Slashdot Mirror
MPAA Agent Poses As Homebuyer To Catch Pirates
bonch writes "The MPAA used an undercover agent posing as a potential homebuyer to gain access to the home of a British couple charged with running a streaming links site. UK authorities decided not to pursue the case, but the MPAA continued, focusing on a Boston programmer who worked on the site, leading to an unprecedented legal maneuver whereby U.S. charges were dropped in exchange for testimony in a UK fraud case."
I guess even police work and evidence collection is getting outsourced these days....
On a serious note, what right does the MPAA have to place 'undercover' agents?
That is not the problem here. I'm okay with the charges against them, the way they went about DOING it is quite another thing.
Since when does the MPAA get to play police themselves? Last I checked their are not a government law enforcement agency.
In essence what happened was MPAA pretented to be a venture capitalist who was interested in the streaming site SurfTheChannel. After meeting the owner in person they followed them to their house. Then a seperate MPAA nob head posed as a home buyer interested in the owner of SurfTheChannel's house.
The MPAA then turned over pictures of the house and details of the venture capitalist meeting to the police who proceded to raid their house. The police decided not to press charges, so the MPAA went after the US programmer who made SurfTheChannel. He did some sort of plea bargain where they would drop the case against him if he would testify against the British couple.
The British couple are now in court on charges of fraud.
It is a British couple in Britain being charged (criminally) in the UK for fraud (how they got fraud out of running a linking site I have no idea. The site was SurfTheChannel, BTW, since TFS doesn't say). Testimony is being offered by a Boston programmer who helped set up the site and agreed to testify in return for charges against him being dropped. The whole "undercover" bit was just to figure out where the couple lived: the MPAA first had someone pose as a venture capitalist interested in the site who met with the husband and tailed him back to his house, which was then snooped on by a hired PI (who posed as the homebuyer).
FWIW I don't think the case is likely to get terribly far. Similar cases against similar sites have failed in the past, but I don't know how bad the UK justice system is so I cannot say.
"None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
MPAA hired an ex-cop to pose as venture capitalist interested in SurftheChannel.com. He learned how much the owner made from the site.
Then he tailed him 250 miles to his home, just to find out where he lives.
MPAA then sent a PI posing as a potential home buyer to the residence, to take pictures of the guys house, paying particular attention to the computer hardware.
They have the house raided, and the MPAA douches are allowed to take part in the questioning. They were even allowed to investigate the confiscated equipment themselves.
UK authorities decide not to pursue a case.
MPAA, not to be denied, went after a programmer in the US that worked on the site. In exchange for dropping his case, he agreed to testify in the UK case and pay the MPAA $10k in go-away money.
At least that's the take-away I got form the article. It's pretty convoluted.
I don't really have an issue with piracy when the media companies make it difficult to view the content legally. I have a major issue when someone is making money off piracy. Screw these people. Throw the book at them.
I would agree with you, except I have a much, much bigger problem with corporations sending UNDERCOVER FUCKING AGENTS into people's homes under false pretenses.
If you can't gather enough evidence of criminal activity to convince a rubberstamp-wielding judge to issue a warrant, served by people at least superficially trained in such silly little issues as chain-of-custody, then you drop the issue. You don't hire plumbers to break in and go through your enemies' files.
When discussing a case that includes both the UK and the USA. make it clear where the cities are located. Not only are there probably many cities called "London" in the USA, but more importantly, there is at least one "Boston" in the UK.
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
What the hell, what does the developer of a site has to do with how its owners operate it? That's like making employees criminally responsible if their company does something unethical.
I think it's probably the Profit motive. You're a hero if you are providing access to media not otherwise available. If you are seeking money for it when you're not the copyright holder then you're just a money grubbing dick. You might be a money grubber even if you hold the copyright; but then you're at least legal.
It's like the story of the vet who sent something like 10k pirated DVDs over to the desert. Yes, he violated copyright, but people have his sympathy. If somebody took those 10k DVDs and tried to sell them for $2 profit each, the view is much different. People view you differently if you're not doing it for profit, especially if you're 'donating' your own resources to the cause without hope of return.
