Google Announces New Nexus Smartphone and Tablets

No Strings Attached? by Anonymous Coward · 2012-10-29 05:17 · Score: 2, Interesting

$299, no contracts, and those specs? Maybe it's time I finally paid attention to the smartphone market and finally bought one. I've not kept up though - will I have to have any kind of "google account" or "phone home to google" stuff enabled to use this phone properly? And if so, how hard would it be to jailbreak the thing and fully change that (without introducing additional issues)?

Re:No Strings Attached? by ThatsMyNick · 2012-10-29 05:23 · Score: 5, Informative

Nope, it is optional. You cannot use the play store without associating the phone with the Google Account though. You could use Amazon App Store, which has most apps. You could side load apps (just copy them to the system apps folder), if you have the apk and you are rooted (I dont know of a reliable site, where you can get the apk file from though)
Re:No Strings Attached? by Nerdfest · 2012-10-29 05:24 · Score: 5, Informative

I don't think you need to be rooted to install APK files ... just drop them on the phone and run them.
Re:No Strings Attached? by Beavertank · 2012-10-29 05:24 · Score: 4, Informative

You'll need a google account if you want to use the Google Play Store (the app market from google) but you can install the Amazon Appstore (which uses an amazon account) instead if you prefer. Otherwise no, you don't have to have a google account to use the phone. Because it's a Nexus device you should be able to unlock the bootloader in a simple process (usually as simple as checking a box in settings and rebooting) then you can flash it with any custom ROM you want. So if you don't trust the default ROM not to phone home you can use a community created one instead (and also since it's a Nexus device a community for producing these custom ROMs should grow quite fast once it's in people's hands).
Re:No Strings Attached? by HTMLSpinnr · 2012-10-29 05:27 · Score: 3, Informative

There's a bit missing in those details. $299 buys the 8GB version, and $349 buys the 16GB version. There is no 32GB version, and a CDMA/LTE version was not announced - these are solely Pentaband HSPA+ devices for now. Or... you can ultimately pay more and go T-Mobile subsidized if you can't handle that much out of pocket at once with $199 out of pocket and $20/mo in subsidies for at least 20 months (Value plan, or $20 more/mo for the plan in general over Value for 2 years if Classic plan).

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$ man woman *
-bash: /usr/bin/man: Argument list too long
Re:No Strings Attached? by brian.swetland · 2012-10-29 05:46 · Score: 5, Informative

This is correct. Just check the "unknown sources" option under settings and you can install apps from pretty much anywhere (web, email, etc) -- the system will show what permissions the app needs and obtain permission to install it (or not) from the user.
Re:No Strings Attached? by spire3661 · 2012-10-29 06:07 · Score: 4, Insightful

Under that criteria, i could label the power button a 'gaping security hole'

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Good-bye
Re:No Strings Attached? by scot4875 · 2012-10-29 06:37 · Score: 5, Insightful

You mean that gaping security hole that still requires the user to confirm their desire to install things after they've been shown a fine-grained list of permissions that said things require?
Unlike Apple, other phone manufacturers don't believe that locking you in a padded room with children's safety scissors is an acceptable practice.
--Jeremy

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Jesus was a liberal
Re:No Strings Attached? by Gen_Music · 2012-10-29 06:45 · Score: 2

Consider something like a ZTE blade. For $50 you can do all that and a lot more on a reasonable second gen smartphone. Unlocked from the get go, HDSPA, wi-fi, multi-touch, and most of the the apps from the Play Store. The screen is about iPhone 3G-era, which is great for the bucks. And its sold around the world at a low price, wherever you are. Sometimes under the name Orange San Francisco, but its the same thing just carrier locked (£18 unlock for non-customers in the UK).
Re:No Strings Attached? by guises · 2012-10-29 07:00 · Score: 3, Informative

With my Nexus 7 there was no option to boot the first time without first setting up a Google account. I don't think this is such a big deal, I set up a separate throwaway account with each of my devices, but that annoyed me.

I'm also a little annoyed that I got my Nexus 7 just a month ago... Would certainly have waited for one of these here Nexus 4's.
Re:No Strings Attached? by h4rr4r · 2012-10-29 07:16 · Score: 2

Then how would an app that sends out sms on a schedule work?
I have to approve each time it sends?
Re:No Strings Attached? by Miamicanes · 2012-10-29 08:50 · Score: 3, Interesting

