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TSA Finishes Removing "Virtual Nude" X-Ray Devices From US Airports

dsinc writes "The Transportation Security Administration announced it has finished removing from all airports the X-ray technology that produced graphic and controversial images of passengers passing through security screening checkpoints. The machines, which the TSA first deployed in 2008, provoked public outrage as the technology, better able than traditional X-rays to detect hidden contraband, also created images that appeared as if they were 'virtual nudes.' Critics called this an invasion of privacy and questioned whether the scanning devices truly lacked the ability to save the images, as the TSA claimed."

29 of 172 comments (clear)

  1. Analog hole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The analog hole always existed, and always will. If one of the TSA Molesters, err, Protectors, saw an image on the screen they wanted to keep, all they had to do was hold up their cell phone and snap a pic.

    Their arguments about how TSA agents aren't able to save the generated images is and always was total bullshit.

    1. Re:Analog hole by Jockle · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Now all they need to do is remove themselves from US airports, and preferably, from the US itself!

    2. Re:Analog hole by peragrin · · Score: 5, Insightful

      While I agree with you in concept. I would point out in 4 years no random photos of celebrities, hot women, etc found their way onto the internet.

      I was fully expecting for the TSA have to denouce some photos and fire a few people by now for actually having leaked some photos.

      Of course that doesn't mean the ability doesn't exist just means that those with access are keeping their mouths shut and are behaving. not impossible but I do find it unlikely.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    3. Re:Analog hole by iggymanz · · Score: 5, Informative

      it was the U.S. Marshalls who leaked pictures in Florida from Gen 2 mm wave machines, the machines for which was claimed the operators "cannot store, print, transmit or save the image"

    4. Re:Analog hole by erroneus · · Score: 5, Informative

      The TSA would NEVER use a scanning device without the ability to record and save the data. Take it from a former screener. *I KNOW* (caveat, I never used one of these backscatter machines as an operator... they weren't in airports when I was a screener.)

      Every one of the X-Ray devices I operated had the ability to save and could even print images. And to me it made sense. Evidence. Once I saw a human torso come through. I couldn't resist printing the image. We did not open the containers... Another time, a loaded pistol passed through in an inappropriate container. A screening supervisor felt confident that he could remove the pistol and unload it. I didn't feel uncomfortable about it -- I'm okay around guns. He obviously knew what he was doing as well. But people freaked out just the same. The image was saved.

      If you wanted to be able to prove something, a picture is better than testimony. What makes anyone believe the TSA when they say they aren't saving the images?!

    5. Re:Analog hole by geezer+nerd · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Amen! The TSA was never necessary, and still isn't.

    6. Re:Analog hole by 0111+1110 · · Score: 3

      And I'd like to point out that the only way in which they 'behaved' was by keeping all the juicy pics for themselves. I know this may be hard to accept, but not everyone feels the need to upload every image they may have to the internet. Wanking to images of thousands of naked 14 year olds is their greatest reward. Why would they want to share it?

      I actually don't think it's all that surprising that nothing leaked. The vast majority of those people are true believers. Their secret but unclassified procedures haven't been leaked either. Probably because no anti-TSA people have infiltrated their numbers.

      --
      Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave.
    7. Re:Analog hole by fredklein · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Of course it was Bullshit. The spec documents the TSA put out for the machines specifically required them to be able to save and transmit the images!

      Google for 'epic tsa spec', and find this: http://epic.org/open_gov/foia/TSA_Procurement_Specs.pdf

      (Not to mention, how'd they get the sample images they show on TSA.gov, if the machines cannot save and transfer images??)

    8. Re:Analog hole by Spykk · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The point is largely irrelevant anyway. Would you be comfortable allowing strangers to look into your bathroom while you use it even if you could guarantee they couldn't take a picture? If not, then why does it become OK as soon as the strangers wear a shirt that says TSA on it?

    9. Re:Analog hole by g0bshiTe · · Score: 3, Funny

      Analog hole

      Why oh why do you have to bring goatse into this?

      --
      I am Bennett Haselton! I am Bennett Haselton!
  2. Misleading headline by dgatwood · · Score: 4, Informative

    Although the X-ray versions have been removed, the equally invasive millimeter-wave versions are still there. The only difference is that now you have to spend a little time changing the device configuration to save off the images instead of being able to see them live.

