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Asus CEO On Windows RT: "We're Out."

Posted by Unknown on from the some-companies-like-making-money dept.

symbolset writes "AllThingsD's intrepid reporter Ina Fried has an interview up where Asus chairman and CEO Jonney Shih says they will not make any more Windows RT devices until Microsoft proves demand for the product. This leaves Dell as the only OEM who has not sworn off Windows RT. Dell is seeking to take itself private, relying on a $2 billion loan from Microsoft." Turns out people want things that are the size of a laptop to work as well as a laptop.

43 of 246 comments (clear)

  1. maybe next time lose the lockdown by X0563511 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So that you can make hardware that doesn't depend on MS?

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    1. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative
      According to Microsoft's annual 10-K report to the US Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), published on Tuesday, their total Surface revenue for all of fiscal 2013 amounted to just $853m. That's nearly $50m less than the $900m charge Redmond took when it discounted its remaining Surface RT inventory by $150 per box.

      And that's not all. That $900m writedown was related to Surface RT only, but the $853m revenue figure includes sales of Surface RT and Surface Pro combined.

      Further down in its 10-K filing, Redmond reports that it upped its sales and marketing budget for the Windows Division in 2013 by a jaw-dropping $1bn, which included an $898m increase in advertising costs "associated primarily with Windows 8 and Surface."

      Got that? Microsoft spent more in a single year advertising the Windows 8 and Surface launches than it took in from Surface sales that same year.

      And remember, none of this was even spread over an entire calendar year. Microsoft's fiscal 2013 ended on June 30. It launched Windows 8, Windows RT, and Surface RT on October 26, 2012. The Surface Pro launch came later, in February. But whichever way you slice it, Microsoft managed to mow through an $898m marketing budget in just eight calendar months – and consumers still didn't take the bait.

      Strangely enough, Slashdot does not consider this news...

    2. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by jimicus · · Score: 4, Informative

      They can't. IIRC the requirements for bundling Windows RT include having the device locked down so it will only run Windows RT.

    3. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by putaro · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Heh - so if they had just given them away they would have lost less money.

    4. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by jawtheshark · · Score: 3, Funny

      Nobody stops you to start the brand....

      --
      Ahhh...the great dumpster continuum. Many a free computer will be found there. -- sowth (748135)
    5. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by nozzo · · Score: 2

      and call the consumer portal 'Your Anus' thereby completing the age old joke.

    6. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by Penguinisto · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Even worse than that, when you consider that if Microsoft *paid* people to take them, they would have stood pat.

      --
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    7. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by RMingin · · Score: 2

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iq9B3evfu8s

      Asus themselves danced around the edges of that joke.

      --
      The preceding comment is my own, and in no way construes an opinon of the Emperor of Mankind.
    8. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by SDF-7 · · Score: 5, Informative

      Unless you are Neil McAllister, it would be nice if you'd signify that you're quoting his article in The Register rather than just plagiarize it.

      Compare http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/07/30/microsoft_surface_sales_disaster/ for all but the last sentence.

    9. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by gl4ss · · Score: 2

      a paltry sum of that was probably developer relations stuff.

      What I'm saying is that MS actually paid people to develope apps for it and to take surface rt's.

      What you had to do to get some of that pie was to not develop the same app for other os's. So none of the companies with actual existing well doing products on other os's got it and no companies which believed they have a good market on other operating systems for their app took the money.

      (which is why I believe most of it went to games.. and to existing game companies since they're reputable.. in other words money down the drain).

      --
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    10. Re:maybe next time lose the lockdown by WGFCrafty · · Score: 2

      The shocking statistic I saw which shows the miserable demand is that Apple could have matched those figures if they sold ipads for $15.

  2. Re:ASUS is Out of the RT Market?? by AndyAndyAndyAndy · · Score: 2

    Couldn't even RTFS?

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    It's always confirmation bias!
  3. A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point. by xtal · · Score: 5, Insightful

    How many MBAs does it take to miss that mind-boggingly obvious fact?

    Here's some free advice if anyone important is reading this (haha):

    Want to be wildly successful? Go invest a lot of time and money into figuring our how to make a 8.5 x 11" replacement for paper. That includes being able to write and draw engineering diagrams with a 0.2mm tip.

    I've wanted one of those forever, I'd be willing to bet a lot of professionals out there have the same problem - the ipad is close, but not quite big enough, and it doesn't have written input.

