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A Year After Sandy, Do You Approach Disaster Differently?

A year ago today, Superstorm Sandy struck the northeastern U.S. The storm destroyed homes — in some cases entire neighborhoods — and brought unprecedented disruptions to the New York City area's infrastructure, interrupting transportation, communications, and power delivery. It even damaged a Space Shuttle. In the time since, the U.S. hasn't faced a storm with Sandy's combination of power and placement, but businesses have had some time to rethink how much trust they can put in even seemingly impregnable data centers and other bulwarks of modernity: a big enough storm can knock down nearly anything. Today, parts of western Europe are recovering from a major storm as well: more than a dozen people were killed as the predicted "storm of the century" hit London, Amsterdam, and other cities on Sunday and Monday. In Amsterdam, the city's transportation system took a major hit; some passengers had to shelter in place in stopped subway cars while the storm passed. Are you (or your employer) doing anything different in the post-Sandy era, when it comes to preparedness to keep people, data, and equipment safe?

230 comments

  1. It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on earth by metrix007 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Summary is misleading.

    --
    If you ignore ACs because they are anonymous - you're an idiot.
  2. Arizona... by mythosaz · · Score: 1

    So, uh, I live in Arizona, so we're pretty much still not bracing for any sort of natural disaster other than it being hot again this summer...

    1. Re:Arizona... by i+kan+reed · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Actually, as much as you personally are intellectually lazy, has elaborate plans in case of drought. and severe floods aren't unheard of either.

    2. Re:Arizona... by i+kan+reed · · Score: 1

      whoops, got a tag improperly ended in there and lost some text. Not crazy, I promise

      the second link:
      http://geochange.er.usgs.gov/sw/impacts/hydrology/state_fd/azwater1.html

    3. Re:Arizona... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So, uh, I live in Arizona, so we're pretty much still not bracing for any sort of natural disaster other than it being hot again this summer...

      I would think Colorado and Utah would be much better options, for a fair amount of the year they could use natural cooling. But, to be honest, datacenters don't provide much in the way of jobs, so I would not be in much of a hurry to bring them here.

    4. Re:Arizona... by mythosaz · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Two quick things:

      Actually, as much as you personally are intellectually lazy,

      You're a dick.

      has elaborate plans in case of drought. and severe floods aren't unheard of either.

      These "disasters" aren't. We regularly have flooding (localized, due to rains, not rivers or levees), excessive heat (110+ for weeks straight), and drought. That's normal here, benign, and we're not doing anything differently because of disasters elsewhere, because we're mostly immune from anything other than what passes for a curiosity story on CNN/Fox when we hit 118 in the summer.

    5. Re:Arizona... by i+kan+reed · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Oh come on, you're a dick too, patronizing people who suffered extraordinary disasters with your post.

    6. Re:Arizona... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well you managed to get at least a Score:2 based on the fact you're an extremely insufferable person. Congrats.

    7. Re:Arizona... by geekoid · · Score: 2

      Theya rent a dick. I'm sorry you don't like being confronted with the truth, but that doesn't make the poster a dick.

      It means that you need to stop being so intellectually lazy and take 2 minutes to see if your view holds any factual water, so to speak.

      "That's normal here"
      So? They are still disasters.

      "benign"
      no, people die, infrastructure gets damaged and so on. Those disaster have a minimal impact becasue, ready for it?...they have a disaster plan. duh duh duuuuuuh!

      --
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    8. Re:Arizona... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your state is the disaster

    9. Re:Arizona... by MarkvW · · Score: 1

      As the water table in Arizona drops deeper and deeper, year after year . . ..

    10. Re:Arizona... by TWiTfan · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't drought in a desert be considered normal?

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    11. Re:Arizona... by mythosaz · · Score: 1

      What death and destruction do you think "disasters" have wrought in Phoenix? We don't have "disastrous" flooding, drought and heat. It's hot. It floods a little when the monsoon is in town.. Sometimes water is low. Those aren't disasters.

      Here's the skinny on what actually happens here:
      http://www.fcd.maricopa.gov/education/history.aspx

      Every once in a while, we flood the ground floor of a home in a wash or ravine, close an airport runway, or wash out a bridge. Sometimes a moron drives through a wash and needs rescued. 33 years ago, we blew out some old bridges... In short, it rains here every once in a while, sometimes it doesn't rain for a while and that's it.

      Heat on the other hand is real.

      Immigrants die in the heat sneaking across the border in droves. 70-some-odd deaths per year are attributed, or had a helping hand from heat here with non-migrant Arizonans as well. They include gems like an 86 year old guy overheating on his roof (!?!) and infants left in cars by morons, but do include the occasional middle-aged heat stroke victim. In a city of nearly 4M, I imagine 70's pretty low. People have to die of something. ...but none of that is abnormal. It's normal to be 110 here for weeks at a clip, and data centers here are built with exactly that in mind -- since it was 110 last year, and the year before, and before, and before.

    12. Re:Arizona... by mythosaz · · Score: 1

      That's the point.

      We've got disaster plans for all sorts of things, but they're all just things we live with every year.

    13. Re:Arizona... by i+kan+reed · · Score: 1

      No, it wouldn't. Drought is defined by abnormal lack of water. it can still have catastrophic consequences for say, cattle ranchers, whose business models depend on a very specific distribution of desert flora(really).

    14. Re:Arizona... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There's still the possibility of, say, solar flare. Wouldn't hurt too much to have some non-perishables, water, and batteries sitting in a closet.

    15. Re:Arizona... by Megane · · Score: 1

      You could get invaded by California, I guess. (Except that I'm sure you already are being invaded very slowly by them.)

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    16. Re:Arizona... by CohibaVancouver · · Score: 1

      So, uh, I live in Arizona, so we're pretty much still not bracing for any sort of natural disaster other than it being hot again this summer...

      Not really a natural disaster per se, but what would the effect on Arizona be if the electric grid went down for a prolonged period in a the summer?

    17. Re:Arizona... by mcgrew · · Score: 2

      Indeed, Superstorm Sandy only affected people in the eastern seaboard. As to do I approach disaster differently? Not since Sandy, since March 12, 2006. Fo or folks down in St Louis it was 1994 when they had a 500 year flood. Folks in Louisiana with Katrina. And what about the folks in Oklahoma, who go through worse than the tornado I was in almost every year? How about Colorado with its fires and floods?

      Hell, what about the British RIGHT NOW. I hear they're having some really shitty weather, that people have died.

      What's so damned special about New York except the Church of Mammon and its high priests?

    18. Re:Arizona... by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      The slow motion disaster that is heading Arizona's (and southern California's) way is the long term drought in the Colorado River basin since around 2000. In that time the storage in Lake Mead and Lake Powell has dropped to less than half of capacity. If the Colorado River basin drought continues before too much longer it will start to severely restrict the amount of water that Arizona and southern California can draw from the river. This will be a disaster for lower basin agriculture and may also affect the amount of water available for major metropolitan areas such as Phoenix and Los Angeles.

