Schools Scanned Students' Irises Without Permission

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Schools Scanned Students' Irises Without Permission

Posted by Soulskill on Friday May 31, 2013 @02:15AM from the not-seeing-eye-to-eye-with-parents dept.

schwit1 writes "Parents in Polk County, Florida are outraged after learning that students in area schools had their irises scanned as part of a new security program without obtaining proper permission. Two days before their Memorial Day weekend break, kids from at least three different public schools — Bethune Academy (K–5), Davenport School of the Arts (K–5, middle, and high school), and Daniel Jenkins Academy (grades 6–12) — were subjected to iris scans without their parents' knowledge or consent. The scans are essentially optical fingerprints, which the school intended to collect to create a database of biometric information for school-bus security."

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s/Freedom/Security/g by Gothmolly · 2013-05-31 02:17 · Score: 5, Insightful

You'll lose both, and deserve neither.

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1. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Artraze · 2013-05-31 02:26 · Score: 2
  
  Their iris patterns weren't "information" until they were scanned.
2. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Anonymous Coward · 2013-05-31 02:35 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  You'll lose both, and deserve neither.
  The dead horse is starting to stink. keep beating, though, if it makes you happy.
  We are a police state in the US now. The excuses are terrorism, drugs, child porn, whatever - and there's a loud minority of people who want that shit and a silent majority who just grumble on the rare occasions when it bothers them - like having their nail file being confiscated at the TSA checkpoint.
  Those of us who saw it coming have lost. There is nothing to do now except wait for the day that it gets so bad - if ever - that regular people start pressuring their politicians to put the cat back in the bag. I have given up. I point and say, "This is where we are headed!" and I get the look of a cow chewing in its cud.
  John Q. Public is worried about his job and his standard of living. He has his big screen TV for his football games that he got on sale for $799 and is estatic but there's this niggling feeling that he's getting poorer. His salary hasn't gone down but he's feels poorer. More money comes out of his pocket for health care, groceries cost a bit more, and it costs $30 more to fill his tank - even though there's an oil boom in the US right now.
  And we expect him to care about about some pissant Florida town that's scanning the irises of kids eyes for "security".
3. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Anonymous Coward · 2013-05-31 03:00 · Score: 2, Funny
  
  Don't anthropomorphize information.
  It hates it when you do that.
4. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by ColdWetDog · 2013-05-31 03:07 · Score: 5, Interesting
  
  We're not really talking about security hear. We're talking about control.
  It's a subtly difference concept.
  
  --
  Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
5. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by alen · 2013-05-31 03:26 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  is he any worse than Jon Q geek rooting his phone every night and downloading new ROM's for no reason?
6. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by cusco · 2013-05-31 03:40 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  Actually we're talking about neither, in this case. I work in the physical security industry, and have worked with iris scanners. They're actually one of the better biometric systems out there, EXCEPT that unlike fingerprints iris patterns change as children are growing. This is a rather inappropriate use of a technology developed for use on adults who have a (relatively) stable iris pattern. It's a ridiculously inappropriate application of a technology developed for two-factor authentication, since it's going to be used in place of the current proximity cards. Biometric technologies should not be used alone, they're too undependable.
  
  --
  "Think about how stupid the average person is. Now, realise that half of them are dumber than that." - George Carlin
7. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Anonymous Coward · 2013-05-31 03:49 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  "Once that becomes unavoidable..."
  It has.
  "...it is the responsibility of all good citizens to end the police state as quickly as possible."
  Just keep in mind that the only real job of any revolutionary is to make the state worse. To do little things that the state will over-react to by clamping down hard on every one and every thing. This gets more and more cud-chewers pissed off, and turns them into revolutionaries as well.
  Because no revolution succeeds until the revolutionaries outnumber the revolted-against in numbers sufficient to overcome any advantage in weaponry.
8. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Dishevel · 2013-05-31 03:52 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  You know what would keep children REALLY safe?
  Put POV cameras on everyone in the world. Have all of that accessible to law enforcement.
  Now the children will be safe. Put yours on first.
  