    "Me too" doesn't cut it. Have some vision, Microsoft. I dare you.

    --
    ..don't panic
    1. Re:A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point. by Scutter · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It would be nice if tablet designers, OS designers, and app coders stopped treating tablets like media consumption devices and started treating them like actual replacements for people who need to do actual work. Try working on a spreadsheet on one. Yes, you can do it. Yes, it's a colossal pain in the ass. Wanna reset a password in Active Directory from your tablet? If you're on Android or iPad, there's MAYBE one or two apps that can do it and then not very well. Oh, but if you want to listen to music on the crappy little speakers, there are about a thousand music players out there. There are any number of freemium games out there, too.

      Tablets are fine for what they are, but you can't sell them as a productivity tool without actually designing it as one, and that's what Microsoft tried to pull with Windows RT.

      --

      "Tell me doctor, with all of your defenses, are there any provisions for an attack by killer bees?"
    2. Re:A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point. by CohibaVancouver · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It would be nice if tablet designers, OS designers, and app coders stopped treating tablets like media consumption devices and started treating them like actual replacements for people who need to do actual work.

      They have. It's called the Surface PRO.

      I have one, and it works like a charm. It's a Core i5 running Metro + Win 8 pro. Runs full Office and has access to all network resources. At my desk it has its desktop extended to another monitor (try doing that with a f*cking iPad) with attached keyboard & mouse. Away from my desk it's got a detachable proper clicky keyboard and a nifty stylus.

      All my colleagues carry two devices (iPad + Notebook) - I carry one. Every time I pull it out at a meeting or at the airport people say "oooh... what's *that*?" The RT noise is distracting people from what is otherwise a very cool machine.

    3. Re:A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point. by Russ1642 · · Score: 3

      Office RT was neutered. No macros, no add-ins, no forms, etc. They didn't design it as a productivity tool, they designed it as a direct competitor to what you get on Android and iOS.

    4. Re:A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      And since the OP mentions being able to write and draw on it, it should be mentioned that the Pro is really good at that stuff also.

      Gabe from Penny Arcade has a pretty thorough review http://www.penny-arcade.com/2013/02/22/the-ms-surface-pro.

    5. Re:A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point. by oGMo · · Score: 2

      Samsung is rumored to be working on a 12" Galaxy Note. This may not be a perfect replacement for paper, but with a full pressure-sensitive stylus and sufficient size, it's a good start. I can't wait.

      --

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    6. Re:A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point. by gstoddart · · Score: 2

      A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point
      I keep hearing this on Slashdot, and I disagree. It's not the easiest form factor to use for some things, and has some limitations to it ... but it's definitely a computer, and it's definitely personal.

      My Nexus 7 lets me open a VPN connection, and remote desktop to a Windows machine. With a Bluetooth keyboard I can type without using the touch screen, and apparently you can buy a Bluetooth mouse for Android devices. It would be like a little tiny laptop -- not where I'd want to do a full days work, but when travelling it's at least nice to have a lightweight option instead of dragging my entire laptop.

      Want to be wildly successful? Go invest a lot of time and money into figuring our how to make a 8.5 x 11" replacement for paper. That includes being able to write and draw engineering diagrams with a 0.2mm tip.

      Everyone says this, and then forgets that they're a small part of the market.

      You're describing a fairly niche product ... not everyone is planning to draw engineering diagrams with a 0.2mm tip on a tablet. You aren't the entire market, and I suspect that most potential buyers of tablets would be thinking "I don't need that". I've seen small-tipped styluses for touch screens. Likely nowhere near 0.2mm.

      But "wildly successful" can't come from the small chunk of the market for high-end professional tablets that can do the stuff you describe. At this rate, give it a few years and you'll end up there anyway. For now, they're mostly a small consumer device not intended for doing all of your work on.

      "Me too" doesn't cut it. Have some vision, Microsoft. I dare you.

      And, when was the last time that happened? Microsoft has been doing "me too" for a VERY long time, and while they have occasionally brought something innovative to market (the Kinect for instance) it's often technology they've bought from someone else (the Kinect for instance).

      I'm just not sure that as a company they're capable of doing that.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    7. Re:A tablet isn't a PC. That's the point. by sageres · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Sorry but it seems to me the MsOffice has been first neutered when they went into mandatory ribbon interface making it quite unusable.

