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Internet-Deprived Kids Turning To 'McLibraries'
theodp writes "After the school computer lab and public library close for the night in many communities, the local McDonald's is often the only place to turn for students without internet access at home. 'Cheap smartphones and tablets have put Web-ready technology into more hands than ever,' reports the WSJ's Anton Troianovski. 'But the price of Internet connectivity hasn't come down nearly as quickly. And in many rural areas, high-speed Internet through traditional phone lines simply isn't available at any price. The result is a divide between families that have broadband constantly available on their home computers and phones, and those that have to plan their days around visits to free sources of Internet access.' The FCC says it can make broadband available to all Americans by spending $45 billion over 10 years, but until then the U.S. will have to rely on Mickey D's, Starbucks, and others to help address its digital divide. Time to update that iconic McDonald's sign?"
Deprivation of Internet - a common cause of picking bad eating habits at low ages for Homo sapiens.
Questions raise, answers kill. Raise questions to stay alive.
If McDonald's can do it for free, then by all means, spend the 45 billion and teach them a lesson!
I rtfa and am quite suprised by what passes for 'poor'. Seems more like people who don't know how to budget and set priorities. Judging by the amount of debt the US has, sounds like par for the course.
Don't complain about syntax, grammar, or spelling. There is no.hell like input on android.
I'm not in the US. I live in the UK and my comments are based on my observation of it.
Sorry, liberals don't like it when the churches do things like "donating free space" to help people. They throw hissy fits, and start screaming about a separation of church and state. Well at least they do in the US, never mind that in Canada that churches and synagogues have been doing this up here for the better part of a decade already and it's open to the public.
We only care when government money is used to maintain such services, or are the only places for those public services to be available.
How comfortable would you be if the only place in your town that had free internet was a mosque?
// file: mice.h
#include "frickin_lasers.h"
A Big Mac is about $4. How do these kids have money for McDonald's but can't afford a low end data plan? T-Mobile has unlimited talk, text and data (2G speed after 200MB) for $3 a day.
As governments around Europe are ruling access to the Internet to be a human right, in the US, our poor must send their children to a fast food restaurant for their needed Internet access.
We're quite an odd nation!
Given that the McDs connections are pretty fast, and pretty reliable, it's actually handy to use as a backup.
Couple of years ago the connection at home was being flaky and finally gave out. Problem was, it was a major DR test day at work, and I needed to be online from home for 12 or so hours.
I just grabbed the laptop, blackberry, and powercord, and went 5 mins down the road to the 24hour McDs. Sat there for hours til my ass was numb, happily on my work BB using hands-free, and worked away for hours.
I wasn't disturbed, had unlimited food and drinks available. Really, not the worst place to work at all. I had more space there than I get at my desk job, and better food and drinks too. Work don't have iced tea on tap.
The McDs connection was enough to remote desktop into my XP desktop at work, without lag or dropping. I was impressed how stable it was. Most places can't handle basic browsing that well given the number of people sharing, but that was totally solid.
... what does it take to set up and maintain a McDonald's style wifi installation? Does anyone here know?
I would think that $45 Billion dollars is a very, very high estimate, for a project that would provide adequate minimal access to wifi around the country, and I am almost sure that McD's didn't spend $45 Billion dollars.
"How comfortable would you be if the only place in your town that had free internet was a mosque?"
As comfortable as I would be in a church, synagogue, masonic hall, court, library or the mall.
This comes with the territory when you're not a prejudiced dick.
The cable company wants at least $10000 to extend to my house, not even a 1/4 mile outside their coverage area. I look at the telephone poles recently down the road, and there are new strands of cable co wiring on top of already existing cable co wiring and I am sure only one cable company exists. They could have used that labor and wire to extend to my house instead. Even if I paid them the money what guarantee do I have to the viability of the signal for both internet & TV and what if a storm takes it down? Oh, and all the wasted dollars on stuff like "free wifi" from the same cable companies they could have used a fraction to expand their coverage area. Oh wait, what the fuck is all that USF money going towards????