The gaping hole in Android's security model is the fact that in order to have an app that fetches location-based ads over the internet, uses wi-fi (instead of GPS) for coarse location, and has the ability to pause when the phone rings or cooperate nicely with alerts and other apps, you basically have to give the app the right to do almost everything up to and including scrape your phone logs and dump them over the internet to the developer's server, then eavesdrop on your LAN's traffic and report it as well.
I don't have time to repost the whole essay I've written a few times detailing a provider-agnostic framework for adserving that keeps apps from leaking private user info by moving responsibility by proxying the network calls to fetch the ad content through Android itself in a way that allows users to say, "I trust Android to not leak my private info, but not this specific app... I'll allow this app to treat Android's new adserver API like a semi-black box to fetch ads in a way that prevents apps from injecting values not carved into stone in android-manifest.xml, and has Android itself inject sensitive values so the app itself can't touch them, and makes the requests in non-realtime with somewhat randomized timing through Google's adproxy (or a trusted CDN, for larger advertising agencies with the resources to pay someone like Akamai) that masquerades the user's IP address (so developers can't comb through logs and match up ad requests with IP addresses).
If Android did something like this, the laundry list of permissions that 98% of modern Android apps end up requiring could be concisely boiled down to:
* Display anonymized, location-based ads fetched over the internet in a way that does not reveal your current IP address or personally-identifiable information to advertisers or the app's developer, and does not allow apps to use it as a back door to leak information over the internet by injecting runtime values specified by the application itself into the ad request or by varying the timing of its network requests to convey private information to a remote server.
The requirement that values either be filled in by Android itself (in a black-box manner that keeps the values away from the app) or declared immutably via android-manifest.xml, and slightly-randomized non-realtime ad-fetching and timing is necessary to keep apps from using runtime values or timing attacks to leak information. If ads are fetched on demand by the app, the developer could modulate the request timing itself to convey one bit of data at a time, over a long period (ex: requesting new ad within 1 minute of last request == 1, requesting new ad after 2 minutes of last request == 0, requesting new ad after 3+ minutes = escape, resume as directed by the next few bits... over the span of an hour, you could leak 30-60 bits of data).
The hard part would be making it vendor-agnostic and not handing an ad monopoly to Google, without excluding ad agencies who don't have the resources of Akamai (hence, the transparent trusted anonymizing proxy for fetching the ad data itself).
Re:No Strings Attached? by Miamicanes · 2012-10-29 09:05 · Score: 3, Funny

This application wants to send a text message (_content_) to _number_. How should I handle it?
[ ] Deny, and ask me for permission next time.
[ ] Deny, and disable this app ([ ]until (*)tomorrow, ( )next week, ( )next month)
[ ] Deny, and uninstall this app
[ ] Allow this time
[ ] Allow until tomorrow
[ ] Allow until next week
[ ] Allow forever
[ ] Allow if (_click to select app_), which implements IGatekeeper, says it's OK to allow.
Re:No Strings Attached? by guises · 2012-10-29 09:43 · Score: 4, Informative

Yes, that's what I got. If you click "no", it prompts you to create an account. There's no way to continue without either signing in with an existing account or creating a new one. That's a particular problem if you don't have a Wifi network to connect through - you pretty well can't use your device at all without connecting to Google at least once.

(That isn't completely true - you can root your tablet and install a third party ROM without connecting to Google, but that's kinda outside the spirit of the question.)
Re:No Strings Attached? by AmiMoJo · 2012-10-29 11:45 · Score: 3, Informative

You can of course just make a Google account for that device, using a disposable email address to sign up and never entering any personal info. You don't need credit card details or anything like that.

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const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Re:No Strings Attached? by AmiMoJo · 2012-10-30 01:24 · Score: 2

The gaping hole in Android's security model is the fact that in order to have an app that fetches location-based ads over the internet, uses wi-fi (instead of GPS) for coarse location, and has the ability to pause when the phone rings or cooperate nicely with alerts and other apps, you basically have to give the app the right to do almost everything up to and including scrape your phone logs and dump them over the internet to the developer's server, then eavesdrop on your LAN's traffic and report it as well.
That simply isn't true. You don't even need permission to receive events when the phone rings, but you do need to ask if you want to read phone logs or access your files. You can't eavesdrop on LAN traffic because Android doesn't support putting the wifi or mobile data radios in "receive all" mode. There are some hacks to do it on certain rooted devices with supported chipsets, but not on unrooted systems.
Location is actually two separate and specific permissions - precise (GPS) or coarse (wifi/mobile network), and they don't give you access to the actual wifi network names or anything like that.
About the only thing you are correct about is internet access, which is all or nothing. Android has really fine grained permissions, allowing apps to do things like prevent the phone from sleeping while not being able to actually change any of the screen timeout or sleep related settings.

--
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Anonymous Coward · 2012-10-29 05:19 · Score: 4, Informative

Pentile is a specific design type (ie IPS), retina is a marketing term for high resolution.

