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EU Commissioner Reveals He Will Ignore Any Rejection of ACTA

Posted by Soulskill on from the if-at-first-you-don't-succeed dept.

Dupple tips a story at Techdirt about comments from EU commissioner Karel De Gucht, who made some discouraging remarks to the EU International Trade committee about the opposition to ACTA: "If you decide for a negative vote before the European Court rules, let me tell you that the Commission will nonetheless continue to pursue the current procedure before the Court, as we are entitled to do. A negative vote will not stop the proceedings before the Court of Justice. ... If the Court questions the conformity of the agreement with the Treaties we will assess at that stage how this can be addressed." De Gucht also spoke about proposing clarifications to ACTA if Parliament declined to ratify it, which, as Techdirt points out, doesn't make much sense: "Remember that ACTA is now signed, and cannot be altered; so De Gucht is instead trying to fob off European politicians with this vague idea of 'clarifications' — as if more vagueness could somehow rectify the underlying problems of an already dangerously-vague treaty."

20 of 253 comments (clear)

  1. As an American... by Das+Auge · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As an American: at least he's honest about it. My politicians just issue bald-faced lies.

    1. Re:As an American... by Luckyo · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No worries, these people will be labeled something among the lines of "terrorists, pedophiles, liberals, wing nuts" or whatever other term will be deemed valid and hostile enough by spin doctors writing speeches for modern leaders.

      Then most of the sheep will happily nuke the "enemies of the state" into the oblivion.

    2. Re:As an American... by Velex · · Score: 5, Insightful

      What's that got to do with it? Why would gun owners invoke the 2nd Amendment to defend a bunch of long-haired hippies who want to steal American Property?

      Especially after acquiescing to the Patriot Act and airport scanners that administer a dangerous dosage of radiation as a routine measure?

      No, my friend, I'm afraid that I've yet to see the 2nd Amendment get invoked for any other reason than to kill brown people and fags except maybe the Civil War. And after the New Deal, the reasons for the secession of the Confederate States look like gripes that could be solved over an afternoon tea.

      Your internet tough guy argument fails. Even after all the shortwave saber rattling I used to believe in and follow when I was growing up, the American people remain hopelessly cowed.

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    3. Re:As an American... by girlintraining · · Score: 5, Insightful

      As an American: at least he's honest about it. My politicians just issue bald-faced lies.

      He's not being honest because it's virtuous; He's being honest because there's no consequences for him doing it. Our politicians lie their asses off when it suits them just like yours. He just knows there's no fight left in the general population. Don't go getting funny ideas about how our politicians are somehow special... they were bought and paid for same as yours, and probably by the same people.

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    4. Re:As an American... by MrHanky · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Most politicians lie and break many of the promises they make. Few of them get killed. An armed populace isn't a significant deterrent, although chest-thumping morons will claim otherwise.

    5. Re:As an American... by Elldallan · · Score: 5, Informative

      On the other hand the European Commission has no legislative power, it only has legislative initiative and as such can only suggest laws.
      Only the European Parliament which is democratically elected can actually enact laws.
      ACTA is currently making it's way through the various committees which act in an advisory manner to the Parliament, said committees have no power and the Commission is merely saying that it will not withdraw ACTA before it has made it's way through the various committees and the European Court of Justice and will eventually be voted upon by the Parliament but if the result in Parliament is a negative vote that effectively kills ACTA within the EU unless the Commission renegotiates ACTA and sends it on another round through the system.

    6. Re:As an American... by ATMAvatar · · Score: 5, Funny

      Pretty much, no. The information can't be faked. The launch officer is the last guy in the chain that knows his bird's target.

      I would have thought the target would be the last guy in the chain to know the target.

      --
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    7. Re:As an American... by qeveren · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Soldiers are trained to obey orders. I wouldn't bet your life on "US soldiers won't fire upon US civilians", since they've happily done so before.

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  2. And there's the out... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    EU nations to citizens: "We voted against it, what more coupld we do?"
    EU nations to RIAA: "Ok, it's passed, pay up."

  3. It will pass in some form by kwark · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ACTA will be ratified in some form because it will be resubmitted again and again till the lobbyiest succeed. This happened before with the EU constitution, it will happen with ACTA and it will happen in the future for many more treaties/laws.

