Valve Finds Open Source Drivers To Be Great

Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Hatta · 2012-08-31 04:52 · Score: 5, Insightful

Of the GPUs available, Intel has by far the best open source driver. They don't even bother supplying a proprietary one. However, intel GPUs suck, and gamers will have either a nVidia card or an AMD card. There are open source drivers for both of these, but they both suck far worse than the Intel driver.

I really hope Valve can talk either AMD or nVidia into doing something about the quality of their open source drivers. But I'm not holding my breath. Chances are they'll just release a Steam box with Intel hardware instaed.

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Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by gman003 · 2012-08-31 05:10 · Score: 5, Interesting

A gaming box with *current* Intel hardware would suck. But that's primarily because the current Intel "GPUs" are integrated onto the CPU die, and are only "good enough" .
I wonder how well Intel's performance would scale up. If they took their basic design, and used 600-1600 render cores instead of 6-16. I mean, a top-of-the-line card from nVidia or AMD has *thousands* of cores spread between two dies, while Intel is cramming a dozen cores into whatever space is left on the CPU die. Let them put out a full-size card, put a few gigs of dedicated memory and cache on it, and see what happens. We won't know for sure until it's tried, but rendering tends to be a pretty scalable problem.
If Intel *does* do that, they would be a likely candidate for the hypothesized SteamBox console, since they seem to be working *very* closely with Valve.
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Zimluura · 2012-08-31 05:12 · Score: 2

edit: it seems AMD does contribute code to the opensource driver. I stand corrected.
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Hatta · 2012-08-31 05:27 · Score: 2

AMD released open source drivers, but they suck. If you want performance, you have to use the Catalyst drivers.

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Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by TheNinjaroach · 2012-08-31 05:30 · Score: 3, Interesting

Chances are they'll just release a Steam box with Intel hardware instaed.
I don't see that happening. Instead, I see Valve partnering with one of the "real" GPU companies (AMD or NVidia) and co-operating with them in the same manner. In NVidia's case, I see them signing enough NDAs to get access to the closed-source driver code.

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Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · 2012-08-31 05:44 · Score: 2

If memory serves, they haven't been OSS friendly in a while and the cards for which unofficial drivers exist are mostly antiques at this point.
(Probably more fundamentally, they fell badly behind in the performance wars, and digital video interfaces made their reputation for quality high-resolution analog output less relevant, and retreated into specialist multiheaded/2d workstation/display wall/etc. gear. I don't know how well regarded they are in that market; but it just isn't a very big one compared to consumer PCs and workstations that need graphical punch. You can't even find a laptop with a Matrox chip in it, and their discrete cards are alarmingly expensive unless your needs and their features align very closely.)
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Baloroth · 2012-08-31 06:01 · Score: 3, Informative

It'd have to be "discrete" anyways, even if it is integrated into the board. There isn't enough room or thermal overhead to put the necessary power on the same die as the CPU, which is what modern Intel graphics does.

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Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Grishnakh · 2012-08-31 06:32 · Score: 4, Insightful

Intel GPUs don't "suck", they're just not as high-performance as the others. They're perfectly adequate for most uses, and getting better all the time.
This is like saying a Toyota Camry sucks; no, it's not a Ferrari, but it's highly reliable and performs perfectly adequately for most drivers.
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Grishnakh · 2012-08-31 06:33 · Score: 2

I'm really curious how they manage to stay in business like that.
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Hatta · 2012-08-31 07:36 · Score: 3, Funny

When speed matters, both Intel GPUs and Toyotas suck.

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Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by gman003 · 2012-08-31 08:25 · Score: 2

Except gamers are already used to having an integrated GPU that goes to waste.
Myself, I have an Intel HD in my CPU, which is currently never used because I've got a whopping GeForce 660M next to it*. Several of my other computers, even desktops, have integrated graphics that are completely wasted.
What would be useful is if you could SLI/CF (or whatever Intel wants to call it) the integrated GPU with the discrete. I've been told the AMD Fusion CPU/GPU chips can CrossFire with a discrete Radeon, although I've not tested it myself.
AMD is also very vulnerable right now. They're dead in the water on the desktop, and not doing too well on the small server front. Meanwhile they're starting to slip against nVidia - they haven't failed, not yet, but they're beginning to. Their last holdouts are mass number-crunching (which Bulldozer is actually good at, it seems) and their CPU-with-powerful-integrated-graphics Fusion "APUs". If Intel can take down Fusion, and help nVidia take down Radeon, then AMD is left as a bit player in the CPU market, occupying a small niche like VIA, Sun and IBM.
* When I ever get around to installing Linux on this thing, I may end up using the Intel GPU instead, simply because the drivers are better (and any task I'm doing in Linux won't be graphically-intensive enough to need the massive power-hog discrete card).
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Tanktalus · 2012-08-31 08:57 · Score: 4, Informative