Our options are 3G data plans, satellite and dial-up. All are shitty, at times 3G is no better than dial-up and the connection keeps getting dropped and shitty unusable speeds during the day. I try not to do any important financial or other transactions during the day as a dropped connection would be bad news. Many of these sites don't respond nicely to have to reload the page, I could be double charged or something and may have to spend time and gas with the bank to clear that up, more money out of my pocket kept from spending on goods on which our economy relies so heavily on.
See, the free market came through where government did not.
Futurist Traditionalism
FTA "Jennifer LaBrenz, a single mom who has take-home income of roughly $2,000 a month, a year ago was paying close to $300 a month for home phone and Internet, satellite television and smartphones for herself and her oldest daughter."
I earn roughly the same salary and dont have sat or cable tv. I also don't give my kids smartphones, a simple pre-paid plan so I can call them is enough. I also dont drive an SUV so I dont pay as much on gas.
A side benefit is that instead of watching TV I interact with my family and my kids aren't busy tooling around on their phone so we can help them with their homework and actually talk with them
Reading this article confirms that some people are poor by their own choosing (or poor choosing).
We're all not entitled to live like kings, so stop fucking thinking that you can.
How comfortable would you be if the only place in your town that had free internet was a mosque?
More comfortable than if the only place with free internet was McDonalds. In the mosque there's be less proselytising and the food is better.
getting an education 20+ years ago -- without the internet.
So, what the fuck is the problem here?
I fail to see why these kids are going to McDonalds instead of to the library. Libraries even have open access computers so you don't have to buy your children tablets when you supposedly cant afford to keep an internet connection.
He was referring to liberals as the hissy-fit throwers, and actually casting Christians in a beneficent light. As a liberal I could report the former, but I believe too much in free speech. As an atheist with qualms about organised religion I do object to them taking over the role of the state, but I'm glad that someone is providing people with the means for self-education. As long as there is no interference on the subject matter (evolutionary biology for example) and no attempt to proselytize this is a good thing.
Oh wait, were you being sarcastic about something you made up in your head without RTFA?
Don't complain about syntax, grammar, or spelling. There is no.hell like input on android.
Even then, a wifi router is, what, $30?
Furries make the internet go.
At least as comfortable as I would be if the only place in town were Mickey D's. I mean - how much chance is there that the manager of Mickey D's will force the kid to eat a free Mac-whatchamacallit? And, how much chance is there that the local Imam will force the kids to bang their heads on the ground five times a day?
IT'S WIFI, for crying out loud. The kids don't have to ENTER either Mickey D's or the mosque.
Even if the Catholic Church enables WIFI, the kids don't have to go inside to be diddled by the choir director!
It's a win-win situation, IMHO
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Wait - they have FOOD in mosques? Dang - why didn't anyone tell me? I'm checking Google Maps for the closest mosque with free wifi!
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
I've an idea - let's everyone report everyone! I don't like your term "hissy-fit throwers" because it's so very unprofessional. Atheists should be professional, at all times, I say!
More seriously - what is this "role of the state". Only very recently, in historical terms, has the state had any role aside from keeping the masses under control, while rewarding the rich for being rich.
Ohh, what am I thinking? That still seems to be government's role.
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
I'm not surprised at all. Capitalism at its very best! Pffft! I hate Big Telecom!
Once again (like in the 80's)Apple was focusing on the "classes" - selling overpriced but stylish tech to those that can afford it, while Commodore et al. sold cheap but functional computers that were purchased by everyone, and brought technology and often education, to the masses.
We are seeing the repeat of this scenario, where Apple sells overpriced but stylish tech (someone wants to challenge me on overpriced? Bring it on, the margins on the iPhone 5 are particularly succulent data) with the iPhones and iPads, and the more well-off are their customers, even according to some research. Enter Android, a free (and opensource) OS that anyone is free to use however they see fit. An deluge of Android-powered devices include smart watches, cameras, mini PCs, consoles, and of course smartphones and tablets. And among the latter two, we see both ultra-expensive ones (Vertu), high-tech ones (Samsung Galaxy S-III, Note II, etc) and... ultra cheap ones, both from known brands such as HTC, and Samsung, and from no-name Chinese companies. The latter is the one that brings tech to the masses, and for this, I am grateful to Android.
