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First Look: Oracle NoSQL Database

snydeq writes "InfoWorld's Peter Wayner takes a first look at Oracle NoSQL Database, the company's take on the distributed key-value data store for the enterprise. 'There are dozens of small ways in which the tool is more thorough and sophisticated than the simpler NoSQL projects. You get a number of different options for increasing the durability in the face of a node crash or trading that durability for speed,' Wayner writes. 'Oracle NoSQL might not offer the heady fun and "just build it" experimentation of many of the pure open source NoSQL projects, but that's not really its role. Oracle borrowed the best ideas from these groups and built something that will deliver good performance to the sweet spot of the enterprise market.'"

35 of 117 comments (clear)

  1. Oracle = pain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Oracle NoSQL might not offer the heady fun and "just build it" experimentation of many of the pure open source NoSQL projects

    Oracle databases aren’t about fun, they are about pain. Severe pain. The kind of pain where you scream so loud in your mind at night that it wakes you up. Pain which you only endure if you need the power they offer over all the much more palatable alternatives available, or need support and/or the perception of not using “some freeware database” in the case of large bureaucratic enterprise.

    All that said, this actually sounds like a good idea, and from what the article describes, it sounds like a good product. It will of course be painful to use, but I can see this catching on in the “serious performance/reliability” and “large enterprise with compulsive need to spend” groups, especially as NoSQL becomes a buzzword.

    1. Re:Oracle = pain by CmdrPony · · Score: 2, Informative

      No, Oracle databases are about performance and features that other database solutions don't offer. They have always been. "There are dozens of small ways in which the tool is more thorough and sophisticated than the simpler NoSQL projects." not only holds true for this Oracle product, it's true for all their products. Yes, they cost a lot, but also offer things anyone else don't. Your website project will probably be ok with MySQL, but enterprises have different needs.

    2. Re:Oracle = pain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      > but enterprises have different needs

      Yes, like PostgreSQL

    3. Re:Oracle = pain by Tablizer · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The problem is that PHB's buy Oracle thinking because it's "top of the line" it will just be great out of the box. Instead, it requires skillful tuning and fiddling to use effectively, but the PHB's don't want to pay for that aspect.

      It's almost like giving a Stradivarius violin to your neighbor's newbie kid and thinking that "because it's a Strad, it will make the kid sound good."

    4. Re:Oracle = pain by jedidiah · · Score: 2

      That's less like Enterprise and more like Galileo.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    5. Re:Oracle = pain by CmdrPony · · Score: 2

      Even if you give an Lamborghini to an uncool guy, it doesn't get him woman or make him cool.. oh wait

    6. Re:Oracle = pain by rrohbeck · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Most of all they're about lock-in => $$$ => Larry's yachts.

    7. Re:Oracle = pain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      In what world do you live? Oracle DB is the only great product they have, the rest is complete and utter crap, and they don't even know how to maintain them. We've been trying for months now to get someone from Oracle to explain us why our OSB does not work as it should, and even the guy from engineering that they shipped over half the world was just as clueless as we are.Siebel has been going downhill ever since they purchased it. BRM has never worked in a large deployment. Fusion is still just a dream that doesn't really work, the list goes on...

      And you know what, it's because all the good engineers don't want to work at Oracle. Over the course of my current project, we've had three different consultants, the first two quit because they said the atmosphere is just awful and noone has a clue what's going on. And they are trying hard to hide that they have people leaving the company in droves, leaving people with very little experience maintaining software that they have no clue about.

    8. Re:Oracle = pain by sqldr · · Score: 4, Interesting

      They are also about selling training course. The syntax for half of the commands is appalling. RMAN for example with its "copy control file from path1 to path2 whilst patting your head and then write home to your gran" attempt at plain english language is far too obtuse for what it actually does, which isn't much. It copies a control file and then does autobackup. Wow. Didn't need a paragraph of shakespeare.

      It's the same throughout. Then they can't even install the software without running a massive java app (I really don't want to go into too much detail about how much time it took to automate Oracle installs...)

      And before you ask - we're running the 6th busiest Oracle database in Europe - according to Oracle themselves - running across 4*128 SSD drive arrays at a cost of millions.. and for the 3 or 4 features we need to justify the licenses instead or designing our way out of the same problem, at times I really wonder about the hassle, especially when our data is so important and locked up into such a bloated closed up mess.

