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Facebook Denies Disputed Page To Both Mercks

itwbennett writes "In follow-up to yesterday's story about how Merck in Germany is threatening legal action to take its vanity Facebook URL back from Merck U.S., Facebook apologized for its 'administrative error' in reassigning the URL but said that if the two companies can't play nice, no one will get the URL."

53 of 210 comments (clear)

  1. To which a Merck U.S. representative replied... by elrous0 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Here, drink this soda and see if you still feel that way.

    --
    SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    1. Re:To which a Merck U.S. representative replied... by msauve · · Score: 2

      Phospho soda, no doubt.

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    2. Re:To which a Merck U.S. representative replied... by Jeng · · Score: 4, Funny

      I was thinking the old formula for 7-up that included lithium.

      --
      Don't know something? Look it up. Still don't know? Then ask.
  2. Difficult problem by GameboyRMH · · Score: 5, Funny

    This is a Mercky issue to wade through...

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    1. Re:Difficult problem by CmdrPony · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I get the joke, but it's actually really easy one. It obviously belongs to the German company that originally registered it on Facebook. Why does US companies think they can thump on everyone else?

    2. Re:Difficult problem by NotSanguine · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It just goes to show what an agreement with Facebook is worth.

      --
      No, no, you're not thinking; you're just being logical. --Niels Bohr
    3. Re:Difficult problem by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 5, Insightful

      At this point, it does not obviously belong to the German company because we do not know how control ended up in the hands of the U.S. company. It is possible that someone with the German company who had been designated to Facebook as the "administrator" did so. Obviously, it is more likely that someone at Facebook turned administrative control over to the U.S. company (probably because they did not realize there were two pharmaceutical companies with the same name and assumed that the representative of the U.S. company was the representative of the company that originally registered the name--it is even possible that the representative of the U.S. company did not realize that they were taking control from the German company when they did this).

      --
      The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
    4. Re:Difficult problem by forkfail · · Score: 2

      Oh, I'm sure that Facebook stuck to the letter of the EULA, which, without doubt, says that Facebook can do whatever they want now, and if you argue about it, they can change the EULA retroactively at will such that there's no question at all about the matter.

      --
      Check your premises.
    5. Re:Difficult problem by Gideon+Wells · · Score: 2

      Under current precedent and what not it is more along the lines it belongs to FaceBook to lease out who whoever. The German company merely requested it first.

      --
      by Anonymous Coward: I, for one, welcome the shift from car analogies to pizza analogies. um.. overlords?
    6. Re:Difficult problem by Cajun+Hell · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It obviously belongs to the German company that originally registered it on Facebook

      No, it obviously belongs to Facebook (or at least as much as facebook.com belongs to Facebook, except that isn't quite as clear). Whatever Facebook decides to do with it, is defined as the right answer.

      --
      "Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
    7. Re:Difficult problem by BasilBrush · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Neither of the Merck companies bought it, so it belongs to FaceBook. And the terms&conditions when registering the name includes provisions for not infringing others trademarks, and for Facebook to take back the URL for breaching the T&Cs.

      Facebook is doing the sensible thing here. The company names are distinguishable - Merck KGaA and Merck and Co. Given that neither is called just "Merck", it makes sense to make them use distinguishable pages, probably with their full company name.

      Better yet is if Facebook could put a page at FaceBook/Merck with links to both companies new vanity URLs.

    8. Re:Difficult problem by Surt · · Score: 2

      Because facebook is a us company, and merck has a lot of money for lawyers, which is how these things are sorted out.

      --
      "Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
    9. Re:Difficult problem by NotSanguine · · Score: 4, Informative

      Oh, I'm sure that Facebook stuck to the letter of the EULA, which, without doubt, says that Facebook can do whatever they want now, and if you argue about it, they can change the EULA retroactively at will such that there's no question at all about the matter.

      Apparently, the German Merck entered into an agreement with FB in March 2010 (cf. Original Story/a)

      --
      No, no, you're not thinking; you're just being logical. --Niels Bohr
    10. Re:Difficult problem by Canazza · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So you're suggesting a Disambiguation page?

      --
      It pays to be obvious, especially if you have a reputation for being subtle.
    11. Re:Difficult problem by Tanktalus · · Score: 4, Informative

      Revenue stream, yes. Pepsi pay for a "Coke" vanity URL on FB? Unlikely. Courts have already determined some rights to trademark names in URLs - though Pepsi still has to pay the regular registration fee to use "pepsi.com", a competitor attempting to misuse their trademark would likely lose the domain in a court battle, as has happened in the past.

