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A Decade of Haiku OS
CharlyFoxtrot writes "Haiku OS, the open source reimplementation of BeOS, celebrated its tenth birthday this week. 'Ten years ago today, the first post appeared on the mailing list of our project — then still called "OpenBeOS" — officially marking the start of our endeavor. Back then, with the imminent demise of Be Inc., there was an excitement and creative motivation in the air, that lead many to think a first release was only a matter of a few years. As it turns out, this estimation was a bit too optimistic ...' The project is currently on the third alpha of its Haiku Release 1."
/me sings Happy Birthday....
It's too early, but by 2013, HP will ship the same amount of (Windows XP,Vista,7,8) as Haiku desktop PCs. Other manufacturers will soon follow suit.
Patents Drive Free Software as Hurricanes Drive Construction Industry
Assuming the OS makes it that far.
Now that they're done trying to clone BeOS (for which they did a fine job), they're starting to go and do their own thing. Much to the despair of everyone else- these new tangents of development are very un-BeOS like and lack the elegance their role model exhibits. The package manager/filesystem they're trying to implement is a perfect example of this.
I sincerely hope that they figure that stuff out- lest Haiku turn into an unmaintainable, overcomplicated piece of junk. It has such great potential, if only they stick to their roots and continue pushing a fast, simple, and more importantly- clean operating system.
-AC
Almost finished now
many bugs, long way to go
Haiku Release 1
"I once preached peaceful coexistence with Windows. You may laugh at my expense - I deserve it."
-- Jean-Louis Gassée, CEO Be, Inc.
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
So it arrives just in time for the post PC era?
Don't get me wrong, I tried Alpha 2 a while ago and I think that if they finish it and if it got support from the developer community it would be the best desktop OS ever: The UI is excellent and it is very developer friendly.
What I don't like about it is that it is basically just BeOS: A normal PC OS. And are you really sure that PCs will be the Computer of choice for anyone besides office workers and Slashdot readers?
We know it's an OS :P
Why would it? Does anyone actually use "custom skins"?
Well, if your OS is less relevant than Hurd these days -- and less capable -- you might have a problem.
The creatures outside looked from Alt-Right to Antifa; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
Everyone but Windows and Mac users, yes. And I have the Zune theme on my Windows XP machine...
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
App development is too easy with Haiku. If only people would make apps that people would realy want, like some cool games and a much better digital office bundle it would kill Windows just as fast as people would switched from the PS2 to the Xbox360.
The reason no OS on the planet has ever beaten Windows (including that iCrap), is because it offered nothing better than Windows that people realy, realy wanted to run. Yes it was technologically better as in a car with the best engine on the world, but without airco, without good brakes, slippy tires and a leaking roof.
It's not that hard to beat Windows, but you must offer apps that people want so badly that they'll dump Windows apps for it.
Signed,
Linux user.
Here be signatures
And if you don't know the difference between a kernel and an OS on Slashdot and post as if they are the same, you DO have a problem.
Prepare for ridicule.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Cool! Does it shut down for a day on leap years too :)
Today is a good day to Zune. February 29th, not so good.
as in...ZERO since HP is getting out of the business.
I don't, I've never used Windows so I'm not really aware of what Windows users do.
I've used various different Linux desktops, but never felt the need to change the "skin".
It's not that hard to beat Windows, but you must offer apps that people want so badly that they'll dump Windows apps for it.
Sure, you just need a better, more stable, easier-to-use OS with more exclusive, powerful, easy to use apps that runs on 500 million different computer setups.
Easy.
When BeOS came out it was impressive (I started on Intel v3.0 (first intel supported version)). I burned some cash getting compatible hardware. The BeOS was amazingly responsive, and was able to do things that windows still doesn't get right. The system was very clean.
I use linux all the time, I'm not a windows fan, but linux ain't right. Cut and paste don't quite work right, sometimes the middle mouse works, sometimes ctrl insrt, sometimes ctrl-v, and sometimes you cant do it without some intermediate window. Yes, I get that this is a Gnome/KDE issue, but the system as a whole isn't working right. The system isn't intuitive.
How many times have you seen some odd error come up, that you wished you could cut and paste into google. But you just can't, It wont let you highlite an error box text. It's sad.
Linux could be so much better, but it needs to be a whole system, not just a bunch of parts that sorta work together.
Everyone but Windows and Mac users, yes.
So everyone but 95% of PC users on the planet.