And yet the major reason why I moved from Catalyst to the radeonhd (and then radeon) drivers was that they didn't crash. I'd rather have a few less FPS if it meant I could have more frames ;-)
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by aaronb1138 · 2012-08-31 12:49 · Score: 2

Matrox also does a good amount of business providing barebones 2D chips to OEMs for servers, namely, IBM and some to SuperMicro. They stick around in that market because their ancient G200 drivers are still beyond reproach for providing .99999+ uptime.
Also, you can't really fault them for going purely into video editing and multi-headed systems as they couldn't keep up on 3D performance. nVidia barely figured out how to run more than 2 displays in the last year, and AMD can barely manage 3+. Matrox has been powering N number of displays from one chip for what, 10 years or so.
I could actually see Matrox getting back into the consumer market with a little licensing of Mali or similar technology. Their commitment to quality was their biggest failing in the consumer market. They were never willing to rush things out the door half baked while ATi and nVidia have dumped generation after generation with some retarded, but avoidable flaw after another.
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by Hadlock · 2012-08-31 14:13 · Score: 2

Intel's HD4000 is an impressive piece of silicon. It runs BF3 (barely playable, but not competitive), Skyrim and a host of other popular, modern games. I'm excited to see where the HD4500 or HD5000 heads. The HD4000 proved that Intel has what it takes to compete on the low end with Nvidia and AMD/ATI. The groundwork Intel is laying now shows room for impressive improvements in the next 18-24 months. The laptop graphics market is going to be very interesting to watch in 2014.

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Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by dbIII · 2012-08-31 16:03 · Score: 2

I've still got one of their expensive 3 head cards in something. Now when I want something with more than two screens I just put another card in another slot instead of getting an expensive matrox card.
Re:Valve finds Intel's driver to be great. by dbIII · 2012-08-31 16:14 · Score: 2

While the nvidia cards couldn't run more than two screens they've been cheap enough in comparison that getting more than one card has been a solid way to run more than two screens for around a decade.

Cooperation is a nice thing by Tei · 2012-08-31 04:54 · Score: 2

Mixing free software and commercial software can sometimes work wonders. Sadly sometimes is a misunderstood thing.

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Presenting Valve as friendly company by Anonymous Coward · 2012-08-31 05:04 · Score: 3, Insightful

I have this feeling that Linux community (or the larger free software community - ESR fans may simply not care) ever since announcements of Steam and L4D ports got public, thinks of Valve a little too high than the company deserves. At the same time as they criticise Windows 8 walled garden, they are pushing new TOS to their Steam service users which, most importantly, dropped the notion of owning a digital "product" in favor of "subscribtion". This is yet another step on the path towards taking our legally purchased software away from us.

As Linux serves to give it's users total control over their computers, I think at least part of community should rethink their enthusiasm over Valve coming to Linux platform. In my opinion, some of practices it brings are totally at odds with free software values.

PS. captcha "dissent", very true.

Re:Presenting Valve as friendly company by Anonymous Coward · 2012-08-31 05:21 · Score: 2, Insightful

One of the core issues here though is that we have a company that is trying to cater to their customers both with great games, an easy and intuative way to install/manage them, easy ways to keep them up to date, solid support for mods and modders on practicaly all their own games, good prices, and DRM which doesn't get in the way of almost anyone.
I agree that what you say about steam's TOS is a step back (if it's really as you describe, i hadn't heard about it before, but i'll take your word for it). But in a landscape that is filled with players such as Electronic Arts, UBISoft and Blizzard on one end, and companies like Nvidia, Sony, Microsoft on the other end (the hardware), it becomes very hard not to root for Valve. I think they seem approachable enough that an outcry by their users will result in them actually reconsidering or at the very least explaining their position. They're far from perfect (Where's my Half-life 3 Gabe, what gives!!! and nice intervals between episodic content !) but they're a choir boy surrounded by serial rapists in the marketspace.
Re:Presenting Valve as friendly company by gman003 · 2012-08-31 05:30 · Score: 3, Informative