"The agriculture ministry is not in charge of Gundam" - Japanese ministry official.
if people are needing internet access to certain sites, maybe its time for a mobile browser that caches, big-style. Interactive sites like facebook, twitter etc can't be usefully cached as the usage is based on direct and timely interaction,but a lot of recreational reading, news, sports, humour and weather could be. A browser set to download 4 links' deep of on-site content for certain predefined sites could save a lot of material in a few minutes to be perused at leisure offline
Back when we only had dial-up and paid per minute this wasnt uncommon. As a solution to make the best and most efficient use of a scare commodity (connectivity) its still relevant.
I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
There is a Mosque not far from me that does exactly that. Anyone is welcome to go in at any time, sit in this nice comfy lounge, which is always stocked with light snacks and juices. They don't try to push their religion on you, all they ask is that if they need some help with something while your there that you provide the help. Usually that help is small things like moving a few boxes around, holding a ladder while their hanging stuff, or helping sweep up the commons area. For the 4 month span I had to go up there for internet access, they never once asked me to help with their religious routines, only with general things, and not very often either.
I don't know about the UK, but in the USA on average, there's a far higher density of McDonalds and other commercial establishments offering 'free'* internet than there are libraries. Such that I'd estimate that I'd have to travel half the distance on average to get internet at a restaurant than I would to get it at a library. Depending, the ability to eat at the store and/or talk loudly can also be an advantage.
I'd prefer some sort of project encouraging community level cooperative/customer owned internet access. I've had far better service with coop phone companies than I've had with commercial cable or telephone.
*Well, technically you have to buy something most of the time.
I don't read AC A human right
What about those who lived out of there car at a poverty level. Took it upon themselves to get a minimum wage job. Work hard. Get advancements. Get better jobs. Get a place to live. I have lived in my car twice. In an attic of a house for free, in a chicken coop with no heating for free. I may have nice things now, but I worked for them. I understand there is a problem, I think my biggest complaint is when it says in the article that people are wasting money on cell phones and tv, yet complain of no internet. That doesn't mean there aren't people who haven't had bad luck. But luck is a lot of what you make it.
Memory is deceptive because it is colored by today's events. - Albert Einstein
As an atheist with qualms about organised religion I do object to them taking over the role of the state
In the UK (where the original poster was from) it is quite common for Church halls to be used for secular purposes. They are effectively village halls (often the 'village' in question was subsumed by a town or city some centuries ago) that happen to be owned by the church. They are usually either free or very cheap to use and often the only large indoor space that is affordable for volunteer groups and community organisations. Although they tend to be owned by the church, using them doesn't usually come with any religious strings attached.
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
Huh? You want to fight to keep the libraries open 24x7? I mean, I agree that would be great, but it isn't financially feasible since the vast majority of people they serve are using it during the day, anyway.
In the US, everything comes with religion attached. Even a bowl of soup for a starving child comes with a self-righteous sermon.
why do the libraries fail to provide free wifi then ? :)
around here, they do - ok, in most cases you have to sit outdoors, but in summer that ain't that bad
Rich
Although they tend to be owned by the church, using them doesn't usually come with any religious strings attached.
well, a meeting to discuss latest early hominid findings might not go that great, i suppose ;)
Rich
Sorry, liberals don't like it when the churches do things like "donating free space" to help people. They throw hissy fits, and start screaming about a separation of church and state. Well at least they do in the US, never mind that in Canada that churches and synagogues have been doing this up here for the better part of a decade already and it's open to the public.
We only care when government money is used to maintain such services, or are the only places for those public services to be available.
How comfortable would you be if the only place in your town that had free internet was a mosque?
