Imprisoned Physicist Honored For Refusing To Work On Iran's Nuclear Program

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Imprisoned Physicist Honored For Refusing To Work On Iran's Nuclear Program

Posted by Unknown on Monday September 23, 2013 @07:02PM from the no-silex-for-you dept.

New submitter I3MOUNTAINS writes "Omid Kokabee, a University of Texas graduate student who has been imprisoned in Iran for more than two years, received the American Physical Society's Andrei Sakharov human rights prize for refusing to collaborate on the country's nuclear program. In May, an Iranian court sentenced him to ten years in prison for 'communicating with a hostile government' and receiving 'illegal earnings.' The so-called 'illegal earnings' were the student loans he received while in Texas."

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Guts by spamchang · 2013-09-23 19:10 · Score: 4, Insightful

This guy has 'em. There are other ways to sacrifice for worthy principles than warfare.
Hook 'em.
1. Re:Guts by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 20:16 · Score: 1
  
  Yep, but he also has a spine.
2. Re:Guts by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 22:07 · Score: 0
  
  Yep, but he also has a spine.
  And, more likely than not, a pair of eyeballs as well.
3. Re:Guts by TWiTfan · 2013-09-24 01:14 · Score: 2
  
  Either guts, or he didn't like the idea of some Mossad agent slapping a magnetic bomb to hist car and blowing him to shit. One of those two.
  
  --
  The cow says "Moo." The dog says "Woof." The Timothy says "Thanks, valued customer. We appreciate your input."
4. Re:Guts by Moryath · 2013-09-24 01:27 · Score: 1
  
  Maybe it's because the collection of theocratic asswipes that run the Iranian government have promised to wipe certain countries off the face of the planet and been caught lying many times about their supposedly "peaceful *coughbullshitcough*" nuclear program.
  The world didn't understand the end result of nuclear weapons before the only two ever used in war were used. Since then we've learned so much more and we've come to the conclusion that they are too dangerous, destructive, and their impact far too long-lasting to ever be used again.
  Letting Ayatollah Assaholla, or any of the clerics, or some crazed nutjob like Ahmadamnnutjob have access to nuclear weaponry would be like walking Hannibal Lecter into a butcher's supply store and saying "here, help yourself." And for all that their new president is sounding better, he's a mullah's cough away from being on his ass and replaced by someone far worse. He's playing the snake game talking out of two sides of his mouth right now, trying to blame "Israel" for every bit of shitty sectarian muslim-on-muslim warfare and every act of stupidity that has been made by the tin-pot dictator crowd that runs the various Arab states in general.
  I'd be more scared that the US has these weapons right now than of some backwater country.
  Tea Party kooks full of Cold War insanity and outdated worldviews aside, the US is a rational actor. The US has no purpose or reason to use nuclear weapons.
  To contrast, Iran is not - and has not been since the 1970s - a rational actor. That is the key difference. Iran's government rules by fear and theocracy, signing themselves up when convenient with certain other nations and generally being the little shitty chihuahua dog that barks a lot and occasionally actually bites someone because it thinks it can get away with it and to prove its miniscule "power." Iran is highly likely to not just "have" nuclear weapons but actively use them out of fright, or spite, or just because they think it will make them look "powerful" on the world stage.
5. Re:Guts by ifiwereasculptor · 2013-09-24 01:34 · Score: 1
  
  I'm not sure it ends up being beneficial in the grand scheme of things, though. Iran obviously isn't a model nation by any standards, but looking at the current scenario of international politics and the powers of the UN*, you may suspect that nuclear deterrence is still alive and kicking. I don't know if we'd have so many wars or if we'd invest so much in warfare if nuclear missiles were ubiquitous, as paradoxical as this statement may seen.
  *See the Iraq war. Also, remember the US are setting their sights on both Syria and Iran, now. If I were one of those countries, yes, I'd be worried and looking for anything that might make them think twice.
6. Re:Guts by CohibaVancouver · 2013-09-24 01:59 · Score: 1
  
  Because the countries that have nukes have demonstrated they are responsible with them - Even Pakistan and India.
  
  I have no such faith in the misogynistic pedophile theocrats leaders of other nations of the world who are clamoring desperately for them.
7. Re:Guts by fredprado · 2013-09-24 02:06 · Score: 1
  
  I wouldn't call Pakistan and North Korea "responsible" or even "stable"...
8. Re:Guts by morgauxo · 2013-09-24 02:07 · Score: 1
  
  Yeah he does but before giving him too much credit I'd point out that he lacks the common sense to stay out of Iran. Especially given his background of studying physics in the US!
9. Re:Guts by CohibaVancouver · 2013-09-24 03:13 · Score: 1
  
  I'll give you North Korea - That's something that can keep one up at night. The only saving grace is that the North Korean leadership likes their fast cars, brandy and cigars too much to risk their toys being turned into a glowing slag heap. Pakistan... I dunno. They've had nukes for 25+ years now. So far they've been responsible, for likely the same reasons as North Korea.
10. Re:Guts by AlphaWolf_HK · 2013-09-24 05:53 · Score: 1
  
  Well they also need to be competent, which NK is not. I mean look how badly they botched that weather satellite (or whatever it was.) If they tried to launch a nuke, they'd probably just accidentally nuke themselves.
  Unlike NK, Iran may very well have the capability of actually attacking somebody with nuclear weapons without hurting themselves in the process.
  
  --
  Careful with names containing L slashdot.org/~AiphaWolf_HK slashdot.org/~AlphaWoif_HK slashdot.org/~AiphaWoif_HK
11. Re:Guts by fredprado · 2013-09-24 11:18 · Score: 1
  
  Nobody is ever competent in the beginning. The fact is that they managed to be competent enough to actually produce working nuclear weapons when most of the world did not, and to make dealing with them by force not worth the risk as long as they keep to themselves, which is also more than most of the world can say.
So, how about... by Radagast · 2013-09-23 19:13 · Score: 5, Interesting

Any prizes for Mordechai Vanunu?