      Their lawyers wouldn't let them even try it.

    12. Re:Difficult problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That seems a likely explanation to me. Never try to attribute malice to an action that can best be explained by simple stupidity. Seems that FB needs to learn a thing or two about what a contract is.

  3. you go FB! by Thud457 · · Score: 4, Funny

    wise like king Solomon.

    No, I can't believe it either.

    --

    the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

    1. Re:you go FB! by DriedClexler · · Score: 5, Funny

      Solomon's solution would be give one of them the "Mer", and the other one "ck", and then instantly void the deal and give it to whoever doesn't want to see the name split.

      --
      Information theory is life. The rest is just the KL divergence.
    2. Re:you go FB! by camperdave · · Score: 2

      Because 'rck' is more difficult to pronounce than 'Mer.'

      The baby ostrich that Foghorn Leghorn adopted seemed to manage it without too much difficulty.

      --
      When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
    3. Re:you go FB! by Opportunist · · Score: 2

      Just have marketing declare it a "meh" and see how it pans out.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  4. Trademarks? by Dexter+Herbivore · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Fantastic, so now Facebook has the right of determining valid trademarks, on top of all the personal data it collects. I may be cynical here, but I get the feeling that 'playing nice' will involve the largest payment in combination with the best legal team.

    1. Re:Trademarks? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Look, if they didn't want their trademarks appropriated they shouldn't have gone to war with us 93 years ago.

    2. Re:Trademarks? by Hentes · · Score: 2

      It's not a trademark issue. Whether they do business with a company is Facebook's choice.

    3. Re:Trademarks? by Cajun+Hell · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Fantastic, so now Facebook has the right of determining valid trademarks, on top of all the personal data it collects

      It's is Facebook's namespace (and you can have on too, right now, if you want). They get to decide whether or not trademarks are even relevant within this namespace, let alone top priority at the expense of all other concerns. Why would it be anyone else's decision?

      Just because some random arbitrary private namespace out there happens to get popular, doesn't mean the rest of society needs to "officially" recognize it, legitimize it, adopt it, regulate it, or take it seriously. It's just a pathname component in someone's website, and it's their site, just like a hypothetical "Apple" directory on my computer which contains a file called "Disney" is my file in my directory on my computer, and no one else deserves .0000001% say in the matter.

      When today's fools finally learn this, then they won't be afraid of new TLDs, BTW.

      --
      "Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
    4. Re:Trademarks? by Alwin+Henseler · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Makes one wonder what a Facebook account is really worth to a company (or pop group, or artist, whatever). On the one hand, the option of gaining & holding customers, and do lots of PR through the social network, on the other hand the possibility that at any time, if someone with same name (competitor?) creates a dispute about it, Facebook might close the account for no good reason.

      Who needs hackers for a DoS attack when Facebook could do the job for you?

    5. Re:Trademarks? by RJFerret · · Score: 3

      "Facemarks"

    6. Re:Trademarks? by NotSanguine · · Score: 2

      Fantastic, so now Facebook has the right of determining valid trademarks, on top of all the personal data it collects. I may be cynical here, but I get the feeling that 'playing nice' will involve the largest payment in combination with the best legal team.

      According to the original report:
      Merck in Germany said in the filing that it entered into an agreement with Facebook on or about March, 2010 for the exclusive use of the web page. Merck said it assigned administrative rights to the web page to a limited number of people, who are its employees, or its external service provider for registration of domain names and social media user names.

      As I said above, it just shows what an agreement with Facebook is worth.

      --
      No, no, you're not thinking; you're just being logical. --Niels Bohr
    7. Re:Trademarks? by Sir_Sri · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This happens a LOT in the software business. Google is trying to sort out which maps to show to which people based on 'official' boundaries (which may or may not reflect actual boundaries, and some boundaries are not filed with the UN publicly so who the hell knows where they are). I worked on a game recently where we were trying to figure out the official border between france and germany at a particular point in time, the area in question has changed hands something like 17 times. 6 guys in a basement were asking very serious questions like the legal status of egypt and sudan under Britian (and how to model that?) the legal status of Taiwan (and whether that meant our game would get banned in China, and whether or not we cared). There are lots of messy legal areas you sometimes have to pick something and role with it.