Easy to use is not the point. If you create a car that steers for you but you still lack that airco then you're still not going to sell anything.
Think of the following possible situation:
A couple of enthousiastic and talented people make a game today, with the awesomeness factor in which the original Doom was once released onto the internet. You can bet your ass that I'll be installing Haiku as dual boot, just to play that game. I'll be dual booting.
Then Haiku gets a super awesome HTMLv5 browser. Might as well browse the web then when I've already booted Haiku. I might as well use Google Docs instead of rebooting to Word...
While I'm serving the web and doing some work, I might as well fire up that media player.
What freaking reason would I have to reboot to Windows? Video editing? Like more than 5% of all people do that... Photoshop? Like more than 5% of all people do that.
While I'm at it I might as well download that file as PDF because anyone can read that. I'll send it with Gmail. Might as well set up that email program now.
Instant messaging? VoIP? Hello, it's 2011 and everybody has WatsApp on their phone...
Here be signatures
It's not that hard to beat Windows, but you must offer apps that people want so badly that they'll dump Windows apps for it.
Signed,
Linux user.
So why do you use Linux?
Because PCs are discrete. 'Amount' is used for continuous quantities.
'The same amount of' would apply in the case of a substance that you could measure by weight or volume; when it is items, 'the same number of' is the appropriate term. Sort of the same as 'less' and 'fewer'. If it's singular, it would be 'amount of' and 'less'; if plural, it would be 'number of' and 'fewer'.
What freaking reason would I have to reboot to Windows? Video editing? Like more than 5% of all people do that... Photoshop? Like more than 5% of all people do that.
Like more than 5% connects to a company exchange server, or use any other random software only available on Windows/OS X. You see, those 5% you're talking about aren't always the _same_ 5%. Every little percentage adds up, and that's why GNU/Linux hasn't taken off, all the small % adds up to a lot, and it just isn't a replacement for them.
-- Linux user #369862
Outlook 2010 has a web interface for your email and agenda. Argument flies out of the windows, still...
Here be signatures
What keeps OpenJDK and Gnash from getting ported? Do they have some deep dependency on Linux?
There is some support for skinning, as one of the devs explains here. But the whole project is very much focussed on getting the R1 done, which is as close to the original BeOS, which is an 90's OS even though it was ahead of its time in many ways, as they can get. There are discussions on where to after that in the glass elevator project though.
If all else fails, immortality can always be assured by spectacular error.
iOS is a complete failure on the desktop.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
We live in a quantized universe, everything is "discrete", continuity is a mathematical concept that doesn't exist in reality if you look deep enough.
Ass? He was just answering a question.
<sig> </sig>
You want to know how to get Linux some share? As a retailer I'll be happy to let you know, it is really easy...1.-GET RID OF THE DAMNED TERMINAL! It ain't 1979 anymore and disco is fricking dead, let go of the fucking blinking cursor, alright? Consumers ain't gonna put up with that shit, it has to go DIAF.
2.-FIX YOUR DAMNED DRIVER MODEL! It is 2011 and the constant driver borkage is getting old, okay? It is bad when a long term Linux user tells me "Well Linux just does that, what you need to do is" and then here comes the terminal bullshit. I don't care if you do it with an ABI, or offer Linus to Cthulu, but the reason NO shop will touch your OS is in no small part to the 6 month driver borkage!
You get rid of these two little things? Well I can tell you as a retailer a LARGE amount of the folks out there frankly don't need Windows. They surf, they watch YouTube, they check their Webmail, they play FB games. NONE of that requires Windows, but because Linux is such a fiddly little bitch, filled to the brim with basement dwellers that think terminals give them special gonad powers, that Linux don't gain shit.
Make it ALL GUI, NO CLI, make it so drivers don't break with every damned update, oh and get rid of that "software tied to which kernel you're running" while you're at it, and plenty of shops like mine would be more than happy to sell and support your OS. of course the day that happens I'll be riding a purple pony with She Ra because of all the lousy hacker wannabes that think having a term makes them something more than what they are, just another lamer. Hell why don't you get rid of your storage and use punch cards while you're at it? Modern tech piffle! Real men load their OS from cardboard!
As for TFA? Its a hobby OS, made by guys that KNOW its a Hobby OS, they have fun doing it, I'm totally happy for them and wish them another happy 20 years. As someone who ran OS/2 when everyone else was running Win 3.x I can understand the appeal of "what if" things would have been different, I really can. I saw everyone shit themselves with wonder at Win95 and went "What? That isn't as good as what I've been running for nearly 2 years!"
