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The Tech Behind James Cameron's Trench-Bound Submarine
MrSeb writes "Yesterday, James Cameron completed a five-mile-deep test dive in the Pacific Ocean, in preparation for a seven-mile (36,000ft, 11,000m) dive to Challenger Deep, in the Mariana Trench; the deepest place in the world. We don't know when the actual dive will occur, but it will probably be soon. At 36,000ft, the pressure exerted on the hull is 16,000 psi; over 1000 atmospheres, and equivalent to eight tons pushing down on every square inch of your body. Understandably, building a submersible (and equipment, such as cameras, motors, and batteries) that can withstand that kind of pressure, and then safely return to the surface, is difficult. This article digs into the technology required to get Cameron safely to the bottom of the ocean, film some 3D, IMAX footage, and then return to the surface."
Avatar sucked.
It just really, really sucked.
some old guy did it already...
How does one reconcile 16,000 psi with 8,000 tons per square inch?
Seems something is off.
Also pretty sure no human bodies will be experiencing that pressure
Am I the only one that read the title and thought to themselves, "Not him again." This guy isn't as much about real science as he is about using science to grab headlines and then not sticking around to follow through. Remember how he was going to single-handedly fix the Horizon oil disaster off the coast of Louisiana? Never happened. Actually, not a single thing this guy has made headlines for has actually panned out.
#fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
Isn't this 1961 technology we're talking about? Remember the Treste!
* Carthago Delenda Est *
Um, maybe it's not this simple, but...
Lets say you have a submarine with a metal shell that can withstand the pressure at 1000 feet below sea level. (For simplicity, call it a pressure of '1000'.). You can lower it only that far into the water before the pressure exceeds the amount it can handle, and the shell collapses. Okay. Now, what if you place that shell inside an slightly larger one? Lower them both to, say 999 feet, then open a valve to let the water in between the shells. Close the valve, and drop the shells another 999 feet. The inner shell has the pressure of 999 pressing in, which it can withstand. But that 999 water also presses out. The outer shell then has 999 pressing out and 1998 pressing in, a net of 999 pressing in, which it can withstand.
Repeat with however many layers you need, and you should be able to go down to the bottom of the Mariana Trench, no?
After an unsuccessful attempt to film the sequel of Avatar at a depth of 36,000 feet in 3D resulted in the actors being squished into the ground under the intense pressures, Cameron vowed to continue filming the movie using a mix of scrapers to move the cast and stop-motion cameras to film the sequences.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
For Avatar 3 Cameron will build his own space station and launch vehicles and film the whole thing in orbit, or maybe Mars.
It made the Guam newspapers today. They are happy to get the attention for once!
You idiot. If he dies, we'll never get to see Terminator III.
Oops wrong hack director. BOOM!
The biggest problem with remotes that I see is the freaking long cable. But why couldn't they lower for want of a better term, a wireless access point to the bottom with a submersible and then release the sub when it gets down there. Then you would have real time control and the freedom of a tetherless vehicle. Only the access point would be connected to the surface. I am assuming it is better to put the access point down there because that much water would interfere with the control signals if they tried to wirelessly remote it from the surface.
Since the distance isn't as great, a waldo sub wouldn't have the same latency/lag that something in space or even a military drone aircraft would experience. As well, since the view ports on a manned craft will be so limited in such an armoured creation, the view from a waldo sub would be pretty much the same thing, if not better. If they really wanted to have the experience of living head to armpit in a tiny space a cockroach would have trouble slipping through, they could make an aircraft-like simulator that they could all cram themselves into uncomfortably and pretend to actually be in the real wirelessly controlled vehicle. It could turn a flip and all that. They could even spray them with a high pressure hose every time the accidentally bump into something with the real vehicle.
-- I ignore anonymous replies to my comments and postings.
equivalent to eight tons pushing down on every square inch of your body
or, equivalent to 16000 pounds pushing down on every square inch of your body, other wise known as 16000 PSI.
So, it's a race then, between Cameron's Deep Sea Challenge and Hawke/Virgin Oceanic's Deep Flight Challenger (which I think is a lot cooler - it "flies" rather than just sinks).
Don't know any dates for either attempt, other than '2012' for Deep Flight's first descent.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
Despite what you may have been told, we don't know everything. It's a small but important distinction.
Your brain is not a computer.
It's nice of them to announce all this initial success, but where is the
recorded documentary evidence?
It's mentioned that IMAX filming was done. That's fine.
Where's the hand held HD teaser from people documenting the making
of the film?
The bathyscape Trieste used a similar electromagnet-holding-shot system that Cameron's sub uses. They had a bit of a surprise after many successful dives.
It seemed that the steel shot that they obtained in Europe had a substantial amount of impurities in it; and the system worked just fine. When they filled the hoppers with American shot, though, it was pure enough that the electromagnets didn't just hold the shot, it magnetized it! Even when the electromagnets were turned off, the shot stayed in the hopper.