Hmmm. Don't think you are a troll, so I'm going to toss you a peanut or two to munch on. Haven't you heard of the Office of Faith-Based and Community Initiatives, created by Bush II more than a decade ago? True, Bush used it as a sly way to fund get-out-the-vote programs targeted at GOP constituencies and faced some serious blowback when his first director of the office, John Dilulio, resigned in protest over the political agenda that permeated an ostensibly apolitical office. The office was expanded and renamed the Office of Faith-Based and Neighborhood Partnerships by that arch-liberal, Obama. The OFBNP has funneled billions of dollars of tax money into exactly the kind of social services that you are referring to, via competitive contracts awarded and monitored by a council of secular and religious leaders from around the country.
I don't think liberals care much at all about *who* is helping redistribute the nation's wealth, as long as it gets redistributed in a way that benefits all, and not just a few. It's a great idea, really, letting churches help. Conservatives who don't like to redistribute wealth in any direction but upwards would look pretty silly if they tried to block money doing God's work, wouldn't you agree?
My question is, why haven't they finished their homework by the time the public library closes? The public libraries around me are open until 9 or 10 pm. You should be able to finish your homework long before then.
The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
Although they tend to be owned by the church, using them doesn't usually come with any religious strings attached.
well, a meeting to discuss latest early hominid findings might not go that great, i suppose ;)
The Church of England (which owns most of these buildings) wouldn't care about that.
No, liberals don't like it when churches use government funding to pretend that they are "donating" something to help people. Neither do libertarians, or sensible conservatives. And a lot of "church help" boils down to just that: government funding funneled through religious organizations in order to promote their own agenda.
I know this may come as a shock to you, but the Canadian political system or society, is in fact, not everybody's idea of the ideal society.
The article says these kids go to McDonalds after the public library closes (where they already get free Internet access).
If this is really such a hardship, why not keep school and/or the public library open a little longer?
So, you need 650 dollars up front in your simplistic example. Gas/electricity of course just arrives for free and has no upfront costs in your silly world of moronic idiots who don't know what they are talking about.
Being poor is about not HAVING any money to spend. A classic example is the washing machine. Going to a laundromat is far more expensive AND time consuming but until you can afford the upfront cost of a washing machine, you have little choice but to try to save up for one while spending the higher amount of laundromat. Say you got a budget of 10 dollars for laundry per week. The laundromat costs 9.50, using your own washing machine costs 500 up front and 5 dollars per wash.
The person who doesn't have 500 dollars, has to use the laundromat and can only save up 50 cents per week. To save up the 500 dollars needed to buy a washing machine, takes years.
That is assuming said person even lives somewhere where it is possible/allowed to run a washing machine. A moron like Solandri will no doubt suggest to not wash your clothes and save up for 50 weeks those 10 dollars and then buy a washing machine. No doubt as the spoiled little rich white kid he will just say to get your mom to do it. He did. But if you do not wash your clothes for a year, you will go through clothes a LOT faster and most likely loose whatever job you have.
It is well known that the richer you are, the cheaper you can life. Even Terry Pratchett wrote about it with Sam Vimes Boots theory of economic injustice. It goes something like this: If you can afford 100 dollars for a pair of boots, you will have a pair of boots that will keep your feet dry for your life and can pass on to your children. If you can only afford a 10 dollar pair, they will leak with in six months and begone in a year. So the poor man spends more on boots then the rich men but still has wet feet. And no, you can't go for 10 years without boots to save up for a good pair.
What morons like Solandri fail to understand is that being poor means you don't have money. You would think this is fairly easy to understand concept but people like Solandri are really dumb indeed, they think poor people just want to be poor and could just get the money somewhere by magic if only they tried.
You can see how stupid Solandri is by not including the fixed costs of utility services, they charge a flat fee on top of which you pay for actual usage. He is a classic spoiled little rich kid who moans about the poor but doesn't know the price of milk.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Well I guess I would be pretty comfortable since it's obvious you haven't supported anything in your community you do feel comfortable with.
A loop, by its nature, continues. If that didn't make sense, start reading this sentence again.