But sadly just like VHS VS Beta sometimes the best one loses, especially if the other guy is "good enough" and cheap. Amiga was good but too expensive and Commodore didn't know how to sell it so it went tits up. OS/2 was cool but IBM wanted to control the hardware and wanted crazy money for shitty behind the curve chips so it too went tits up. But as long as they have fun with it? Cool beans, everybody needs a way to burn off stress. Some folks play guitar, some build models, The Haiku guys try to build a modern Amiga. Hats off to 'em and I wish them all the luck in the world.
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
I've used various different Linux desktops, but never felt the need to change the "skin".
If you've used various different Linux desktops, odds are that you've already used different themes on the same major version of desktop without even doing anything, because each major distribution tends to have its own theme or at least theme selection.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
ass.
Some asses are discrete and others seem to be continuous.
of course the day that happens I'll be riding a purple pony with She Ra
Ponies! I call shotgun!
It is being ported, but :
"There are still some hangups to getting the first bootstrap build
going. It would be really helpful if someone could figure out the
issues between haiku and gcc such that gcc could be built with the
java support, so we could use it for bootstrapping."
There's a Gnash port too, though personally I think they'd be better off focussing on a good HTML5 capable browser, Flash is a dead man walking.
If all else fails, immortality can always be assured by spectacular error.
Considering there are OpenJDK ports for the *BSDs, I don't think so.
Dilbert RSS feed
When you say "everyone but Windows and Mac users", you do realize that you're only talking about less than 1% of the entire PC market (including laptops and netbooks)?
Computers are more than laptops and netbooks and tablets and servers. There are also cellphones and pretty much any color phone has themes. Heck, even some mono ones do. Truth is that skinnable interfaces are the norm. Windows has a skinnable interface but only enthusiasts typically mess with it. Microsoft has released (AFAIK) precisely two themes for Windows XP, Zune and San Fermin. But skinnable applications are also the norm; what Windows user hasn't used Windows Media Player? Selecting another skin is a fairly accessible and prominent option.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
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Flash is a dead man walking.
And it'll keep walking as long as Strong Bad Emails are still made in Flash. Or are you putting your faith in Smokescreen to emulate existing SWF animations on top of HTML5?
Maybe, maybe not. It's not something I actually set out to do, though, and I can't really understand why you'd want to.
"Haiku Browser" is Firefox. Still no argument...
Here be signatures
I haven't been to Homestar Runner in years, are they still releasing new stuff. All those comics could just as easily be streamed in h264, they are already released as DVD's so they must have them in some video format or other. The migration to HTML5 is already under way I think. I mean who in his right mind would release a new site with a flash interface these days ? These things happen very fast, one day you're on top the next you're on the rubbish heap of history next to Real Player.
If all else fails, immortality can always be assured by spectacular error.
It's great that you made the 10 year anniversary. I'm rather impressed by the quality of the system at this point. It's a lot of work that most people will never understand. (Yeah i run an even less relevant OS project)
Working on Linux isn't the same thing. There are many people that work on Linux. Keeping a smaller project running is a lot more challenging. They had the magic to attract help, but at the Linux levels. I think they'll have something quite usable in some time. I've dug through some of their code and it's quite good in many places.
MidnightBSD: The BSD for Everyone
The only BSD that's impressive about this is OpenBSD. NetBSD and FreeBSD had licenses from Sun for binary "real" java releases that they could later use to bootstrap OpenJDK. The work porting Java initially was awesome, but it was much easier for FreeBSD and NetBSD to move forward with OpenJDK than it was for OpenBSD or DragonFly.
Thanks to the Linuxolator, we could run old linux JDKs and use them to bootstrap the older binary builds and then go from there. Java requires Java to build (or a subset of it). OpenBSD came up with a clever bootstrapping approach.
Also, the FreeBSD ports of JDKs were based on the Solaris code, not the Linux code.
MidnightBSD: The BSD for Everyone
All those comics could just as easily be streamed in h264
At the cost of ten times the bandwidth.
This is why the big 3 continue to have a foothold in the desktop space. Here's a hint, if everyone started using a new platform, Adobe would port it or flash would die. Either way, I'm happy.
MidnightBSD: The BSD for Everyone
How appropriate.
