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Ask Slashdot: Store Umbilical Cord Blood — and If So, Where?
gambit3 writes "My wife and I are expecting our first child in 3 months, and one of the decisions we still have to make is whether to store our baby's cord blood. Even if we decide the upfront cost is worth it, there is still the question of using a public bank or a private one (and which one to trust), and whether to also store umbilical cord tissue for stem cells. Does you have any experience or suggestions?"
I think their website is www.cordblood.com
You pay an up-front fee for the collection and first year storage, and a smaller fee each year for storage.
Methods are known that can prevent the reproductive process in humans.
So, this "wife" of yours supposedly had "sex" with you? Whatever! What next mods? Are we going to get stories about Slashdot posters getting tired of their supermodel girlfriends interrupting their Battlefield 3 matches?
I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
The chance that someone else is going to need your cord blood is way, way higher than the chance that you'll need it for your own family. Give it to the public bank.
Plus, the private banks are damned expensive.
Keep it at your home in your freezer and defrost it in a year and eat it
"there is still the question of using a public bank or a private one (and which one to trust)"
I wouldn't trust them with anything. At least my childs blood.
I used Cryo-cell, since they provide this service in Ecuador. As a company it seems very serious and active, but I had never used the stored cells. I really don't know how well the company will respond once you need it.
...store it in the cloud.
My wife and I used CryoCell (http://www.cryo-cell.com/). They are slightly cheaper, but CBR is much larger and does research as well.
http://marrow.org/Get_Involved/Donate_Cord_Blood/Donate_Cord_Blood.aspx
The scientific benefits are still uncertain, and the statistics as to whether your child would need it are pretty low. Better to donate, save your money, and increase the odds that someone will be helped
That's what we did with our first child, and will do with our second. In addition to the costs associated, banking it is a what-if scenario, and adult stem cells are already starting to show promise. We expect no problems justifying it to ourselves or our kids IF they develop some sort of problem AND first-party cord-blood treatment is the best or only solution for it: we're choosing to help people now, as opposed to potentially helping person later. If the efficacy situation were more apparent to us now, it would be a closer decision.
My son was born a little over a year ago, and I selected ViaCord as a cord blood bank. We evaluated a few, and they seemed to be more competent than other options. It's important to get the "collection kit" up front, and have it with you in the hospital... at least in my case, the hospital does not provide any of the supplies. Also, your wife will need to make sure that the OB/GYN is aware ahead of time about your decision to store the blood.
As someone without children, WTF are you all talking about and why do people do this?
Big discussion about it here: http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1121431/
I'd say not worth it...
I have a 2.5 (mine) and a 1.5 year old (foster child) and to me if you would need this I think they would probably have an indication of it before the kid is born. Things are so far along these days with the 4d ultrasounds and such...
Enjoy fatherhood. every 6 months they get more fun with the first 6 month being more of a family pet than a real person. Now at 2.5 years we are running around the backyard having squirt gun fights and she is coming up with all kinds of crazy views on the world. It goes quickly...
But yea, if you and the wife are healthy and she took care of herself the past number of months, the chances of ever needing it are very low.
the tech will exist to derive stem cells from an adult
so you don't need it
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
We used ViaCord for our first, and will be using them for our second. Similar to other services, you pay a collection fee (blood approx $1500, blood+tissue approx $2700) and then a small annual fee for storage.
It remains unclear to me that cord-tissue preservation will be worth the gamble; the option wasn't available several years ago for our first, but is now. We are debating about whether the extra cost is worthwhile, considering no studies have demonstrated effective therapies using cryo-preserved cord tissue.
Your mileage may vary.
Enjoy the adventure with the new one.
If the Government becomes a lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for law;
The cord blood banking industry is right on the border between speculative medicine and outright scam. It's insanely profitable, which is why every doctor's office is littered with pamphlets for competing cord blood banks.
There's a vanishingly small likelihood that your child will have some otherwise untreatable disease that the cord blood will help with. Most of the things they say cord blood can help with (like genetic defects) actually wont help your child, since the cord blood has the same faulty genetics. The banks also tout the potential for cord blood use in future therapies. However, it's likely that any treatment that uses cord blood would be just as effective using stem cells.
So what are you banking, in this case? I have no idea. The cord blood might be helpful for your next child, I guess.
Another thing to keep in mind is in order to harvest the cord blood, you have to cut the cord before it stops pulsating (that is, before all the blood in the cord has reached the baby). There's a growing body of evidence that your baby benefits from this blood, and the cord should be left intact. So banking your baby's cord blood may actually harm your child. Of course, whatever the effect it's unlikely life threatening, but it does seem unnecessary.
It breaks my pluginses, my precious!
Seriously WTF!?!?!?
I've gone through the birth of all five of my children and I've never contemplated anything close to this. Once I pay the hospital bill the birth process is over.. Next!
Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"
Is this a thing now?...
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is kinky.
do NOT click that link.. some things you can't un-see. ... :( you've been warned.
Contender for http://first-world-problems.com
... for both our kids. We decided to 'donate' the cord blood (was free, and then you get 'preferential' access later if you happen to need some from the 'bank' later).
Turns out our kids were both born on Sunday evenings, and they do not collect blood on Sundays.....
Now I read all sorts of things about keeping the umbilical cord 'whole' for longer helps with anaemia... i.e. letting the cord 'drain' for longer is better for the baby. There's debate about how long the draining should take, but, it precludes the donation of the core blood.