Booyah!! by erroneus · 2012-10-29 05:21 · Score: 5, Interesting

I knew there was a reason I didn't buy the Samsung Galaxy S3. Among the reasons:

1. To get it 'affordably' I would have to buy it from a wireless carrier... oh yeah and extend or buy a new contract with expensive data plan.
2. To get it otherwise, I would have to pay about $500... that's an expensive toy.
3. The darkest color I could get is blue...blue?! Really? Something wrong with black or grey? White is for chicks and Apple users.
4. When you get a phone through a carrier which is carrier branded, unless it's an iPhone, then the carrier is responsible for firmware updates. In cases like that, you will either never get one or it will be extremely late in coming and will contain even more bloatware than before.

Something told me that if I were to just hold off a little longer, I could get my next phone without all the trouble, And there we have it... A new Nexus 4 heading to my pocket in the near future.

As for the new tablet?? Well... that's kinda pricy. I've got a Nexus 7 and I'm pretty happy with it. But then again, the price was extremely reasonable. $500?? That's well within my "balk" range... the $200-$250 range is well within my "I'll strongly consider it" window. And a phone without obligations at $299? And likely to support high speed data options (which I will not likely use or pay for)? It's a no-brainer.

Re:Booyah!! by Rich0 · 2012-10-29 09:22 · Score: 2

T-Mobile. If you live in a well-populated area chances are they're fine. The only time I've ever had poor signal was out in the boonies, and I'm only very rarely out in the boonies.
Re:Booyah!! by asdf7890 · 2012-10-29 11:26 · Score: 3, Informative

There is a rather useful search engine run by a company you may heard off, that helpfully directed me to the official specs when I made an appropriate enquiry: https://play.google.com/store/devices/details?id=nexus_4_8gb

The dimensions are listed there, to the precision of 0.1mm (no word on the accuracy though).

Still no microSD? by Daetrin · 2012-10-29 05:24 · Score: 5, Informative

All the leaks seemed to indicate the Nexus 4 would have no microSD slot, and none of the news this morning seems to contradict that. I'd pick one up in an instant if not for that fault.

My ancient Nexus One has an 8 GB microSD card in it, and that filled up ages ago. So getting the 8 GB Nexus 4 would be a non-starter, and i don't expect it would take me long to fill up the 16 GB version either. I don't care what Google says, streaming everything off the cloud is not an option. I'm happy with T-Mobile for the price i'm paying, but they don't have the best coverage. (And from what i understand other carriers that have better coverage have stricter limits on data usage instead.)

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This Space Intentionally Left Blank

Re:Still no microSD? by LodCrappo · 2012-10-29 05:27 · Score: 3, Informative

out of curiosity, what did you fill up 8gb with? I went for the 16gb version of the nexus 7 and after 2 months and literally hundreds of apps have only 2gb used, thinking I should have saved the $50 and got the 8gb version.

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-Lod
Re:Still no microSD? by HTMLSpinnr · 2012-10-29 05:38 · Score: 3, Interesting

I'm not the OP, but in my case, At least 7GB of the ~13GB available on /sdcard (partition, not actual removable media) in my Nexus S is music which I listen to on occasion - mostly in my car or on a flight. The balance (when closer to full) is pictures before transferring to local network or cloud storage or Apps installed to USB (no longer required for Nexus 4's monolothic partition), etc. Amazon MP3 with CloudDrive storage solves the balance of my music problem (you don't have to marry yourself to Google Play for everything). For most, it's simply silly to carry around your entire collection. It's unlikely you'll want all of it available, thus learning to place effective selection criteria when picking what goes to your device helps manage the size constraint.

Personally, I'd feel constrained by 8GB, but not by 16GB once you realize that even 8GB of "music" is more than anyone needs unless they're spending a TON of time away from the balance of their library. What will put the squeeze on things are 8MP photos and full HD video. Provided I can offload my photos to cloud storage (via Wifi thanks) or home storage, I can live with this level of storage. Thus, I'll be buying the 16GB version to replace my Nexus S.

Now if they had 32GB at $429, this would be a compelling compromise/price point, and would shut down many of the "it's too small" comments.