    19. Re:Arizona... by tragedy · · Score: 1

      I've been to Phoenix. One thing that's immediately obvious flying in is that, if the water supply to the city is cut off by anything, the whole city needs to be evacuated or everyone dies.

  3. Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There were some warnings about Sandy

    But what percentage of those in major quake zones have an escape bag? You know, one you grab as you flee, just before your house comes tumbling down. The 5 second bag.

    If Seattle gets a strong 8, or a 9, the elevated roads in and out of the narrow strip of land will likely all collapse. Millions of people could be cut off for a long time.

    1. Re:Being prepared by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      According to various shows and friends, being prepared for the next major storm/earthquake/tsunami/fire/drought/etc. is to have a large gun and ammo cache, an underground bunker, food and water for a year, off-grid energy generation and the willingness to shoot the roaming hoardes of looters, bandits and otherwise famished and unprepared bleeding-heart hippies that will try kill your dog, rape your mother and steal your food.

      In the meantime, past experience indicates that 5 days of food and water is plenty of supplies to wait out the rebuilding effort, along with a house that matches the local building codes. Society is not going to collapse, Mad Max will not come to pass, and I'll be most worried about paranoid neighbors shooting me as I come to check in on them.

      So my plan: backup important data across the network, have food and water for a few days and hunker down while the roads are cleared and energy access is restored. If I get bored, I can always hunt turkeys in the backyard.

      --
      Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
    2. Re:Being prepared by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      That level of prep is meant to defend against societal collapse. A storm does not cause this.

    3. Re:Being prepared by CastrTroy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I wonder how much societal collapse could be caused by a storm. Sure, not complete societal collapse, and not national societal collapse, but it seems likely that many parts of a single city's society could collapse if there was a big storm. Maybe in the US, this is much less likely, because the government would send in disaster relief, but look at what happened when Haiti was hit by that earthquake. Had the world not come to their rescue, things could have been much worse, and they were pretty bad anyway. Many cities in less better off nations could be pretty much completely ruined by a large storm.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    4. Re:Being prepared by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      That's at least one level above those that consider having gun and ammo and becoming part of the roaming hordes of looters enough...

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      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    5. Re:Being prepared by nine-times · · Score: 2

      Yeah, sometimes things like "disaster recovery" and "security" get a bit out of hand and/or miss the point. You get people really into the idea "If a nuclear bomb hit my office, I could get my operations back up and running from another location immediately, because all my data is immediately synced to a location on the other side of the country." Well yeah, that's great, until you realize the person has confused a "sync" with a "backup", and besides if a nuclear bomb hit your office, you'd have bigger problems.

      What few people will admit is that most of us can afford to be out-of-commission for a few days. You might not like it, and you might lose some money, but the world would keep turning and life would go on. It can be tremendously expensive to protect yourself against every possible disaster scenario, and you may end up spending a bunch of money to save yourself only a little, for a scenario that almost never happens. And then, of course, there's also the possibility of some weird nightmare scenario that gets past all of your safeguards, which you couldn't have predicted.

      Sometimes you're better off accepting that bad things happen, instead of trying to protect yourself from every possible bad scenario.

    6. Re:Being prepared by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Of course. The next, obvious question though is: what is going to bring about societal collapse? And the answers I get to that range from riots to super storms to earthquakes to hyperinflation to asteroid impact to brand new plague. Most of the answers also mysteriously assume that those events are likely enough to warrant shelling out multiple thousands of dollars immediately.

      The reality is that we've been through everything short of an asteroid impact, and civilization has not collapsed. Especially not western civilization. Maybe that's why Europeans are non-plussed by all these possibilities, and look at the US like a family does at its crazy uncle who is raving about government brain scans: they've been through all of it, and they've come out alright. True, there were a few World Wars that came about from some of those events, but it wasn't a collapse of civilization. If anything, it proved that civilization was rebuilt pretty much instantly by citizens working together and sharing their meager means.

      Full disclosure: my parents still tell me stories of The War. It's as close as Europe ever came to total collapse, and it didn't.

      --
      Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
    7. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you claiming there are nations worse off than Haiti? I can hardly imagine how that could be possible. About the only thing that Haiti didn't have going against them was cholera, but the rescue effort fixed that, too.

    8. Re:Being prepared by mjr167 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You must not have been in New Orleans after Katrina...

    9. Re:Being prepared by chuckinator · · Score: 2

      It would help to get an amateur radio license before hand so you can contact what's left of the authorities to regroup (or just let them know not to shoot you). A CB would work just as well, but you're more likely to get in touch with them on the amateur 2 meter 144 MHz VHF frequencies than the CB 11 meter 27 MHz HF frequencies. 70 centimeter 440 MHz UHF frequencies may also help if you want to link up with others operating FRS/GMRS radios, and a GMRS license will give you the privilege of working the GMRS emergency repeaters.

    10. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've only seen 5 minutes of the doomsday preppers, the guy had stock piles of food, ammo etc. his wife thought he was crazy, she would just go hunt or find some bugs to eat if it came to that, she had personal experience she had been a refugee walking across Cambodia or something like that...

    11. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      True, there were a few World Wars that came about from some of those events, but it wasn't a collapse of civilization. If anything, it proved that civilization was rebuilt pretty much instantly by citizens working together and sharing their meager means.

      I have letters from WWI from a neutral European nation which almost appear cliche at times. Stuff like "I hope this letter reaches you", etc. There's also a mention about the lack of food.

      Society didn't collapse. But perhaps a fully stocked larder isn't a bad idea.

    12. Re:Being prepared by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      Possibly North Korea. For the simple fact that it's likely they would have denied access to foreign aid workers.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    13. Re:Being prepared by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Protip: During a disaster, the authorities won't gave a rats ass whether or not you are licensed.

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    14. Re: Being prepared by Badblackdog · · Score: 2

      >> I wonder how much societal collapse could be caused by a storm? I can answer that for you. Hurricane Katrina caused a lot of death and destruction. Everything fell apart here for a lot of people. The people trapped in the Superdome and Convention Center turned on each other like animals. Society is back to normal now but for a few weeks this place had a total societal breakdown.

    15. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I like to keep about 3 months of non-perishable food items, have a storm proof bunker I call the basement, and have been looking into getting a generator. I have no guns and ammo but I do live in the area lovingly called tornado alley, the last time a tornado hit were I live was 1971. This does not mean that we have never have storms that leave us without power for an extended time {usually 5 or less days but up to 14 days a couple times} or have been snowed in for 7 - 14 days.

      A few years back we had a hail storm that produced baseball sized hail and I tackled a guy and held him down because he was determined to get to his brand new car and somehow save it. As much damage as was done to the cars in the parking lot he would have never made it without being horribly injured or possibly killed.