  4. No killer app by jfdavis668 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    A version of MS Office which supports touch poorly is not a killer app.

    1. Re:No killer app by dingen · · Score: 2

      I can't believe they thought it would be. A touch-friendly version of Office might be good, but even that probably will depend heavily on a physical keyboard to do some actual work. And guess what? People already have machines with a physical keyboard running Office on them.

      --
      Pretty good is actually pretty bad.
    2. Re:No killer app by guytoronto · · Score: 5, Funny

      A version of MS Office which supports touch poorly is not a killer app.

      Well, it killed the Windows RT tablet pretty well.

    3. Re:No killer app by Joce640k · · Score: 2

      And guess what? Most people use Office sitting at a desk, not on a Sofa.

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      No sig today...
    4. Re:No killer app by dingen · · Score: 2

      Exactly. And even for typing on a sofa, a laptop is much more convenient than a tablet.

      A tablet cannot succeed when it depends on accessories to be useful, especially when those accessories are optional and hurting mobility.

      --
      Pretty good is actually pretty bad.
    5. Re:No killer app by gstoddart · · Score: 2

      Exactly. And even for typing on a sofa, a laptop is much more convenient than a tablet.

      I beg to differ.

      I bought a Nexus 7 a while back, and have subsequently bought the case with the Bluetooth keyboard. Separate from that, the Google keyboard app has "swipe to type" where you basically connect the dots of the word and it figures out what you intended. I didn't even know that was there until recently when I stumbled on it.

      I've found with the ability to drag your finger around means I can type at what I'd call a reasonable speed, but definitely not my usual typing at a keyboard and a desk. It's not handwriting, but I can waggle my finger around where the letters are and type at a fast enough pace that it's usable. In fact, it's a pretty damned good compromise.

      Sometimes, I'm willing to sacrifice a little speed in typing for the comfort of doing it from my lazy boy or my backyard. Or in an airport. Or in the hotel bar. Or avoiding bringing my laptop when I travel but still need to keep some minimum connectivity.

      Nobody is suggesting a tablet is going to replace your desktop machine just yet, but it's getting to the point where you can at least use it for some stuff. The ability to VPN into work and remote desktop to my machine from my Nexus is nice to have as an option that can cut down how often I need to bring my laptop with me.

      A tablet cannot succeed when it depends on accessories to be useful, especially when those accessories are optional and hurting mobility.

      I don't see those accessories as hurting mobility. I see them as making the device more flexible and useful in more situations.

      I can noodle about on it and not ever do anything but basic typing or viewing content. I can use the on screen keyboard to at least be able to respond to emails from a more mobile device in a comfy chair, and the drag and type allows for a decent speed. And I can put it on a desk, turn on the Bluetooth keyboard, and have access to a small keyboard which is faster than the on-screen one. All without taking it out of the case that has the keyboard.

      For what I paid for the Nexus, there's a ton of utility in that device for me.

      It's at least a generation of technology away from being able to replace my desktop machine, but given that the latest version of the Nexus 7 is running at full HD. And a generation of technology is about a year or so now.

      And given the Google is making that $40 thing that allows you to stream to a TV onto HDMI -- the technology exists that you could very quickly plug your tablet into your TV and with a wireless keyboard and mouse and turn pretty much any TV and tablet into a workstation.

      --
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  5. Re:Makes sense by Joce640k · · Score: 2

    Nope. The "news" part is that they're confirming that Microsoft's bet-the-company strategy is failing.

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    No sig today...
  6. Re:ASUS is Out of the RT Market?? by interval1066 · · Score: 2

    Judging from the highly (over?) produced tv ads that were out for these things I'm guessing pretty badly.

    --
    Python: 'And then suddenly you have a language which says "we're all stuck with whatever the whiniest coder wants".'
  7. Cheap over touchscreen by simonbp · · Score: 4, Informative

    The Samsung ARM Chromebook is still the best selling laptop on Amazon. The second best seller is the cheapest Windows (not RT) laptop from Dell. Windows RT devices do not appear on the list at all. It appears the market really doesn't care about touchscreens, but does care about price and battery life.

    http://www.amazon.com/Best-Sellers-Computers-Accessories-Laptop/zgbs/pc/565108

    1. Re: Cheap over touchscreen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Indeed, reality is that people are willing to pay a premium to avoid Windows...