    --

    Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    1. Re:Misleading headline by 0111+1110 · · Score: 3, Informative

      Why do you say they are equally invasive? The laws of physics would seem to indicate that they are not. The few images I have seen have been much less detailed than the xray images which are nearly as good as black and white photographs.

      Removing the private wank booths is by itself a huge step forward (assuming they really do get rid of them) and the cartoonish stick figure images on the machines with the newer software would seem to eliminate the privacy issue completely. Assuming of course that the TSA is not lying again and secretly continues to monitor the images in the peep/wank booth.

      The millimeter waves are a huge improvement. No ionizing radiation. Based on our current understanding the 27-30 Ghz microwaves are not harmful.

      The millimeter wave images are orders of magnitude less suggestive and detailed than the x-ray machine images. They don't appear to be wank material. Many of the millimeter wave scanners in the US are fitted with automatic detection software which effectively illiminates the privacy issue anyway.

      The mmw machines with ATD software still have problems however. Based on independent testing they have something like a 50% false positive rate and if the machine alarms you must submit to a potentially sexually invasive procedure in order to fly. If they were to eliminate either the after-scan patdown or the false positives the scanners might be acceptable except for the fact that they don't really achieve anything. Metal detectors are far more effective at detecting real threats, much faster, and do not require any genital patdowns afterward.

      The sensible thing to do is to go back to the metal detectors and maybe augment them with explosive sniffing dogs until reliable explosive detection machines are invented.

      --
      Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave.
  3. Misleading summary, as usual by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The scanners are still there. They still get the digital data of a virtual nude. They just pass that through an algorithm that replaces the image with a stick figure before the image is shown to the operator.

    The government still gets the detailed biometric identifying information it wants, the digital 3d model of your nude body still gets stored in the databases they deny exist. They just don't show it to the operator now, so everyone feels better.

    1. Re:Misleading summary, as usual by Mitreya · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The government still gets the detailed biometric identifying information it wants, the digital 3d model of your nude body still gets stored in the databases they deny exist. They just don't show it to the operator now, so everyone feels better.

      I never understood why people just go through these scanners like sheep. I have never been through one despite flying periodically -- one can and should decline the scan.

    2. Re:Misleading summary, as usual by petsounds · · Score: 4, Informative

      I never understood why people just go through these scanners like sheep. I have never been through one despite flying periodically -- one can and should decline the scan.

      In the USA, yes you can decline and instead get sexually groped by a TSA employee. In other countries like the UK you can't decline -- if you want to get on your flight, you go through the scanner.

    3. Re:Misleading summary, as usual by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      They'll be on the bus soon enough. What's your argument going to be then?

    4. Re:Misleading summary, as usual by tftp · · Score: 5, Insightful

      As a UKian, I would like to play devils advocate: if it stops one single delusional nutter from murdering upwards of 200 people

      It appears to be the mainstream opinion in the UK, judging by the fact that the Prime Minister still has the office.

      I wonder, is there anything that the UK population will not submit to, if submission saves the life of one abstract child?

    5. Re:Misleading summary, as usual by Jockle · · Score: 5, Insightful

      As a UKian, I would like to play devils advocate: if it stops one single delusional nutter from murdering upwards of 200 people in one easy stroke because the voices in their head told them to, and the only thing between that latent human homicidal psychosis and my safety is a porno machine, what do I care how many 3d pictures of my cock I have to give up?

      That's not a very good devil's advocate because it is easily debunked. Rights are far more important than safety, and you could use that same argument to justify molesting people at random, regardless of their location. If one nut is stopped, who cares about silly old rights!?

      That is extremely dangerous thinking, but I fear that most people truly believe such nonsense.

    6. Re:Misleading summary, as usual by Loki_1929 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As a USian, I'd like to respond.

      My country was born when a group of doctors, lawyers, and farmers came to realization that the slim chance of gaining liberty was worth taking up arms against the most powerful military the world had ever seen. They didn't come to that realization in secret; they signed and publicly posted an open letter of treason against the Crown, who controlled the world's most powerful military, and who would have gladly put each of them to death for their treasonous act. They then proceeded to fight not one, but two wars against the world's most powerful military to secure the rights they believed all people were entitled to enjoy. They were not seasoned soldiers or military strategists who knew how to fight the armies of the Crown; they were doctors, lawyers, and farmers who were almost certainly about to die in a completely futile effort. One of the states that arose during this period adopted the motto "Live free or die".

