhD thesis by stating_the_obvious · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Nudging technologies have been around for as long as people have traded one good for another. Prices ending in .99, "buy one, get one free", and the ever popular "act now" are all examples of efforts to nudge someone to action. It can only be a good thing that these subliminal forces are finally being harnessed to encourage positive behavior (e.g., stairs versus elevators or washing hands after using the bathroom)

  6. Oblig. Fun Theory by Jim+Hall · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The Fun Theory does this from time to time. My favorite is the piano stairs in Stockholm. It's a classic example of a "nudging" effect, and yes - I do consider it "ethical".

    Of course, the question is if the "nudging" effect lasts over the long haul. I wonder how many of these people would have used the piano stairs after a few days, or a week?

    1. Re:Oblig. Fun Theory by swanzilla · · Score: 2

      Not sure about the long haul, but I would assume that stair usage and hangover severity would be inversely proportional to one another.

  7. Re:Short answer: no by RoverDaddy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Well seat belt laws go beyond advice and suggestion to the point of coercion (i.e. Don't do what -we- think is good for -you- and you will be punished), so I don't think that's a good example. But as far as this topic goes, I agree. No ethical issue at all.

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  8. Ethics... by econolog · · Score: 2

    We can say it's unethical but it has happened the world over for many years now and in less noticeable ways than signs. The source of this isn't always the government of that area. Marketing is a form of this for example. The ways people can be manipulated are not limited to just this. TV is a very good medium. There are ways this can be applied in other media but video tends to be the most effective. Social media is also very powerful. As far as this altering your experience (which shapes the individual) it can be summarized that you have less control than you think.

  9. Sounds a bit harsh actually by ArhcAngel · · Score: 2

    I mean...to hang someone by the color of their balls and all.

    --
    "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
  10. Marketers have been using it for decades by Billly+Gates · · Score: 2

    Why do you think America has been going bankrupt trying to keep up with the Jones next door.

    Or walk into a casino? When someone wins large lights and very loud sounds are made while the machine dispatches the cash slowly all for everyone to see that someone else made money.

  11. Ambient Design by hardwarejunkie9 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'm actually an industrial engineering student who studies cognitive ergonomics (pretty much social engineering). I'm actually quite interested in "nudging technologies" and am doing a bit of research in related fields. I took a Psych class that discussed the relevance of subliminal messaging and covered a bit of the controversy surrounding it. The professor mentioned something strange: subliminal messaging doesn't make an individual do anything they otherwise would not do if persuaded. You can only get standard behavior that the individual would be interested in performing on their own. These nudging technologies do affect an individual's autonomy by affecting the choices they make, but, in the end, they still can make their own decision to take the elevator. An important contrast to consider is that the alternative to make people take the stairs more is to coerce them by making rules. Is that any more ethical? At least in a nudge system they have the option to do as they wish. Sure, the individual may not be aware that they are influenced, but it would be a system incredibly hard to abuse. I've had to deal w/ individuals who throw their newly emptied coke bottles into the trash when the trash can is directly next to the trash can. I don't feel that the best approach is to convince them with general aphorisms about the environment but rather to nudge them that way we can all get along to taking care of more important problems.

    --
    I like losing arguments, it just means that I can take your point and make it my own.
    1. Re:Ambient Design by lgw · · Score: 4, Interesting

      You're going to find an internship at a Disney park, right? The "social engineering" there is masterful, as well as the more ordinary engineering just to allow herds of people to move freely without getting in each other's way (I still find the Orlando airport the easiest big airport to move through thanks to their influence). For example, employee areas aren'tusually blocked by doors or even signs; instead the colors and architecture are carefully chosen to make customers feel uncomfortable, and nudge them back to where they're supposed to be, without explicitly marking areas "off limits" as you walk through the park.

      I've had to deal w/ individuals who throw their newly emptied coke bottles into the trash when the trash can is directly next to the trash can.