  --
  Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
9. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Blaskowicz · 2013-05-31 04:08 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  It was information completely unknown to anyone before scanning, unless someone already took high res close up pictures of children's irises. That is very unlikely.
  Do you know the precise temperature (down to 0.001K) and composition at a sub-millimetric scale of all matter in a 100km radius around the center of Jupiter?
  I bet you don't. Nor do I know what my own iris patterns are.
10. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Ultra64 · 2013-05-31 04:22 · Score: 2
  
  I think you forgot to add "WAKE UP, SHEEPLE!"
11. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Aryden · 2013-05-31 05:02 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Whether you think the program is good or bad is irrelevant. The issue at hand is, they did this to minors without permission from the parents or notification to them.
  But seriously though, why would you need iris scans of kids? Their reasoning is to track the students getting on and off the buses, replacing the identification cards that they students carry now. Oh wait, ALL of the kids had the scans done. What about the kids that do not ride the buses, the ones that walk or have parents/guardians pick them up and drop them off everyday. Not only are they invading the privacy by collecting personal information from a minor without consent, but they are removing a valuable lesson in responsibility, as well as collecting this data for people that will not or do not use the system at all.
  What's more, the article says that all of the students went through the program, but you're telling me that there were no students at all that objected? I find it hard to believe that there were high school students involved and no one said "no".
  How are you going to react when the police come door to door installing biometric scanners and requiring you to scan in/out each time you leave the house, walk into/out of a building, get into/out of your car?
12. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Dishevel · 2013-05-31 05:17 · Score: 2
  
  I did not know that Google Glass was set up to forward everything all the time to the Feds.
  or ...
  Are you a bit tarded?
  
  --
  Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
13. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by noh8rz10 · 2013-05-31 05:35 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  it forwards everything to google for cataloging and crossreferenicng and advertising. then feds get a warrant and its game over for privacy, as the brits say.
14. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Rockoon · 2013-05-31 06:42 · Score: 2
  
  What's more, the article says that all of the students went through the program, but you're telling me that there were no students at all that objected? I find it hard to believe that there were high school students involved and no one said "no".
  I dont find it so surprising. My generation is quite alarmed about things that the following generation is not alarmed about. This is so because the generations after mine were conditioned in ways that my generation was not. Likely my generation accepts things that the previous generation was alarmed about but we too didnt listen.
  
  If you never had an absolute right to something, do you miss it?
  
  Lets get right into the thick of the current erosion:
  
  If you never lived in a world where the IRS didnt go after those opposed to the erosion of liberty...
  If you never lived in a world where the federal government didn't spy on and invade the privacy of an unfriendly press...
  If you never lived in a world where you had an absolute right to a firearm...
  
  --
  "His name was James Damore."
15. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by Dishevel · 2013-05-31 07:13 · Score: 2
  
  Of all the companies that have your information and have been getting NSLs ...
  Which ones other than Google have been fighting them in court?
  I trust that Google understands that the privacy of my data is (in the long run) important to their profits.
  
  --
  Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
16. Re:s/Freedom/Security/g by ArsonSmith · 2013-06-01 19:02 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Umm, because "Oil is not a local industry. Prices are international"
  
  --
  Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
scanning students for bus? by iggymanz · 2013-05-31 02:19 · Score: 4, Insightful

pro-tip: when buses are hijacked or children kidnapped, it will be an adult that does it. As for recognizing kids, the driver can work off a paper with thumbnail pictures
1. Re:scanning students for bus? by Nickodeimus · 2013-05-31 02:22 · Score: 2
  