      In the spirit of their realization and their actions, please allow me to be the first to say: Fuck your safety. Being free isn't safe. Safety is never, never worth the cost of losing freedom.

      I quite honestly wish that all the people who think as you do would go back to England. I think it'd return this country to a much better state; one where we still had balls and did great things.

      --
      -- "Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
  4. All part of the plan by schwit1 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Security industrial complex got its billions and then guess what, it seems the machines have a problem. Ok, we'll buy the version 2 at only twice the price. A few years later ... what? They don't detect the latest terrorist explosives? Hey, we've just come out with version 3 and have we got a deal for you.

    All the while the retiring senior TSA folks are getting job offers from the security industry to lobby and sell on these same government contracts.

    1. Re:All part of the plan by Rob+the+Bold · · Score: 5, Funny

      If only they didn't detect "latest explosives" -- that would be understandable. It had been demonstrated many times that they don't detect shit.

      To be fair, detecting shit wouldn't really help, what with everyone being -- literally -- full of it.

      --
      I am not a crackpot.
  5. Re:Waste of money by NormAtHome · · Score: 3, Informative

    Whoever approved this incredible waste of taxpayer money really needs to loose their job along with half of Congress.

  6. Claim: Verified by girlintraining · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Critics called this an invasion of privacy and questioned whether the scanning devices truly lacked the ability to save the images, as the TSA claimed."

    It has always had the ability to save such images; The TSA merely claimed that such a 'diagnostic mode' was not available during normal operation. There is no way for you, the passenger, to know if and when it is in such a diagnostic mode, however. So the TSA's claim is technically true.

    But since the radiation levels have also not been published, it's also technically true that the radiation levels are safe, in spite of those cancer clusters showing up, because the TSA says they're safe and therefore there is no need to publish the emission limits.

    In other words... all you have to go on is their word in both cases. Which, given as many times as their statements haven't been found to be credible, is no assurance at all.

    --
    #fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
  7. Better name: Radiation Scanners by steveha · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I don't care that much about the "Virtual Nude" thing. (Although I might care more if I were an attractive young female, I guess.)

    My objection to the thing is the X-ray radiation. I am by no means convinced these things are safe.

    http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=us-glossed-over-cancer-concerns

    Four doctors from the University of California, San Francisco wrote an open letter expressing their grave concerns based on their expertise. They listed dangers of these scanners and requested to see the safety studies and get access to the raw data of the safety studies; they also asked for the names of the people who conducted the safety studies. The government's answer boiled down to "our experts have studied this and it's safe". Completely non-responsive to the listed concerns and not sharing any data.

    http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=126833083

    So I never yet have let them scan me; I always have requested the pat-down. When they ask if I would prefer it in private, I tell them no. I'd rather the patdown be out in the open where anyone could watch. I have no particular reason to think any TSA agent would give me extra trouble in private, but I'd prefer as much publicity as possible.

    I guess millimeter wave isn't ionizing radiation? That's a giant improvement right there. Maybe the new machines are safe? Safer, anyway.

    --
    lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
    1. Re:Better name: Radiation Scanners by GoChickenFat · · Score: 3, Interesting
      My last trip to the airport the pilot and crew were allowed just in front of me. There was only one open lane and it was for the body scanner. When the crew showed up they opened the old magnetic line so I tried to join right behind them (btw, the body scanner line was completely open with no one waiting). The TSA agent said "you can go over to the other line". I said no I don't want to go through the body scanner. He said why not and I simply said I don't want to. He asked again why not. I said well if it was safe why isn't the crew going through it (I got a couple funny smiles back from the crew). He said why are you asking so many questions and then added if I go through I'd get an extra pat down. At that point I just kept following the crew through and he didn't stop me. I did get just my legs checked by another TSA agent - no big deal.

      The other thing I've noticed is if you travel with young children they take you out of line and directly to the magnetic scanner. Not just your child and one parent but your entire family. For me it was four adult family members along with my 4yr old - no extra pat down needed.

      in summary - the body scanners cannot be completely safe and they know it.

  8. Re:What? by steve6534 · · Score: 3, Informative
  9. Re:Waste of money by im_thatoneguy · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I'm trying to think if my income has gone up 50% in the last 10 years.