--
$ man woman *
-bash: /usr/bin/man: Argument list too long
Re:Still no microSD? by farble1670 · 2012-10-29 05:38 · Score: 2

if you install a lot of games, the space goes quick. it's not uncommon for a game to take up over 1GB of local storage. i have one (bard's tale) that takes up over 1.6GB.
also, if you ever want to pre-load movie rips, you are looking at 700MB-1.4GB each.
Re:Still no microSD? by m1ss1ontomars2k4 · 2012-10-29 05:41 · Score: 2

No idea about Daetrin's exact situation, but like him, I can't possibly afford to stream everything from the cloud. I filled up most of a 32 GB microSD card with music and video; if it weren't for the video I'd only need maybe 16 GB. Let's see--should I pay an extra $10/month for a (much) larger data plan, or should I get a phone with a microSD slot and buy a 32 GB microSD card for like $25? Of course, it's complicated by the fact that the kind of phone that comes with a microSD slot is very different from the kind of phone that doesn't--if you want updates directly from Google there's no other option other than a Nexus device, etc.
Re:Still no microSD? by clutch110 · 2012-10-29 05:46 · Score: 5, Interesting

I don't think that is the main reason as Android now uses MTP to allow concurrent access to the SD card. It is my belief that one of the reasons behind the lack of any sort of SD card is the possibility of it impacting the user experience. If you put in a cheap slow SD card then the apps located there slow to a crawl. With the built in flash storage, it should run to whatever standard Google demanded. I also believe this is one of the reasons Apple refuses to include expansion capabilities, the other of course the ability to charge a huge premium on upgraded space. For the Nexus 4 the bump from 8 to 16GB is only a $50 up-charge which isn't that bad in my opinion.
Re:Still no microSD? by the+eric+conspiracy · 2012-10-29 05:55 · Score: 4, Insightful

Media. Audiobooks in my case.
Re:Still no microSD? by tepples · 2012-10-29 06:06 · Score: 2

Amazon MP3 with CloudDrive storage solves the balance of my music problem
Provided you're using your phone on Wi-Fi at home or at a public hotspot, or you can afford a big data plan.

For most, it's simply silly to carry around your entire collection. It's unlikely you'll want all of it available
Unless you want to play a particular song for someone else who's in the room or in the vehicle.
Re:Still no microSD? by spire3661 · 2012-10-29 06:13 · Score: 2

I like to load recorded TV on mine. 128 GB is the bare minimum i need to operate at the volume i want to. Im paitently waiting on the new NAND process to come online and make bigger modules available. Google is artificially restricting how much memory these devices can hold to force you through their services. Its punishment, not innovation.

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Good-bye
Re:Still no microSD? by plover · 2012-10-29 06:42 · Score: 4, Insightful

I think the real reason to not have an SD card would be that that Google is subtly trying to push consumers into the cloud. Flash drives don't make them extra money. But Google Drives do.

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John
Re:Still no microSD? by aliquis · 2012-10-29 07:03 · Score: 2

I don't know but I can only guess that having all VNV Nation albums alone would be 2+ GB, possibly 2.5.
Sure you could argue that once you have all VNV Nation albums you don't need any other music.
But I think that's wrong.
You at least need Complex - Dope, Skaven - War in the middle earth, Captain - Space debris & Beyond music, Jester - Stardust memories (Tip & Firefox - Enigma)
It's hard to argue your life could ever be complete without them.
Complex - Dope: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_yJ5M3BY2Ts
Skaven - War in the middle earth: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGJQYYYTICU
Captain - Space debris: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thnXzUFJnfQ
Captain - Beyond music: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlOxf9a2Eik
Jester - Stardust memories: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLMhBE99byM (Fasttracker version and decent sound card make it sound too harsh - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hY9p1oiE1_Y)
Enjoy. Those five tracks contain more creativity, total ownage, scenery, awesomeness, geek life and last longer than any of the current tablets has brought to the table together.
R.I.P.
Re:Still no microSD? by knarf · 2012-10-29 07:25 · Score: 3, Insightful

It is my belief that one of the reasons behind the lack of any sort of SD card is the possibility of it impacting the user experience.
"Hook, Line and Sinker". Look it up.
The real reason for the lack of an SD slot is this: "Pricing starts at $399 with 16GB of storage and tops out at $499 for the 32GB model"
When was it again that 16 GB of flash cost $100?

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--frank[at]unternet.org
Re:Still no microSD? by farble1670 · 2012-10-29 08:19 · Score: 2

I don't know but I can only guess that having all VNV Nation albums alone would be 2+ GB, possibly 2.5.
then upload them to google music, and then they only use up 0 bytes of local storage.
Re:Still no microSD? by batkiwi · 2012-10-29 08:42 · Score: 2

Not everyone has unlimited data plans, and not all areas have 100% coverage on the way to/from work (including tunnels/sparse areas/etc).
Re:Still no microSD? by rsborg · 2012-10-29 11:59 · Score: 2
I don't know but I can only guess that having all VNV Nation albums alone would be 2+ GB, possibly 2.5.
then upload them to google music, and then they only use up 0 bytes of local storage.
Places where this idea fails:
- Airplane without internet service (ie, most)
- In a location where cell service is horrible
- In a car where you pass by a weak or locked wifi point and you're on promiscuous mode
- If you have a wifi-only device, anywhere you don't have wifi
Streaming only really makes sense for home/work situations where you are unlikely to hit a bandwidth availability issue or data cap. Travelling anywhere means it's a crap-shoot, so local storage is as important as ever. I've filled up my 64GB iDevices with plenty of content and have run out of space before taking movies. There is no reason to not get the most available storage of any device you get unless it will never leave home.
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Make sure everyone's vote counts: Verified Voting