--
--Joakim Ziegler
1. Re:So, how about... by Simploid · 2013-09-23 19:31 · Score: 2
  
  Wiki says he spent 18 years in prison, more than 11 of them in solitary and after release his movement is still restricted! Is this even real? Never heard of this!!
2. Re:So, how about... by Simploid · 2013-09-23 19:36 · Score: 2
  
  Reading further in Wikipedia, He received and was nominated for a lot of awards in Europe including noble peace prize.
3. Re:So, how about... by AHuxley · 2013-09-23 19:40 · Score: 1
  
  Yes all too real. Note the use of the honey trap operation..
  
  --
  Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
4. Re:So, how about... by GodfatherofSoul · 2013-09-23 19:42 · Score: 0, Troll
  
  I give him the Balls of Steel trophy. I'm surprised Israel hasn't just staged an accident by now.
  
  --
  I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
5. Re:So, how about... by m.alessandrini · 2013-09-23 21:52 · Score: 1
  
  Eh eh, they're all heroes unless they cross your interests, or interests you have in common with someone else. NSA docet.
6. Re:So, how about... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 23:08 · Score: 1
  
  One refused to build nuclear weapons, one built nuclear weapons and then betrayed an oath. How are they similar?
7. Re:So, how about... by durrr · 2013-09-23 23:27 · Score: 0
  
  "former Mossad director Shabtai Shavit told Reuters that the option of extrajudicial execution was considered in 1986, but rejected because "Jews don't do that to other Jews."[34]"
  In short, had he not been a jew, he'd been found dead from autoerotic asphyxation in female underwear instead of kidnapped.
8. Re:So, how about... by nbauman · 2013-09-24 02:51 · Score: 1
  
  "former Mossad director Shabtai Shavit told Reuters that the option of extrajudicial execution was considered in 1986, but rejected because "Jews don't do that to other Jews."
  Unless they try to make peace with the Palestinians. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yitzhak_Rabin
9. Re:So, how about... by nbauman · 2013-09-24 02:54 · Score: 1
  
  The similarity is they both did something to oppose nuclear weapons.
10. Re:So, how about... by interkin3tic · 2013-09-24 06:14 · Score: 1
  
  Did you read what the Israelis did to him? Perhaps the society was worried what Mossad would do to them if they highlighted Israel's human rights violations and developing nuclear weapons. I mean, they're STILL punishing that guy, and they are our "allies." It's much safer to criticize Iran, you know the government isn't going to cooperate with Iran to punish you for it. Israel?
11. Re:So, how about... by Sun · 2013-09-24 07:43 · Score: 1
  
  You seriously don't see the difference between someone imprisoned for refusing to participate, and someone imprisoned for taking an auth of secrecy and then violating it?
  Shachar
12. Re:So, how about... by interkin3tic · 2013-09-24 08:49 · Score: 1
  
  I don't think an oath changes the ethics of nuclear weapons. Furthermore, Israel actually had nuclear weapons. The closest thing to a legitimate purpose of nuclear weapons is deterrence, which requires everyone knowing you have them. Nuclear weapons that are secret would only have one purpose: to murder lots of civilians of another country, out of revenge or ethnic cleansing.
  
  Yes I see the differences: Vanunu's actions were greater.
13. Re:So, how about... by Sun · 2013-09-24 16:50 · Score: 1
  
  In other words, you praise the man who promised to do something you find unethical, and then betrayed the trust of those he made the promise to (and suffered consequences) over the man who decided he will not do something unethical, and suffered consequences for that refusal? You view the regime that punishes those who betray trust given, under consent, as worse than the one that punishes those who exercise their free will to openly refuse the trust to begin with?
  I do not see the logic (never mind agreeing with the premise) of your argument.
  For the record, the rest of your argument suffers from ignorance. Everybody knew Israel had them from before. If you want to educate yourself about the program, as well as when it was actually used (without a single nuke exploding), I recommend "The Samson Option: Israel's Nuclear Arsenal and American Foreign Policy". It has plenty for you to get mad at Israel over, should that be your inclination, and it even covers the Vaanunu episode.
  Shachar
Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 19:13 · Score: 0

1) Why was an Iranian national studying in the US to begin with?
2) The article says he was studying lasers and optics. This makes him an unlikely choice for a nuclear anything program.
1. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 19:32 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  For plutonium nukes, the sphere of explosive around the plutonium must be perfectly shaped. What else must be perfectly shaped: mirrors and lenses for telescopes.
2. Re:Questions by drkim · 2013-09-23 19:36 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  The article says he was studying lasers and optics. This makes him an unlikely choice for a nuclear anything program.
  Congratulation!
  You are the one-millionth poster on /. to post without reading the article! Great job! Keep up the good work!
  [Balloons drop] [Confetti mortars fire]
  "Iran has been pursuing a kind of uranium enrichment called SILEX which uses carbon dioxide lasers, the same kind of lasers that Kokabee was using in his graduate studies."
3. Re:Questions by Swave+An+deBwoner · 2013-09-23 19:47 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  Answer to 2) is in TFM#1:
  
  Iran has been pursuing a kind of uranium enrichment called SILEX which uses carbon dioxide lasers, the same kind of lasers that Kokabee was using in his graduate studies.
  Answer to 1) took a few more Google cycles:
  
  Did you know that thousands of Iranian students study in the United States each year? In fact, for the past several years, the number of Iranian students studying in American colleges and universities has steadily grown such that Iran is now 22nd among the top 25 places of origin for international students.
  And, in recent months, President Obama and Secretary Clinton have announced big steps forward in promoting exchange and opportunity with the Iranian people. As Secretary Clinton announced in May 2011, (http://www.youtube.com/), new visa regulations now allow Iranian students to receive two-year, multiple entry visas. This gives young Iranians the opportunity to return home for family events, to participate in internships, to travel outside the United Statesâ"and they wonâ(TM)t need to get a new visa every time.
  You can find the quote here:
  http://iran.usembassy.gov/education.html
4. Re:Questions by TheRaven64 · 2013-09-23 20:09 · Score: 1
  
  And it's a completely fucked-up policy, because the hoops that a US company needs to jump through to hire an Iranian national are insane. So you end up educating a load of people, then telling them that they're second-class people and sending them back home. Guess how favourably disposed they are to the USA after that...
  
