Like a Redstone Cowboy

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Posted by timothy on Sunday August 28, 2011 @06:23PM from the tinyurl-getrollin dept.

neonsignal writes "Machine creations in Minecraft are becoming increasingly complex as people build on each other's ideas. Some notable examples include a Rubik's cube simulator, a 5-channel music sequencer, a 3D color printer, a 16-bit processing unit, and Conway's Game of Life. My own recent contribution is the world's slowest Universal Turing Machine. I'm now waiting for someone to implement Tetris in Redstone logic."

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"My own recent contribution: by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:25 · Score: 1, Funny

First boast!
1st post! by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:26 · Score: -1

1st post!
1. Re:1st post! by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:40 · Score: -1
  
  first but not the last fail.
What am I missing here... by Fluffeh · 2011-08-28 18:33 · Score: 4, Insightful

Disclaimer: I haven't ever played Minecraft, so I might not understand the fuss properly. Please feel free to educate :)
Haven't games within games been around for a heck of a long time? There are loads of mods that either emulate classics or offer a totally new unrelated game to players. Heck, I recall even playing texas hold em with guildies during raids through an ingame mod when I was playing Warcraft.
What is so special about minecraft that it makes so many stories? Is it just purely flexibility and users being imaginative, or is there a particular reason that /. loves it so? I recall a post a few months ago about a guy who recreated a good portion of a Star Trek ship in minecraft. Was it merely a slow news day then as well?

--
Moved to http://soylentnews.org/. You are invited to join us too!
1. Re:What am I missing here... by jimmydevice · 2011-08-28 18:38 · Score: 2
  
  just watch one of the videos, you will then understand. I's all mechanical 3d blocks.
  mindfuck is easy.
2. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:43 · Score: 1
  
  Not sure, I'd call it game, Minecraft is more like 3d paintbrush.
3. Re:What am I missing here... by 3.1415926535 · 2011-08-28 18:43 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Part of it is that it's hard to actually make anything using in-game redstone wiring, in the same way that it would be tricky but nerdily rewarding to make a 16-bit ALU using discrete transistors and wires on a breadboard. It also requires digging around in interesting and often surprising environments to actually *get* the redstone to make this stuff, so it's makes a good time sink for addictive personalities. It's pretty different from writing a mod for a game in some scripting language.
4. Re:What am I missing here... by smash · 2011-08-28 18:43 · Score: 2
  
  its the amoount of creative freedom you have. you can wire up pretty much anything in redstone, and the landscape is, for all intents and purposes, infinite (at least in terms of X and Y).
  
  --
  I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
5. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:46 · Score: 1
  
  Well, in World of Warcraft you can create mods by going out of game and writing some Lua script. The thing with Minecraft is that's it happens in-game, simply as a result of the basic building blocks they provide, and without having to learn complicated scripting languages and APIs.
  I think I am not really doing Minecraft justice with what I said above, but it's really nothing like just having a moddable game.
6. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:46 · Score: 0
  
  I don't understand, why you waste your time posting instead of just firing up wikpedia and look it up for yourself?
7. Re:What am I missing here... by Amiralul · 2011-08-28 18:50 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Ever played with LEGO? Ever built your own fort or tree house? Ever went on a beach and built up castles or simply dig holes? Minecraft if the digital version of all of these activities and more (adventure, exploration, unusual landscapes, 3D viewer for models impossible to see otherwise - Star Trek ships for instance).
8. Re:What am I missing here... by Wizarth · 2011-08-28 18:50 · Score: 2
  
  The main reason these are notable is these are not mods. There is no programming code involved. This is all done within the games mechanics. And those mechanics are limited to little more then wires and some simple logic gates.
9. Re:What am I missing here... by Beelzebud · 2011-08-28 18:53 · Score: 1
  
  Playing a texas holdem addon in WoW isn't quite the same as building a 16-bit processor out of mincraft blocks and redstone circuitry, now is it?
10. Re:What am I missing here... by varcher · 2011-08-28 18:54 · Score: 2
  
  Minecraft harkens back to the nostalgia of Lego (incidentally, http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Cl1OHhsao3A/TbkenaqJq1I/AAAAAAAADMo/lInbKf814Z8/lego-minecraft-1.jpg is a minecraft scene, in Lego. No less).
  The combination of light gameplay (there's a grand total of 4 hostile - and horrendously stupid - critters that pop out of the dark to annoy you) and the liberty of placing blocks however you want them have proved a massive hook.
  It took me about one hour. And while I'm not the most imaginative of architects, making some stuff on the fly after seeing one of the thousand of videos where aspiring architects (most of which cheat anyway) showcase their massive e-block... I do enjoy.
  Regarding redstone circuitry, I think it hovers on the razor-thin edge between ease and complexity. It's simple (the base element is the universal NOR, meaning you can make any digital boolean circuitry), quirky (which is important if you make a game rather than a dumbed down electronic simulator), and that's what fuels the creativity. And, unlike other games, it's all there in basic form. While a few modders have added "what they felt was missing", in fact, there's relatively little missing. A few sensors, a few actuators, but the whole is enough.
11. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:55 · Score: 0
  
  The digging around for enough material part can be easily overcome with cheats.
12. Re:What am I missing here... by somersault · 2011-08-28 19:37 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  I like how you think building a giant in-game circuit for this stuff is simpler than just scripting behaviour.. I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.
  
  --
  which is totally what she said
13. Re:What am I missing here... by psiden · 2011-08-28 19:50 · Score: 1
  
  Creativity thrives on limits. Its' not very impressive to build and ride a vehicle in 50 mph (~80 kmh) - except if it has to be powered by rubber bands only. In this case, redstone is the rubber band. Try it, its fun!
14. Re:What am I missing here... by Tei · 2011-08-28 19:54 · Score: 1
  
  You talks about games implemented outside of a game that can be played inside. This is about (using your words) games implemented inside of the game, that can be played inside of the game. Or using my own words "hardware implemented inside the rules of a virtual universe".
  Making a mod for a game in Lua or other is a nice thing. But implementing computers using the rules of phisic inside a game is a huge nerd achievement and really nerd-fun.
  
  --
  -Woof woof woof!
15. Re:What am I missing here... by RogerWilco · 2011-08-28 20:24 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  It's not about playing the game. it's about creating the contraption to do it. The focus is on the creative process.
  So an analogy in WoW would not be the ability to play an ingame game, but to make it. Remember the chess game from Karazhan? Suppose WoW plugins could make things like that. Suppose plugins could make battleground like concepts, with new types of combat and siege. Or plugins could add dances to the game. Or new model mounts, engineering tools, etc.
  Imagine that kind of freedom. There would be an amazing new WoW addon each month, that would end up as a Slashdot topic. Suppose someone made an addon that would allow parties and raids to meld into a combined form, like Voltron or Megazord. Suppose you had total freedom in how to defeat a raid boss: You could build a wall around it and drown it in lava, or build a cannon and shoot your plate wearing players at it (especially dwarves), fight it as a big human pyramid, so only a few people can move everyone around. Wow can't do that, because it would be totally unbalanced. It would be a lot of fun and give addon developer a whole new meaning.
  That is what Minecraft does: It gives you basic building blocks (literally), and a lot of creative freedom to mould the world.
  It means that the creativity is no longer limited to what the designer of the game could come up with, but the players can add their own creativity. The sky is the limit (literally, as it's only 128 blocks high).
  
  --
  RogerWilco the Adventurous Janitor
16. Re:What am I missing here... by Redlazer · 2011-08-28 20:29 · Score: 1
  
  The thing about Minecraft, is that these things are being created using the game's tools. Rather than someone developing a mod with code (like lua for WoW).
  Redstone can be used to power items with "electricity", like a Minecart Booster Rail, among tons of other things. Some of them may require a mod to facilitate (the Better Than Wolves mod adds mechanical power to the game, for example).
  -Red
  
  --
  Guns don't kill people, "with glowing hearts" kills people.
17. Re:What am I missing here... by SuricouRaven · 2011-08-28 20:32 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  One simple logic gate. The NOR gate. That's all you get - any other gate you want must be constructed from NORs. You can have up to five inputs, but getting that type of wireing density requires three-dimensional thinking.
18. Re:What am I missing here... by martas · 2011-08-28 21:06 · Score: 1
  
  Creating new content is a feature of the game itself in Minecraft (in fact it's pretty much the point), whereas traditionally it's been something that a person with special skills can do outside the game. Or at least that's my understanding.
  
  --
  weinersmith
19. Re:What am I missing here... by Spacejock · 2011-08-28 21:09 · Score: 1
  
  It's legos without running out of bricks.
  
