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Microsoft To Bring Cable TV To 360
iONiUM writes with a CNET article outlining the next step in Microsoft's plans for cable television, which he says "seems like yet another step forward in killing traditional cable companies." From the article: "[Microsoft] announced this morning that nearly 40 television content providers — including Comcast, Verizon, and HBO in the United States — will roll out programming over Xbox Live. The company also has deals lined up with providers in the U.K., Spain, Canada, Mexico, Germany, and Italy."
and you may have to pay a outlet fee as well?
xbox, as a platform, is really kicking some ass. who would have throught that the xbox would be microsofts road to integrating entertainment and computing, as they've wanted to for 15 years
Cable companies probably won't take this lying down! Are we all going to see internet costs going up if their main profit center no longer is without competition?
Cable TV? Is that thing still around?
seems like yet another step forward in killing traditional cable companies
Yet these same cable companies are the ones most likely providing you internet access. It's evolution, nothing more.
I call it 'The Aristocrats'
Oh, boy, this is comedy gold:
If Microsoft made TV...
When you change channels, you will occasionally get an hourglass for a few seconds, for no apparent reason.
Every time there's a change to the channel line-up, you'll have to download a 300 MB update, wait ten minutes for it to install, and then restart your TV.
Instead of the NTSC color bars, during "technical difficulties" they will show a blue screen with white text.
Every year they'll change what all the buttons on the remote do. Next year volume up/down will be mapped to numbers 2 and 7.
"Hi there! It looks like you're trying to find something good to watch. Would you like me to suggest something?"
dragonhawk@iname.microsoft.com
I do not like Microsoft. Remove them from my email address.
I can completely give comcast the shaft? best news ive heard all day.
Call me cynical, but if MSFT is partnering with Comcast (and Verizon) to do this, then I don't think there's going to be a chance that this de-thrones cable. It'll be the same crappy deal, but this time you get it through your XBOX instead of a set-top.
This is nothing new - they're already doing this on iOS and on the web. You'll still need to subscribe to cable in order to utilize the programming on the XBOX, much like you must pay Netflix to watch their movies on the Xbox. All they're doing is replacing the Set Top Box / DVR with the Xbox, and for that I'd applaud them - one less energy sucking device on the table is always good, but they won't be cutting out the cable companies in this, just shifting the medium.
Let me count:
1) by subscribing to fiber/cable giant (internet)
2) by subscribing to Xbox Live Gold (streaming ability)
3) by paying overage charges for busting limits watching a cable show via XBL served over cable network
4) by paying Netflix/Hulu to stream the show ala video-on-demand
5) by paying Netflix/Blockbuster to send me a DVD of the show
6) by downloading the show via torrent, then paying a lawyer's extortion fee
7) by ignoring the lawyer's extortion letter and going to court
8) by appealing the jury's ruling
9) by appealing the appellate court's ruling
I'm stopping at nine. I could keep going. It just seems cheaper in the long run to download everything from a CDN like RS, MU, FS, NL, UT, WU, etc. No subscription fees other than internet, and no torrent uploading to lawyer spies to get your IP address on a list of people who are distributing their God-forsaken content...
meh
My home is set up with a Ceton Cablecard hookup and Windows Media Center.
It is the best DVR I've ever had the pleasure of using, and the UI and usability far surpasses everything out there. What they will do with the XBox integration is beyond me, but I've saved over $400 a year by swapping to media center (2 boxes = $40 a month).
Granted not everything Microsoft does is great, but Media Center is one of their best products that nobody knows about. That said, I think if it's in the same vein, that their TV service will do well.
The price is always right if someone else is paying.
I expect to be more expensive. For example basic cable is like $40 for 30 channels but may not have some channels you want. Well you can get another 50 channels and digital for $60 more. Want specific channels in addition to your package? $5 each using the Xbox. Comcast and Verizon will be making lots of money.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
You still have to have a cable subscription to access the content for most of this content. If anything, it's a step forward in killing the standalone set-top box. This hurts set-top box manufacturers, AppleTV, GoogleTV, and Boxee.
360 what?
It is almost certain that any third party TV over IP will contribute to your download cap.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Oh, BOOHOO!
And don't forget that, even when you're paying all that, you still need to watch ads.