  --
  I am TheRaven on Soylent News
5. Re:Questions by m.alessandrini · 2013-09-23 20:12 · Score: 2
  
  1) Why was an Iranian national studying in the US to begin with?
  Entering US is quite regulated, so I think US government knows and accepts that students or workers from Iran go there, and think it's an advantage for both. The world is no more the one from the cold war era, and many people from Bin Laden's country (for example) always were and are in USA (even his relatives if I remember correctly).
6. Re:Questions by mysidia · 2013-09-23 20:12 · Score: 1, Interesting
  
  "Iran has been pursuing a kind of uranium enrichment called SILEX which uses carbon dioxide lasers, the same kind of lasers that Kokabee was using in his graduate studies."
  This is like saying he was studying computer aided design, and got arrested for refusing to join their computer hacking program, that happened to use similar computer systems.
  Just b/c he had used the same kind of lasers, would not of meant he could do anything with uranium enrichment
7. Re:Questions by antifoidulus · 2013-09-23 20:26 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  Because the Iranian government has done to the post-secondary education system in Iran what the Republicans have attempted to do(and in some cases succeeded) in doing to secondary education in the US, i.e. hand it over to the religious fundamentalists who only care about promoting whatever imaginary being they happen to believe in. The University of Tehran appointed as president a guy who had no post secondary education but lots and lots of Islamic bona fides. If they want an education that is more rigorous than "Muhammed is great!" they have to look elsewhere.
  
  --
  Monstar L
8. Re:Questions by antifoidulus · 2013-09-23 20:29 · Score: 1
  
  which is a shame because before the fundies started changing everything Iranian schools were pretty good. Ironic that one of the biggest impediments to the religious fundamentalists getting a homegrown atomic weapon is their own religious fundamentalism.
  
  Though this is hardly the first time ideological purity has ruined a once great educational system. Supposedly a lot of German scientists complained that during the war they found it almost impossible to do research because all their graduate assistants could do is recite Nazi propaganda and not much else.
  
  --
  Monstar L
9. Re:Questions by PolygamousRanchKid+ · 2013-09-23 20:33 · Score: 1
  
  Congratulation!
  You are the one-millionth poster on /. to post without reading the article!
  You must be nude here.
  It's more like the one-millionth-billionth poster.
  I sometimes get the feeling that most folks don't even bother to read the post that they are replying to, let alone the article.
  
  --
  Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
10. Re:Questions by viperidaenz · 2013-09-23 20:36 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  But you took a lot of money off them in the process.
  That's all that matters, right?
11. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 20:38 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  What a bunch of BS. there.
  I am Iranian scholar staying outside Iran. Your post does not make any sense whatsoever.
12. Re:Questions by dbIII · 2013-09-23 20:43 · Score: 1
  
  SILEX which uses carbon dioxide lasers
  I knew it - carbon dioxide causes nuclear warming :)
  On a more serious note this sort of state driven military research in other places via graduate students happens a bit. I taught a bit of stuff to a masters student from Indonesia that wanted to work on composite materials with a very low radar signature to be used in aircraft. The first I could help him with, the second was a bit outside of what I knew so there was no moral dilemma.
13. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 20:57 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Bin Laden's country is Saudi Arabia, which is a major US ally.
14. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 21:03 · Score: 0
  
  There is no shortage of money-ed applicants for schools. They could double tuition if they removed admission standards and still have impacted classes. The question is why give a seat to someone based on the premise of "hearts & minds" that could have gone to a viable contributor to our domestic economy only to lose that "heart & mind" by making them feel rejected upon graduation? It is a lost opportunity, counterproductive, and a waste of resources.
15. Re:Questions by mestar · 2013-09-23 21:48 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  "Iran is now 22nd among the top 25 places of origin for international students."
  Yes, yes, but how high is it among the top 100?
16. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 22:13 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  This is like saying he was studying computer aided design, and got arrested for refusing to join their computer hacking program, that happened to use similar computer systems.
  Just b/c he had used the same kind of lasers, would not of meant he could do anything with uranium enrichment
  Yes, because studying the usage and calibration of the exact necessary type of lasers will in no way qualify you to perform a job where you are required to select and calibrate those lasers.
  Just because he doesn't know anything about uranium doesn't mean he can't take a sheet of paper from a nuclear physicist saying "set energy output to X for period Y or until target reaches maximum temperature Z."
17. Re:Questions by antifoidulus · 2013-09-23 22:17 · Score: 1
  
  Nice troll for ayatollah, but the fact remains they appointed as president of the University of Tehran a man who has no academic qualifications but he does believe really hard in an imaginary man in the sky and a child rapist who claims to have spoken for the imaginary man in the sky.
  