  --
  Hal Spacejock: Science Fiction with Nuts
20. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 21:10 · Score: -1
  
  I's all simulated mechanical 3d blocks
  There, fixed that for ya
21. Re:What am I missing here... by Tuuresairon · 2011-08-28 21:40 · Score: 1
  
  in the same way that it would be tricky but nerdily rewarding to make a 16-bit ALU using discrete transistors and wires on a breadboard.
  More like "make a 16-bit ALU using buggy discrete transistors and broken wires on a breadboard". Nerdily rewarding? I'd call it masochism.
22. Re:What am I missing here... by nschubach · 2011-08-28 21:57 · Score: 1
  
  To be totally truthful (fair?) to the casual reader, you cannot make infinitely large creations because mechanics (redstone, pistons, et al.) do not operate if you are too far away.
  
  --
  Every time I start to have faith in humanity, I ruin it by driving to work between 7 and 8 am.
23. Re:What am I missing here... by nschubach · 2011-08-28 21:58 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  It depends on the person. Some people are more hands on. This is why we have hardware and software engineers.
  
  --
  Every time I start to have faith in humanity, I ruin it by driving to work between 7 and 8 am.
24. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 22:01 · Score: 0
  
  Was that really necessary?
25. Re:What am I missing here... by geminidomino · 2011-08-28 22:21 · Score: 1, Funny
  
  This is why we have hardware and software engineers.
  When you say things like that, you make it sound like we're actually supposed to complement each other, rather than sniping at each other in pointless holy wars, at least until some uppity liberal arts degree comes along to draw our combined ire.
  Goddamned radicals are invading slashdot.
26. Re:What am I missing here... by Internetuser1248 · 2011-08-28 22:23 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  Once again minecraft shows itself to be dwarf fortress' inferior cousin. This is not the only example.
27. Re:What am I missing here... by dissy · 2011-08-28 22:43 · Score: 2
  
  where aspiring architects (most of which cheat anyway) showcase their massive e-block
  I'd just like to add that, at least right now there is no true "game" aspect to this game.
  It's a "game" app in the same category as Lego Digital Designer is a "game".
  The two common modes of play are a) Survival, where you only get the resources you can mine yourself, and have to avoid the baddies and deal with the few game like pieces that won't be done until the final version.
  And B) creative mode, where there are no bad guys, no RPG or adventure game aspect (Outside of exploring), and you get free access to all blocks to place as you will.
  Creative mode is not called "cheating" and there are plenty of servers even configured to run this way.
  In this mode Minecraft is a lot more like Lego Digital Designer, even if slightly less of a tool.
  Just because one doesn't have to jump through hoops to get bricks in Lego Designer in order to place infinite bricks, one would not call this cheating since it is this way by design.
  The only major difference between the two modes is that when someone accomplishes the same task in Survival mode, they just put a ton more work into it. (And that isn't to say that ton of work was trivial, I respect anyone with the skill to design something I could only do in creative mode while dealing with bad guys at night and exploding creepers)
28. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 23:03 · Score: 0
  
  Can I use Facebook inside it?
29. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 23:23 · Score: 0
  
  It's the perfect sandbox game for autists and everyone here aspires to be one, so there.
30. Re:What am I missing here... by Nyder · 2011-08-28 23:24 · Score: 1
  
  Disclaimer: I haven't ever played Minecraft, so I might not understand the fuss properly. Please feel free to educate :)
  Haven't games within games been around for a heck of a long time? There are loads of mods that either emulate classics or offer a totally new unrelated game to players. Heck, I recall even playing texas hold em with guildies during raids through an ingame mod when I was playing Warcraft.
  What is so special about minecraft that it makes so many stories? Is it just purely flexibility and users being imaginative, or is there a particular reason that /. loves it so? I recall a post a few months ago about a guy who recreated a good portion of a Star Trek ship in minecraft. Was it merely a slow news day then as well?
  What, google doesn't work for you?
  
  --
  Be seeing you...
31. Re:What am I missing here... by Skowronek · 2011-08-28 23:32 · Score: 2
  
  I'm very much an addictive personality *and* an actual digital designer. My personal reaction to Minecraft's "redstone" crap was a resounding "meh", though.
  In the same amount of effort and time that it takes to build a slow, useless piece of Minecraft logic, I can build something actually interesting in an FPGA by instantiating and placing LUTs (a marginally higher abstraction level than redstone), and have it run at 500 MHz.
  After doing ASIC design, even FPGA design feels a bit like playing with Lego bricks after building real bridges (there's nothing wrong with Lego bricks, but they do not have the same mechanical qualities). But at least it's not plasticine, like Minecraft (again - nothing wrong with plasticine, but it really does limit what you can do).
  People should be dissuaded from doing otherwise unremarkable things in the most painful way possible (16-bit CPU in Redstone - great, but you could achieve the same CPU in 100-200 lines of Verilog, and it would be quite fast). Those guys are probably quite bright, and could do much more impressive things if they didn't restrict themselves to plasticine. Start on the Lego :)
32. Re:What am I missing here... by Teancum · 2011-08-28 23:38 · Score: 1
  
  Once you get down to a deep enough level and finally start getting redstone, it usually isn't (from my own experience) all that difficult to keep getting more. The trick is getting down to it in the first place and staying alive when you open a new underground chamber filled with critters or monster spawners if you are really challenged.
  Yes, you can cheat too, in a huge variety of ways. There isn't even just one "cheat" as even that is customizable.
33. Re:What am I missing here... by Lehk228 · 2011-08-28 23:48 · Score: 2
  
  but sometimes a monster will come out of the trees and wreck part of it.
  
  just like a little brother does to your Legos
  
  --
  Snowden and Manning are heroes.
34. Re:What am I missing here... by drjones78 · 2011-08-29 00:05 · Score: 1
  
  Minecraft is essentially digital Legos with zombies. People build crazy amazing things in minecraft for the very same reason you can find people building Lego car assembly plants out of Legos... really no good reason at all except for the "fun" of doing it. Not really my idea of great fun, but well... to each his own.
35. Re:What am I missing here... by ObsessiveMathsFreak · 2011-08-29 00:14 · Score: 1
  
  It means that the creativity is no longer limited to what the designer of the game could come up with, but the players can add their own creativity.
  
  It's worth noting that Notch has explicitly stated that one of his development goals is to promote emergent gameplay and creativity. Minecraft is like LittleBigPLanet in this sense; user created content and creativity was the goal from the beginning.
  
  --
  May the Maths Be with you!
36. Re:What am I missing here... by justforgetme · 2011-08-29 00:18 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  I think that You are not getting it.
  You are right on all accounts but ignore the reason why building minecraft machina in a sandbox is more fun than programing an FPGA: Minecraft still is a game, programing FPGA's on the other hand is at best a hobby (if not straight out work for some). So it is the gamelike qualities that encourage for this. The fact that you can have Friends pop into the server your sandbox lives in and help out (or destroy everything). It is the community that you belong to when doing this.
  Don't look at this quantitatively, this is not a survival game in a free economy, this is doing things because you can.
  And that is true nerd spirit!
  
  --
  -- no sig today
37. Re:What am I missing here... by Skowronek · 2011-08-29 00:24 · Score: 2
  
  Dunno, I really enjoy Minecraft otherwise (building, pretty landscapes, running around with friends), but redstone logic feels not only like work, but like the most unpleasant part of my work - what I'd call "the drudgery".
  And not only it's like work, but it's also ultimately pointless. You are not exploring new frontiers, you are trying to recreate 1960s tech with wood sticks.
38. Re:What am I missing here... by nschubach · 2011-08-29 00:27 · Score: 2
  
  But with DF you are limited on the embark area... so you have to balance your options.
  The interesting thing (to me) is that DF requires that you build your contraptions using actors (the dwarfs) instead of manually placing all the items yourself. So you have to balance a population of labor's needs with your final goal. You can, of course, cheat in both games. But I still wouldn't place DF on a throne of gold. Toady can only do so much and it feels like things are slowing down.
  
