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9th Circuit Court Elevates Celebrity Privacy Rights Over Video Game Portrayals

The EFF posted a biting response to yesterday's Ninth Circuit ruling that heavily weights celebrities' right to privacy, and construes that right very broadly. From the EFF summary of the case: "The plaintiff, Sam Keller, brought the case to challenge Electronic Art (EA)'s use of his likeness in its videogame NCAA Football. This game includes realistic digital avatars of thousands of college players. The game never used Keller’s name, but it included an avatar with his jersey number, basic biographical information, and statistics. Keller sued EA claiming that the game infringed his right of publicity — an offshoot of privacy law that gives a person the right to limit the public use of her name, likeness and/or identity for commercial purposes. ... Two judges on the panel found that EA’s depiction of Keller was not transformative. They reasoned that the 'use does not qualify for First Amendment protection as a matter of law because it literally recreates Keller in the very setting in which he has achieved renown.'" The piece later notes that this reasoning "could impact an extraordinary range of protected speech."

207 comments

  1. Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    "Two judges on the panel found that EA’s depiction of Keller was not transformative."

    Ok, next patch they will transform his stats to the worst player in the game.

    1. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ah yes, the "He doesn't deserve rights because he beat me up in high school" argument. I salute your shrewd legal mind!

      ah yes, the "i disagree with him so i absolutely must make this personal and generally act like a catty woman on a shitty reality tv show".

      actually in the first year of high school i learned that knocking out one of the jocks makes the others leave you alone esp if you do it in front of their buddies. public schools are like prison, you get no respect unless you "shank" (punch) somebody. i was defending myself against an unprovoked attacker so i feel no remorse about that.

      no i have had plenty of opportunities related to my work, to be on TV and get lots of public attention. i prefer being behind the scenes because i don't want this kind of attention. i have a beautiful wife, family who love me and friends i can truly trust. i am satisfied with that. i absolutely DO NOT WANT to go grocery shopping and get mobbed by a bunch of sycophantic celebrity worshippers. so i don't do certain things. i accept it is a package deal and I say no to the entire package. but enough about me, since you felt a need to bring that up. onto the topic at hand:

      this guy didn't understand what he was getting into or he decided that the scholarship opportunities and cheerleader access were worthwhile. either way, he has no complaint. it would be like buying a car and complaining that you need to put fuel in it, or buying a computer and being outraged that it needs electricity. makes no sense.

    2. Re:Solution to the problem by Schmorgluck · · Score: 3, Insightful

      should of

      You fail.

      --
      There's nothing like $HOME
    3. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ah yes, the "i disagree with him so i absolutely must make this personal and generally act like a catty woman on a shitty reality tv show".

      That's what you did above.

      actually in the first year of high school i learned that knocking out one of the jocks makes the others leave you alone esp if you do it in front of their buddies. public schools are like prison, you get no respect unless you "shank" (punch) somebody. i was defending myself against an unprovoked attacker so i feel no remorse about that.

      This didn't happen, and every single person who read your post knows it.

    4. Re:Solution to the problem by bitt3n · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "Two judges on the panel found that EA’s depiction of Keller was not transformative." Ok, next patch they will transform his stats to the worst player in the game.

      this is a great opportunity to employ the small penis rule. slightly change the likenesses of the players from reality, and in the stats, just list their penis as 2-inches long.

    5. Re:Solution to the problem by Oligonicella · · Score: 2

      "I bet he liked being a celebrity when he fucked the entire cheerleading squad"

      And you demonstrate that you IQ is equal to your age.

    6. Re:Solution to the problem by LocalH · · Score: 1

      How on earth can you "know" that didn't happen?

      Coulda swore this was /., not Reddit.

      --
      FC Closer
    7. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How on earth can you "know" that didn't happen?

      Coulda swore this was /., not Reddit.

      He's an insecure little man, that's why he acts like one. You can see how desperate he is to put me down in some way or another. So desperate he is willing to be completely and transparently irrational just to try to do it.

      Apparently the fact I stood up for myself back in high school bothers him. Maybe he was a coward and has to hate me because I wasn't. See how I said maybe because this is speculation? I don't presume to know his life and neither should he presume to insist he knows mine.

      For what its worth i didn't stand up to the jocks in high school because i am so big and badass. I am a nonaggressive person who minds his own business and mostly i just want to be left alone. I stood up to them because i felt like that was better than constantly being harassed and bullied. I expected to get my ass kicked infact, the point was that the other guy might win the fight but he was going to get hurt doing it. Most bullies will look for easier targets since they dont like having to work or take any risk for their jollies. Turned out the jock who acted all badass trying to show off to his friends wasn't really so tough. Also turnedout his friends weren't really friends because they stood there and laughed at him instead of helping him. Neither of those should be a big surprise but at that age i didn't fully understand it.

    8. Re:Solution to the problem by dyingtolive · · Score: 3, Funny

      You guys are adorable. Now go back to reddit.

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    9. Re:Solution to the problem by Rockoon · · Score: 0

      How on earth can you "know" that didn't happen?

      Maybe because the only place that the 'jocks' are the bullies is in Hollywood.

      --
      "His name was James Damore."
    10. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I bet he liked being a celebrity when he fucked the entire cheerleading squad (the basic nature of woman is of a whore that is why rich and-or famous men always have arm candy). He complains now? Wahhh. More pew-pew less QQ.

      Awwww. Did he have sex with the girl who you thought was your girlfriend just because you pulled her bra strap every day?

    11. Re: Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I am 158 damn it! Now get off my lawn!

    12. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Disregard that, I suck cocks.

    13. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      GP is ascribing what happened to him to the GGP.

      Yeah, not all of us on Slashdot were wimpy losers in school. Personally, most of the people at my school were afraid of me and I wasn't even that big of a guy. Somehow I got the image of being a Satan worshipper, despite the fact that I am not religious nor did I promote religion in any way, shape or form. Must have been all of that Cannibal Corpse, Napalm Death and Slayer that I used to listen to.

    14. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Two judges on the panel found that EA’s depiction of Keller was not transformative."
        Ok, next patch they will transform his stats to the worst player in the game.

      Translation: They did too good of a job. Maybe headline should read, "Judge rules the Art movement known as Realism Illegal, orders confiscation of the Mona Lisa."

    15. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You IQ is very low.

    16. Re:Solution to the problem by hairyfeet · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I just don't see why so many are the EFF on this one when it means supporting EA a company notorious for screwing EVERYBODY from the employees on up.

      Personally I'm all for this rule because i'm hoping it will open debates i think are long due, which is why are college athletes not allowed to get paid for what they do but everyone can make money off of them just like in TFA? Most of these kids will NEVER make it to the majors and if they blow out a knee on their last year their life usually ends up shit, meanwhile everybody else, the school, the groups in charge of licensing like the NCAA, even game companies like EA THEY can all make money but the kid can't? I'm sorry but that is severely fucked up.

      And let me just head those that will say "but they get paid with an education" off at the pass because I went to a "football school" and I can say pretty much all a LOT of those players are learning is how to play a better game, we've seen enough examples of players that couldn't even read the diploma they were handed to know that is a bunch off bull. So just pay the kids alright? Put it in a trust for the guy or whatever and that way if something bad happens to them and they can't play at least they'll have some money to start over, but it just ain't right that these kids are not allowed to make shit while everybody else cashes checks based on their work, its not right, its not fair, and if this ruling kills the blanket licenses the NCAA is allowed to SELL based on these kids without giving them shit in return? Then I'm damned glad the judges ruled this way, I just don't get why the EFF are for a status quo that enriches these large corps while not giving a cent to the kids whose labor is being sold.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    17. Re: Solution to the problem by Mabhatter · · Score: 1

      But NCAA sports aren't "professional" that's why they can't accept any favors or outside help paying for school, etc...

      So why would he expect his face in a video game?

    18. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You fail at life.

    19. Re: Solution to the problem by Mabhatter · · Score: 0

      I agree, the court basically ruled the athletes are the same as other celebrities. Put a character in a PAID video game with Johnny Depp's face (or voice for South Park or Simpsons) or Harrison Ford, etc and watch just how fast their lawyers slap you with royalties.

      Even your local newspaper photographer knows to publish COMMERCIALLY you need a "release" or at least permission just taking a picture of somebody on the street.

      Basically EA is just taking the likenesses because they are college kids and don't know any better... It's OK, next season EA will have the NCAA add "likeness" to the release info all the players have to sign to play and keep their scholarships and they'll be back on track legally.

      And once that happens, the players will be able to argue they "individually" have commercial rights (because the NCAA just forced you to sign tgem over) and the NCAA not allowing other people to give them gifts and such is illegaly interfering with their personal affairs.(business)

    20. Re:Solution to the problem by oh_my_080980980 · · Score: 1

      Except the Supreme Court disagrees with the Ninth Circuit, see Larry Flynt versus Jerry Falwell, Hustler magazine was allowed to use a likeness of Falwell in a parody...

    21. Re:Solution to the problem by jamescolon1992 · · Score: 0

      rent ps3 games and get free delivery in Canada. MyChoiceVideo.com

    22. Re:Solution to the problem by schnell · · Score: 1

      Except the Supreme Court disagrees with the Ninth Circuit, see Larry Flynt versus Jerry Falwell, Hustler magazine was allowed to use a likeness of Falwell in a parody

      Totally different issues. The right to use a public figure's likeness in a work of parody or satire is well established by the above case. This case is about EA selling people a video game that uses this football player's likeness and not paying him. No parody, satire or other "fair use" involved - it's a flat out commercial product that depends in large part on the use of real-world people's likenesses to attract customers.