If I were to be doing it again (and I'm not planning to...), I would talk with the O/B and delay the cutting of the cord for a few more minutes, and then forgo the donation of the blood entirely.
The prospects of tangible short-term benefits far outweighs the unlikely need for obscure treatments at some uncertain point in the future from some company that may or may not be around when you need them, and they may or may not have destroyed your tissues anyway, for a condition that may (at that time) be curable without cord blood anyway.
gus
.. if only.
You have children pretty often, don't you?
We looked into this for our first kid. My wife is an anesthesiologist so has some idea about this. What we found (at least for Australia in 2006) was: - a public bank service is better than storing an individual's blood. Stem cells are exciting medically because they don't have the same sorts of matching requirements that blood and organs do - there were trust issues withe private operators
Take the money you would have spent on this and putit into a college fund. Odds of seeing a return on your investment are much greater.
So if your hypothetical supermodel girlfriend does play Battlefield 3 with you, who "OWNS" who?
My non-hypothetical non-supermodel wife is a descent player of Ultimate Mortal Kombat. Though I do think Sonya's leg grab is ultra cheesy!
I only look human.
My mother is a halfling and my dad is an ogre, so that makes me an Ogreling
they can't think of better things to do with it
$269/yr, though that may have gone up for newer subscribers. (http://www.corcell.com/)
Seriously, donate it to your own child at their birth. Read up on the benefits of delayed cord clamping. The only situation that I've heard of where it's not worth it is where an emergency arises during the birth that requires the child and mother be seperated ASAP to safe a life. The umbilical cord and placenta contain a significant amount of blood which is the childs. Clamping and severing the cord immediately can basically make the child anemic right off the bat. It only takes a few minutes for the cord to finish transfering that blood to the child, so give it some time. It may also be possible to still harvest the cord for storage or donation but I'm not sure.
Anyways google "delayed umbilical cord clamping"
When a baby is born, blood continues to flow through the cord for a while giving the baby much needed nutrients. It is common practice for midwifes. Baby comes out, goes straight to mama's bare chest for skin-to-skin heat transfer and up-close pheromones (leaving the naturally protective goo). In a minute or so the chord goes from bright full-of-blood colored to dull gray and empty and it no longer pulses. Clamp and cut the chord then. We did this with our now 7 month old, she was back up to birth weight at the three day check up.
Donate it to a public bank which should be free for you and offers the best chance for the cord blood to help someone. When we asked a doctor what to do when having our first child, she explained that donating to a public bank is the best option. The thing that most people don't realize about saving cord blood in a private bank for your own use is that if your child does happen to come down with the type of disease (e.g. leukemia) that requires stem cell treatment, it is highly unlikely that doctors would ever use the child's own cord blood because the child's stem cells already led to a case of leukemia and so there's no way they want to inject those (potentially) flawed stem cells again.
My wife and I got a bunch of that crap when we had our kids. We didn't know what to make of it so we asked her OBGYN and basically got that they were all scams as there aren't treatments that have been developed that use it and the chances that your child might benefit from any treatment developed using it are slim to none (another poster mentioned that you would be better off buying lottery tickets with that money and giving them to the child). Also as another poster mentioned it is amazing how many pamphlets are in a doctors office, I figure that the companies pay to put them there as a form advertising. If you still feel the need to have it collected donate it to research as there it stands a better chance of doing some good.
Time to offend someone
My wife and I have decided to donate the cord blood twice with our local donation agency. Before choosing whether to donate or bank we spoke with the resident expert and nationally recognized hematologist at well respected children's hospital where my wife's brother was undergoing leukemia treatments. After speaking with him and understanding all of the pluses and minuses of banking and to some degree how even banking cord blood may not be as good as advertised due to the small amounts banked, we decided to donate it to those that need it immediately. Understanding the need for cord blood in the hospitals now versus a potential if remote need in the future was the way we went.
You know you just made me and everyone else want to click that link even more, right? Even thought I know I will regret it.
OK well that was not nearly that bad, probably fake.... But you never know.
OK looked it up and it is done by some artist, sounds like to protest abortions and does not use real human flesh.
Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
This is kinda intriguing to me. I wonder where the technology is going to be in the next 5 years.
Also there are a lot of claims being made on this tread that are in favor, against, and for alternatives. I really think that we need to be posting links not only to educate ourselves and others but also to help our future parents make the proper choice for their child and their family.
Me--two kids, 4 & 7. I had to deliver my daughter on the kitchen floor, but that's a story for a different day.
If you do the delivery properly (with a midwife not a doctor--pregnancy isn't an illness) after the baby is born, you wait a few minutes before cutting the cord. And if you do that the blood ends up in the baby, WHERE IT'S SUPPOSED TO GO.
Why do I feel like I get better medical advice from Slashdotters than from my own medical network? For my two children, we were bombarded with sales pitches for private cord blood banks, but were never informed of options to donate or of the option to let the cord "drain". Cost/Benefit on the private banks was ridiculous, so our nectar of life just ended up in the bin.
Here's a reference:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22089242
search for "umbilical anaemia"
.. if only.
What they won't tell you is that the amount of blood you get in this coord is only sufficient for a maximum weight of your child of about 1.5Kg so keeping this insufficient amount of blood for your child of 15 years old is totally useless...