  --
  Every time I start to have faith in humanity, I ruin it by driving to work between 7 and 8 am.
39. Re:What am I missing here... by JoeMerchant · 2011-08-29 00:40 · Score: 1
  
  I too speak from a position of Minecraft ignorance (I 'think' I logged on once, long ago, when the first Minecraft story piqued my interest, that first hand experience left me mostly unpiqueable for Minecraft since then).
  Anyway, I -believe- the fuss is mostly because Minecraft Classic is a "free" to play game in which creations are "free" for others to copy - so it's kind of a "best of" meld of Free Software, Legos, and Second Life.
  Personally, it looks like a ginormous time-sink to me.
  ------
  It's a scary day when ginormous doesn't trigger the spell-checker.
40. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 00:41 · Score: 0
  
  Sulu! Z minus ten thousand meters!
41. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 00:47 · Score: 0
  
  Welcome to slashdot.
42. Re:What am I missing here... by Tuan121 · 2011-08-29 00:48 · Score: 1
  
  Heck, I recall even playing texas hold em with guildies during raids through an ingame mod when I was playing Warcraft.
  You will have to elaborate, but I'm assuming by "mod" you mean he linked you to something via an ingame web broswer? I'm somehow doubting WoW allows you to do anything more than that.
  But anyway, the appeal of minecraft is that you are "physically" creating things in the game, even more amazing is you can do so with other people in realtime. You aren't writing (arguably boring) code and then adding it into the game*, you really get to feel like you are building things and discovering how to make something work. It really engages the player by having just simple tools at your disposal and you can go and try to build amazing and crazy things.
  So does it deserve all the attention it gets? Absolutely. Go play it and you might be surprised how amazing it is.
  *Granted you can have "mods" by coding as well, but that is mostly rewriting server logic/abilities, and not generally modifying anything about how the game works itself.
43. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 00:52 · Score: 0
  
  "Machina" is not some plural for machine. It's just latin for "machine." The plural is "machines."
44. Re:What am I missing here... by MobileTatsu-NJG · 2011-08-29 00:56 · Score: 1
  
  Sometimes we prefer to hear from someone directly about their experiences. That's partly why the internet has a lot of discussion forums and isn't just made up of one big wikipedia.
  
  --
  
  "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
45. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 01:05 · Score: 0
  
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46. Re:What am I missing here... by quantumphaze · 2011-08-29 01:17 · Score: 1
  
  Personally, it looks like a ginormous time-sink to me.
  So is Slashdot, TV and porn.
  
  --
  Unicode in Slashdot
47. Re:What am I missing here... by argStyopa · 2011-08-29 01:27 · Score: 1
  
  I enjoy minecraft, albeit not nearly as much as some.
  The thing about minecraft is that
  a) it's an individual developer, not a giant studio
  b) it's 99.9% sandbox, where you can do whatever you want. It's just basically pieces with a basic set of physics.
  c) it's free/cheap. Dunno what it is now, but I think I paid $5 when it was in beta.
  It's fun to build things (think - unlimited lego set), plus it hearkens back to the halcyon days when gameplay was more important than polished graphics (fwiw I think that's just rose-colored glasses).
  It's simple, fun, and cheap, putting essentially no limits on what you can do.
  
  --
  -Styopa
48. Re:What am I missing here... by ObsessiveMathsFreak · 2011-08-29 01:32 · Score: 1
  
  Dwarf Fortress and Minecraft are two completely different games. Both are centred on 3D discrete block grids. The similarities end there.
  Minecraft is a 3D first person interactive environment manipulation game. Dwarf Fortress is a quasi-interactive, procedurally generated, virtual world simulation. In Minecraft, players make their own fun. In Dwarf Fortress, players are told that "Losing is Fun". In Minecraft, the ultimate goal is to make epic creations. In Dwarf Fortress, the ultimate goal is to make epics.
  Even their distribution models differ. These two games are really chalk and cheese.
  
  --
  May the Maths Be with you!
49. Re:What am I missing here... by X0563511 · 2011-08-29 01:33 · Score: 1
  
  Most who do things like the submission tend to just give themselves the materials if they don't outright use something like WorldEdit to do the work.
  
  --
  For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
50. Re:What am I missing here... by bidule · 2011-08-29 01:35 · Score: 1
  
  Once again minecraft shows itself to be dwarf fortress' inferior cousin. This is not the only example.
  Having played both, I'd say you are comparing SimCity to Doom. If it wasn't for DF's hellishly inconsistent interface, I could still enjoy them all. Nethack was a joy compared to this monstrosity.
  
  --
  ID: the nose did not occur naturally, how would we wear glasses otherwise? (apologies to Voltaire)
51. Re:What am I missing here... by X0563511 · 2011-08-29 01:36 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, and the AC is clearly someone in marketing.
  
  --
  For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
52. Re:What am I missing here... by SharpFang · 2011-08-29 01:36 · Score: 1
  
  Imagine a modding engine where to get each character you use in a script of the mod you need to enter an ancient dungeon, fight skeletons and then mine the walls for coding commands. Typing "if(x=0)" feels different than usual if obtaining the "if" statement was forged from two rare ores found on the bottom of a pit filled with scorpions, the "x" was guarded by goblins, the "0" was found floating in shark-infested waters on the seaside and you needed to assemble the "==" from two trees you chopped down.
  Programming using a nail and a box of punch cards seems leisurely by comparison.
  
  --
  45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
53. Re:What am I missing here... by bidule · 2011-08-29 01:47 · Score: 1
  
  or build a cannon and shoot your plate wearing players at it (especially dwarves),
  Why build a cannon when you can just punt Gnomes at the boss? Some even have the right equipment to survive months inside its stomach. Yeah, it's more fun inventing machinery to punt oversized people, but where will you find a Dwarf with enough ingenuity to create an acid-resistant diving suit?
  
  --
  ID: the nose did not occur naturally, how would we wear glasses otherwise? (apologies to Voltaire)
54. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 02:02 · Score: 0
  
  So you could make an Apollo guidance computer in the game?
55. Re:What am I missing here... by flimflammer · 2011-08-29 02:09 · Score: 1
  
  Doubt all you want; there is no in game web browser in World of Warcraft. World of Warcraft's user interface is 100% customizable via lua scripting. You can do a ridiculous amount of things with it.
56. Re:What am I missing here... by nschubach · 2011-08-29 02:11 · Score: 1
  
  ...gardening, boating, fishing... (continue other hobbies here...)
  
  --
  Every time I start to have faith in humanity, I ruin it by driving to work between 7 and 8 am.
57. Re:What am I missing here... by nschubach · 2011-08-29 02:13 · Score: 1
  
  It's 15 euros now (about $22).
  
  --
  Every time I start to have faith in humanity, I ruin it by driving to work between 7 and 8 am.
58. Re:What am I missing here... by guruevi · 2011-08-29 02:44 · Score: 1
  
  You can also create an OR (cross 2 redstone wires) and a NOT gate (wire to a block with a redstone torch). But what do you think your current computer is made out of? At the very low level they're all very basic gates of the same type.
  I studied electronics design and while doing the high-level stuff is fun in a simulator, to build a unit we were at some point required to condense all of our logic to as few chips as possible because a single chip can have 4-16 gates but they'll be 4-16 of the same gates and chips are expensive and wire (on a circuit board at least) is cheap (it has to be there anyway) while chips (even though they may be only 50c) are expensive and take up a lot of space which helps a lot to save costs in mass production.
  
  --
  Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
59. Re:What am I missing here... by SuricouRaven · 2011-08-29 02:54 · Score: 1
  
  That's not quite an OR gate, because the inputs are coupled together. A problem if you want to drive more than one OR gate off of the same output. Still useful, but not even a true logic gate really.
  
  It's the redstone equivilent of the EE newbs mistake of thinking they can just couple gate outputs together and get a free OR gate, without knowing what that 'high Z' thing in the datasheet is for. Then their chips go popcorn.
  The restone NOT gate is really just a NOR gate with the unused inputs left unconnected.
  The simple wire-link OR gate is useful for combination locks though. My old home on one server used to use one such design, until I upgraded it to a system where entering the wrong combination causes pistons to retract the floor from beneath you and expose a fifty-level-deep pit.
60. Re:What am I missing here... by tibit · 2011-08-29 02:55 · Score: 1
  
  it would be tricky but nerdily rewarding to make a 16-bit ALU using discrete transistors and wires on a breadboard
  Not very tricky. Much simpler than a 3D printer in minecraft. The problemw ith minecraft is that its simulator has glitches, and can mis-simulate when the machine load is high, etc. It's a game, and the simulation logic tries not to lag the display. This makes it non-deterministic AFAIK. It's unfortunate. If you watch the 3D printer video, he has to tweak things all the time -- almost just like with real-world Rube Goldberg contraptions that often work 1 out of 20 times end-to-end.
  
