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Cherry's New Keyboard Switches Emulate IBM Model M Feel
crookedvulture writes "Slashdot has already covered the four main flavors of Cherry MX mechanical key switches: red, black, blue, and brown. Now, there's a green MX variant that emulates the feel of the buckling spring switches in old-school IBM Model M keyboards. The green switches combine tactile feedback, an audible click, and a stiff spring that requires 80g of actuation force. They're a stiffer version of the MX blues that more closely matches the characteristics of IBM's buckling spring design. Previously reserved for use with space bars, the green switches have now taken over an entire Cooler Master keyboard. And, unlike the old Model M and contemporary copycats, the new CM Storm Trigger has modern conveniences like an integrated USB hub, LED backlighting, and programmable macros." I've had my hopes raised and then dashed by some other keyboards whose makers promised Model M feel, so I'll believe it when I feel and hear it.
I would dearly love buckling spring keys but still the "bend" of my MS "natural" that I have gotten so used to. I can still type faster on a model M - I have several, but the ergo keyboards are so much better for my beat up wrists.
As opposed to actual Model Ms which are still made. With the same switch design. By many of the same workers. On the same machines.
http://www.unicomp.com/
Why bother "emulating" the buckling spring feel when you can get a brand new keyboard with real buckling springs. Oh, and it's made in the USA too!
(Also, they have keyboard layouts that offer the Ctrl key in the correct location. 'cause it's about damn time...)
The real litigious bastards...
1000 fake modpoints to you sir. You win an internet.
Or just buy a used model M. All the ones ever made likely still work. Some of them might be in the dump but even those likely still work.
Typed on a keyboard born on 1990-07-17.
Yes, because they are the best ever made.
Things that are good people still want. I also have a cast iron pan in my kitchen, am I emulating the second century BC or just using a good tool?
You shut your whore mouth. Buy one made by IBM and show some self respect.
I bought one of those Unicomp keyboards and I was very disappointed with the build quality. It looks like they just made a cheap plastic housing for the keyboard but there was none of the heft of an original IBM model M.
Why would a keyboard need lights?
Who looks at them? You look at the monitor and type on the keyboard.
I was actually pleasantly surprised by their prices. $79 really isn't all that bad. I remember these keyboards costing more than that, back in the 1980s, and inflation means that this is actually a huge bargain. Then again, everything but the Commodore 64 was overpriced as hell, back in those days.
Worst. Site. Ever.
I can't even see what the thing looks like from those thumbnails, and nowhere is there an explanation as to what "Classic 104" is vs "Ultra 104" and the like.
Thanks, I'll stick with my Das Keyboard.
For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
.......This was the best keyboard they ever made... http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:IBM-3279.jpg One of the first products I ever worked on, over 30 years ago.
Why purchase an imitator when you can buy the original âoeModel Mâ. We have produced the buckling spring âoeClickâ keyboard for IBM and thousands of discriminating users worldwide for 15 yearsâ¦. Join the many that have made the switch to a much more accurate data entry alternative.
http://www.pckeyboard.com/
IBM originally contracted out their keyboards to Lexmark and, when the contract ran out, Lexmark employees bought the rights and formed Unicomp.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
It's been used in spacebars on Cherry Mx Blue keyboards for a while, just not an entire keyboard.
This is a Cherry Mx Blue switch with a stiffer spring, nothing more. Enthusiasts have been making keyboards like this for a while now (which is where Cooler Master got the idea), and it most definitely does not replicate a model M feel or sound.
If you want a Model M, buy a Model M or a Unicomp.
I also have a cast iron pan in my kitchen, am I emulating the second century BC or just using a good tool?
No, you're not, unless you're Chinese. Only the Chinese had cast iron in the second century BCE.
Ezekiel 23:20
If you RTFA, it does mention the Unicomps and give a reason for preferring the CM Storm Trigger. To wit: "Because, let's be honest: the Model M is not a pretty keyboard, and its Unicomp successors also won't be winning any beauty pageants. None of those keyboards have the same array of gamer-friendly features, like macro keys, as Cooler Master's offering, either."
I have a recent Model M here (in the black, Mac-optimized version) and I like it a lot. I'm no die-hard gamer, don't need macros, and I don't enter my keyboard in beauty pageants. It would be nice if they could build a USB hub into them, though.
So maybe I am white but emulating a second century BC chinese person?
BCE makes me a sad Atheist.
I purchased a Unicomp "Linux" keyboard. I stopped using it after a few months. It's PS2 not USB and I had roll-over issues.
I replaced it with the Newegg Rosewill model. I'm happy with it but I'd like back-lighting in my next "Model M clone".
Does anyone know of a Bluetooth Model M clone?
BCE makes me a sad Atheist.
It's a simple matter of historical accuracy. BCE/CE makes perfect sense, because Dionysius Exiguus miscounted. We have 2013 CE now, and the most likely AD date seems to be 2020. I would feel stupid if someone forced me to say "Christ was born five/six/seven [choose according to your preferences] years Before Christ". Wouldn't you?