BeOS was designed as a replacement for MacOS, unfortunately, Steve one-uped Jean-Louise with NeXT and stole that crown with a superior product. I still prefer
BeOS over NeXT though
The last efforts of Be Inc. was to bundle the lightweight BeOS into Internet Appliances, a concept not dissimilar to Tablet-based computers. They even had a Tactile UI called BeIA, (which although completely unrelated to) could be considered a precursor to modern tablets.
PalmSource bought Be Inc.'s IP and planned to integrate components of BeOS into the new version of PalmOS "Cobalt". Meanwhile Palm's Hardware division decided that Windows Mobile 5 was a better option for their hardware. Palm and PalmSource merged shortly after that before fading into obscurity
Following the announcement of iPhoneOS, the desiccated remains of Palm realised that they were going to be killed outright and decided to emulate Apple, and bought on Jon Rubenstein. Poorly spec'ed Hardware, as well as misguided attempts to leech off the success of iTunes allowed Apple to steamroll WebOS, which was designed to compete with a Web-App only iPhoneOS. The release of the iPhone SDK bought iPhoneOS way ahead of WebOS.
I'd like to think that WebOS still had some of the legacy of BeOS. Probably none of the code, a little bit of the IP and a whole lot of Spirit.
BeOS, I do remember you.
WebOS, I will remember you.
Well, then there is the point of: Do you really want some OS to beat windows?
I personally like the fact that the FOSS OSes are a bit of a niche on the desktop. I don't care that much that I need to pull up terminals to do some stuff, actually on some occasions it is quite relaxing to go the minimal and info oriented route to troubleshoot something instead of getting encumbered with gui hell.
In addition to this using a solution that is not in the mainstream generally means that you will get a much more knowledgeable community which helps productivity and learning. just go to yahoo answers (picked this because it very well represents the skills/abilities of people on the Internet today) and ask a question about a medium complexity computing task, in both the win7 category and the linux one. Then wait a day or two and compare the answers you will get. Not really the same quallity? That's the expected outcome. The win7 thread will have about 2^20 answers of which but a handful will be of any value. on the linux thread you might get just the one answer but it will help you complete your task.
On another note, I am running a complete FOSS web development studio and we are beating the hell out of our local competition that relies on proprietary software. As an added bonus screening/interviewing job applicants is much easier with a pure foss setup, people who don't want to hop into a new computing environment and get out of their comfort zone (or haven't already) are usually sub par material in the IT world.
So as a conclusion I would like to suggest that the FOSS variants should not become mainstream maybe a slight increase in market share might help but in desktop world 1-2% sounds perfect imo. (go Windows!!!)
any ignorance in the above text is mine. MINE!!!! you can't have it. go get your own.
-- no sig today
He found the secret secret place where they keep the apps, that people want so badly that they'll dump Windows for, which when publicized will lead to a huge increase in linux users and finally begin the "year of the liinux desktop" ;-)
tinfoil hat?
-- no sig today
She Ra
shotgun!!!
-- no sig today
Every now and then I'll download and play with one of the "alternative" OSs. The box I'm typing this on (a Mac running Lion) has VMware installs of Haiku, Syllable (what AtheOS evolved in to), Minix, and several flavours of Linux. What next? MVS under Hercules, perhaps?
Technically, Minix is the most interesting. Haiku is the prettiest.
...laura
While I agree with the sentiment in general, it's not necessarily a reason to not use Linux in the home user/SMB user market. There's a simple solution for these people: Use a long-term Linux distribution such as Ubuntu Long Term Support (LTS).
Link: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LTS
Let's face it: Most home users/SMB users don't change their hardware very often, so once a computer is set up, it is essentially a static configuration, save for the occasional memory or hard drive upgrade, upgrades to monitors or replacing keyboards and mice. This being the case, an LTS version of Linux is ideal, I would think?
Finally, I fondly remember OS/2 - I ran it at home from Warp v2 to Warp v4, and it was a great OS! I ran it dual-boot during that time (OS/2 and DOS/Windows 3.x and DESQView, later DESQView/386 and QEMM-386), buying hardware based on OS/2 driver support. When Window 95 was released I saw the writing on the wall, but continued to dual-boot. I finally gave up on it completely a few months after Windows 98SE was released: OS/2's hardware support was lagging ever-farther behind, and when Creative Labs stopped releasing OS/2 drivers I'd pretty much had enough. I bought a copy of Scitech Display Doctor for OS/2, and that helped somewhat, but my next computer had no OS/2 partitions. I still have my last copy of OS/2 Warp v4, and occasionally look at it on my shelf and think "I should try get it running under VirtualBox"...
