Slashdot Mirror
DOT Exempts Maker of 'Flying Car' From Road Vehicle Safety Rules
Stirfry192 writes with news that Terrafugia, makers of a vehicle alternately called a 'flying car' or 'roadable aircraft,' have been granted a three-year exemption to federal motor vehicle safety rules in order to foster further development and innovation.
"The DOT granted the three-year 'hardship' exemption because it bought the argument from Terrafugia that its attempt to comply with DOT regulations at the same time as Federal Aviation Administration rules would be prohibitively expensive. Terrafugia had argued that an exemption would allow it more time to research more appropriate solutions to the requirements at the same time as making the flying car a feasible project. The company, an MIT spin-off located in Woburn, Mass. intends to use motor-cycle tires and rims instead of tires usually used for regular cars. The purpose is to minimize the weight of the craft."
Next thing you know, flying carseats will be exempted. This is a slippery slope.
Gently reply
NRC Exempts Maker of 'Backyard Reactors' From Nuclear Safety Rules
I think this is really cool but it seems impractical. Aircraft are very expensive to maintain and you'll need a pilot certificate to fly this. It's probably cheaper to have a car and rent a plane (or, depending on the cost of this thing, just buy a used 172). The usable load is very low, as well (hopefully that 330lbs number is in addition to fuel).
I also look at this from the perspective of being a "dual-purpose" vehicle; most of which are mediocre. A common example might be a dual-sport motorcycle. It's not a great motorcycle and it's not a great dirtbike, but it can do both. Just from the looks (wings all folded up, blocking vision out of the rear windows, etc) this is not going to be a practical car. I guess we'll see how good of an airplane it will be. My question is, what problem does this solve? You drive to the airport, unfold the wings, then get out of the car and do your pre-flight? How is that different from getting out of your car and doing your pre-flight on your regular aircraft?
Either way, this seems like a neat invention. I think they'll have trouble selling 200 of these, especially if they are priced similarly to normal small aircraft, but it would be really cool to see this thing in person.
I know you yanks do not like corners; but motorcycle wheels are not designed to take large lateral loadings . . .
of completely hare-brained ideas that looked great in the cartoons I grew up with but are not currently feasible. Who knows? Maybe they'll make the darn thing work and not cost a mint!
Don't let regulation stand in the way of Gravity; the later is a cruel master and an important teacher.
In the future, I would want to not be isolated from my friends in the Space Station.
so it's an aero-plane that transforms into an auto-mobile, but used motor-cycle tires... very inter-resting
They want to sell it to Americans with a load limit of 150kg?
I can't say I'm surprised by the windshield exemption. That's an aircraft vs. car issue. The two are designed completely differently (maintaining visibility vs. maintaining integrity).
I am intrigued at the idea of commuting by air though. My employer often brings in people to discuss commuting options (as traffic is somewhat fickle here in Atlanta) and none of them would even discuss the potential of commuting via gyrocopter with me.
Que?
to comply with DOT regulations at the same time as Federal Aviation Administration rules would be prohibitively expensive
That is why you won't have a flying car by 2015.
This will never work.
No-one will submit to being groped by the TSA and have to take their shoes off before getting in their car to go to work each morning.
Tambien: que?
Korma: Good
The average driver will never see this on the road. It's a rich person's toy.
I like driving cars and flying airplanes. I don't want this vehicle...it's definitely not going to drive as well of a good car, doesn't have the useful load of even a Cessna 172, and leaves me asking, "what problem does this really solve?" it's not like you're going to be able to take off from freeways. So you drive to the airport, and take off there. Just like you do today...
As others have pointed out, there are a lot of problems, both regulatory and practical, that make this a costly and difficult ventures. Save your money; buy something really practical, like a flying saucer that works only in ground effect.
You recommend moving to a better state to escape oppressive statutes. In such a case, what's the best practice to find a job for both oneself and one's spouse or life partner, or to make sure that one's elderly parents are taken care of?
The only thing good about this is that it will allow for some great James Bond scenes in the future.
Other than that- the military might use them- but for the hoi polloi- this is out of our reach. Even if costs become acceptable- the logisitcs involved with having thousands of these in the air (even with pilots licenses) would be a nightmare- computers would need to be involved to make sure these don't crash.
Then there is terrorism and no-fly zones. You have a dozen airplanes near the capitol- you can make sure none get too close to a landmark. Send up the fighters as a deterrent if they cross the line?
You have a thousand- do you send up the air-force every time one gets too close to the no-fly zone. Do we shoot down every drunk redneck with a pilots license who decides he wants to see the pentagon from above to see if it really has "six" sides.
You can prevent cars going places by barriers.
Will every state capitol building need to be encased in a large bullet-proof glass box?
You couldn't put one fucking direct link to a picture of the vehicle, could you?
Didn't M.A.S.K. already have one of these like 25 years ago?
I bet there is another angle for this too.
An aircraft that a semi-well off person can keep, in the same line as a bomb shelter.
Tons of survival nuts would love to have a vehicle that, during a disaster of any sort, only needs a long enough stretch of space nearby to get them airborne. If WWIII, zombies, aliens, or whatever might scare the paranoid is coming, few people are going to care whether they take off from a well mowed lawn, or a straight stretch of nearby road. Regulations be damned, they'll be airborne.
Many of these events don't leave enough time for someone to even get to an airport. However, a plane in your garage?
By the time three years are up, Terrafugia will be out of money and out of business. But this still raises interesting questions ...
In the unlikely event that Terrafugia doesn't go out of business, will aircraft/vehicles manufactured and sold without safety equipment be retrofitted? At whose expense?
