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GNOME 3.10 Released
kthreadd writes "Version 3.10 of the GNOME software collection has been released. New in this release is improved support for Wayland, the upcoming X replacement. The system status menus have been consolidated into one single menu. Many of the applications in GNOME now features header bars instead of title bars, which merges the titlebar and toolbar into a single element and allows applications to offer more dynamic user interfaces. GNOME now also includes an application for searching, browsing and installing applications called Software. Several other new applications have also been added to GNOME including Music, Photos, Notes and Maps."
"GNOME now also includes an application for searching, browsing and installing applications called Software"
I had to read that like 4 or 5 times before it clicked that the name of the application is "Software"
Is it just me, or is GNOME picking a completely new default multimedia applications every other release or so? Why can't they run with something for a few years, for a change?
Integrating everything one way that powers on high say it should be done isn't why I run Linux.
In SOVIET RUSSIA... erm...NSA AMERICA, the Internet logs onto YOU!
Gnome and KDE went through similar histories. The maintainers (for some unkown reason) decided they had to radically change their product - just as Ubuntu decided to introduce a totally new gui a few years ago. The verdict with Gnome is almost universal - the new Gnome (Gnome 3, which you have with Centos 6, unfortunately) stinks and isn't getting any better. Nevertheless, those who offer Gnome - e.g., Redhat, SUSE, others - offer only the latest version. Redhat has made it the default. Their motto is "just get used to it". But there is one hugely positive development: Mint decided to fork the old Gnome, Gnome 2. Mint offers 2 versions of Gnome 2: the Cinamon gui and the Mate gui (pronounced matey, a type of tea). I have no experience with Cinamon but love Mate. I am using it on my main computer. I noticed recently that Fedora also offers a Mate variant. My guess is that eventually most of the distros will; they will offer their main gui, whatever it is, plus Mate, XFCE, LXDE, etc. I am guessing that Gnome 3 will eventually go away.
KDE4 is like Gnome 3 but actually improved as it developed. One of its peculiarities is that it offers 5 (I think) different ways of laying out and using the desktop. One of them - called Folder View - makes it quite similar to the discontinued KDE3. I have instances of folder view KDE4 in my PCLinuxOS and Mepis setups, and like it. Be aware, however, that KDE3, like Gnome 2, has been forked. If you go to the Trinity Linux website you will find that there are people who have rejiggered Debian, Ubuntu, and PCLOS with the KDE3 gui. In fact, one of my partitions is running Debian Wheezy with KDE3. One of the best things about KDE4 is the Dolphin file manager which I have imported into all of my non-KDE setups. It is far, far superior to every other file manager, including the old Konqueror, which Trinity KDE3 still has.
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
Gnome for Workgroups!
How bad of a shot do you have to be to target 99% of everything out there and still miss?
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
I understand some of the complaints. It get it. But, wow, Gnome is looking really good! It will be interesting to see how this new menu layout works. So far I haven't had any complaints in Gnome 3. I've been using Gnome everyday since it was initially released in the RedHat/Fedora distros. I've had more complaints with the bumps in the road with Fedora over the years than Gnome itself.
So in your alternate universe Mark Shuttleworth has a relationship with Gnome that is not only "friendly", but he actually has a say in what they do? Because in this universe, none of that is true.
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
...b-but, you get to set your lock screen wallpaper now! The GNOME developers are allowing unchecked and rampant levels of freedom never before seen (in GNOME 3).
Seriously, you know you're fucked up when you're touting something that's existed since Windows 98 is getting touted as a feature: https://help.gnome.org/misc/release-notes/3.10/more-core-ux.html.en
Support the EFF and Creative Commons. The war is coming, and they're supporting you...
Then fuck off and don't bother commenting on a thread you care nothing about. Every time Gnome Shell is mentioned on Slashdot swathes of you haters come in and say how you will stick with Gnome 2 or it's more loyal successor and then continue to visit every Gnome Shell thread to post more hate comments, it's Open Source for a fucking reason, you aren't being forced to use it there are alternatives, and there are are forks from gnome 2, I don't go into MATE threads and say how i hate that incredibly aged paradigm.... so FUCK OFF and don't come back unless you actually care about Gnome 3.
Curious to know people's thoughts on this: how necessary are projects like MATE now that GNOME 3 has a supported-in-the-long-term "Classic" mode?
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
Please skip making a 3.11 version... just to avoid another flood of ".. for Workgroups" jokes.
now that GNOME 3 has a supported-in-the-long-term "Classic" mode?
The Gnome developers have a long history of throwing out features and behavior based on a whim. Why would anyone believe that "classic mode" is going to receive long-term support?
How can we continue to believe in a just universe and freedom to eat crackers if we have no ale?
WinAmp (except for an awkward period) still looks like it did fourteen years ago, and it's still whipping llama asses.
I'll pour a 40 out for my dead homie, XMMS - it was truly a worthy counterpart.
I realize it's passe in today's society to value fact, reason, and truth over feelings, impulse, and consensus, but it's still ok for people to state their opinions, whether they're using the product or not. Criticism should not be silenced for the sake of feelings. Frankly, gnome is just a collection of current design trends that are questionable at best, and that is the reason you see the commentary. The problem is bigger than gnome itself.