      Wel, eveyrone does that, but I also throw my everyhting into the trash can when it's next to the recycle bin, just for the joy of pissing off hippies, so be careful what you design (but then some jerks throw normal stinky trash into recycling bins where I live: now that sucks).

      --
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  12. This just in! by Palmsie · · Score: 2

    Psychologists study human behavior... then change it! What kind of world do we live in, Dr. Milgrim?

    --
    Carl Sagan quotes get you an automatic +5 on all posts.
    1. Re:This just in! by Darinbob · · Score: 2

      Shocking!

  13. Sheep Don't Think by tunapez · · Score: 2

    If people want, or allow themselves, to be shepherded and corralled, I guess there's no stopping progress.

    --
    Imagination drew in bold strokes, instantly serving hopes and fears, while knowledge advanced by slow increments...
  14. Re:Mentalism! by Zirnike · · Score: 4, Funny

    I actually wonder how susceptible I am to all of this, myself...

    I hope everyone liked the post I made snowgirl make.

    --
    I'm not shy, I'm stalking my prey
  15. Re:Short answer: no by lgw · · Score: 2

    "Follow this safety procedure or we'll kill you" does seem remarkable popular reasoning these days. But here there's no threat, no donside, so I also don't see the ethical question.

    --
    Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  16. Classic example: fly in urinal by hayne · · Score: 3, Informative

    I guess the fly in urinal is a classic example of nudging technology.

  17. Re:Mentalism! by BadPirate · · Score: 2

    Spoiler: The cake is a lie.

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    - Holy crap, I've got MOD points! Who thought that was a good idea.
  18. Re:"the lift" by rkww · · Score: 4, Insightful

    But the story, if you chose to read it, would tell you that the research was conducted by a British university and the devices they monitored were in fact lifts. And to be pedantic, American is the regional dialect.

  19. Re:Short answer: no by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    A bunch of libertarians will shortly show up to argue that seatbelt laws are unethical.

    ...And they'll be right, at least about the laws that apply to adults driving their own vehicles.

  20. Nudge to the stairs by steveha · · Score: 4, Insightful

    One of the examples from TFA is a set of colored balls, hanging in an open space by in a stairwell. The bright, cheerful balls represent people taking the stairs, and the grey balls represent people taking the elevators (lifts). There are pressure pads used to count people, and the counts are used to estimate stair usage and elevator usage. The colored balls are just a visual indicator.

    According to the article, people say things like "You took the elevator... you are making the grey balls go up, you know" or similar.

    And now, my point: the colored balls are not what people care about. People already have an opinion about whether stairs or elevator are "better" in any sense, and the colored balls display is leveraging that. I could use the same technology to track how many people look out the East window, vs how many people look out the West window, and I'm pretty sure nobody would care which color of balls is "winning" at the moment. The colored balls in and of themselves have no power.

    I remember in Junior High School a teacher waxed philosophical about wrist watches. "Just think, we strap them on and then obey them. We rush through lunch because of them. A tiny and simple device can drastically shape our behavior!" (Probably a horribly inaccurate quote; this is a memory I haven't thought of in years.) Even at the time I rejected this thesis. It seemed to me (and still seems to me) that the watch itself has no power; it is the whole structure of civilization, at least where it is intersecting with your own life, that makes you care what time it is. If you took the watch off, you would still hurry through lunch, because you need to be done with lunch by some specific time. Indeed, without the watch, you might hurry more, since you might not be sure how much time you have.

    The map is not the territory. Neither a watch nor colored balls nor any of the other stuff in TFA can compel behavior. Simple ergonomics can give a mild nudge; tricks that leverage things people care about can give a stronger nudge, but only because the people already care about something.

    So the whole "ethics" thing is overblown. And as others have noted, that was one throwaway line from TFA; it's odd that it was chosen for the summary.

    steveha

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    1. Re:Nudge to the stairs by tbird81 · · Score: 2

      I agree with your original thought.

      To me, it just sounds like a usual high school teacher. They often spout off the nonsense that runs occasionally through their minds (and that runs through all of our minds) but they have a captive audience.