Mercedes Can Now Update Car Software Remotely

MatthewVD writes "Our cars run millions of lines of code that need constant and, often, critical updates. Jim Motavalli writes that Mercedes-Benz's new mbrace2 'cloud infotainment system' has a secret capability: it can update software automatically and wirelessly. In a process called 'reflashing,' the Mercedes system turns on the car operating system (CU), downloads the new application, then cuts itself off. With companies like Fisker paying dearly for constant recalls for software problems, automakers will likely rush to embrace this technology. No more USBs in the dashboard!"

Comments

Secret capability?

[commlinx]

From the Mercedes site:

Remote Vehicle Diagnostics Beyond allowing you to perform a check of your vehicle's main systems remotely, mbrace2 technology can automatically alert both you and your authorized Mercedes-Benz dealer to potential issues before they become full-fledged problems. In addition, it enables your vehicle to receive software updates wirelessly through the mbrace2 network.

So while maybe undesirable, not sure it's 'secret'.

Re:Secret capability?

[erroneus]

If this were not the manufacturer of the car doing this, I might have thought the same thing you are thinking. But if people begin to get troubled with too much recommended maintenance, they will start to believe their cars are unreliable and will not buy another one... or at least not one that tells them things they don't want to know.

Re:Secret capability?

[Anonymous Coward]

Ever heard of "hyperlinks" Sherlock?

aka

Citation needed

Ever heard of "getting off your lazy fucking ass", Sherlock?

But since you've already proved yourself to be mentally challenged, I'll save you the "trouble".

Re:Secret capability?

[geekmux]

If this were not the manufacturer of the car doing this, I might have thought the same thing you are thinking. But if people begin to get troubled with too much recommended maintenance, they will start to believe their cars are unreliable and will not buy another one... or at least not one that tells them things they don't want to know.

Are you paying for "reliability" or "Government-regulated mandatory safety upgrades"?

"Repairs" can be spun many, many different ways...such as the difference between optional and mandatory types of insurance. People hate paying for either type of insurance, but don't see much of a choice when it's "mandatory". A "cost" turns into a "fee" if EVERY car owner is charged for it, so this is yet another vehicle to mandate mass fees, turning profits through "safety standards"(for both the auto industry and Government). But you somehow feel better about it, because your 37 air bags are all up to date with the latest software patch and ready to protect you (not that they didn't before).

Oh and your insurance company feels better too, because they got a piece of the profits as well by mandating that no car will be insured without an "active maintenance subscription". Oh yeah, you'll need auto anti-virus protection too.

(I mean seriously, what do you think auto and insurance lobbyists do all day?)

Re:Secret capability?

[pnewhook]

Given that most new cars have a period of maintenance factored in where the owner does not pay for warranty work (often 5 years), any warranty work performed like software updates simply come right off the companies bottom lin.e It only makes good business sense to make this as inexpensive as possible and if they can do updates remotely without actually going into the dealer then this is a huge cost savings for them and far more convenient to the owner.

Also, given how much of the safety systems on these high end Mercedes are under software control, I wouldn't be surprised if the lawyers are warning the company that if they do not do due diligence in rolling out safety related upgrades, then they may be liable for crashes related to the failing of this software. In such a case making sure the software updates are rolled out to as many people as possible as easily as possible would be a mandate of theirs.

Re:Secret capability?

[19thNervousBreakdown]

Haha what a douche! He totally had something he enjoyed but was a poor financial choice, and then when the time came to be responsible he got rid of it for a (presumably) more sensible ride! What a loser!

Also, lease? Eeeeew! Can you believe somebody would choose to pay less on a monthly basis when they don't plan to keep the car past the lease duration instead of paying more and then going through the risk and hassle of selling it? Man! I'm so much smarter being upside-down and paying gap insurance on my zero-down loan instead of leasing. Or, should I say, "low-classing". What am I, a drug dealer? Boy it's great being smug.

What a revolution

[Anonymous Coward]

Mercedes is now able to crash cars remotely.

Many possibilities

[Anonymous Coward]

This also means that hackers and government agencies can update the software automatically and wirelessly. Finally there is no more need for cutting the break cables.