      Facebook only has one facebook.com/yourname url to give out, and honestly, they don't want to be involved in the fight over who is more Merck than the other, that's why they're telling them both to sort it out themselves. Facebook has no idea who has a more valid claim to the name, and, this is of course muddied by them being in separate areas. Facebook might have to oblige the US trademark for the US branch of the company in the US, and the european version in Europe or just have to oblige the US version or, well, who the hell knows? There's no winning answer here. They may have signed a contract, but my suspicion is that the contract would only be valid if Merck (gmbh) was the legal trademark holder, which, depending on the circumstances, it might not be.

    8. Re:Trademarks? by Hentes · · Score: 2

      For precedences, look at the telephone system, with it's ubiquitous namespace.

      I didn't know you could trademark a sequence of numbers.

    9. Re:Trademarks? by Stormy+Dragon · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, but you can put up a billboard and refuse to let Disney by space on it. Facebook isn't using the trademark improperly, merely refusing to let either side use it. This makes perfect sense for Facebook. Whichever one it would have sided with, the other would have sued them. If it lets neither use the name, there's nothing they can do.

    10. Re:Trademarks? by Pi1grim · · Score: 2

      Just wait 'till Russia gets a say in this.

    11. Re:Trademarks? by Sez+Zero · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There's no winning answer here.

      Sure there is: the winning answer is to not use Facebook.

    12. Re:Trademarks? by Sir_Sri · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Not for either of these two companies. There are 800 million facebook users, 400 million of which are accessed daily. If you want an advertising base, that would be it.

      When you're in the customer service business you aim to connect to your customers how *they* want to connect, not how you think they should be connecting to you.

    13. Re:Trademarks? by reasterling · · Score: 2

      Who needs hackers for a DoS attack when Facebook could do the job for you?

      So quit relying on other peoples web sites and get your own. Really, we have two pharmaceutical companies fighting over a stupid facebook account. If I was them I would be too embarrassed to even admit that I had a facebook account.

      --
      "For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice" -- God
    14. Re:Trademarks? by Opportunist · · Score: 2

      Russia? Who cares, but I'd dive for cover if Vietnam should call any time soon.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  5. That's a rather stupid "solution" by tomhudson · · Score: 4, Informative
    So, Facebook screws up, and now it's up to the original URL holder to "play nice" and let someone else squat with them? Keep it up Facebook - you're just giving us yet another reason to show that you don't "get it" on so many levels.

    What next - people with their names as facebook urls having to "play nice" with others with the same name who come later?

    1. Re:That's a rather stupid "solution" by GameboyRMH · · Score: 2

      Well it's an improvement. MySpace's policy was to straight up give the URL to the better-monied party.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    2. Re:That's a rather stupid "solution" by Lord+Crc · · Score: 4, Interesting

      And what would you do, then? It's not like it can magically decide which of the two companies you want to see when you input the URL.

      I'd do what Wikipedia does, turn it into a disambiguation page, listing all relevant pages.

  6. This is awesome by onyxruby · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Two companies have just been bitch slapped for getting uppity about a common name in world market. How many other inane intellectual property disputes could have been resolved or prevented by doing this?

    1. Re:This is awesome by residieu · · Score: 2

      I don't see how this is awesome. Bobby had a toy, Jimmy came along and told the teature. "I want that toy!" The teacher took the toy from Bobby and gave it to Jimmy. Bobby cried "That's my toy! I'm telling Mommy!" The teacher responded by taking the toy away and not giving it to anyone.

      So rather than responding by acknowledging that they were wrong in taking the address away from the German Merck, they act like they're in the wrong for complaining.

    2. Re:This is awesome by pclminion · · Score: 3, Insightful

      So rather than responding by acknowledging that they were wrong in taking the address away from the German Merck, they act like they're in the wrong for complaining.

      As parent of a two- and four-year-old, I agree with the strategy. Complaining makes you a baby. I don't care which one of them did it/started it/took it/broke it, they work it out between themselves. When I hear screaming from the other room over a toy that toy is gone for the rest of the day, no questions no interrogations no "getting to the bottom of it." I don't give a shit what happened. Screaming == toys are gone.

  7. Translation: by forkfail · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Letting the bidding begin!

    --
    Check your premises.
  8. I propose... by PGGreens · · Score: 2

    cutting the URL in half! Then we will see who it truly belongs to.

  9. What's all this Facebook craze anyway? by cpghost · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Really, wtf? Both companies have more than enough resources to set up their own domains and webpages where they can do whatever they want, without any kind of interference whatsoever. Why would they need to be on Facebook at all when they can have their very own place on the Net? This Facebook craze is going waaaay too far, IMHO. Individuals who don't want to or can't set up their own domains can go with it, no problems, but big companies?