      --
      "95% of all Slashdot .sig quotes are incorrect or completely fabricated." -Benjamin Franklin
    23. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Two judges on the panel found that EA’s depiction of Keller was not transformative."
        Ok, next patch they will transform his stats to the worst player in the game.

      no, no ... next year those 2 judges will "perform" in very niche porn game in very interesting roles.
      No names, just their avatars and statistics. No harm done, riiight?

    24. Re:Solution to the problem by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      This case is actually not at all remarkable. If we were talking about pro players here, there wouldn't even be any question. It would be taken for granted that you can't take their likeness and just do whatever you want with it.

      Parody is a very particular exception that.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    25. Re:Solution to the problem by Theaetetus · · Score: 1

      I just don't see why so many are the EFF on this one when it means supporting EA a company notorious for screwing EVERYBODY from the employees on up.

      Because it's not just about EA, but establishing precedent that could adversely affect companies we like.

      Personally I'm all for this rule because i'm hoping it will open debates i think are long due, which is why are college athletes not allowed to get paid for what they do but everyone can make money off of them just like in TFA? Most of these kids will NEVER make it to the majors and if they blow out a knee on their last year their life usually ends up shit, meanwhile everybody else, the school, the groups in charge of licensing like the NCAA, even game companies like EA THEY can all make money but the kid can't? I'm sorry but that is severely fucked up.

      But should they be paid by the video game manufacturer directly, or should they receive a cut of the licensing/tickets/television rights/swag income from the college? Consider that, with the former, at best you get "NCAA 2014 with star quarterback [famous name] and 10 anonymous shmucks!"

      I agree that it's not fair that people make millions off of these kids, but I think you have to target it at its source, the NCAA and the colleges, and not the individual game/swag manufacturers.

    26. Re:Solution to the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Eric Cartman: [speaking like a Georgia plantation owner] Helloo thear! The name is Eric P Cartman. I'm a well-respected owner in the slave trade.

      Dean Howland: In the what?

        Eric Cartman: [walks over to a picture of the UCB basketball team] You have some might strong-lookin' workers heah, sahr. I'd be willin' to offer you forty dollars for two of the white ones and fifty for the blacks.

      Dean Howland: Are you refering to our student athletes?

      Eric Cartman: Student atholetes. Hoho, that is brilliant sahr. Now, when we sell their likeness for video games, how do we get around payin' for our slaves uh- "student atheletes" then?

      Dean Howland: Look, there are

      [catches his breath]

      Dean Howland: good reasons why our student athletes cannot be paid, young man

    27. Re:Solution to the problem by Outta_the_way_peck! · · Score: 1

      There is really no point in arguing about this since there will be no more NCAA games. http://www.webpronews.com/ncaa-will-not-renew-ea-contract-ncaa-football-2014-to-be-the-last-ncaa-game-2013-07

    28. Re:Solution to the problem by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      I apologize, I didn't make myself clear...I did NOT mean to infer that each student should have to negotiate with a game manufacturer directly, what I was trying to say is this conversation is low overdo because when you look at how much everybody from the colleges to the NCAA to the guys selling popcorn at the game hundreds of millions are being made off of these kids and they ain't getting shit and that is FUCKED UP, no matter how you slice it.

      These kids suffer and bleed for the game, hell some of them end up with brain damage that will cause them problems the rest of their lives, yet everybody else can make money off of them but they can't get a cent? That is bullshit, just because they are young does NOT give the schools and groups like the NCAA the right to exploit them for hundreds of millions in profits!

      Name any other situation besides student athletes where corps can make tens of millions but get away with no giving the one doing the work a penny because i can't think of one. What they ought to do is have some sort of student union,whether per school or over the whole shebang to be decided later, but they need somebody negotiating to get them a fair slice, what we have now is rigged and broken.

      So again my bad if I didn't make myself clear, if this ruling starts the conversation going that ultimately ends with students being treated like individuals with the right to be paid for their work instead of disposable players? Then I'm ALL for it, 100%.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    29. Re:Solution to the problem by Theaetetus · · Score: 1

      Name any other situation besides student athletes where corps can make tens of millions but get away with no giving the one doing the work a penny because i can't think of one.

      Students who do research, undergrad or graduate level, on inventions that end up being patented and licensed by the university. ;)

    30. Re:Solution to the problem by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      So in other words "colleges exploit students while taking their money"...why am i not surprised? I have been saying for awhile now that colleges have become rackets, with costs jumping several times the rate of inflation while at the same time piling on the bullshit prereqs so they can bleed 'em for every class they can. The whole thing has become both a massive scam and a supporter of classism by letting the uber-rich buy their way into a permanent upper class simply by having the cash to go to an elite school, the thing is a scam.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    31. Re:Solution to the problem by Desty · · Score: 1

      the basic nature of woman is of a whore that is why rich and-or famous men always have arm candy

      Wow. Thanks for letting us know that you have serious problems and that the rest of your post can be safely ignored as the ravings of a madman.

  2. some are more equal than others by turkeydance · · Score: 1

    never thought 1984 would skew this way.

    1. Re:some are more equal than others by GodfatherofSoul · · Score: 5, Informative

      Isn't that Animal Farm?

      --
      I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
    2. Re: some are more equal than others by RyuuzakiTetsuya · · Score: 3, Informative

      Probably because you're quoting another Orwell work, animal farm.

      --
      Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
    3. Re:some are more equal than others by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Especially since it was "Animal Farm" and not 1984.

    4. Re:some are more equal than others by gl4ss · · Score: 2

      yeah and this dude is.. .. a publicly playing dude and the stats are about his public plays, no? I mean, they probably took 'em out of some stats magazine or some shit like that.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    5. Re:some are more equal than others by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lose the over-the-top misquote.

      They were using the likeness of a football player in a football game, and profiting off it. Without licensing.

    6. Re:some are more equal than others by oodaloop · · Score: 3, Funny

      To be fair, I don't recall Animal Farm specifying in what year it took place. Maybe it also took place in the year 1984, albeit in an alternative dimension where animals talked and Oceana wasn't at war with Eastasia.

      --
      Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
    7. Re:some are more equal than others by HornWumpus · · Score: 3, Insightful

      A Jersey # and some playing stats, licensed from the NCAA. It's not like they secretly motion captured him with his girlfriend and 'hot chocolated' them.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    8. Re:some are more equal than others by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia.

    9. Re:some are more equal than others by turkeydance · · Score: 1

      my sarcasm font is disabled. my idea of a little fun. mix 'n match Orwell.

    10. Re:some are more equal than others by besalope · · Score: 2

      Isn't that Animal Farm

      To be fair, I don't recall Animal Farm specifying in what year it took place. Maybe it also took place in the year 1984, albeit in an alternative dimension where animals talked and Oceana wasn't at war with Eastasia.

      Pretty sure he meant the quote, "Some are more equal than others," was from Animal Farm, not the year that Animal Farm took place.

    11. Re:some are more equal than others by slick7 · · Score: 1

      Isn't that Animal Farm?

      Yes it is, because the greedy pigs are in charge. Besides, if the celebrities didn't want fame and fortune, then they shouldn't have stuck their faces all over the TV and movie screens.

      --
      The mind conceives, the body achieves, the spirit manifests.
    12. Re:some are more equal than others by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia.

      These are divisions with in EA right?

    13. Re:some are more equal than others by thunderclap · · Score: 0

      and you know this how? NSA is tracking everyone. Yes, i believe there very well could have from the numerous security footage on the stadiums now. Not his girlfriend and hot chocolated them. Yes they certainly had enough facial and body shots to replicate him.

    14. Re: some are more equal than others by Mabhatter · · Score: 1

      The jersey and number and stats are generally from taxpayer funded PUBLIC schools... But EA can't use THOSE without license... Just watch how fast they get sued.

      The NCAA doesn't have rights to player images because the players are legally amateurs. So otherwise the individual players could have their own licensing for their images and make money!!! But the NCAA doesn't allow PLAYERS to use that right in their league and the NCAA hasn't sold that to EA.

    15. Re:some are more equal than others by idontgno · · Score: 1

      But the celebs want fame and fortune. Not one or the other.

      If anyone'll be making money off of their (apparently famous) likeness, it's gonna be them.

      --
      Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
    16. Re:some are more equal than others by Cordus+Mortain · · Score: 1

      Happened in both. The high up Party members could turn off their monitors for a few minutes at a time. If Winston Smith did it, he'd have been dragged off.

  3. Sooo by Hatta · · Score: 1

    Bring back Mutant League Football and this won't be a problem.

    --
    Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
  4. Does this apply to all athletes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    So, now anyone can make a video game featuring pro athletes?

    1. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by phantomfive · · Score: 3, Informative

      No, now no one can make a video game featuring pro athletes, without paying each athlete.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    2. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      More like now nobody can without bribing all the players.

    3. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So, now anyone can make a video game featuring pro athletes?

      ... and the concept of reading comprehension takes another shattering blow to the jaw ...

    4. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by XaXXon · · Score: 1

      that's what the unions are for. It's not going to be hard to make a game, but the athletes will be paid for their likeness.

      I'm not sure how I feel about this. I don't think that a famous person should have their likeness used for anything any commercial venture wants to use it for. What if they made a baby-killing simulator and used his likeness. Shouldn't he be able to stop that?

      With regards to biographies, it seems like that should fall under news/reporting and be excepted.

      Hrmm.. I don't know.

    5. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by XaXXon · · Score: 2

      You would simply go to the players' union and ask for permission. All the players in the union will have pre-agreed to allow the union to bargain for the palyers as a group. That's what unions do.

