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Zediva Shut Down By Federal Judge, MPAA Parties!

AlienIntelligence writes "Looks like the loophole that Zediva founded their business model on evaporated. Zediva's biggest problem was getting over a 1991 ruling against a similar method of transmitting copyright works. Zediva has vowed to appeal the ruling."

30 of 189 comments (clear)

  1. Zediva clearly forgot the Golden Rule by elrous0 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    He who gives gold to Congressional and Presidential election campaigns makes the rules.

    And $111 million is a lot of gold.

    --
    SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    1. Re:Zediva clearly forgot the Golden Rule by EvilStein · · Score: 5, Interesting

      it is.. but it sure helped get a bunch of former RIAA lawyers (five so far) elected to positions in the Obama Administration...

    2. Re:Zediva clearly forgot the Golden Rule by interkin3tic · · Score: 2

      I don't know anything about the 1991 law, being unable to access the article at this time, but is it maybe:

      -MPAA et al pay lawmakers a lot of money
      -Lawmakers make laws that favor the MPAA etc
      -Zediva's plan is illegal by those laws
      -MPAA continues to give lawmakers money to make laws that keep all the control in the MPAA's hands.

      Seems very relevant to me.

    3. Re:Zediva clearly forgot the Golden Rule by erroneus · · Score: 2

      Actually, I'm not convinced Zediva's plan is illegal. The media and the player are individually and exclusively locked to a single customer at a time with the same limitation that one would have from a brick and mortar video rental. The only difference, in my view, is the "-- over the internet" part of the situation and frankly, that aspect is trivial.

      I think what has happened is that Netflix and others pay something to the MPAA and so the MPAA expects that from everyone despite whatever happens on the back-end which is to say, the MPAA only cares about the delivery and not the source which I think is completely wrong.

      The media industries are most certainly having their cake, eating it and having more cake spontaneously to boot.

      So it's true -- they have bought some pretty favorable laws and judges with their money and it's a damned pity.

    4. Re:Zediva clearly forgot the Golden Rule by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      There's an easy - really, really easy workaround for all of this.

      It's time for everyone to just say "fuck it" and stop sending these fuckers money.

      Go to the Pirate Bay or any other torrent site of your choice, and download all you want FOR FREE.

      That's right, it's totally and completely FREE. No charge. FREE.

      You only have to pay for your connection to the internet.

      FREE!

  2. Dumb ruling by bigsexyjoe · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It is common to ignore the letter of the law in favor of the "spirit" of the law. And the spirit of copyright law is protection of the movie industry against all little people and all disruptive technology.

    1. Re:Dumb ruling by cpt+kangarooski · · Score: 2

      No, I don't think so. There's no support for them directly, it's just coinciding interests.

      I'm a liberal, and I'm firmly in support of free speech. While it's true that there are some people on the left who have problems outside of their comfort zones (e.g. violent video games, explicit song lyrics, pornography as demeaning and oppressive toward women), there are plenty of us who think that the "no" in "Congress shall make no law" is important.

      This general position results in supporting publishers against those who would censor them, but it's not because leftists like the publishers or even the works (the record and movie industries are full of slimy people, business practices that run from bad to unethical and often illegal, and output that's trashy or distasteful to say the least), but because leftists dislike censorship.

      And since there's not too much that's objectionable about those industries other than the content that they produce -- they're not really known for destroying the environment, or needing dictatorships propped up, or needing billions in tax dollars to build useless military hardware, they're treated as being relatively (though not wholly) benign.

      The industry itself has plenty of liberals and plenty of conservatives, and plenty of lobbyists who will seek to garner support from any legislators they can without being ideologically picky, just as you'd expect from any large number of people in a major industry. For example, look at all the fights that the publishers get into with unions.

      --
      -- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
  3. so... by The+Dawn+Of+Time · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Twenty years ago, it was decided this wasn't legal. They decided to do it anyway and were shut down. This somehow makes content owners evil.

    Do I have the facts straight?

    1. Re:so... by interkin3tic · · Score: 2

      No, the content owners are evil independent of whether or not another company is skirting the laws (the ones the content owners have bent themselves.)

    2. Re:so... by sjames · · Score: 5, Interesting

      It's an odd situation in general. Rent DVD from blockbuster, take it home and play it = legal.

      Rent DVD player and DVD from blockbuster, hook up to your TV and play it = legal.

      Leave DVD player at blockbuster but run really long video cable to your TV is untested, but the length of the video cable doesn't seen legally relevant (even if it is a technical problem).

      Now, treading ever further into untested waters, same setup but you just call Blockbuster and rent the DVD and get an employee to play it in the DVD player you left there.

      Next up, multiplex the video cable with other communications. Still doesn't seem relevant. Video cables that include ethernet channels aren't illegal.

      Rent the common multiplexed communications cable from someone else. Why not, you're renting the player and the DVD, why not the cable?

      Now, connect a digitizer at your end and watch on the computer. Shouldn't matter, it's not illegal to do that on a home theater.