Re:Many possibilities

[supersat]

I'm willing to bet it's far more likely that they'll need to patch security holes remotely than it is for the update mechanism itself to be exploited. That is, assuming they digitally sign the updates.

Re:Many possibilities

[arth1]

I'm willing to bet it's far more likely that they'll need to patch security holes remotely than it is for the update mechanism itself to be exploited. That is, assuming they digitally sign the updates.

So? Even a 1000:1 ratio would be unacceptable.

And if a lesson were to be learned from Playstation / XBox / DVD / Blu-Ray / iPhone, it's that as long as customers (and thus hackers) have access to the hardware, keeping things secret is a temporary reprieve at best.

Re:Many possibilities

[toastar]

What, you mean security through obscurity doesn't work?

Re:Many possibilities

[houghi]

I use security through less security. People are so trained that passwords are at least 6 characters long and often 8 that they will never try my SPACE as password.

Re:Many possibilities

[geekmux]

It's not a parking brake, never was. It's an emergency brake. I bet most people in the U.S. never bother setting it when the car is parked, heck, many of them I'm sure wouldn't know where it is or how to use it in an emergency. There's a "P" setting on the shifter, that's good enough :/

Oddly enough, the laws of inertia still exist in the Western Hemisphere, even including the United States!

(I hear there are hills too...)

Re:Many possibilities

[erroneus]

We ignore laws here... especially the government.

Re:Many possibilities

[JaredOfEuropa]

What P? My car, like most cars over here, has a shifter with settings labeled 1 through 5, and R. So yes, it's a parking brake.

Re:Many possibilities

[mapkinase]

I am tired of this standard banal instantly modded up response:

- Something is made easier
- Aha! Government all other evil guys will have easy access too!

Duh!

Re:Many possibilities

[LoRdTAW]

I know I'm feeding the trolls but:

It's not a parking brake, never was. It's an emergency brake.

If you have a stick shift (aka manual or standard) transmission, the emergency/parking brake lever is what you use to park your vehicle and as a backup mechanical brake if for some reason your normal hydraulic brakes completely fail. So yes it is a parking brake in addition to being a last resort mechanical brake. They are still present on all(?) automatic cars as a safety feature. Before the parking pawl it was the only way to park your vehicle so it has and always will be an emergency/parking brake. After a while it became commonplace to just call it a parking brake, maybe the word "emergency" made people feel uncomfortable. Who knows.

When automatic transmissions first came around, the "parking pawl" was not always present so a lever or handle was necessary to mechanically lock the vehicles brakes to prevent it from rolling, like a manual. Then the parking pawl was standardized (in the US around 1965) to give drivers a more safe and reliable parking mechanism. It can not be used as a brake mechanism, its a gear like ring on a splined shaft which when engaged, slides into a grooved recess of the transmission case. This locks the output shaft which in turn locks the entire drive line. Engaging that at highway speeds would mean catastrophic transmission and/or drive line failure.

I bet most people in the U.S. never bother setting it when the car is parked, heck, many of them I'm sure wouldn't know where it is or how to use it in an emergency. There's a "P" setting on the shifter, that's good enough :/

What was the point of making that statement? To be a snobby jerk off and put down Americans when ever you can? Is it fashionable where you come from? The parking pawl is more reliable than a mechanical cable activated parking brake. One the ring locks the drive shaft it is not rolling anywhere. A cable actuated emergency/parking brake can come out of adjustment and also suffer from a failed cable. It is not necessary to use on an automatic. I happen to use it on hills as a backup to prevent the weight of the vehicle from binding the parking pawl.

And an example: I purchased a forklift that weighed 8000 lbs. I hauled it on a 3000lb trailer and towed it with a ~6000 lb automatic vehicle. All together it weighed around 17,000 pounds or 7,700 kg. I stopped at a friends house and decided to stay the night, problem was his house was on a hill and I could not fit the rig into his driveway. I set the parking brake and tested to see if it would hold, it didn't. 7700kg on a steep hill was just too much for it, it crept forward little by little. I put the automatic transmission in park and it held perfectly.

Re:Many possibilities

[h4rr4r]

It's the emergency make the car smell bad lever.