Regards,
dj
I'm not the biggest fan of Outlook (or OWA), but we use it at work, and OWA is actually pretty decent in web browser support. It works in IE of course, Firefox, Chrome, and Safari (and maybe other browsers that I haven't tried). According to this site, as of June 2011, that's 97% of the browser market share.
Why, no, I haven't meta-moderated lately. Thanks for asking!
Just looking around other OS's like I sometimes do, hey lets check out Haiku, look at whats available and make sure my hardware works with it
ah cool nvidia support, ah FAIL agp drivers for geforce 7 series or less otherwise use the vga driver
moving along ...
guys you gotta make some attempt to at least try and keep up with hardware if your making an OS
so anyway I tossed it on my 2.4ghz celeron craptop since its more fitting, still had to use some generic driver on a pretty old ATI card, and the OS was obnoxiously slow (well the computer is already slow so only -1 pt) and frankly there was nothing to run.
it was fun for a day, but realistically pretty spartan, and not that functional, maybe I will check back in a decade to see if they have advanced at all.
You want to know how to get Linux some share? As a retailer I'll be happy to let you know, it is really easy...1.-GET RID OF THE DAMNED TERMINAL! It ain't 1979 anymore and disco is fricking dead, let go of the fucking blinking cursor, alright? Consumers ain't gonna put up with that shit, it has to go DIAF.
What blinking cursor? You mean that one that is right at home in pretty much every text editor used today? Or the one in all Web browsers' location/address/search bars? Or the ones in those various other text entry boxes in just about any other program?
The above quote was pretty damn dumb, but the rest of your post is just plain retarded. You better tell Apple and Microsoft to ditch their respective command line terminals. Modern Linux distros that focus on new users (and there are a lot of them) rely on the command line about as much as Windows and Mac OS do for the most part. The only time I use the terminal is when I *want* to use the terminal; ie., to do things quicker and more efficiently that I would otherwise be able to with *any* GUI. And in those times... I'm happy to have a terminal that works so well compared to the crap Command Prompt included with Windows.
I would say its mostly hobbyists having fun, the development of this thing moves at a snails pace, and the only goal I have ever seen is to replicate Be
I'd rather spend the bandwidth, which is relatively cheap
People who can't get fiber Internet, cable Internet, or DSL where they live might disagree with you. They use a wireless (satellite or 3G) broadband service that caps users at 5 GB of transfer per month. So might web hosts that exceed their allotted bandwidth from too many people choosing the H.264 option rather than the SWF option.
than rely on an interpreter of often dubious quality.
Which is why, for example, Firefox sandboxes the dubious-quality interpreters.
back when Homestar Runner was newly popular
...dial-up was also popular.
There's not "tons" of those, there's a handful of those. I am given to understand a number of them are pretty cool but the number is still not very big.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I still can't think of a good reason why the terminal should be necessary or even useful. Things should either be automated so the CLI isn't necessary and a singler folder filesystem would supplant any disk navigation CLI queries.
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
Can you give me the best example of where the terminal would be more useful than any alternative?
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
Tada! BeBits!
Enjoy the BeBits archive, get a knife and fork so you can eat your words dinkypoo.
Remember, Slashdot does not have a -1 disagree moderation, and no, troll, flamebait, and overrated are not substitutes.
My Reason I want it on my computer: The second I know how to do it in the terminal, I know how to automate it.
The Reason I would want it on my mothers computer: Instead of going through miles and miles of "click this, read that, click there, check that, click this, read me back what the message says" back and forth while troubleshooting I can just send a mail with "copy/paste this in the terminal, and send me back the result".
Also the GUI and the Terminal are two different tools. Like a hammer and a saw. Each has its specific advantages and disadvantages.
You of course there seem to be people who *really* hate saws, and will never touch them, and go throw hissy fits when they see one.
They only use the hammer all the time, even to cut boards.
Oh, and a "Windows" CLI example:
What's easier, getting a customer to click through dozen of sub-windows in the network configuration while troubleshooting, or print and fax you a single screen-shot of "ipconfig /a" from the CLI ?
Easily: installing new software.
For example, "q) How do I install a web server?"
"a) sudo apt-get install apache" (tabbed-auto-completion helps here!)
It works for almost any questions about the OS: with Windows, the answers are "Click Start, click this, click that, click X tab, click something, select something, clickety-clickety-click, click OK, reboot."