Actually, the real problem is that America refuses to provide a "living wage" for most entry-level positions and that you guys have no remedial social system. Over here (Germany), long-term unemployed people get a housing benefit where they have a small flat including a full kitchen and a communal washer dryer. On Hartz IV (long-term unemployment) in Germany, people can live on roughly €400/mo with this housing benefit. Maybe it's not pleasant, but it sure is better than sending people to McDs for €1 hamburgers. In addition, it's cheaper in the long run. You guys need to gain some long-term perspective.
Libraries, with a few PCs you can use are the answer.
No, no they aren't. Spending the paltry $45B (if we weren't murdering brown people for oil we'd have it in the couch cushions) is the right answer. Remember when we spent a lot of government money to extend the phone system to "all" citizens? (Except those in the deep desert, and we all know they even used to have a booth just hanging out in bumfuck in the Mojave.) It's now time to do that with the internet.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
This is a personally offensive, childish post, bordering on hate speech against Christians. You are very lucky SlashDot doesn't provide me with a 'report' button in its comment sections.
Well, no one will think that you're the type to throw hissy fits any more.
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I do wonder about the cause and effect here though, would people who work during the day go to the library in the evening if it was open? I do think it'd be worth having one evening a week of later opening hours and seeing how it went, possibly with added incentives of interesting talks from speakers if there's room. I know some of the London museums have done 'special' evening openings recently and from what I've heard those went very nicely, attracting people who travel into London for work and don't really want to have to do their weekly commute at the weekend in order to go to a museum.
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When I was a kid, my D&D group met in the basement of a library. Now, it's possible that before the "D&D is a Satanic Suicide Cult" panic, my church might have allowed us to use their space.
However, even if they didn't believe in it, chances are they'd say "no dice" after the Moral Panic started, so they wouldn't have had to explain to angry parishioners why they were allowing Satanic Minions of Satan to meet on church property.
"MIT betrayed all of its basic principles."
McDonalds has rigid lobby designs that don't include electrical outlets anywhere customer-accessible. This means kids (and adults) get to stop using the Internet when their battery dies. This is in contrast to Starbucks, etc. which try to provide as many outlets as possible. McDonalds is in the 'net cafe business only grudgingly.
Much of the USA has trouble getting broadband because the population density of rural areas makes it too expensive do the "last mile" connection of broadband to the home. This isn't like South Korea or Japan, where the population density is high enough per square kilometer to justify the enormous expense of hardwired high-speed Internet connections to everyone.
I think if the IRS were to offer substantial corporate tax incentives to get the "last mile" connection--whether by DSL, cable or even long-range wireless not tied to cellphones like 802.16 WiMax--out to rural customers, they could solve the problem pretty quickly.
USA-ian here.
I was over at some friends' house (2 lesbian black women) a few years ago, and they had an other visitor.
Their visitor was complaining about money.
Said person was obese, with professionally done (read: gaudy) fingernails and a ridiculous-looking huge multicolored weave. She carried a Coach bag and a smartphone.
Her 2 kids were in clothing that looked like hand-me-downs from the Boys and Girls Club.
Neither she nor they spoke what could be considered proper English.
When she left, I asked my two friends about her. Unsurprisingly, she was on welfare.
Then I asked why she had all that gaudy-looking crap if she needed money.
Their reply was that she had to have that stuff to make herself feel good. They actually both seemed confused by the question.
Stupidity is its own reward.
I feel pity for the kids.
"ABCD-EBT Little Wayne just wants what's best for me."
Now go ahead and mod me down.
Ten years ago I was overnighting in a Starbucks parking lot to send my work in. I was one of many living in vehicles and roaming the US, doing a bit of work here or there. Most of the venues mentioned here were our links to the internet - to our bread and butter. But that's nothing new around the globe, most of the under-developing part of the world has been going to community wifi centers for a long time. I'm in Nepal now, and there is a cybercenter on almost every block within the Kathmandu valley (mostly filled with students). But the sad thing is this: America has not progressed to this point: where even the poor can afford an internet connection in the home, and can certainly find an affordable cyber center within walking distance.