    6. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by icebike · · Score: 1

      So, now anyone can make a video game featuring pro athletes?

      These athletes weren't PRO, they were still in college. (Perhaps on a Football scholarship).
      But if accepting a scholarship opens your life to every public use under the sun, then we've not only slipped down that slippery slope, we've hit rock bottom.

      So its not the same as a pro player being paid to perform.

      If it was only the Ninth, I wouldn't worry, but the Third Circuit found essentially the exact same thing for a different player.

      Still I find it odd, that this Court, or any Court, asserting any right to privacy issues one one bench while on other benches, they have gaveled down any such right when ever the government wants a peek at your emails.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    7. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Anubis+IV · · Score: 3, Informative

      What union? This is the NCAA, i.e. they're in college and aren't employed to play.

      For professional sports, sure, but for the NCAA there are strict rules forbidding the players from receiving payments. Licensing their likeness may fall outside the bounds of what's restricted, so it may be possible for them to do so, but there aren't any unions that speak for all of the players. The closest thing is the NCAA itself, but as far as I'm aware (and I may be very mistaken, since I'm disinterested in all of the football fanaticism I see around me in America), the players don't sign away their rights to the NCAA in order to play for their school's team.

    8. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Remember Tecmo Bowl for the NES? The player names were the same, but the team logos were made up and IIRC the team names were only the city names and not the actual team names. It wasn't until Super Tecmo Bowl that they got the legal rights.

    9. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by sixsixtysix · · Score: 1

      what if you made a biographical game?

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      ...
    10. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Dynedain · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Unions (theoretically) exist to protect the employees against the management through collective bargaining.

      Unfortunately in the case of collegiate football, NCAA is the management, and the Universities are the staffing agencies, EA is a 3rd party buying the product, and no-one is representing the interests of the players.

      --
      I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
    11. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by GumphMaster · · Score: 1

      What if they made a baby-killing simulator and used his likeness. Shouldn't he be able to stop that?

      That would be the reasonable time for defamation law

      --
      Patent litigation: A doctrine of Mutually Assured Destruction... in which everyone seems willing to push the button
    12. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by ArchieBunker · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why is this a problem? You are using their likeness to generate income without their consent or compensation.

      --
      Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
    13. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by icebike · · Score: 1

      EA is a 3rd party buying the product,

      EA is the third party usurping the product and repackaging it to make a profit.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    14. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Dynedain · · Score: 1

      No, they bought the product from the NCAA.

      --
      I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
    15. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      EA is a 3rd party buying the product,

      EA is the third party usurping the product and repackaging it to make a profit.

      I'm pretty sure EA Sports pays the NCAA for the license rights. Otherwise, every school represented would be suing as well. I would also guess that the player signs such rights over to his school which signs them over to the NCAA...

    16. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      More likely that they grant permission to use their likeness in video games as a condition of receiving the scholarship.

      The major conferences want to break off into a new division and pay players a stipend. I can imagine that smoothing the way for such a requirement.

    17. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What ever the case, parody MUST be safe. I support college players getting more power over their image. They get shafted enough as it currently is. I do not support college players getting an easy path through college because of their sport, but that is a separate issue.

    18. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by gr8_phk · · Score: 1

      Only if the NCAA secured the rights to it from the players.

    19. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by Dynedain · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Exactly the point and why their is a lawsuit against both EA and the NCAA.

      --
      I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
    20. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by thunderclap · · Score: 1

      which is why they make games with College atheletes

    21. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by thunderclap · · Score: 1

      that's what the unions are for. It's not going to be hard to make a game, but the athletes will be paid for their likeness.

      I'm not sure how I feel about this. I don't think that a famous person should have their likeness used for anything any commercial venture wants to use it for. What if they made a baby-killing simulator and used his likeness. Shouldn't he be able to stop that?

      With regards to biographies, it seems like that should fall under news/reporting and be excepted.

      Hrmm.. I don't know.

      Better question: What if they made a baby-killing simulator and used Casey Anthony's likeness. Shouldn't she be able to stop that? She was found innocent in a court of law.

    22. Re:Does this apply to all athletes? by hibiki_r · · Score: 1

      The NCAA does its best to make sure it enriches itself and the colleges that participate in their competitions without giving the athletes a dime. The kid's output is what brings in all that revenue, and it's not that they are not getting their fair share: They are not getting a share, at all.

      If you look at their balance sheets, you'll find that some universities are not places of learning that happen to host sports: They are professional sports franchises that happen to provide some higher education for cover.

    23. Re: Does this apply to all athletes? by Mabhatter · · Score: 1

      The NFL makes them sign over every detail the lawyers can think of...

      The NCAA is amature, so under that definition PLAYERS don't have the right to exercise their INDIVIDUAL image rights under NCAA rules. Because they are "amature" the NCAA probably can't force the players to sign those rights over to them.. Even player names are probably pushing the NCAA's use of "amature". The NCAA represents the SCHOOL because the school owns the team, mascots, stadiums, etc.. But not the STUDENT images.

    24. Re: Does this apply to all athletes? by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      It could be the NCAA lawyers just forgot to add that to the papers he signed. He also sued the NCAA, and he didn't file until after he graduated (and the NCAA couldn't punish him).

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  5. have nfl blitz come back by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

    That game was fun.

    1st and 30

  6. Well, at least one person is safe by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

    They reasoned that the 'use does not qualify for First Amendment protection as a matter of law because it literally recreates Keller in the very setting in which he has achieved renown

    I guess CowboyNeal is perfectly safe then. I shudder at the prospect of this likeness.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    1. Re:Well, at least one person is safe by MarkvW · · Score: 1

      You do know that there was a real Cowboy Neal out there--a very famous one. Neal Cassady Jack Kerouac's running partner and an OG of the 'Beat Generation.'

      Maybe CowboyNeal is gonna get his ass sued by Neal Cassady's estate!

  7. Not an Orwell moment, let's not reach by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Really not sure where you get the Orwellian connection here: Co was trying to use his likeness without licensing. If they walked up to your door, took your picture, then put you in "Madden Doorbell Ringer 2013" you could sue for the same reasons. This guy wants control over how his likeness and (though somehow not in this case) name is used, whats wrong with that?

  8. Simple Solution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Seems to be a simple solution for game developers, throw in real stats for all of the players and then have some bot go through the stats and change things slightly, skin color, jersey number, etc. Next thing you know the NFL will be suing them for using the same rules as the "official" game though, "want to use a 120 yard field & six points per touchdown? Fork over $1 million"

    1. Re:Simple Solution by tmorehen · · Score: 1

      The simple solution is: if you want to make money off my likeness, compensate me.

    2. Re:Simple Solution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So I guess then there can be no 'based on fact' college sports games any more, since the NCAA takes a dim view on a player being compensated in any way.

    3. Re:Simple Solution by LocalH · · Score: 1

      Next thing you know the NFL will be suing them for using the same rules as the "official" game though, "want to use a 120 yard field & six points per touchdown? Fork over $1 million"

      Horseshit. The game of football, using more or less the same "official" rules, predates the existence of the NFL. They would only have a claim over any NFL-specific rules, if even that (with the whole "can't copyright essential game elements, only expressive artwork" deal, they might not have a leg if you make a "Pro Football 2014" with every rule the same as the NFL down to a T, as long as you don't mention the NFL or use any trademarked or copyrighted material while doing so).

      --
      FC Closer
    4. Re:Simple Solution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, the NFL just wants the money for using the names and likenesses of their established IP, namely the teams, and certain related things, like say, the name of the Superbowl.

      Which coincidentally is why a lot of people want to play the game.

      So...yeah, fork it over.

    5. Re:Simple Solution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      No - the simple solution is to stop making that games...

      If it becomes to expensive to make the game, the resuling income from sales is simply not worth it any longer...
      So - no more sport games...

    6. Re:Simple Solution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And I imagine the "pig skin throwers" back from the turn of the century would have wanted their piece of the pie for starting the popularity of "football", I doubt they ever got any. IP as it is used today is largely a fallacy, most of it is based on older stories, sports & arts and the work of others. If they were actually using his name and exact stats you'd probably have a good point, but they weren't. They were trying to approximate the general feel of the game (maybe a bit too closely given the jersey number), not trying to copy it down to the last detail, because current IP law would make that insanely expensive.

    7. Re: Simple Solution by Mabhatter · · Score: 1

      By EA PAYS for the stats and the TEAM livery because the NCAA sues people HARD for not doing that. The whole issue is that the NCAA has no right to ask STUDENTS for image licensing, so EA used that illegally.

  9. Not bribing by SuperKendall · · Score: 5, Insightful

    More like now nobody can without bribing all the players.

    How is it "bribing" a player to give them money so in return you have their permission to use their likeness?

    If someone created a game that used your likeness wouldn't you think you should at least be asked permission to do so?

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:Not bribing by king+neckbeard · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If I was awesome in the game, I would be happy that I'm being portrayed as awesome to the world. If I was portrayed in a neutral light, I wouldn't have a reason to care all that much. If I was potrayed as lame, then it would obviously be some kind of parody or other transformation, so while I may be unhappy, I wouldn't have any just complaint.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    2. Re:Not bribing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And if you were shown as the weak link that costs the game, the criminal or the pedophile? Ah well, just a parody, not real, so who cares, right?

    3. Re:Not bribing by CanHasDIY · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If I was awesome in the game, I would be happy that I'm being portrayed as awesome to the world. If I was portrayed in a neutral light, I wouldn't have a reason to care all that much. If I was potrayed as lame, then it would obviously be some kind of parody or other transformation, so while I may be unhappy, I wouldn't have any just complaint.