Re:Many possibilities

[Joce640k]

Go ahead and try it next time you're cruising along. No, seriously. At best you'll get bad smell from the mechanism. It won't slow you down worth a damn.

While you're at it: Try stomping on the brakes when nobody else is around, just to see what happens. That way you'll know what to expect in a bad situation.

Stuff like this is called "learning to drive".

Re:Many possibilities

[thegarbz]

This locks the output shaft which in turn locks the entire drive line. Engaging that at highway speeds would mean catastrophic transmission and/or drive line failure.

Actually engaging it while in motion means catastrophic parking pawl failure. I've actually had this happen to me when slamming on the brake to avoid an accident in the making up ahead. A heavy metal pole in my car flew forward and jammed the transmission into park while doing about 60. End result is the little safety pin which requires you to press the button before changing between drive and reverse, and by extension into park is broken (yay quickshift), and I am now fully reliant on the parking brake when I'm on a hill as the parking pawl is toothless.

Bloody expensive part too. Fortunately not critical.

Re:Many possibilities

[LoRdTAW]

That is only useful for parking on a reasonably level surface. There was a time when big trucks had all mechanical diesel engines and drivers would practice this. And I have heard of more than a few trucks mysteriously starting themselves up and running away. Turns out the drivers never set any mechanical brake, did not leave the engine stop lever in the stop position (which cuts fuel) and parked on a slight incline or hill. The trucks weight would overcome the friction of the drive line, begin to roll and crank the engine causing it to fire up and run away.

I was victim to this thinking when I first started driving big trucks. It was an old GMC that had no clutch interlock and I had a bad habit of starting it from outside the truck while standing on the ground. Another driver was old-school and parked it using the gear lever, I never noticed it. It started and thankfully there was another vehicle parked next to it and the wheel was turned all the way to the right. It surged to the right and crashed into the vehicle next to it. It dented the fender and step, nothing major. If the wheel was pointed strait or in my direction the outcome would have been bad. I admit that I should have been in the cab, foot on the clutch and checked to see if the transmission was in gear. I just never expected the mechanical brake to be off and transmission in gear, it was a practice I was unaware of. Boss was pissed at me but even more pissed that someone left the truck in gear with no parking brake on. We both had our asses chewed. You learn from mistakes.

Using the gear lever to park any vehicle is not nor has it ever been an acceptable method of parking. Its more a last resort for a worm or maladjusted parking brake.

Re:Many possibilities

[Joce640k]

it will slow you down a LOT faster than just trying to engine brake.

Have you actually tried it in an emergency at highway speeds? I have. I assure you you'll have time to pray to several dozen deities before it actually stops the car.

Re:Many possibilities

[19thNervousBreakdown]

I know what happens. You slow down. I've also been in the car while somebody pulled the e-brake on dry pavement at 50 mph while turning the wheel. Queue dramatic screeching and a perfect 180. (he's an excellent stunt driver (very different from an excellent driver in general, which means safe, although his driving record of zero accidents over a 15-year career attests that he's that too, or at least lucky) but it still scared the shit out of me). If your e-brake doesn't slow you down, you have a broken emergency brake and your car probably shouldn't pass inspection.

You're also making the assumption that all e-brakes work the same way, which isn't true. Some cars (generally older ones, I think) use a pin against the drum. My car, which has disc brakes in the rear, directly attaches the cable to the caliper, bypassing the hydraulic system. Others use it, but don't rely on engine vacuum, others stop the front wheels, I'm sure there's plenty of other variations. The main point is, it's usually a redundant system, which is why it qualifies to be called an "emergency" brake. They're also usually ratcheting, which qualifies them to be called "parking" brakes. Most, you can call either and be correct.

As for emergency stopping, that's part of my test drive of a car, and part of my decision on whether to buy it or not is based on its behavior there. I'm not sure what part of my post made you assume that I'm a poor or irresponsible driver. I also ... uh ... "test" my car's handling on snow/ice by doing donuts in empty parking lots. Anyway, if you assumed that my handbrake won't slow my car down because yours doesn't slow your car down, you should get your car checked out.