      Finally, move the digitizer to blockbuster's side of the rented multiplexed communications cable. Fundamentally, you're still renting a DVD and a player from Blockbuster and watching it at home, but somehow it has magically become illegal according to the judge. What part makes it illegal now? Is it legal as long as you burn a gallon of gas in the back yard so you can do your part in the pollution effort?

    3. Re:so... by Whorhay · · Score: 2

      When the law was written I'm fairly certain it was intended to mean transmission to multiple people, and probably over the air or some such multicast method.

      What Zediva is doing is no different than plugging a DvD player up to your computer or TV directly in your own home. The DvD player is "transmitting" over a wire, the length of that wire and where it leads so long as the signal is only going to one customer should not be legally relevant. Hell you could even plug your DvD player at home up to multiple TV's in every room of your home, that's not illegal that I am aware of.

      Hopefully Zediva will win the case at large even if they lose on this temporary injuntion. Some where along the line some court should manage to acurately interpret the law instead of acting as a MPAA shill.

    4. Re:so... by ObiWanKenblowme · · Score: 2

      Assuming the setup is such that whomever pays to rent the movie is the only one who can view it, and there's only one stream per purchased disc at a time, then honestly what is the clear difference between your HDMI cable and the internet? Both are simply a medium for moving the stored bits of data that make up the movie from wherever they're stored to wherever they're decoded and played on a screen. The only difference is that the internet is arguably more convenient.

      I also fail to see how this would count as "public transmission", since only the subscriber has access (i.e., it's not being "broadcast" and freely available).

      --
      Obvious exits are NORTH, SOUTH, and DENNIS.
    5. Re:so... by spazdor · · Score: 2

      What is that difference, and why is it legally relevant? Please expand.

      --
      DRM: Terminator crops for your mind!
    6. Re:so... by sjames · · Score: 2

      There is a clear difference between a $5 HDMI cable and a Monster cable as well (the price, that is) but it's not a legally relevant difference.

  4. What Zediva Does... by SlashdotOgre · · Score: 4, Informative

    For folks who've never heard of Zediva, they apparently let customers stream newly released movies. Their business model was that the customers rent the DVD and DVD player which are both located at their facility, and the customers access them over the Internet. Clever approach, but this shutdown should be of no surprise.

    --
    Sadly, PS/2 was yet another victim of USB, which doesn't care what you plug into it, the electrical slut.
  5. Re:Who didn't see this coming?? by HarrySquatter · · Score: 2

    Yes, because that is an actual covered exception under the first sale doctrine. Streaming the movie over the Internet to people is on the other hand not a covered exception.

  6. No binding precedent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Nothing about the ruling in On Command was binding on this court, so I'm not sure why everyone thinks the argument was ridiculous. I think it's absurd to construe the prohibition against transmitting copyrighted acts to "the public" as encompassing this activity. How is someone sitting at home on their computer "the public"? It is clear that Congress intended, by this phrase, to prohibit transmitting of copyrighted works to the public at large, not to individual people for individual use.

    It's legal to rent DVDs to people. It's legal to rent DVD players to people. It's legal to rent DVDs, DVD players and viewing space to people. But it's not legal to rent a DVD and DVD player to someone to use at a distance. That defies logic.

  7. Re:Who didn't see this coming?? by Baloroth · · Score: 4, Informative

    Except they don't rebroadcast to multiple customers at the same time. For each person watching the DVD at a time, Zediva has one copy and one DVD player. Its almost identical to renting the physical copy of the movie, but without actually sending them the disc itself. So its nothing like broadcasting, except it occurs at a distance.

    --
    "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
  8. Re:Who didn't see this coming?? by EvilGrin5000 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    from TFA:
    "Only one person can rent a DVD at one time, meaning that if Zediva bought 20 copies of a movie, only 20 people can watch it simultaneously. Still, Zediva saves money because it could serve many more customers with the same physical copy of a DVD than a company that has to mail out a DVD and wait for its return. "

    So they're not using a single DVD to broadcast to multiple people simultaneously; they are basically a renting organization that is very similar to RedBox except it is done through streaming and online purchasing but the limitation is still a 1:1 ratio of viewer-to-physical dvd copy. Ask yourself this: if Redbox has 20 copies of a movie and every day 20 people rent it and return it (some the same day, some after a day or two), how is this different than Zediva's business model other than the online factor vs. physical stand?

    --
    A black cat crossing your path signifies that the animal is going somewhere. -- Groucho Marx
  9. Re:Who didn't see this coming?? by demonbug · · Score: 2

    So Zediva thought they could purchase a single DVD and re-broadcast the content to multiple customers, essentially relying on a very loose interpretation of the first sale doctrine and avoid paying the same licensing fees as Netflix or Amazon.

    If the MPAA didn’t take them to court, then Amazon or Netflix or Redbox, hell the entire legitimate broadcast industry would have.

    No. The person renting the video has exclusive use of the DVD (and DVD player) for the period of their rental, which would generally be about the length of the movie. Two people can't be watching the same movie at the same time unless Zediva purchased two copies of the video, just like a physical rental store. Except for the obvious savings because the rental period only lasts as long as the person is watching the video, and it is instantly "returned" when they are finished, it is no different in this respect than renting a physical disc from a brick-and-mortar.

