Slashdot Mirror
Sick of Your Local Police Force? Crowdfund Your Own
Nerval's Lobster writes "A subset of Oakland, California residents have decided to crowd-fund a set of private security patrols, via a trio of campaigns on a crowdfunding Website named Crowdtilt. The three patrols, if adequately funded, will cover Lower Rockridge North/West, Lower Rockridge South/West, and Lower Rockridge 'including part of the Uplands.' Each campaign has a different (Facebook verified, apparently) sponsor, and wants between $20,000 and $25,000 to make the dream of private patrols a reality. Unlike Kickstarter, the Crowdtilt campaigns don't feature fabulous prizes for contributing; gifting $100, for example, won't entitle you to 'One (1) free "accidental" shooting of your choice.' That aside, dozens of residents have contributed cash to the loosely allied projects. 'What occurred last week at the Casual Carpool has ignited our neighborhood to act,' reads one of the campaign descriptions, referring to the broad-daylight stickup of commuters waiting in a carpool line on Oakland's Hudson Street. 'While the city and the police are doing what they can, we feel it's time for us as a community to begin exploring a wide range of ideas and taking some action on our own.' All three crowdfunding pages want to hire VMA Security Group for a four-month trial period through February 2014, possibly followed by a continuing contract if everything works out. That security company already patrols the Rockridge commercial district during the holiday season, and protects a number of Oakland businesses and households. While the VMA Security Group's officers are certified to carry firearms, one of the crowdfunding pages plans to ask any of them assigned to the neighborhood to remain unarmed 'unless they feel they cannot accomplish their duties otherwise.' Upscale neighborhoods pay for private security all the time, of course. The question is whether crowdfunding — better known for financing things such as games and indie movies, at this point — could catch on as a way of funding residential projects."
If they were to convince me to donate, I'd have to know that I was indemnified against any blowback from their actions. It sound's ripe for enforcement scandal. All in all I think I'd rather contribute more to the local police and work to get them up to scratch if they are lacking in some way.
Nullius in verba
Sounds like a beautiful idea, but these poor people are being placed in a position where they are forced to pay for ineffective police (at gunpoint no less) while volunteering to pay for their own police who will be held accountable for their action AND inaction.
I wonder of the private cops work for Bitcon?
Time Bomber the Book coming soon.
If only there were some mechanism where a large portion of the population could give some money to people to provide law enforcement services to a community before the Internet was invented.
this is how police forces were initially created in this country anyway.
Rockridge? I saw this movie, it involves an incompetent, corrupt governor, and a black sheriff. I also suspect it will end with a giant pie fight in the Warner Brothers studio commissary.
Slow Down Cowboy! It's been 1 hour, 47 minutes since you last successfully posted a comment
This is the explicit purpose of taxes. When the majority of people say that society would benefit from everyone chipping in to a cause. What is this world coming to when people resort to a website called "Crowdtilt" as a replacement for government?
Are They calling it Oakland Community Police?
Does RoboCop work for them?
In Soviet Russia, Trojan exploits YOU!
Wut?
I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
What's the point of this? The local culture isn't going to be changed, and your going to have the same culture clash with the new police department as the old. Cops enforce the law? Residents get pissed about getting arrested. Cops don't enforce the law? Residents get pissed about crime.
This says nothing of the fact that the "new" police would have to work with the "old" police on a daily basis. This is a neighborhood where snitches are murdered and the murder is celebrated. How on earth is a new police department going to fix this?
Hanging around neighborhoods deterring bad guys is boring, doesn't make good numbers on the conviction rate and brings in no cash. Far better to wait at the bottom of the hill near that partially obscured speed limit sign with a radar gun.
Think about it, vote down as many levies as you like for the city as a whole, doesn't matter one bit so long as you and your neighbors have armed thugs patrolling your neighborhood.
What's the difference between an armed neighborhood watchman, and an armed police officer? Beside the tin star and $30K/yr salary, anyway.
The answer, sadly, is that the armed watchman can and will be held accountable for his actions, whereas the police officer can murder your neighbor in cold blood, get two weeks paid vacation, then be found to be free from wrongdoing and back out on the streets, still armed.
Given the options, I'll take the armed neighbor any day of the week.
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Leave Oakland.
I don't care how attached I may feel to a location, the safety of my family is my number one priority.
Yet in my nice suburb the cops ride around a nice pattern all day. Crime is low, they are ready to respond at all hours and always helpful. This is why I smile when I pay my property taxes. No need for them to try to bring in more cash.