If I recall correctly (and I read about this 40 years ago!) they were able to dump the entire shot canister to get back to the surface.
I love Mondays. On a Monday, anything is possible.
As I see it, the problems that they experience in construction all boil down to: prevent 3D objets from going 2D.
Figures thats why Cameron is involved.
Diving breathing issues aren't about gas pressure, but about saturation of blood and tissue with gasses. At higher pressure, your blood and tissue take up way more gasses than they do at surface pressure. Therefor, if you dive deep, you will become equivalent to a soda bottle. If you surface too quick, it's like someone shakes you and then takes the cap of the bottle. All of a sudden, there will be bubbles in your entire body. Those bubbles will kill your (brain) cells, by oxygen deprivation.
At higher pressures, gasses that are normally "inert" to the human body tissue, will form chemical bonds with your tissues, making the gasses poisonous. That is why there are different gas mixtures used for high pressure (deep) dives.
Even if you can overcome this by using liquids to replace the gasses, it appears that your nerve tissue will have electrical/chemical problems transmitting signals at about 750 meters (75 times atmospheric pressure).
I was promised a flying car. Where is my flying car?
Losing subs because of a slight malfunction costs too much. It may in theory be a perfect solution, but the chances of the sub getting lost versus the costs of building one, currently make it an unprofitable risk. Even with the significant chance of snapping the umbilical, that is still cheaper than risk losing unmanned crafts. There are frequent stories of research vessels losing an unmanned sub, usually costing six figures or more. You don't hear much about commercial vessels losing subs, but the oil and glass-fiber-cable-on-the-ocean-floor companies have plenty of experience with risk calculations and choosing the cheapest solution to get the job done. They default to cable operation, unless they can't avoid untethered. In that case, they usually outsource the job. The military and secret services know a thing or two about this as well, but won't tell you, even if you ask.
This all being said, it's about time people come up with a more reliable way to control and propel unmanned submarines. Using some form of transmitter station lowered to some place close where the sub is, might make getting signals through easier. However, water isn't as uniform a transmission medium as you might think. Currents and temperature differences make layers that can be reflective to radio and sound waves. It would be kind of embarrassing to lose a submarine because you crossed an inversion and your signal wasn't getting through.
I was promised a flying car. Where is my flying car?
So, after making some of the best sci-fi action movies ever filmed, James Cameron kicks back with some dives to the bottom of the ocean.
You know what the best part of it is? Nearly every dive he has done has been paid for by others. After filming titanic, he did a bunch of dives as "research" for his next movie, Avatar. I must have missed the underwater scenes in that film...
Anyways, the beauty of doing it this way is :
1. He gets to charge the investors in the movie for the costs of the underwater dives AND still receive his full salary
2. Since research is a business expense, neither JC nor the movie studio pay any income taxes on the money used to fund this hobby
3. Since he's bringing an IMAX camera along for the current endeavor, WE'RE collectively going to pay the bills for the expedition!
Anyways, stuff like this is how rich people get even richer. I mean sure he could probably write a check for the millions of dollars these trips costs, but that's not how rich people roll...
With all that said, I don't see anything wrong with his actions. Mr. Cameron didn't write the tax laws, and unlikely many wealthy people, he started from nothing, and he created something to earn his wealth. It's become fashionable to criticize Avatar, but it was one of the best looking movies ever filmed, and had a solid story.
I think some people have the wrong view on why we don't do things that we have done before. The simplest reason is, been there, done that.
As in, the challenge has been met. Now lets find a new challenge. Is there a compelling reason to go to the floor of the ocean? The moon? Yeah it would be cool and there is good science in both, but is there a need.
Back in the fifties and sixties, if not the seventies, it was about East versus West. Funny how an arms race turned into a game of one up man ship along peaceful lines.
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
The results will be really implosive!
Religion: The greatest weapon of mass destruction of all time
He should invite Clive Cussler to come along for a ride. Maybe Clive will bring Dirk Pitt along too.
Oh, really?
They should collect the old iron ballast pellets left behind by the last visitor to the Challenger Deep, Bathyscaphe Trieste.
Kriston
RELEASE THE KRAKEN!
They say it was hauled from the Challenger Deep, but I'm positive that beast never swam in terrestrial waters until a week ago...
I quote Wikipedia:
Syntactic foams are composite materials synthesized by filling a metal, polymer or ceramic matrix with hollow particles called microballoons, "syntactic" meaning "put together".[1] The presence of hollow particles results in lower density, higher strength, a lower coefficient of thermal expansion, and, in some cases, radar or sonar transparency.
It's easier to be a result of the past, but more fun to be a cause of the future! http://www.spacefinancegroup.com/