  --
  A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
61. Re:What am I missing here... by tibit · 2011-08-29 02:56 · Score: 1
  
  I agree. But man, this 3D minecraft logic looks beautiful. Maybe someone needs to make a 3D language that looks like mineraft and translates into Verilog or VHDL :)
  
  --
  A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
62. Re:What am I missing here... by Cederic · 2011-08-29 02:56 · Score: 1
  
  you can go and try to build amazing and crazy things
  But I'm a software engineer at heart. I write things that do the work for me, I don't do it myself.
  Minecraft clearly works for people that want to make stuff, but lots of people just want the made stuff. That doesn't mean they aren't creative, it doesn't mean they aren't capable, it just means they've optimised out that slow tedious build phase.
63. Re:What am I missing here... by tibit · 2011-08-29 02:57 · Score: 2
  
  So, now you know how it felt to be a scribe in the monastery, copying books all day :)
  
  --
  A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
64. Re:What am I missing here... by tibit · 2011-08-29 03:02 · Score: 1
  
  Probably yes. You'd need to make your own game engine, though, because the original is too slow and AFAIK non-scriptable. You'd end up wasting days waiting for just a few routines to execute.
  
  --
  A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
65. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 03:19 · Score: 0
  
  Yep. Most of these people use external tools. Either inventory editors to give them the materials or 2D or 3D world editors, which allow complex creation much faster than in game. Not that that really diminishes their accomplishment that much, though. Such complex projects would simply not be feasible without one of those tools. The world may be practically infinite, but your time is not (even for these nerds).
66. Re:What am I missing here... by himurabattousai · 2011-08-29 03:28 · Score: 1
  
  I take it that you've seen the (nearly) 1:1 Enterprise-D that someone built. Impressive for the details, as well as the absolutely ridiculous amount of time needed to build such a thing.
  Looks bitchin' in YouTube, though.
  
  --
  "osake no hou ga, biiru yori ii" to omotteiru.
67. Re:What am I missing here... by jd.schmidt · 2011-08-29 03:44 · Score: 1
  
  Using redstone in Minecraft is more like building a circuit board by hand to do some task than like programing a mini app, and not using ICs but only single components. Or maybe it might be like building a device to play tic tac toe out of Legos, which has been done and reported here BTW. Not that it is more l33t than programing, just interesting and different,
68. Re:What am I missing here... by Culture20 · 2011-08-29 03:45 · Score: 1
  
  So an analogy in WoW would not be the ability to play an ingame game, but to make it. Remember the chess game from Karazhan? Suppose WoW plugins could make things like that. Suppose plugins could make battleground like concepts, with new types of combat and siege. Or plugins could add dances to the game. Or new model mounts, engineering tools, etc. Imagine that kind of freedom.
  
  As I was reading this I was thinking "I'd pay for a WoW like that." Then I remember second life and vowed not to pay for a WoW like _that_.
69. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 04:10 · Score: 0
  
  Now you are thinking in portals?
70. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 04:35 · Score: 0
  
  Personally, it looks like a ginormous time-sink to me.
  So is Slashdot, TV and porn.
  I might agree about TV, but /. and porn are much quicker, hit it & quit it affairs.
71. Re:What am I missing here... by Belial6 · 2011-08-29 05:24 · Score: 1
  
  you are trying to recreate 1960s tech with wood sticks.
  Now your getting it.
  
  Really, is building 1960's tech with sticks, any more ridiculous than lighting a fire with sticks? Sure, I could just use a lighter or a match, but it is cool that I can do it with tech no more advanced than a length of rope.
72. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 05:31 · Score: 0
  
  Except that what you make still runs inside 2010's tech.
73. Re:What am I missing here... by justforgetme · 2011-08-29 06:14 · Score: 1
  
  I always thought it was popular practice to loose the trailing e under such syntax.
  Well, who said that the anonymous mass won't teach you a thing or two?
  
  --
  -- no sig today
74. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 06:15 · Score: 0
  
  Of course the two seem similar. Notch the creator has said many times over he wanted to create a dwarf fortress like game but within a 3d world. Hell there is a DF plugin now that lets you import your DB structures ( and maybe even world) into minecraft.
75. Re:What am I missing here... by mldi · 2011-08-29 06:26 · Score: 1
  
  Persson has given credit where credit is due for the inspiration of his creation. He has already said he was heavily inspired by DF (among others). Why can't people create something different? Nobody can be inspired? What good is that?
  
  --
  If you aren't suspicious of your government's actions, you aren't doing your job as a responsible citizen.
76. Re:What am I missing here... by hvm2hvm · 2011-08-29 06:48 · Score: 1
  
  you wrote "loose" instead of "lose" intentionally, right? RIGHT?!
  
  --
  ics
77. Re:What am I missing here... by shadowfaxcrx · 2011-08-29 07:07 · Score: 1
  
  Simplicity has nothing to do with it. Nerds like to see what they can get a machine to do that wasn't necessarily thought of by the machine's designers.
  I remember in high school programming a GUI, Doom, Tetris, and Pong on my TI-85. It would have been a hell of a lot simpler to get a Gameboy. But that would have missed the point.
  Redstone seems to have been mainly thought up in order to run minecart systems. It's a pretty good bet that Notch never thought of making a color printer with it. The fun is in making Redstone do stuff it wasn't necessarily designed to do.
  
  --
  "I disagree with you" does not equal "flamebait."
78. Re:What am I missing here... by somersault · 2011-08-29 08:18 · Score: 1
  
  That's nice, but I was referring to the "complicated" bit, so it has everything to do with "it". Games such as LittleBigPlanet, Minecraft, GarrysMod, etc are fun, but scripting is obviously a simpler way to perform most general calculations.
  With the physics engines already built into these games, then some goals may be simpler to achieve in the game world than when scripting from scratch of course.. I just think it's bizarre to think of scripting as more complicated than painstakingly recreating an arithmetic processing unit inside a virtual world.
  
  --
  which is totally what she said
79. Re:What am I missing here... by Internetuser1248 · 2011-08-29 08:45 · Score: 1
  
  If your computer can handle it, you can have a pretty huge embark area. Bigger than what you get with the player range in MC. Nevertheless I apologise to those who felt my comment was too scathing, they are different games. Still megaprojects were always a major feature of DF, and although the ones in minecraft are more colourful and often more detailed in shape, DF has always been lightyears ahead in terms of moving parts and functional structures. Each to his own of course, I enjoy minecraft too.
80. Re:What am I missing here... by uigrad_2000 · 2011-08-29 09:42 · Score: 1
  
  It would be if poker in WoW was built using stuff you found in the world.
  Instead, mods in World of warcraft are written using lua (a programming language, not a world obect). If raid bosses dropped variables, enclosure blocks, and while-loops, and those were needed for building the mod, then that would be closer to what people are doing in minecraft.
  If you want to compare modding within the two games, then things are a bit closer. Modding in minecraft gives a lot more open (ie there are no fly mods in WoW, but lots of them in minecraft), but this is only because there is no universal server in minecraft. What would be cheating in WoW is just a "different way to play" in minecraft. So, the result of mods in WoW are cosmetic only. You can't ever write a mod using the published API to kill kobolds, and if you do it on your own, then it breaks the TOS.
  Most people would view WoW as the much more immersive game, but the fact that people write mods to play poker while waiting for things to develop makes me wonder if I really understand what it means to be immersive. In Minecraft, people would never bother playing games through the chat system while their characters just stood in one place. If a poker game was made with mods in minecraft, I'm quite sure it would involve actual buttons in the world for "Call", "Raise", etc., and the display of cards to each player would be real world objects, viewable from their vantage point, but not from the other player's vantage points. Returning cards to the discard pile could be done by opening a water valve, letting water wash away the tile-entity cards, and then the valve would close, allowing a dry surface for the next dealt hand. Minecraft may actually be the most immersive game ever.
  