I think therefore I can't be ~TTNH
Yeppers...and every person on welfare or any government assistance drives Cadillac and eat T-bone steaks with caviar side salads. I absolutely know this is true because tea party members tells me this same story each week. I wish I didn't have to hear this crap but if I called these folks out on their weekly "stories" they'd label me a commie liberal who wants adolf hitler and joseph stalin to be my best friend and mentor.
Good luck getting a glass of wine with your medium rare steak.
I don't think the glass fiber much cares what's running over it. Just replace the gear on each side of the run as a set.
Depends where you are. A lot of them do a similar thing to the Sikh community do with gurdwara, where they will have their church service then all have something to eat while they discuss it. I could get to like a church where you spend most of the time eating veg curry and discussing the bits where the holy book is wrong ;-)
Where the fuck do you live that you get $20 dollars a month internet.
It already irks me that the local public library has such short hours. Like, they close at 5 on Fridays. There should be a law that if there is a sporting event going on anywhere on public land in the county, the library has to be open.
But the librarians like their 9-5 hours, I suppose. It's convenient that those are the hours that 80% of their patrons are at work and can't interfere with their important librarian tasks by visiting the library.
If it isn't sponsored or required it doesn't violate separation or church and state. You're free to pray in school, during finals some students even might be encouraged to do so. But making it required is the rub.
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
The Krishnas have a nice spread too, but they don't know much about grilling a burger.
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
Comcast is $29 a month for the first 6 months, not that far off. If you're really desperate you can cancel and renew it every 6 months. Me and my roommates did it in college to save money.
-Glitch "We all know Linux is great...it does infinite loops in 5 seconds." - Linus Torvalds
In many locations politicians of dubious ethics and room temperature intelligence, have passed laws
to make it illegal and/or impossible to build a community wifi.
I realize there are some technicalities and costs to amortize, but really! so what?
Compared to expecting kids to hang out in fast food joints so they can do homework, or look for a job online,
how can communities really believe that some shared wifi is a bad thing?
It's mostly the "asleep at the wheel" voters fault, that's us folks...
These messed up laws should be reversed at the Federal and/or State level immediately and
funding provided to make community wifi and broadband happen.
Plus some serious people tasked and responsible to make sure it actually does and report progress frequently, this is already way overdue.
We have to choose between allowing our leaders to force us into either:
a third world style information access (no access)
or having a well educated and employed society.
Patriotism, basic community spirit, ethics, makes this seem like a no brainer to me.
IMHO, there can be no excuses, no apologistas, no rationalizations that justify continuing a monopoly at the expense of the USA's future generations.
The way I see it, this is also part of the rich corporations strategy to dumb down America, and we need to make an effort to buy/bribe the politicians into changing their "screw the people, if it helps me get re-elected" laws.
The Europeans have it defined correctly, internet access is now a basic right, a need.
Suggested action: Let your political critters know that voting for this kind of dumb stuff, is not acceptable, if they ever want your vote.
There is no god; get over it already! Never exchange a walk on part in the war, for a lead role in a cage.
Where im at each broadband provider has a section of the city. Im stuck with 100 a month internet cable bundle.
While I haven't read my phone all that carefully lately, I seem to recall that we (Americans) were paying a little extra each month so that the phone companies could provide internet access to rural areas. And, if memory serves, this charge started back in the '90s. That we still have piss poor internet access in rural areas after about 20 years of the phone companies collecting this extra charge is nothing of criminal.
CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
Good luck getting a glass of wine with your medium rare pork chop.
FTFY
I hate to tell you this, Mr. Conservative, but Jesus was a liberal. Taxes? "Render unto Ceasar..." You conservatives seem to hate the poor that Jesus said "Blessed are" of. Tax money for food stamps? Conservatives are against it. "They should get jobs" you say, Jesus said "look at the lilies of the field, they neither sew nor spin yet Solomon in all his glory was never so clothed." Conservatives love money, but the bible says the love of money is the root of all evil.
Jesus was a liberal, a radical, Caiphas was a staunch conservative. Why do you think he was crucified? Conservatives hated him.
Oh, and if you're a lawyer you don't want to know what Jesus said about you.