    --
    cpghost at Cordula's Web.
    1. Re:What's all this Facebook craze anyway? by forkfail · · Score: 3, Insightful

      For a lot of people, Facebook is the web.

      And having someone "like" a company means the opportunity to get them to read several bits of advertisement a day - voluntarily, without the popups that so annoy.

      Not saying it's a good thing, just that it's the way things are at this time.

      --
      Check your premises.
    2. Re:What's all this Facebook craze anyway? by Kozz · · Score: 2

      For a lot of people, Facebook is the web.

      So, what you're saying is that Facebook is the new AOL?

      --
      I only post comments when someone on the internet is wrong.
  10. A sensible solution to a stupid problem by janeuner · · Score: 2

    In this chapter, we have two private corporations fighting over a subdirectory owned by a third corporation.

    All of these "people" are insane.

  11. Re:ridiculous by NatasRevol · · Score: 2

    Pretty sure Facebook has all the rights to Facebook.com/*anyname* and always will.

    If they want to sell/give it to the highest bidder, or the american branch of a company, or the Mars Rover, they can.

    --
    There are two types of people in the world: Those who crave closure
  12. No soup for you! by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 2

    No soup for you Merck!

    How about they cut the facebook page in half and give each Merck a half.

    --
    "That's the way to do it" - Punch
  13. Trademarks still exist by tepples · · Score: 2

    Facebook is still subject to national jurisdictions, and trademark law still restricts what Facebook is allowed to do with its own domain. Perhaps the most legally justifiable answer might be to geolocate the IP address, find the correct trademark owner for a given country, and then redirect to MSD's or EMD's Facebook page as appropriate.

    1. Re:Trademarks still exist by mr1911 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Except that Facebook is still private property. They don't have to let you promote your trademark on their site any more than a company could force you to paint their logo on the side of your house.

      Denying both companies access to the name on Facebook is a completely viable and legal means to not infringe on any trademark.

      You may also want to brush up on trademarks a bit. It is possible to have the same trademark for different industries, and one does not trump the other. Say for example, I have a registered trademark for Apple toothbrushes. I am free to promote my trademark, even if Apple computers doesn't like it. Granted it does get even murkier when industries are similar across international boundaries, but one trumping the other is still a tough argument to make.

      In the end it is very funny that Facebook basically give a timeout to two companies acting like two year old children.

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      Any offense taken to this post is at your sole discretion.
  14. Re:Dilution by mr1911 · · Score: 2

    Not if the mark is famous [wikipedia.org] like the Nike swoosh, the McDonald's arches, the Disney mouse-ear-silhouette, the Olympic rings, or the Red Cross emblem.

    I didn't say it was always possible to have non-competing trademarks. You cite logos, which are much easier to argue for complete exclusivity than names. Even if I had the registered trademark for Apple Toothbrushes, I would not expect to be able to use the Apple's bitten-apple logo for it. As you pointed out, logos are generally more protectable than names -- one would not expect to use Apple's bitten-apple logo for any purpose, regardless of the name or industry. Hence the power and attractiveness of logos.

    It may cost Facebook a little bit of money in geolocated pages, but their actions may have saved them a much larger headache and cost by not being drawn into the middle of a trademark dispute.

    Your concept for geolocated pages is possible to become the final solution. Expect it to be done quietly and without the fanfare of the current situation.

    Facebook's action of denying both parties access to the name has made the geolocated pages concept more attractive to both. Certainly more so than if it would have been Facebook's first offer to remedy the situation.

    --
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    Any offense taken to this post is at your sole discretion.
  15. Ehmm, no. by Ecuador · · Score: 3, Informative

    The company names are distinguishable - Merck KGaA and Merck and Co. Given that neither is called just "Merck", it makes sense to make them use distinguishable pages, probably with their full company name.

    "KGaA" is a German acronym for "Kommanditgesellschaft auf Aktien" which is sort of a "limited company/partnership" or something like that. So, the NAME of the company is just "Merck", with the KGaA designation defining the type of the company. Since you would always say the name of the shoe company is "Nike", when officially they are "Nike, Inc.", I would suggest it is the same with the "German" Merck. Moreover, the "US" Merck's full designation seems to be "Merck and Co., Inc.", you can't be pushing for dropping "Inc"s but keeping "KGaA"s just because in your narrow worldview you recognize the former and not the latter.
    So, the German company is the only one that is just "Merck".
    Now, what facebook should do or not do about it, I don't know and I really don't care.

    --
    Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent. Polar Scope Align for iOS