      This is one area where Ballmer's decision to build a cult to rationalize away the glaringly unethical and predatory nature of the Windows monopoly is hurting them big time.

  8. Re:Makes sense by UnknowingFool · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Also even if Asus was in it still, there are millions of RT units from MS sitting out there unsold to compete with. I would say that someone at MS was wildly optimistic about RT projections or very bad at math. While we don't know the actual number some estimates have it at 6M unsold RT units. Surface RT was launched Oct 26, 2012 and was only sold at MS stores which only number two dozen or so. 6,000,000 units / 25 stores / 275 days / 12 hours means a MS store would have to sell 72 Surface RT units optimistically. And those are in addition to the ones already sold. I don't think that even Apple stores sell that many iPads during holiday season. What was someone thinking?

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  9. Another victim of the Microsoft Tax by RocketScientist · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Apparently some reports say that Microsoft is charging $90 per tablet to license RT. Consider that most retail "stuff" has a 100% markup to MSRP, and that means in order to compete with the cheaper offerings from Google ($200) and even Apple ($249) they'd have to be able to build the tablet for $10 to $60. You're not gonna get build quality for $60. That's the real reason the Surface tablet exists: nobody else really can make one and be profitable, so Microsoft wanted to show how to make one profitable (go high-end and put everything in it, despite that it cost a bit more than a nice iPad with less features, and rely on the Microsoft name).

    If Asus wanted to make Microsoft look bad, they could ship the same tablet, one with Android and one with RT, and just have one be half the price of the other, and see how they flew off shelves.

    1. Re:Another victim of the Microsoft Tax by sageres · · Score: 2

      No wonder MS has still tons of unsold tablets in stock. I would buy the device in a hart-beat if it were much cheaper, and if a clear way of wiping the current OS and putting Linux and subsequently Android on it would exist.

  10. A Great Machine In There Somewhere by tuppe666 · · Score: 2

    Secure boot was a disgrace that should not have been allowed. I am getting increasingly concerned that the old duopoly is Apple and Microsoft has no interest in evolving its Desktop machines, Windows replacing their OS with a tablet interface, and Apple is replacing it with a cylinder...and the choice of expensive external hard drives. All in pursuit of those early adopters money in the tablet (mobile) market ironically a market that has been taken from them by Googles Android(67% Market share) faster than the smartphone market; Apples(28% Market Share) "Sold" suddenly means "Shipped" and Millions of Tablets Disappear in Inventory adjustments(Channel stuffing perhaps?) and the margins are vanishing from it even faster; The Microsoft(5% Market Share) Surface price even massively discounted looks overpriced.

    The sad fact is I am convinced there is a great machine in there somewhere. I personally would be happy with surface running GNU/Linux with android compatibility...and the Play store. In my opinion apart from an unnecessary low resolution screen which is indefensible in a Nexus 7 1920 x 1200 with 323 pixels per inch (the return) world. Yet they have made such future impossible with their(not your) hardware. I am now waiting for the next generation of touchscreen chromebooks which will also solve the problem of price as Intel and Microsoft gouging their hostages on 70% gross margin, A major factor when you face competition.

    As I said Secure Boot is a disgrace. Ironically Asus CEO and chairman Jonney Shih sees the of Android with a keyboard too (If only Asus would add GNU/Linux to Mix) as the future http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000185493&play=1 (Jon Fortt really really likes Apple and should be sacked) even though Asus are selling significant Android tablets including the incredibly popular Nexus 7 (both generations).

    FYI Tablet Market figures from here http://venturebeat.com/2013/07/29/apples-ipad-market-share-chopped-in-half-as-android-takes-over/

  11. Nobody wants to work on a tablet! by xtal · · Score: 3, Insightful

    You're missing my point.

    I have three 30" screens I work on. It is wonderful.

    I want a device that acts like my trusty pad of paper, but better. I like to be able to read and flip through reference papers leaned back in my chair, or over a coffee. I'm not going to sit down and work in that environment - certainly not to code, design a CAD part, work out a tooling process, design a PCB, figure out a circuit, or even write a long memo. I have a great work setup for those tasks.

    Microsoft completely missed the mark and the consumers have spoken. You and some others want to work on a tablet, fine - most don't.

