Slashdot Mirror
Massachusetts Set To Repeal Controversial IT Services Tax
Nerval's Lobster writes "Massachusetts lawmakers have agreed to repeal a six-week-old tax on computer services that generated such outrage that even the governor who proposed the tax in January now opposes it. The 6.25 percent sales tax on 'computer system design services' was proposed by Gov. Deval Patrick in January, but got little notice before it was slipped in mid-July into a $500 million supplementary funding bill meant to pay for improvements in the state's public transportation system. It was passed by the legislature with almost no debate, was signed into law by the governor with little public outrage, and went into effect – theoretically – July 31. IT businesses in the state used social media, business associations and angry letters to both lawmakers and local media to describe problems with the tax and show their opposition. Confusion over what qualifies as a 'computer system design service' and how to actually implement the tax – which was supposed to generate $161 million in revenue for the state – has been such a challenge to implement that the state has yet to collect a dime. The main logistical problem is figuring out what is covered and what isn't: data access, data processing and 'information services,' for example, are not taxed, which exempts most hosting, cloud, outsourcing and remote-access monitoring or security services. Democratic leaders announced Sept. 12 they would support repeal of the tax, which could be completed within weeks. 'It is now evident that the impact of the tax is broader than any of us ever anticipated or intended,' according to Mass. Senate President Therese Murray at a press conference Sept. 12."
(see subject)
"Idiots make laws they know nothing about, without doing any research into the possible consequences. Film at 11."
"So after all this, you make my case for me. To end this stalemate, you must die..."
It would be nice if lawmakers put any effort at all into evaluating the effects that their laws will have...
The best thing about UDP jokes is I don't care if you get them or not
Death and Taxes. Two things you can always rely on.
Oh, and more NSA spying.
Death, Taxes and NSA spying. Three things you can always rely on.
I swear, the way laws get passed in this country is like pushing any commit from a developer straight into production based on its commit message, without even a code review process.
N4st0r, trixx0r h0bb1tz0rz! Th3y st0l3 0ur pr3c10uzz!
Pass it. Repeal it. Pass it. Postpone it.
FFS, just pick one, will ya'? Your state needs the tax dollars, so it's not so bad. But people don't like to pay taxes on this (or any, actually) kind of work, so it's bad.
Nothing is ever going to please everyone, but going back and forth on this shit makes sure that nobody will be happy with you. Asshats.
So the legislature admits they passed a law with no idea what its impact would be. As a voter and taxpayer in the commonwealth of Massachusetts, I say with all due respect: WTF?!
I mean, they get points for admitting a blunder and backpedaling furiously, but the hubris of passing laws nobody in the legislature understands is mind-boggling. Just, wow.
If the incumbent in my district has an opponent on the ballot for a change, I sure will consider voting for him/her. (Most state and local offices around here have only one candidate. Another democracy fail.)
[Sir Garlon] is the marvellest knight that is now living, for he destroyeth many good knights, for he goeth invisible.
we have to PASS the bill to find out what's in it!
They imposed a sales tax on "computer services" that created such outrage, it was repealed before it even went into effect.
"Anyone who [rips a CD] is probably engaging in copyright infringement." - David O. Carson
... ask Them to get outraged about the NSA trying to shove a leash up Your ass, fuggedabowdit!
Subject says it all.
It says Massachusetts is going to repeal a tax but we all know that can't possibly be right. ;-)
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
Massachusetts 1765: "Taxation without representation!"
Massachusetts 2013: "Taxation without implementation!"
There might be hope for Taxachusettes, yet.
Nah, just kidding! "They just want your money to turn around and buy votes with programs" continues as a successfully descriptive theory, unchallenged, like relativity and quantum mechanics.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
So some "well-intended" politicians decide to legislate on the basis of "it sounds like a good idea and it's going to save us" and it turns out it was ill-informed, ill-conceived and the full ramifications were not considered.
We just nationalized our health-care industry (and a significant portion of our national economy by extension) on this same basis and we cheered it as a moral duty and an advancement of our society.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAt54NKsRRk
Think of all the children you will feed with that $161 million, shut up and pay the tax like a good blue state, or we'll go all over the media and call you bigots and racists.
"Now, I doubt any of you would prefer a rolled up newspaper as a weapon against a dictator or a criminal intruder."
I just sell "database storage space". The software and processing is free!
I am curious how they can come up with estimate of how much the tax would generate, while also not having a clearly defined scope of what the tax would cover.
It'd be like someone saying they want to buy a car, and me saying it'll cost $20k. The term "car" covers a wide, wide range of possible options, and to give an ballpark figure would be nigh impossible with any accuracy unless I knew the specifics.
Instead of saving money by making existing infrastructure more efficient, such as by changing their tolls to variable congestion tolls as a means of permanently eliminating traffic congestion... they raise taxes.
Any sufficiently unpopular but cohesive argument is indistinguishable from trolling.
This would all be much easier if the NSA would simply set up automatic transfers from our bank accounts to the Treasury so the feds can just take what they need.
It's called customer service.
"We receive as friendly that which agrees with, we resist with dislike that which opposes us" - Faraday
In Massachusetts, one party is completely dominant, to the point that 81% of the House, 90% of the Senate, and the Governor are all from the same party. It doesn't matter which party, this kind of stupidity is rampant in one party states because there is little criticism in most areas of law until after the fact. Utah has similar numbers for the other party, so I imagine the same stupidity happens there.
Software is big business in MA, and one of the few growth areas outside of biotech. Did we want to kill a golden goose?
