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Bradley Manning Sentenced To 35 Years
An anonymous reader writes with bad, but not unexpected news: "The U.S. soldier convicted of handing a trove of secret government documents to anti-secrecy website WikiLeaks has been sentenced to 35 years in prison. Pte First Class Bradley Manning, 25, was convicted in July of 20 charges against him, including espionage. Last week, he apologized for hurting the U.S. and for 'the unexpected results' of his actions. He will receive credit for three and a half years, but be dishonorably discharged from the U.S. Army."
It's not a legitimate secret. It's a coverup of war crime. They are not the same thing.
Considering today news is breaking about the NSA monitoring 75% of all domestic US internet traffic, and logging all domestic emails, as well as their plans for a national facial recognition system (as in live video feeds), it seems obvious to me that they sentenced him today and announced it in this way in an effort to distract us from what really matters.
Sources: http://www.nbcnews.com/technology/nsa-has-access-75-percent-us-internet-traffic-says-wsj-6C10967780
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/21/us/facial-scanning-is-making-gains-in-surveillance.html?_r=0
Reporting on war crimes should be considered a service to his country.
Meanwhile Bush, Cheney, and a whole line of people that authorized or performed torture remain free. People who murdered innocent civilians and laughed about it, free. It's all a big joke.
I agree. And I'm glad many Bothans died to get the plans for the Death Star into the hands of the rebels. Those traitors to the Empire deserve it!
Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
I'd understand if you'd want those who commited the war crimes he revealed to be executed, but him? I don't understand how you can arrive at the conclusion that he deserves that, unless you were perhaps one of those who commited a crime he revealed ?
William Calley, the officer in charge of the My Lai massacre (murder of 304 civilians) server 3 1/2 years house arrest.
Bradley Manning has been sentenced to 35 years, and must server 1/3 to get parole which they will of course deny him.
President Obama authorized the killing of Americans without trial, something illegal under the very rules of the U.S. (constitution)
One of those Americans killed was a 16 YEAR OLD BOY who was murdered by his own government, without trial.
The United States no longer pretends to be the land of the free, it now openly favors corporations (Apple given presidential override of import ban), rich individuals and political cronies.
Today is a very sad day. The truth is the enemy, justice inconvenient, and money/power the one true ruler of this country.
Merely disgusted.
if the government's idea of "secret" weren't complete and total BS. Today, "secret" simply means "stuff that would embarrass us". The only context that getting most of today's government "secrets" into the public's scrutiny would qualify as "aiding an enemy" is if they consider the American people to be their enemy. Which is, sadly, closer to the truth than it ever should be.
In SOVIET RUSSIA... erm...NSA AMERICA, the Internet logs onto YOU!
"Protect Whistleblowers: Often the best source of information about waste, fraud, and abuse in government is an existing government employee committed to public integrity and willing to speak out. Such acts of courage and patriotism, which can sometimes save lives and often save taxpayer dollars, should be encouraged rather than stifled. We need to empower federal employees as watchdogs of wrongdoing and partners in performance. Barack Obama will strengthen whistleblower laws to protect federal workers who expose waste, fraud, and abuse of authority in government. Obama will ensure that federal agencies expedite the process for reviewing whistleblower claims and whistleblowers have full access to courts and due process."
The United States government is the largest criminal organization in the world. Bradley Manning exposed some of the war crimes routinely committed by the United States. That, in and of itself, makes him a hero. It takes no courage to invade another country that is drastically weaker than you are and to then shoot people (mostly civilians) who are simply defending their country from foreign invaders. It takes a lot of courage to stand up to the Imperial US Government.
ACLU's Ben Wizner: "When a soldier who shared information with the press and public is punished far more harshly than others who tortured prisoners and killed civilians, something is seriously wrong with our justice system."
"It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." -- Prof. Dumbledore
Why people have such a problem with the fact that he was in the army, supposedly serving his country, and did something that he was forbidden to do, and so should face the consequences? .