    16. Re:Being prepared by TWiTfan · · Score: 1

      There is a point to be made there. Being a doomsday prepper after a real disaster would make you more of a target than anything else. Anything more than one or two guns and a few days of supplies would be like hanging up a big sign that said "Come raid here!" And going on a national TV show and bragging about it is probably not the smartest move either.

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    17. Re:Being prepared by cold+fjord · · Score: 1

      Cannibal Korea is best Korea.

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    18. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      According to various shows and friends, being prepared for the next major storm/earthquake/tsunami/fire/drought/etc. is to have a large gun and ammo cache, an underground bunker, food and water for a year, off-grid energy generation and the willingness to shoot...

      Do you really have friends like that, or do you just think all republicans are all like those whackos you see on reality TV?

    19. Re:Being prepared by compro01 · · Score: 1

      Sure, but knowing what you're doing (and having practise) before the disaster comes rolling in is probably a really good idea.

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    20. Re:Being prepared by chuckinator · · Score: 2

      You are incorrect, uninformed, and perpetuating misinformation. Licensees participating in ARES (amateur radio emergency service) and RACES (radio amateur civil emergency service) drills practice not only how to operate their stations in power blackout situations, they also practice operating frequencies under net control conditions and how to report and relay relevant emergency information in concise, brief messages that won't interfere with any ongoing emergency response efforts. A disaster is the time in which it is most important to be licensed, understand how the equipment works, and understand protocols and procedures for operating on the air so you don't interfere with the ongoing radio communications during the disaster. The last thing that will help is someone who doesn't know how to work their radio, how to follow authorized operating protocol, and how to be helpful and keep your head screwed on under duress. What will get you a stern talking to in a time of peace will get the book thrown at you in a time of crisis when there really are lives on the line. You will also be more likely to be caught operating illegally during a time of crisis since that's when the powers that be will need that resource the most.

    21. Re:Being prepared by nospam007 · · Score: 1

      "But what percentage of those in major quake zones have an escape bag? You know, one you grab as you flee, just before your house comes tumbling down. The 5 second bag."

      That's just something for you young whippersnappers. We old ones firstly, don't care, secondly we have a 75 second bag ready because we already know we'll never come back.

    22. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "food and water for a year,.."

      I thought that was for Morons only.

      PS. Those who get it, mod up.

    23. Re:Being prepared by couchslug · · Score: 2

      NOLA shouldn't have residential areas below sea level. No reason other than sentiment exists to rebuild them there.

      I have the option not to live in areas absolutely guaranteed to get hammered by hurricane storm surge. Not living there is part of my "disaster prep". The US is vast and so are ones choices of domicile.

      --
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    24. Re:Being prepared by chuckinator · · Score: 1

      I do want to clarify that any radio on any frequency may be used if the threat of human life is clear and present and no other means of communication are available, but it is much better to be able to make contact out with a licensee callsign. It's even better to know how to operate the radio and follow established procedures and protocols of the amateur service so you can be helpful rather than have to get help from someone on the air just to know how to operate the device. That radio is little more than an electronic brick in the hands of someone that doesn't know how it works.

    25. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yet the long-term costs to the economy (consider the strategic location of the city with respect to the Gulf of Mexico and Mississippi River) should we lose New Orleans mean it is better for the nation to incur short-term costs to rebuild the city.

      Don't forget it is not the fault of New Orleans that it is in such a terrible situation. Years of mismanagement by the Army Corps of Engineers (whom the city sued--unsuccessfully--to regain control of the waterways) have led New Orleans down the path to this fate.

    26. Re:Being prepared by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 1

      I actually do have friends who are preparing for the end of times. Storing guns and ammo for the looters, stashing gold and silver at home.... The wackos on TV are real, and they are among you.

      --
      Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
    27. Re:Being prepared by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 1

      That's becoming my #1 concern: if the end of civilization DOES happen, the preppers are ideally prepped to be looters and bandits. They have a well-fortified homebase in a far-off location, lots of guns, lots of ammo, lots of prepared food, and zero ability, tools and seeds to grow their own food. They will run out of food before they run out of ammo, and then they will most likely become what they feared the most themselves.

      --
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    28. Re:Being prepared by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 1

      I have a few relatives who told stories about fleeing the genocides which surrounded those wars.

      I'm sure that Europeans have 'been through all of it, and come out alright.' That's because they are alive to consider how they came out alright. I'd ask my grandmother how her mother felt about the situation, but she is in some unmarked grave in Poland.

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    29. Re:Being prepared by mjr167 · · Score: 1

      My parents live in NOLA and did not flood. Total damage to their property from the entire ordeal was one refrigerator and a couple shingles.

      The fact that their house was habitable was irrelevant to the fact that the city had no power, no sewage, no running water, and no order during the 3 months they spent living in Texas waiting for the national guard to OK returning while they pumped 10+ feet of water over the levees. It turns out that in addition to a house, you also need things like a grocery store, a gas station, etc.

      There was no looting in their neighborhood cause an ex-marine lived next door with his guns, ammo, generator, and enough supplies to last... Everyone makes fun of the crazy gun nut next door until Katrina hits and then you deputize him and throw him a party.

      I was there the Christmas after Katrina and it was creepy. Almost 6 months later, half the city was still dark and there were still trees laying in the streets. The day the Pop-Eyes opened up they had a line for the drive-threw that was 3 blocks long...

      The argument that people should not live in New Orleans because it floods is shallow and short sighted. The same argument could be applied to California, Oklahoma, the north-east, etc. There are very few places free from risk of natural disaster and saying 'you knew the risks, you deserved it' ignores the real complexities and benefits associated with any one location.

    30. Re:Being prepared by psithurism · · Score: 0

      I wasn't. Maybe you could explain how only those with big guns survived that disaster?

      I've been through minor hurricanes and earthquakes, but they seem to have been experienced completely differently by my neighbors. I remember relying on my own water caches and canned food though I didn't refuse supplemental aid from the red cross and salvation army. My neighbors on the other hand seem to recall something like a zombie-tornado since they keep stockpiling sniper rifles and big game guns and ammunition that they think is going to help them through the next one. I guess it encourages me to ensure their prepared enough not to come after my stuff.

      Back to the original article, which unfortunately seems to have the nerdy-part completely ignored by other commenters. I still need to find a data backup solution. My company has finally gotten away from, I kid you not, the thumb drive of project critical data that had to be picked up by the nearest employee. We now have our primary svn repository at a different site location on the other side of the US. Personally, I'll certainly throw a zip locked hard drive (cellphone too obviously) when I grab my bug out bag for evacuation, but otherwise I'm thinking true-crypt + amazon deep freeze, but that is pretty hard to update. Any other nerds figured this out?

      Clearly, I'd save as much computer equipment as possible, but usually the short notice that you learn your particular area needs to be evacuated, racks and even desktops are usually too cumbersome to deal with and probably not as useful/valuable as the other items you might take, like extra gas, a generator, and other stuff that would be more likely to get looted in a really badly hit area.