Re:Many possibilities

[LoRdTAW]

Know whats even more scary?

Back in the early days of trucking, there were no spring brakes or maxi brakes. So if you parked a loaded tractor trailer on a hill the only thing keeping it from rolling was the "drum in hat" style parking brake on the transmission or carrier (differential). It was nothing more than a drum brake that was mounted to the drive shaft. and they held around 80,000 pounds (36,000kg) on a hill IF they were adjusted properly. Those guys carried and used chocks.

You still find those parking brakes on medium duty trucks without air brakes. Many of the medium duty transmissions sold today (mainly by Allison) do in fact have a parking pawl. And they hold up to whatever they are designed to hold, sometimes up to 33,000+ pounds (15,000+ kg).

What could possibly go wrong

[Anonymous Coward]

I was going to say something, but I can't think of anything clever, because I'm shaking my head in disbelief so fast that I'm getting dizzy. Please tell me that the wireless interface at least has its own fuse that can be pulled.

Re:What could possibly go wrong

[c0lo]

Please tell me that the wireless interface at least has its own fuse that can be pulled.

On behalf of our R&D dept in East Europe and Russia, I can state that we don't know it ... yet. And, unless you aren't a Mercedes owner, we are not going to inform you.
If, however, you own this model, just tell us where it is parked and we'll let you know (if a fuse can be pulled, it's likely we can replace it with absolutely no troubles for your, while you're asleep).

Raising my black hat, I send you my best wishes and hopes of a successful ...(ummm... how to put it?... ah, yes...) collaboration,

(non-readable signature in 133t-sp34k)

Re:what could possibly go wrong

[digitig]

Soon: - First maleware for cars spotted in the wild. Car manufacturers: "No problem. it only infects the multimedia system" - Maleware displays a huge kitty on the HUD. First malware caused traffic accident with casualties.

I think auto manufacturers are waking up to the fact that women buy cars too.

Re:what could possibly go wrong

[siddesu]

I saw it in Terminator 3 already, thank you. The robot chick had pneumatic tits.

what could possibly go wrong

[Anonymous Coward]

Soon:
- First maleware for cars spotted in the wild. Car manufacturers: "No problem. it only infects the multimedia system"
- Maleware displays a huge kitty on the HUD. First malware caused traffic accident with casualties.
- Anti-Virus Software mandatory for cars
- Kaspersky/McAffee/.. : ~40% of all cars infected with one virus or another....

Incoming exploit in 3..2..1...

[Mistakill]

I can see this will be exploited somewhere along the way...

Well Mercedes are a favourate of bankers

[Chrisq]

Well Mercedes are a favourate of bankers and corporate "fat cats". I couldn't think of a better challenge to Anonymous. Speed limiter to 20mph? Stuck in the driveway? I wait with eagerness.

Re:Well Mercedes are a favourate of bankers

[FunPika]

20 miles per hour speed limiter? How about limit it to just under the speed limit (since GPS's seem to be able to get that these days). It will effectively piss off people in a lot of areas such as Massachusetts (I have gotten passed on a double yellow there for going slightly over the limit...don't underestimate how much this would piss off Massholes). The 20mph limiter would just make the driver be like "FUCK THIS!", a GPS based limiter could troll the driver and everyone around them in the right areas, at least for a little while.

Re:Well Mercedes are a favourate of bankers

[SuricouRaven]

Set to play Never Gonna Give You Up at random intervals, and disable audio controls for the duration.

Re:Well Mercedes are a favourate of bankers

[zippthorne]

In many areas of massachusetts, speed limits are not set at the speeds the roads were designed for/are safe to operate at, but at revenue generating levels - speeds at which police officers on speed patrol can spend their whole day writing tickets.

Enforcement is still lax, though, because if enforcement was efficient, people would drive at the lower levels to avoid it. Effectively, mass does not have speed limits. It has a "random road tax."

Who pays?

[skovnymfe]

I'm assuming the car connects to some sort of 3g or other wireless network to download updates.

Who pays for this?

Re:Who pays?