Also, at least here in Canada, hospitals do not use privante banks, as standards can vary and they only trust public banks... so even if you did have some usable blood they won't use it!
Also, there's only a 25% chance that the rest of your childrens/family may be compatible...
And do not forget that must of the "cures" detailed in their publicity is mainly science fiction!
Also, internationally there's no shortage of this kind of blood it's easy to find compatible donors in public banks around the world...
So don't go and buy a 15 year contract for unusable blood !
Sources : (in French) http://www.radio-canada.ca/emissions/la_facture/2011-2012/Reportage.asp?idDoc=208988
yeah, i was aware that it may entice some more... but i figured better people were warned, rather than blindly clicking like i did. good to know it is fake. still disgusting.
A view from the other side of the fence: http://midwifethinking.com/2011/02/10/cord-blood-collection-confessions-of-a-vampire-midwife/ Basically, the opposing argument is that newborns need their blood. Wait a few minutes to let them get it all. Many companies market many things to new parents... cord blood saving may be little more than that.
The current wisdom is to wait until the cord stops pulsing (that is, is no longer connected to the baby's or the mother's blood supply) before clamping and cutting. It seems to make sense - the pulsing indicates that it's "in use".
Frankly, the whole cord blood seems like a scam to me. It doesn't do any good at the moment, and any suggestions that it eventually will are hand-wavey at best. Add in the large ongoing costs (and substantially larger initial costs), and the implied emotional argument of "you're bad parents if you don't do this" and it seems like Homer's "happy dude" scam. Pay a truckload of money, get essentially nothing in return, and be assured by some company that gladly took that money that it makes you better.
I have developed a truly marvelous proof of this comment, which this signature is too narrow to contain.
I didn't check the link myself. But there is actually a practice that some women do where they consume the placenta. Usually it's dried out and then ground up into a powder and mixed into a beverage or something. The idea being that it's got a lot of nutrients such as vitamins in it and usually a mother who gave birth recently is in short supply of those vitamins.
...to steal our precious bodily fluids!
There is zero solid evidence that stored cord blood is useful for anything now. It is a waste of money to store.
Could it be of use in the future? Doubtful - any kind of real stem cell treatments are 10-20 years away, and they will likely have solved most of the IPS issues by then so your skin cells might be as useful as cord blood stem cells.
I didn't check the link myself. But there is actually a practice that some women do where they consume the placenta. Usually it's dried out and then ground up into a powder and mixed into a beverage or something. The idea being that it's got a lot of nutrients such as vitamins in it and usually a mother who gave birth recently is in short supply of those vitamins.
I feel this is proof of Intelligent Design. Childbirth is a very strenuous affair; the mother is completely exhausted at the end. God knows this and provided the mother with a uterine vag-steak vending machine for an immediate, revitalizing treat!
There is no evidence that cord blood does anything....However, medicine moves fast, as does technology.
We did this with our first child, and the second is due in 7 months. It's cheap insurance and even though nothing is proven...yet, can you even imagine where technology and medicine will be in 20 years?
It's relatively cheap insurance so do it.
Another point to consider is the health benefits of leaving the cord attached longer, and not taking the blood. From http://parentingsquad.com/when-to-cut-the-umbilical-cord:
In a recent article in the Journal of Cellular and Molecular Medicine, experts are suggesting that leaving the cord intact for a longer period would allow more of the umbilical cord blood to flow to the child and may have significant health benefits. The cord blood transports nutrients, oxygen and stem cells to the baby.
So, you need to balance the positives and negatives of letting your child get the benefits now, banking them for potential use later, or donating the blood. There are good arguments for any choice.
There certainly are a lot of "internet experts" who pop up on here with their cheap opinions. There are others on here who don't need to make the choice between saving for our children's education and paying for blood banking, and have no use for lottery tickets. As parents, the choice of how to best raise your child is yours.
. . .did a story on cord blood banks a couple of years ago. Basically, it's expensive and the odds that it will be used are extremely low. Methinks companies are preying on parents' fears.
Read this and watch this.
What the hell happened to taking a multivitamin? Seems much better than a placenta smoothie.
Who needs to worry about storage when it tastes that good?
We donated the cord blood from both our kids.
When your kid has a 1 in 400 chance of needing it themselves even ONCE in their entire lifetime...well, I'd rather help someone in need.
With the first link, the chain is forged.
When my wife and I were looking for cord blood bank, we found that our OBGYN had a $500 rebate for ViaCord. Ask around!
I does not have any experience or suggestions on this topic.
"We shall grapple with the ineffable, and see if we may not eff it after all." - Douglas Adams
for #1, it wasn't widely available. For our second kid, it was something like NeoCells/Viacord...I think they were involved in a merger at some point. Anyways, you are buying insurance...so make sure the company is legitimate. Cheap, but too cheap is a warning sign. Pay special attention to the intake procedures, the more expensive ones are more full service, so make sure you do your homework if you're taking on more of the processing. If you happen to have a local bank, you can save a bit on courier fees.
When doing cost comparisons, the storage costs are key...see what kind of discounts exist for paying larger terms.
For our 3rd kid, we will likely just donate the cord blood.