FYI, it's always been phrased as a "subscription".
The recent change only tries to ban class-action lawsuits, which yes, is kind of a dick move.
Re:Presenting Valve as friendly company by ravenshrike · 2012-08-31 05:36 · Score: 4, Informative

On the other hand if you ask for less than $10,000 in arbitration they'll pay for your lawyer fees win or lose.
Re:Presenting Valve as friendly company by iive · 2012-08-31 06:42 · Score: 2

On the other hand if you ask for less than $10,000 in arbitration they'll pay for your lawyer fees win or lose.

On the other hand if you ask for less than $10,000 in arbitration they'll pay for your lawyer fees win or lose.
If you are going to dispute for a small amount of money you are always better off using Small Claims Court. It is a real court and you can expect to get a real fair verdict. Most of the small claims courts even forbid lawyers.

On the other side arbitration in USA is known to be so biased that it is literally a farce (in 99.9% of the cases). The arbitration is done by private entities under little to no oversight, you are going to face corporate lawyers and the arbitration is binding, meaning you can't appeal it . The arbitration is biased because the corporation can pick not only the arbitration company but also the actual arbiter. Here is the testimony of an arbiter that got rejected after single judgment in favor of a customer.
Re:Presenting Valve as friendly company by Hatta · 2012-08-31 07:45 · Score: 2

If you are going to dispute for a small amount of money you are always better off using Small Claims Court. It is a real court and you can expect to get a real fair verdict. Most of the small claims courts even forbid lawyers.
In my state, either party to a small claims suit can request that the case be moved to a regular court. If requested, it shall be moved. So small claims is effectively neutered here. If a big company wants to bury someone in legal fees, all they have to do is ask the judge to let them, and the judge must let them.
On the other side arbitration in USA is known to be so biased that it is literally a farce (in 99.9% of the cases).
Justice in the USA is literally a farce.

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Re:Presenting Valve as friendly company by olau · 2012-08-31 11:13 · Score: 2

While what you say is true, that Steam comes to Linux is infinitely better than it staying on Windows, also for people's freedom.
15 years ago I heard similar arguments that ports of free software to DOS/Windows should be discouraged because of the intermixing. Guess what? That intermixing gave me and a whole bunch of other people a hint at what free software really means and eventually brought us over.
So get off your high horse, mr. Anonymous Coward, and let people cheer.

Good news by JDG1980 · 2012-08-31 05:06 · Score: 4, Interesting

This is good news, because a company like Valve might actually have the clout to get AMD and/or nVidia to release good open-source drivers. After all, if it wasn't for the games released by companies like Valve, a heck of a lot fewer PC owners would need/want discrete video cards. And neither AMD nor nVidia wants a popular game to run worse on their card than on their competitors.

Re:Good news by gbjbaanb · 2012-08-31 06:25 · Score: 2

but if a steambox is coming, and they buy 10 billion graphics cards from AMD or nVidia, then there's no reason why they would bother with an OSS driver - the hardware will be fixed in stone, so a single binary custom built for the steambox will be all that's needed.
No, you'll never get these 2 to provide OSS drivers for their high-end products simply because this is part how they compete with each other. Until someone understands this, nothing is going to change.
Now, I guess you might get some traction if you could persuade both companies to release full OSS drivers for all their cards, and that would benefit us all (as both companies take the good bits from each others drivers), but therein lies the problem - they'll take the good bits from each others drivers and will have to compete against each other on price and hardware capabilities making each company as good as each other. They won't do that.

Re:Yes, we get it. by Cley+Faye · 2012-08-31 05:07 · Score: 3, Insightful

Linux IS a good platform for games. As said, you can see what's happening at every level, which mean no need to workaround weird unexpected behaviors and stuff.
Linux isn't a good platform for some game developpers, because of the small user base. But for Valve, aside from the initial work of porting their Source engine, it only means more reach. Having the engine already work on macs probably helped a lot. And if great games start to be available on Linux (and I mean more than one AAA game per year, at most), it might also leverage the linux presence.
Giving the user the choice is the only sensible choice for people working with their brains, and Valve's pretty good at it.