  --
  Free unix account: freeshell.org
81. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 10:20 · Score: 0
  
  Compare how many people find DF accessable VS Minecraft.
  Think about why. THAT is what you are missing,
82. Re:What am I missing here... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 12:15 · Score: 0
  
  That's not quite an OR gate, because the inputs are coupled together. A problem if you want to drive more than one OR gate off of the same output. Still useful, but not even a true logic gate really.
  It's the redstone equivilent of the EE newbs mistake of thinking they can just couple gate outputs together and get a free OR gate, without knowing what that 'high Z' thing in the datasheet is for. Then their chips go popcorn.
  Well, to be fair, Redstone doesn't have different 'voltages'.
  Although someone did recently discover an interesting edge trigger that relies on an odd quirk of Redstone mechanics- Redstone signals only travel 15 blocks, and if two signals meet, if it is first, the weaker prevails. Lets say you have a 'wire' from the East meet one from the South. The East wire has traveled 10 blocks to get there, and has only has 5 blocks left. The South wire has only traveled 3 block, and has 12 left. If you turn on the East wire, it will light up to the intersection, and then continue 5 blocks further (let's say to the North). If you then turn on the South wire, it will light up to the intersection, but will not go North past the end of the 5th block, even though it should go 7 past that. Okay?
  Now, add a Western wire that leads, not directly into the intersection, but up to a single cube of liquid next to the intersection. When that West wire is turned on, it forces the liquid to update itself, and the blocks immediately around it, including the Redstone intersection, when then 'realizes' that the South wire has a 'stronger' signal, and 'allows' it to go the additional 7 blocks.
  Speaking of updating blocks, someone discovered several MC versions ago, that a Redstone signal could be used to change the way water flows. Water, when placed on a flat surface, will flow toward a nearby hole. If you then carefully dig another hole right next to the water, it will not change how it flows until a nearby block is updated (by say, Redstone turning on/off). Then it will flow into the nearby hole as well. To reset, simply fill in the nearby hole, then carefully dig it out again. Using the recently introduced pistons, this can be done automatically. This allows detection of, among other things: furnace use, blocks being placed/removed, Redstone ore blocks being hit or walked on, etc. Whoever thought...
  Oh, and if you throw a repeater on each input of an OR, they'll be isolated from each other.
83. Re:What am I missing here... by dvdwholesale3 · 2011-08-29 13:30 · Score: -1
  
  P90x is an extremely intense program.Sheer will and determination may get you to the finish line,but to achieve the best results,youâ(TM)ve got to have the proper quality and quantity of nutrition.We make these supplements optional,so you have a choice.But know that P90x supplements were designed for this program and will supply your body with the necessary nutrients to give you added strength energy,and stamina for each workout. As you may notice from the math on the following pages,P90x is not bulit around adaily âoecalorie deficitâ for weight loss like the general Beachbody plans found in Power 90,Kathy Smitsâ(TM)s Project :You!Type 2,and Slimin 6.Itâ(TM)s important that you understand why ,so you have the right training mentality with this program ,with the right expectations. http://dvds-free.com/
84. Re:What am I missing here... by geminidomino · 2011-08-29 13:48 · Score: 1
  
  2 Liberal arts graduates didn't get the joke
85. Re:What am I missing here... by smash · 2011-08-29 16:08 · Score: 1
  
  Well i guess if you like playing ASCII based terminal games, Dwarf Fortress is superior. Minecraft's graphics are retro enough for me thanks.
  
  --
  I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
86. Re:What am I missing here... by kirkb · 2011-08-31 05:20 · Score: 1
  
  Oooh, "I played (shabby obscure thing) before (mainstream derivative) was popular."
  Go away, hipster gaming troll.
  
  --
  Slashdot: come for the pedantry, stay for the condescension.
87. Re:What am I missing here... by dvdwholesale3 · 2011-08-31 13:26 · Score: -1
  
  P90x is an extremely intense program.Sheer will and determination may get you to the finish line,but to achieve the best results,youâ(TM)ve got to have the proper quality and quantity of nutrition.We make these supplements optional,so you have a choice.But know that P90x supplements were designed for this program and will supply your body with the necessary nutrients to give you added strength energy,and stamina for each workout. As you may notice from the math on the following pages,P90x is not bulit around adaily âoecalorie deficitâ for weight loss like the general Beachbody plans found in Power 90,Kathy Smitsâ(TM)s Project :You!Type 2,and Slimin 6.Itâ(TM)s important that you understand why ,so you have the right training mentality with this program ,with the right expectations. http://educationchildrendvds.com/
Two words... by DurendalMac · 2011-08-28 18:33 · Score: -1, Troll

Asperger's Syndrome.
1. Re:Two words... by neonsignal · 2011-08-28 19:33 · Score: 1
  
  I'll take that as a compliment :-)
2. Re:Two words... by spongman · 2011-08-28 20:04 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  what a sorry place we've come to as a species if every time someone has the drive, passion and concentration required to do something extraordinary like this they're labeled as having some kind of disorder.
  Michelangelo? Asperger's definitely, right?
  At least this guy's not some spaz that can't sit still for more than 10 seconds...
3. Re:Two words... by Redlazer · 2011-08-28 20:28 · Score: 0, Redundant
  
  They very well may have Asperger's, the problem is in assuming that someone with Asperger's has a "disorder", and is not merely "different". Indeed, they are simply better at, guess what, envisioning a specific project and exhaustively accomplishing that goal.
  
  --
  Guns don't kill people, "with glowing hearts" kills people.
4. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 20:43 · Score: -1
  
  what a sorry place we've come to as a species if every time someone has the drive, passion and concentration required to do something extraordinary like this they're labeled as having some kind of disorder.
  Michelangelo? Asperger's definitely, right?
  At least this guy's not some spaz that can't sit still for more than 10 seconds...
  I don't know if I agree with you. While saying someone has aspergers is technically labeling them as having a disorder, the implications of said labeling will depend on the views we hold.
  The drive, passion and concentration required, of which you speak, often comes bundled with difficulties coping with people. I think having a diagnosis may be helpful, providing an answer to a nagging feeling about not quite cutting it socially. And being allowed to be labelled an aspie can lead to getting state funded help coping (ymmw).
  Even a snivel of Aspergers can be quite a pain, figuratively speaking, but in some ways it can be somewhat of a blessing as well as a curse, IMO.
  I, for one, am grateful for all the meticulous work all these great aspies put in to give us Wikipedia, for instance.
  "Normal" people, on the other hand - people with an IQ of around 100, that bond together chatting about their hair and workout and about the funny commercials they saw last night - what a bunch of idiots!
  Nah, they're all right. They got some social skills. Sometimes I wish I was more like them. Other times I think I'm not so interested in shampoos and whatever it is that interests them.
5. Re:Two words... by Psychotria · 2011-08-28 20:48 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  My thoughts exactly. When did a place who's slogan is "News for Nerds" become such the antithesis of that? Once upon a time (I've read for much longer than my UID indicates) we'd discuss things because they were interesting. We'd discuss just about anything that inspired the imagination. Now the big stories are world events, and the really interesting things (peoples doing things just because they're interesting and trying out new ideas) are shoved aside, or they get comments like "Two words... Asperger's Syndrome."
6. Re:Two words... by Hazel+Bergeron · 2011-08-28 20:52 · Score: 0
  
  Asperger's (mild autism) is a disorder. I can "envision a specific project and exhaustively accomplish that goal" yet I do not have Asperger's.
  It's like saying that someone agoraphobic is "merely different" because, by not finding it easy to leave the house, they are less likely to become distracted so are better able to "exhaustively accomplish" some mind project. While the confines of a disability might make it more likely for the disabled person not to become sidetracked, it is foolish to describe it as something neutral. Moreover it is harmful to the developing child on the autism spectrum - he has a real chance in his early years of being helped to overcome the disorder, but Internet autism heroes (suspiciously often self-diagnosed) want to deny that the problem even exists, reducing public understanding.
  And when the public lack understanding for something, funding and research always dries up.
7. Re:Two words... by Psychotria · 2011-08-28 20:59 · Score: 1
  
  While interesting, your reply does not address the "assumed" aspect.
8. Re:Two words... by cheekyjohnson · 2011-08-28 21:13 · Score: 1
  
  That all depends on what you see as harmful. Some people merely like doing different things than other people. So while you may see it as "harmful" and think they need "help," other people simply don't care.
  
  --
  Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
9. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 21:41 · Score: 0
  
  Hazel addresses the "assumed" aspect by implying that those people who claim their own Aspergers' is not a disorder but a benefit don't really have Asperger's at all. In the same way that it's possible just to have unusual focus without having a disorder, it's possible to be socially uncomfortable or awkward without having Asperger's, and Asperger's is one of the most common self-diagnoses out there. It's something people almost want to have.
10. Re:Two words... by Ihmhi · 2011-08-28 21:57 · Score: 1
  
  Being normal is boring anyway. The loonies are the interesting ones to hang around.
  
  --
  Random Thoughts From A Diseased Mind (Not For Dummies)
11. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 22:36 · Score: 0
  
  That isn't the only part of Aspergers and you know it. Aspergers sufferers also have a hard time coping with others and generally interacting with people.
  Just because you can sit and create something huge and complex doesn't mean you feel irritated being around people.
  And even if you do, doesn't mean you are an aspie either, you could generally just hate, I dunno, meetings, or hate your fellow peers because you want to get that grant, or whatever other reasons.
  Some people just genuinely hate large rooms of people. Still doesn't make them an aspie. They can interact with people fine.
  Mind you, some people hold introversion as a disorder as well. Who made up these rules exactly?
  It's not like introversion can lead to a species dying out. If it did, there'd be no introverts left.
12. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 23:08 · Score: 0
  
  I really hate how everytime somebody does something impressive someone shouts Asperger or autism at them.
  And Minecraft only has two types of circuits: wire and NAND gate. If you need Asperger's to figure these out it means that every computer scientist has Asperger's, too.
13. Re:Two words... by p0p0 · 2011-08-29 00:40 · Score: 1
  
  This is usually above a little "drive, passion and concentration". These people are designing 3D Printers and CPU's inside a GAME using basic logic built in, that wasn't really planned for anything else than closing and opening doors.
  