A better link. by Tomun · 2012-10-29 05:27 · Score: 5, Informative

http://googleblog.blogspot.co.uk/2012/10/nexus-best-of-google-now-in-three-sizes.html

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Quila · 2012-10-29 05:39 · Score: 4, Informative

And Apple "Retina" displays are also IPS. Pentile basically means you can forget the resolution number they give. It's probably not going to look as clear as an iPad even though the resolution specs are higher.

Re:"True HD"? by farble1670 · 2012-10-29 05:40 · Score: 3, Insightful

negative. HD == 720p, which is ~1280x720px.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-definition_television

Re:No LTE. Less space than an iPhone. Lame. by farble1670 · 2012-10-29 05:41 · Score: 4, Insightful

1/2 the price of an iphone. win.

Nexus 10 needs better designers by JDG1980 · 2012-10-29 05:42 · Score: 4, Informative

They managed to cram some awesome hardware into the Nexus 10. 2560x1600 at a $399 price point is very, very good.

But the physical design of the tablet – there's no way to sugarcoat this – is butt-ugly. Why did they have to make the bezel so huge? And asymmetrical? (I suppose that latter factor may have been a precaution against being sued by Apple.) Even though the hardware inside is great, the exterior just looks cheap. It looks like what you'd find on a $99 Archos tablet. Samsung's other designs are much more elegant than this.

I'm not at all impressed by the lack of a SD card slot. I loathe the "cloud" (and since this is a Wi-Fi-only device, it's not a viable solution anyway), and I'm not going to spend an extra $100 for 16GB extra of flash memory that cost the vendor under $10. Admittedly, this doesn't make Google/Samsung any worse than Apple on this front, but I had hoped they might actually do better.

Also, is there a physical home button? I can't tell from the photos. A tablet needs at least that one physical button.

Re:Nexus 10 needs better designers by cduffy · 2012-10-29 06:50 · Score: 4, Insightful

I loathe the "cloud" (and since this is a Wi-Fi-only device, it's not a viable solution anyway)
How many people carrying around a Nexus 10 won't have a Bluetooth-enabled smartphone in their pockets?
If the tablet always has connectivity when it's near your phone, why would you want to pay your carrier $30/mo (or whatever) for the privilege of having separate connectivity?
Re:Nexus 10 needs better designers by Anonymous Coward · 2012-10-29 10:01 · Score: 2, Insightful

Why I would want to buy a smartphone when my 7" and 10" tablets ARE MY PHONES?
Samsung understood that in their Galaxy Tab series by adding GSM radio to 3G models in first place.
I have 7" model and it replaced my Lumia smartphone. I have now a tablet and smartphone in one nifty 7" form. 72GB storage and I don't need to worry about battery in heavy use for 3-4 days. I is such a solid package that any smartphone doesn't even come a close.
And for GSM Voice calls, I have a bluetooth dongle as I keep tablet in my pocket (fits to all pockets perfectly, if not wearing a swim suit!) and when at home, I can still hold tablet on my ear in old fashion way or enable speaker to make normal conference call, or use 3.5mm hands-free if so.
41 day standby, about 8.5-9 hours video continues 720 videoplay at full screen brightness and talk times 2G = about 30 hours and 3G about 20 hours.
I must say, Galaxy Tab 2 7" 3G is coming pretty boring device because it isn't anymore fight or thinking when I need to recharge it, where is my laptop/tablet/smartphone or anything else.
Even this is written with my tablet. I use "thumb keyboard" from playstore and it gives me very fast typing speeds what is nearly same as avarage typer does.
Oh, just to fuck your mind. I pay unlimited data speed and amount 2 euros a month. I get max speed what carriers networks (not just my carrier network but my contract allows me to swap to any carrier in my country, now 5, network if having better signal there) what is HSPA+ now because I have 3G device. If place my SIM to 4G device, I get max 4G speed.
I rarely get lower than HSDPA speeds, minimal being around 7MBits but typica is between 12-18 MBits down and 5-7Mbits up. So downloading something over 2 megabytes per second isn't "WHOA" but just normal.
And all that just for 2 euros a month.... 2 year contract what ends in 18 months.
Re:Nexus 10 needs better designers by kllrnohj · 2012-10-29 11:50 · Score: 2

Also, is there a physical home button? I can't tell from the photos. A tablet needs at least that one physical button.
There's not one, not two, but *THREE* physical buttons! Power, volume up, and volume down - just like on the Xoom and the Nexus 7.