[gl4ss]

mercedes.
or in other words - the guy who buys the car. if you could hack that data connection to contact whatever else sites though.. I'm assuming it would do it via 3g actually too. it wouldn't be too hard for mercedes to negotiate europe wide contracts for it for fairly cheap(the data amounts will be rather low). so it might be something like 200 bucks for 3 years of updates, which considering the total cost of the car isn't really that much. if it can prevent one recall for a model that would otherwise need the dealer to do "free" work billed to mb then from mb's viewpoint it's a good deal.

Re:Who pays?

[Opportunist]

If money is an issue, you obviously should not own a Mercedes.

Re:And then the police got the feature they wanted

[arth1]

How long until all police cars will be fited with programs that uploads a breaks-is-always-on update?

You're about 12 years too late.
http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2010/03/hacker-bricks-cars/

Sometimes, It's Good To Be Old-School

[longbot]

No automatic updates for me, unless Mercedes wants to install a computer to update in my '84 300TD.

Turn on the CU?

[sirdude]

"In a process called ‘reflashing,’ the Mercedes system can turn on the car operating system (CU), download the new application, then cut itself off."

So the car is regularly polling a server and can switch itself on? That sounds decidedly unsettling.

Could somebody elaborate on the diagnostic capabilities of these cars? Do they alert you if your brakes are inefficient or if your tyres are wearing out? I'm too poor to afford one to know :(

Cheers.

Re:Turn on the CU?

[MachineShedFred]

If it works like the iDrive system in BMW, the ECU stays active for about 10 minutes after the car is turned off, in order to remember navigation position and the creature comfort stuff like heated seats being turned on. Mercedes is likely putting this update check in after such an interval.

As for the brake and tire wear checking, that's done by a Mark-I eyeball installed in a service technician at the dealership, which is included in the service plan that comes with the car.

Virus scan on Cars

[million_monkeys]

Soon: - First maleware for cars spotted in the wild. Car manufacturers: "No problem. it only infects the multimedia system" - Maleware displays a huge kitty on the HUD. First malware caused traffic accident with casualties. - Anti-Virus Software mandatory for cars - Kaspersky/McAffee/.. : ~40% of all cars infected with one virus or another....

Great, so now my car's only gonna go 15 mph because McAffee is using 90% of my engine resources.

Maybe in the US

[Any Web Loco]

Maybe in the US. Here, in the socialist hell that is Europe, they're really fairly common.

Best scenario...

[DrogMan]

So you're the getaway driver sitting in the stolen Merc - your partners in crime are runing towards you. You hit the 'start' button... "Please wait while we install the latest software update. This process will take approximately 5 of your finest German minutes." Fantastic!

Tracking ?

[Anonymousslashdot]

The system is also able to collect any kind of data from the connected sensors and send them automatically and wirelessly to the manufacturer. It's called "automatic updates" these days, but it's just another name for eavesdropping.

Re:Ok , but what happens if...

[will_die]

I would guess they have a information box informing the user there is a patch available that the user has to initiate and requires that the car be parked with the engine off.

Re:Transparent upgrades - yeah, right

[Swampash]

Remember how you could always spot a Microsoft "Patch Tuesday" when you got to work and found all the desktop machines had rebooted overnight?

Spotting Mercedes Patch Tuesday on the autobahn is going to be epic.

Avi Rubin hacking cars. TED.com

[Leafwiz]

Hacking cars has already been done, and is shown here in this ted.com video. 4:42 is where he explains about it.

http://www.ted.com/talks/avi_rubin_all_your_devices_can_be_hacked.html

Many of the internal systems was hacked, including the system for breaking.

From ted.com:
"Could someone hack your pacemaker? At TEDxMidAtlantic, Avi Rubin explains how hackers are compromising cars, smartphones and medical devices, and warns us about the dangers of an increasingly hack-able world.

  Avi Rubin is a professor of computer science and director of Health and Medical Security Lab at Johns Hopkins University. His current research is focused on the security of electronic medical records"

Re:on the fly

[TaoPhoenix]

Sure, you pinpointed one of the really eerie parts of this.

Let's even say it's not hackers, can you imagine if the company itself messed up its update, even just on the install? You're going 65 miles down the road, then the car freezes for two seconds while the update installs?!

Yeesh.