In *nix, it's always something like: "copy the following 3 lines and paste them in a terminal running as root. Change XYZ to what your needs are. Done."
Truly, many things are faster in the terminal window - as long as your fingers are on the keyboard anyway.
Hope that helps.
a: This helps my case even more. The whole thing software installation should be automated, and in the future it certainly will be. Hence making the terminal/shell/cli/console/command line prompt (or whatever it's called next Tuesday) redundant.
As for your second point, that comes more under the realm of documentation/preferences. Instead of a terminal to display this information, we should be using a real-time filtered info window, where any text typed (into a single line's textbox, no more) filters out information on the fly into the main display area.
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
That comes more under the realm of documentation/preferences. Instead of a terminal to display this information, we should be using a real-time filtered info window, where any text typed (into a single line's textbox, no more) filters out information on the fly into the main display area. The terminal is far from ideal for this kind of thing.
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
It would vary by person, but one thing I wouldn't trade the command line in for a GUI program is audio encoding.
Say I have wave or FLAC files, and I want to make a quick Ogg Vorbis encoding at, say, quality level 5.5. I go to the directory containing the CD/files (which could, by the way, be as simple as finding it in the file manager and "open in terminal" if I really wanted).
mkdir Band-CDTitle; oggenc -q 5.5 *.flac; mv *.ogg Band-CDTitle
Also, wget -- I almost exclusively use wget to download files. The only exceptions are when I can't, because of the way the file is put up. Nothing beats its stability and minuscule resource usage for downloading large files, as well as its options and timestamp preservation. And best of all, I don't have to worry about the browser crashing since it's not downloading, or its GUI crashing since it doesn't have a GUI. In fact, X.Org could crash and it wouldn't phase it, especially if it was running in another virtual tty.
I am someone who came from Windows and still primarily use the GUI, but there are just some things I love having the terminal available for. As I said though, it would very per person; I'm sure a lot of people don't give a damn about these two things.
Maybe because he has found reasonable replacements for all the apps that he wanted?
I think you rather missed the point.
If you want automated installation, Linux or BSD are the way to go, both use GUIs or CLIs (your choice) for the same thing.
But the user must be involved to some point, like choosing whether to install MySQL server or client, etc.
I don't think you've thought that through its implementation very well, but I suggest you might actually learn to like apt-get as a package management tool.
Remember, in Linux / BSD, all software is updated through package manager, no separate updates for Firefox, Thunderbird, Apache, etc.
Certainly a GUI is best for some things, but if you think doing away with CLIs is a step forward, you're simply wrong. Sorry, no offense.
Choose the best tool for each job, etc.
Your audio example could easily be a custom-made preset inside a GUI. You'd get the same thing done with one or two clicks. If you wanted different values each time, then the tab in the gui would replace the space bar in the terminal, as it would move on to the next field/textbox.
If software is written right, it will be as stable as any terminal.
I hate kludgy slow software as much as anyone (hence why I'm so interested in Haiku, and wrote an article about latency which made Slashdot's news a short while back), and I have a fair amount of experience with the command line......... but I remain unconvinced.
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
Having read your original post again more properly this time, you're right, it almost feels like a different post, at least the first half or so (that's an odd feeling!). Let me try again:
Yes, Windows can easily make what should be a one step process into a million steps. But that's with a bad design. I'm saying what could be, rather than what is (I too hate having to trundle through window after window in the way you spoke of).
To give a better idea of how the GUI can work for speed instead of against; picture a "Master Prefs" program window with every single preference of the OS inside. These millions of entries would be searchable instantly (0.1s), with real-time filtering, and metadata (including semantic variations of a word) attached to each option so you could find or edit the desired option in seconds. It would be quicker than typing and would save having to remember the massive array of options.
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
Er just to clarify the last sentence of my post; obviously one would need to type in keywords, but I meant it would be quicker than typing what would be the equivalent of the CLI version. Heck, I'm tired..... time for bed.
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
I have a daemon here, awget which monitors the clipboard (can also be a folder for drag'n'drop) and launches wget. So find file I want to download, hilite and copy, click yes on popup, and wget the file.
Of course this is old technology so probably wouldn't work in anything designed in the 21st century. (OS/2 here)
It's also trivial to encode a file as you mention from the GUI though you still have to enter the parameters into a popup.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
Now a days OS/2 uses a port of Alsa for sound cards, works fine. Serenity Systems has the source code for Scitech now so hopefully the weak link, graphics support, will be fixed though I'm sure you'll still have to be careful of your hardware purchases. One nice thing is that IBM considers multi-core chips to be one CPU so your Warp V4 system is licensed for SMP as long as there is one physical chip.