      Easy for some nobody, no-name neckbeard to say.

      However, if your fiscal security was based on your own likeness, you'd probably be singing a different tune.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    4. Re:Not bribing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

      No, his fiscal security is based on his continued perfromance. If his face got burnt off and somehow didn't affect his eyesight, he could still play at a high level, likeness has nothing to do with it.

    5. Re:Not bribing by king+neckbeard · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If simply being me was a marketable skill, then I would hope I would be extremely grateful. Currently though, I have to actually be useful to make money.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    6. Re:Not bribing by cheekyjohnson · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If someone created a game that used your likeness wouldn't you think you should at least be asked permission to do so?

      I might prefer to be asked for permission first, but I don't believe that censorship is the answer or that I should be able to stop them from arranging data in a certain way.

      --
      Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
    7. Re:Not bribing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hey, that's King Neckbeard to you. And everyone else on /.

      I almost called you out for pointless name calling, but then I read he user name and realized that would be silly.

    8. Re:Not bribing by SuperKendall · · Score: 0

      If I was portrayed in a neutral light, I wouldn't have a reason to care all that much.

      I'll get right on that beer-pong game that uses your likeness for free then. Thanks!

      --
      "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    9. Re:Not bribing by Cabriel · · Score: 1

      If someone was using your name to sell their product, doesn't that imply that you support or endorse their product? Someone must ask for permission to legally (legitimately?) make the claim that you support or endorse their product. The vast majority of people believe this, and the law revolves around what "reasonable people" would understand.

      In this case, even though the name was stripped out, the player is still clearly and obviously identifiable in the game. Someone who played the game before watching the sport would see the player in real life and think "Hey, that's the guy from my game!" This is EA very obviously overreaching, and we should not try to justify bad habits by big businesses.

    10. Re:Not bribing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We're talking about college football, I'm pretty sure they don't get paid.

    11. Re:Not bribing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This really has to do with the NCAA then bribing players. The NCAA has been (or always was) a defunct sanctions system, they are the ones that probably gave EA the go ahead to do this. I am not standing up for EA, but this idiot should have sued the NCAA. The NCAA has been chastised for its lack of action, and for its lack of aiding/protecting athletes. More colleges with athletic programs are trying to move away from the NCAA, not only because the NCAA is worthless, but they can get away with whatever they want without having to worry if and when the NCAA decides to lay out fines or punishment.

      In all fairness the schools themselves should be held accountable, I find it hard to believe they either know nothing of this, or they didn't care.

    12. Re:Not bribing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Easy one.

      Absolutely not.

    13. Re:Not bribing by ohnocitizen · · Score: 1

      I fucking love your username. Ok, as to the actual argument, think of your likeness as software: You put it out there, either for free as a service, or people pay you to use your likeness. Either way, if a company came along and started using your software to make money without your permission, wouldn't you be angry? If their likeness is so mundane, why did they have to copy the face, jersey, stats of a player, why not just make them up entirely? And why should companies get to use a person's likeness for free to make money? I'm not famous, and that would creep me the fuck out.

    14. Re:Not bribing by king+neckbeard · · Score: 2

      If he was on the cover or noticeably in marketing materials, then there's a decent argument for endorsement. If he's just one person in the game not really distinguished from the others, then he is, in my opinion, roughly the equivalent of an extra in a movie. They don't get residuals, only a small sum for showing up, and this guy was not physically present.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    15. Re:Not bribing by cheekyjohnson · · Score: 2

      If someone was using your name to sell their product, doesn't that imply that you support or endorse their product?

      Not to me.

      The vast majority of people believe this, and the law revolves around what "reasonable people" would understand.

      I don't think most people are "reasonable" (since it's subjective and all) at all, but even if they were, I don't think most people understand the law

      --
      Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
    16. Re:Not bribing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Funnily enough, in the EU you could make an argument that this falls foul of 95/46/EC - the data protection directive.
      Since the details concerned are very much personally identifiable (if they weren't, we wouldn't be having this discussion), any processing in the EU has to comply with that directive.

      And yes, one of the stipulations concerns informed consent.

    17. Re:Not bribing by turp182 · · Score: 1

      Their fiscal security is based on their sports ability (both skill and fitness to perform), not their likeness. They aren't models.

      Get a bad injury while playing NCAA ball, no pro career, no matter how good you WERE. Get injured badly in the pros, sorry, no more money (depends on your contract though, seems A-Rod can get a lifetime ban and still make over $60 million...).

      If modelling was their career choice it would be different, that is truly basing fiscal security on one's likeness. T'would be a crappy game...

      I have no opinion on the article, haven't played sports games since the early SEGA NHL series (thousands of hours played).

      --
      BlameBillCosby.com
    18. Re:Not bribing by CanHasDIY · · Score: 2

      Their fiscal security is based on their sports ability (both skill and fitness to perform), not their likeness. They aren't models.

      When their likeness is used for profit, they very much are models, if not in title.

      Get a bad injury while playing NCAA ball, no pro career, no matter how good you WERE.

      Which has fuck-all to do with the fact that EA is making money off this dude's likeness, without his permission, and giving him precisely dick in exchange.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    19. Re:Not bribing by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      If he's just one person in the game not really distinguished from the others, then he is, in my opinion, roughly the equivalent of an extra in a movie.

      EA created a player in the game that has his number, his stats, his physical likeness, and just so happens to play for the same team. So no, he's not "roughly the equivalent of an extra," he's the character in the game minus his actual name.

      Side note: you don't know a whole lot about sports, do you? Each player has their own set of statistics, so each and every player is distinctly distinguished from each other.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    20. Re:Not bribing by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      His voice, face, and name are not present. That would mean that he is pretty clearly an extra from the perspective of SAG, and they go quite a bit beyond what the law requires in California, let alone the rest of the country. In fact, he would have probably been laughed out of court in any other state.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  10. somewhat California-specific by Trepidity · · Score: 4, Informative

    It's worth noting that the U.S. has no federal copyright-like "publicity right". Authors have copyright, and inventors have patents, but the Copyright & Patent Clause does not authorize any other kind of IP.

    California, on the other hand, has a specific law granting celebrities exclusive use over their likenesses. Since it's a state law, in a federal court it prevails unless either it's preempted by a federal law under the preemption doctrine, or violates an incorporated-against-the-states right of the people, such as First Amendment. Here, the court held that California's law didn't violate the First Amendment.

    That isn't good, but it doesn't actually mean that celebrities have some kind of inherent or national right to control their likenesses. States which disagree with this kind of outcome should make sure they repeal, or don't pass in the first place, laws like California's.

    1. Re:somewhat California-specific by Trepidity · · Score: 2

      [Reply to self]

      Oops, I linked the amendment to the California law that strengthened it, rather than the law itself. Here's the full codified law.

    2. Re:somewhat California-specific by icebike · · Score: 1

      That isn't good, but it doesn't actually mean that celebrities have some kind of inherent or national right to control their likenesses. States which disagree with this kind of outcome should make sure they repeal, or don't pass in the first place, laws like California's.

      It isn't exactly BAD either.

      First, in the present case(s), these were college kids, playing in what is nationally asserted as a non-pro setting.

      But also, it seems quite obvious that such rulings asserting some semblance of privacy are long overdue.
      The violations of all norms of behavior often goes to absolutely ridiculous extremes, which makes it pretty much
      a necessity for government to step in and even the playing field. Hence California's Paparazzi Law.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    3. Re:somewhat California-specific by lord_mike · · Score: 1

      Most states have some sort of right of publicity legislation. It varies from state to state, but pretty much every state recognizes this right.

    4. Re:somewhat California-specific by westlake · · Score: 2

      That isn't good, but it doesn't actually mean that celebrities have some kind of inherent or national right to control their likenesses. States which disagree with this kind of outcome should make sure they repeal, or don't pass in the first place, laws like California's.

      Because the state doesn't want the resident celebrity whose image is bankable and therefore taxable --- along with everything else he brings in.

      Sports sim fans are fanatical about rules, teams, leagues, players, stats, uniforms, stadiums and so on. What they want is the authentic game day experience. If you fake it, you lose them. That is why you pay for the rights to everything.

      It's really quite amusing to see the geek defend EA's right to a free ride.

    5. Re:somewhat California-specific by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think 'trademark law' should apply in this case.

      A trademark doesn't have to be registered, or even a design. If you've built up "recognition" of your brand using a distinctive look, name, shape, colour or whatever, then you're entitled to complain when someone else tries to use that same, or a confusingly similar, look, name, shape or colour to build *their* brand in the same sphere of business.

      Seems to me that principle should apply here, and the courts are right to recognise it. The EFF is, on this occasion, wrong.

  11. Well the obvious answer then... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is to make a video game featuring exact likenesses of these 2 judges in a cort room pleasuring a giant penis with assorted comporate logos on it. "very setting in which he has achieved renown"

  12. Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by nephorm · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This isn't a matter of parody or satire; this is EA making money from the likenesses of people they never compensated. It is akin to creating a CGI representation of an athlete or celebrity and using it in a TV commercial.

    1. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      Why shouldn't they be able to profit from his likeness? It doesn't imply an endorsement of EA or anything else. It portrays him as he is.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    2. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by bitt3n · · Score: 1

      It is akin to creating a CGI representation of an athlete or celebrity and using it in a TV commercial.

      that doesn't seem like a particularly accurate comparison. one is likely to believe the CGI representation is the actual person, whereas no one playing Madden thinks he's actually controlling Tom Brady.