  --
  Monstar L
18. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 22:43 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Well, obviously if they're 22nd among 25 they would be 88th among 100th.
  Really, it's depressing how down is math level in /. these days.
19. Re:Questions by fnj · 2013-09-23 23:40 · Score: 1
  
  It's more like the one-millionth-billionth poster
  Turn in your Austin Powers ring. It's more like the "meeeeeeellionth poster".
20. Re:Questions by fnj · 2013-09-24 00:01 · Score: 1
  
  It makes absolutely no difference whatsoever whether he believes in anything you regard as imaginary or not. What matters is whether he is trying to impress on the curriculum any improper or undue slant. At worst he is an accomplice (not necessarily willing) in a pervasive system of brainwashing and subversion. It is more honest and effective to concentrate on the system.
  Please understand, it's not that I necessarily object in principle to bigotry against belief systems that are arguably evil or at least retard civilization. What I object to is unclear process and wrong targeting. The target ought to be a government incorporating exclusive support of a specific religion and targeting those who do not support that religion in violation of elementary human rights.
21. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 00:28 · Score: 1
  
  Welcome to the physics career path, where you may make several large jumps to other similar fields, sometimes with little to no experience on the exact devices you will be working on. I jumped from not working with lasers at all to working with lasers right out of grad school, so going from working on the same type of laser to the same type of laser is a rather small jump.
22. Re:Questions by tinkerton · 2013-09-24 00:43 · Score: 1
  
  Antifoidus is probably referring to the 4 year presidency of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbas-Ali_Amid_Zanjani. That was apparently the only cleric who ever was president there and it really didn't work out. But apart from that I fully agree with AC about 'a bunch of BS'. I checked UNESCO and Iran is doing pretty well in education, while in the good old days of 1976 they weren't. In 76 25% of the women could read.
23. Re:Questions by jittles · 2013-09-24 01:12 · Score: 1
  
  And it's a completely fucked-up policy, because the hoops that a US company needs to jump through to hire an Iranian national are insane. So you end up educating a load of people, then telling them that they're second-class people and sending them back home. Guess how favourably disposed they are to the USA after that...
  Do you have some sort of reference for that? I used to go to college recruiting fairs to pick up engineering talent for my projects. At that time I was working for a government contractor with both classified and ITAR related materials floating around. We had an especially qualified Iranian national come by. Unfortunately we did not have any work that was not, at the very least, covered by ITAR. I pretended that it was not the case and asked HR and our DSS liaison as to whether we could hire this individual. Both indicated that they were perfectly eligible for hire, and that we just had to place them on a contract that was not covered by ITAR or other security clearances.
24. Re:Questions by fnj · 2013-09-24 02:38 · Score: 1
  
  Back to third grade also for the idiot moderator.
25. Re:Questions by JTsyo · 2013-09-24 02:50 · Score: 1
  
  Now you have educated people who has seen how life is outside Iran back in Iran.
26. Re:Questions by tibman · 2013-09-24 03:07 · Score: 1
  
  You might have to get your ring looked at.
  
  --
  http://soylentnews.org/~tibman
27. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 03:35 · Score: 0
  
  Greetings. If you wouldn't mind sharing your insight, how is it that the Iranian people are so well educated, noble, and beautiful, yet those in their government seem to be none of these things? Am I a victim of western media? Or is it some ruse to curb rampant tourism (as I assume changing the country's name from such a beautiful sounding one, Persia, to such an ugly sounding one is)?
28. Re:Questions by mmell · 2013-09-24 03:46 · Score: 1
  
  Pissed that they lost? Sure, I would be too.
  ...but we did have that marvelous opportunity to (briefly, yet powerfully) shape their thinking. Perhaps not as effective as that "insoluble geometric shape" thingie . . .
29. Re:Questions by mcgrew · 2013-09-24 04:39 · Score: 1
  
  It was pretty obvious to me that he was poking fun at mestar's inability to grasp that if you're 22nd out of the top 25, you're 22nd out of the top 100. And most likely mestar knew that full well but was trying to joke. Poorly; there are way too many barely literate and barely numerate people who think being a nerd means you buy shiny stuff from Apple and Microsoft.
  
  --
  Free Martian Whores!
30. Re:Questions by mcgrew · 2013-09-24 04:41 · Score: 1
  
  Moderators, plural, all three of whom correctly tagged it as "funny".
  
  --
  Free Martian Whores!
31. Re:Questions by pslytely+psycho · 2013-09-24 07:46 · Score: 1
  
  Wait a moment here....There are articles?
  
  --
  Donald Trump, on a crusade to make Nixon look respectable
32. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 08:08 · Score: 0
  
  You must be nude here.
  Do I really have to be?
33. Re:Questions by mysidia · 2013-09-24 12:22 · Score: 1
  
  doesn't mean he can't take a sheet of paper from a nuclear physicist saying "set energy output to X for period Y or until target reaches maximum temperature Z."
  Just because he had used a carbon dioxide laser in his studies, does not make him an expert technician in the operation of all kinds of carbon lasers.
  Furthermore, anyone off the street, with a little bit of training could probably due to the "set energy output to X for period Y" bit.
  The article implied they wanted him to collaborate with them as a physicist, not some lowly laser technician that Iran would have an ample supply of.
34. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 16:27 · Score: 0
  
  As much as going through physics grad school teaches the students about one particular subfield in detail, it also demonstrates that the student is capable of learning about a particular subfield, and can problably learn about another one if needed. More often than not, I've seen physics graduates get a job working on something only vaguely similar to what they did in graduate school. This can be anywhere from jumping between say working on tunable dye lasers to femptosecond lasers, or jumping from lasers to working on spectroscopy without lasers, or radicially different topics like particle beams. A lot of information is already out there on such subjects, and just needs to be assembled by someone vaguely familiar with the topics. If anything, the only two things that come from having directly worked on the same type of device before are shorter learning period (many places expect an incoming physics person to spend 6-12 months just relearning their new project), and the less communicated, detailed, hands on experience of actually operating the equipment, typically picked up from instruction from a technician.
35. Re:Questions by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-25 15:20 · Score: 0
  
  At the graduate level, you are usually paying them, not taking their money.
Iranian nuclear program by Vintermann · 2013-09-23 19:14 · Score: 3, Insightful

Wouldn't it be nice if the west had the entire moral high ground on this? Considering iranian physicists and physics professors are murdered by foreign agents over a low shoe, you can't blame Iran for being paranoid.