If Terrafugia goes out of business after delivering airplanes without safety equipment will the owners be prohibited from driving them?
Terrafugia was granted a waiver (by the FAA) to the maximum gross weight regulation to allow for required road safety equipment such as air bags. Developing an economically viable roadable airplane or flying car is a hard. Doing it in today's highly regulated environment is really hard.
This is great news. Once we get the flying cars, the next step is...jet packs!
I've been waiting since 1967.
You are welcome on my lawn.
If the Terrafugia gets off the ground, what happens when you get in a minor fender-bender on the road? Will the FAA have to send an inspector to validate the airworthiness of the plane? Or will you get pilots saying - "yeah it looks OK to fly".
I am Slashdot. Are you Slashdot as well?
We won't see this product get to market. Or at the very least, 99.999% of all Americans will never experience this product in person in the extremely unlikely event that it does somehow make it to market.
It's nice to see someone working on the old flying car problem again, but we're just not going to see it happen.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
Make it 3 wheeled and it's a motorcycle and does not have to obey ANY DOT automobile laws.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Flying cars won't be available to the masses for years, not until they are 100% automatic. Just wait until the first Muslim gets in one and crashes into some capitol building!
Motorcycle tires are made to have tread along their edges to allow for better cornering grip. Also, motorcycle tires are generally taller than most car tires. These things together make motorcycle tires generally more expensive than car tires. I think their argument is false, they can likely find car tires narrow or small enough if they look in the right places.
"Flying Car 2! Now with wings."
I imagine that the real practical application of eliminating gridlock and commute time that we all want to see is this scenario.
1. Roll out of my garage onto my street/airstrip.
2. Get flight clearance and take off. (In the same amount of time it takes me to buckle up and select this morning's soundtrack.)
3. Fly to my work's airstrip and park.
4. Depending on the technology state
- Plug in to charge up the batteries
- Fold up plane into my briefcase like GeoJet. (my preference is BOTH in reverse order)
For every benefit you receive a tax is levied. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
The use of motorcycle wheels reminds me of the pothole problem when riding a motorcycle. It's not pretty. I'm certain that this "roadable" car has almost no suspension, little maneuverability, and poor road visibility. That's makes it worse than a motorcycle when hitting a pothole. There is no way to make a public road as smooth as the surfaces of an airport.
are completely __________. Let's see how we can make it arhred* to read your damned comment.
* rearrange the letters
The Flying Car is one of those things that I see will take a while before technology really gets there and mature enough to be useful. But there are real benefits towards the flying car. Lets say a flying car will only be allowed to fly 50 ft in the air, and over existing roadways, and you need 15 clearance over the car. you can still triple the volume that our current roadways take.
Yes once the kinks and technology gets out only the rich will afford the flying cars, then as production moves and more kinks are clear up it will become more popular. I think the major hurdle is making these guys energy efficient. As a road car doesn't need use energy to keep it above gravity
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
It can be made to work, the question is whether they can make it practical to own and operate. The airforce has had folding planes for decades, but I doubt that even if you were to strip the weapons and modify it for road use that it would be affordable.
And you thought city design in the US doesn't promote walking today...
What a horrible title but par for the course around here.
From the horses mouth:
Traditional laminated automotive safety glass would add significant weight to the Transition® and could fracture in such a way as to obscure the vision of the pilot in the event of a bird impact. This exemption allows the use of polycarbonate materials that provide comparable protection to the occupants at significant weight-saving without shattering or crazing – improving the safety of the Transition®. In the exemption text, NHTSA states: “We further conclude that the granting of an exemption from these requirements would be in the public interest and consistent with the objectives of traffic safety.” In 2010, the Transition® was granted an additional 110 pounds allowance by the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) in a prior exemption action by the DOT.
Also the full text of the exemption is here: http://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2011/06/29/2011-16222/terrafugia-inc-grant-of-application-for-temporary-exemption-from-certain-requirements-of-fmvss-no
Chicken fried butter sticks? Do
You've got the basics right.
1. Face the outhouse south. It makes use in winter less unpleasant.
2. Make a seat oout of styrofoam. Again, winter use.
3. Anyplace that piss can hit should be coated with metal. Otherwise the salt builds up in the wood, and you get porcupines and mice gnawing the wood for the salt.
4. It's a good idea to have a funnel and pipe for what is effectively a urinal. This decreases the splashing on the seat, and dribbles on the floor. If you have a large enough group to have bathroom collisions, you may want to make a urinal stall on the side opposite the door.
5. All horizontal surfaces should be smooth.
6. All surfaces should be made as cleanable as possible. Good quality floor enamel on the floor. Everything else whitewashed yearly.
7. Separate vent pipe from the pit to several feet above the roof. If painted black, and capped properly it will draw air from the pit and make the room much less smelly.
8. Two part door so you have the option of watching the view while sitting.
9. Screened so well that flies have no access to the pit. Lid on the opening done so that it is fly proof, and it cannot be left open.
10. Sited so that it cannot contaminate your drinking water.
11. Far enough from the house to avoid smells, close enough to be convenient.
12. Built in a manner it can easily be moved to another hole, but also is resistant to being blown over in a strong wind.
13. Mouse proof storage for toilet paper.
Third Career: Tree Farmer Second Career: Computer Geek First Career: Teacher, Outdoor Instructor, Photographer.
While the idea is kind of cool, I'm not sure that the argument "But it will cost us money to adhere to regulations!" should be a valid excuse.
If an idea is not profitable, the solution is not to exempt it from everything until it _is_ profitable, it's to say "Well, that isn't profitable, feel free to try something else."