    3. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      All the same, it seems fair that if they use him in a game, he should get a cut of the profits.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    4. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by Frobnicator · · Score: 2, Informative

      I have to agree with the third judge on the panel. They aren't profiting from his likeness. They are profiting from the NCAA statistics.

      They have a contract with the NCAA to use NCAA stats. The numbers are all NCAA statistics.

      If we follow the majority judges' logic to the end, groups will be unable to publish statistics on the players unless they have an agreement with every player. Agreements with the league about the league's statistics are no longer good enough. Sorry ESPN, your costs just went up.

      --
      //TODO: Think of witty sig statement
    5. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It is akin to creating a CGI representation of an athlete or celebrity and using it in a TV commercial.

      that doesn't seem like a particularly accurate comparison. one is likely to believe the CGI representation is the actual person, whereas no one playing Madden thinks he's actually controlling Tom Brady.

      I don't think you really understand the purpose of advertising. Advertisers don't get celebrities to endorse products because they think people will say "Lady Gaga uses that deodorant! I'm going to get it and smell like her!" (Chances are she doesn't use that brand.) Instead, there's two goals:
      1) associate a product with someone you like or trust
      2) get you to remember that product by associating with someone you know

      #1 makes you more likely to buy that product when you see it in the store; you won't think of Lady Gaga when you see the brand she endorsed next to random brands, but it will be in the back of your head that you somehow trust that brand because you like Lady Gaga. #1 is the same idea: people are more likely to buy a brand they've heard of or remember, and if Lady Gaga endorses a brand, you're much more likely to remember it than if some random person is on the ad. In short, the CGI celebrity can accomplish the same goals as the real one.

      So...why is the original correlation valid? The game is trying to make you think of real football. How can you do that? Easy, use real players. Then you will think the game is more realistic because it has people that look just like the ones you know and love.

    6. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by cheekyjohnson · · Score: 1

      Why not? I think this is about as nonsensical as copyright and its poisonous ilk.

      --
      Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
    7. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why are newspapers and magazines able to print photos of celebrities without compensating them? If paparazzi can basically stalk a celebrity to get their photo for a magazine and be protected by the first amendment, why can't EA use information that's part of a television broadcast to create a depiction of someone?

    8. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You must be too cool to have "idols", on the other hand, invite a group of kids to play the game and you will notice how they will all go "I wanna be X" and do indeed live into so much that they are effectively being/controlling X. Maybe you do not want/need to escape your life to be someone else, but that is the experience these games sell.

      TL;DR: Plenty of people plays thinking/fantasising that they are (or are controlling) Tom Brady (or whoever)

    9. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Personally I think the idol-worship is way out of hand, and these magazines and paparazzi should be severely limited in what they can do. that said, a newspaper brings information about news - real events - facts - things that happened/are about to happen. EA is selling a "make your own story" featuring these players. I think there is a difference between facts and fantasy - you may ofcourse think differently

    10. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by slew · · Score: 1

      This isn't a matter of parody or satire; this is EA making money from the likenesses of people they never compensated. It is akin to creating a CGI representation of an athlete or celebrity and using it in a TV commercial.

      I'm not sure this is that different than say the novel War and Peace making reference to dozens of real people to give it an aura of period authenticity. It's also somewhat akin to say making money from writing an unauthorized biography of some athlete or celebrity. These usually aren't parody or satire (well sometimes, but not always).

      In the games in question, EA really only used the jersey numbers and never actually used the real names of the folks, although they were superficially similar to the people involved.

      Taken to it's extreme, it would basically prevent celebrity impersonators, or maybe even people that merely are mistaken for another celebrity from being employable.

    11. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by nephorm · · Score: 2

      Making reference to real world characters is one thing. But imagine if someone had tried to make the movie "Being John Malkovich" without actually hiring or getting permission from John Malkovich. Then you have the situation that the movie is being sold based upon the likeness. You have a first amendment right to talk about other people, as long as you don't say something slanderous or write something libelous. You can even make money off of what you say about those people. But if you use someone's likeness merely to add value to your product, you ought to pay them. Otherwise, why shouldn't I take a picture of my favorite actor and put him in an ad for my next product? It is the same thing with model releases - you have to get specific authorization to use a model's likeness to sell products.

      Regarding unauthorized biographies or documentaries: The difference - and this is where the EFF's analysis is flawed - is that documentaries and biographies are selling an interpretation of events, not using a likeness strictly to sell a product. If EA wanted to publish a list of player stats as a fact book, or a NCAA encyclopedia, they probably would've been able to do so with no problems. They could have included the players' pictures without permission.

      Doesn't EA pay pro athletes to depict them in video games? This just seems like they are taking advantage of college athletes, and trying to get away with doing something never could with pro players.

    12. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by Dynedain · · Score: 1

      If we follow the majority judges' logic to the end, groups will be unable to publish statistics on the players unless they have an agreement with every player. Agreements with the league about the league's statistics are no longer good enough. Sorry ESPN, your costs just went up.

      EA is profiting from both the likeness and the stats. They pay a licensing cost to NCAA for both. Sure anyone can redistribute the facts, but when you take the facts to build a persona and place that persona in a fictional circumstance, you now are no longer simply using the statistic. Now you're capitalizing on the similarity of the persona to the real person, aka, their likeness.

      --
      I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
    13. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by cpt+kangarooski · · Score: 1

      It is akin to creating a CGI representation of an athlete or celebrity and using it in a TV commercial.

      Even then, I think that the courts can take it too far sometimes. About twenty years ago, Samsung ran a series of ads for their line of VCRs, playing up how reliable they were, and how we would all still be using them in the future. (As I'm sure we all do)

      One of the ads can be seen here: http://joshblackman.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/Vanna-White.jpg

      Vanna White sued Samsung, claiming that the use of a prop robot wearing a wig and dress, and turning letters infringed on her publicity right. And she won. But I find the dissent in the case to be more compelling:

      The majority contends that "the individual aspects of the advertisement ... [v]iewed together leave little doubt about the celebrity the ad is meant to depict." Majority Opinion at p. 1399. It derives this conclusion from the fact that Vanna White is "the only one" who "dresses like this, turns letters, and does this on the Wheel of Fortune game show." Id. In reaching this conclusion, the majority confuses Vanna White, the person, with the role she has assumed as the current hostess on the "Wheel of Fortune" television game show. A recognition of the distinction between a performer and the part he or she plays is essential for a proper analysis of the facts of this case. As is discussed below, those things which Vanna White claims identify her are not unique to her. They are, instead, attributes of the role she plays. The representation of those attributes, therefore, does not constitute a representation of Vanna White. See Nurmi v. Peterson, 10 U.S.P.Q.2d 1775 (C.D.Cal.1989) (distinguishing between performer and role).

      Vanna White is a one-role celebrity. She is famous solely for appearing as the hostess on the "Wheel of Fortune" television show. There is nothing unique about Vanna White or the attributes which she claims identify her. Although she appears to be an attractive woman, her face and figure are no more distinctive than that of other equally comely women. She performs her *1405 role as hostess on "Wheel of Fortune" in a simple and straight-forward manner. Her work does not require her to display whatever artistic talent she may possess.

      The majority appears to argue that because Samsung created a robot with the physical proportions of an attractive woman, posed it gracefully, dressed it in a blond wig, an evening gown, and jewelry, and placed it on a set that resembles the Wheel of Fortune layout, it thereby appropriated Vanna White's identity. But an attractive appearance, a graceful pose, blond hair, an evening gown, and jewelry are attributes shared by many women, especially in Southern California. These common attributes are particularly evident among game-show hostesses, models, actresses, singers, and other women in the entertainment field. They are not unique attributes of Vanna White's identity. Accordingly, I cannot join in the majority's conclusion that, even if viewed together, these attributes identify Vanna White and, therefore, raise a triable issue as to the appropriation of her identity.

      The only characteristic in the commercial advertisement that is not common to many female performers or celebrities is the imitation of the "Wheel of Fortune" set. This set is the only thing which might possibly lead a viewer to think of Vanna White. The Wheel of Fortune set, however, is not an attribute of Vanna White's identity. It is an identifying characteristic of a television game show, a prop with which Vanna White interacts in her role as the current hostess. To say that Vanna White may bring an action when another blond female performer or robot appears on such a set as a hostess will, I am sure, be a surprise to the owners of the show. Cf. Baltimore Orioles, Inc. v. Major League Baseball Players Ass'n, 805 F.2d 663 (7th Cir.1986) (right

      --
      -- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
    14. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      How are the stats copyrightable, aren't they just a collection of facts? Shouldn't they fall under the same rules that phonebooks do?

    15. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by slew · · Score: 1

      But imagine if someone had tried to make the movie "Being John Malkovich" without actually hiring or getting permission from John Malkovich. Then you have the situation that the movie is being sold based upon the likeness.

      1. AFAIK, the script was written and shopped around w/o John Malkovich's knowledge or permission. He was picked apparently because the screenwriter liked the sound of his name and his personality. Only later was the actual John Malkovich notified and convinced to sign to do the movie.
      2. The movie has literally nothing to do with John Malkovich's real life nor any non hallucinogenic fictional interpretation of anyone's actual life.

      I don't think this case is really much different than if someone made a movie called "Citizen Kane", or wrote a book called the "Science of Michael Crichton", or even a sitcom called "That's My Bush!".

      I've read that the "theory" that EA was going by is that the NCAA owns the jersey numbers and they paid a license to the NCAA for the use of the college uniform designs and team names. The college players in question didn't share in this revenue (nor do they share in other NCAA revenue like licensing of jerseys to clothing manufacturers, ticket sales or broadcast revenue) and no student's actual names were used in the EA product.