Free Martian Whores!
That's about as dumb as they get. Liberals don't mind churches doing their share of helping folks.
What liberals MIND are things like Prop 8 and other such things. I would say liberals do not care one whit about churches helping the public but when conservatives cut off funding for things religious folks don't like yet give churches tax exemptions or funding FROM said state then we get a little testy.
YOU do not understand what the separation of church and state argument is even about but feel free to comment on it as if you do. heh.
And UP there in Canada YOU have a national religion. YOU have national languages (or did you not notice everything is in French and English) ... UP in Canada your laws are different because you are still part of the commonwealth ... we however are not. Just is what it is, eh?
Tell me what you believe...I'll tell you what you should see.
He was referring to liberals as the hissy-fit throwers, and actually casting Christians in a beneficent light.
Yes, which tagged him as a church-going conservative hypocrite.
As an atheist with qualms about organised religion I do object to them taking over the role of the state
As a Christian, I agree. It isn't up to me to judge anyone, and IMO only those things that harm or endanger others should be illegal. I think the worst kind of government would be a theocracy.
As long as there is no interference on the subject matter (evolutionary biology for example)
Anyone who thinks science and Christianity are at odds either misunderstands the science or Christianity. IINM the same can be said of Bhuddism and Hinduism.
Free Martian Whores!
Bullshit, for the last two years my church has given two weeks' groceries to every family with a chile at Harvard Park Elementary over Christmas break, because it's the poorest neighborhood in town and school breakfast and lunch is all some of those kids get. No sermons involved, volunteers simply drop off the groceries.
I don't believe St John's breadline, run by the Catholics here, makes you say grace or anything. They're just feeding poor people. No sermon attached.
Free Martian Whores!
right... its as if the world was perfect. full of unicorns and ferries until the tea party came around. its all bushes fault and the tea party, no one else is to blame.
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
K-12 assignments are not posted online...yet (at least around my parts - friend is a substitute teacher i asked)
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
However, even if they didn't believe in it, chances are they'd say "no dice" after the Moral Panic started, so they wouldn't have had to explain to angry parishioners why they were allowing Satanic Minions of Satan to meet on church property.
When we used to play D&D in the high school library we were prohibited from rolling any 6-sided dice because they could be used for gambling.
I'm sure that wasn't what you meant by "no dice", but I never let a good segue pass me by.
RTFA
Don't complain about syntax, grammar, or spelling. There is no.hell like input on android.
To be fair, the tablet was probably given to them by their school.
When did Canada get a national religion?
Wow that is frighteningly racist.
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
Good luck getting a glass of wine with your medium rare pork chop.
That's your problem right there - you don't eat pork medium rare - only well done. Less chance of salmonella or other nasties. The other white meat and all of that.
Sara
Designer, Gamer, Macgrrl in an XP World
I believe it's trichinosis.
Which is the theory behind the NBN in Australia. Of course the Liberal party (note the use of the capital "L"), think wireless is smarter because it's cheaper to deploy than running fiber to every house.
Sara
Designer, Gamer, Macgrrl in an XP World
Even if you're using wireless for the last 100 meters, having wire or fiber to each neighborhood will help.
Than don't believe me AC. I'm not hiding who I am.
Memory is deceptive because it is colored by today's events. - Albert Einstein
I work from home and have done so nights and weekends for the last fifteen years (no, I'm not a male hooker). I wish all government and business entities catered to more than just the 9-5 crowd, but I recognize that it simply isn't justifiable. The extra expense compared to the traffic they'd get in return (though a library would be more popular than most other services, I'm sure) just seems too much.
On the other hand, if they'd update libraries a bit -- make them open very late into the night or even all night and then open up (by contract) a cafe and coffee shop in one and encourage lounging around and reading, it would be a pretty great night spot and they could do enough business to help with the added costs of keeping them open.
It might even make me come use the library, which I haven't done since I was a kid because internet. And Amazon.