    31. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sometimes you're better off accepting that bad things happen, instead of trying to protect yourself from every possible bad scenario.

      But how will we defend the DHS budget then?

    32. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I've had friends of mine who worked overseas and saw collapse in Haiti and other places. Once the food trucks stop moving in, give a city 72 hours, and the place will turn into one big Donner party with people turning on each other. The national guard isn't going to risk life and limb going into a place with looters running rampant with the bullets flying everywhere. They will let the predators eat the prey, then each other, and after that, come in to secure things.

      Another example of this was Houston. When the last hurricane hit the area, an evacuation was called a number of days beforehand. Due to the bad traffic and lack of roads out, there were still people on the highways (and had to leave their cars) when the hurricane hit. Most US cities don't have the infrastructure to get people out in any reasonable time. The town where I live (Austin) can't get people in and out when it comes festival time, much less if there were a real disaster.

    33. Re:Being prepared by mjr167 · · Score: 3, Informative

      You are correct regarding standard hurricanes. You expect to pack up and leave, spend 3 nights in a hotel, then come home. Or spend three nights reading books by candle light and boiling your water if you elected to ride the storm out.

      Katrina, however, resulted in a large city being mostly abandoned for several months and a large portion of the population that for whatever reason (there are many that we will not debate) decided not to leave happened to also coincide with the large criminal portion of the New Orleans population.

      Looters set one of the malls on fire and then shot at the firefighters who responded to put the fire out. They shot at the rescue helicopters... I do not know why these people decided shooting at the national guard was an appropriate response, but they did. The looting really was just as bad as they reported on TV.

      These people decided that since the city was mostly abandoned they were justified in setting random parts of the city on fire and stealing things. There were also normal, sane people who stayed behind and enforced law and order in various places. The easiest way to do this was to post a sign that said 'we shoot looters' and then make good on that promise because the only person making sure some asshat didn't come and burn your house down for fun was you.

      Normal society works because the sane people vastly out number the nut jobs who like to hurt other people and set things on fire. Sane people also happen to be the type of people who see a cat 5 hurricane heading towards a city below sea level and get the fuck out of town before it hits. When most of the sane people leave, that leaves only the nut jobs who think it's ok to set other people's things on fire and no one to stop them.

      Police stop crime because someone is there to report the crime. When no one can report the crime, criminals don't worry about the police.

    34. Re:Being prepared by Nethead · · Score: 1

      You are incorrect, uninformed, and perpetuating misinformation.
      And you, sir, are what we call an ECommie. Get your reflective vest and callsign hat, and jog off. We don't need no stinkin' badges. Your radio ain't going to dig you out of a fallen house. What you need is a good set of demolition tools, food, water, first aid and tarps. Get to know your neighbors and help them when the shit hits the fan. CERT training can help but just don't go all happy with it and make it your whole life. Enjoy the now.

      If you want a radio for emergencies, then get one on your state EOC frequency so you can bypass all the ECommie wannabes.

      I've got a VHF-low Maxtrac channeled up for Washington State CEMNET and the Red Cross. I'll be grabbing that before I grab my 2m.

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    35. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Perhaps the US? When disasters strike other countries, the US and Europe are sending aid posthaste to the area.

      When Katrina hit, nobody outside the country offered any assistance whatsoever to the people in need, and in fact there were many people in Europe gleefully gloating about the disaster with a nice glow of "ha-ha" schadenfreude.

    36. Re:Being prepared by mlts · · Score: 1

      If you buy a generator, buy one now, have an electrician install either an interlock system on the circuit breaker or a transfer switch. (Interlocks are code safe, and allow you more freedom to choose what circuits you want on the generator, but a manual transfer switch is a lot more idiot-resistant.)

      When disasters strike, generators go immediately at the hardware stores, so it can't hurt to at least have a portable one (or two Honda 2000 watt models that are paired) to keep the computers and refrigerator running.

    37. Re:Being prepared by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      unprepared bleeding-heart hippies that will try kill your dog, rape your mother and steal your food.

      What about those that want to kill your mother, rape your food and steal your dog?

    38. Re:Being prepared by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      How functional was New Orleans after Katrina?

    39. Re:Being prepared by AK+Marc · · Score: 0

      The US is closer to total collapse than anywhere else, including Japan and Greece. The US was just hours away from hyperinflation (what would have happened if no budget resolution was passed). That would have been fun to see. The moment the US misses a single dollar of interest on the debt, the cost of debt would skyrocket, and the only way to balance a budget would be to print money. Then comes the hyperinflation. When bread doubles in price from the morning to the evening, we'll see some major issues.

    40. Re:Being prepared by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      Gold? What use is gold? You can't eat it or make tools from it.

    41. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The looters weren't "nutjobs"or lacking in sanity -- they're normal. When the normal social hierarchy favoring age/money is disrupted, people tend to revert to oldschool physical dominance. That favors the more aggressive able-bodied young men toughened by life in 'bad'/low-income areas, and some of them regard it as their chance to grab whatever they feel they "deserve"and otherwise exact revenge on the folks with more money/power than them.

    42. Re:Being prepared by tragedy · · Score: 1

      When Katrina hit, nobody outside the country offered any assistance whatsoever to the people in need, and in fact there were many people in Europe gleefully gloating about the disaster with a nice glow of "ha-ha" schadenfreude.

      Well, the rest of the world outside the US is obviously just terrible... At least, maybe you could credibly claim that if what you are saying were actually true. Many, many countries offered and provided aid after Katrina. Some of it was delayed due to the US initially refusing it, of course.

    43. Re:Being prepared by chuckinator · · Score: 1

      Ecommie wannabe? Only group of folks I've heard refer to hams by that moniker operate their Maxtracs under their employers' public safety LMRS licenses. I certainly hope you're not bootlegging that on 30-50 MHz.

    44. Re:Being prepared by Nethead · · Score: 1

      Nope, operate under State authority for the tribal EOC. Wouldn't want to lose my ham ticket or radio-telephone license. I'm also good with my county radio officer. I just don't play the vest & badges game. When the shit hits the fan, they know who I am.

      It's not like I don't have my ICS-400 and shit.Hell, I even put up a D-Star box on the tribal tower so we can go digital with the county EOC. You just won't find any laminated card around my neck or me checking in each week on the net. When you've built broadcast stations, radio becomes just a tool.

      I haven't talked on the radio for months. But I still know how to pass traffic.

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    45. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Retailers in my area brought in so many generators during Sandy that they never actually ran out. Strangely.

      About a week in, I saw one of my neighbors drive into the neighborhood with a brand new generator in the back of his truck. At that exact moment, the power came back on.

      Oops.

      The BEST time to buy a generator is about a week after the event. Craigslist is full of ads for new generators, used only once.