That's what I hate the most. Last monday was "Terra Nova" premiere on FOX (Latin America), they had a FUCKING COUNTDOWN TIMER 2 days before, on the top left of the screen, during EVERY SHOW!
What the hell?
+1
Media Center is the best product Microsoft never marketed.
[Microsoft] also has deals lined up with providers in the U.K., ...
That's hardly surprising, given that most TV content in the UK is already available on competing platforms, and has been for a while. This is just MS playing catch-up with what Sony's PS3 has done for a while now; the surprising thing is how long they took to do it.
"Little does he know, but there is no 'I' in 'Idiot'!"
There is no doubt that cable TV are losing market place.
Devices like the Roku- and a subscription to Netflix/Hulu and you can get almost anything you want- and for lower price. That said- most of the major channels (with a decent budget to make original content) are channels that have a firm base in cable. These channels are grand-fathered in- there is an inherent cost to become a new cable channel- and there isn't much point being an internet startup if most people only see cable.
Once a larger portion of people switch to internet-based TV this could spark a revolution over the established order. There would no longer be such a big threshold to start up new channels- and borders will inevitably be crossed. British stations, American stations, Australian stations... they'll all be competing for the same "English-speaking" world market.
Suddenly there will be many multiple the current number of stations producing their own content. Most of this will be very low budget and not get much of a following- however the big stations of today will see their share eroded. It will be survival of the fittest.
This is a good thing right? Well, yes and no. The spread of stations available mean stations will need to produce good-quality (but cheap) productions.
A lot of high-budget shows will die. A lot fewer high-budget shows will be made. You will have greater choice- but it will all be lower budget- but most likely better written. There will be a lot of wading through crap to find the good stuff- but the good stuff will be there because content will matter due to higher competition.
Stations will come and go- just like local commercial radio- they will constantly reformat, collapse, and be born.
The absolute worst thing that could happen would be if enough "good" stations team up "buy us as a package" to monopolise internet TV to stiffle competition. Then we would be back to the old days- of big budget but low quality. The more competition the better TV we'll get.
"That's the way to do it" - Punch
The cable companies know that bandwidth caps are their best defense against people canceling cable TV. If they essentially say the Xbox (or Netflix, or whatever) plan is limited, but cable TV is "unlimited", then they still have a competitive edge they can try to wield.
What consumers really need is real, effective choice in who their ISP is. Competition is the key to delivering value.
As long as Comcast, et al., have monopoly power to wield, prices are going to be suspended artificially high and consumers will continue to cut the cord.
The deals look like extensions of service for their traditional customer base. I doubt Xbox will provide anything if I don't already have a cable TV contract with the supplier. What I want is to be able to stream the shows that I want to watch, and not subsidize channels I don't want. Until that happens I will continue to rely on Netflix, Hulu, and the broadcast corporation websites to what the shows I am interested in.
"I myself am made entirely of flaws, stitched together with good intentions."
The easy way is to have patience. I just wait for the season to come out on disc.
[1] No commercials other than the stupid previews
[2] Can rip them to any device I own
[3] I know if the show failed or survived and whether to even bother
[4] If I want a nice copy of the show for myself, season box sets are often heavily discounted
This is why I scoff at the "streaming is hip and now and *with it* and discs are dead" folks. Not as long as streaming is buried under Byzantine legal rights agreements and I can't watch precisely what I want. It's like I'm supposed to poke through what some streaming source has available to find something watchable. Uh, no, that's not how those of use with limited and valuable entertainment time do things. I have a list of things I want to watch. Disc rental/purchases are the *only* way to fulfill that list right now.
And if I do get impatient, there's always the magic of "unofficial" downloads.
I'm starting to become concerned about these inexpensive web video content services not being all they're cracked up to be in today's internet service market. I'm all for web content, but what happens when I leave the web TV on all day? I'm going to get dinged for the bandwidth charges that what! Recently Netflix introduced a "low resolution" version of their service to combat this problem. I guess the future really does look like Max Headroom.
I hope Microsoft makes this happen! This will nationalize cable making prices, service, and content more competitive. Also allow companies to start they own syndications.
AT&T U-verse customers have been able to use the XBox as their set top box for some time now.
http://www.att.com/u-verse/explore/xbox-receiver.jsp
Clarification: You do need a PC for your solution, unless there's a cablecard for Xbox I don't know about.