      Of course the students are pissed off about this (and the general fact they don't share in any NCAA revenue). It's really just all about the money...

    16. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If their sole profit is from the statistics then there is no benefit to them to use ANY realistic likenesses. So why would EA pay to develop and implement them?

    17. Re:Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness? by organgtool · · Score: 1

      Why Should EA Profit from His Likeness?

      Why should an athlete profit from EA's work when they contributed absolutely no effort towards the development of the game? Did this athlete compile all of his own statistics and provide them to EA? Did he pose for pictures of his likeness to be textured onto the character model? Did he provide motion capture data for this game? Then why should he receive one cent when he contributed no work to the product? I'm really tired of people expecting to be paid for things such as their "likeness" because it's not something that makes sense to own. For anybody who thinks otherwise, consider how many people look alike and imagine all of those people start putting their hands out every time they look similar to a rendered character in a movie, tv show, video game, etc. And if you still think you own your likeness, then what happens in the case of identical twins?

  13. All men are equal, but some more equal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Watch for laws that apply only to some people.

    NSA spies on Bill Clintons emails (and likely politicians in general), on soldiers sex talks to their wives back home, on journalists phoning their newspapers, and still insists it 'never' abuses all this data its been illegally collecting, which of course is untrue.

    Which of these do you think would get special protection? I think politicians will write themselves special privacy protection from the NSA and they'll think that's fine, forgetting that everyone of them was an ordinary person before they became a politician.

    I also think they're really dumb, XKeyscore 'logs' searches only because General liar Alexander decided it does. I bet he has versions that don't log squat he uses for his personal politics. Because the idea that everyone in the NSA is a saint, and everyone outside is a potential terrorist, doesn't wash.

    http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130731/16193324027/nsa-boss-insists-that-analysts-cant-abuse-surveillance-systems-forgets-to-mention-that-they-have.shtml

  14. What about actors, etc? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm not sure how this ruling can be made. Biographical info, statistics, sports number... All facts and publicly available.

    So is IMDB now illegal? It publishes similar info about actors/actresses/has-beens.

    1. Re:What about actors, etc? by pspahn · · Score: 1

      IMDB publishes public information about works of entertainment. NCAA Football is a fictional representation based on works of entertainment.

      IMDB is fine to publish factual items about "The Phantom Menace", but they can't publish a video game based on the same thing.

      It will be interesting to see how this might affect fantasy sports games, but I suppose they differ in the simple fact that the video game creates an alternate and fictional world where these people exist, rather than simply taking the public statistics and known abilities and running math on the results.

      --
      Someone flopped a steamer in the gene pool.
  15. Right for privacy!? au contraire by El_Muerte_TDS · · Score: 1

    Keller sued EA claiming that the game infringed his right of publicity

    It's about the right for publicity, not the right for privacy.

    1. Re:Right for privacy!? au contraire by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      Keller sued EA claiming that the game infringed his right of publicity

      It's about the right for publicity, not the right for privacy.

      Correct - it is against the law to use someone's likeness without getting their permission first; notable exceptions such as parody excluded.

      As it should be.

      --
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    2. Re:Right for privacy!? au contraire by Schmorgluck · · Score: 1

      I know I'm nitpicking, but it's more the notion of satire than that of parody that apply here.

      --
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  16. I agree with the decision by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Actors, news anchors, sports superstars, etc. all make their living on the image broadcast in the media. You can't use an actor's likeness to sell a product unless you contract with the actor to do it. If EA wants to use his likeness, pay him for it.

    Secondly, it's about time that college players start getting a cut of the billion or so amount of money that the NCAA and colleges having been raking in over the last couple of decades.

    1. Re:I agree with the decision by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      I think it's a mistake to conflate an endorsement with all usage of likenesses. This isn't Coca Cola placing his face in an ad for Powerade, this is a video game company making a realistic football video game.

      Look, EA deserves far worse than this to happen to them. I hate them with a fiery passion, but they are actually right on this.

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    2. Re:I agree with the decision by vux984 · · Score: 2

      this is a video game company making a realistic football video game.

      So... taking all the college players stats for the last 50 years, randomly assiging them jersey numbers, skin tones, eye colors, heights, and phsyiques would result in a realistic player pool from which to create a realistic football game.

      Why exactly does the jersey number, physical profile and football stats all need to line up to a very particular and easily identifiable individuals?

      That's not "realistic" football players, that's "real" football players. And they deserve to get paid.

    3. Re:I agree with the decision by lord_mike · · Score: 1

      The players do get a cut of the money that the NCAA makes on the games. They not only get scholarships, but they get new facilities, equipment, training staff, etc. The money that comes from big name programs goes right back into big name programs. Very few athletic programs actually make a profit. Most lose money. Why? Well, the non-revenue sports such as women's volleyball, crew, soccer, etc. can get very expensive, too, and football and/or basketball subsidize those sports. In many schools, even football loses money, since it is the most expensive sport of them all. This idea that schools are raking in the dough while these poor athletes suffer being treated as gods on campus is an erroneous one. Unfortunately, it seems that the courts are really being affected by the sob stories instead of reality. The result is that we, the ordinary consumer, lose. There will be no more historical games, not just in sports, but anything involving the last century involving any real people. The dissenting opinion stated that under this ruling, the movie Forrest Gump would have been illegal. Historical sporting games are out, of course, and any current realistic amateur sporting games are also toast. It's a broadly dangerous ruling that pretty much tramples historical legal precedent on the first amendment. I hope that someone takes this appeal and somehow rights this wrong, but I doubt it. I don't think the judges are aware how broad and artistically stifling this ruling is.

  17. how is that going to work? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    had they used his name I could understand, but jersey number? theres not a whole lot to chose from, and how different from some real player must the stats be to not infringe?

  18. The EFF is wrong here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is about EA profiting from the likeness of unpaid, uncompensated NCAA players, something that EA and the NCAA have been doing for a long time. Just watch Crack Baby Basketball episode of South Park for the satire of this. I don't think this has anything to do with free speech so much as blatantly profiting from someone's likeness without compensating them.

  19. Pay or not to pay, that is the qq. by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 2

    You use the man because he's famous at a sport, pay the man because he's famous at a sport.

    It's not really any different from trademarks. You can blabber about Harry Potter all day. You just can't write a story then sell it without permission.

    Football games are not public events in the same sense as a fight in a street is.

    Nothing to see here, move along.

    --
    (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    1. Re:Pay or not to pay, that is the qq. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It's far more complicated. If you're a member of the NCAA, you are barred from profiting from ones likeness related to the game of non-professional football. Only the NCAA and/or schools can profit from your likeness. Sam Keller is trying to do an end run around the NCAA.

    2. Re:Pay or not to pay, that is the qq. by Schmorgluck · · Score: 1

      I agree with the sentiment of your post, but oh boy do you mix up three totally unrelated notions: right to one's own image, trademarks, and unauthorized derivative works.

      --
      There's nothing like $HOME
    3. Re:Pay or not to pay, that is the qq. by lord_mike · · Score: 1

      And yet, on the same day, this same panel ruled against Jim Brown's likeness lawsuit against EA, saying that personal trademarks were not violated by EA's Madden all star team.

  20. I thought the NCAA owned his likeness by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Doesn't the NCAA have all athletes sign away rights to their own likenesses? Does that really not cover this "right of publicity"?

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-06-19/ncaa-6-4-billion-threatened-by-suit-over-player-likeness.html

    Also, these judges clearly do not understand "transformative use" or they do not understand the very nature of video games. While the game has recreated his look, jersey number, and copy/pastad his stats it is not done to "recreate reality" as evidenced by the fact that I, as a player, can make this avatar run plays that he never has run nor ever would run. I could make this avatar do all sorts of crazy shit in a video that he never has nor will ever do in real life. Actions that the video game player takes or could take are also part of the video game itself.

  21. Yes, publicity means privacy in this context. by Valdrax · · Score: 1

    The right of publicity is essentially the right to control commercial use of one's name, likeness, and reputation. It is the right not to be exploited for sensationalist profit. Is the right to control what words people try to put in your mouth -- what people try to claim that you endorse or support. This is part right now that people are railing against -- the notion that profit trumps speech.

    However, there's another side to the publicity coin, and that's the right to be left alone. The right not to have one's likeness and life drug through the public eye without some kind of public merit. It's based on the notion that we have a natural right as to how and whether aspects of our lives are communicated to the public. It's very closely related to the doctrines behind prohibiting slander and libel. That side is very much about privacy.

    The general causes for action under the notion of right of publicity are:
    1) Intrusion upon physical solitude.
    2) Public disclosure of private facts.
    3) Depiction in a false light.
    4) Appropriation of name and likeness.

    While this case is about #4, #1-3 are essential privacy rights, and while the EFF is not arguing against them, I worry that weakening appropriation weakens false light, disclosure, and intrusion torts.

    As to the case at hand, in general, commercial speech gets the lowest protection by the First Amendment. Privacy trumps profitable speech, but much like defamation law, the protections weaken the more political and public your life is and the closer the speech comes to political or academic speech, until it comes to the point that politicians essentially have no right of publicity, which is frankly the way it should be.

    --
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  22. I'm not with the EFF on this one by Dynedain · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I like to support the EFF, but I'm firmly in the camp of the athlete in this. Basically, collegiate athletes are unpaid, and the schools make tons of money off of their celebrity status. Then, EA swoops in and makes a contract with the private governing organization (NCAA) and gets to make even more money off of it. It's a guaranteed revenue stream as each year they release a new title with simply updated bitmaps and adjustments to values in the stats database. The NCAA gets a big fat chunk of profit (which they don't distribute). The schools also get big fat chunks of the profit (for using the school's trademarked logos and identities) but we somehow pretend that the athletes are amateurs and shouldn't be compensated beyond their education (which is little more than a rubber-stamped diploma).