--
xkcd is not in the sudoers file. This incident will be reported.
1. Re:Iranian nuclear program by CauseBy · 2013-09-23 19:25 · Score: 1
  
  Is low shoe a typo or a reference to something I don't recognize? I can't figure it out.
2. Re:Iranian nuclear program by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 20:52 · Score: 0
  
  It could be a reference to how a woman in Saudi Arabia could be punished for showing some ankle, so, a metaphor for a pathetic reason.
3. Re:Iranian nuclear program by Buggz · 2013-09-23 20:53 · Score: 2
  
  It is a word-for-word translation of a norwegian saying. Doing something "over a low shoe" basically means doing said something very much/very often/excessively/uncritically.
4. Re:Iranian nuclear program by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 21:17 · Score: 0
  
  It is something of a stretch to describe Israel as "the west"
5. Re:Iranian nuclear program by realityimpaired · 2013-09-24 00:15 · Score: 1
  
  Not really... "the west" generally refers to members of the cold war 1st world, of which Israel was very definitely a member. By that criteria, Australia also gets lumped in with "the west", even though it's a south Pacific nation and has closer ties to the southeast Asian economy than it does the European.
  "the west" also gets used to refer to wealthy industrialized nations because, until quite recently, almost all of the wealthy industrialized nations were in Europe or North America... again by that criteria, though, Israel is a wealthy industrialized nation. Granted, a *lot* of its wealth has come from "aid" money from the United States, Israel still has a lot more money than much of the world. In this sense, "the west" refers to the 1% nations. (and if you have access to indoor plumbing and can eat meat on a regular basis, you're part of the 1% in the world).
  Besides, do you think Israel is the only nation that's ever carried out extrajudicial executions of people it deems a threat? Every nation in the G20 has done it at some point in history. It's naive to think the Americans and the Brits haven't been messing with Iran's nuclear ambitions, and the French have probably fucked with them too. Hell, even the Canadians have conducted espionage in Iran in the past and it's not a stretch to think they're doing it now.
6. Re:Iranian nuclear program by Trepidity · 2013-09-24 00:30 · Score: 1
  
  For those wondering where it's from, here's an explanation from Per Egil Hegge, via this thread (in Norwegian):
  
  In his book Katta i sekken, Kjell Ivar Vannebo writes that the origin is German, and comes from the fact that Germans often drank from a cup which was shaped like a shoe. Drinking over a shoe meant drinking too much. Later it became "low shoe", and the phrase was also expanded to include performing activity other than drinking, at a level far above normal or acceptable.
  The title of that book, by the way, translates to "cat in a sack", but is not related to the English idiom "let the cat out of the bag"... instead it's the Norwegian version of the English idiom pig in a poke.
  
  --
  10 PRINT CHR$(205.5+RND(1)); : GOTO 10
7. Re:Iranian nuclear program by bill_mcgonigle · 2013-09-24 06:33 · Score: 1
  
  Wouldn't it be nice if the west had the entire moral high ground on this?
  What high ground does it have?
  Oh, right, Iran invaded the Talysh Khanate region in 1826, so it's an imminent threat to the region. Also, there were those poorly-translated speeches in Israeli tabloids from a weak President who is out of office.
  Ah, but Iran doesn't participate in the world central banking system, so better get in there and take it over before they do get nukes (the multinational banks can't get their client states to invade counties with nukes), for the sake of the petrodollar. One must ask, "Cui bono?"
  At least the CIA overthrew Iran's democratically elected government, to ensure a half century of stability in that country, so we've got that as a base to start from.
  
  --
  My God, it's Full of Source!
  OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
8. Re:Iranian nuclear program by unitron · 2013-09-25 04:53 · Score: 1
  
  "Drinking over a shoe meant drinking too much."
  By "over", do all these people talking about shoes mean "more than"?
  In other words, it's not a question of relative vertical locations?
  
  --
  I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
9. Re:Iranian nuclear program by lissnup · 2013-09-25 08:03 · Score: 1
  
  My understanding is that the literal translation "doing [something] over" = "overdoing [something]"
Meanwhile Oppenheimer et al by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 19:15 · Score: 0

Unfortunately haven't been nominated for some reason...
Background story by tinkerton · 2013-09-23 19:48 · Score: 2

The background story for this is: "Iran is currently trying really hard to make a deal with the West, if not with the US then at least with Europe. We've got to stop that. Throw everything at them that you got."
Watch this guy become some hero/martyr in the Stat by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 19:49 · Score: 1

All Iran wants is to be untouchable like Israel, North Korea, Russia, China, India and Pakistan. And I completely understand after what the USA did to them in the 80s.
The so-called 'illegal earnings' by Chrisq · 2013-09-23 19:58 · Score: 3, Funny

The so-called 'illegal earnings' were the student loans he received while in Texas.
I hate to think how much compound interest he will have accumulated while in jail.
1. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by Thanshin · 2013-09-23 20:26 · Score: 1
  
  I hate to think how much compound interest he will have accumulated while in jail.
  If only he hadn't left the lights on at home...
2. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 20:31 · Score: 1
  
  Yep, Riba (interest, bordering usury in case of student loans) is indeed forbidden by sharia law, so he got what he deserved.
3. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 21:10 · Score: 0
  
  I see no problem with this... Muslims that I know pay off credit card debt immediately, to prevent any interest from being accrued. If only everyone in the US would do as much, that would fix a lot of debt problems....
  I agree that it's a bit much to jail someone over it, but in principle I don't understand why people disparage the concepts so much.
4. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 21:28 · Score: 0
  
  Yes, it'd be much better if instead of charging interests in exchange for a loan of $30000, the banks were actually
  paying the $30000 tuition directly to the university, then selling it back to you for $45000 then lend you $45000
  at no interest. Much more moral than lending you $30000 and charging you whatever interest rate would end up costing you $15000 in the end.
5. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 21:30 · Score: 0
  
  Wow, wasn't aware you had to pay interest in the US for student loans! Ouch!
6. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 23:19 · Score: 0
  
  On the other hand humans set of (sic) bombs, fly aircraft into buildings, rape white women, etc.
  FTFY.
7. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by cdrudge · 2013-09-24 00:56 · Score: 1
  
  Probably should toss the whole government into prison then: http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2013/07/19/in-rare-delinquency-irans-world-bank-loans-overdue-as-sanctions-bite/
8. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by wisnoskij · 2013-09-24 01:06 · Score: 1
  
  It is actually against Christian and Jewish law, and since their book is just a offshoot of the new Testament they have it as well.
  