      --
      I wrote my first program at the age of six, and I still can't work out how this website works.
    9. Re:Oracle = pain by renegadesx · · Score: 2

      You haven't used Oracle RAC & ASM then haven't you?

      --
      Make SELinux enforcing again!
    10. Re:Oracle = pain by hey+hey+hey · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And before you ask - we're running the 6th busiest Oracle database in Europe - according to Oracle themselves - running across 4*128 SSD drive arrays at a cost of millions.. and for the 3 or 4 features we need to justify the licenses instead or designing our way out of the same problem, at times I really wonder about the hassle, especially when our data is so important and locked up into such a bloated closed up mess.

      You might think such things as a fun fantasy, but you would be insane to actually do it. When it (say) turns out your home grown solution corrupts records spanning odd page boundaries, you will be quite sad as you and the one other guy who has a clue how your "clever hack" functions gets to work 24hour days trying to debug the problem, determine the extent of the damage, and try and figure out a solution. It is times like that when having thousands of consultants, and a major corporation with teams of dedicated programmers ready to jump on your problem (for a price, certainly for a price) is the only sane option. If you are really as big as you say, your data is WAY to valuable.

      I may not be fond of Oracle either as a corporation or as a product, but there are reasons it rules in the enterprise DB niche.

    11. Re:Oracle = pain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yeah, I'm not sure where you get that idea from about dbas and devs not being required to communicate... That's way off...

      What kind of world do you think you're living in?

    12. Re:Oracle = pain by durdur · · Score: 3, Informative

      Oracle is not "plug and play" for developers, far from it. But it is true that recent versions do a lot of auto-tuning, and you can get reasonable performance with not a lot of work (but that assumes you don't have a truly dumb design, and really high performance requires a DBA, for sure). Oracle's superior locking model also in my experience produces less developer pain that many of the alternatives.

    13. Re:Oracle = pain by Just+Some+Guy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Postgres still requires that the developer and DBA actually talk to each other every once in a while, whereas Oracle does not.

      s/requires/allows/, because as far as I can tell Oracle legally obligates the two parties to communicate through layers of upper management before the DBA can so much as add an index the developer needs.

      --
      Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
    14. Re:Oracle = pain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Vendor lock-in(g) :)

    15. Re:Oracle = pain by durdur · · Score: 3, Insightful

      What is Oracle's superior locking model?

      Oracle uses row-level locks only, and unlike for example MS-SQL or Sybase, will never escalate lock scope to the block or table level. It does not have any limit on the number of rows that can be locked during a transaction.

      If you have a mostly-read application this may not matter, but it matters a lot if you have a high update frequency from multiple clients.

      You can try to relax the transaction isolation level in MS-SQL to get greater update performance but that does not then provide the same degree of isolation as Oracle.

    16. Re:Oracle = pain by Doc+Hopper · · Score: 2

      In what world do you live? Oracle DB is the only great product they have, the rest is complete and utter crap, and they don't even know how to maintain them.

      Disclaimer: I work at Oracle. Your description does not match my experience.

      We've been trying for months now to get someone from Oracle to explain us why our OSB does not work as it should, and even the guy from engineering that they shipped over half the world was just as clueless as we are.

      I and my team use OSB every day (about 80/20 to Netbackup) to back up petabytes of data. The chances are very good you've encountered one of numerous hardware-related gotchas that can derail success with OSB. I like the product, but the hardware support can be a killer.

      Let me know the My Oracle Support number you filed and I'll take a look and see if I or my team might be able to chime in if we've seen the problem before.

      Siebel has been going downhill ever since they purchased it.

      I was part of the Siebel acquisition.

      In fairness, Siebel struggled because within a few months of acquisition, developers had to change focus. Previously it was almost-exclusively a Windows/Internet Explorer product, heavily tailored to that environment, including Windows on the back-end most often with AIX running DB2 for the database. The slowdown in Siebel development -- in my opinion -- was largely due to the huge Linux porting & HTML standardization effort.

      Today's Siebel runs on Linux middle-tiers with Oracle database under the hood. And its stability is better for it. Every time you use My Oracle Support, you're actually using Siebel.

      Additionally, you're seeing the results of that effort reflected in CRM Fusion. Of course the product has bugs, but we're eating our own dogfood every day and we're acutely aware of most of them!