Because "I was just following orders" should never, ever, ever be a legitimate reason for committing crimes against humanity.
I'd like to believe that someday we will get to a more enlightened part of our evolution and realize that Bradley Manning's actions were the start of a more transparent government, and that the Internet took on the role of government overseer that the media long ago surrendered to the very same government. Maybe then he will be released, pardoned, and seen as the hero that he is.
Serving your country and serving your government are not necessarily the same thing. I think Manning was serving his country but not his government.
I don't think anyone can argue with the fact an offence was committed. But the punishment should fit the crime. It is on that basis I object to this sentence. The sentence is so long that I feel this punishment violates your constitution. It is cruel and unusual.
We're talking about locking this guy up longer many rapists or murderers. You're even talking about executing him. How is that a sensible level of punishment?
At the end of the day, nobody died from this leak. Nothing of any substance has changed in geo-politics either. The cable leaks had a tendency to show that US foreign policy behind closed doors was pretty much the same as it was on the public sphere. As a Brit, I thought they actually came out of it looking quite good. It was the other countries were made to look like asshats.
Manning is a bit of an idiot and should serve some time but taking his entire life in forfeit for his stupidity is totally disproportionate and in my view unconstitutional.
I have respect for this man. He broke the law for the sake of what is right.
eHem i think you are reaching for Devestated not Decimated since they ate more than 10% of our freedoms about 3 years back
hint for you
Decimated: One out of Ten removed
Devastated: One out of Ten Remains
Redacted: Zero remain
Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge
You feel that because of some twisted nationalistic pride and unquestioning faith that the overlords are benevolent, know what they're doing, and are above the vast swaths of historical abuse by similar authority figures. We feel he's been unfairly treated because of a lot of things.
1) He exposed a whole hell of a lot of people doing "forbidden" things. Most of whom are never going to face prison time, courts, fines or even a slap on the wrist.
2) The people he's exposing have previously concealed their wrongdoing. Gaming the system of justice is serious infraction. It's often worse than what they're hiding.
3) The people he's exposing have a vast amount of political power and very much have control over his punishment. I don't think it's a stretch to say that they're abusing their power and being vindictive.
4) He's been tortured. Not the sort of torture with massive blood loss, hideous scars, and severed limbs, but the sort of torture you get in a lab setting. And it looks like it was enough to break him.
Yes, he should face consequences for violating orders and exposing secrets. And he should face praise and leniency for making the USA a better place and upholding his oath. You know, to protect the nation from threats from within.
He's up for parole in 11 years (at least as theRegister reports it).
Funny, isn't it? How rednecks are considered ignorants, but most of them have a clear definition of what is "government" and what is "america". Amazing how patriotic they usually are (flags, american pride, traditions), and yet they hate the "gub'mint". They're considered crazy paranoids because of that hate, and how the gub'mint tramples on their freedom.
And here we are, educated people, confusing government with country.
If he'd been smart enough to send the war crime data, and ONLY that, to the Hague etc then he'd likely have fared better than by doing a bulk data dump which included so much material he couldn't have checked it all.
Reactions to Manning seem to be dictated by the ideology of the beholder rather than what he actually did.
I don't find him either a hero or a villian, just a young troop with serious personal issues who went attention-whoring without thinking it through despite his training.
I'm also not sure that what he released wasn't salted with items which allowed those doing the salting to further their own agenda. Hammering Manning would confirm everything he dumped in the eyes of the world. He'd have been easy to exploit.
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
The Empire was a legal entity created through a vote in the Senate.
So, yeah the rebels were terrorists.
Oh wait, they won..I mean freedom fighters.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
He did, arguably and depending on your perspective, as much harm as the original "crimes" he revealed.
No, the State has admitted that his disclosures did not lead to any deaths.
You don't just share 10,000 secret documents without at least reading them first.