  --
  Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
9. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by mark-t · 2013-09-24 02:21 · Score: 1
  
  How is it more "moral" to pay 45k without interest for borrowing 30k than it is to borrow 30k and pay back what works out to 45k over time?
  And of course you realize that if you usually still have the option of paying it back faster anyways, so that you will actually pay even less interest... although some financial institutions may impose a limit on exactly how much faster you're allowed to pay it back without renegotiating the terms, but even then, the terms can usually be renegotiated from time to time as one's financial ability to repay a loan improves over time anyways.
  
  --
  File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
10. Re: The so-called 'illegal earnings' by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 16:17 · Score: 0
  
  My comment was sarcasm about the hypocrisy of islamic finance. It's a description of how 0% interest islamic loans work.
At least by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 20:00 · Score: 0

He received a trial and wasn't taken out by drones.
1. Re:At least by Swave+An+deBwoner · 2013-09-23 20:37 · Score: 2
  
  Yeah, fsvo "trial":
  
  Human rights observers and those close to Kokabee say that he did not receive a fair trial.
  "It's not really a trial in the sense that we are used to. He was not allowed to speak to a lawyer," said Eugene Chudnovsky of Lehman College, one of the co-chairs of the Committee of Concerned Scientists.
  During the trial, no evidence was brought against him. He was not permitted to see a lawyer during his incarceration or the trial, and was not told his court date until he was brought to the courtroom. During his imprisonment, Iranian security forces used harsh techniques to coerce confessions from him.
  (This was from the second article linked at the top of this discussion, BTW.)
2. Re: At least by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 00:06 · Score: 0
  
  yes I'm SURE the media is reporting accurately and the sources are not lying. just like when Saddam murdered all those babies!
3. Re: At least by Swave+An+deBwoner · 2013-09-24 05:02 · Score: 1
  
  Amen Brother!
  Thankfully articles like this one put those canards to rest where they should:
  http://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/jun/23/terrorism.iraq
A couple of clarifications by m.alessandrini · 2013-09-23 20:06 · Score: 1

I hope that prize is meant for "fighting for your ideas against tyranny" and not for having refused to work on a nuclear program, otherwise hundreds of american scientists would be outlaw.
And, several iranian students are attending phds here at our university (Italy), some of them in microbiology to cite something that could be "borderline", so are all they at risk now?
College loans == illegal earnings . . . ? by PolygamousRanchKid+ · 2013-09-23 20:07 · Score: 2

Islam generally frowns on "usury", so I guess a determined Iranian Religious Judge could easily fudge a conviction with a trumped up charge about that. Islamic Banking jumps through all kind of hoops to keep the Imams happy when making loans and paying interest.
But I'm curious if student loans are a general problem with Islam . . . ? Do pious students avoid them . . . ?
This would be a catastrophe for the US, if it would wake up tomorrow an Islamic Republic . . . all those students saddled with debt that will never be able to pay back would face prison, as well!
My wacky thought for the morning . . .

--
Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
1. Re:College loans == illegal earnings . . . ? by m00sh · 2013-09-23 20:16 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  Islam generally frowns on "usury", so I guess a determined Iranian Religious Judge could easily fudge a conviction with a trumped up charge about that. Islamic Banking jumps through all kind of hoops to keep the Imams happy when making loans and paying interest.
  But I'm curious if student loans are a general problem with Islam . . . ? Do pious students avoid them . . . ?
  This would be a catastrophe for the US, if it would wake up tomorrow an Islamic Republic . . . all those students saddled with debt that will never be able to pay back would face prison, as well!
  My wacky thought for the morning . . .
  Foreign citizens are not eligible for student loans in the US. Kokabee probably got some other form of financial assistance like a fellowship or an assistantship. The summary is wrong.
  The wikipedia article says he was working on his second PhD. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omid_Kokabee
  What is the point of getting a second PhD? Other than financial, I don't see other reason to pursue a second PhD. Besides, all the class credits would transfer and you'd basically end up doing research what a post-doc would do but be a PhD student.
2. Re:College loans == illegal earnings . . . ? by Blaskowicz · 2013-09-23 20:41 · Score: 2
  
  Perhaps it was about keeping a student status so the administrative aspects of being able to be there were easier.
3. Re:College loans == illegal earnings . . . ? by m.alessandrini · 2013-09-23 21:36 · Score: 1
  
  Don't muslim workers have salary?
4. Re:College loans == illegal earnings . . . ? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 01:03 · Score: 0
  
  PhD students have the freedom to pursue their research topic rather single-mindedly, taking time to wade through heaps of literature.
  Once you climb slightly higher in the academic hierarchy, you encounter all these encumbrances that just distract from that (yes, amazingly enough there's a whole lot more than the non-research workload that PhD students get to deal with).
  If you want to work on research topics related to the ones you got your PhD in, it doesn't really make sense to do another.
  But if (e.g.) you did a PhD in computer science - visualisation, and you're moving into language processing, then I could see the benefits of doing a PhD in (non-computer science) linguistics.
  TL;DR: it can make sense if you're moving into a domain where you have little to none prior knowledge.
5. Re:College loans == illegal earnings . . . ? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 03:06 · Score: 0
  
  usary is a sin in the christian bible. is there a problem with christians repaying loans ?
6. Re:College loans == illegal earnings . . . ? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 08:21 · Score: 0
  