      Fusion is still just a dream that doesn't really work, the list goes on...

      Wow, I must dream like every day. I support the boxes it runs on, I use the product, and so do tens of thousands of others. It's ambitious, and it was a huge effort, but I fully expect it to mop the floor with other products. We're using portions of it throughout many of our other enterprise products right now.

      And you know what, it's because all the good engineers don't want to work at Oracle.

      Really? I work with world-class teams every day that amaze me with innovations large and small. There are pockets of unhappiness, for sure, and now that the tech market is improving there are occasional defections. I've been here almost eight years now, and it's not for lack of options. I interview at least four times a year for other positions elsewhere. I choose to remain.

      Why? Great environment. Great commute. Incredibly intelligent co-workers. Highly-focused training in an area I love (storage & backup). Market pay. Lots more.

      And they are trying hard to hide that they have people leaving the company in droves, leaving people with very little experience maintaining software that they have no clue about.

      Depends on the team. I'm friends with people all over in tech, and right now the market is driving everyone job-hopping. Oracle is HUGE, so from what I can see it's just affecting us as much as anyone else... but with tens of thousands of employees, everybody knows somebody who's left recently.

      There were mass defections shortly before & after the Sun acquisition. I've been through numerous acquisitions with several companies, and it apparently comes with the territory. I don't see any more "droves" of people leaving than before. But Oracle's working a little harder to keep the good ones now that the tech job market has improved so much.

      To sum up... it's unfortunate you've had a bad experience with support on a few products. Rapid changes in our pro

  2. Press releases by nyctopterus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I know that a lot of submissions are inevitably going to be based on press releases (it's straight from the horses mouth so to speak), but do they have to be so blatantly biased? Could we have some sort of editorial? The last sentence of this post make me want to vomit.

    1. Re:Press releases by rrohbeck · · Score: 5, Funny

      It could be worse - it could be an article about Agile.

  3. Re:Oracle is just to piss you off. by Tablizer · · Score: 2

    But that's when you turn back to Oracle to buy a real database. They know what they're doing.

  4. Re:hah, talk about nonstarter by Tablizer · · Score: 5, Funny

    Slashdot uses the NoComment database. Comments are passe.

  5. Google Patents? by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Anybody know how broad Google's map/reduce patents are?

    It's been said that the whole reason Oracle bought Sun was to clobber Google with the Java patents so they could cross-license the map/reduce patents and get back to an Oracle database that could scale.

    Regardless, corporations should just release their software and fight it out in court later (sorry, real people, you can't play) but now that this is out, things might get more interesting in the patent wars.

    --
    My God, it's Full of Source!
    OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
    1. Re:Google Patents? by fsckmnky · · Score: 2

      It is my understanding, based on stuff ( sorry for the lack of specifics here ), that map/reduce was not in fact invented by google, by predates google by 30 or 40 years, and was simply re-discovered by google, according to some article I read sometime in the past that unfortunately, I cannot recall now. I dont think this has been challenged at all, however, and googles patent could still indeed be valid, depending on details.

  6. Obligatory by acjacinto · · Score: 5, Funny

    We're looking for Oracle NoSQL DBAs with 10 years of experience --recruiter

    1. Re:Obligatory by Tablizer · · Score: 2

      Just your lucky day! I happen to have experience in NoTruth.

    2. Re:Obligatory by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Perfect; I myself have no SQL experience, neither with Oracle's products or anyone else's.

    3. Re:Obligatory by Billly+Gates · · Score: 2

      I have 10 years experience with NoSQL Oracle DBMs as well as 7 years of HTML 5 experience with IE 6

  7. Opinion: Complete failure of Oracle security respo by SmurfButcher+Bob · · Score: 3, Interesting

    So Sayeth Litchfield:
    http://seclists.org/bugtraq/2005/Oct/56

    'nuff said

    --

    help me i've cloned myself and can't remember which one I am

  8. Re:hah, talk about nonstarter by M0j0_j0j0 · · Score: 2

    This just made my day.

  9. Re:Berkeley DB by Dr_Barnowl · · Score: 4, Informative

    BDB is an in-process key-value store. It's limited to being accessed by a single process, and has much more limited replication ability.