Re:Yes, we get it. by micheas · 2012-08-31 05:17 · Score: 4, Informative

Apples and oranges. Carmack was talking about the financial viablity of targeting games to run on desktop Linux. Valve is talking about the two platforms from a developers perspective.

Carmack as said that Valve entering the desktop Linux market changes thinks somewhat.

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Re:What? This story isn't about Linux by not+already+in+use · 2012-08-31 05:19 · Score: 2

Open source drivers for what platform, now? Less knee-jerks, more summary.

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Re:Only Valve can afford to experiment by preaction · 2012-08-31 05:20 · Score: 5, Interesting

Valve as a company is built to experiment. They were experimenting before they had metric fucktons of money (a metric fuckton is 1.7 imperial fucktons). Turning TF2 into "My Pretty Mercenary" (accessorize! explodize!) was an experiment. Steam itself was an experiment. Their experiments have frequently paid off, and now they've got the ability to do even more radical experiments.

Re:Yes, we get it. by Anonymous Coward · 2012-08-31 05:29 · Score: 5, Insightful

>Funny how Valve just *loves* Linux now that Microsoft threatens their primary business model. Meanwhile, John Carmack, who supported Linux before it was trendy and cool and has no financial incentive to shit all over Microsoft claims that Linux is not a good platform for games. Gee, I wonder who I should believe?!?!

John Carmack did not say that linux is not a good platform for games. He said that the games that ID-Software ported on linux did not earn the cost for porting. This is a hard fact.
But, no wonder that this is the case. Most gamers that use linux although have a windows partition for gaming. And when the windows version of a game comes month before the linux version, you already "lost" a big part of the potential linux market to the windows version.

Now, Valve shit their pants because of the windows market, and try to change it. And they have the power. Valve can solve all the distro and patch problems for the developers. If they deliver an easy way for game developers to reach the linux audience, linuxgaming will hopefully be a worthwhile market.

Re:Yes, we get it. by semi-extrinsic · 2012-08-31 05:41 · Score: 3, Insightful

No matter how you twist it, if Linux gets graphics drivers on par with Windows, it is much better for games since it wastes much less resources.

Case in point: My Linux installation at work, which is an 8 core, 16 GB RAM computational workstation, uses 231 MB of RAM after I've logged in. Two days after last reboot, with five terminal windows, Firefox with a dozen tabs, Citrix (to run Outlook, restrictive company Exchange policy...), Gimp, Blender, two additional CAD programs, and two instances of a PDF viewer, I'm still only using 1.7 GB RAM.

On the same system, Windows 7 uses 1.5 GB after I've logged in, no programs running. And yes, I'm using both preload and readahead on the Linux system, so don't give me the "Windows uses RAM to store things it will need in the future" because my Linux does as well.

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Re:Hmmmm by HuguesT · 2012-08-31 05:44 · Score: 2

I think you need to compare the graphics performance of the current crop of Intel integrated GPU with that of the Xbox 360 or the PS2. They are not so far away anymore, perhaps even better.

Since the Xbox is a viable gaming platform, then perhaps an Intel + Steam box would be as well.

Yes, Nvidia and AMD are much better, but does it matter ?

Re:What? This story isn't about Linux by Baloroth · 2012-08-31 06:04 · Score: 4, Insightful

The fact that the open source drivers are on Linux isn't really important to the story at all, asides from the background (i.e. that is the reason Valve are working with open source drivers to max out performance in the first place). The interesting thing is how the OSS allows Valve to tweak or examine the driver code on the fly to find out how to optimize performance.

Reading the summary is great, but understanding the point is even better.

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"None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton

Re:Yes, we get it. by not+already+in+use · 2012-08-31 06:06 · Score: 3, Insightful

>And yes, I'm using both preload and readahead on the Linux system, so don't give me the "Windows uses RAM to store things it will need in the future" because my Linux does as well. If you're *only* using 231MB of 16 gigabytes, you're not caching nearly as many things as it could/should be. The only point you make is that Linux is terrible at putting your system's resources to good use.