    --
    ..don't panic
  12. Apple didn't pretend iOS was OSX by Overzeetop · · Score: 3, Insightful

    And Android has never claimed that you would be running full Linux on your device. Microsoft's blunder wasn't that they made a tablet OS, it's that they tried to pass it off as their full fledged desktop by giving it the same name when they had already spent 8 years with their desktop software already on tablet computers, and doubled down by simultaneously releasing a looks-and-feels identical version which really did run all of Windows desktop software.

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  13. Can't Believe Microsoft Thought it was a Good Idea by macromorgan · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The main strength of Windows was its ability to maintain an impressive amount of backwards compatibility. A few applications aside, things I bought 10 years ago still work on my Windows 8 x64 machine (without virtualization or emulation). To attack two well entrenched competitors Microsoft went in guns blazing without what is historically been the most compelling feature of Windows. I have an MBA, and even I saw this coming...

  14. Re:Microsoft's money - now with strings by MachineShedFred · · Score: 2

    Everyone seems to forget that the deal with Apple was really "$150m non-voting stock, a commitment for Office on Mac, and a cross-license agreement so that you won't win a billion dollar suit against us because we stole QuickTime, but you're losing patience for because you're out of cash."

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  15. Linux Netbooks Did by tuppe666 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Linux netbooks didn't really take off

    Except they did every store had more netbooks than anything else, Microsoft heavily discounted XP to compete(11 years old only if your stupid enough to count from launch), and then with Intel limited its specifications and Microsoft limits its OS (and it ran badly) to not cannibalise its more profitable none existent Ultrabook and its existing laptop market. They successfully killed it of...and then Apple launched the iPad which had none of the limits, some advantages...and a killer price (then not now) and obvious the brand.

  16. Plenty of people work on tablets by sjbe · · Score: 2

    I have three 30" screens I work on. It is wonderful.

    For what you do it is wonderful. What you do != what everyone else does. For my job I don't actually need that much screen real estate and most of what I do can be done on a single 17" monitor if I really needed to. For many of my clients I do my work on a laptop with a 15" screen and it works just fine thank you very much.

    Microsoft completely missed the mark and the consumers have spoken. You and some others want to work on a tablet, fine - most don't.

    You are conflating two issues. You are absolutely correct that Microsoft missed the mark with the Surface RT. Had they introduced the Pro for a reasonable price instead of the crippled RT then they might have had something. Tablets and laptops are going to converge over time. There are some technical hurdles to be overcome but the lines between the two are going to blur significantly in the next few years. Apple, Google and Microsoft are all working in this direction.

    Where you are wrong is in thinking that Microsoft's failure somehow implies that no one does work on tablets. Plenty of people work on tablets. I have sales people visit my office all the time using tablets for real work. Plus it's no big deal to dock a tablet/laptop if you need better monitor options. Tablets are used in doctors offices and by sales people and by restaurants TODAY. Just because they aren't doing engineering on them doesn't mean it isn't real work. Over time, tablets and laptops will converge significantly much like how cell phones have taken over much of the low end camera market. A tablet is just a laptop with a touch optimized interface. With the right software, many tasks that can be done by laptops could just as easily be done with a tablet.

    1. Re:Plenty of people work on tablets by The+Cat · · Score: 2

      For fuck's sake will you people stop humping the "tablets are going to replace PCs" inflatable doll?

      Plus it's no big deal to dock a tablet/laptop if you need better monitor options.

      Which makes it a PC. Stop humping the balloon.

  17. Re:online? by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2

    Do you know what a straw-man argument is? Even if you include online sales, I doubt it would approach 72 units per hour. One of the odd things to the MS strategy is if you have a new product, you want to get it into the hands of people in as many ways as possible. There were product demonstrations but limiting RT to just MS stores initially means that consumers could only demo them at 25 locations? Now you can get them at Best Buy, etc. but I don't know if artificial scarcity works for MS products.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  18. Re:Makes sense by ColdWetDog · · Score: 2

    Look, people around here would buy ANYTHING with a CPU, memory and screen for pennies on the dollar if they get to take it apart and stare at the innards.

    Announcing that a Slashdot user would buy any particular device is the Kiss of Electronic Death to mass markets. Remember the iPod? Lame, eh? Remember the HP tablet? Fantastic?.

    Shorting anything that the Slashdot hive mind likes is a good way to make money. You're weird and you know it.

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