  Foreign citizens are not eligible for student loans in the US
  Yes they are, as long as they have a green card.
  http://studentaid.ed.gov/eligibility/non-us-citizens
Iranian Snowden by Frankie70 · 2013-09-23 20:51 · Score: 1

Kind of like an Iranian Snowden. Snowden was also nominated for the same prize right. Both guys not cooperating with their government evil plans.
1. Re:Iranian Snowden by m.alessandrini · 2013-09-23 22:49 · Score: 2
  
  And strangely the american dissident did not win the american prize, even if, on a pure theoretical plane, refusing to spy emails is less damage to a nation than refusing to work on a nuclear program. And I think Snowden would get no less prison years than Kobabee. The only difference is the more civil trial he would have in USA (even if... even if... let's not start mentioning things happening somewhere outside USA...). I see a lot of hypocrisy in those cases, accuse one and defend the other one. I'm not talking about USA only, this happen in every country. Take Putin: he keeps the Pussy Riot girl in a prison camp for years, without seeing her daughter, for a contestation, then give asylum to Snowden... Human rights are quite optional when it comes to your own interests.
2. Re:Iranian Snowden by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 23:52 · Score: 0
  
  No, but the American that wages illegal wars over and over again has managed to win a Nobel Peace prize. To engage in war and win a peace prize, you have to be at a whole other level of amazing at bullshitting. He became a legend amongst the presidents with the most bullshit spewed and awards won from those bullshits.
3. Re:Iranian Snowden by IamTheRealMike · 2013-09-24 00:00 · Score: 0
  
  Why is it "evil" for Iran to want a nuclear bomb, given that Israel and the USA both hate them, and have lots?
  BTW the USA treats anyone who holds any Iranian rial as having "illegal earnings" and punishes them severely.
Re:Iran's Nuclear Program is Peaceful by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 21:11 · Score: 0

No, there is not.
Re:First! by durrr · 2013-09-23 21:25 · Score: 4, Funny

Well, something that will never get nuked are that guys student loans.
Imprisoned Physicist Honored For Refusing To Work by Carlos+Dias · 2013-09-23 21:25 · Score: 1

You gotta have some balls to take that position you know. I have respect for people of these sort.
'Murica! by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-23 22:52 · Score: 0

Seems Iran learned their legal "maneouvers" from the best.
the amazing morphing discussion by murdocj · 2013-09-23 23:04 · Score: 2

Fun to see it transition from "Iran imprisons scientist for having the courage of his convictions" to "USA / Israel evil". Good to know Slashthink is alive & well.
1. Re:the amazing morphing discussion by m.alessandrini · 2013-09-23 23:10 · Score: 1
  
  Why would it be a problem? I feel natural to put an event in a broader context to evaluate it in light of the international relationships, and the so-called rogue countries are not the only one doing horrible things like that when they feel it compelling.
Isomorphism is fun! by EuclideanSilence · 2013-09-23 23:39 · Score: 1, Interesting

In May, an Iranian court sentenced him to ten years in prison for 'communicating with a hostile government' and receiving 'illegal earnings.' The so-called 'illegal earnings' were the student loans he received while in Texas."
Let's change that up a bit.

In May, an American court sentenced you to ten years in prison, $1 million in corporate fines, and $250,000 in individual fines; civil penalties up to $55,000 per violation for 'violating trade embargo'. The so-called 'violation of trade embargo' was you visiting your family in cuba and buying a cigar while you were there.
Sorry Iran, US laws are more ridiculous and our penalties are greater.
1. Re:Isomorphism is fun! by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 01:18 · Score: 0
  
  So fucking stupid. No one would be imprisoned for 10 years for buying a cuban cigar. Get real.
2. Re:Isomorphism is fun! by EuclideanSilence · 2013-09-24 02:08 · Score: 1
  
  So fucking stupid. No one would be imprisoned for 10 years for buying a cuban cigar. Get real.
  You missed the part of the article where it points out "On October 10, 2006, the United States announced the creation of a task force made up of officials from several U.S. agencies that will pursue more aggressively violators of the U.S. trade embargo against Cuba, with severe penalties."
A third alternative... by ivi · 2013-09-23 23:52 · Score: 1

Energy from Thorium gives us one more way to resolve this issue, ie, beyond 1. Withholding nuclear technology and 2. Sharing it with Iran, namely:
Share the safe, non-Plutonium-generating Energy from Thorium (LFTR technology with Iran &;anyone who' ready to use it.
1. Re:A third alternative... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 08:07 · Score: 0
  
  Ah, the reactor that no one's actually tested, and which after everyone said you couldn't make a bomb out of, it was found that you could make a bomb out of it? Yup, that'll solve everything.
  Me, I don't care, I think it should be tested, but Thorium is not some magic bullet.
Re:First! by rvw · 2013-09-24 00:11 · Score: 2

Well, something that will never get nuked are that guys student loans.
Not until the lawyers get their hands on this. I think they are the only ones able to get him out of prison, out of Iran, to the US, just so he can pay off his loan.
It would have been so different in the USA. by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 00:54 · Score: 0

There he'd have been arrested as a terrorist instead.
Or scrabbling for right to get asylum in a foreign company.
Following your moral code against the wishes of the established government is no better liked in the USA than it is in Iran.
1. Re:It would have been so different in the USA. by jon3k · 2013-09-24 01:19 · Score: 1
  
  Remind me again of that time an American was sentenced to jail for having a loan because he didn't work for the government. Oh that's right, Americans aren't bat shit insane.
They're not looking for a nuclear bomb. by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 01:28 · Score: 0

The calls for us in the West to abandon "unworkable renewables" and take up "Safe clean nuclear technology" is not an exhortation to get armed to the teeth with nuclear bombs.
The nuclear programs here are about nuclear power generation.
So, until you have proof that this is only about a nuclear *bomb* program, please stop pretending that bombs are the only nuclear and admit that they want nuclear power just like us in the UK and you in the USA are being exhorted to move to, despite the massive reserves of fossil fuels available in those countries which somehow become "proof" that nuclear power is only for bombs when it's Iran's fossil fuel reserves.
Unintentional humor by Zontar_Thing_From_Ve · 2013-09-24 01:59 · Score: 1