    I think it's atrocious, and I'm hoping this lawsuit shakes up the system substantially. The NCAA are the ones most at risk here in the fallout. EA won't be hit nearly as hard since this isn't their only major franchise, and the schools will still be able to license they way they always have.

    Disclaimer - I'm a fan of collegiate football.

    --
    I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
    1. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The difference is that the schools compensate the athletes with a free education. That is not "unpaid." Just line up the millions of students who will have $25-50k in debt after their education and see if they don't think getting a free education is a pretty good deal.

      EA, however, gives the students nothing. They profit from the students' hard work without giving them a dime. Oh, sure, they pay the NCAA, but that doesn't do much for the kids.

    2. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just because the NCAA is atrocious (I agree) doesn't mean this ruling is right. Two wrongs don't make a right. A bad ruling is a bad ruling even if it helps someone you like. On top of that your shakeup wouldn't come. The result will be that this will be added to the release that athlete sign to play. Nothing more.

    3. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by dyingtolive · · Score: 1

      I just mentally changed all the words in your post to the equivalent relevant to the music industry.

      I wonder what would happen if someone made a game where they used unlicensed likenesses of bands, without using their actual music.

      This is probably off topic. :(

      --
      Support the EFF and Creative Commons. The war is coming, and they're supporting you...
    4. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Dynedain · · Score: 2

      The amount they get in a "free education" is far below what they could get from endorsement deals.

      Furthermore, they're expected to spend all their time in training, practice, competition, etc., and are given very simple course loads which they are often just credited without doing any coursework. What is the value of the education in that scenario? When these kids break a bone as a rookie in the pro leagues, ending their career, how many say "Well at least I have a BA in > from > to fall back on?"

      Hence my comment about rubber-stamp diplomas that provide these athletes with very little.

      Granted, in the less popular sports, the athletes aren't getting as much "free education" or at least realize they have fairly little athletic earning potential over their lifetimes and so focus on their academics. Prestigious degrees are far more common in athletes outside of football and basketball.

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    5. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Dynedain · · Score: 1

      NCAA is being sued in this as well and the damages could be astronomic for them.

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    6. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Dynedain · · Score: 1

      And I don't think it's a bad ruling and I think the EFF is putting up a strawman argument. I think Zuckerburg should have seen compensation for The Social Network. It's clearly based on him, makes up things about him, and

      Now I think he was smart in not making too much stink about it (which could have backfired in his IPO scheme and damaged the Facebook brand), but if he did, I think he would have been in the right, as much as I may not care for him personally.

      In my opinion, reporting, repeating, or declaring facts is "fair use" (for lack of a better name). Placing the likeness or name of a real person in a fictional setting for profit should be protected. This is why movies love to use the disclaimer "All likeness or similarities to real people is unintentional."

      If you publish a book with Harry Potter characters without getting permission from JK, are you going to get in trouble? Why should it be any different because you're using real people instead of fictitious characters?

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    7. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The amount they get in a "free education" is far below what they could get from endorsement deals.

      You write that only thinking of the schools and players in the "Power Conferences". And even out of those schools, only a fraction of those players are superstars that could make significantly more in endorsement deals. No one, outside of their family and friends, is interested in the 3rd string defensive tackle or the six guys on the basketball team that never enter a game unless it is a blowout.

      The vast majority of schools never have their games televised on a major network. The overwhelming majority of "student-athletes" would never command endorsement deals that would equal their tuition cost.

    8. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by cheekyjohnson · · Score: 1

      Why should it be any different because you're using real people instead of fictitious characters?

      What if the reader doesn't think that using fictional characters should result in someone getting punished? In that case, your question kind of becomes pointless.

      --
      Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
    9. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, those kids you're talking about don't get full scholarships. They get brain damage, but not even healthcare that covers the recurring problems.

      And yes, the value of their education is substantially less than a real education in every metric but bullshit tuition dollars.

    10. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I am really glad to see this decision. College athletes are so badly abused. The NCAA makes BILLIONS and not only do they not pay the people generating this income (the athletes), they actually penalize them for taking "bribes." Honestly I can't understand why this is allowed. +1 Dynadain, I agree 100%

      Disclaimer: I would rather reinstall windows than watch a college game, but I hate seeing people abused.

    11. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bullshit.

      College educations for the most part are $100,000+ or more over a typical 5 year stay most college football athletes receive.

      Most college football players never see TV time, nor do they see the NFL calling...ever.

      Free education, books etc. are MORE than compensation for any likeness usage the NCAA may ever resell.

    12. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Dynedain · · Score: 1

      Free education, books etc. are MORE than compensation for any likeness usage the NCAA may ever resell.

      You're missing my point. Since the athletic program monopolizes their time, they rarely get much of an education. They get a diploma, but not the education that it implies. Hence, they receive very little value.

      Also, the kids that don't make it to the NFL aren't getting full ride scholarships. As I said before, those kids tend to get better degrees and a better education because they're partially responsible for paying for it, and so care more about the education itself.

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    13. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      NCAA is being sued in this as well and the damages could be astronomic for them.

      The NCAA will just require students to waive such rights if they want to participate in collegiate athletics, get athletic scholarships, etc. If they or their schools don't already.

    14. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bullshit, those who qualify to play on the football team may not get airtime but they get a sports scholarship

    15. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Using lawsuits in hopes of 'shaking up a system' without directly targeting bad behavior is a recipe for bad precedent and bad law that will adversely impact far more than the system you dislike.

    16. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Also, the kids that don't make it to the NFL aren't getting full ride scholarships. As I said before, those kids tend to get better degrees and a better education because they're partially responsible for paying for it, and so care more about the education itself.

      Everyone on scholarship in FBS (Division I-A) football has a full ride. The vast majority of those players never get a sniff from an NFL team.

    17. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by chonglibloodsport · · Score: 1

      And where do you think that $100,000+ in tuition goes? Answer: it lines the pockets of all the fatcat school administrators. These schools are not in the business of education; they're in the business of making money so they can grow their bureaucracies.
      http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-11-14/bureaucrats-paid-250-000-feed-outcry-over-college-costs.html

    18. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Right. Every kid who suits up to play collegiate athletics is brain damaged. /appeal to please think of the children/

    19. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      i'm not on your side. There are lots of entities which make money off the players. The colleges themselves can make millions from selling seats to marketing the team. The photographer's take pictures and video all the time, which they make a living off of. Magazines and tv stations like ESPN sell this info for a lot of money too. Then there are clothing manufacturers who get licenses from the school to create jerseys of the players and other assorted fan clothing.

      The point is, i'm sure there are a whole heap of people who make a living off the players. The players themselves don't make a dime. What they do use is their fame gained to go professional and that's where they make millions for playing. If you want to start "licensing" the players because they deserve compensation for their image being used, that starts a whole mess of nasty unintended effects. What if that bled over to not being able to photograph police in public because they have the right to deny use of their trademark or other such nonsense?

    20. Re: I'm not with the EFF on this one by Mabhatter · · Score: 2

      Do students pay 1099 or W2 and other EMPLOYMENT TAXES on their full scholarships??? No? Then they are not PAID and the NCAA is dodging a serious amount of Employer Taxes that the IRS should collect!

    21. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm pretty sure that when you sign up to play any collegiate sport, you sign contracts allowing the school to use and sell your likeness. Don't like it? Don't sign the contract and (most likely) don't play.

    22. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by RyoShin · · Score: 1

      While I agree that college athletes should get paid when products use their likeness (their main "salary" is a free ride at the college, from my understanding,) and that EA in general is an evil company, I believe the EFF's stance here is proper on a broader scale (I haven't RTFA; this is Slashdot, after all.) What if the person in question was, I don't know, a film actor?

      Granted, EA's likeness is far, far more specific, and the team at Naughty Dog did change Ellie's likeness away from Ellen Page and closer to that of Ellie's voice actress before release, but a lot of the same general ideas are at use here. While I believe that everyone should have control over the use of their own likeness and person, there does have to be a limit or any two-bit actor (assuming we limit it to "public figures") could start suing companies because the main character in Modern Shooter 8 sounds like them and uses their catch phrase "Whoop-de-nany." From the summary, EA's use may overstep that boundary, but the EFF may still have the right idea here.

    23. Re:I'm not with the EFF on this one by FuzzyDustBall · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately the diploma (especially from the right school) is worth more than the Education.

  23. What Goes Around... by magusxxx · · Score: 1

    I wonder what would happen if you made a video game about a courtroom and made the judges look like judges in real life. And then have those judges make legal decisions they normally wouldn't make. Even show some taking bribes to throw cases. As long as they're in the setting they've achieved renown in, all's good. Right?

    --
    Care killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.
    1. Re:What Goes Around... by bws111 · · Score: 1

      Since the judges said that the athletes could not be exploited like that I find it unlikely that they would think it 'is all good'. Did you have a point, or did you just fail reading?

    2. Re:What Goes Around... by magusxxx · · Score: 1

      I read the linked article and find my original statement as compared to the Brown vs Electronic Arts case to be on point.

      --
      Care killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.
  24. South Park by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's sad when an episode of South Park makes this subject more clear.

  25. NCAA contract by gerardrj · · Score: 1

    If the NCAA endorsed and has a licensing deal with EA then all the NCAA has to do is change the contract with the players: You agree that EA may use you likeness and personal statistics for the purposes of creating video game characters.