I don't read AC A human right
I'm one of those people.
I believe that an ordinary person should not have to be encumbered with copyright law - even lawyers who specialize in it can't give you firm answers about what is and is not fair use. There was just a story yesterday about something like 57% of the population being "pirates".
As soon as you make IP part of your business, however, I believe it is fair to require you to know the ropes. It's similar to tax law IMHO - if an individual screws up their taxes, then they should just pay some interest on the money they owe and move on. If H&R block makes a habit of screwing up other people's taxes, then maybe big fines, restitution, and loss of license/certification is in order.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
This is getting too wacky and out of hand. I mean, piracy is one thing, but playing police?
Next thing you know laws will be privatized for the highest bidder in a location. I think we need to step back and ask ourselves, is piracy really worth letting this crap slip by?
I think we should start by reducing the amount of legislation and bureaucracy and let the police do their job. Then we write the minimum amount of laws required to protect start up industries, and then we hang all the lawyers anyways because they're ridiculous and will ruin everything (as always).
Except they didn't break in, they didn't go through anybody's files, they weren't "agents" in the context of law enforcement. It's not like financial companies, insurance companies, service providers and other industries don't have their own investigators who look into things before taking legal action. While there's definitely a few red flags here, the summary presents this like it was some kind of undercover raid, and the comments like this kind of take that even further.
Sounds like gaining entrance to home under false pretenses should be prosecuted as fraud as well.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
>They were even allowed to investigate the confiscated equipment themselves.
\Wouldn't any lawyer be able to get this easily thrown out? The police giving away evidence to the plaintiff to do as they wish with it aster the case was dropped? Isn't that stealing, conspiracy, possession of stolen property, tampering with evidence, etc, etc , etc.....
by TheSpoom (715771) Uncaring Linux user here. I have nothing to add to this but please continue. *munches popcorn*
where are the laws to stop that?
Sounds like the couple aren't the ones who should be charged with fraud. Verifying the identities of the 'interested parties' would have likely quashed this whole debacle before it progressed into the absurdity it is now.
If the MPAA/RIAA are going so far as to infiltrate your home with 'actors' to thwart copyright infringement, they really have hit the bottom of the cesspool. That's absolutely disgusting!
I wonder if I could just go around slapping people until they pay me to stop. That'd be pretty sweet.
The MPAA would probably sue me for stealing their business model, or something. Guess I'll just have to keep working hard to make my customers happy, instead. Stupid reality and it's stupid applying to me.
Pay your legislators enough cash and you don't only control governmental actions, you almost become PART of the government apparently.
Well, corporations are government creations, so it's not entirely surprising. The cycle goes roughly:
1) create permanent private-benefit corporations
2) protect individuals in corporations from nearly all consequences
3) allow corporations to grow much larger than non-corporate business could achieve to gain unnatural economies of scale
4) allow corporations to squelch their competition through favorable laws, incumbent-protecting regulations, court actions, etc. Be sure to speak boldly about new regulations to control corporations, then let corporations write those regulations.
5) take small percentage of corporate profits as taxes
6) take much larger percentage of corporate profits as campaign contributions to ensure cycle perpetuation
7) GOTO 2
You'll notice the loop is positive feedback and doesn't halt so long as resources are available to keep it running.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
It's only a crime if the people in power say it's a crime. Right now, the people in power are the MPAA.
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
Mixing these two always seems to lead to bad things. Sigh.
One man's pink plane is another man's blue plane.
You have to realize that Slashdotters never click the links to read articles. They rely on the summary to tell them what reaction to have so they can post comments about it. Actual reading of the article or may or may not occur at a later date.
Please. They've sued dead people. If you think this is rock bottom you've forgotten the last 12 years.
Not only were Hollywood representatives taking part in the questioning, they also brought along investigators who were allowed to examine the equipment.
Why on earth are they allowed to look at the equipment? Can company X allege something now against company Y in order to look through Y's internal files?
They're also re-writing the laws with their checkbooks, implementing censorship to protect an obsolete business model. Whacky spy shit does not trouble me. Taking away our rights is, morally, rock bottom.