Ezekiel 23:20
So true, 8" cast iron skillet belonged to my grandmother, it really shows no signs of wear that a good wire brushing of the outside surface won't fix. Probably good for a couple hundred years of use, easily. No stickier than your average 'no-stick' thing that even if you pay $100 bucks for it will last 2 years tops.
Older ain't better, but it ain't worse either.
"Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem." -- Jefferson
Marketing on Slashdot again, huh... *sigh*
The Cherry MX Green does not feel like a buckling spring from the Model F or Model M keyboards, really.
While it is a stiff clicky switch, it is far less tactile, and the tactile point is different.
The Buckling Spring on a IBM Model M or Model F has a slow progression in resistance followed by a sharp drop at the actuation point at around 2/3 - 3/4 way down the stroke.
The Cherry MX Blue and Green have a small bump at the actuation point, which is higher up, at about 1/2-way down the stroke.
As other posters have already written, the MX Green is just like a MX Blue with a stiffer spring. It was made to be used for the Space Bar on a keyboard that is otherwise populated with MX Blue.
Compared to the Blue, with the Green's stiffer spring you tend to press harder on it and that diminishes the feel of the tactile bump somewhat.
The Green has always been used as the space bar switch on Cherry's own keyboards with Blue switches. The only new thing is that it is used on a whole keyboard.
Having a stiffer switch on the space bar is common. Ordinary rubber dome keyboards often come with coiled springs under the space bar to make it stiffer.
If you want a Buckling Spring keyboard, you could buy a new Model M from Unicomp. They are built using the same machines and tooling that the old IBM keyboards were. They even cost less than many gaming keyboards with Cherry MX switches.
BTW. This post was typed on a Dolch keyboard (Cherry G80-1813HFX) with Cherry MX Blue switches, except for the Green switch on the space bar.
"We mustn't be caught by surprise by our own advancing technology" -- Aldous Huxley
This evangelized "IBM Model M" keyboard is something like "Gibson Les Paul Custom 1968" guitar for typists and developers.. huh?
Or hell if you want a classic Model M just go to your local mom & pop PC shop, we usually have a couple stashed and are pretty reasonable about the prices, especially if you BS with us a little while because we love having someone that can talk shop. I got a couple guys that work maintenance in all the local government and small office buildings and they are under strict orders to make sure any "clicky clack" keyboards end up coming my way. Both myself and my boys are all using classic clicky clacks, they are really great for shooters and you just can't beat the feel, they have good throw and reaction time, I swear by my clicky clack.
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
Its a keyboard you can beat a man to death with, and still be perfectly usable as a keyboard.
"I have a hell of a time finding Model M keyboards. "
Goodwill is where I've found all of mine.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
I bought one of those Unicomp keyboards and I was very disappointed with the build quality. It looks like they just made a cheap plastic housing for the keyboard but there was none of the heft of an original IBM model M.
I have a Unicomp SpaceSaver 104 and a Customizer 104. I would not buy the Customizer again; it has all of the bulk of the classic Model M without the same build quality. On the other hand, I love the SpaceSaver -- while it's likely not as effective for self-defense as the classic Model M is, I love typing on this as much as my ~30yr old IBM keyboard (which still works great!), and it uses less desk space, and is natively USB. It also doesn't feel as flimsy as the Customizer does, probably simply due to there being less plastic overall.
I also use a Das, which I don't like typing on as much as the SpaceSaver but it is extremely well built. Maybe I'll replace all the key switches in it with these green ones if they're more like buckling springs!
$50-$100 are you serious? http://www.ebay.com/itm/IBM-Model-M-Clicky-Keyboard-PS-2-tested-working-SEPT-1993-/121075252956?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item1c30a5bedc
Each processor would proceed sequentially as if it had been better for them not to rise against Saul.
Thrift stores are the cheapest bet (think out-of-the-way Mom and Pop Christian Ministry type thrift stores, not Goodwill).
Stopped by one recently and asked if they had any old keyboards in the back. The employee pointed me outside to a shed behind the building. There was literally a pile of old IBM Model Ms laying behind the place, had been hit by rain several times. Took a garbage sack of them home, let them dry out and everything was fine (there was even an old IBM model 5150, but my wife wasn't about to let me add that to the PC graveyard in the office).
The annoying bit is that so many of them are AT instead of PS/2 (good luck even finding PS/2 ports on modern hardware, now it is just 4 USB ports in the back).
Nothing beats the original... I said, 'NOTHING BEATS THE ORIGINAL!' (needed to shout over the keyclick noise...) ;-)
The best-seeming Bluetooth mechanical keyboard I've found is the KBtalKing Pro. There are a few caveats:
1. $179.
2. At least when they first came out, they only had red switches, which I dislike. At the moment, you can choose blue, brown, and red, though; not sure if that is permanent.