What you are seeing here is the birth of a government. First it's law enforcement, paid for by voluntary contributions. Then maybe some additional services - upgraded fire or rescue. Then it gets big enough that someone has to start working full time to manage it. If everyone decides (as often happens) that the people organizing this shouldn't be profiting, they all agree to take turns. Of course, this becomes cumbersome and they really find they need more continuity so the community chooses 3-4 people who will manage it, and they change those people every couple of years to each person doesn't get burned out. Then after a couple years the revenue starts flagging, and they realize that they're going to have to reimburse the organizers, and have to find a way to make sure everyone is contributing. So they form a local organization which includes everyone getting services and they agree on a way to split the costs equitably so everyone gets a bill. Most places choose the split by land area or value. Soon enough they realize that with everybody paying, they can get better garbage service, and maybe even reform the schools if everyone kicks in a little more.
And then one street decides that they aren't really getting enough service, so they take up a collection for a private security firm to supplement the (now official) police...
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
This Slashdot story reminded me of an awful Christian Slater movie, "Kuffs" which used the San Francisco Patrol Special Police as its plot device. As it turns out, that organization is real (couldn't Google it in 1992 when the movie came out).
This sounds a lot like what they want in Oakland.
In my neighborhood we have great police coverage, especially at night. One officer keeps making repeated rounds past his ex-wife's house all night long.
"Think about how stupid the average person is. Now, realise that half of them are dumber than that." - George Carlin
If I threw a rock hard enough, I would have hit the Uplands. That neighborhood is CRAZY. Trick or treating there as a kid was a good way to work off the calories from all the candy, as you had to go up so many steps the sugar was a wash. Many of the homes there have coats of arms over the doors. They are wealthy, wealthy, wealthy. I've seen houses in my old neighborhood which is a ghetto in comparison selling for well over $1M, so these places are easily in the tens of millions.
Of course they're getting private security. The Oakland police are so busy that if you're reporting a crime that is not CURRENTLY IN PROGRESS, they'll mail you a report form. You never even see an officer if your car or house is broken into.
Meanwhile, half a mile away, on Telegraph Ave, Berkeley has about the highest concentration of mentally ill homeless people in the nation, perhaps outside of Manhattan. But heaven forbid someone gets their big screen TV stolen.
The CB App. What's your 20?
If you don't pay the guards, they stop showing up. If you don't pay the cops you go to jail, have liens placed against your property, and have your wages garnished.
THL phish sticks
No, Taco Bell employees have name tags with their first name on it. We want to stay unnamed.
Was anyone expecting this? I mean it's not like it's Florida...
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
This is how policing and fire fighting started to begin with. Neighbors would band together and volunteer to patrol the streets to prevent crime. Some rural areas still use an emergency siren to summon the area's volunteer fire fighting force; first one to the station drives the truck.
At some point we decided we wanted a dedicated force so we banded together and started paying the police and fire fighters as professionals. But they were still our neighbors and friends and part of the community.
When our communities became too large for everyone to know one another and our local management organization, the government, became too large to care we ended up in the situation we have today of us and them. There are people who really believe the government "gives" us protection in the form of police officers and fire fighters. Those who believe this forget that we banded together to create those institutions to serve us and save us the trouble of having to volunteer ourselves.
Once the government became a foundational institution we just assumed that "they" had the responsibility to protect "us", we accepted that unions were formed to negotiate with "us" and we assume that we're prohibited from protecting ourselves.
The professionalization of the police and fire fighting organizations are what allowed huge parts of the population to justify their abdication of personal responsibility.
I can't argue against that professionalization because of the efficiencies it should deliver. I can, however, argue that community policing is sorely needed in many parts of this country. Any profession, unionized or not, is going to fight against competition.
We need to remind "them" that we didn't give them a monopoly on protecting us and we certainly didn't abdicate our own right of self protection and preservation.
If I see police walking round this bit of London I wonder what's happened. This is a nice bit, there shouldn't be any street crime! I don't see the police in the same places, so I think they're good at patrolling everywhere rather than a fixed route.
(We have a map of crime rates in different areas of London: http://maps.met.police.uk/ )
All they do is call the real police, the ones that we are already paying for with our property taxes.
It seems like a better solution would be to make the real police answerable to the will of the people. Perhaps these neighborhoods should focus on fixing their political processes rather than building a parallel police dept.
Last October my neighbor invited both our city councilwoman, and her opponent, to a neighborhood meeting at his house. About 80 people showed up. We grilled both of them on what they were going to do about recent burglaries. The result was the councilwoman was re-elected and we got a specific cop assigned to our area. He is "our cop" and works with our neighborhood watch group, personally follows up every crime report, and attends our periodic neighborhood BBQs to give pointers on crime prevention. If you pay taxes, the police work for you, and you (collectively) have the power to make them do their jobs.
Merriam-Webster is not an English dictionary. It's a random mish-mash of colonial argot.