  What you're missing is that a government body has scanned biometric information from people and that information will never ever be removed from the system. This is how they, in a nutshell, put a barcode on every human.
2. Re:scanning students for bus? by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · 2013-05-31 02:28 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  pro-tip: when buses are hijacked or children kidnapped, it will be an adult that does it. As for recognizing kids, the driver can work off a paper with thumbnail pictures
  I wouldn't put it past some of the older students(grades 6-12 certainly would include a few) to be overtly dangerous; but some iris-scanning nonsense also entirely fails to address that, since a student will be an authorized user and sail right through...
  It really doesn't make much sense at all. Even if you wanted to play some electronic-orwell attendance tracking game, iris scanning is both expensive and invasive compared to, say, mag stripes on student IDs.
  Is somebody's cousin the vendor? Does somebody in admin or on the school board jerk off to Minority Report every night?
3. Re:scanning students for bus? by ShanghaiBill · 2013-05-31 02:36 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  As for recognizing kids, the driver can work off a paper with thumbnail pictures
  I am having a hard time understanding why even this is necessary. What problem are they trying to solve? If my daughter wants to go to a friend's house after school, she gets on her friend's schoolbus with her and goes to her house. Some of her friends occasionally ride her bus to our house. The bus driver didn't ask or care. So far this has resulted in no deaths or maiming.
4. Re:scanning students for bus? by Nickodeimus · 2013-05-31 02:41 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  ...and it takes one law or event like 9/11 to change that. This is the problem with almost all government overreach. It starts out as a benign "think of the children" scenario and turns into something that is monstrous because some law perverts what was originally intended.
5. Re:scanning students for bus? by gstoddart · 2013-05-31 02:49 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  And yet, once this information is in the hands of a private entity or even a government entity, the DHS can demand it under the Patriot Act and not tell anybody.
  At this point, you pretty much have to assume that anything ever collected about you can end up in the hands of government if they decide they want it.
  Imagine a world in which children have all of their biometric data collected and cataloged before they can even spell biometric -- because it seems to be happening.
  I sincerely hope there are some pretty harsh legal penalties for this, and that the companies are ordered to destroy the data. A school board has no business doing this kind of thing without parental consent. This is just blatant stupidity and over-reaching.
  
  --
  Lost at C:>. Found at C.
6. Re:scanning students for bus? by geekmux · 2013-05-31 03:00 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  mag stripes on student IDs.
  You're underestimating the extent to which the kids will subvert a system.
  Yes, and I'm also failing to understand why any of this shit is truly necessary, since it would appear for the most part (99.9999999% statistically?), over the last 50+ years of busing students to/from school, this hasn't been a justified necessity until now, in an era where taxpayers can be bent over at will to pay for greased palm programs.
  And we're stupid and apathetic enough to re-elect them.
7. Re:scanning students for bus? by idontgno · 2013-05-31 03:04 · Score: 2
  
  am having a hard time understanding why even this is necessary. What problem are they trying to solve?
  The problem they're solving is an unholy combination of over-the-top hover-parenting and "internal passport" movement control on the part of government, summarized as: "We will know where you are at all times, and you will be where we know you are supposed to be at all times."
  Freedom of movement, like most other freedoms (thought, speech, faith) is a problem for control freaks. Your freedom impinges on their control. If they're making the rules, guess which one wins?
  Free people are hard to control. That's a problem for those who want to control people.
  
  --
  Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
8. Re:scanning students for bus? by ColdWetDog · 2013-05-31 03:16 · Score: 2
  
  I went to high school in the 70's. We had to push the damned bus uphills. Both ways.
  
  --
  Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
9. Re:scanning students for bus? by ShanghaiBill · 2013-05-31 03:37 · Score: 2
  
  Well it might not at your school. But kids do go missing.
  Yup. This has happened to my daughter several times. She didn't come home on the bus as expected. This is how I dealt with it: I dialed her cellphone number. When she answered, I asked her where she was, and she told me.
  For parents that don't trust their kids with cellphones, and think their kids are too stupid to get on the right school bus, they could strap a bright orange cone on the kid's head with the school bus number printed on it.
  Either way, once school is over, I don't see why it is the schools responsibility to babysit the kids.
10. Re:scanning students for bus? by cusco · 2013-05-31 04:03 · Score: 2
  
  The actual reason is because too many school districts were getting money from the Dept. of Education for students who never showed up for classes, so the congresscritters connected with one of the mega-database companies declared that the schools had to prove that the students were actually attending school x-many days of the school year. This is how they prove it.
  
  --
  "Think about how stupid the average person is. Now, realise that half of them are dumber than that." - George Carlin
Oh, the ironies... by Mystakaphoros · 2013-05-31 02:20 · Score: 5, Funny

Meanwhile, down the hall, students were studying the Bill of Rights.
1. Re:Oh, the ironies... by nitehawk214 · 2013-05-31 02:21 · Score: 2
  
  Which, sadly, the "o" in "Bill of Rights" was concealing an iris scanning camera.
  