  You go build a 16-bit CPU, and see how you feel when everyone says "nothing special, move along". You WILL feel pride for your project, and you will be saddened when no one shares that pride.
  And when those first videos popped up, the CPU being one of the earliest, there was no guide or any documentation n how to do it. They used regular information from the real world, and translated that to the game's built in logic.
  So stop bing such a tool and appreciate what these people have done with their minds.
14. Re:Two words... by ToasterMonkey · 2011-08-29 00:55 · Score: 1
  
  what a sorry place we've come to as a species if every time someone has the drive, passion and concentration required to do something extraordinary like this they're labeled as having some kind of disorder.
  Michelangelo? Asperger's definitely, right?
  I reproduced the Mona Lisa on my graphing calculator, and also have a mental condition that causes nerd-like behavior. Where's MY fanfare?
  Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and all that. This is a slashvertisement, so lower that pedestal a notch or two.
  
  as a species
  Hang on, I'm wiping the tears from my eyes.
15. Re:Two words... by SuricouRaven · 2011-08-29 01:03 · Score: 1
  
  NOR. Not NAND.
16. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 01:11 · Score: 0
  
  Ok. Here aspie goes wondering how was their above comment off-topic for this thread of discussion. Maybe aspie was not clear. Stupid ADD. Now I would like to point out that "labeling" and "disorder" (pejorative-sounding as they appear to me in the context of the comment in question) may have not been what the commenter with the two words had in mind. Maybe they meant them in a loving way? That's how this one will choose to take it, anyways.
17. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 01:23 · Score: 0
  
  If people succeed and are happy with their situation, then maybe they won't be asking for help. At that point the question whether they fulfill whatever criteria or not is not that important.
  Some need help. They should get some.
18. Re:Two words... by cheekyjohnson · 2011-08-29 01:37 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, I agree. If people aren't happy and do want to change, I think they should be able to get help.
  
  --
  Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
19. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 01:49 · Score: 0
  
  Good points.
  However: Should a patient not be entitled to feel some fondness of (for example) the nerdy aspects of the disorder?
  I like taking things literally and diving into details about every hint of an ambiguity even in everyday conversation and even if I understand what the person talking to me intends to say with the words they use. Should I or should I not like some parts of the disorder, in your opinion?
  (I'm not very much diagnose-patriotic, though, and haven't joined a club or anyting. Or gotten down with the lingo (like using "neuro-typical" for non-aspies, I think)).
20. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 02:33 · Score: 0
  
  Depends on which state you define as true and which as fault. Personally, I use different interpretations in different parts in my machines, so I can use them as either NOR or NAND and even OR and AND if necessary. Makes everything a lot faster since you don't have to add inverters everywhere.
21. Re:Two words... by Hazel+Bergeron · 2011-08-29 04:51 · Score: 1
  
  Should a patient not be entitled to feel some fondness of (for example) the nerdy aspects of the disorder?
  I like taking things literally and diving into details about every hint of an ambiguity even in everyday conversation
  Should someone with OCD be entitled to feel better when they have checked X enough times? Or should they feel bad that they've had to check X so many times before they feel satisfied? Or something else?
  Should an alcoholic be entitled to feel good that he can drown his problems in drink?
  etc.
  Decoration and ambiguity are normal in natural language. Handling it (and interpreting it correctly) is completely routine for the "neuro-typical"; studying it is an appropriate part of linguistics. If you occasionally have trouble with and/or have a casual interest in the features of human communication then you're as any other intelligent human. Whether this stems from mild autism or not really doesn't matter.
  But if you find it difficult to handle or you obsess over studying it to the extent that it affects your ability to function then you may want to find out how to overcome this. And you may want to accept the input of others in the question of whether it is affecting your ability to function: neither the autistic nor the alcoholic may be able to acknowledge how his condition affects him.
22. Re:Two words... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 08:25 · Score: 0
  
  Thanks.
  I think I'm gleaning a stance of "there is nothing to celebrate in Aspergers in and of itself". I think you're probably right. From my appreciation of logic and big questions doesn't follow that Aspergers is the shit. I'll still go on liking nerdiness and appreciating people who care to join me waxing philosophical.
23. Re:Two words... by spongman · 2011-08-29 17:15 · Score: 1
  
  err... I think you missed the point a little. Well, quite a bit, actually.
24. Re:Two words... by spongman · 2011-08-29 17:19 · Score: 1
  
  wait, was all that supposed to make some kind of sense?
HIK-UP !! by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:43 · Score: 0

I've been walkin' these streets so long
Singin' the same old song drunker-ina-skunk
I know every crack whore in these dirty sidewalks of Broadway
Where hustle's the name of the game
And nice guys get washed away like the snow and the rain
There's been a load of compromisin'
On the road to my horizon
But I'm gonna be where the lights are shinin' on me
Like a rhinestone cowboy
Riding out on a horse in a star-spangled rodeo
Like a rhinestone cowboy
Getting cards and letters from people I don't even know
And offers comin' over the phone
Well, I really don't mind the rain
And a smile can hide all the pain
But you're down when you're ridin' the train that's takin' the long way
And I dream of the things I'll do
With a subway token and a dollar tucked inside my shoe
There'll be a load of compromisin'
On the road to my horizon
But I'm gonna be where the lights are shinin' on me
Like a rhinestone cowboy
Riding out on a horse in a star-spangled rodeo
Rhinestone cowboy
Gettin' cards and letters from people I don't even know
And offers comin' over the phone
Like a rhinestone cowboy
Riding out on a horse in a star-spangled rodeo
Rhinestone cowboy
Gettin' cards and letters from people I don't even know
Python Fiddle by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 18:49 · Score: 0

Call us when it runs Python Fiddle.
Little big planet by Billly+Gates · 2011-08-28 18:59 · Score: 1

This looks kind of like Little Big Planet for the PS3

--
http://saveie6.com/
Pretty cool logic by bradley13 · 2011-08-28 19:10 · Score: 1

My son got bit by the electronics bug over the summer. He then proceeded to implement logic gates in Minecraft, and used them to build binary adders and other circuits. Is that nerdy enough for /. or what?
More to the point, I am pretty impressed with Minecraft - that one can use it to create such things.

--
Enjoy life! This is not a dress rehearsal.
1. Re:Pretty cool logic by Spacejock · 2011-08-28 21:15 · Score: 2
  
  My 13 yo daughter has been running her own minecraft server for quite a while now. She's registered a domain name and runs her own forum & website for the group she plays with. She's also coding the web pages by hand, using a text editor. (Computer programming is her fave topic at school.) Keep 'em off the streets, that's what I say.
  
  --
  Hal Spacejock: Science Fiction with Nuts
2. Re:Pretty cool logic by mentil · 2011-08-28 21:25 · Score: 0
  
  My FBI Agent has been running her own honeypot for quite a while now. Keep 'em off the streets, that's what I say.
  FTFY :)
  
  --
  Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
3. Re:Pretty cool logic by djdanlib · 2011-08-29 02:21 · Score: 2
  
  Keeps 'em off the streets, for sure.
  But it also keeps 'em off the playground, and out of the woods, fields, and streams. Heck, kids are only visiting friends to sit in front of THEIR screens nowadays.
  Don't forget to send 'em outside to play once in a while. Even the most computer-addicted of us needs some fresh air and sunlight to be healthy :)
4. Re:Pretty cool logic by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 02:47 · Score: 1
  
  Hell yeah, my parents kept me "safe" at home all the time, and while I did grew up without incidents, I never got the hang of people. Took me ages to realise that.
  Socializing is very important, you must make that clear to your kids. Of course it's also important they do what they like and develop their own skill set, but if you have the time, take them to the local playground once in a while, they will appreciate it on the long run.
5. Re:Pretty cool logic by perryizgr8 · 2011-08-30 04:12 · Score: 1
  
  it would be a much better use of your son's time if he used software like logisim or something. minecraft will impose limits due to the vast amount of time it needs you to put in to make simple ccircuits.
  