Electronic toilet paper.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Gov't forces are too busy writing tickets to build revenue.
No ... ask any police officer, they spend about half their day dealing with domestic disputes.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
So, what does it cost to get somebody with state power, a badge, and a crazy-strong presumption of right and innocence should anything inconvenient go to court on my side?
Rentacops are rather risible figures; but the opportunity for influence-purchasing inherent in hiring actual cops makes me a trifle nervous. You (probably) couldn't get away with having your own personal death squad or anything; but who's going to ticket the guy who hands out cushy after-hours 'security' gigs?
Upscale neighborhoods pay for private security all the time, of course.
That's usually a sign of their disdain for the public at large or that one is in a Third World country.
The question is whether crowdfunding—better known for financing things such as games and indie movies, at this point—could catch on as a way of funding residential projects."
Privatizing law enforcement has the same issue with privatizing prisons - worse quality with more incentive to prosecute.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
The question is whether crowdfundingâ"better known for financing things such as games and indie movies, at this pointâ"could catch on as a way of funding residential projects.
Beyond a certain size, which is variable, you need taxes instead of voluntary donations. Because some people are just leeches on the system.
Yes, I'm looking at you so-called libertarians, randroids, and anarchists that want all the bennies of living in a civilized society but think that paying for it is bad.
--
BMO
In my neighborhood, we had the cops who just sat around with radar guns all day while home invasion robberies were fairly common. We fired the police force we were using from a neighboring city and replaced them with the county sheriff. They quit with all the traffic nonsense and immediately got to work stopping crime! I am also very happy with the results.
Peter predicted that you would "deliberately forget" creation 2000 years ago...
When I was a graduate student at University of Chicago, the University's private police force was the third largest police force in Illinois, after the cities of Chicago and Springfield. That may still be the case. The University police patrolled the Hyde Park neighborhood of Chicago in which the University is situated. Hyde Park is surrounded on three sides by high-crime neighborhoods, and on the east by a park along the shore of Lake Michigan, but it was safe to walk the streets of Hyde Park at all hours of the day or night. University police patrol cars could constantly be seen cruising slowly up and down every street. In those days before cell phones were popular, you could walk up any street almost without ever taking your hand off an emergency call box. When I first visited Hyde Park for my interview, I remember being told the exact boundaries of where it was safe to walk. That included things like "make sure to walk only along the south side of 47th Street, never along the north side of the street."
This is just another case of the haves who are able to "contribute" or donate to a security zone vs the public funding of police. I'm sure all of the people who contribute are vehemently against increased "taxes", yet those taxes are the very thing that support public services like police. They are in essence paying a selective tax (supporting private security). Those areas too poor to hire their own private security will continue to decline. This is no different than the rich sending their children to private schools, hiring security and personal physicians then refusing to pay any form of taxes. As we continue down this path, the middle class will dissolve and we'll be left with children begging in the streets and the era of Dickens or a world like Mr Potter in "A wonderful life" will the reality for everyone.
What's the difference between an armed neighborhood watchman, and an armed police officer?
Well, here are some:
1. The police officer has the legal authority to act on behalf of the government. In theory at least, they are carrying out the collective will of the citizens as determined by the politicians. By contrast, the armed neighborhood watchman has no more legal authority than I do.
2. The police officer has the right to do things that citizens do not. For instance, a police officer can forcibly detain someone against their will if they have a reasonable suspicion that person is engaged in criminal activity, whereas a neighborhood watchman can only use force against someone who is presenting an immediate threat to people or property.
3. The average police officer has considerably more training than your average security guard. Most of that training is not about using violence, but rather about how to read and control people's emotions.
4. The police officer is supposed to protect and serve anyone and everyone. The armed neighborhood watchman is supposed to protect those who pay him. That makes a big difference for those who can't afford to pay for the security guard.
5. The police officer that covers your neighborhood coordinates his/her efforts with other police officers and other police departments in a way that armed neighborhood watchman simply can't do. For example, if someone is running from the cops, the various departments will work together to keep the chase going even if the suspect runs from one jurisdiction to the next. Your neighborhood watchman, on the other hand, might have to deal with trouble he never knew was coming, rather than knowing in advance, planning, and coordinating with the other neighborhood watchmen around him.
The police forces are certainly not perfect, but there are real reasons they exist, and real differences between them and private security guards.
I am officially gone from
Wtf are you talking about? I didn't post anon...in fact, this is my real name idiot. That is as anti-anon as you can get.
Question: all of the regions on that map (even when zooming in) appear to be either average or above-average. What's the average calibrated against if there aren't any below-average data points? Is the rest of London really slightly-below-average enough to counterbalance the mess in the middle?
Maybe it's just Lake Woebegone writ large?
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon