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Mozilla OS Looking Grown Up On Its Own Developer Phone
An anonymous reader writes "It's no secret that Mozilla has been working on a mobile OS. Previously codenamed Boot2Gecko, the project focused on a purely HTML5 based system that worked in many ways like current mobile devices. As the project grew into Mozilla OS, the company has laid out a partnership with ZTE that will have real world devices in certain markets early next year. Testing for this OS had previously consisted of a compiled ROM that would be flashed over a handful of Android devices. Now, Mozilla has moved into full fledged product evaluation mode with their own custom developer phone."
I suppose there will be a degree of negativity about boot to gecko, along the lines of "they've already lost" and "they should focus on fixing the browser".
Personally, I wish them every success. Firefox has been great, and the idea of a phone OS built by a non-profit whose only agenda revolves around standards, privacy, user control, openness and general sanity will be a refreshing change from the likes of Apple, Google, and Microsoft. It actually seems to be happening, too, unlike so many other projects we hear about.
(But if you want some negativity - given that they're primarily funded by Google, and presumably don't have a massive patent war chest, they'll probably be sunk if they ever get anywhere. Time to donate!)
I really doubt that this is good direction. It's the greatest lock-down of all time. Every web-app (Google Docs etc) is behind the greatest DRM of all time, just like Blizzards Diablo 3.
The only reason this haven't ben discussed on Slashdot before is because it's been Google that has been developing fully browser based OS, and Google fanboys have de-routed every intelligent discussion about the merits of Chrome/Firefox OS.
Sorry, but in my opinion we must stop this development here and keep our native open and closed source apps. You can't even disassemble browser apps, all you have is the front-end. At least with Windows and MS apps I know they are going to stay around and work when I need them.
didn't they already announce something like this?
http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/07/mozilla-dumps-boot2gecko-name-firefox-os-tktktk/
the picture in this article sure as fuck looks like a reflashed android though! pretty full fledged, but that's zte for you..
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
my question is: how easy is it to get on good side of FAA (or your country's fly-or-no-fly agency)...?
It sounds a lot like WebOS to me.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
How is this different in architecture from HP's WebOS?
I was promised a flying car. Where is my flying car?
i have been running this on my laptop for curiousity value.
it works very well, and writing new applications for it is very very easy because its just all web development with html, jsand css.
makes it very quick and easy.
also webgl works. Unlike Iphone and android.
i actually think that this will be big, but take time for people to appreciate it.
for companies and startups its hell getting android and iphone apps out, but with this is easy peasy.
the main thing will be that cordova (phone gap) support it, so that people can write in web technologies and still deploy to android, iphone and firefox os easily
So if everyting is HTML5 then presumably this is going to be like WebOS or apple's Dashboard apps? Didn't Facebook recently retreat from HTML5 to native? Then there's the grim history of javas early promise of write once run everywhere. Has HTML5 grown up so much that it can finally pull it off? or is this more than HTML5
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
From what I've read of B2G/Mozilla OS is that it will be lightweight and be able to run on cheap low-end phones. If it can deliver a smooth, slick interface and/or longer battery life on cheap phones better than equivalent android phones then it could well take market share. The way way we will find out is when they start shipping.
Has anyone used this OS yet, and can share some thoughts on it?
I'm a bit worried that it's a low cost (and probably relative slow) phone, while at the same time HTML5 can be a pretty heavy load.
I myself am not very fond of Android, and I will not buy anything from Apple or Microsoft. IMO The market can use another platform, especially when it is a portable platform with portable apps.
Well, don't worry about that. We can get you back before you leave. (Dr. Who)
How is it negative to want Firefox improved, rather than having them waste resources on some half-assed "operating system" for phones?
Firefox is a product that many millions of people actually use on a daily basis. It's also a product that exhibits poor performance and excessive memory usage. That means it's a perfect candidate for improvement. The need for improvement is clearly there, and there are many people who would benefit from said improvement.
Yes, it is better now than it was several years ago, but that's mainly because of extreme competition from Chrome. It could still be so much better, however. Its users are still BEGGING for Firefox's performance to be improved, and its memory usage to be reduced. Nobody is begging for yet another a mobile "operating system", especially not one from Mozilla.
Lets see, the whole ecosystem will depend upon android running gecko at a reasonable speed. The weakest link in any js, css based environment will be the web itself. So essentially the core phone apps that do not connect to the net need to be bullet proof speed daemons to make a dent in the market.
Big question is how well does the core work when the phone is just being used as a phone, camera, audio recorder/player, video recorder/player or office notation device.
Speaking from my experience with the Windows phone environment where doing anything as simple as taking notes requires a ridiculous number of steps to use the device, Mozilla can become the killa of devices if they concentrate on making access to simple functions like taking notes, saving files, browsing your storage, recording video and voice and the other things that smart phones can do, easy to access. Without having to go through a tonne of screen press steps.
Hint, create access to simple functions as a browser button that is accessible at any time regardless of the screen app that is current. Then on all apps have a back button to return to the last function. If you hit the back button twice it will return you to the home screen and save any changes that you have made to a file, recording etc automatically. KEEP IT SIMPLE and you will succeed where Microsoft and others are failing miserably.
Google chrome had the right idea and the time for a desktop/home screen that does it through one interface has arrived. This does not mean that you need to be online to access the cloud for text editing or whatever and if Mozilla does it right where all the others try to send you off to the cloud to do simple things and store things at extra bandwidth cost then Mozilla could succeed big time in the phone OS world. Yes there is a huge market for Palm like devices and sending everything to and accessing the cloud is just too expensive and time consuming for the majority of people who want a smart phone. Microsoft, Apple and Google might find that their cloud centric universe can piss on them sometimes.
Personally the only thing I use my smart phone for is taking audio notes, video notes, written notes, and photos. Of course telephony is important but the cloud certainly is not! Yes I can facebook or gmail or whatever but that is not what I spend all my time doing and the majority of the myriad of small business smart phone users like myself are in the same boat.
With RIM about to bite the green weenie, Mozilla has the chance to step into the world of small business in a big way if they play their hand right as NOONE is going to unseat Apple and Google in the consumer smart phone market not even Microshaft.
"The browser is the OS," ring any bells?
Since when is anthropomorphizing a piece of software named for a ficticious form of fauna insulting?
You should checkout the fully 3D HTML/JS FPS
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/demos/detail/bananabread
Oops!
There was a problem starting Bananabread. Please see the Troubleshooting section below for more information.
Technical Details: WebGL is missing.
=======
That much about web based apps that just work.
Wiki says:
"Mozilla Firefox - WebGL has been enabled on all platforms that have a capable graphics card with updated drivers since version 4.0"
Last firefox, ati 5770, what the heck?
HTML5 is quite good when someone implements it properly. Not everyone wants Google sticking their nose in everything they do. This is a good alternative.
works for me
No, HTML not written for apps is very relevant. HTML provides next to zero ready-made GUI elements, nor layouts.
Next to zero, but not zero. It does in fact provide ready-made GUI elements, and in fact it's most if not all of what you need to build a functional (if ugly) interface even without CSS.
This leads to DIVeritis, laden with classes and id's.
Who cares? You're not meant to edit the HTML directly.
These are all "stringly typed" at best and thus hard to maintain, harder to debug and refactor.
These can all be generated programmatically, which can be done by a widget library atop Javascript.
CSS is also not suited for apps: you cannot copy/paste a widget from somewhere and expect it to render exactly as in the example.
Your argument is that it makes copy/paste less trivial than other systems in which you might build widgets?
Sure, with some effort even HTML-based apps can look "native" and good, but from what I've seen from Tizen and FirefoxOS the HTML-code to get there is simply atrocious.
Who are you, and why should I care about your opinion?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
IMHO, the best thing about this is you get a nice OS without the Google or Apple lock-in (how stupid is it that you have to create an account in order to use your phone?).
That, and you don't have to be logged in all the time. It's the same as your desktop: you choose the level of privacy you want.
I'm not a lawyer, but I play one on the Internet. Blog
I believe these devices are called "Otoro", because that is what it says on this page:
"Otoro
Otoro is a phone being used as a test and development platform as a low-to-midrange smartphone. Most core Firefox OS developers are working on Otoro."
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Boot_to_Gecko/B2G_build_prerequisites
New things are always on the horizon
Yes, the S2 is a one of the development phones of Firefox OS.
New things are always on the horizon
"Sure, with some effort even HTML-based apps can look "native" and good, but from what I've seen from Tizen and FirefoxOS the HTML-code to get there is simply atrocious."
Funny, as this discussion is on a page which discusses Firefox OS. So the HTML-based apps are native to the platform.
New things are always on the horizon
Their "catching name" will probably be Firefox OS (or maybe people will be able to buy a "Firefox Phone"). Firefox is a name which many people already know.
I don't see how that is a bad idea.
New things are always on the horizon
Actually Firefox OS does not tarket the high-end phone market, but the lower end.
HTML5-applications don't need to depend on a server. Anything which will be on the phone by default will certainly not depend on an Internet connection.
New things are always on the horizon
You're a moron. This phone has high-end specs, where there are Android phones still selling in the US which are lower-spec than FirefoxOS is targeting, and which are going, non-subsidized, for as low as $40. There is no lower-end than that, and FirefoxOS most certainly will not out-perform Android.
http://www.virginmobileusa.com/shop/cell-phones/venture-phone/features/
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
Does about:support say anything useful about why WebGL is not enabled for you?
The cool thing about developing apps for this phone is that should be fairly simple for Mozilla to provide a compatibility wrapper for Android and iOS, so you get cross-phone app development.
Any thoughts on Enyo?
enyojs.com/showcase/
Thanks!
People may buy this product if it is better or at least as good as what's currently on offer. That means offering solid software, solid hardware, and solid services.
It will be interesting to see if Mozilla can succeed here. They don't have a track record of releasing hits; only the Firefox browser really took off and that's because it was an excellent and better alternative to its competition at the time.
I just hope for their sake that they don't go with the "it's better because it's open" line. Being open is not what made a bunch of people download Firefox, and it won't make a bunch of people buy a phone.
"We live in a global world" - Harvey Pitt, former Securities and Exchange Commission Chairman
Thanks you! You just made my point! My laptop gets 8-15FPS while running this HTML5 web demo in H/W accel. Firefox. When I run the Native version of Cube I get over 100FPS.
Do you see the problem now? My laptop is much more powerful than that hardware they are targeting, but all of the built in and downloaded apps will be gimped by this HTML "technology".
For those of you interested, try it out yourself:
Cube 2: Sauerbraten:
http://cubeengine.com/files.php4
Firefox HTML5 Cube 2 port:
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/demos/detail/bananabread