That said, I really like the Windows Media Center interface. That's the only DVR we use currently. Much better out of the box than the Comcast DVR or homebrew solution I used for years: GB-PVR. I just wish the link to it on the Xbox was more prominent. More than a couple clicks/menus fails the WAF.
If there was an easier way to access WMC TV recordings from other small STBs (Roku, Apple TV) it would be the perfect solution.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
..... They expect Rogers, Bell, Telus and Shaw to let them play in the sand pit? LOL...
by TheSpoom (715771) Uncaring Linux user here. I have nothing to add to this but please continue. *munches popcorn*
I don't see how, unless you plan to have an XBox in every room. We have one on our big entertainment center TV. But in the bedroom we just have a Roku. If MS starting putting out sub-$100 Media Center STBs (with Netflix and Hulu, etc., in addition to XBL content ) then you could make that argument.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
Is it intended to act as a DVR or is it streaming only? If the former, can it record a show while playing a game? Convergence sometimes has casualties.
I have no interest in extending Microsoft's monopoly into the Living room any more than I want to hand Apple the same monopoly on a silver platter.
Single vendor solutions ultimately do more harm than good.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Yes. This is by no means a cheap option.
Besides, if you are going to put xboxes under all of your TVs you could just use Media Center and avoid channel specific streaming.
Stream everything.
This does nothing to displace conventional cable like an AppleTV or Roku does or even XBMC.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
I know the ATT uVerse version of this for XBox was an expensive addition. I don't know anyone that did it.
But assuming it's free for comcast or verizon users, the one thing this isn't, is a cord-cutting or cost saving move against your cable company... as was pointed out in a number of articles earlier in the week. It's another widget to try to keep you on board, just like their awful dvrs.
I'm not sure what the whole "seems like yet another step forward in killing traditional cable companies" thing is about. This is brought to you by the "traditional cable companies". The only difference is that your xbox gets to show you ads before comcast does... and you still get to pay both of them for the privilege.
I just wish the link to it on the Xbox was more prominent. More than a couple clicks/menus fails the WAF.
You do know that you can set the Xbox to auto-boot into WMC, right? It's all in the system settings. That's exactly how I have mine set up. They even wake up the WMC host PC using WOL. WAF++++++14!
I love my Ceton, but I do wish that it would boot faster. From the moment that the HTPC boots or wakes up, it is about 70 seconds or so before it itself is ready to go (in the meantime, WMC acts kind of kooky, like it can't find an available tuner). The only way around this is to just leave the HTPC on all of the time, which is something I'm not willing to do. Of course, this is only a problem when I'm watching live TV (an increasingly rare event, as opposed to recordings).
To the best of my knowledge, cable companies send their signal once, and all the boxes entitled to hear it hear it at the same time. This is very efficient for the sender. Transmissions based on tcp/ip will not be efficient. Are there plans in the works to use udp broadcast or multicast to replace the functionality of broadcasted stations? If they do broadcast the tcp data, then it would probably not be efficient for the receivers.
Are they discussing a replacement for broadcasted content that keeps things efficient?
One of the free providers is Crackle.com which is like HuluPlus except free and Sony-only movies and television content. Yes, that means we can finally watch Seinfeld since Netflix doesn't stream it! The slap to PS3 owners is that Sony doesn't have this on their own system, haha.
The reason streaming media failed for me was:
1. It killed my data cap from my ISP
2. crappy remotes that you had to use arrows and point to a letter on screen
3. inconsistent content
Unless Microsoft can fix my biggest issue.... capping out my ISP (watching HD content does this quickly), I will have no use for it... Which is why companies like comcast should be sued for the data caps (many other countries around the world have no caps... because their companies were not greedy fools and they knew how to invest a good amount of money back into their systems)
Honestly, if the media center extender worked on other Windows PCs, I'd rather just buy a small dell zino box and set it up on my TV. No such luck though... another boneheaded thought by microsoft.
The price is always right if someone else is paying.
It won't do more than cable TV via the old set top box. It won't cost less. What's the point?
I agree that it'd be nice. But honestly, I don't think it's as much Microsoft's fault as it might seem. The content providers have their paws all over what can be played, where, and by what. As I'm sure that you've seen, you can't copy most shows from one WMC to another WMC and play it there. That's not Microsoft, that's the likes of Comcast. Clearly, Microsoft put a lot into WMC, it's also unlikely (on that front) that they just "forgot" or "didn't notice" that a PC functioning as an extender would be the ultimate.