    Basically the same as Netflix video by mail, except instead of physically sending the discs through the mail all the discs are kept and played at a central location and only the output is streamed to the renter.

    It appears that the judge in the case feels there is a clear-cut and legally established difference between renting the physical media and playing it in private, and renting the physical media in one location and broadcasting it to another, private location. Even though there is a physical disc dedicated to the person watching the video, the transmission of the video instead of the physical media makes it a public performance, and therefore requires a specific license agreement from the media's owner.

    I do wonder if a similar argument could be used to upend the burgeoning cloud-based-player industry; on the one hand it seems like a similar theme, on the other the cloud-based player is only sending the the digital file that the seller is (presumably) licensed to distribute - there is no pesky original physical media that is supposed to be carted around, only the digital file.

  10. Sound like it should be legal if: by kandresen · · Score: 2

    1) You are renting a video player which is located in the store and provide exclusive access to you while renting through an encrypted virtual interface
    2) You are separately renting a movie
    3) You ask as delivery method that someone is placing your rented movie inside your rented dvd player
    4) You connect the rented player to your display unit
    5) You see the movie

    Streaming was done by you from your equipment to your equipment. The streaming can in this case not be said to be done by the store, as it is solely initiated by the client from his own rented player with his own rented physical media. I don't see how this can be illegal. Maybe I did not understand it right, and they don't rent the player out separate from the movie? In that case there might be problems...

  11. "transmitting"? by ZorinLynx · · Score: 3, Insightful

    How is "transmitting" the video over the Internet any different than "transmitting" it over an HDMI cable from a local DVD player to a television? In both cases, bits are being moved, and only one person has access to them.

    I hate how convoluted copyright law has become.

  12. Re:Who didn't see this coming?? by wagnerrp · · Score: 3, Informative

    No, not exactly. Their claim to legitimacy was that they purchased dozens of copies of each DVD, and thousands of DVD players paired to slingbox-type products. When the user rented the DVD, the DVD was loaded into a player, plugged into the internet streamer, and unicast to the subscriber. That DVD and DVD player were inaccessible to any other user during that time. It behaved just like a normal rental, except the subscriber did not have to physically go and pick up the DVD. The only real difference between this and a traditional rental service is the turnover rate per disc is much higher.

  13. Judge's ruling pro-biz, anti-law by BcNexus · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Judge went above and beyond in the scope of his/her ruling so far that he/she is blindly favoring the MPAA:

    The 12-page injunction took issue with nearly every argument Zediva made in its defense, and even went further, arguing that since Zediva's users could occasionally encounter movies that were "out of stock," consumers would be confused about how streaming video services work, potentially ruining the market for Hollywood.

    Oddly, Martin also argued that Zediva's service, which charges per movie, could cause "confusion or doubt regarding whether payment is required for access to the Copyrighted Works."

  14. Public Performance by Translation+Error · · Score: 2, Informative
    A lot of people seem confused about exactly what the court found wrong with Zediva's actions. It wasn't that they were streaming one disc to multiple people at once (they weren't). It wasn't that they were renting discs to people. It wasn't because they were streaming the content of discs they'd purchased.

    It was that Zediva was playing movies for other people (and taking money for it) without having the public performance rights to do so. This is the same principle that stops someone from opening a movie theatre and just buying a DVD of each movie they want to show. The 1991 case said a hotel can't get around that by having a bunch of VCRs and sending the output of each to a single hotel room, and the judge for the Zediva case found this to be no different. And he's right.

    --
    When someone says, "Any fool can see ..." they're usually exactly right.
    1. Re:Public Performance by spazdor · · Score: 2

      Translation: the 1991 court ruling was absurd for the same reason this one is.

      --
      DRM: Terminator crops for your mind!
    2. Re:Public Performance by smbell · · Score: 2
      That's pretty much what the judge said, however his logic is highly suspect. In order to say it was a public performance he basically said because people are part of the public it is public. From the ruling.

      Customers watching one of Plaintiffs’ Copyrighted Works on their computer through Zediva’s system are not necessarily watching it in a “public place,” but those customers are nonetheless members of “the public.” .... The non-public nature of the place of the performance has no bearing on whether or not those who enjoy the performance constitute “the public” under the transmit clause.

      So watching a movie in the privacy of your own home is now a public performance.

    3. Re:Public Performance by Immostlyharmless · · Score: 2

      That's almost what it sounds like, and seeing as thats illegal, I think it just made my entire media library unviewable? Unless there are legal minds amongst us who can split the hairs and tell us the difference?

  15. Re:The Geek Problem by sjames · · Score: 2

    Really, they are within the actual spirit of the law as well. Video rental is intentionally legal. The only thing they violate is the will of the MPAA and their hired lapdogs.

  16. Re:Who didn't see this coming?? by spazdor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Can we stop using the word "broadcast" to refer to long-distance, point-to-point communications, please? If we keep using these terms wrong, we shouldn't be surprised when judges arrive at absurd conclusions about laws which are concerned with "broadcasting".

    --
    DRM: Terminator crops for your mind!