    This is a server based product ; your client communicates with servers using a driver. It's "eventually consistent", meaning that changes take time to propagate across the replication axis, so not all clients see the same picture (although with this one, you can influence the ACID-ity of atoms of data by grouping them on "major" keys).

    The advantage is mostly scalability. You can throw more servers at it to provide more capacity, and the software will do a lot of the work to ensure that this works. If you want more capacity on BDB, you need to throw a bigger chunk of iron at it.

    The other major difference ; the open-source license (Sleepycat) for BerkeleyDB is copyleft. Despite the name, it's not released under a Berkely Software Distribution style license - Oracle dual license it and you have to pay a commercial license fee to distribute products based on it without releasing your own sources.

    The Community Editor license file for Oracle NoSQL from the distribution lists a number of licenses, all of them BSD-style - new BSD and Apache 2.0 ; in certain quarters this will be greeted with a great deal more enthusiasm. The only difference between the Community and paid editions is the support.

  10. Practically ACID by mandelbr0t · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The serious part of Oracle NoSQL is a practical approximation of ACID compliance, the standard that SQL databases like to offer.

    If this claim holds up, then its easy to see where Oracle could come out ahead of other NoSQL databases. TFA mentions that this practical approximation is dealt with by arranging the cluster machines in two axes: the replication axis and the sharding axis. Along the sharding axis, each major key is guaranteed to be tied to a single machine. Since there is only one record to be updated, there is no "eventual consistency" problem. The replication axis is responsible for making multiple copies of that data. If full ACID compliance is desired, even along the replication axis, there are plenty of options for ensuring that the write is complete before calling the transaction complete: the master node is updated, a majority of replicated nodes are updated, or all replicated nodes are updated.

    This approach seems to take the best of both worlds in the NoSQL arena: sharding, which is the approach used by MySQL cluster, and replication, as used by pretty much every other NoSQL store available. Of course, if you have a fuck-ton of data, you'll also need a fuck-ton of machines. This is not a server you will be testing without considerable resources at your disposal.

    --
    "Please describe the scientific nature of the 'whammy'" - Agent Scully
    1. Re:Practically ACID by Lord_Naikon · · Score: 2

      No sharding solution can guarantee consistency in the event of node failures, unless you completely block writes or reads until the nodes are back up. It's great that they bind a key to a particular server, but I can think of several other NoSQL solutions which do the same thing. Basically everything that uses hashrings and do lookups based on that. Oracle NoSQL is hardly unique in that respect.

  11. Re:New enterprise project = stodgy by default? by ADRA · · Score: 2

    How about: "Not suitable for High-school kids looking to write their first database application"
    or
    "Not for mere morons"
    or
    "Not suitable for enthusiasts"

    It seems like of silly. For playing around with K/V based systems, on the low end, you can throw something together with bubblegum and gumption without much concern about reliability, concurrency, or scaling. If you are a large project with a non-trivial set of requirements, the learning curve on a solution should be far less important than the effective output of the system in production. Now I've never used Oracle's NoDB solution (or any NoSQL solutions for that matter) but I'd reserve judgement until its actually in your hands to see how it works with your development practices.

    Personally, I was obsessed with the concept of NoSQL in development until I realized just how much heavy work systems like Oracle do for effectively free using relatively simple SQL expressions. Maybe if I ever work on huge volume or huge scale systems, my tone may change, but in my typical enterprise scale systems (tables under 10mil rows) I haven't seen the need for anything else.

    --
    Bye!
  12. The Brilliance of 'MapReduce' Is Overblown by curmudgeon99 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I cannot understand why MapReduce has been turned into such a holy creation. The idea could not be simpler: you have a big dataset? Break it apart into pieces that are free of external dependencies, process the pieces in parallel and then aggregate the matches from the processed pieces.
    This is not Hadoop, with its elaborate application plumbing or CouchDB with its curious use of MapReduce as part of its querying system.
    MapReduce is too simple for all acclaim. It's too obvious.

    1. Re:The Brilliance of 'MapReduce' Is Overblown by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 3, Insightful

      MapReduce is too simple for all acclaim. It's too obvious.

      Yeah, we did these in first-year algorithms class - they called them scatter/gather at the time. Google's insight seems to have been doing this with key/value pairs and making it an n-stage operation for application-independent parallelization.

      Which, of course, the USPTO threw a patent at. So, here were are, stuck with it until 2024. Yay, government.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)