1. too much wasted space. I didn't buy a high res monitor just to have a giant tablet.
2. sparsely populated dialogs. I suppose this relates to #1, but still.. Why do we need 4000 extra dialogs to move through remedial tasks like changing backgrounds and color schemes?
3. hidden or nonexistent advanced tweaking. Again, a trend that makes living with computing frustrating. In this age, the user is assumed not suited to define his own workflow and layout, so we're all stuck with assumptions made by 'designers' who 'went to school for design', who never actually did anything else with their computers other than run photoshop...maximized fullscreen of course. To get what I want, I now have to manage a litany of patches against libgnome et al, or if I'm running windows 7, I have to hack up shellstyle.dll using a resource editor, and don't even get me started on windows 8. Why? This is not progress.
The problem boils down to placing aesthetics above functionality. This might work sorta ok for limited use devices, but not desktop machines used for complex workflows.
Because RHEL7 is going to use it as the default desktop environment, and Red Hat is the biggest paying contributor to Gnome.
~$ locate 1990's
~$which 1990's
1990's is found in Atari ST an old Spectrum48k that somehow kept going
When you are a gnome, you have to aim high to avoid shooting people in their feet.
Because the Xorg developers say that the code base is rotten and that this is the right thing to do.
Aren't the X.org developers the ones writing Wayland?
You'd think that no-one would trust developers who say 'this software we developed is awful, but the next version will be the best thing evah!'
Oh, hang on, that's been Microsoft's strategy with every Windows release in the last twenty years.
I recently converted from gnome 3.4 fallback to gnome 3.8.
I found it the most annoying pos to try and work with, until I started adding extensions to get back little bits of what I consider core functionality. Kudos to the gnome peeps for making it very easy to download/enable/disable various addons now. The only problem? Twenty fuckin extensions are required to get back those options I want, or to remove shit thats being forced down my throat. Then guess what...extensions often collide and interoperate strangely. Then you have 'mega extensions' that come with one small thing you want and twenty other features you give not a shit about, and, one of those other twenty things collides with another plugin you use.
Then you have the lockscreen. Maybe gnome devs don't use it, but I do, and locking and unlocking / resuming from screen off take anywhere from 30-60 seconds!?!?!?!?! The whole time you're like what in the fuckin fuck is going on.
Want to suspend? No you don't apparently. You only turn off your computer completely or reboot in gnome.
Want to try and use up more than a small portion of the top bar? Ok we'll start chopping the fuckin clock short so you can't read it AND clicking on the (now shortened) clock/calendary display to bring up the calendar pane? No clock on it, awesome. Not to mention it taking 2-5 seconds to pop up the stupid calendar pane.
So much in gnome 3 feels sluggish during operation, even if its just a ~100ms delay, that I feel like my i7 with 32gig of ram is from the early 00's.
Once middle click paste goes away gnome can go fuck themselves, but I'm sure by then they'll have removed more small things I didn't know I found vital---or forcefully prevent some current extensions from working anyways. /rant over
The question is, how necessary are projects like GNOME now that Mate and Cinnamon exists? Gnome decided it was a good idea to suck, it's a wonder they still have any users. Why would we give Gnome another chance?
I can't understand why someone would put up with so much garbage when perfectly viable alternatives exist. Do DEs really have brand loyalty?
You know, I remember, many years ago now, an article that got posted on /. about usability of the Linux desktop for casual/beginner/"regualr people" users. GNOME and KDE were examined. At the time Gnome 2.x was fairly new.
One of the prominent complaints (one that got MSFT and AAPL fanbois gloating) was how people struggled with the exotic names for everyday applications.
So...you have to click this GIMP thingy to edit pictures? To go ont he web you need to clock "Konqueror" or "Galeon" (the latter of which morphed into "Epiphany"--so much more clear what it does eh?). To burn a CD I need "Brasero", etc.
The user had to rely on icons--sometimes they were not so useful either.
So the GNOME people have finally done something about it and name the app that helps you install software "Software", and call the web browser "web" instead of "Epihpany"...makes sense considering the feedback right? Well, now they are being mocked by experienced users for the unimaginative names. It's not like a computer literate person can't figure out what "WEB" does (oh gee, that must be the GNOME web browser...well isn't that more boring than Epiphany, but I guess now Aunt Martha will know how to get on the web).
By the way--"WEB" is just Epiphany renamed--the GNOM browser. Firefox/Iceweasel or Chromium still appear with their respective names/icons, so you can relax unlessyou are among the 1% of GNOME users who just use the GNOME Web browser and nothing else.
(As I type this I use GNOME 3.8 from Debian unstable and experimental packages--'tis a great improvement over 3.4 and earlier that so many still use or base their first impressions on--hopefully 3.10 will be packaged for Debian in due time--pwehaps a couple weeks before 3.12 comes out ;-)
But I *DO* repect your opinion. You don't like GNOME, that is fine. You've stated reasons why you don't like GNOME. That is great. That is on topic, even if I don't entirely agree (though GNOME 3 *does* have room for improvement).