To run OS/2 in Virtual box you need at least V4.5 (V4 + all the free fixes) and unluckily even though Vbox was designed to run OS/2 it has drifted away so you need to pick the right version for it to work. As I'm still running OS/2 on real hardware I haven't kept track.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
Why would somebody post that as AC?
Anyway, that's a possibility. That's why I prefaced it with 'might' :-)
-- no sig today
Yeah this works if you already know what to type. Otherwise the steps become:
1. Search Google for "how to install apache on ubuntu" which leads to a site saying "Invoke Apt-Get in the following way: sudo apt-get install apache".
2. Google "How to invoke commands on linux". That doesn't actually lead to any results like "Click Applications->Accessories->Terminal". You may think it's obvious, but a newbie would *not* know this.
3. Type the command.
4. Get really confused when typing in the password prompt doesn't produce any *'s. Why the hell is it still even set up like this? I actually don't know the original reason, but I'm guessing it hasn't applied for many years, or is insanely paranoid.
5. There's no 'apache' package.
6. Somehow find out that you have to use 'apache2'. I don't even know how a newbie would do this.
Vs (ok you have to imagine that it works as *indended*. The Ubuntu Software Centre is still a bit crap.)
1. Applications->Ubuntu Software Centre. Fairly easy to find.
2. Search for apache.
3. Imagine search actually works sanely and it put apache2 at the top and doesn't call it a "Metapackage".
4. Click it. Click install.
5. Imagine the password prompt tells you *which* password to use (wtf guys?)
6. Click ok.
7. Done.
Way way easier. Oh, and predictable responses that miss the point: 1. Why would a newbie be installing apache. 2. This only works on ubuntu. 3. You can't install everything using the ubuntu software centre.
Oh, and I did a search, and as far as I could find the only reason for not showing *'s for passwords is that someone could count the number of characters! What. The. Fuck.
Mathematical concepts don't exist in reality? A lot of people could ADD to that discussion, but there is a high probability of DIVIDING the audience into mutually mis-communicating groups, which would MULTIPLY the number of times I'd need to explain things, and in turn SUBTRACT from my time in the pub.
Pretty much all of which are undesirable outcomes, in my book. And in the pub's books too.
I don't know what you think of as "continuity" in the sense of a mathematical concept, and I don't have a precise definition of it since I don't claim to be a mathematician (competent at arithmetic is as far as I'd go ; and if that means a million-line spreadsheet rather than a ten line program, so be it), but I do have a pretty good handle on what is a continuous function, what is a discontinuous function, why it's important to differentiate (hah!) between the two , and how to get around the problem if you have to integrate a discontinuous function.
The driller on the brake or the derrickman in the pits may not recognise their pit management of a well kill as involving functions of any sort (apart from squeaking the brake, or opening a valve), but they do. And that is a very real-world piece of reality.
Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
> There are discussions on where to after that in the glass elevator project though.
Given the mailing list archive stopped in 2009, a more correct phrasing would be: "there were discussions".
Given the (lack of) speed of development of the cloning of the original BeOS, it's not very surprising that the discussions about the future have stalled..
A reminder that the NIH syndrome has (mostly) killed another nice project *sigh*.
1) Good future, I have no idea if it's possible within Windows. Kinda all applications which put out sound has a volume controller in my experience. I rarely want to listen to music and try to listen to a video at the same time but if I did I'm sure my music player and media player or YouTube flash application would let me control the volume of all of them. ... And if you need to multi-boot I don't see the problem with any OS combinations or what makes Linux so special.
2) Whatever.
3) Doubt many Windows users have a problem with multi-booting
4) What?
5) What?
5.5) What?
5.6) What?
6) True. Don't say much about OMG ALL THE LEENUCKS APPS WHICH IS SO LIKE TOTALLY AWESOME AND BEAT WINDOWS FOREVARH!
Though of course there's some good applications for the free desktops. I like the whole KDE environment. Or well, rather did like it. Many applications got too many panels and buttons and eventually I may want to have more of the integration on the web instead of on the desktop. As in doing my mail, IM, calendar, whatever stuff collected and available everywhere from the browser.
7) What?
8) I just need the greatest one. And I may have to agree with Fedora that the desktop is getting less important.