  --
  Wealth is the gift that keeps on giving.
Give me a break by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 19:14 · Score: 1, Insightful

I mean who would want to know stuff like Mozilla's Community Lead Tyler Downer leaving due to crap QA processes or perhaps the fact Nokia's Developer Network was hacked revealing the personal details of thousands of developers when we can learn about the bloody wonders of Redstone in Minecraft, land of the unoptimised shitty coding and memory management. Stop putting up this crap or at least post (Since this is games.slashdot.org) some of the PAX 2011 stuff rather then another Minecraft article.
1. Re:Give me a break by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 22:11 · Score: -1
  
  Just FYI, we can post multiple stories on this site. You can scroll past ones you don't care to read about. I can't help but notice you've gone out of your way to come on here and Troll about it.
  Did YOU submit either of the stories you linked to, or are you just on here pissing and moaning about not seeing them?
Minecraft patents by dokc · 2011-08-28 19:37 · Score: 1

The next step will be patenting everything in Minecraft by using existing patents and adding "in the Minecraft" at the end.

--
In love, war and slashdot discussions, everything is allowed.
1. Re:Minecraft patents by mldi · 2011-08-29 06:34 · Score: 1
  
  The next step will be patenting everything in Minecraft by using existing patents and adding "in the Minecraft" at the end.
  Kinda like adding "mobile" in front of other existing patents!
  
  --
  If you aren't suspicious of your government's actions, you aren't doing your job as a responsible citizen.
Perhaps you're on to something.. by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 19:40 · Score: -1

I think Slashdot's crowdsourcing-based article submission system either is starting to fail or never worked well in the first place.
If the /. community wants to eat shit, let them eat shit.
a standout post by codeAlDente · 2011-08-28 19:45 · Score: 1

sir timothy, thy headline stands out as a true beacon of nerdy-ness in a sea of news for nerds. gaze on proudly at thy screen, o noble warrior, and ponder whither thine own universe or ye olde nefarious existence might stand tall as the universe's slowest possible Turing machine.

--
He once inserted random mutations into his code, just so he could have the experience of debugging.
1. Re:a standout post by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 22:36 · Score: 0
  
  "Slowest possible Turing machine" sounds like a challenge! Time to get out the water-flow logic gates...
Blackjack in Leisure Suit Larry 1 by justleavealonemmmkay · 2011-08-28 19:52 · Score: 1

n/t
Worst title ever. by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 20:04 · Score: -1

I mean seriously do you actually listen to that crap? Good god man.
PUT D LIME IN D COCONUT AND SHAKE IT ALL UP !! by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 20:12 · Score: 0

I say, DOKTOR !! I say, DOKTOR !!
How come I got this in me skull and can get rids of it ??
Badminton Racquet by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 21:01 · Score: -1

This predecessor to the modern game of squash,Badminton Racquet is played with 30? inch (775 mm) wooden racquets. While squash equipment has evolved in the intervening century, tennis racquets have changed little.
Great Potential by arisvega · 2011-08-28 21:02 · Score: 2

The least that it is, it is a natural evolution of IRC; one can interact with other people's avatars, but the digital environment is much more appealing.
Already in the game there is a stereoscopic mode; one can choose to set the display in red-blue 3D, and that is only one of the aspects that make this game so immersive.
Imagine when VR displays and even more immersive technology are commonplace, wouldn't you just appreciate it that such a piece of software exists, one that allows you to create your own virtual interactive on-line environment, and it is ridiculously cheap because its indy developer absolutely loves what he is doing? They (he and his team) went viral just from word of mouth, and made enough money to "exit gracefully" to some undisclosed island- yet they chose to hire more people and develop like crazy. And he was not put down by PayPal withholding his income, embarrassing him to his clients.
Not only that, but Persson (the creator of Minecraft) has stated that "Once sales start dying and a minimum time has passed, I will release the game source code as some kind of open source."
C'mon, what more do you want.

--
The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
1. Re:Great Potential by FTWinston · 2011-08-28 21:50 · Score: 0
  
  The least that it is, it is a natural evolution of IRC
  So it's IRC, but with worse chat, and added Creepers? Actually, there's probably a lot of things in life that can be made better simply by making them worse, and adding creepers.
  
  C'mon, what more do you want.
  Optimised netcode!
2. Re:Great Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 22:49 · Score: 0
  
  Ssssssssssssssssex.
  Did the earth move for you darling?
3. Re:Great Potential by znerk · 2011-08-28 23:05 · Score: 1
  
  The least that it is, it is a natural evolution of IRC; one can interact with other people's avatars, but the digital environment is much more appealing.
  So, you're saying that we are experiencing the beginning of "the matrix", or whatever name you'd like to apply to "cyberspace", as described in books such as Neuromancer and Snow Crash, or game systems such as Shadowrun or Cyberpunk?
  
  --
  This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported License.
4. Re:Great Potential by SuricouRaven · 2011-08-29 01:05 · Score: 1
  
  Didn't really work out. Second Life made an effort, but it just showed that for most online purposes you don't want to be aware of everyone else. It's really only good for chatting, gaming and flying penises.
5. Re:Great Potential by arisvega · 2011-08-29 02:04 · Score: 1
  
  So, you're saying that we are experiencing the beginning of "the matrix", or whatever ..
  
  With google around, half a billion individuals in facebook and 3 billion people undernourished? That thought crossed my mind, yes.
  What, not dystopian enough for you? You want victorian white zeppelins with brass knobs and levers floating about, is that it?
  
  --
  The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
6. Re:Great Potential by arisvega · 2011-08-29 02:13 · Score: 1
  
  Optimised netcode!
  Fair point. Or at least a shell.
  
  --
  The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
7. Re:Great Potential by Mindcontrolled · 2011-08-29 06:04 · Score: 1
  
  What, not dystopian enough for you? You want victorian white zeppelins with brass knobs and levers floating about, is that it?
  Actually, it is too dystopian without white zeppelins with brass knobs and levers for me.
  
  --
  Ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
man wtf by Spy+Handler · 2011-08-28 21:03 · Score: -1, Troll

I got all excited seeing the title, thinking this was going to be something about space exploration and Redstone rockets or something of this nature. Turns out, it's about a freakin cellphone game.... what a gyp
1. Re:man wtf by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-28 22:44 · Score: 1
  
  Turns out, it's about a freakin cellphone game.
  It is not available on any phones, nor has it ever been.
  
  thinking this was going to be something about space exploration
  Are you really fucking serious? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhinestone_Cowboy
  
  "The song is about a cowboy who has no interest in leaving the big city. He is an aspiring Broadway performer who dreams of fame and success while walking down the dirty streets of New York City."
  
  Yeah, that really says "space travel". (rolls eyes)
  And that post currently stands at +2. No wonder I rarely stop by here any more.
2. Re:man wtf by znerk · 2011-08-28 23:11 · Score: 1
  
  I got all excited seeing the title, thinking this was going to be something about space exploration and Redstone rockets or something of this nature. Turns out, it's about a freakin cellphone game.... what a gyp
  Actually, it's a PC game. There isn't a cellphone client, yet.
  Maybe a little research before making an idiot of yourself would be worthwhile.
  Heck, maybe you should play the game and see what the fuss is about. It's free to play classic, and I'll bet you your lunch money that you can waste an entire lunch break just playing around with it.
  To see some of the incredible things some people have done, just hit youtube and search for minecraft. There's everything from single-digit calculators to full 8-bit computer implementations.
  You are too easily dismissive of things that do not fit your mold.
  Disclaimer: I don't play MineCraft, mostly because paying 20 euros for a beta does not fit my budgeting needs.
  
  --
  This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported License.
3. Re:man wtf by drinkypoo · 2011-08-28 23:51 · Score: 1
  
  Disclaimer: I don't play MineCraft, mostly because paying 20 euros for a beta does not fit my budgeting needs.
  besides, it's attack of the clones, copies of MC are coming along gradually... paying is for early adopters, I'll play my old games for now :)
  
  --
  "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
4. Re:man wtf by Troed · 2011-08-29 00:31 · Score: 1
  
  It is not available on any phones, nor has it ever been.
  My Sony Ericsson PLAY runs the official Minecraft for Android absolutely perfectly, thankyou.
  https://market.android.com/details?id=com.mojang.minecraftpe
  
  --
  it's in my head
5. Re:man wtf by Troed · 2011-08-29 00:32 · Score: 1
  
  Actually, it's a PC game. There isn't a cellphone client, yet.
  Maybe a little research before making an idiot of yourself would be worthwhile.
  https://market.android.com/details?id=com.mojang.minecraftpe
  
  --
  it's in my head
6. Re:man wtf by znerk · 2011-08-29 13:14 · Score: 1
  
  Interesting. I would have sworn it wasn't in the list when I searched for "minecraft" on the market a week or so ago. Might have been two weeks ago, though, which would explain why I didn't see it (It was released August 16th).
  