Manning left that job up to journalists. He first tried to leak directly to the NYT, as Ellsberg had done and they rebuffed him. He then went to Wikileaks, which arranged a consortium of newspapers (El PaÃs, Der Spiegel, Le Monde, The Guardian and The New York Times) to analyze, redact, and publish the information responsibly.
Snowden, perhaps reflecting his age and experience, is doing exactly that.
Why is Snowden more qualified to determine what's right and wrong to publish than a group of experienced journalists?
So while I feel strongly that any crimes revealed by Manning should be prosecuted, I also feel that he needs to go away for a while.
But that's not how it works. If Manning revealed crimes, then he is to be afforded, by law, whistleblower protection. In fact, he did reveal crimes, has been denied those protections, and those who committed the highest crimes are walking around with huge pensions and stock options for doing so.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
IIRC Wikileaks was initially releasing the documents a bit at a time, working with journalists to, among other things, redact anything that might put anyone in danger. It was only when the US government started attacking Wikileaks on every available front (forcing CC processor to stop taking donation, getting Assange extradited etc.) that the entire thing was made public.
I suspect that if the US government had accepted the leak as fait accompli and honestly tried to work with Wikileaks to redact information that could cause actual harm to informants etc. they could have significantly limited the damage. None of this would have prevented them from prosecuting Manning, btw.
But no, instead of trying to ensure that reporters of leaks (Wikileaks included) acted responsibly, the US government decided that those reporting on leaks were criminals themselves. That is complete nonsense and a dangerous attack on western democracy.
I'm unsure if Manning deserves to spend time in prison for his actions. I am sure that the US government has done things in response to Manning's actions that are way worse.
"but most of them have a clear definition of what is "government" and what is "america""
no, they don't.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
He didn't commit treason, and the death penalty is barbaric and riddles with flaws.
Frankly, time served and dishonorable discharge is punishment enough.
He'll never be in the position to do it again, he isn't a danger, and all he is doing is costing us money to keep.
AA federal felony, and a dishonorable discharge will punish him for life.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
But he just did.
If he'd been released with time served, he'd be forgotten.
While he's in prison, unjustly serving 35 years for the sin of revealing war crimes, he is a powerful, powerful symbol.
We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
When Bush was president, any criticism of him was seen by the "rednecks" as an attack on America. "Why do you hate America?" was pretty much a cliche.
Reporting on war crimes should be considered a service to his country.
What war crime did he report on? You mean the Collateral Murder video? WikiLeaks "reported" on that. He did no such thing. He just took some documents and leaked them. If these had been financial documents or other "personal" documents, he would be held just as liable, even if they exposed the crimes of those to who the documents pertained.
>Remember, though, as Luke has taught us. The only way to win is not to fight.
Was that before or after he blew up the Death Star?
--- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
At the end of the day, nobody died from this leak.
Are you sure? Because of WikiLeaks carelessness in handling the documents given by PFC Manning a lot of names of informants and dissidents were revealed. Even the names of those who happened to visit US Embassies were revealed. Can you be certain that none of those were killed or in the very least made an example of, much like PFC Manning is being made an example of?
Just FYI, I don't agree that he should have gotten 35 years when more violent criminals can get < 10 years. Personally, I think he should have gotten a few years, have the NSA keep tabs on him(at least then their domestic spying might be justified), then be black listed from any job that entails any sort of confidentiality or security agreement. This would show he got punished(time served in jail), isn't put in a position where he can repeat his actions(black listing), and that if he leaks again then the government will know(NSA watching).
> and all he is doing is costing us money to keep.
Not at all.
He's also being made into a poster child for "Don't forget, Uncle Sam wants YOU... to keep your goddamned mouth shut"
You don't think that matters a hell of a lot more to the folks in power than, say, keeping some piddly little serial killer locked up?
--- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
You also elect them.
undermined serious diplomatic negotiations
If that is true, and there are arguments on both sides. Then I would still argue its not Manning who is to blame.