    46. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What is even more ironic is that the generators bought for the previous disasters end up in storage... and gasoline, especially E-10 fouls up carbs quickly, so come the next disaster, the generator run once will not work again.

    47. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Society can get into "failure modes" which almost are as bad as collapse. So far, one failure mode is a continent full of little nation-states always at war with each other. This prevents anything meaningful from being done (think trade) because one duchy or dukedom doesn't want another to have any resources, so a passing trader will get their stuff seized and perhaps drawn and quartered just because the local duke has the power to do it.

      Europe lasted in this mode for a good chunk of a millennium until the plague made it impossible to base the feudal society on the backs of so few serfs, so things became hell as the nobles tried to preserve their way of life, then finally, ended up making unions and turning the tiny dukedoms and such into viable nations that could afford the arts and sciences.

      There is also tribal warfare which is similar. When territory is divided into little spaces with constant warring over them, there no way for anything to be accomplished whatsoever other than trying to be the most brutal of the bunch.

      As for collapse and revolution, in reality, revolution is something utterly impossible in a modern day society. In the US, if some of the separatist/secessionist [1] types wanted to revolt, all it would take would be a few UAV strikes with VX gas hitting some small towns and militia camps, and they would be lining up to surrender by the thousands, just like the Iraqis did during Desert Storm. Doesn't matter how well armed some prepper is in that scenario.

      Collapse can happen in the US, but there are a lot of parties, strong groups, waiting in the wings which can grab the helm of US government.

      [1]: Same thing. To me, there isn't much difference between people wanting five states to secede and separationist guerrillas.

    48. Re:Being prepared by Suggestive+Language · · Score: 1

      Well Manhattan, Ansterdam, Venice and Hong Kong should not have been built on coastal land only few feet above sea level. And your point again was?

      --
      I got no problem voting with my feet.
    49. Re:Being prepared by Suggestive+Language · · Score: 1

      Nice to know you've been so sheltered until now.

      There doesn't need to be anywhere near a total collapse (interesting that you hedge with a rather extreme definition of "collapse") for public services and safety to degrade to a level that adversely affects the health and safety of ordinary citizens for a period of days to months. One only need to look to Latin America's last big economic collapse, the Syrian War or the roughest periods of post-Communist Eastern Europe to witness a massive drop in police protection, civil service resources and public utilities.

      By the way, hundreds of thousands families in World War II were instantly displaced or caught in harrowing deadly situations by army movements, massive bombings, deliberate targeting of civilians and frequent rounds of genocide. In many major cities services were disrupted for weeks, months, even years. A Jewish family, much less *any* family in Europe in 1939 would have been well served by some survival training, spare supplies, escape plans, safety plans and a even a serviceable, concealable weapon in many cases.

      --
      I got no problem voting with my feet.
    50. Re:Being prepared by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      that is probably why they constantly talk about OPSEC and refuse to show somethings

    51. Re:Being prepared by chuckinator · · Score: 1

      Very nice! Yeah, I didn't mean to come off as one of those folks because I'm not. I just didn't want people thinking that having the equipment was all you needed because the training and exams and licensing are pretty important. Either way, have a good one and 73, sir.

    52. Re:Being prepared by intermodal · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty sure that regardless of how "total" the collapse may be, any collapse lets people benefit from whatever survival training and preparedness they may have. Even if you don't need it, it never hurts to have it.

      --
      In SOVIET RUSSIA... erm...NSA AMERICA, the Internet logs onto YOU!
    53. Re:Being prepared by intermodal · · Score: 1

      The trick is to take them out and run them a bit on a regular basis. Not only will it keep the machine in better working order, but it also improves your understanding of the equipment. Fix a minor quirk here and there, you'll find your generator is more useful to you in a disaster, since that's when you're likely to need that experience.

      --
      In SOVIET RUSSIA... erm...NSA AMERICA, the Internet logs onto YOU!
  4. Well yeah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I now carry a copy of all the Bear Grylls episodes on my smartphone, just in case.

    1. Re:Well yeah by Applekid · · Score: 1

      I now carry a copy of all the Bear Grylls episodes on my smartphone, just in case.

      All the episodes? I just need a little note telling me to drink piss.

      --
      More Twoson than Cupertino
    2. Re:Well yeah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But with only that note to aid you how will you know to squeeze the liquids out of Elephant dung or to do jumping jacks butt naked in the snow?!

    3. Re:Well yeah by camperdave · · Score: 1

      Following Bear Grylls examples will get you killed. He is a highly trained stunt man. You'd be better off with Les Stroud's or Ray Mears's stuff. You'd be better off still with a good ebook on knots, and edible plants, and a few weekends out where there is no cell phone coverage.

      --
      When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
    4. Re:Well yeah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can drink all the water in my shit, I give it to you.

    5. Re:Well yeah by Megane · · Score: 1

      You'd be better off still with a good ebook on knots

      Oh yeah, and maybe some kind of solar or other charger so you can actually read those ebooks for more than a couple of days when the electric grid is down.

      --
      #naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }
    6. Re:Well yeah by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      Anyone with a lick of common sense would learn basic rope and knot tying beforehand. Then again, common sense being taken at character creation seems to be a bit on the low side these days.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
  5. Storm of the century.. for this continent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Today, parts of western Europe are recovering from a major storm as well

    Yeah, we're uhh, clearing some trees and that's it?

    Not sure if it's the same thing as Sandy..

    1. Re:Storm of the century.. for this continent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Today, parts of western Europe are recovering from a major storm as well

      Yeah, we're uhh, clearing some trees and that's it?

      Not sure if it's the same thing as Sandy..

      12 people died and an unpublished amount of people are in hospitals and may not survive, buildings are damaged, some to a degree where they are downright gone and railroads didn't really resume normal operation until almost 24 hours after the storm started. Other lines have yet to even give an estimate on how long repairs will take due to massive damage. Also authorities had to evacuate stranded people. Last, but not least, Denmark reports the strongest gust of wind ever recorded (53.5 m/s).

      Maybe not as fatal as Sandy, but clearly not "just a few fallen trees" like you make it sound like.

  6. No, nothing different. by CitizenCain · · Score: 2

    My employer and I are still located in the Midwest, and still do nothing to prepare for hurricanes.

    1. Re:No, nothing different. by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      What about tornadoes?

    2. Re:No, nothing different. by CitizenCain · · Score: 4, Funny

      No tornadoes here either. (Ohio Valley, Central Ohio). We don't get any natural disasters... I guess God figures that living in Ohio is punishment enough.

    3. Re:No, nothing different. by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Are you being funny? Central Ohio does get tornadoes.
      Also, disasters can e man made. To train cars pulling dangerous chemical(Chlorine, etc) move through central Ohio? if so then their should be a plan in case of derailment.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:No, nothing different. by hawguy · · Score: 1

      No tornadoes here either. (Ohio Valley, Central Ohio). We don't get any natural disasters... I guess God figures that living in Ohio is punishment enough.