My wife and I went to a birthing center for our last two boys and received information on letting the cord finish pulsating before the cord is cut. Basically the logic is if you're cutting the cord early your depriving your baby of the blood they need to live and breathe when they are first born. I'd rather they get all their blood now so they can be healthy later, not have their body fight for a bit while they regain the blood they lost from the transfer.
http://www.gentlebirth.org/archives/cordNFM.html
My wife and I asked our Ob/Gyn and pediatrician about this before the birth of our second child, and both of them said that doing so was a waste of time and money. The cord blood is only good for specific genetic conditions that occur in one out of a hundred thousand live births, while most medical conditions that may occur would be treated without the need for cord blood.
Finally the doctors said that banks play on your emotions as new parents. They said that donating the cord blood would be nice, but a lot of hospitals dont want to deal with the bother and administrative hassle of collecting and shipping.
Ultimately I'd ask your doctors about it and see if they recommend it, but most likely you are just going to be wasting money.
Seriously. It is called "delayed cord clamping", and there is a wealth of research about the benefits to your child. Basically, you wait until the cord stops throbbing to cut it (about two minutes), and all of that blood gets pumped into your child. Your kid ends up with more iron, minerals, and everything else that sits in your blood. It reduces risk of anemia, sepsis, hemorrhages, etc. The downside is that your OB will have to stick around for a couple more minutes than he wants to. Based on the science, it is a no-brainer, and OB's don't do it essentially out of habit. Based on intuition, /it is your baby's blood/, why wouldn't you want it inside your baby?
Do your research on this. It is cheaper than banking blood, and safer to boot. As one doctor puts it, "if I wouldn't drain 10cc's of blood out of a baby for no reason, why would I clamp the cord early?"
The Academic OB/GYN has a nice summary and list of links to research.
You still should donate. The cord blood is a very precious resource for researchers. And it is very unlikely that delaying the cutting of the cord will make any measurable difference.
mother cats eat it raw (no thumbs to work a blender).
insensitive clod overlords obligatory xkcd car analogy russian reversals whoosh pedant fanbois ftfy in 3...2...1..PROFIT
How is it better? It is or course technically better to just eat the vitamin rich placenta since it is free and would just be wasted if you threw it away.
Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
We did this for all 3 of our kids. Here in New York it is free to donate and store, if you or someone else needs them, the cells are available. I have no desire to enrich the private banks.
Reminds me of this mime: http://troll.me/2011/06/24/futurama-fry/not-sure-if-serious-or-trolling/.
Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
What an unusual keepsake! I think for my first child I might bribe the doctor into having me keep the uncleaned vag-tongs!
you have to cut the cord before it stops pulsating (that is, before all the blood in the cord has reached the baby). There's a growing body of evidence that your baby benefits from this blood, and the cord should be left intact.
Dumping all that blood into the kid also increases the risk of jaundice. Untreated jaundice = brain damage.
With the first link, the chain is forged.
just buy a minus 80C freezer and store it yourself, that's literally all it is. Also, you can use the minus 80 to store meat and flash freeze beer. I know personally that is what professors in academia do, except they leave it in their lab next to other frozen chemicals, instead of at home in the garage.
Now I read all sorts of things about keeping the umbilical cord 'whole' for longer helps with anaemia... i.e. letting the cord 'drain' for longer is better for the baby
Unless you suspect the baby will be anemic, I'd recommend against draining all that blood into baby. Increases the risk of jaundice! Jaundice, if not detected/treated, = brain damage.
With the first link, the chain is forged.
Really jumped the gun on the /. April Fools day posts.
I figured "uterine vag-steak vendine machine" gives it away as an intentionally silly post.
Just calm down, wait an extra minute, and your newborn will get those stem cells that mother nature intended. The cord will empty it'self it you just give it some time.
Except that multi-vitamins can be over-dosed on and the amount of said vitamins actually being used by your system is questionable. Always better to get your vitamins and nutrients from natural sources.... though I'd hesitate to try placenta anything, though all other animals seem to eat it.
Don't complain about syntax, grammar, or spelling. There is no.hell like input on android.
Having looked into it several times (2 kids) we have decided that it is simply to expensive to store our own. Donating works well though. Often times the donation centres keep your name on a list so that you have priority for the future as well.
Also, be aware that while storing the cord blood is useful, actually allowing the blood to completely go to the baby is even better. All the blood in the cord / placenta is the baby's blood. By depriving it of that blood, that can put them down a lot of iron. Often letting the blood pump for 10 minutes after birth before clamping is sufficient (our doctor in Canada says the standard here is 1.5 - 2 minutes now but the parents can ask for more). Many mid-wives will actually let the placenta "birth" before clamping to be sure the baby gets all of its own blood.
My wife ate the placenta in pill form and it helped in numerous ways. Totally removed the baby blues.
And my dog eats its own shit, that doesn't make it a good idea.
It's good to know that "natural" sources can't result in an overdose.
Put the cord in a nice pit with some lye and bury it for a while, then slow steam cook. It's delicious.
Others prefer their cords tartare but not for me! Storing works best!
-- Political fascism requires a Fuhrer.
He needs all the help he can get.
In the future always avoid marriage and what ever you do don't have kids. I know this may sound wrong to you now but a few years of having a family will change your mind forever.
I think that the kid of a parent who goes to Slashdot for this kind of information is doomed.