    Maybe if we hadn't been duped into throwing the unions under the bus you might have had an organization negotiating on your behalf to get regular raises to reflect your increased productivity. Also it's not 50% since the number of employees increased too. It's more like 40% increase in wages assuming your numbers are correct. That means they got about a 3.5% raise every year. That's exactly in line with the private sector which also was projected to see on average about a 3.5% raise.

  10. I'm still going to opt out. by Karmashock · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Pat me down.

    Had the fellow at the airport literally grab my penis last time. So yeah... that was uncomfortable. But that is how you ACTUALLY drives these machines out of the airport. Refuse to use them.

    When the TSA finds that pat downs are not effective at forcing people into the scanners they'll let us walk through a metal detector and leave us alone.

    Its not as if the xray machines have ever stopped a terrorist attack or likely ever will.

    Do you know how you stop a terrorist attack? Know who is getting on the f'ing airplane. Its not that complicated. All the people that have later gone on to do some terrorist attack were on a terrorist watch list already.

    Is it fair to profile someone WHO IS ALREADY on a terrorist watch list? That is, if you're on a terrorist watch list... would it be fair to pat YOU down or scan you you or whatever? Again, not simply because of race, national origin, or anything equally specious. But contacts and behavior consistent with someone plotting a terrorist attack.

    And if someone is clever enough to stay off those lists while also intending a terrorist attack... do you really think an xray machine is going to stop them? Xray machines would stop a moron that would jam explosives up his sleeves without understanding how an xray machine works. You might claim it would deter a smarter attacker but really all you've done is force him to disguise the weapon or bomb as something else.

    In the end, you're pitting the intelligence of someone clever enough to stay off the watch lists against a minimum wage government drone bored off his ass while he scans yet another person that he has no belief is a threat.

    When you treat EVERYONE as a threat you threat NO ONE as a threat. You have to have targeted security. Enough passive security to deter morons and really a metal detector is more then sufficient to do that. And then the FBI and CIA need to keep useful lists for the few clever ones that might try something sneaky. And when one of the sneaky ones books a plane flight... they spend an extra 10 minutes in back room as someone gropes them for... whatever. Everyone else though... don't waste our time or dull edge of your security by pretending we're a threat when we're not.

    --
    I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
  11. Re:Waste of money by artor3 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Your analysis contains some very important oversights:

    Your numbers are taken from the US Census Bureau: 2001 & 2011.

    First, let's look at the difference between 2003 & 2004, so that we can see the addition of the Department of Homeland Security. See how the total number of full time employees stays roughly the same, but the 2004 numbers have that extra section for the DHS with ~140k full time employees? Those people weren't all hired that year -- the DHS employees are already in the grand total on the top line. You were double counting them in your 2011 numbers. So let's revise your numbers to account for that:
    2001: 2.7M employees with a payroll of $11.4B
    2011: 2.85M employees with a payroll of $16.1B

    That's a 6% increase in headcount, and a 41% increase in payroll. Still pretty big, right? Well, we ought to adjust for inflation. Looks like the $16.1B would have been worth $12.7B in 2001.

    So really, we're looking at a 6% increase in headcount, and an 11% increase in inflation-adjusted payroll. It's not nothing, but it's not what you're making it out to be.

    Let's go into even more detail!

    By pulling up the 2008 numbers, we can see which parts are attributable to Bush, and which are attributable to Obama. Since Bush has more years of growth, we'll annualize the results.

    (I did this in Excel, and you're free to download the tables from the Census website and repeat my calculations. I'm tired of making hyperlinks.)

    Under Bush, the Federal Government grew at an average of 4.5% per year, with the largest contributors being National Defense, Healthcare and Law Enforcement. Under Obama, the Federal Government grew at an average of 1.4% per year, with the largest contributors being Healthcare and the Postal Service (which didn't grow much percentage-wise, but its sheer size meant that even a few percentage points put it over the top). Remember, we're talking about payroll here, so Social Security & Medicare aren't nearly as big.

    So under Obama, the government payroll has actually been shrinking in inflation adjusted dollars. And remember, this is pre-sequester. Of course, that doesn't mean all of the cuts were Obama's idea, or all of the heavy spending was Bush's. But it does show that over the past several years, the government has been trimming the fat. Your "throw the bums out" approach is unwarranted.