      Are you sure?

      http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/tornadoes-wreak-havoc-in-the-o/62353

      Destructive storms tore through the Ohio Valley Friday producing numerous large and devastating tornadoes and carving a path of destruction that left dozens of people dead.
      There was a total of 107 tornado reports across 11 states on Friday. At least 39 people were killed by the massive tornado outbreak.

      And don't forget about the floods:

      http://mrcc.isws.illinois.edu/1913Flood/awareness/materials/TalkingPoints1913.pdf

      Heavy rainfall, equivalent to two to three months
      worth, fell across the Ohio Valley between March
      23 and March 27th of 1913. The resulting runoff
      produced cataclysmic floods and damages never
      before seen over such a large area extending
      from Indiana, Ohio, Kentucky, Pennsylvania,
      New York, and later communities along the Mississippi River

      Maybe that was just a freak 100 year storm.... but it was 100 years ago.

    5. Re:No, nothing different. by CitizenCain · · Score: 1

      Yeah, being funny. Although, at the same time, it's true for the city I live in.

      The only major metropolitan area in central Ohio (where my employer and I are located) hasn't had a serious natural disaster in a century - the only thing I could turn up from a quick Google search was some flood in 1913. The only thing I can remember that might qualify as a natural disaster was some big hail storm in the mid 00's that did some property damage. I'm kind of hard-pressed to call it a natural disaster when the primary impact was car dealers having to discount a bunch of new, hail-damaged cars, though.

    6. Re:No, nothing different. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I guess God figures that living in Ohio is punishment enough.

      ...And even then, there are degrees to the punishment.
      While Northeast Ohio may have the benefit of distance from the politics in the state capital, we're saddled with bipolar weather, hopeless sports teams and the fans that follow them...

      As for the extreme weather, it's always "amusing" when the special snowflakes in the weather service sound the civil defense alarms in cities 15 miles inland for a waterspout.

    7. Re:No, nothing different. by mspohr · · Score: 1

      I lived in Cincinnati (Ohio Valley) for a few years and we definitely had tornadoes.
      I moved.

      --
      I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
    8. Re:No, nothing different. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about tomatoes? Tomato tornadoes?
      And tortilla tornadoes? Are you woefully underprepared for them too?

  7. Finding better locations.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Generally speaking the east coast is a dangerous place to put anything critical, they get a lot of strange weather. My thought is look for places where weather is more predictable. For instance states such as Colorado, Utah, and perhaps Arizona. Granted Colorado had floods last year, but one would hope you would place a data center in a location that is a lower to non-existent risk of that, such as Denver or Colorado Springs area. The power is underground, so heavy snow storms are less likely to take power for any significant amount of time. Anywhere in the mid-west could get tornado's which are very unpredictable. Plus, in the cooler states such as Colorado and Utah, you can use natural cooling for a fair amount of the year, thus reducing utilities.

    1. Re:Finding better locations.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I suppose that lower rent on the East Coast means that they can afford hurricane preparedness costs and still come out ahead. Or something.

  8. Approach disaster differently? by tech.kyle · · Score: 1

    Nope. I still run away until it's over.

    --
    If we colonize Mars, it won't be the World Wide Web anymore. UWW?
  9. Pathetic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    It's only called "Superstorm Sandy" because of the pathetic response of government and the self-centered hubris of nor-easters. It was just a hurricane; the Southeastern US getting far stronger storms much more often.

    1. Re:Pathetic by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Pretty much this.

      Central Europe recently had a few earthquakes. They sure made the news I tell you. Damage? C'mon, I felt them, but that's about it.

      I bet the average Californian wouldn't even have woken up.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Pathetic by Sique · · Score: 1
      That's not a very good way to look at it.

      You are prepared only for the disasters you expect, and the expectations are different for each region. There is no point to prepare for a blizzard near the equator, and there is no point to prepare for avalanches in Louisiana. The Southeast is better prepared for strong storms, because they have historically happened several times in the Southeast. I guess, the disaster relief plan for a complete freezing of the Mississippi mouth for several months is not very good either - it doesn't happen very often, and the flooding that might happen because of the impounded water has never been experienced before. Japan has a long tradition of building earthquake save buildings and does routine earthquake relief exercises, but I don't think you find the same amount of earthquake preparedness in Chicago.

      Chastizing people for being not prepared for something that no one in that region in the last 150 years has experienced is just being a smartass.

      --
      .sig: Sique *sigh*
    3. Re:Pathetic by cayenne8 · · Score: 1

      It's only called "Superstorm Sandy" because of the pathetic response of government and the self-centered hubris of nor-easters. It was just a hurricane; the Southeastern US getting far stronger storms much more often.

      Yep...wait till a Katrina or Andrew hits your ass and then you can call it a "super" storm.

      I feel poorly for the NY/NJ areas that Sandy hit, it was a weak storm, but did damage. I'm torn between feeling sympathetic....but also remembering SO many calls, from people (especially in the NE of the US) calling for moving New Orleans, that no one should live there, it is dangerous, stupid placement (it is there for a reason)...etc. The rudeness and lack of sympanthy for a sister city (not just NOLA but all the gulf that suffered from Katrina) from many in the northeast, does at time hamper my ability to feel for them.

      I've not seen nearly as many calls to move NYC and the important things there to a safer area...

      Yet, I relent and still do feel for the folks up there, knowing how tough it can be...and like many in LA, have sent or contributed to help to those that got hit up there...

      Anyway....now they're getting to see what we went through with FEMA and dealing with the Feds, etc. And hey guys...it is IMPROVED and BETTER now than when we had to deal with it...

      [rolls eyes]

      See how good the feds to for you, you're closer to them, maybe they'll listen and help a bit more than they did for us.

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    4. Re:Pathetic by khallow · · Score: 1

      We need to keep in mind the two huge differences between NYC and New Orleans. Even if Sandy had hit in 2005, NYC would still have fared much better because a) it's above sea level, and b) because the local and state governments are much more competent and less corrupt than the Louisiana equivalents.

      For example, two key contributing factors (I'll consider them the biggest factors) to the Katrina deaths were waiting a day before declaring an evacuation of New Orleans. And second, failing to evacuate about 100,000 people who didn't have transportation while simultaneously leaving a lot of public transportation (mostly school buses) parked (where much of it was destroyed by flooding waters). Those were local and to a limited extent state government faults.

      In comparison, New York City showed far greater competence when responding to the 9/11 attacks four years earlier and to Hurricane Sandy, for that matter.

      So no, I don't think New Orleans should get a pass just because bad things happened during a breakup of FEMA. It would and will be a mess next time this happens. And you know that the local government is eventually going to undermine the defenses against hurricanes and flooding for profit. That's what they do.

      My view is that if New Orleans wants to fund its own flood defenses like New York City does, then I'm willing to let it be. But otherwise, it doesn't deserve to exist.