As a new parent, you are going to be barraged with a constant stream of "you're doing it wrong" messages. Advertising leverages your anxiety to sell you things, and new parents are a goldmine of anxiety. "Wouldn't you do everything possible for your baby?" is a hard sales pitch to decline...nobody wants to be the materialistic asshole who values money over a safety net, even for a very extreme edge case. But it's still a sales pitch for something not worth the price. If you donate, maybe you will still be able use it, or maybe the person who did use it will pull your kid out from in front of a truck some day. You can't make yourself responsible for every future contingency.
Unless you have unlimited funds, there are better things to spend your money on. And if you do have unlimited funds, hire someone to figure it out for you.
The best thing you can do right now is get used to the ideas of gray areas and imperfect decisions. You have several thousand more to make in the next year or two.
The cord keeps pulsing for a reason after birth....give your baby a chance to keep ALL of his or her own blood.
I could google anything and come up with whatever answer I want to hear. Babies can become jaundiced whether you delay cord clamping or not. All of our children were mildly jaundiced; it's common and generally not a big problem. We delayed clamping with our last child, but his jaundice was no worse than that of the others. Anecdotal I know, but he was the healthiest baby of them right off the bat.
Here is the specific question to ask private banks.
Is there any instance in which a person, as a newborn, had cord blood stored, and then used their own cord blood later in life?
When our kids were newborns, the answer was "no"; I would assume it is still "no". I believe there do exist cases in which kid #1 needed their parents to conceive and give birth to kid #2 so that kid #2's cord blood could be used for kid #1, but that's an entirely different matter.
I know that you may be thinking "I can afford the hundreds of dollars, and it's worth it for the infinitesimal chance that it could help our child"... but the logic breaks down when you consider other things you can use that money for that are much more likely to help your child.
As someone who is having his first child in just over one month, I have very recently been looking at these options and have chosen a public bank. For the question of Public vs. Private vs. nothing, I think other slashdotters have covered it. Private is expensive and it's unlikely you'll need it. Public can do help for someone right now. Doing nothing is just throwing a promising resource in the trash. That's just my two cents about that. So let's say you have chosen the Public option. Well, here is where Slashdot is not well suited. You should be talking to both the hospital you plan to deliver at and your OB. I'm sure your OB has already given you all of the pamphlets, so you have an idea of what companies do what. If not, ask for them. Then talk to your hospital about which banks they work with. Depending on where the hospital is, what health system it's part of, etc. will determine which banks are available to you. This should narrow your list considerably. Then cross-reference the hospital's list with your OB's. Some OB's will charge for the collection, even for donations. Again, ask your OB if there is any charge for donations. I would be surprised if after talking to the hospital and your OB if you would even have a choice of which bank to use, so don't waste your time agonising over which bank is best.
"It's not whether you win or lose, it's how drunk you get." -- H. J. Simpson
Hint: There were no multivitamins thousands of years ago, when this practice originated.
With the first link, the chain is forged.
How about fucking stop making babies already. Jesus. Didn't you notice how the plant's overpopulated? Fucking dolt.
Freezing cells can cause the water inside to expand and rupture the cell walls destroying the cell completely. Isn't there a reason donated blood is only kept for 3 months before it is thrown away?
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Windows 10 is great - I used it to download Linux.
Our first child was born with Down syndrome and leukemia, unbeknownst to us until he was born. We store his cord blood with Cryo-cell - paid the upfront costs, OB collection fee and yearly storage fees. As a result of that experience, our second child's cord blood is being stored for us, in the event that our son should need it, with ViaCord - they took care of all fees. I like both companies. They were both professional and easy to deal with. Our good friends also use Cryo-cell. It's like buying insurance - you buy it and hope you never need it. I wish you the best of luck.
I think once you have a child you will find storing cord blood to be very low on your list of priorities - if you don't believe me now...you will - best of luck
Do a little research, the whole thing is a scam.
Totally useless.
You'll be paying for years and what you keep is totally unusable.
Gonna gimme a cord of blood?
"Does you have ..."
Abort now.
Google "Jaundice", which can be a result of dumping too much blood into the kid.
That's the carp you hear from doctors who are unwilling to change the way they have always done things..
It's just that there is no study showing that. On the contrary. While there is no significant increase of jaundice, delayed clamping might lead to healthier babies a few months later and might give the baby a boost right after birth.
The effect of timing of cord clamping on neonatal venous hematocrit values and clinical outcome at term: a randomized, controlled trial.
Delayed Cord Clamping in Very Preterm Infants Reduces the Incidence of Intraventricular Hemorrhage and Late-Onset Sepsis: A Randomized, Controlled Trial
Late vs Early Clamping of the Umbilical Cord in Full-term Neonates
My suggestion:
read up on delayed cord clamping (decent sources, like parent-to-be-books from your local library written by MDs and maybe medical journals) and include it in your birth plan. With the money saved from cord blood banking buy something like this binary Infant Bodysuit
What's proven by many studies, however, is the beneficial effect on the immune system of keeping the umbilical connected and free of clamps for several minutes after birth.
To all those "citation needed" nazis: You must be new here. The effect had been the topic of at least one news item here before.
You know it's time for the next revolution when your rulers' names end with roman numerals.
My wife did the research and our twins cord blood is stored in some desert facility (the country's largest cord blood registry) until the twins hit age 18. All I know is I wrote the check for $8,000 USD at the time of birth. Peace of mind is how my wife sold it to me as. Also, the idea that by the time our kids reach age 18, they may have some pretty neat things figured out in the science world on how to use cord blood. Cyborg jet packs???