On the flip side, for $150 (when on sale), the Xbox 360 Slim is not a bad extender IMHO. Have two of them, booting directly to WMC (this is just the easiest for everyone involved, even when grandma visits). Family has gotten used to "it takes a minute or so when I turn on the TV." By far the slickest DVR I have ever used ... if move to another room, simply pause in one room and pick it up in the other room. Works great!
I just finished rolling out my Windows Media Center with a InfiniTV 4 & the CableCard setup as well, it rocks. I haven't turned in my DVR & Cable Box yet, probably in a few weeks, but it will end up saving me $30+ a month, enough to pay off the InfiniTV 4 card & other parts in under a year.
I'm using a free Xbox360 as a media center extender, which works well. The thing that pisses me off is Microsoft requires me to spend $60 a year or something on an Xbox Live Gold account if I want to watch Netflix, onto of the Netflix account I already pay for. Netflix is great on my Media Center already, I just refuse to be gouged to watch it on a different device.
Agreed on the XBox Live account for Netflix. I don't want to pay twice for Netflix, so I won't. It's just annoying to get a service that's basically free, only when you're a member of something else. Blargghhggh!!%$!@$
The price is always right if someone else is paying.
Good idea. If our 360 was just for WMC that's what I'd do. But we use it for games and Netflix, too. I can update my Harmony remote to put the WMC button on the first screen (it defaults to the second screen). That will probably do the trick.
Do you find your media PC wakes up sporadically on its own, even when it's not recording a show? I'm backing mine up to a Windows Home Server, with the media extensions enabled. Between that and WMC it seems to wake up often.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
So basically you get to pay for content you could have gotten for free in most cases if MS included a browser. If they require a gold membership for the BBC I seriously hope people complain about that. People shouldn't have to pay for the damn TV licence and then MS to watch BBC programmes.
I agree, but getting everything to work harmoniously takes a serious commitment to tinkering.
Our house has A Roku, an Apple TV and a 360 used as a Media Center Extender to a Win 7 PC used as a DVR. A Windows Home Server hosts pictures, movies, and music to all devices. The house also has other Windows machines, iPods and iPhones. Email, contacts, and calendars are accessed with Google. I wish they would all just get along!
Issues:
1) No universal music format outside of the venerable MP3, which is what all my music is ripped to. Playlists do not play nice.
2) Windows Media Center and Windows Home Server don't run iTunes.
3) iTunes and the Roku can't see or play native WMC TV recordings.
Workarounds exist but require file conversion apps, which is a turn off for most consumers. If there were some third party media aggregator that was platform agnostic I'd be all over it. Google, Amazon, or even Logitech (their remotes work with everything) could step in here since Apple and MS don't seem to hate them as much as each other.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
I would have maybe a faint, tiny glimmer of interest if we weren't on our fourth XBOX 360 after the others RRDed. And that's only been a couple of years. And that's with the console on a UPS and in open air (no cooling restrictions) in an air conditioned environment.
The major professional and college sports leagues still have long-term exclusive contracts with cable TV.
My goddess! You are so uninformed. Citation please?
I was referring to cable TV as opposed to Internet TV, not cable TV as opposed to direct broadcast satellite TV. According to this article on Multichannel News, ESPN recently renewed a multi-year contract with the NFL to show Monday Night Football. MLB has an online blackout if the game is televised locally.
NFL had an exclusive contract with DISH for years. You couldn't get it on cable at all
By "cable", I was referring refer to any subscription television service organized into tiers of tied channels, regardless of the physical medium. Can you recommend a word for television providers with the same general business model as cable or satellite television that is shorter than than "cable or satellite TV"?
Oh, you mean they had contract with the TV networks, the channels themselves, that are on both cable and satellite?
Yes. The contract is to black out the games online wherever a broadcast, cable, or satellite network has the exclusive right.
I see. So, when pro/college sports make shitty deals with Viacom or Sony you blame Comcast or Cox.
I blame only the league.
Tell me when I can go back to the days of plugging the cable line directly into the TV without the need for set top boxes and multiple remotes. Wasn't CableCARD supposed to come and fix everything?