    5. Re:Pathetic by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Not really that simple.
      Using your example: A 6 point earth quake would be interesting in CA, but devastating in other parts of the world.

      Let me know when one of those little earthquakes shuts a city down for a week.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    6. Re:Pathetic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sandy was a superstorm because of where and when it hit. The higher than typical storm surge hit NYC pretty much during high tide, swamping the defenses, and completely flooding entire sections of the subway system, and tunnels in the city. We're not talking a few inches, or a couple feet, we're talking entire sections of the subway system flooded up to sidewalk level. Completely submerged. It also required sections of the city's power grid to be shut down to prevent permanent damage due to being submerged. In a city that heavily populated, the loss of power can leave people stranded with no way to get home, and with no way to get food. It took weeks to pump the water out of the subways and get the necessary repairs done.

      And that's just the flooding involved.

    7. Re:Pathetic by 0racle · · Score: 1

      Well, it was also very large.

      More to the point the cost of the damage it caused is passed only by Katrina in 2005 by virtue of hitting areas that do not normally have to worry about major storms of this type. Calling it a 'Superstorm' (it 'merged' with a nor'easter which is what started the name) was stupid, but it wasn't just another rain storm in New York.

      --
      "I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are."
    8. Re:Pathetic by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      A 6 point would shut us down for weeks.

      That was a 2 or 2.5 or something, and it made the headlines for a few days.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    9. Re:Pathetic by Applekid · · Score: 1

      It's only called "Superstorm Sandy" because of the pathetic response of government and the self-centered hubris of nor-easters. It was just a hurricane; the Southeastern US getting far stronger storms much more often.

      Yep...wait till a Katrina or Andrew hits your ass and then you can call it a "super" storm.

      Funny you mention that, I lived in South Florida during Andrew.

      Bad hurricane? Yes. Hit the ground at Category 5. Tore up Homestead. Made a mockery of the infrastructure. Eventually lead to shoring up building codes and projects putting power lines underground. But even then, nobody had the arrogance to call it "superstorm". Calling it "Superstorm Sandy" is branding conjured up by self-centered New Yorkers.

      --
      More Twoson than Cupertino
    10. Re:Pathetic by sl149q · · Score: 1

      It is called Superstorm because it was not actually a hurricane (based on wind speed) when it landed....

      The media needed a new term to convey how bad it was even though it was not a hurricane.

    11. Re:Pathetic by riverat1 · · Score: 2

      It was a "Superstorm" largely because of its size. It caused damage from Michigan to Nova Scotia to Florida and was the largest such storm ever observed. By the new total energy measurement they're starting to use on storms like this it was the largest ever measured. Here is a quote from Dr. Jeff Masters at the wunderground blog:

      1) Hurricane Sandy was truly astounding in its size and power. At its peak size, twenty hours before landfall, Sandy had tropical storm-force winds that covered an area nearly one-fifth the area of the contiguous United States. Sandy's area of ocean with twelve-foot seas peaked at 1.4 million square miles--nearly one-half the area of the contiguous United States, or 1% of Earth's total ocean area. Most incredibly, ten hours before landfall (9:30 am EDT October 29), the total energy of Sandy's winds of tropical storm-force and higher peaked at 329 terajoules--the highest value for any Atlantic hurricane since at least 1969, and equivalent to five Hiroshima-sized atomic bombs. At landfall, Sandy's tropical storm-force winds spanned 943 miles of the the U.S. coast. No hurricane on record has been larger. Sandy's huge size prompted high wind warnings to be posted from Chicago to Eastern Maine, and from Michigan's Upper Peninsula to Florida's Lake Okeechobee--an area home to 120 million people. Sandy's winds simultaneously caused damage to buildings on the shores of Lake Michigan at Indiana Dunes National Lake Shore, and toppled power lines in Nova Scotia, Canada--locations 1200 miles apart. Over 130 fatalities were reported and over 8.5 million customers lost power--the second largest weather-related power outage in U.S. history, behind the 10 million that lost power during the Blizzard of 1993. Damage from Sandy is estimated at $65 billion, making it the second most expensive weather-related disaster in world history, behind Hurricane Katrina of 2005.

    12. Re:Pathetic by russotto · · Score: 1

      It wasn't "just a hurricane"; it was a hurricane combining with a nor'easter. Technically it was no longer a hurricane at landfall, but that's sort of academic. The damage it did was real, not due to the "pathetic response of government" -- that caused fuel shortages as they diverted fuel to the politically connected, but it didn't do damage.

      While Sandy's winds were minimal for a hurricane, it had a 9 foot storm surge. That's more characteristic of a Category 3 hurricane. And it hit at high tide. It pushed water up the Passaic and Hackensack rivers and flooded inland parts of New Jersey. It was also a huge storm: It had tropical storm force winds 500 miles from the center, which pulled down a lot of trees and power lines and damaged houses on its own accord.

      I found my preparations for it to be quite adequate: I arranged to be a few thousand miles away, and my house is on the lee side of a hill.

    13. Re:Pathetic by Macgrrl · · Score: 1

      Christchurch had a 6.3 magnitude earthquake a few years back...

      --
      Sara
      Designer, Gamer, Macgrrl in an XP World
  10. Having a RV helps somewhat... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Being someone who goes RV-ing often, knowing how to dry camp (this doesn't just mean parking at the local Wally World or Tesco, but actual boondocking in the woods), it does help to teach someone what they actually need come a disaster. The main thing is that a power outage just means to fire up the generator [1] used for the travel trailer, plug extension cords for the fridge, a room A/C, computers, and an electric stove element, and go from there. With a motorhome (even a type "B" rig that is a converted van), one can just use that and still have a functioning kitchen, refrigeration, hot showers, and the usual things needed even if there is no water or electricity available at the house.

    The best thing for a disaster is a small motorhome or campervan. Not just for bug-out reasons, but the ability to live comfortably for an indefinite amount of time until power and utilities are restored.

    [1]: RV-ers tend to use inverter generators. They are much quieter than the normal contractor type, and the inverter gives clean power output.

    1. Re:Having a RV helps somewhat... by hawguy · · Score: 2

      The best thing for a disaster is a small motorhome or campervan. Not just for bug-out reasons, but the ability to live comfortably for an indefinite amount of time until power and utilities are restored.

      Well indefinitely, or until you run out of propane for the heater and stove, fuel for the generator and fresh water.

    2. Re:Having a RV helps somewhat... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have a Honda 2500 watt generator that I bought used for about $200. It's been handy for a number of tasks over the years and kept my fridge cold and lights on during Sandy. It's not like my family would have starved without it, but with a cold fridge and a gas grill, we were able to have nice meals at home even without electric service. Most important, I refilled my gas cans, car, and propane tanks before the gas stations lost power.

      I made this same post here at the time and was labelled a "prepper". Lol.

  11. datacenters are vulnerable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...land based datacenters that is. If they were floating in the ocean they would just ride out the storm. Its like getting thrown clear of a car wreck when not wearing a seat belt.