It turns out that banking cord blood is really expensive, and you'll almost certainly never need it. We decided it wasn't worth it and donated the blood.
I think that it's a step forward, to preserve the umbilical tissue for the future. I would definitely use a public bank, as it's unlikely to ever go bankrupt, shut down or be maintained in a dubious manner. What really fascinated me, however, is the thought of a future where all living humans have in their own possession their umbilical cord, if they ever need replacement tissue ... much like a key to their own genesis. I find the practice quite enlightened (even if the real world representation may leave to be desired) and I would be quite interested in the psychological and developmental impacts of knowing that somewhere, the matrix to your spare parts exists.
Of course, you, as a parent, may fuck it all up but I know that I would find a lot of comfort, even in adult age and likely throughout my life and even beyond my parent's death, in knowing that my makers didn't break my mold and left me my blueprints.
If money's not a scare resource...as it isn't for many of us in the engineering/IT world...I can't see why I wouldn't pay a few hundred or a few thousand dollars to do something that has a small chance of being a life saver.
My God can beat up your God. Just kidding...don't take offense. I know there's no God.
Exactly.
And this is why GP should eat some more dog liver and kidneys.
Hint: there was no SCIENCE thousands of years ago.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
My wife preforms placenta encapsulation as a service. Her business has steadily increased over the past year and she is doing 3-6 per month now.
We did that for the first few years but then had them destroy it as the use is very limited and only good for certain things. Still, small price to pay to have another protection for your child even if the use is limited. Never know what the future brings. It's really just like anything else...insurance that you hope you never need. Cheers.
To make a special occasion, a real special occasion. Stretch it to feed the whole family.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
The cord blood racket is a joke. The current stem cell research already allows scientists to either revert your differentiated cells into stem cells - or to harvest and propagate native stem cells. People are spending abhorrent amount of money on an unproven storage technology that is unlikely to be useful.
That study show they there really isn't a difference.
I mean,. then numbers are far to low to rule out 'noise'.
They do warrant further study on a larger population. Say 10 groups of 500, each in a different population.
Although I am pleased to see people looking at actual studies.
Just to be clear: Just because a study is on PubMed doesn't make it a good one.
Likelihood is high, but hardly perfect.
My opinion, and it's just that an opinion, is that with further study we will see a slight difference depending on diet and iron the the population being studied.
The only dog I have in this show is the desire for good solid data, and people making decision have access to good data.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
That's not a theory. It's a wild ass guess based on the naturalistic fallacy.
The current data shows this:
Late clamping (>60 seconds) increase iron but also increase jaundice risk.
SO, if you are iron poor, then late clamping may be worth the jaundice risk.
If you are not iron poor, then late clamping has no gain and still carries the jaundice risk.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18591323
That is a cochrane review. Since it is a review of the literature, it is a good place to start. Reviews aren't always the best place to make policy from. Depending on method a size of available data to review.
oh, and while people relate jaundice to 'just yellow skin' it can actual cause liver and brain problems.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Do not pay to store your own cord blood:
1) You cannot use your own stem cells any current stem cell therapies. If you have a genetic condition that can be solved with stem cells, you must use cells that do not have the condition. But someone else could use them. It is more likely that you will use someone else's stem cells. The only reason to use your own is in the theoretical future where you can regrow an organ.
2) It is more likely that someone else will need those stem cells. Paying to have it held for you denies someone else a potentially lifesaving therapy. Imagine paying a company to store your own blood in case you needed it after an accident/surgery. Better to bank it for anyone to use.
3) Donating the cord blood for anyone to use is free.
4) Many of the companies that offer umbilical cord blood banking prey on people's fears and operate in unethical ways. Organizations such as the American Academy of Pediatrics have called-out specific companies for questionable behavior.
Many hospitals and birthing centers promote cord blood banking because they are convinced by salespeople that it is a smart thing to do. But they often don't know much about it. Do some reading on this before making a decision. Often times doctors give advice about medical treatments that they are not trained on. (Ex: Don't ask an OB/GYN about stem cell procedures any more than you would ask a licensed electrician about a plumbing problem, or a criminal lawyer about copyright law.)
Start with the Wikipedia article:
in the fridge in an old catchup bottle. But I make sure to cross out catchup with a sharpie and write cord blood on there, every since my husband's incident after our first baby...
Get some DMSO and some liquid nitrogen and do it yourself.
OUCH I clicked it.... should have listened to your warning...
This is a UDP joke, I don't care if you get it or not...
stolen from rotten.com from years and years ago. fail.
Sure there was, it just wasn't formalized. It was more Thag trying different things and discarding the ideas that failed, or people learning not to eat toadstools the hard way.
Hail Eris, full of mischief...
E pluribus sanguinem
I have a 1-year-old son and when my wife was pregnant we attended some lunch for expecting parents, where we were given some useful information and then they tried to sell us this service.
You should realize that this is the moment in your life where you are the least likely to be able to make a cool-headed decision that involves risk-benefit analysis. The people trying to sell you this service are fully aware of this fact and are exploiting it. The best you can do is defer the decision to experts, and the medical community doesn't support private cord blood banking.
We decided to donate it to a public bank (which doctors generally do support), but then we found out that no public bank covers our area.