8.5) What?
9) AFAIK drastic changes in most free apps come from the developers, not from the users, in many cases the developers and the users don't care for the same thing and the developers wins. If you want something else make it yourself or shut up and stop complaining. Chances are the "PR idiots" is rather more likely to bring out what the users want instead of what the developers think is cool or care about.
I don't know if you answered to me (maybe Slashdot messed up?) but if you did your answer doesn't make much sense and it's very basic claims which has been true for Linux and the free desktops for decades but it really don't tell why the applications would be so superior to Windows. Which most people wouldn't agree upon.
For instance Windows is likely to have much more choices and eventually some better ones for creating music, or video. Obviously better games. Maybe better things for like creating a news paper / magazine. Better applications for working with graphics.
1) Ok. Nothing I would want to do anyway. :)
2) Good for you.
3) There are plenty of boot managers. Can't see why whatever you use for Linux (grub?) would be superior or so special vs anything else.
4) Say what? I never said I have no idea what a Linux distribution was. Who knows. Maybe I used one a decade before you did?
7) Can't see what it was a reply to, I blame Slashdot for not putting a "parent" link here, or quoting the parent post.
8) I don't think I've said anything about choices. Maybe I did. I didn't said everyone had to use KDE. I liked the integration of it, that's all. Now Google or whatever can give me similar integration online so I don't need it as much in my desktop. Depends on whatever you trust Google or Opera or whatever with your data though.
10) Ok. Then I didn't answered the wrong post atleast
Personally I got no special reason to use Linux specifically. Most of the unix like OSes would do as long as they can run the software I preferred to use.
For me applications > OS.
That's funny, I have Fedora 15 running on my 3 y.o. laptop with zero CLI setup. Free drivers only.
I know tobacco is bad for you, so I smoke weed with crack.
Nice to know that they changed it from this: http://www.mozilla.org/ports/beos/
And since it works on Chrome (webkit), it should also work on Webpositive.
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It's about to use the Gallium3D driver architecture, for which there is a nVidia driver (which kinda sucks if you intent to play anything more demanding than Quake3 on it) and AMD actually has active driver development on it, which is about 25-125% performance of the blob (depending on various tests, but Doom3 runs fine, so I guess it's not a desaster).
BTW Android just had a Gallium3D tree merged...
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Because of the productivity factor in certain use cases like programming, administration, video and music entertainment, web browsing infotainment and the pure geekyness of it.
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For all things 'work' considdered; absolutely. For silly things like gaming I still dual boot, but not out of love...
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You want to know how to get Linux some share? As a retailer I'll be happy to let you know, it is really easy...1.-GET RID OF THE DAMNED TERMINAL!
Like the cmd on Windows 7, where you have to fix your sleepmode by typing: /h on
powercfg
?
It ain't 1979 anymore and disco is fricking dead, let go of the fucking blinking cursor, alright?
Like Windows that still uses a fscking hourglass? (now fancy round one)
2.-FIX YOUR DAMNED DRIVER MODEL! It is 2011 and the constant driver borkage is getting old, okay?
You mean those fancy pants modular modules, which Vista later copied and worked so well without BSOD'ing? Ah those... Or do you mean Gallium3D GPU driver model that rivals all competition?
As for TFA? Its a hobby OS, made by guys that KNOW its a Hobby OS
That must be why so many important institutes and companies rely on it for running the fscking economy, right?
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When communicating with people, you communicate with words. You can talk to them or type. You don't record a fscking home video everytime you interact.
Now what makes a computer more usefull then to tell it what to fscking do, instead of pointing at shit with a cursor?
I can go to a terminal, tell it what to do, how to do it and on what to do it, in that order.
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Typing is good yes. A console uses typing, but so does a text editor, IRC, and a million other things. The idea of a console is so ingrained into many (not all) Linux folk that they would even use it as a basis for a calculator, when something like Soulver on the Mac is a far superior way of working with numbers (notepad like editing with real-time answers as you type).
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
Sure it could be done using a GUI, and it is in many programs. But when I enter the command, I know *exactly* what I'm telling it, and I know exactly what the software is going to do. And although I could, I wouldn't trade that in for a GUI.
As I said, these are just my preferences; trust me, I've used and compared a ton of GUI frontends over the years and I know it's possible. But I would still NOT go back any one of them after trying the command line. The simplicity, low memory use, and speed are just another advantage, but those aren't the only reasons.