  --
  I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
2. Re:Oh, the ironies... by JustOK · 2013-05-31 02:23 · Score: 5, Interesting
  
  Illinois high school teacher John Dryden has been reprimanded and docked a day’s pay after informing his students of their Constitutional rights before administering a school-mandated survey about “at-risk behavior.”
  http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/05/29/high-school-teacher-punished-for-informing-students-of-their-fifth-amendment-right/
  
  --
  rewriting history since 2109
3. Re:Oh, the ironies... by Mystakaphoros · 2013-05-31 02:34 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  Illinois high school teacher John Dryden has been reprimanded and docked a day’s pay after informing his students of their Constitutional rights before administering a school-mandated survey about “at-risk behavior.”
  http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/05/29/high-school-teacher-punished-for-informing-students-of-their-fifth-amendment-right/
  Sadly, it doesn't surprise me. When I was teaching high school journalism, I got repeated verbal orders to infringe on student free speech, which I was supposed to follow up on without a paper trail so that admin couldn't be connected to the violation. Got in a fair amount of trouble for "failing to do so" a few times. Needless to say, I don't work there anymore.
4. Re:Oh, the ironies... by stewsters · 2013-05-31 02:40 · Score: 4, Interesting
  
  That teacher is more awesome that he knows. I hope the kids paid attention to the lesson they received that day.
imagine the confusion if by nopainogain · 2013-05-31 02:24 · Score: 3, Funny

the kids went home and said "mommy, the school scanned the pupils today".
Where are these parents by Hatta · 2013-05-31 02:28 · Score: 2, Insightful

Where are these parents when it's time to protest actual privacy violations?

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Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
1. Re:Where are these parents by localman57 · 2013-05-31 02:32 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Fucking around on Facebook.
2. Re:Where are these parents by smooth+wombat · 2013-05-31 02:44 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Cheering on the TSA and hooting it up for the Patriot Act.
  
  --
  We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
3. Re:Where are these parents by Dripdry · 2013-05-31 06:38 · Score: 2
  
  No, they're probably worried more about keeping their job and healthcare from day to day than about some dumbass policy at school that they know they can't change anyway since they have no time to go to the board meetings and don't want to get involved in crazy school board politics (yes, of course they exist). Some even say they don't want to rankle the neighbors with politics.
  This is the reason that the person who did the final draft of the 1st Amendment, Fischer Ames, was a HUGE critic of democracy: People are busy. Really busy. they would not have time to help run the government! That is what is happening here.
  This We're Smart and Everyone Else Is Stupid mentality you're fostering is part of the destruction of our country, a subtly vicious meritocracy, and it HAS to frickin stop if we want any progress. Parents are NOT dumb, they're over-frickin-worked and exhausted! They have little or no time to worry about rights. They just want their kids to get a good education (yes, I know the argument here...) They trust in the school system because it's the only thing available to them, and a host of other reasons.
  
  --
  -
Re:If anyone should know.. by bmajik · 2013-05-31 02:30 · Score: 2

IMO, this is a terrible place for the feds to get involved. What is appropriate for middle schools in urban high-crime areas is not appropriate for elementary schools in rural North Dakota.
School violence is not historically higher now than it has ever been, and overall violence in the US is at an all-time low.
The centralization of education has been uniformly terrible for the US.

--
My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily represent those of my employer.
Overkill Much? by sargon666777 · 2013-05-31 02:32 · Score: 3, Insightful

Really? We need military levels of record keeping to keep track of school children getting on busses? Seems wasteful, and overkill.. If you need an ID (which I dont think you should for school busses) then a simple picture ID should do.. Growing up my bus driver (and the kids) knew all the kids getting on and off anyhow..

--
Am I lying when I tell you that im telling the truth? Or am I telling the truth when I say that Im lying?
1. Re:Overkill Much? by PolygamousRanchKid+ · 2013-05-31 02:56 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  We need military levels of record keeping to keep track of school children getting on buses?.
  Follow the money. Whoever implemented the system for a juicy fee probably has good connections to the school board.
  The whole thing sounds like boondoggle pork to me.
  
  --
  Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
Backdoor Contact lens??? by RobertLTux · 2013-05-31 02:37 · Score: 4, Funny

i wonder how hard it would be to make a contact lens that caused the scanner to throw an error (or worse was a backdoor into the system).
Scanning Image
Processing
Identified Krystal Rayne Dawnmeadow approved SYSTEM ADMIN ALL ACCESS
(and of course daddy would have told his favorite minion exactly what to punch into a terminal to .....)