Wow, did you really have to post that several times? What's in it for you? Instead of scaremongering, what's the risk? Our son stayed attached to the placenta until it became detached naturally. Look up "Lotus Birth". As for jaundice: sun light. I really don't understand the turning birth into a medical circus. My wife is still breast feeding our son (will turn 2 years old, soon). Something that's not considered weird in Mexico (were we live). Our daughter was breast fed until recently (she'll turn 5 soon). Again, this would make us "freaks" in quite some so called "civilized countries". Children sleep with us in one bed (look up family bed). Much easier to nurse the children and they sleep much, much better. Or as I read once on a site (paraphrased, can't recall the exact words): why carry a child inside you for months only to put it away from your body after birth (in its own bed, in its own room). The latter is even something that's recent. Not that long ago the "family bed" was considered normal (here in Mexico it still is).
Perl Programmer for hire
The law requires doctors to tell you about this "option". Most of them think its a scam. Public banking (donor system) is plausible; but unless you have a family history of one of a few rare diseases, the state lottery is probably a better investment. We didn't bank our kids' blood because the public system was already at capacity... Apparently, there isn't much demand there, either.
Back, bottom of the fridge, away from the vodka.
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
What? He said "store"...
Well, they're more easily processed and disposed of and you'd have to have a very large stomach and eat all day long.
Don't complain about syntax, grammar, or spelling. There is no.hell like input on android.
The probability that one will need stem cells from cord blood is very low. Most of the treatment methods are highly experimental and applicable only to a handful of groups. Most of these conditions are identifiable during genetic tests and screening during pregnancy.
At least some of the public blood banks which collect cord blood promise that if you donate cord blood and in future a need arises they will try to locate cord blood which will match the donor (or try to give the donated blood if it is still available). Try to locate a public blood bank which operates like that.
It's important to delay clamping and let the umbilical cord blood go into your newborn! Your child will be healthier. It's what nature intended!
There's a lot of new evidence to support this like this NYtimes article: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/29/health/research/delay-in-clamping-umbilical-cord-has-benefits-months-later.html?_r=1
Recently a consumer interest show in Quebec did a report on private cord banks.
One of the big sticking point is that the window of actual usefulness is relatively short as there is only a small quantity of stem cells available, and usually once someone is over 50kg there is not enough stem cells for treatment.
Here is the link in french
http://www.radio-canada.ca/emissions/la_facture/2011-2012/Reportage.asp?idDoc=208988
Store it in a #2 mayonnaise jar on Funk and Wagnall's porch.
We only did it for our first child as I didn't see enough benefits (and we couldn't offset the cost) when we had our second child.
But we used http://www.cryosite.com/ (yeah its Australian)
The (now Danish??) Princess used them for her children as well... if that means anything to you.
One thing to remember, a Public storage means you have ZERO guarantee of getting YOUR bloody back when you request it...
"Consider how lucky you are that life has been good to you so far. Alternatively, if life hasn't been good to you so far
IMO, you'd probably be wasting your money.
First, the chance that you'll ever need a genetic therapy is small.
Second, the science of making stem cells out of adult somatic cells is advancing, so most likely, if sombody who's a baby now ever needs gene therapy, they will probably be able to do it with stem cells from the adult patient.
source: http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/117/4/e779
For our son we picked "Lotus Birth": don't cut the cord at all but keep the child + placenta together for the time it takes. As for jaundice: it's common (as far as I know) for children to be a little "yellow" after birth. Exposure to a little sun light helps to break this down. Don't let your personal experience cloud your judgement, nor don't Google selectively.
Also, co-sleeping is not as deadly as you tried to make out in your other reply: SIDS happens as often in a cot, and I don't see you panic about a cot. Also, don't mistake co-sleeping for falling drunk or drugged in bed on top of your child, or sleeping on the sofa. See also: http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/oct/16/sudden-infant-death-syndrome-children?INTCMP=SRCH
Perl Programmer for hire
They have already been collecting our blood for over 35yrs now through UN directives to most countries. Most of our DNA is already patented and how do you think they got all that DNA? They stole it from you at birth when your parents thought they were sending it away to a state lab for testing. Google: US government storing baby blood. Some combo of that. Youll read many articles about how they stole it and stored it to this day and use it for medical and military research. Now they made it a law a few years ago mandateing that your babies blood is owned by the government and you get no say in it. Check out the links and see for yourself. They have sources and isnt a joke. We are on our second and will be home birthing. As for money spent storing U-cord, spend it on college fund or something to better you life now.
http://www.naturalnews.com/032972_vaccinations_DNA_harvesting.html
http://futurestorm.blogspot.com/2008/12/us-government-can-now-legally-take-your.html
Think this is crazy should read what theyve been doing for years without your consent. In Texas they got sued for not only storing your childs blood but sending it to Armed Forces DNA database. This happens in every state now and from every child in every hospital now due to a little known law passed during bush years. They take blood from the child at birth and dont need your consent supposedly. I find that egregious and you can only guess what they are doing with the DNA database Bioweapons? Who knows but its been admitted they can make a virus for you and anyone with similar DNA strands they are targeting. Complete violations by everyone at the top of society. search: Texas Tribune DNA Sample FEDS
http://www.texastribune.org/texas-state-agencies/department-of-state-health-services/dshs-turned-over-hundreds-of-dna-samples-to-feds/
I think I'd bank my future children's cord blood, since I personally have the capacity to do so, but if I had to put $$$ on the line I don't see the point. Cord blood stem cells are not some multi-purpose cure all. About the only thing they'll be useful for in the near term (10+ years) is repopulating your child's hematopoietic system in the event that your child gets leukemia, and has his/her haematoetic system irradiated to wipe out the cancer. The problem is, a single cord is not enough to repopulate, so you'll have to wait for cord blood expansion methods to get FDA approval. Despite massive pharma interest, the best methods for doing this are still preclinical (http://www.sciencemag.org/content/329/5997/1345.short). Unless you have money to burn, donate to a public cord blod bank and save your cash.