    Boom: you want to play NCAA basketball, you have to agree to this. Don't agree? don't play.

    --
    Article X: The powers not delegated... by the Constitution...are reserved...to the people
    1. Re:NCAA contract by bws111 · · Score: 1

      There is currently an antitrust lawsuit against the NCAA. That sort of move would not help their position.

  26. Is Sam Keller transgender? by viperidaenz · · Score: 1

    The summary refers to "his jersey number" and "her name"

    1. Re:Is Sam Keller transgender? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think they're using "her name" in the hypothetical, in lieu of "the player's name", since it's used in reference to the general ruling.

  27. How do I control players in a live game? by ZipK · · Score: 1

    They reasoned that the “use does not qualify for First Amendment protection as a matter of law because it literally recreates Keller in the very setting in which he has achieved renown.”

    So if live football games are like their video recreations, how do I control the player with the ball? This will really help me with my fantasy league next year.

  28. Amateurism rules by tepples · · Score: 2, Interesting

    How is it "bribing" a player to give them money so in return you have their permission to use their likeness?

    That depends on whether accepting such a "bribe" would cost a student athlete his amateur status and thus his eligibility.

  29. Tetris v. Xio by tepples · · Score: 3, Interesting

    the whole "can't copyright essential game elements, only expressive artwork" deal

    Tell that to Xio Software, who got successfully sued by The Tetris Company for making a block-stacking game that uses pieces made of four square blocks.

    1. Re:Tetris v. Xio by Theaetetus · · Score: 1

      the whole "can't copyright essential game elements, only expressive artwork" deal

      Tell that to Xio Software, who got successfully sued by The Tetris Company for making a block-stacking game that uses pieces made of four square blocks.

      No, they didn't lose because they had a block-stacking game that uses pieces made of four square blocks. You should read your link, which notes that "a puzzle game where a user manipulates blocks to form lines which disappear' would be noninfringing." Rather, it was the particular colors selected for the blocks, the way the game fills up the field at the end game, the appearance of garbage lines, the particular movement of the blocks, the patterns on the blocks themselves, etc.

      Xio Software lost because their argument was that every part of the game was an "essential" game element and wasn't subject to copyright, even though they conceded that there were a limitless number of aesthetic options they could have used.

  30. Such a reader is in the minority by tepples · · Score: 1

    What if the reader doesn't think that using fictional characters should result in someone getting punished?

    Until 51 percent of readers agree with this hypothetical reader and take this agreement to the voting booth, copyright continues to exist as the statius quo.

    1. Re:Such a reader is in the minority by cheekyjohnson · · Score: 1

      Just like the TSA and a host of other garbage, then. I guess as long as we have all this other garbage, we should just keep eliminating more and more rights rather than trying to put a stop to the process.

      --
      Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
  31. But But but... by gr8_phk · · Score: 1

    Don't they have to license the players "likeness" for NFL-based football video games? And doesn't the NFL make exclusive deals for video games? Isn't this the reason there aren't competing games using real players?

    1. Re:But But but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Professional players sign contracts that give the NFL the rights to use the players' likenesses.

  32. Anyone heard of Tabloids? by davydagger · · Score: 1

    Public Figures do not have the same rights to privacy as everyone else.

    If they did, tabloids wouldn't be allowed to exist.

    Another example of how the system favours the media industry and is harsh against the computer industry and its workers.

  33. How many here read the article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    For those of you siding with the judges, how do you answer these questions...

    What if someone wanted to write a book about the NCAA, and they wanted to include the player in question as a character in the book, and they wanted to portray everything in the book as historically accurate as possible; should they be barred from doing so without the player's permission? What if instead of it being a normal book they wanted it to be a choose-your-own-adventure style book? Or what if they wanted to make a movie about the NCAA, shot with actors, but done in a documentary style, and with an actor chosen because of a strong resemblance to the player in question? What if this movie was set up to have multiple endings that a viewer could choose between, like the movie "Clue"? What if instead of just multiple endings, a viewer could choose the direction of the story multiple times throughout the movie? What if instead of being a movie shot with actors it was an animated movie? What if it was done with CG? What if this "movie" was designed to be played back on a game console and the viewer controlled the "story" with a game controller?

    The same logic that the judges used can be used to disallow all of the above. Maybe you don't care, because the individual is supposedly a struggling student athlete, and is somehow deserving of money. But what if the person in question was a politician, or some other influential person? Under this ruling, you're creating a situation where anyone can dictate how the public can present them in the historical record. I mean, what if an NCAA player says, "You can use my likeness in the game, but only if you give me stats that are way better than I have in real life", or what if a politician says, "You can make a movie about my life, but only if you portray everything I've done with my chosen spin on it"?

    Likeness rights, outside of copyright, should only matter if a third party is trying to use someone else's likeness is such a way that a reasonable person might believe that it is the real person performing the activity in question, and not just a recreation of their likeness.

  34. But they're not. by raehl · · Score: 4, Insightful

    They're using a jersey number assigned by the NCAA that will be reused for other players later, and a set of stats collected by the NCAA.

    This won't last long, NCAA will just amend their terms so that all athletes must give up likeness rights to compete.

    1. Re:But they're not. by redlemming · · Score: 1

      This won't last long, NCAA will just amend their terms so that all athletes must give up likeness rights to compete.

      While we're at it, let's make sure to limit contract law so that fundamental rights can't be given up in a contract where multiple items are bundled together. Hence, organizations that deal with athletes and other celebrities must have a separate contract with those individuals, written exclusively with respect to the rights such as the right to privacy or the right to publicity, and so forth, if they wish to take advantage of anything more than an individual's basic skills.

      Obviously the legal profession has a vested interest in keeping the scope of contract law as broad as possible. That in itself is a good reason to limit it: anything that discourages the legal profession from unnecessarily expanding the scope of legal practice makes for better legal ethics and a better legal system.

  35. Simulating the game not the character by phorm · · Score: 1

    It seems there should be a line between one's persona as an individual versus a member of a team/group. For example, one could make a game with characters from various sports teams in said sports roles, but you couldn't use their likeness for non-sports games.
    I also fail to see how stats are owned by the player as opposed to the league.
    In the end, we'll probably see game character vaguely similar to players, but different enough to skirt lawsuits, similar to using Deagle instead of "Desert Eagle" etc.

  36. Indenticals and clones.... by Maelwryth · · Score: 1

    This would all be far more interesting if he had a twin.

    --
    I reserve the write to mangle english.
  37. Not about being awesome by dutchwhizzman · · Score: 1

    It's about being able to ask money for appearing somewhere. The guy doesn't care how good or how bad he looks in the game, he just wants money for it. The big question is if his NCAA contract that licensed off the details to EA includes the use of his physical likeness or nor. Also, the contract between his club and the NCAA and his contract with the club are involved here. If any of these fail to include the licensing of his likeness, some party will be left to pay a lot of money.

    --
    I was promised a flying car. Where is my flying car?
    1. Re:Not about being awesome by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      He wants to get paid for doing nothing. I feel so sorry for him. I'm guessing that they don't show his face in the game, so it's an even weaker argument. He doesn't speak, and he probably doesn't show his face. They could have him getting arrested on COPS, so they can have him in a video game.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  38. Small penis rule in effect by mp3some · · Score: 1
    So if I were to insert Sam's realistic likeness into a school girl centric Hentai, but ensured the scale was correct for a 2 inch penis, then he'd have no claim to fame?

    /yes double insertion entendre
    //first attempt at a slashdot post, I'll take some positive karma now you stingy sons of whores

    --
    http://methamphetam.in
  39. Meh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I hate EA as much as anyone else here, but I think the very nature of being in a video game is transformative. From a commercial perspective, EA should not qualiy for fair use since they basically copy the looks of entire teams of people (the entire game would have little appeal otherwise)

    But I think it is extreme overreach to say that privacy is invaded by a digital interpretation of someone or something. If we all jumped the gun on this kind of thing, that would make games like GTA/carmageddeon impossible because every box with 4 wheel would infringe on then vehicle they are parodying. Hell every use of the DMC-12 DELOREAN or it's likeness would violate Universal Studios rights to Back To The Future.

    On the other hand, a persons personal privacy should be protected. Making any "punch (name)" flash on newgrounds should be removed for the same reason.

    Am I not making enough nonsense here? No privacy is invaded by creating the likeness of someone. Commercial or otherwise. Go look of that story about the asshole who was selling body pillows of cosplayers and ask the cosplayers if they would have consented had they known that was going to happen.

    We really have a problem, legally, defining what is okay to do with digital data that forms a likeness of that individual. Celebrity or not.

  40. The 9th Circus fails again by Smokeybehr · · Score: 1

    Keller should quit whining and be glad for the free publicity. The 9th got this decision wrong, since this falls somewhere between Fair Use and no personally identifiable information. Of course, I agree with some of the posters that EA should totally nerf that character so that nobody will want to play him.

  41. The Tetriminos themselves are copyrighted by tepples · · Score: 1

    From the page you linked: "The court found that [...] The style, design, shape and movement of the puzzle pieces were not inextricably connected to the ideas, rules and functioning of the game and therefore wereprotectible elements." From the opinion itself: "Xio was also free to design a puzzle game using pieces of different shapes instead of using the same seven pieces used in Tetris." This made it pretty clear to me that the exact shapes of the Tetriminos, not just their colors and textures, are copyrighted. And even if the shapes themselves weren't copyrighted, standardizing the colors is like standardizing green means go and red means stop.

  42. "9th Circuit Rules That Celebrity 'Rights' Trump" by antdude · · Score: 1

    I thought this was about Celebrity Apprentice. LOL!

    --
    Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
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