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Anonymous Coward · 2012-10-29 05:44 · Score: 5, Informative

Apple's retina displays are also a "lottery". They are not all from the same manufacturer. The lower quality ones have IR (image retention, kind of like short term (a few minutes) screen burn in). The samsung displays are superior to the lg ones, here is a 350+ page thread from fanboys as proof https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4034848?start=255&tstart=0

Lack of CDMA/4G LTE option disappointing by tguyton · 2012-10-29 05:44 · Score: 2

I'm sure I'm not the only Verizon user disappointed with the lack of a CDMA/4G LTE version. Especially if it was also offered at $300 unsubsidized, I'm sure there would be many people interested since it will allow users to retain any pre-existing unlimited data plans. Hopefully they have something in the works - I would really love for my next phone to be a Nexus device (especially given how much I'm enjoying my Nexus 7), but I'm not willing to change carriers and lose my current plan with discounts for it.

Re:Lack of CDMA/4G LTE option disappointing by Miamicanes · 2012-10-29 09:21 · Score: 2

That's a lame excuse. Put the LTE module on a daughtercard, sell the phone without it, and users with AT&T/Verizon/Sprint/MetroPCS can buy their carrier's LTE module, rip off the back, plug it in, and snap it back on. Or really, just put the RF amplifier and antenna on the daughtercard. I believe there's even a company in Japan that came up with a standard ~10 years ago for more or less this purpose (allowing users to buy a radio module from their carrier, and stick it into a phone made by someone else. If you think the US is bad, Japan is even worse when it comes to mobile networks with proprietary, closed phones).
There's no reason a phone with LTE can't be "open". The radio modem's firmware has nothing whatsoever to do with Android. It lives in its own firewalled universe. All Android does is pass the flash data to it when updating. If the radio modem wants to reject the new firmware, it can and will.
The whole issue with CDMA Nexi was a spat between Qualcomm (not wanting to release the source to peripherals on their SoC that had nothing to do with the actual phone/rf functionality), Verizon (not wanting open devices, period), and the reality that the existence of semi-open firmware for Sprint phones makes hacking Verizon phones with more or less identical hardware a lot easier. Verizon was vehemently opposed, Sprint was either indifferent (or too broke and poor to matter), and Qualcomm just stonewalled Google until they got frustrated and gave up.

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by ackthpt · 2012-10-29 05:45 · Score: 2

And Apple "Retina" displays are also IPS. Pentile basically means you can forget the resolution number they give. It's probably not going to look as clear as an iPad even though the resolution specs are higher.

Perhaps you mean sharp it's been my experience with a number of small CE items that higher resolution does not produce a sharp display, unless the graphic handling provides sufficient contrast. I have one device which has very high resolution for a 3 inch screen, but looks somewhat blurred and faded. Lower resolution, better backlighting or higher intensity LEDs would serve the user better.

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A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Sponge+Bath · 2012-10-29 05:49 · Score: 2

Got me the strangest woman
Believe it, this chick's no cinch
When I wanna get her goin'
Then I whip out my Big Ten Inch...

...Nexus tablet computer.

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Enderandrew · 2012-10-29 05:53 · Score: 5, Interesting

I'm literally holding an iPhone 4S and Samsung S3 in my hand at the same time (work phone and personal phone).

The S3 has the supposedly crappy pentile display, the 4S has the non-pentile display, with a higher DPI to boot.

Yet text is far crisper and easier to read on the S3 because Apple doesn't know how to do sub-pixel hinting for reasons I can't comprehend.

--
http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.

What PenTile means by tepples · 2012-10-29 05:55 · Score: 3, Informative

The common RGBG version of PenTile has green pixels on the pixel centers and red and blue between pairs of pixels. So you get only half the effective horizontal resolution for any border between black, red, blue, or magenta objects or between green, yellow, cyan, or white objects.

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Anonymous Coward · 2012-10-29 05:55 · Score: 5, Informative

It's not that they don't know how to do it; it's that they choose not to.

Jeff Atwood gives a good commentary on why they choose not to here: http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2007/06/font-rendering-respecting-the-pixel-grid.html

Re:me like! by Enderandrew · 2012-10-29 05:56 · Score: 4, Informative

I don't think any of the major US wireless carriers offer discounted monthly rates for buying your phone outright. You might as well reap the price of discounted phones if your bill is the same rate.

In Europe, you have the option of a contract subsidizing your phone, or no contract and a cheaper rate, but buying an expensive phone outright upfront.

