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Ask Slashdot: What OS For a Donated Computer?
chefwear writes "I am thinking of donating retired computers to a local charity for kids. What OS do you think would be best for this? From reading tips regarding the donation of computers, it's widely recommended to keep with the currently installed OS (which is Windows XP in this case). Since XP will be unsupported in about two years, I'm not sure I would be setting the little ones up for success. Would anyone suggest donating a computer with a Linux distro like Ubuntu to a local charity for kids?"
In which context and for what should it be donated?
it depends on what the purpose of the PC is going to be, are the kids going to be playing games, is it for web browsing, is it for educational purposes, is it to teach programming or business skills? All of these possibilities may affect the choice of OS. Overall though, if the tips that you've read suggest staying with the installed OS, why not follow the tips? XP being unsupported shouldn't affect them in any real manner, and if it does become a problem then the OS can be changed at that time.
Keep the old xp's lying around and install Ubuntu dualboot.
I would install Ubuntu or some other free operating system. Main reason being licensing, with Ubuntu they'll get a current operating system and future updates and I don't have to worry about whether the XP license was part of a family pack and I can't even give it away, or whether it's an OEM license that prevents them from modifying the hardware, etc.
XP is still very much relevant - much to Microsoft's chagrin - regardless of its expiration date. The machine comes with a (OEM) license, presumably, so why waste it?
At the same time, might as well expose them to a Linux distribution that at least has scores of layman support, such as Ubuntu.
So why not set up a dual-boot system?
Leaving a clean copy of XP would be my suggestion since you already have the licenses and I reckon the Hardware itself will not likely survive another 2 years (They are Kids after all). But then again that would be too easy so here is another suggestion: Install OpenBSD to provide a solid foundation On top of that install Ubuntu (for an easy to use Linux distro) in VirtualBox, On top of that copy of Ubuntu install Windows XP if the kids need it to run their games In that virtual instance of XP get Firefox to point to jslinux so the kids have something to tinker with if the hardware is not enough spend some money for some more RAM
Windows XP needs expert maintenance to keep it running properly. You need to install antivirus and keep it updated, you need to run Windows Update, you need to keep various software packages up to date (and they all have their own ways to update). Printers and such all support XP, but you have to figure out where to get the driver and which one to use; whereas with Ubuntu the driver support isn't 100%, but the stuff that does work will really Just Work with no fussing. (Where I work, there is a networked printer that Ubuntu talks to perfectly, and it took well over an hour to get it working under Windows 7. And I had to install some wacky HP software that I really hate, to get it to go.) And even if you do everything right, after a few years the system will get kind of slow and bogged down, at which time you should really do a bare-metal reinstall to speed things up again.
Ubuntu should run well on any computer from the "Designed for XP" era. It has one unified package manager. The Ubuntu Software Center is a place where kids can get stuff for free, and it's legal and it won't be malware.
When I give away computers, I put Ubuntu on them. (Sometimes I also put Windows on them, if the person getting them has a need for Windows. But kids have no actual need for Windows, and Ubuntu works great.)
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
Be ready to do some real support. You may not find it very different form Windows but they will. That is just life, they aren't computer people. Be ready to have plenty of training to do. If you aren't willing to do that, then consider just leaving XP on them. You aren't doing them favours if you give them systems they can't handle and say "Too bad, your problem now!"
Also make sure Linux supports everything they want to do. If it is just web surfing and e-mail, no problem. However if they want to run special educational software, it may be Windows only. If that's the case, XP may be what is needed. Remember that "You don't need that," or "Well there might be OSS that is kinda like it," is never an acceptable phrase. Unless you can find something that they are happy with as a replacement, it isn't a replacement.
Just make sure that if you give them a Linux system, it will be workable for them. While a supported OS is always the best way to go, an unsupported OS won't necessarily be horrible. If the firewall is enabled and people don't use it as an administrator, it could be a long time before there is a real security issue.
Also keep in mind how long the hardware will last or is going to be used. XP will have patches for another 2.5 years (April 8, 2014 is when it stops). Will the systems still likely be running much after that?
There isn't a right way to do this, depends on the situation. So decide if you are willing to support it (or if they have a support guy that handles Linux, which is unlikely), and if so then find out if you can meet their needs with Linux. If not, put XPSP3 on them, patch it, harden it to the extent possible, install security software like MSE, and call it good.
I would go with Ubuntu, linuxmint or some such desktop distro today. Not so much because it's a better OS or will be supported longer than XP but because when you're donating computers you have to expect that they will end up in the hands of people who can't necessarily afford to buy software to do a lot of things and by default XP comes with 0 extras and won't necessarily know how/where to fine open source options for windows. In this light your typical linux distribution comes with software that will do a little bit of everything from office/word processing/whatever to editing graphics and even a few fun games for kids with plenty more for free in the repositories. I did this for several years in central Nebraska. In all I gathered up several hundred PC's from local businesses that were going to discard them and refurbished them and installed a user friendly linux distribution (at the time I was using Lindows/Linspire) and never had a complaint or even a call back with anything other than a thank you. Most distros like ubuntu, mint, fedora etc today are just as easy to use as windows out of the box even for a new user poking around trying to figure things out.
Moe info is needed. I had to do something similar when my employer got rid of a lot of old machines. they went to different places, and for each, I evaluated certain criteria.
Who will be administering these machines? This might make the decision easy for you, it might not BE your decision if there's a competent admin in the organization there who will of course have their own ideas. They may use the product keys the machines came with, they may have their own distro they want to standardize on, or they may even qualify for one of the cheap or free site licenses that Microsoft offers to NPOs.
As others have asked, what will the machines be used for? If it's 100% for the web, any OS will do, and it's a question of what will be easiest to maintain. Install the OS, lock it down good, install Firefox or Chrome in terminal mode and you're golden.