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Re:The state of graphics on open source by Baloroth · 2012-08-31 06:13 · Score: 2

Sorry, I won't be even considering running games on my Linux boxes/laptops. I'm running Windows 8 on my gaming laptop and it handles graphics, HDMI out, dual cards, dual monitors, Steam, all games (not just Source games) just fine. Why would I ever subject myself to the mess that is graphics on Linux?

Won't get better unless someone (e.g. Valve) works on fixing it.

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"None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton

Re:What? This story isn't about Linux by not+already+in+use · 2012-08-31 06:16 · Score: 3, Informative

The interesting thing is how the OSS allows Valve to tweak or examine the driver code on the fly to find out how to optimize performance.

Anyone who *actually* games wants to know who the fuck cares about underpowered Intel video card drivers. Oh, it will be able to play 5 year old Valve games? WHOOPTY-FUCKING-DOO.

Perhaps you forgot about the time, years ago, when the FOSS crowd courted ATI, saying "Release your specs! The FOSS community will do the rest!" What did ATI do? They released the specs. An opensource driver was born, and it's an unstable, slow piece of shit. When these FOSS folks realized they weren't technically competent enough to actually create a driver for a modern GPU architecture, they went back to demonizing ATI for not releasing their proprietary driver under a free license.

What's the moral of the story here? Just because something is open source doesn't mean "the community" is going to be able to do shit about it. Intel wants to point and say, "Look! Intel GPU can play 5 year old valve games!" Valve wants to say, "Look, Linux is a viable gaming platform!" At the end of the day, it's totally irrelevant to people who want to play new games on modern GPU's.

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Re:What? This story isn't about Linux by maeglin · 2012-08-31 06:35 · Score: 4, Insightful

The interesting thing is how the OSS allows Valve to tweak or examine the driver code on the fly to find out how to optimize performance.

Anyone who *actually* games wants to know who the fuck cares about underpowered Intel video card drivers. Oh, it will be able to play 5 year old Valve games? WHOOPTY-FUCKING-DOO.

Perhaps you forgot about the time, years ago, when the FOSS crowd courted ATI, saying "Release your specs! The FOSS community will do the rest!" What did ATI do? They released the specs. An opensource driver was born, and it's an unstable, slow piece of shit. When these FOSS folks realized they weren't technically competent enough to actually create a driver for a modern GPU architecture, they went back to demonizing ATI for not releasing their proprietary driver under a free license.

What's the moral of the story here? Just because something is open source doesn't mean "the community" is going to be able to do shit about it. Intel wants to point and say, "Look! Intel GPU can play 5 year old valve games!" Valve wants to say, "Look, Linux is a viable gaming platform!" At the end of the day, it's totally irrelevant to people who want to play new games on modern GPU's.

You are clearly not a big picture person. What this means is that a multi-million dollar company is saving time by using open source. Time saved is money saved, and, using political algebra, every dollar saved is 30 jobs. What did Intel lose? Nothing. Meanwhile, the economy as a whole gains GDP and everyone wins.

But, absolutely, you're right, and the other guy is wrong: this is all useless because you don't like Valve's game line-up.

Re:What? This story isn't about Linux by LordLimecat · 2012-08-31 07:04 · Score: 2

Anyone who *actually* games wants to know who the fuck cares about underpowered Intel video card drivers

Starcraft 2 is 5 years old? Torchlight 1 / 2 are 5 years old? League of Legends is 5 years old? I suppose you could label TF2 and WoW as 5 years old, but that kind of ignores the whole "still actively developed" thing.

All of those work just fine on an underpowered Core i3 2310m, using HD3000. Current gen Ivy Bridge processors are expected to deliver ~10-15% better performance, and IIRC the HD4000 line is ~50% more performance over the 3000.

Re:What? This story isn't about Linux by Baloroth · 2012-08-31 07:07 · Score: 4, Insightful

Anyone who *actually* games wants to know who the fuck cares about underpowered Intel video card drivers. Oh, it will be able to play 5 year old Valve games? WHOOPTY-FUCKING-DOO.

Again, NOT THE POINT. The point is: open source drivers are easier to work with. Creating one for a graphics card yourself? Hard. Writing drivers is always a bitch, thats why they often don't work right (even the closed source ones creating by the people who made the hardware in the first place). Thats why the ATI open source driver kind of sucks. Graphics cards have a ton of out-of-spec tweaks and gimmicks to improve performance, and always have, sometimes even tweaks intended to make a single engine run well. That makes creating your own driver a monumental task, even if you ostensibly have the specs, because those specs are never quite valid. Hell, ATI/Nvidia can't even get their drivers to work right all the time, and they made the damned cards.

All of that is a reason why the ability to work with an existing driver (assuming it is well-made) a huge bonus. Because otherwise you are working with a black box that doesn't ever work exactly as advertised and as it properly should. If you can look at the source, you can try to figure out why. Ideally, the hardware would itself be open too so you could see how far it deviates from the specs (they all do), but we don't live in an ideal world. Thats why I use a close-source driver and probably always will. But it'd be cool if I didn't have to. And that's the point of the story.

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Re:Yes, we get it. by Anonymous Coward · 2012-08-31 07:08 · Score: 2, Informative

On UNIX machines, some filesystems actually use the free memory as a cache, but leave it marked as free in case an application needs them.
UFS for instance does this, while ZFS for instance does not (it uses an explicit cache).

Re:Yes, we get it. by OneAhead · 2012-08-31 07:45 · Score: 3, Interesting

You gotta be trolling. I'm running dual-boot too, and just about everything I do goes so much smoother in Linux than in Windows. From my usability point of view, it feels like windows is just squandering resources. GP's numbers do seem about right to me.

That said, I've always felt uneasy about "comparing the numbers" between Linux and Windows. The way windows' Task Manager reports memory usage is different form the default "top" view, and they're both somewhat nontransparent to the uninitiated because virtual memory management is complicated business. To make an apples-to-apples comparison, one has to precisely analyze how much memory is cached, buffered, swapped, committed and allocated. To make matters more difficult, Linux distros and users have a strong inclination to customize how the kernel manages memory and what software is being loaded, so there will be huge differences between different Linux measurements. And even windows can be leaned out or fattened up to a great extent by users and OEMs.

Re:Yes, we get it. by oursland · 2012-08-31 07:49 · Score: 4, Insightful

You're misunderstanding Valve's position. They're not tweaking the drivers so much as using the source to understand which operations in THEIR software behave poorly. You're also ignorant to how much tweaking is already done in video games to make them work under Windows. Look at the furor Rage's release last year caused because AMD's drivers were broken and id Software didn't jump through hoops to make it work on that platform like so many other companies do.

Re:What? This story isn't about Linux by jedidiah · 2012-08-31 07:57 · Score: 2

Also, you don't have to provide patches. You can also provide good bug reports. These are talented experienced graphics programmers that like to push hardware to it's limits. They are likely to "break things" and kind of know what's going on. They can share this information with the people who need to know.

That could be the community or that could be Nvidia.

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Re:Only Valve can afford to experiment by jedidiah · 2012-08-31 08:03 · Score: 2

This is what game companies that haven't lost their soul do. They experiment. Sometimes the experiment fails, sometimes it becomes the defining work of a genre.

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Re:The state of graphics on open source by jedidiah · 2012-08-31 08:06 · Score: 2

...or just suck it up and use the text mode installer. The card may be newer than your distro. You may need to install 3rd party drivers after the install is done.

Consider it a Windows-ism.

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A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.

Re:What? This story isn't about Linux by bored_engineer · 2012-08-31 08:47 · Score: 2

An opensource driver was born, and it's an unstable, slow piece of shit. When these FOSS folks realized they weren't technically competent enough to actually create a driver for a modern GPU architecture, they went back to demonizing ATI for not releasing their proprietary driver under a free license.

Not quite what I've heard. AMD didn't just release the spec, they also released a driver. . . .and assigned several developers to keep working on it. My own opinion is that the open driver keeps slowly improving, and has been useable for a bit. (With the caveat that I don't play games very often.)

Re:Yes, we get it. by olau · 2012-08-31 11:03 · Score: 2

While we're at John Carmack, he also said that he found the Intel open source drivers really interesting to look at, and recommended it to anyone else writing a graphics engine. He then proceeded to say that if he could clone himself so he would have more time, he would love to work on optimizing them.

So it's not just the Valve developers who see the benefit of open source drivers.

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Valve Finds Open Source Drivers To Be Great

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