I can't thank of any legitimate reason, none, that a representative government should be conducting diplomatic negotiations in secret!
The public has a right to know EXACTLY what agreements our government is making with any others, full stop. Because lets face it if we can't know what is being discusses is probably illegal, immoral, or otherwise socially unacceptable to our society. As to all the spying and espionage; Why does everyone else in the world seem to resent our nation today? Might it have something to do with the fact we have become the bogey man lurking in every shadow waiting to topple their freely elected government; muck around in their private affairs, drone strike their children etc.
All the secrecy is not protecting our national security; very much the opposite, its turning us into the pariah that makes us a terror target in the first place. It makes our public feel like they don't have a voice, breaking down society. It harms faith in government, also breaking down society. It makes informed voting impossible, so we don't elect the best leadership. Instead of the government helping discover and disclose vulns in software and network systems to keep our industry safe, it causes them to remain hidden. I could go on and on.
Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
I don't find him either a hero or a villian, just a young troop with serious personal issues who went attention-whoring without thinking it through despite his training.
How was he attention seeking? He leaked the documents through the most protective and secure whistleblowing service ever created at that time. He never wanted to be identified but was exposed by someone he thought he could trust, but who didn't take any repsonsibility for the information that Manning shared with him and thus doomed Manning to his prison term.
Leakers are in a difficult position, especially given massive databases of documents. One person could not possibly safely release all the documents, but he trusted Wikileaks to look through and responsibly release the documents (which they did along with other reputable news agencies). He had seen what he considered to be crimes in the documents he did look at, so it is reasonable risk to leak the entire corpus in hopes of illuminating more crimes. Wikileaks states "we may remove or significantly delay the publication of some identifying details from original documents to protect life and limb of innocent people."
If you are a leaker, especially at that time, Wikileaks was a seemingly responsible choice. That all the documents eventually got released without redaction was a security mistake (by Wikileaks and others) that cannot be blamed on Manning. The important thing to remember is that exposing crimes of those with great power is extremely valuable and worth considerable risk and cost to those innocent of the crimes.
More info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_diplomatic_cables_leak
Complexity Happens
Ghandi.
Nelson Mandela.
Not saying Bradley Manning is in the same category. But sometimes people in prison do end up as powerful symbols.
I only look human.
My mother is a halfling and my dad is an ogre, so that makes me an Ogreling
Plusgood. He is given 35 years helpwise for Big Brother.
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."
You're correct. He would have been caught after sending only the first handful of reports, and he probably would have been tried for only one count of espionage instead of six. And any actual crimes that folks might have uncovered in the rest of the material would never have been uncovered.
That's the problem. At a fundamental level, whistleblower protection must cover public disclosure, because (with the exception of a single isolated incident here and there) if the organization against whom the whistle is being blown were capable of policing itself, the blowing would not have been necessary in the first place; blowing the whistle to an internal auditor is pretty much guaranteed to be useless. And once you release something to the public, chances are, the government knows who you are. Therefore, you get one shot at releasing everything that needs to be released. Anyone suggesting that there's another way is really kidding himself or herself.
This is not to say that he couldn't potentially have tried to be more selective about it, but there's also a time factor involved. The longer it takes from when a crime occurs to when the public knows about it, the more likely it is that the perpetrator will get off because of statutes of limitations. Therefore, if the goal actually is ensuring that those crimes get prosecuted, the best hope is distributing the information broadly to a large group of people who can then divide and conquer. The press is remarkably good at that. The only question is whether they can be trusted to be responsible about what they disclose.
Now disclosing it to a site like Wikileaks... is a different story. His mistake was not what he disclosed, nor was his mistake disclosing it to the press. His mistake was disclosing it through a dubious organization that operates on the fringes of the law rather than going directly to a reporter at a major news organization.
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-Turkey
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/restore-united-states%E2%80%99-human-rights-record-and-grant-clemency-pvt-bradley-manning/L7zHZv4r