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US Ordered To Hand Over Megaupload Documents

Posted by Soulskill on from the hope-you-didn't-break-anything dept.

An anonymous reader writes "A judge in New Zealand has ordered the U.S. government to hand over evidence seized in the Megaupload raid so Kim Dotcom and his co-defendants can use it to prepare a defense for an extradition hearing. The judge wrote, 'Actions by and on behalf of the requesting State have deprived Mr. Dotcom and his associates of access to records and information. ... United States is attempting to utilize concepts from the civil copyright context as a basis for the application of criminal copyright liability [which] necessitates a consideration of principles such as the dual use of technology and what they be described as significant non-infringing uses.' Once the defense attorneys have gathered and presented their evidence, the judge must decide whether the U.S. can make a reasonable case against Dotcom."

10 of 242 comments (clear)

  1. Dear USA by overbaud · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Please leave the rest of the world alone. Thankyou.

    --
    Users... the only thing keeping 1st level support from being the bottom feeders.
    1. Re:Dear USA by mechtech256 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      New Zealand is responsible for what they do in their own backyard with their own police forces. If they want to surrender their sovereignty to a bunch of RIAA/MPAA hacks who have paid off the right people, that's their prerogative. It's obvious that they've realized the mistake and are trying to make things right, but in the end it's NZ that screwed up here.

    2. Re:Dear USA by The+Master+Control+P · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You know, manufacturing in the US has actually kept going up ever since the 80s. It just doesn't employ anyone any more because it's more cost effective to pay an engineer here to design an automated shop that employs 10 people instead of 500.

    3. Re:Dear USA by baileydau · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The US produces very little? It's incredibly obvious to tell you're trolling with statements like that.

      Actually from my point of view, I'd have to agree with the GP.

      I can't think of a single item I own that was actually made in USA. I own plenty of stuff made by US companies, but as far as I'm aware not on US soil.

      At one stage I thought my mountain bike was actually made in the US, but then I found a sticker that disproved that (can't remember where it said now)

      A brief survey of most stuff I own indicates that most of it came from China, followed by Taiwan and various other Asian countries.

      That's one of the big issues I see with the "first world". We don't actually make the stuff any more that got us to that position in the first place. How long before the rest of the world doesn't need us any more?

      --
      Ever stop to think ... and forget to start again?
    4. Re:Dear USA by boundary · · Score: 5, Interesting

      It is absolutely not our (the New Zealand people's) prerogative. This whole situation occurred because the NZ Police (none of whom are elected) thought they could get some international glory from a big case. They failed to do their research. They failed to follow proper procedure. They failed to use appropriate force. They failed on every account. And now they look like the try-hard asswipes that they are. If this was a one-off I'd be mildly surprised, but it has happened before, and it's making me feel quite nauseous. For example the NZ Defence Force has been caught on numerous times sucking up to the yanks just to improve their chances of being involved in military exercises, which was in strict contravention of the orders they received from the NZ Government at the time. They are out of control. So are the cops. Small men in large uniforms, thinking their dicks will grow bigger if they chum up to the big boys. Everyone, without exception, that I have talked to about this in NZ is absolutely disgusted with the way things have turned out. Blaming NZ is a total cop-out. The cops are at fault, for sure, but how about the US taking the requisite amount of blame for creating the conditions where their entertainment/copyright assholes are running riot across the globe, and the US government is materially supporting them?

    5. Re:Dear USA by TheRaven64 · · Score: 5, Funny

      Bombs along Hadrian's wall and the a LOT of rowing...

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      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  2. Re:docs need to prove conspiracy.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    INAL but from what I've been reading it's more complex then that, the conspiracy/ racketeering and money laundering charges only stick if they can show criminal copyright infringement. Problem is copyright infringement is civil issue in NZ AND they need to show probable success of conviction for crimes with at least a 5 year jail term in NZ before extradition can even go ahead.

    Conspiracy to commit a crime carries a maximum penalty of 5 years so qualifies, but they need to show both likely hood of conspiracy and the original crime.

    A laymans example would be: I think you and your friend conspired to cheat on a test. I may have emails showing you conspired but I can't just have you extradited by showing conspiracy, I have to convince a judge that cheating on a test is a criminal offence first. A much taller order.

    Also remember that the judge has already stated his displeasure with the failure to follow due process in the initial arrest and has required the crown to guarantee to cover costs and lost income if kim dotcom is not found guilty.

    -Kactus

  3. Re:Take note by QQBoss · · Score: 5, Funny

    If this happened in Australia Kim would altready be in US custardy.

    NZ purposly made legal mistakes and are now intentionally hindering the US!

    It is distinctly possible that the USA would jail Kim for as long as they could, but it is highly unlikely they would ever attempt to turn him into a creme brulee.

  4. Missing the point by cbope · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I believe the most significant quote from the statement is this:

    "United States is attempting to utilize concepts from the civil copyright context as a basis for the application of criminal copyright liability [which] necessitates a consideration of principles such as the dual use of technology and what they be described as significant non-infringing uses."

    In other words, the NZ government realizes this is a misuse of the justice system to allow the US government to prosecute a civil case as a criminal one without giving the defendant access to evidence. The significant problem here is that the rights of the right-holder is being held to a higher standard than the rights of the defendant in this case.

    I'm not attempting to say Mr. Dotcom is completely innocent in this case, but the US legal system has destroyed his business, confiscated his assets and likely taken away his future without due process and without a conviction of any crime at this point. Innocent until proven guilty, anyone?

  5. Re:Wait, NOW!?!? by X.25 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    They aren't saying they haven't seen enough evidence to say Dotcom is guilty of a crime, they are saying that he has a right to defend himself against extradition and that defense needs to be able to review evidence for and against that charge.

    Various news outlets in NZ tried to talk to just about everyone (PM, Crown, etc) and find out whether FBI presented evidence (and what evidence was that) before raid was ordered, who exactly authorized the raid, negotiated with FBI, etc.

    Everyone refused to talk to media about these issue. As if they're not public servants paid by taxpayers' money, but working in a private company and can decline to comment.

    In short - noone (except police, I guess) knows what evidence NZ police has seen before the raid. They might have not seen any evidence, for all we know.