3. I haven't been able to confirm rollover. I read that a different Bluetooth keyboard only had 2KRO (which I believe matches the Model M, incidentally); I'm not sure if that's a limitation of going wireless or if it was just a limitation of that particular keyboard.
4. Blank keycaps are only available with red switches (by no means a dealbreaker, but I prefer blank keys).
I would love a Bluetooth mechanical keyboard with NKRO (I would accept 6, though), blue switches, blank keycaps, macros, and the look and build quality of a Das Keyboard. Given that mechanical keyboards are experiencing something of a renaissance of late, hopefully that dream will become a reality.
If you can't convince them, convict them.
You want low activation force on an ergonomic keyboard. Hence rubber dome, low force cherry switches, scissor switches, that sort of thing. High force click switches are bad for ergonomic because of how hard you have to punch the keys. They may be "geek cool" but ergonomic they are not.
If you want a mechanical ergonomic keyboard look at Kinesis or TrulyErgo. Personally I like Kinesis' Freestyle 2, though it is not mechanical switches.
They are all low force switches though, since that is what is good for ergonomics.
It's the main reason even on my Macs I use Microsoft or Logitech keyboards. Mac keyboards are like typing on a desktop. They actually keep getting worse over the years. I love the old feel of an IBM keyboard and miss the rock solid metal feel. I wear out a keyboard in about three months these days while the old IBMs would last years if not decades. I do agree with the I'll believe it when I feel it crowd but it does sound promising. For text typing there's nothing that beats a good ole stiff keyboard. My biggest complain over feel is the the cheapie printed keys. After three months the "A" is completely gone and several others are fading. After six months a third of the keys are hard to read. My touch typing skills are basic and they don't apply when you are doing graphics since I don't hold my hands in a typing position.
"Or just buy a used model M. All the ones ever made likely still work. Some of them might be in the dump but even those likely still work."
Not the one I spilled a Coke on. If the Model M's ever rise up against their human masters, bring a fridge pack with you.
I have two of them. One is USB, all black, with Unix layout (ctrl and esc in the right places). With *blank* keys except for 4 green keys where HJKL go.
Das Keyboard looks like a poor imitation of my new keyboard.
I think the only real thing I want from Unicomp is a Model M style keyboard but with the layout and size of the Happy Hacker.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
One bit of warning about the Unicomp keyboards (I run two), I would suspect the same for USB adapters... is they take a bit of power, so if your USB port isn't offering enough juice (500ma), you may want to pickup a USB adapter that has an additional power source (I've had to do this for use with my KVM at home). I have to say I love the things... I went through almost a decade of a new keyboard every 6-8 months, until I got a Unicomp 104-key... swear by them.
Michael J. Ryan - tracker1.info
. . . i hate those clicky keyboards and wind up busting them over my knee and trashing them.
Do not, repeat, not, under any circumstances attempt the same thing with a Model M. If you do, you'll know why.
I am not a crackpot.
Good news! The Unicomp Keyboard uses the type-m switches. They bought the mfg rights to the type-m keyboard and they're proudly made right here in the United States of America! I am typing on my Unicomp Type-M keyboard right now and I love it.
http://www.pckeyboard.com/
**Highly recommended for the type-m keyboard fan**
Only the Chinese had cast iron in the second century BCE.
Not so fast
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
I have a customized Unicomp myself. Worth every penny and it is not made cheaply in China. It makes noise but so did the model M... I can't see this thing wearing out, but those cherry switches look like they would go before my springs. (I've heard claims of millions of clicks before... I've got two worn out mice to prove the numbers are not high enough.)
Also, the springs in mine look like normal springs you could buy online somewhere (naturally, I took it apart upon getting it!) It'll be easy for the next generation to replace worn springs; that is if your children bother to get a USB adapter for their phone... and if they can't afford the brain implant computers.
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
why you post as AC? you'd be +5 funny by now if you hadn't.
What changed under Obama? Nothing Good
Ow!
That hurt you bastard.
You might get a good keyboard, but you're very likely to get something that doesn't work properly.
Last week, I got a coupon for a Cooler Master keyboard with Cherry MX Blue switches. It was a very good price, but then I looked at the reviews. Concentrating on the negative reviews, I saw mention of keyboards with one or two broken keys, and keyboards with delicate USB connectors that break, and keyboards that stop working entirely after one year, after one month, after one week. Sometimes the customer would RMA keyboards several times before getting a keyboard that worked reliably. This is not what I imagine when I read claims of "50 million life cycle."
Have a nice time.
Would you post your real details if you were bragging on the 'net about something worth millions of dollars on eBay?
No sig today...
You're buying a model M and you're worried about dimensions?
Maybe you're not in the target demographic. Just sayin'.
No sig today...
I don't understand the attraction of those old IBMish keyboards. You wore out your fingers with all the pressure they take to type on, and you feel self conscious typing on them because they're so noisy. What really is the attraction?
You probably think Apple makes nice computers.
No sig today...