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Reliable site for APKs by tepples · 2012-10-29 05:59 · Score: 3, Informative

I dont know of a reliable site, where you can get the apk file from though

Ideally, the publisher of a Free, free, freemium, or ad-supported application would distribute an APK on the application's web site, usable by anybody who has turned on "Unknown sources". A reliable site will use HTTPS with a well-known CA or HTTPS + DANE (public key fingerprints in DNSSEC).

Re:Reliable site for APKs by tepples · 2012-10-29 09:24 · Score: 2

That's still more work than just uploading it to the Google Play store, and perhaps the Amazon store.
If the application's developer already has a web site, how is making the APK available for download from that web site any harder than submitting it to Google and Amazon? A lot of free software projects already do this, especially those hosted on Google Code or SourceForge, as Nerdfest pointed out in the post above yours.

More work for very little benefit.
One benefit to making an APK available is that you're able to reach owners of older Archos devices such as the Archos 43 Internet Tablet, which prior to October 2011 was Android's closest thing to the iPod touch. These devices come with AppsLib instead of Google Play Store because they lack cellular data, which at one time was a requirement in the Android CDD.

Google Voice by jerpyro · 2012-10-29 06:02 · Score: 3, Interesting

If I order the new nexus phone with no contracts, can I activate and use it as a wifi phone without it being associated with a carrier via Google voice?
I would gladly pay $300 for that.

Re:Google Voice by bhagwad · 2012-10-29 08:38 · Score: 2

Lots of people find the other functionality of a "smartphone" far more useful than the occasional call. I make around 3-4 calls a month with mine.
Re:Google Voice by GreenEnvy22 · 2012-10-29 12:47 · Score: 2

Google has had a built in SIP client since gingerbread, no need for a sip client (though some may offer more features than the plain google one)

Re:me like! by amRadioHed · 2012-10-29 06:08 · Score: 3, Informative

T-Mobile does, unless that changed recently. I still have the cheaper non-subsidised plan.

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too big by GodWasAnAlien · 2012-10-29 06:29 · Score: 2

Are the Korean hands getting bigger every day? Or is it now popular to hold a phone with two hands now?
I really wish there was a Nexus phone with a 4"(or less) display.

Re:too big by EmagGeek · 2012-10-29 07:52 · Score: 5, Funny

If you want a phone with a small screen, just get an iPhone.
Re:too big by AmiMoJo · 2012-10-29 11:35 · Score: 2

You know how some guys are just too short to play basketball? Well some guys' thumbs are just too small to operate the best smartphones.

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Re:me like! by Jah-Wren+Ryel · 2012-10-29 08:13 · Score: 2

I don't think any of the major US wireless carriers offer discounted monthly rates for buying your phone outright. You might as well reap the price of discounted phones if your bill is the same rate.

Prepaid. Prepaid is almost always significantly cheaper than contract.

For example, with an iphone prepaid can save you $500-$1000 over a 2 year contract including all up-front costs like the full purchase price of the phone. And that doesn't include all the misc "surprise" fees that frequently show up on contract phone bills but never on prepaid.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57449345-94/why-a-prepaid-iphone-is-an-amazing-deal-for-bargain-hunters/

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Re:"True HD"? by Cid+Highwind · 2012-10-29 08:29 · Score: 3, Funny

Sir!
This is slashdot! If there's one place on the internet spec-wankery and taking potshots at marketing misusing terms of art are not only permissible, but good form, this is it.

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how much does flash cost? by farble1670 · 2012-10-29 08:37 · Score: 2, Interesting

can someone explain this to me?

i can buy a 32GB micro SD card for $20. that's retail. but google charges +$50 for +8GB? that, and it has to be cheaper for them to add flash internally that for me to buy a retail-packaged micro SD card?

even assuming retail prices, they should be able to ship a 32GB version for less than $20 more, and still make the same profit on the extra memory that would otherwise be made on selling the memory retail ... ?

i understand that they might want to milk customers here ... but if they are really trying to beat apple on prices, offering a low-priced 32 or 64GB model seems like a no-brainer.

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Anonymous Coward · 2012-10-29 08:40 · Score: 4, Informative

I realize they're cheaper to produce... but that's probably because the result is cheaper looking. Just do it the standard way and save us from the misery of the pentile display.

None of the Nexus devices have a Pentile display - the Nexus 4, 7, and 10 all have regular RGB subpixels.

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by kllrnohj · 2012-10-29 08:45 · Score: 5, Informative

The tablet is a Pentile display.