That said, "GNOME 3 sucks I use MATE" and then going on to expound about how wonderfully traditional MATE is is OFF TOPIC. The article is about the release of GNOME 3. Unless you are going to make some observation about GNOME 3 beyond a one line "sucks" comment then said comment is very deservedly modded into oblivion.
We've heard it all before. It is a broken record, it is a dead horse that people just can't stop beating. If you must be critical be constructive and be a bit specific about what needs improvement. We do NOT need to hear "GNOME 3 sucks". That is less than useless. Go away and let *intelligent* critics have some input (I would even put up with Torvalds or DeRaadt style profanity laden rants so long as they have meaningful point to them).
To be fair to the Wayland developers they are trying to make a protocol that is optimized for today's needs. X11 can be shoehorned into having some of the same functions but things are harder to implement and often have additional overhead in X11 that does not exist with Wayland.
The project leader for Wayland has argued that many things about X cannot be fixed without major protocol changes. The Wayland model is so radically different they cannot justify calling it X12 or X13.
There is some confusion about what is a GNOME-based application and what is part of the GNOME environment itself.
For example Shotwell is a third-party GNOME based application. It has never been part of the GNOME project--not a GNOME component. Rather, it has merely been the most commonly used app for photo management and viewing as packaged by distributions. Shotwell supplanted F-Spot becaus the latter was built with .NET/Mono and many had concerns about potential MSFT-interference.
GNOME did not have final say on either F-Spot OR Shotwell given they weren't GNOME desktop components--just apps designed to work on GNOME. Until now there WAS no official default app. Now there is:: GNOME Photos.
As such, I expect that GNOME Photos, Music, Notes, Maps, etc. will continue for the long term as the "defaults" as they are new official GNOME components. Furthermore I suspect Shotwell, Rythmbox, etc will continue on as alternatives, likely with some enhanced capabilites, different feature sets, etc. just as WEB (aka epiphany) is the "official" GNOME browser client it is still commonly (or even normally) supplanted by a 3rd party browser.
Oddly enough, I just installed Cinnamon and Mate yesterday. KDE is too buggy and I refuse to use Gnome (but I have tried it). All of the older window managers that I recall really seem stale now: E16, FVWM, Blackbox, etc. I tested out E17 excitedly but it is way too buggy. I have been using WindowMaker and it mostly works but still feels ... limited.
So I edit xinitrc to add the mate startup, exec mate_desktop or somesuch because I want to try it first since I am thinking I will likely go to Cinnamon. I execute startx... and not quite orgasmic, but god it felt GOOD. I quickly went in and started to try and tweak some things to make it more like I want it and still see evidence of previous damage by the Gnome devs but holy crap it felt good!
Classic mode has to compete with Mate. Mate does not have to compete with Classic mode. Mate is winning and judging by the Gnome devs past actions, Gnome will never really be able to compete. Gnome is dead to me.
I really should try Cinnamon but I doubt that I will. Mate feels THAT good. Just wow. So very nice.
"Someone needs to talk to the tree of liberty about its ghoulish drinking problem." by ohnocitizen
RHEL is not just for servers, there's a desktop and a workstation flavour that is supposed to be used on desktops and laptops.
What is wrong with FVWM95?
Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
To some extent, yes. If you have maintained the same machine for years with all your environment highly optimised, you vaguely imagine migrating to an altogether different DE is going to be more painful that trying to re-jig the latest POS into simething manageable. However, this time the Gnome team have gone too far. After using gnome-fallback-shell for a bit, and now evaluating several alternatives, it is LXDE for us.
Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
* You must own a 3D licence to drive it, witch cost you money and time to earn.
* The instrument panel (because it's ugly to have useful information displayed all the time) will be replaced by a projection on the windshield with information placed everywhere on it as soon a you do an action, hiding the road.
* And because there is too much informations there, there kill almost all of them as you should known yourself your actual speed (cpu load), energy reserve level (free memory), etc...
* The commands around the steering wheel (because it's way too complicated for users) will be replaced by a touchpad on the center of the steering wheel: you have to swipe up to the extreme upper left corner to display the possible action catalog on the extreme right of the windshield projected screen and then swipe from the extreme left to the extreme right to select the action like turning on the light. Touchpad is the future, period. Commands are for the elders that can no longer adapt there brain to the modern evolution.
* The navigation system (virtual desktop map) basically choose a random direction just second before intersection until it find the destination completely by luck. The map data randomly swap towns (desktop) location so you have to manually maintain a translation index in your head. You cannot program more than a few destinations.
* There is no way to carry something other than a standardized adult on the car. Who would like to have children anyway ? And a car is only there for the joy of driving, so there is absolutely no need to have place for baggage or anything special to transport. Car have is not designed to transport something.
* The car is only adapted to special roads made for them. Using it with previous generation of roads is completely unsupported can raise unexpected results.
* All the accessories actually on the market are completely incompatible with this car. You have to use only the accessories provided by the manufacturer, but the catalog is very short and the quality is bad.
* Sometime it cash for no reason.
* The manufacturer of the car ignore any complain from there customers, telling to them that there are not using the car the way it was designed to be used.