The MPAA (through their UK minions, FACT, a "private commercial organisation, representing the interests of the audio-visual industry") did some investigating to find out who the operator of SurfTheChannel.com was. After various undercover meetings, fake deals and that sort of thing, they were able to identify the operators as a UK-based couple. Then they set the police on them.
The police turned up, with FACT people, and arrested the couple, seizing a load of evidence, and a FACT specialist was able to copy a load of data from the computers (and may have done so illegally). While in custody the couple were interviewed with FACT people present, FACT were able to examine the evidence, and eventually most of it was handed over to them for analysis.
Eventually, the couple were released and the CPS (who decide whether or not to bring prosecutions) decided not to charge them. The police then handed the rest of the evidence over to FACT who wanted it so they could run a private prosecution. The couple sued the police and FACT to get their stuff back (after their direct requests were refused). These facts all come from the resulting case (Scopelight Ltd & Ors v Chief of Police for Northumbria & FACT) which FACT won on appeal.
The initial arrests were in August 2008, the CPS gave up in December 2008, FACT filed their private prosecution in February 2009 and that appeal was ruled on in November 2009. This new information has come to light because that private prosecution is currently being heard in Newcastle Crown Court.
The other major fact that emerged was that the US programmer who worked on the site was arrested by US authorities, but managed to get out of being convicted for his part in exchange for agreeing to testify in the UK case. So the US let an alleged criminal go so he could help a private, UK-based company win a private prosecution in the UK.
So the MPAA is guilty of Extortion, gotcha.
>In exchange for dropping his case, he agreed to testify in the UK case and pay the MPAA $10k in go-away money.
Yep, very clearly guilty of felony extortion. Arrest all MPAA fucks, or shoot them, either works. Start with Chris Dodd to make the message as clear as possible.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
Iirc they're on charges of conspiracy to defraud, which is a separate offence to fraud. Fraud is quite narrowly defined (by the Fraud Act 2006). Conspiracy to defraud is one of the most controversial criminal offences in English law as it is incredibly broad and vague, potentially criminalising an agreement to do something that is of itself perfectly legal. It's popular with FACT and the MPAA at the moment as it is far easier to prove than criminal copyright infringement.
Private corporations are not law enforcement officers.
It means that the sick greed which drives the movie industry knows no bounds.
If Google really cared they would fix Android Chrome to reflow text, instead of discriminating
After the police dropped the charges they turned over all the computer equipment to FACT, even though FACT is not a government agency, didn't own the equipment, and the owners were not being charged with a crime. The couple sued to get their computers back in 2009 and won in the lower courts, but lost in the upper courts. So, in GB it is now legal for the police to seize your computer equipment without filing charges and turning the equipment over to FACT without compensation. crazy.
It used to be "separation of Church and State". Now it should be "separation of Corporation and State". Unfortunately it likely will take another war for that to happen.
That is correct. Based on the tip Law Enforcement (LE) seized the couple's computers. LE analyzed the computers and opted not to press charges. Here is the problem. Rather than return the couple's property to them LE turned the computers over to the MPAA.
Sounds like the MPAA has taken a lesson from the World of the News playbook ...
It gets even better when you read about stories like this one, where RIAA member owned VEVO was busted illegally streaming a football game at an event at Sundance a couple years ago.
And let's not even get into Hollywood Accounting...
You know why the MAFIAA is so pissed off about getting ripped off? Because it's cutting into the profits they make ripping other people off. Poor babies...
I hate to reply to my own post, but I looked into this a little and while strange to me as an American, I now understand what's going on.
In the UK it is legal for private parties to charge another private party with a criminal act. It's called private prosecution and we have nothing like it in the U.S. FACT is legally allowed to charge these people with a crime, employ the police to seize their property for evidence (with a warrant), and act as prosecutor in front of the court (they can be sentenced to prison as an outcome). The crown (government) prosecutors can choose to take over the prosecution and even put a stop to it if they want, but they can also do nothing. So, turning the evidence over to FACT is not at all inconsistent with British law.
Personally, I find the idea of private prosecutions frightening.