Nope, RGB subpixels - standard LCD layout. It is *NOT* pentile. Hence the "RGB Real Stripe", which is Samsung marketing for "we didn't fuck with it"

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Solandri · 2012-10-29 09:09 · Score: 4, Informative

Whether or not pentile sucks depends on the PPI. If the PPI is too low, then you can see the individual sub-pixels and pentile (RGBG) sucks relative to RGB. But if the PPI is high enough, then you cannot see the individual sub-pixels and RGBG is indistinguishable from RGB while using fewer sub-pixels. The reason is a quirk in the human visual system - our eyes' resolution in green is much better than in red and especially blue.

Pretty much every recorded image we see takes advantage of this. Nearly all digital cameras use a Bayer filter (RGBG overlay), so the images they capture have half the red and blue resolution as they do green. Unless you flip certain JPEG options, a JPEG image you create from a pure RGB scan will do the same thing - reduce the red and blue information that's stored relative to green. Same for MPEG and NTSC. Basically, nearly all the recorded images you've ever encountered in your life were brought to you in RGBG. That you never noticed is proof that it's indistinguishable.

It's only displays which were typically RGB, but that was because there were no "pixels" on CRTs, and LCDs typically had low PPI. Once the display's PPI becomes high enough, RGB becomes a waste. When the G sub-pixels in an RGB array are dense enough to surpass the the threshold of visual acuity, the R and B sub-pixels are far too dense and way past that point. That is, you have way more R and B sub-pixels than are actually needed. If you're at this point, then an RGBG display like pentile with the same pixel density (but lower sub-pixel density) will create an image that's indistinguishable from RGB but using fewer sub-pixels.

Re:No LTE. Less space than an iPhone. Lame. by farble1670 · 2012-10-29 09:35 · Score: 2

Considering it has about as much features of an old 16 GB iPhone 4s, I'd sure hope it would be less.

that "old" 4s has a weaker processor and lesser display, and costs exactly the same. huh. i guess maybe when you compare phones you need to do a little better research,

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by VortexCortex · 2012-10-29 09:59 · Score: 3, Interesting

Yeah, that and if you don't do any sub pixel font drawing, then you can use the same exact code in portrait and landscape. However, if your display can be tilted then the vertical and horizontal sub pixel layout is swapped. Some Pentile displays are designed to be horizontally & vertically agnostic.

MS also has several patents on some sub-pixel rendering tricks, and although MS cross licensed them to Apple, who knows if they did so for their mobile devices? Maybe that's why you even need a high res retina display? To mask the lack of sub-pixel rendering? (can't be troubled to try and find out, ATM)

What contract-free providers for the Nexus 4? by BadassFractal · 2012-10-29 10:12 · Score: 2

I'm curious what budget contract free carriers such as Virgin Mobile and Straight Talk will be supporting this phone? I know that Virgin Mobile doesn't actually allow any phones besides the ones they sell on their network, but it's possible that other companies are less restrictive. Any thoughts?

Re:What contract-free providers for the Nexus 4? by jsh1972 · 2012-10-29 10:29 · Score: 2

simple mobile offers unlimited talk/text/internet for gsm phones for $50/month with no contract, $60 for hsdpa+ 4g unlimited.

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by creepynut · 2012-10-29 10:37 · Score: 2

Indeed, I have a 4th generation iPod touch and my wife has an iPhone 4s. Although it shares the resolution, great for text, the screen on the iPhone is vastly superior when it comes to playing games or watching videos.

Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by Tough+Love · 2012-10-29 11:45 · Score: 2, Funny

retina is a marketing term for high resolution.

I understand that Apple uses the marketing term "Cataract Display[tm]" for their low resolution displays.

This makes sense. But I am a littled confused about why Apple introduced the new iPad mini with a Cataract Display[tm].

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Re:Ugh, Pentile displays by rsborg · 2012-10-29 12:05 · Score: 3, Informative

Apple's retina displays are also a "lottery". They are not all from the same manufacturer.

Just to be clear, the "retina" issues identified above are all related to the Mac Book Pro (retina) not the iPad.

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Re:Release date 3rd or 13th and Nexus 7 upgrade by asdf7890 · 2012-10-29 12:18 · Score: 2

The summary says November 3rd, but the linked article says November 13th. I'll assume the original article is correct.

The horses mouth suggests your assumption is correct: https://play.google.com/store/devices/details?id=nexus_4_8gb

Re:me like! by puto · 2012-10-29 13:23 · Score: 2

I work for ATT and have a Tmobile phone, because of wifi calling and unlimited data, which is still cheaper than my corporate discount, especially when I can use my wifi calling when I am outside of the US. Tmobile is not going bankrupt, they just bought metro pcs which got them spectrum and a shit ton of customers. Plus. they have roaming agreements with the T. But then again, leave the industry to use who know what goes on behind the scenes. But you must be one of our corporate shills...

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