You can find the quote here: http://iran.usembassy.gov/education.html
I find that link name a little humorous in that the US has not had an embassy in Iran since some, ahem, "unpleasantness" in the late 1970s. But we do need to keep accepting and educating them because it benefits big business (US universities) and anything that benefits big business can't be bad? Right?
What an idiot by Lawrence_Bird · 2013-09-24 02:25 · Score: 1

Any Iranian national who leaves the country to do anything in the west (US in particular) should expect to at the least be interrogated and at the worst, jailed. That this guy was getting an advanced science/engineering degree makes him all the more valuable to the state. I realize his "family" still was in Iran, but to think for a moment he was not going to have serious problems at some point while visiting was the height of stupidity. When he made the decision to study in the US he effectively made the decision to leave Iran for good.
Obama by jeff13 · 2013-09-24 03:08 · Score: 1

Well, yea but, how can we make this Obama's fault?
I'd rather be in JAIL than DEAD by bobbied · 2013-09-24 03:45 · Score: 1

Where advancement in the Iranian nuclear industry is quick and puts your career on the fast track to the top, there are some serious issues. The least of which is any moral objection to what you are working on.
Over the last decade, nuclear scientists have been dying in droves in Iran. Consider it an occupational hazard. No they are not dying from dangerous research or risky experiments gone wrong, they are dying from what I call "High speed Lead Poisoning" and "Rapid dismembering due to proximity to large energy releases". (They are getting shot and blown up..)
His decision was more likely about not getting killed and less about any moral objection to what he would be doing. If he had a moral objection, I would think he would have chosen a different area to study.

--
"File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
1. Re:I'd rather be in JAIL than DEAD by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 05:33 · Score: 0
  
  that pretty much sums it up
why does anyone go back to Iran? by kawabago · 2013-09-24 04:01 · Score: 1

Why anyone would go back to Iran once they are out is a complete mystery to me.
1. Re:why does anyone go back to Iran? by Swave+An+deBwoner · 2013-09-24 05:05 · Score: 1
  
  Often it's because their family is still there.
2. Re:why does anyone go back to Iran? by GameboyRMH · 2013-09-24 06:13 · Score: 1
  
  Also few countries make it easy for just anyone to stay indefinitely.
  
  --
  "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
Zionist Slashdot propaganda by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-24 04:38 · Score: 1

The owners of Slashdot are in lock-step with the Siamese-twin depravities of Saudi Arabia, and Israel. Anything, and I mean ANYTHING that helps develop the circumstances for genocidal attacks against nations deemed targets of the Saudis or zionist psychopaths of Israel is seen as god's work by Slashdot's owners.
You sheep really need to read PNAC again, and study the list of target nations slated for destruction by the depravities that created this document. And then you sheeple need to read up on the state of Iraq and Libya since team Tony Blair launched their 'invasions'.
Iran has active terror cells trained and financed by Israel, who specifically target ALL senior scientists and their families in Iran. These Iranians take money from Israel to rape, torture, kidnap and/or murder the targets or members of their families. Periodically, Putin hands over details of Israel's terror networks, and Iran rounds up these terrorists wholesale- leading to the usual racist filth claiming that Iran is abusing Human Rights again. It does not matter to the zionists apologists that flood Slashdot's comments that these terrorists have engaged in some of the worst atrocities ever seen, and dedicate themselves to providing Israel with lists of EVERY scientist in Iran linked to Iran's ability to defend itself from the sickening arsenal of genocidal weapons the zionists of Israel have stockpiled since the 1950s.
Slashdot will continue to promote pro-Israeli and anti-Iranian stories until Slashdot's owners get their wish, a US nuclear attack against Iran. Meanwhile you will never see Slashdot discuss stories like the recent UN report that confirmed that Israel, at the highest level, abuses non-jewish children as official policy. Of course Israel, to the cheers of Slashdot's owners, convicted an Arab man for rape- for having consensual sex with a jew after telling her he was 'jewish'. Can't have members of the 'sub-Human' classes thinking they can have sex with the 'master race', can we. The British and US government had to pretend outrage at this conviction, but behind the scenes applauded this NAZI-identical form of racist atrocity.
PS jews all across the world defended this conviction in forums. They claimed the 'impersonation' law present in most West nations justified it. The 'impersonation' Law actually refers to a stranger sneaking into a woman's bed, and passing himself off as her husband/boyfriend, because it is dark, or she is drunk. It NEVER, EVER refers to the lies a person may tell about themselves before indulging in consexual sex (unless the lies are about gender or state of infection with certain diseases- in which case other laws may come into play). The abuses of Human Rights in the depraved state of Israel are almost infinite, and almost entirely aimed at people described by the zionists as 'sub Human'. A tiny number of abuses are aimed at some jews, when a jew offends a more powerful religious jew (say, when a jew refuses to give permission to his partner for a divorce, at which point the depraved state of Israel imprisons him until he cries 'uncle').
Re:Nice propaganda piece by couchslug · 2013-09-24 04:53 · Score: 2

Christianity obligates the US into a suicide pact with Israel. Christian (j)ihad requires it.
There is nothing to be done about that, but at least most of the casualties are Superstitionist so not much of value is lost.

--
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
Re:Watch this guy become some hero/martyr in the S by Hentes · 2013-09-24 06:28 · Score: 1

And bullying scientists into helping them achieve that goal and imprisoning the ones who refuse is also understandable? Fuck off.
Re:Ranty ranter is ranting by Moryath · 2013-09-25 03:08 · Score: 1

"Isreali"
Sure sign the anonymous coward is a neo nazi lying shitwad racist: they can't even spell the name of that country correctly for fear "the jews" will see them talking about it.