Slow Down Cowboy! It's been 1 hour, 47 minutes since you last successfully posted a comment
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/joke
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/prediction
dragonhawk@iname.microsoft.com
I do not like Microsoft. Remove them from my email address.
Actually, I don't find the machine waking up sporadically, other than for recordings (or when an extender wakes it) ... if I had to guess maybe there's some sort of add-in or service you're running in WHS that is doing the waking? Or it has a bunch of scheduled tasks via an application (virus scanner, defrag, etc)? You might check the event logs if you haven't yet, there could be something funny going on in there. Most motherboards can allows you (in the BIOS) make some settings to disable certain wake timers (or adjust sleep modes), too, which might give you more ideal operation.
I hear you on the games and Netflix, and waking to the Xbox dashboard. Unfortunately my house is a bit "nerd unfriendly" one could say (my wife isn't a gamer at all, and has a relatively small patience for me playing when she's around!) ... if I can make the Xbox not look like or act like an Xbox by default, but still be able to make it perform like an Xbox ... well that's as good as gold in my house!
Get a HD Homerun Prime 3 tuners that are shared to every WMC box on your network. 250 is not that bad a silent atom PC that I already had, a used xbox360 and a VM on the home server for the main recoding box. Wish I knew about the idiotic you have to pay Microsoft for the privilege of streaming netflix though. Replaces 2 tivo's at 25 a month and a cable card rental payback is about a year. Also gives me the ability to watch live TV on every windows box in the house (7 at last count) even can watch some live tv on linux. You can strip the MWC DRM if you need to and convert for ipod and droid use. Best upgrade from tivo's is automated commercial deletion. With DRM stripping all my content is available to any UPnP/DLNA device in the house.
No sir I dont like it.
Yeah, no. DVDs down here HAVE ads. My dad got himself some Rolling Stones DVD which has a national bank ad (which you can't skip) at the beginning. And since it's not TV space, it's the full-lenght ad. About 2 minutes.
I know I can rip them, but, you know, why do I have to?
Interestingly it looks like (for once) us Aussies were the first to get this, about 6(ish) months ago Foxtel started broadcasting via streaming channels to the XBox 360. I will admit it is not a full featured service but it is a really good start. I will be curious to see how it plays out overseas to see if you get full featured (such as pausing, recording etc) as of course there are technical limitations that have to be overcome there. Stuart
Hit me up on twitter @StuartCRyan
200 watts for the XBox 360???
Apple TV 6 watts.
I do not think I want a power hog running my Cable TV....
The cable companies know that bandwidth caps are their best defense against people canceling cable TV. If they essentially say the Xbox (or Netflix, or whatever) plan is limited, but cable TV is "unlimited", then they still have a competitive edge they can try to wield.
But cable TV is unlimited, to all practical intents and purposes -- it is a broadcast medium, so the bandwidth cost is unrelated to the number of users.
The internet, however, is a unicast medium, so every new user takes up more bandwidth.
Microsoft aren't performing a public service, they're simply trying to monopolise. Microsoft have never had a big history of efficiency either. They almost singlehandedly handed a desktop monopoly to inefficient x86 chips, which led to battery life problems when the era of portable computing started. Their software has historically suffered so much bloat that user memory requirements grew rapidly enough to fill the capacity offered by the market for the decade from Windows 95 to XP.
Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
Hey, who needs expensive NCIS when we've got "Navy Police" for free?
They cancelled "Firefly"? Come and watch "Glowbug" instead!
No more Stargate SG1? Why not try "Freegate SG2"?
(Don't get me wrong -- I love Linux, just the Linux gaming scene is a bit of a joke....)
Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
they forgot the 51st state of europe methinks
Free speech was meant to be free for all... how can anyone grow up in a nanny state ?
Hmmm....
* The remote would have only two buttons.
* You wouldn't be able to remove channels from your channel list -- who needs to delete channels in this day and age?
* There would be a "Beta" logo overlaid on the screen at all times.
* Channels would randomly appear without an explanation of what their programming would be, and then disappear quietly a year or two later.
* And, of course, every channel, show and commercial you ever watched would be tracked forever.
Anyone else?
dragonhawk@iname.microsoft.com
I do not like Microsoft. Remove them from my email address.