    1. Re:It will pass in some form by UltimaBuddy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      If its passing is inevitable, I want it as hobbled and useless as possible.

    2. Re:It will pass in some form by mhajicek · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Then the courts will have no choice but to ignore it completely.

      No, it will just be enforced selectively ("with discretion") as most current laws are.

    3. Re:It will pass in some form by SecurityTheatre · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The other option is to have it so overreaching that it becomes impossible to do anything without infringing.

      Then the courts will have no choice but to ignore it completely.

      The problem with laws like this isn't that they get ignored, but that they get selectively used.

      There are other similar laws and the result is that anyone (police, lawyer, judge, politician, busybody neighbour) gets to decide whether or not you are guilty.

      I mean, since you are always guilty, it's just a matter of turning you in for prosecution. It's great for police who want to harass you, or a landlord or tenant who wants to screw you for asserting your rights, or a business competitor who would like you out of the way.

      It basically brings a country slowly into a police state. I do not favour it in the way you seem to...

  4. ruling class gonna rule by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 5, Insightful

    is anyone surprised?

    the amount of power held by those that ACTA favors outweighs the amount of power held by those against.

    rulers gonna rule. who'd have thunk it?

    (I'm not in favor of ACTA, not even close; but I don't really hold up much hope when this much greed is involved, mixed with this much 'can-do' power to pull it off.)

    this is a people problem. a scalability one. do our governments 'work' for us anymore? in the modern times, with mass communication now possible, are any of our systems really working? it does not seem so!

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    1. Re:ruling class gonna rule by cpu6502 · · Score: 5, Informative

      No not really. When the ink was barely-dry on the Bill of Rights, our Congress and 2nd president signed a law that made free speech and press illegal (guess they thought the first amendment & their oath meant nothing). In response our 3rd president, who repealed the law, said liberty requires constant vigilance by the electorate else it will be lost.

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  5. A country that is not a country. by metrix007 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is the type of thing when you have something resembling a country, but that is not in essence a country, which has non of the protections or checks and balances that a state should actually have.

    Democracy at the EU level, kind of a joke.

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    1. Re:A country that is not a country. by sociocapitalist · · Score: 5, Interesting

      This is the type of thing when you have something resembling a country, but that is not in essence a country, which has non of the protections or checks and balances that a state should actually have.

      Democracy at the EU level, kind of a joke.

      You say this, and yet democracy seems to be working better in Europe than in what is supposed to be a democratic America. In both cases you have a collection of States that make up a super-state. In the US, the States retain many powers that the Federal government is not allowed to fuck with. The same is true for the EU.

      The EU has a multiplicity of political parties in each country, all of which are democratically elected, with the European Parliament being directly elected and with a rotating presidency of the EU itself that shifts to a different country every six months power is never focused too long in one place.

      The countries in the EU provide checks and balances to each other, quite without meaning to. Because of the different interests that each country has, it's difficult for any given policy to be pushed through even by the strongest country or even set of countries in the Union.

      So how, exactly, is democracy at the EU level a joke?

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  6. Keep trying til you get the vote desired by cpu6502 · · Score: 5, Informative

    That appears to be how the European Union operates. The Constitution was rejected, so they turned it into the Lisbon Treaty. The Irish rejected the treaty so they held a second vote 6 months later, so they could get the "yes" vote desired. In Denmark they canceled the election and just acceded to the treaty automagically.

    NOW it appears they'll use the same approach with ACTA: It matters not how the EU Parliament votes, we'll just rewrite it and submit it a second time or third time until we get a "yes". Of course the U.S. ain't much better: TARP failed the first time so they rewrote it and tried a second time. When the Supreme Court rejects a law as unconstitutional, the Congress simply passes the law a second time (minus the objectionable bits).

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  7. Re:You mean he actually bought the European Court? by 0123456 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Democracy has never counted in the EU because the majority of the people of Europe have never wanted a bloated, centralised state where bureaucrats in Brussels tell them what to do.

    When EU citizens vote wrong, they're forced to vote again and again until they give the right answer.

  8. Re:Do we miss stories where they fight for people? by lennier · · Score: 5, Insightful

    do they ever really stand up for The People and say, "no matter what we're going to do X even if you say no"?

    Sometimes a popularly elected government comes into power and both promises and honestly intends to act against business interests, sure.

    That's called a "rogue state" and we have CIA drone strikes to deal with them.

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