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1. Re:Backdoor Contact lens??? by SJHillman · 2013-05-31 02:45 · Score: 2
  
  Just ask little Bobby Tables, I hear he got new contacts.
Re:If anyone should know.. by Hatta · 2013-05-31 02:41 · Score: 5, Informative

All of these issues are pretty much based on so much of the violence which the US schools have been faced for the last 20+ yrs.
Juvenile violent crime has been falling for the past 20 years. These issues must be based on something else.

--
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
Re:So let's give 'em *MORE* tax money! YAY!!!! by Sperbels · 2013-05-31 02:45 · Score: 3, Interesting

Bush never performed "extrajudicial killings" on US citizens.
I suppose we don't really know....because the Patriot Act enacted under Bush, made it legal to disappear US citizens in secrecy.
Re: Beck by transporter_ii · 2013-05-31 02:53 · Score: 2

Glenn Beck loves big government, as long as it is bombing people he doesn't like or arresting them for drugs that he doesn't like. The deficit? It is horrible, just horrible, unless they are printing up money for war.
He had a real chance to make a real difference with Ron Paul, with hours to talk about him on the radio...but the few times he mentioned him was to crap all over him. Oh the ironies that Beck just likes the Constitution when it works in his favor.
A pox on him.

--
Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy knowledge, religion destroys spirituality
No big deal by Archangel+Michael · 2013-05-31 02:58 · Score: 2

Schools can say it was for "Reproductive Health" reasons.
No, there is no concern about over reaching governance!

--
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
Re:So what exactly is the problem with this? by fermion · 2013-05-31 03:02 · Score: 2

Unlike RFID, which is a perfectly reasonable way to implement the safety and record keeping issues that parents want, iris scans cannot be replaced when the information becomes compromised. For instance, when the school database is hacked and the biometric information is leaked, we cannot the change the eyes. Once compromised it is always compromised. This is the general issue with biometric scans. it does not fail gracefully. And of course iris scans are RFID squared. You can't leave your eyes behind.

--
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
Re:If anyone should know.. by Seumas · 2013-05-31 03:07 · Score: 2

What an ignorant statement. We are a union of states. I don't know where the hell you hail from, but the concept is that states determine their own laws and govern themselves. I don't know where people have this ass-backward concept that somehow it all comes from the top-down and the Federal government legislates and controls everything.
Additionally, this has NOTHING to do with "violence the schools have been facing for the last twenty years". The violence has not changed dramatically (especially of the kind you're likely referencing). This is purely a fear-based personal-data grab. Having a child's iris data on record in no way prevents him from committing a crime or being the victim of a crime. All it does is *commit* a crime against his or her humanity by treating them like a criminal and entering them into a life-long database without having actually committed any crime to justify it.
That so many people have the mindset you've shared is actually kind of terrifying. How the hell can people exercise and defend their rights when they don't even understand them?
Re:s/Freedom/nothing/g by darkonc · 2013-05-31 03:12 · Score: 4, Insightful

Security?? WHAT security?
If some kid is intent on shooting the driver and everybody else on the bus, do you really think (s)he's gonna stop for an eye exam before going hog wild?
And if it's some PTSD-suffering ex-marine blowing up the bus, it's gonna be the same situation -- even if the attacker DOES stop to look in the scanner.
In this case, you get NOTHING for your lost freedom: no security, no safety, no real knowledge after the fact ...
NOTHING

--
Sometimes boldness is in fashion. Sometimes only the brave will be bold.
Re:So what exactly is the problem with this? by lxs · 2013-05-31 03:21 · Score: 2

Are you seriously suggesting that invading the sanctity of the body is in the same category as taking a close-up picture of their eyes?
Well, both the contractor and the school are happy by fufufang · 2013-05-31 03:25 · Score: 3, Insightful

This iris scan device is expensive, ineffective and excessive.
But there are money for the contractors, bribe for the school administrators. Everyone is happy, right?
Re:s/Freedom/nothing/g by serviscope_minor · 2013-05-31 03:36 · Score: 4, Insightful

If some kid is intent on shooting the driver and everybody else on the bus, do you really think (s)he's gonna stop for an eye exam before going hog wild?
And even if he does stop for the eye exam what will it confirm? The columbine killers were both students at the school they shot up (surprise!), so such a system wouldn't have stopped them.
Database thinks, yep, Harris and Klebold are on the bus.

--
SJW n. One who posts facts.