If you have any expectation that the staff or kids will want to install their own applications, you're almost certainly better off with XP - end of life or not. WINE is probably not something you want to get into with folks who don't understand computers well enough to administer them on their own.
Remember, just because it's a charity for local kids doesn't necessarily mean anything. Kids might not ever get anywhere near these machines. They could go to an admin who does the finances. One of the PCs we donated went to a charity for Cerebral Palsy where it's being used for fund raising. It's running Razor's Edge on XP.
The best thing to do is ask how they expect to use the machines. Then figure out how to set them up based on that (If they don't have their own people).
Touch everywhere, even when inappropriate.
Ask yourself 3 questions:
1) Will the kids want to play computer games? Of course, they are kids, what else are computers for at that age? That means XP.
2) Who will help them with the computer? Answer: other kids, parents and teachers. I bet your bottom dollar kids will get much better teaching from others with XP compared to Ubuntu, purely because of the install base and general familiarity.
3) Is the 2 year limit on XP relevant? Of course not, in 2 years as an XP machine it'll be due for a re-install anyway (if not before).
It might be worth taking a look at the Helios Project, (Website: http://www.heliosinitiative.org/ , Blog of bloke running it: http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/ ), as this is exactly what they do, collect together donated PCs and stuff, and provide refurbished PCs with Linux on to people on a charitable basis (predominantly disadvantaged kids I believe). (And they do some training etc as well I think).
Anyway, a lot of the postings on their have been quite interesting over the years, and I think they currently use either Ubuntu or Linux Mint.
Oh dear ... we asked a bunch of nerds which OS is best for a group of people they can't relate to.
No sig today...
As long as the PCs have 40GB or more of disk space, just install Ubuntu side by side with XP, with the latter as the first choice in GRUB.
This gives them a familiar environment (XP), but lets curious kids explore Linux if they're interested.
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Because you should only be donating high quality iPads to kids, anything else just isn't fair on them. You don't want to restrict their intellectual and socio-economic growth
And with the vast number of apps available for any possible purpose, whether for business, education or pleasure, there really is no better platform for choice.
So, all in all, it has to be Apple iOS for freedom, choice and thinking of the children who are our future.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
I wouldn't give anyone a system with an existing OS. You should scrub the drive and install fresh. Particularly with XP or other strains of Windows, there's no telling what might be crawling around in an old system. Even with Linux, are you certain you've found every trace of your old pr0n collection and deleted it?
Have gnu, will travel.
I have five kids (4 daughters, 1 son) and about the same number of computers in the house. Here is what I've learned:
Windows computers, no matter what version become unusable after six months due to kids installing stuff that includes three metric tons of crapware. If you remove the ability to install, you remove the ability to learn to manage the computer, which kind of defeats the purpose of letting your kids have a computer to begin with. When things go wrong, Dad is out 4-8 hours, usually re-installing everything on the laptop.
Macs work well, but are too expensive to let a 13 year old throw in the backpack, get stolen at the school library, etc... a $400 PC is not nearly as likely to grow legs because it will sell for $200 on the street. A $1300 Mac will get $900, which buys a lot of mind altering chemicals. When things go wrong, Dad is out 10-30 minutes.
Linux works fine. The kids like Kubuntu because they can customize everything (KDE4 is good at that), can access everything (Konqueror and Dolphin are amazing) and the browsers (Chrome, FireFox, Reconq and Opera) are all fine. OpenOffice is well suited to K-12 use, and Inkscape and Gimp are fantasic. There is no IE to fsck everthing up to hell. System administration is surprisingly not that big of a deal. It's pretty cool when they tell you, "Dad, I wanted to learn 3d so I found this thing called blender and here's what I made." When things go wrong, Dad is out 10-15 minutes, tops, and can usually SSH in and fix the problem.
-- $G
Ebuntu.
My father is 88. Last year I noticed his Ubuntu desktop had changed and I asked how. It had invited him to update to the next LTS release, he had followed the instructions. He is a retired lawyer, not a programmer.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
training and support for the little things like internet connections or even installing software. The Microsoft Windows ecosystem is somewhat self supporting with so many _"experts"_ all over the place willing to show the completely clueless what things to click on.
So, if the charity has a small base of volunteers and they could be trained on the basics and some were willing to learn more, something like Ubuntu would be perfect. The charity could use LTSP to set up a multi-seat training room or labs and if they were REALLY into it, all the installed systems could have their software update system set to the charities server for updates but not really needed unless there were lots of customization.
Without the basic training, the charity would get calls like "where is the D drive when I put my CD in?". But with Edubuntu and the KDE education packages along with others I think a Kubuntu installation would be a very good solution. And unlike a Windows system, they would not be taught to pirate proprietary software because they can't afford it, they would be taught to look for and try out different free solutions and can do so from the 10s of thousands of free software packages out there.
LoB
"Anyone who stands out in the middle of a road looks like roadkill to me." --Linus
If you subscribe to (now government-backed, thanks Blizzard) view that software EULAs are enforceable and software copies that come with EULAs don't have their titles transferred, then your "gift" of a computer will also come with contractual obligations upon the user that they never opted into and don't have the power to opt out of (except by replacing the OS). Furthermore, they probably won't even know what those obligations are, since you will be clicking through the 52-page "I agree" screen instead of the children reading it carefully and clicking "I agree" to indicate the child's fully informed consent to the binding contract.
(If this sounds totally fucked up, don't blame me.)
Doing this to anyone would hardly be "charitable," and doing it to children who don't even have a chance of understanding all the risks, would be even less so. Thus, you might want to avoid that if you're thinking in terms of charities.
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