Believe me, we were all in shock over this. You cannot create something in this state without the government hanging a tax on it. And, once that tax is in place and the bureaucracy suckling on the tax teat it is established, it's a permanent fixture. You'll never see a bureaucracy go away. Years ago, after returning home from a five-year stint in California, to my surprise, the Commonwealth of Massachusetts sent me an "excise tax" bill on my beat up car; the tax is, in fact, an ad valorem tax (based on the value of the car). I called my mom to ask what the heck it was and she simply stated: "Yeah, they tax driving in Massachusetts. Is it any wonder the Bay State got the moniker: Taxachusetts?
Massachusetts actually repealing a tax? I better call Sister Hannah, hell is freezing over.
"It is now evident that we are idiots".
>'It is now evident that the impact of the tax is broader than any of us ever anticipated or intended,'
'It is now evident that there was no impact analysis done as the impact of the tax is broader than any of us ever anticipated or intended,'
There fixed that for you...
They repeal one, and raise another. Last month the state's gas tax rose by 3 cents a gallon to 26.5 cents a gallon
You know, the place with all the libertarians and no taxes and Live Free Or Die, Motherfucker! I was shocked when it $500 or so to register my car there - the fee (not "tax") is calculated based on the MSRP and age of your car, just like down here. Nice going, guys.
Ever consider that it might be stuff like that that tends to push people into the libertarian party?
But yeah, different states are different. To look at how much tax a state differs by you have to look at a lot of taxes - and quite a few states seem to have a tax on just about everything. Sales tax or no sales tax? Are counties/cities allowed to assess their own tax? Is it all through property taxes? Do you only tax 'land' property, or do you also tax vehicles, and what about other assets? There is at least one state where you're supposed to pay a property tax on any items you have above a certain value, such as jewelry. Gas taxes, fuel taxes, phone taxes, income taxes etc...
It can get crazy.
I don't read AC A human right
If lawmakers can't be trusted to competently create the laws, why do we bother to elect representatives and give them a salary? More and more I think that we should just fire the lawmakers and all their legislative assistants, and instead spend the money on a secure discussion and voting platform.
You should see all the blatant racist policies that have gone into effect. We are ranked #49 on economic growth, yet the supporters are running that in the past 45 days we are ranked 3rd in economic growth in the midwest THANKS GOVERNOR WALKER!!! It's so so bad.
Am I correct in understanding that 'computer services' are exempt from sales taxe? If so, why? And why is it wrong to correct that?
their hands in the cookie jar.
why the heck can't we do the same to stem the tide of cheap foreign labor and plummeting wages?
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
"Yeah, they tax driving in Massachusetts. Is it any wonder the Bay State got the moniker: Taxachusetts?
Except you moved from a state with a local/state tax income of 11.2% (California) to one of 10.4% (Massachusetts.) MA is ranked 8th; California 4th. So please do shut the fuck up about "taxachusetts" - your taxes are LOWER than they were when you were in Commiefornia.
They "tax driving" everywhere. Roads are paid for from the primary source of taxes: state and federal income tax and local property taxes. Your excise and gasoline taxes don't come even close to paying for the roads you use, I assure you. The myth that drivers pay for the roads they use is just that - a myth. We all do, even if we don't use them. That's mostly because the gas tax hasn't been inflation adjusted in decades, nor has it been adjusted for increasing mileage cars get, nor has it been adjusted for the increased damage from heavier SUVs that are so damn popular now.
Consider that half of the people in the largest city in New England don't drive, and still are paying the same federal taxes. And have to use a public transit system that was saddled with billions of dollars in debt for a HIGHWAY construction project (the Big Dig). It's a miracle the MBTA keeps running despite being $6BN in debt.
Please help metamoderate.
In Massachusetts, one party is completely dominant, to the point that 81% of the House, 90% of the Senate, and the Governor are all from the same party.
Romney, Swift, Celluci, and Weld were all republicans. Before Dukakis during the mid 1900's, there was a fairly even trade back and forth between republican and democratic governors. Go back even further, and it biases towards republicans. But please, don't let actual facts get in the way of your rant about MA being a "one party" state.
The supposed "liberalism" in Massachusetts isn't really that true - we're quite conservative, it's just that most people don't understand what the fuck "conservative" means - they think it means some christian right-winger.
Basically, we're good about following the constitution. The thing says everyone's created equal (as does our own constitution, which predates the US constitution) so it wasn't "liberal" to say "hey, gay people can get married too."
I remember back when the bombings happened and some jackhole congresscritter said something about us "cowering" and how we wished we could arm ourselves. To which many people said "Hey fuckwit, remember that thing called the American Revolution? We started that, with our state's CIVILIAN MILITIA." To this day, there are people with minuteman license plates, descendants of the original minutemen. All over the state are statues of minutemen, posing with their rifles. Every kid learns about the initial battles fought here, in grade school. We re-enact the battles every year, too. Got a statewide holiday to celebrate the affair as well.
Please help metamoderate.
This isn't the first time that the IT professionals have been targeted for unfair treatment in the tax code.
When will you learn? Discuss and debate bills first. And if you actually pass it make sure that everyone knows what the effects will be.
Seems like the liberals can't quite get this straight. Stimulus, Obamacare, IT services tax, etc... I guess Pelosi *was* right after all - we have to pass it so we can find out what is in it.
"A plan fiendishly clever in its intricacies"- Homer Simpson
...just about the time they hired an IT Services company to implement the new tax plan in the Mass. Dept. of Revenue computer systems.