We went through all the pros and cons of storing cord blood when our kids were born. Finally we decided against it. It looked too much like a rip-off. We felt that the companies that offered services make a big business out of people's fears. IIRC, it's highly unlikely that your kid will be in a condition to benefit from its stem cells. There was no public service at that time in Germany or I would have considered donating it.
Say out loud: I'm an Aspie and I'm somewhat proud, I guess. Uh. Can I write an email in all caps instead? Hm...
Fuck off, faggot. Nobody appointed you as chief netcop.
P.S. Sentences start with a capital letter.
You remind me of this one.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
So what's the easy way to eat toadstools?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
What do you think monkeys in the wild do? When humans d it, we call it "lotus birthing". Look it up. At birth, the placenta contains roughly a third of the baby's total blood, and for some reason (no medical reason other than tradition) we cut it off. The placenta falls off by itself reasonably quickly, after it has finished transferring its blood to the baby.
Don't!
Hail Eris, full of mischief...
E pluribus sanguinem
In Belgium we have a system of donating umbilical cord blood.
This has the advantage of the simple fact that it is massively donated, screened and used.
1) first baby not nearly enough blood was taken for valid donation
2) next baby umbilical cord around neck so cord was cut with scissors in split second - blood splattering up the ceiling among splattering on other errr... things
3) third baby again not enough blood for valid donation
Just mentioning this to tune your expectations.
"My wife and I are expecting our first child in 3 months..."
That seems like an awfully short gestation period to me.
We use CorCell. It's been 8 years since my son was born, and no longer remember what the initial costs were, but I think my insurance covered part of it.
We pay $95 per year for storage, and by contract their price will not increase for life. Looks like the store cost has increase to $125 a year.
Hi, Interestingly, there was an investigation about those banks in canada recently and here are the results : 1 - The blood quantity that are saved in private banks would save a child up to 10 kilograms (about 20-25 pounds), so, a child of about 18months. So it's totally useless to pre-pay for years. 2 - Public banks have HIGH conservation standards, lot higher than private banks.The problem with private banks is that you never know if it's a good one or a bad one. public banks have all the same quality standards. plus, most hospitals NEVER take blood from private banks because of random quality standards. if you can understand french, here is the investigation : http://www.radio-canada.ca/emissions/la_facture/2011-2012/Reportage.asp?idDoc=208988
Sure are a lot of Dr. Nick Quacks posting in on this as if they KNOW cellular destruction in 2 years is somehow imminent.
My sister had Lymphoma, My father died of Leukemia and there are known therapies (efficacy to be proven) out there that somehow can create a treatment from the cells. I don't claim to know enough of what those are, you won't see me even attempt such.
If there's -any- chance I don't have watch my child go through that it's worth the $5k.
Understand you are taking the following risks:
1. You may go through this and end up with an unusable sample.
2. The empirical data on treatments derived from this science is in it's infancy.
3. People might think you're a nutjob.
The current aggressive negative attitude in this thread is unsettling. Clearly people posting things along those lines haven't seen their family members take their last breath from a disease that cord blood / tissue may (or may not) fix.
I will spend far more money in my lifetime on computer components than this gamble.
*note* I only feed the trolls once per day and this is it.
It is probably more helpful to the baby if you let him or her have all of its blood after it's born. Some hopefully helpful info for you and your wife (and congratulations): http://midwifethinking.com/2011/02/10/cord-blood-collection-confessions-of-a-vampire-midwife/ http://thenonconformistmom.blogspot.com/2011/07/delayed-cord-clamping-whats-that.html
Should have done what we did - have identical twins.
I have heard it said that there are registries out there who will accept your donation and, if down the road your child may need it, will provide it back to you if it has not already been used (probably for a fee at that point would be my guess). Might be worth investigating donation policies.
I heart anarcho-capitalism.
Live your life. Let your kids live their life. It may turn out to be a curse. If they have it, they may be able to make you live *Forever*. You wouldn't want that, would you? Be careful what you wish for. You may get it.
really? you do see the irony in your post, dont you? P.S. who gives a fuck - we're not writing to congress here. just asshats, like yourself.
I am always amazed that people technologically minded, and for this reason one would imagine, prone to use reason to reach important decisions, can fall so completely for something that is a scam the size of Vegas.
This reminds me of the furore about vaccination and autism "based" on what clearly was spurious evidence, and even giving some credence to the evidence, minuscule odds against.
People don't understand odds, probabilities and statistics, add to this a lack of understanding of basic epidemiological research, add mumbi jumbo that adds to precious little and you have a recipe for disaster.
Don't pay for this please. There is no science backing such choice, at the moment it is all wishful thinking,
IANAL but write like a drunk one.