I live in an area of Melbourne (Australia) that has a sharp economic divide between moderately wealthy and poor. In my neighbourhood there are new McMansions going up that cost 3-4 times what our house cost 10 years ago, and the random house that is 10 times the value depending on the location. We also have a high number of migrants (mostly asian, indian and african) who are often living in shared houses, typically rented, who have minimal resources, low incomes and virtually no savings.
A few years back I spent about 6 months unemployed and was a frequent visitor to the local library. The internet enabled PCs were pretty much constantly in use by people looking for work, answering email, trying to use public services that were only available online, etc... The common users were typically either immigrants, the elderly or (judging by their clothes) people who couldn't afford a connection at home.
Most of the paperwork I need to do my taxes now is all online (including submitting a return). My utilities and bank charge extra to get bills and statements on paper rather than receiving them electronically. Job ads for middle income jobs are almost exclusively advertised electronically. There are hundreds of little ways that we are edged online, and it's happened so gradually you probably haven't even noticed it.
Sara
Designer, Gamer, Macgrrl in an XP World
I've heard they cook up a pretty good hairy llama, though.
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
probably longer than you will be; that is, if you go to church.
certainly longer than me.
but using church attendance as a dick-size metric? really??
you seem to think that attendance to a church is a good and honorable thing. that's your fault; stop thinking that 'stuff I like should be stuff you like'.
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
If only the FCC had the forthought to have the telecos to charge a small monthly fee to pay for the expansion of broadband networks in underserved/rural areas.
I bet they could have raised several billion dollars.
There is also no way that the telecos would just take that money and not extend and improve their networks.
It is unpossible I tell you.
"Over 20 Million (pages) served!"
THINK! It's patriotic
A number of suburban libraries have complained that parents tell their kids to hang out there until the parents get home from work. Sometimes the kids get bored and feisty and the libraries dont like it.
If you liked my original post enough to grace it with a reply, you'll like this even more:
Roughly to the tune of "The ABC Song"
A B C D E B T Little Wayne just wants what's best for me.
So I will buy his new CD
And it will make me into a re-re
I'll be living at ma-mama-how till I am thirty
A B C D E B T Little Wayne just wants what's best for me.
But because there once was slavery
I can blame it all on old whitey
And all the other re-re will nod and agree
A B C D E B T Little Wayne just wants what's best for me.
And here's another one for you, sort of a rap thing:
"Your son sells drugs and your daughta is a ho
'Cause you all watch Montel and Maury
And the Jerry Springer Show.
But since you're too stupid and lazy
To actually fix what is wrong
You'll just whine like a little bitch
About this "frighteningly racist" song.
If anybody here didn't like my songs, don't just bitch about it. Get off your sit and DO SOMETHING about it. Let your friends know that what they see is what they'll be, and to turn off that bullshit-drama-show-having mind-rotting television set.
If they want to feel good about themselves, they can maybe teach their damn kids to speak English so the kids can actually get decent jobs or even start new businesses.
P.S. And please don't your kids Jaeqwon and Latishonda. Burger King is already overstaffed.
NOW you can down mod me. You know you want to.
Just Do It.
So your offended and would report the post if you could but claim to be politically progressive. What a surprise. Crawl back under a rock.
The new right fascists are bilingual. They speak English and Bullshit.
Not so much any more, given a hygenic restaurant.
And there's citations for you too.
It's not the years, honey, it's the mileage. - Colonel Henry Walton Jones, Jr., Ph.D.
Which is almost a non-issue any more.
It's not the years, honey, it's the mileage. - Colonel Henry Walton Jones, Jr., Ph.D.
Nothing to see here.
Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
How does the restaurant being hygenic[sic] affect whether the meat arrives with tapeworm cysts, salmonella bacteria or other contaminants that were acquired while it was still running around grunting?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Jalapeno or habanero?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Since the first brewery opened there.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Because, generally, hygienic restaurants are worried enough about details that they will source from reliable sources and will handle food in a fashion to minimize health issues.
It's not the years, honey, it's the mileage. - Colonel Henry Walton Jones, Jr., Ph.D.
Don't talk wet. Trusting suppliers - have you been under a rock for the last month?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."