  --
  This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported License.
I want to see RNA Translation in redstone by mentil · 2011-08-28 21:28 · Score: 3, Interesting

The animations I've seen make translation look neat, I bet it'd look neater with 3d blocks in a video game. Somehow.

--
Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
1. Re:I want to see RNA Translation in redstone by SuricouRaven · 2011-08-29 01:12 · Score: 1
  
  Hmm.... Not quite doable yet, but if there was just some way to sense the presence or absence of a block (without relying on water removing torches, which is one-shot) then I can see how you could at least make an RNA-like replicator. Insert 'strand', get copy.
2. Re:I want to see RNA Translation in redstone by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 12:44 · Score: 0
  
  if there was just some way to sense the presence or absence of a block (without relying on water removing torches, which is one-shot)
  1) use glass blocks as spacers. Using pistons, run blocks past a repeater. Solid blocks transmit redstone current, glass blocks don't.
  2) Google 'BUD switch'
Not to long... by Deus.1.01 · 2011-08-28 21:34 · Score: 1

Until players game battle it out in their own self designed battle cruisers....modders willing offcourse, we got Build Craft, Industrial Craft and the Zeppeling mod...just fine tune it and add some newton diagrams into the zeppelin mod and we're good to go.

--
My -1 Troll is actually a +1 funny. And my -1 flame is actually a +1 insightfull.
The real end to calvin and hobbes by SmallFurryCreature · 2011-08-28 22:15 · Score: 0

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/recovery-follies/47734-how-calvin-hobbes-really-ended.html
Agree 100% with you.

--

MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Obligatory xkcd by Chris+Mattern · 2011-08-29 00:08 · Score: 1

http://xkcd.com/505/
shameless plug by Speare · 2011-08-29 00:08 · Score: 1

I've gotten sucked into the Minecraft vortex, and amongst my several major sculptures I've also gotten fairly handy with redstone wiring.
I produced a 50 meter bust of Hatsune Miku (modeled in Blender), and inside the head, a friend of mine collaborated and we made a fully operational "Dance Dance Revolution" game complete with 3 row scrolling step display, a reward/prize dispenser for good "dance" moves, and a programmable music system. Every block and circuit was harvested, traded, and placed legit... no World Edit used at all.
http://www.planetminecraft.com/project/digital-diva-hatsune-miku-exterior/
On server.serenitymc.net, guests can log in and issue a "/warp diva" command to check it out, even without signing up for builders rights. Check it out.

--
[ .sig file not found ]
Processor speed by Anonymous Coward · 2011-08-29 01:24 · Score: 0

Is it measured in MEGA Bloks/second?
Re:Obligatory PA by rwa2 · 2011-08-29 02:07 · Score: 1

But just the moment before that, it's totally like this:
http://penny-arcade.com/comic/2010/09/17
I'll have a peppermint one by ginbot462 · 2011-08-29 02:18 · Score: 1

You'll never top the universe ... until the end when get to pop out our own bubble universes. Mine's going to have blackjack and hookers. Course the Me in Mine is an amalgamation of entities spread out over space-time. You know, on second thought .. forget the blackjack.

--
Atlas Shrugged : Thematic Story :: Battlefield Earth : Organized Religion
Cheating : Minecraft :: Art :: RealLife by ginbot462 · 2011-08-29 02:52 · Score: 1

It would be disingenuous to not mention world editors when talking about "cheating" in minecraft. Not to say I even agree with that label (and it usually comes from ones that haven't created huge in game constructions), however there is editor haters and in-world builders are keen to emphasize the methodology used (often recording it). Again, I think art can be judged on the product (e.g. "classical" ) AND/OR the process (e.g. sand mandalas). Creating something in a computer modeler/editor takes some skill and good eye for symmetry, lines, and details as well. Does it take as long? Of course not; the process/product is just a different school of art. Adversity can produce great art, but it is not the only progenitor.
Google "minecraft ghibli world" and read some of the comments by the "haters". I don't even know (or care) if it is editor or in-game created, and maybe it was just one or two comments. I should know better than to read youtube comments.
For something almost purely process, see "minecraft far lands or bust". I would argue that this too is art.

--
Atlas Shrugged : Thematic Story :: Battlefield Earth : Organized Religion
1. Re:Cheating : Minecraft :: Art :: RealLife by dissy · 2011-08-29 04:46 · Score: 1
  
  Yea I would have to agree that using a world editor program and then claiming otherwise is pure cheating as well as lying.
  Fortunately it's usually pretty easy to tell, and quite a lot of interesting worlds were created with an editor (The 16 bit CPU for example, he used a world editor to get a huge stretch of empty land blocks to work on, but then supposedly made the rest in game)
  Some really interesting things have been done in that area though which I wouldn't consider cheating exactly either.
  If you don't know of it, check out the Minecraft Song Planner software.
  You give it music in a way an artist would, and it exports a world schematic to be imported with a world editor. Creates the needed blocks in modules to play a song. One kick ass hack if you ask me!
  But yes as your point is the 'cheater haters', or purists as I call them, some people will complain no matter what.
  It should be obvious to everyone that creating something in the normal survival mode of Minecraft takes WAY more time and skill than doing it in creative mode, which again takes more skill* than doing the same thing in a world editor.
  Most of the complaints seem to be from kids who think their way of doing it is being likened to doing it in the world editor, when I don't believe that is the case.
  Of course there will always be the type to claim credit when it is not due, including claiming they did things in-game when it wasn't. These people are usually cheaters in everything they do in life however.
  * At least with my experience with a world editor app, fighting the absolutely horrid UI was a game in and of itself, and I never used it for anything but making large swaths of empty flat land to work with.
  Personally anything outside of that usage seems to me to be easier to do in-game!
2. Re:Cheating : Minecraft :: Art :: RealLife by ginbot462 · 2011-08-29 05:19 · Score: 1
  
  >> Fortunately it's usually pretty easy to tell
  Glad to know. Reminds me of people doing time runs in games (course this makes more sense as emulators can mess up timing); the pieces should be viewed the lens of the process (e.g. Anne Frank's diary is inseparable from it). Hell, art forgeries can gain their own fame if good enough:
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elmyr_de_Hory
  "I thought Raul Julia was Puerto Rican. I didn't know he was ... Cuban!" - mst3k, Overdrawn at the Memory Bank
  
  --
  Atlas Shrugged : Thematic Story :: Battlefield Earth : Organized Religion
Interesting but... by SDrag0n · 2011-08-29 03:15 · Score: 1

I think it's great that people have been this creative with Minecraft, and I think it's cool that Minecraft is capable of doing it. On the other hand I question the usefulness of doing bigger and bigger things like this. Of course, this is coming from an adult with a job and a half who is also married and taking classes so I might be a little more judicious with my time.

--
I don't have time to make a sig
ok, its a circuit simulator... yay. by pjr.cc · 2011-08-29 08:41 · Score: 1

while i love minecraft, i personally think the whole "lets use the worlds slowest and most combersome circuit simulator to simulate a really complex circuit" to be an utterly pointless endeavor. Or at least, not news worthy. To me these things always read as "nerd uses circuit simulator to simulate a circuit", and wow thats a slow news day.
I doubt very much people are actually mining to get the minerals to build something like this (what i mean is using inventory editors and the like, and if they are mining it, they're crazy) and the second it became possible to do generic circuits in minecraft, anything really became possible. So its really not about "wow, look what this does" as much as "look how much time i can waste" to me. Realistically there is nothing to stop you simulating just about any circuit at all in minecraft (physical machine limitations not withstanding).
So when did it all become newsworthy? Yes its interesting seeing people translate real circuits to redstone, but thats all it is. Its like when google go came out, its a new programming language so do we get excited everytime someone does something with it? if i coded a database server in google go, would it be worthy of a slashdot post? I think not, not unless my database did something no other database does. To me, thats what this is, its a new language for doing circuit design, but not a particularly good one even if it is quite capable.
I can understand people wanting to do it, but is it really news worthy? at least, thats how it is for me. I've wasted alot of time in the game but its still just a game with a set of capabilities that arent really all that ground-breaking.
Dont get me wrong, i dont have a problem with people wasting their time doing all this, but it still all boils down to "nerd uses circuit simulator to simulate a circuit" and hence isnt exactly mind-blowingly impressive stuff to me.... or am i just becoming jaded? it reminds me of a big-bang episode where they installed a internet-connected home automation system and got all excited about people around the world switching on and off a light. Yeah, i'd get excited too (10 years ago maybe), but its not news.
Now if amd came out tomorrow and said "we're doing all our circuit design in minecraft because of x" then that to me would be interesting cause it would mean minecraft had some functionality of a circuit design tool that was actually noteworthy.