    1. Re:datacenters are vulnerable by somersault · · Score: 1

      Its like getting thrown clear of a car wreck when not wearing a seat belt.

      Except without the windscreen/vehicles/pedestrians/the ground/buildings/trees impacting your face.. is not wearing your seatbelt seriously considered safer by some people? Give me a seatbelt and airbag to the face over being thrown down a road at 70mph anyday..

      --
      which is totally what she said
    2. Re:datacenters are vulnerable by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      As anyone who deals with marine equipment can tell you, salt water and electronics don't mix well.

    3. Re:datacenters are vulnerable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      wow, i thought that making two incredibly transparently stupid comments would have clued people in to sarcasm

    4. Re:datacenters are vulnerable by geekoid · · Score: 1

      And there are never raging storms on the ocean!

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  12. Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Medievalist · · Score: 1

    Tax dollars weren't used to relocate owners of expensive beachfront properties that washed away, instead they were used to rebuild the same beaches and homes.

    Which are already washing away again...

    Chris Christie stirred,
    Stared on the horses of the sea, and heard
    The cars of battle and his own name cried;
    And fought with the invulnerable tide.

    1. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 1

      Not really. Tax dollars aren't available to repair 2nd homes, and the amounts aren't really big enough to repair a high value home.

      The beaches are getting fixed, but that is the economic life blood of a coastal town.

    2. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Medievalist · · Score: 1

      If by "fixed" you mean the beaches are being "prepared for the next hurricane that will sweep them into the sea" then, yes!

      This sort of thing reminds me of the Great Stone Fleet.

      And all for naught. The waters pass--
      Currents will have their way;
      Nature is nobody's ally; 'tis well;
      The harbor is bettered-will stay.
      A failure, and complete,
      Was your Old Stone Fleet.

    3. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      just like tax dollars are used to rebuild the same homes in tornado alley

      why do people live in places where a mile in diameter spinning cloud destroys your town or city every few years?

    4. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by stenvar · · Score: 1

      Not really. Tax dollars aren't available to repair 2nd homes, and the amounts aren't really big enough to repair a high value home.

      Second homes are insured under the National Flood Insurance programs, just like first homes. Since that insurance is heavily subsidized, tax payers are paying for rebuilding these homes. Only starting in 2013 did owners of second homes even have to start paying higher premiums than owners of primary residences, but they are still paying way below market rates. Yes, this is a bailout for the wealthy.

    5. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 1

      Beach replenishment from the action of nor'easters is an annual or nearly so thing around here. In fact they generally do more damage than hurricanes. It's one of the the things your beach tag pays for.

      Not a big deal. Think Sisyphus,

      And no, Sandy was not a hurricane.

    6. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by geekoid · · Score: 1

      SO? if the beaches bring in more revenue then the cost of repairing the beach then what's the problem?

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    7. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Medievalist · · Score: 1

      "The problem" would be socialization of costs and privatization of profits.

      I pay for the beach rebuild, the people who are rebuilt (who are wealthier than I am) reap the profits, but my neighbors and I can't afford to visit the beaches anyway.
      Lather, rinse, repeat since the beaches are highly impermanent and might well move five miles inland over the next hundred years.

      Pretty typical post-Reagan economic setup, really.

      Chris Christie, Chris Christie
      Riding through the land
      Chris Christie, Chris Christie
      With his teabagger band
      He steals from the poor
      And gives to the rich
      Stupid bitch

    8. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by PolygamousRanchKid+ · · Score: 1

      Second homes are insured under the National Flood Insurance programs, just like first homes.

      I wonder how many second homes were suddenly declared first homes, after the storm?

      . . . and how about that boardwalk? Rebuilt, only to be burned down again in an . . . "accident", in the Tony Soprano sense of the word.

      When there's lots of federal money being handed out someone's going to find a way to take advantage of it.

      --
      Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
    9. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Medievalist · · Score: 1

      I don't generally see Sisyphus as a model for good governance. :)

      I'd happily help the people wiped out by Sandy relocate to safer ground. I'll help them load their belongings into trucks and give them money, too. But if they want to stay I don't think the government should force me to subsidize that decision. It's fundamentally unethical of them to take my money for such futile endeavors; especially when cheerleaders for rebuilding Hello, Governor Christie are ideologically opposed to spending tax dollars that might actually benefit actual poor people.

      Love the Laplace quote, BTW, makes a good sig.

    10. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most of those cities are around geographical items that move storms around them like bluffs and valleys that create a path of least resistance for the storms to travel away from the city. I have watched the national news report that my town was destroyed by a tornado when all that happened was a farmer 10 miles out of town had some damage to an old barn.

    11. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As someone who purchases insurance to cover all my properties and belongings, I find it objectionable that my tax dollars go to help anybody who chooses to live near the water.

    12. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Medievalist · · Score: 1

      As someone who purchases insurance to cover all my properties and belongings, I find it objectionable that my tax dollars go to help anybody who chooses to live near the water.

      That's a little too Ayn Rand for me. I'm OK with helping others as long as we're helping them get out of harm's way.
      Public assistance to relocate, but not to rebuild. If they insist on staying they can do it on their own dime.

    13. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As someone who purchases insurance to cover all my properties and belongings, I find it objectionable that my tax dollars go to help anybody who chooses to live near the water.

      Somewhere, right now, somebody is saying the exact same thing about people who choose to live in whatever area you're in, and with just as much justification.

    14. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by stenvar · · Score: 1

      Sure, people are going to do that.

      Also, NFIP is supposed to raise rates to require less tax payer money, but senators are already talking about how 20% increases are "unfair" and need to be delayed.

    15. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The worse part is, I am pretty sure these insurance subsidies were created in response to poor people losing everything, because they could only afford to live where that was a real risk (risk is something that drops property value, but if you don't own as much the risk is lower).

      Of course, now that you can get insured, wealthier people want to live there, and the poor are displaced anyway.

    16. Re:Government bailouts for the wealthy as usual. by GumphMaster · · Score: 1

      WTF is a "beach tag"?

      --
      Patent litigation: A doctrine of Mutually Assured Destruction... in which everyone seems willing to push the button
  13. Datacenter on the 17th floor by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

    I wonder if anybody is thinking twice about having a datacenter on the 17th floor of an office building, in a city by the ocean? Unless there is some specific need for you to be close to Wall Street, It's probably a good idea to make sure your servers are hosted where there is minimal likelihood of natural disasters, and also in a place that is easily serviceable from the ground. Although having it on the ground would have likely been worse in some cases, being a lot further inland where flooding is pretty much impossible would be even better.

    --

    Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    1. Re:Datacenter on the 17th floor by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 1

      How about redundant datacenters in two places that are both reasonably protected, well separated, and economical?

    2. Re:Datacenter on the 17th floor by silas_moeckel · · Score: 1

      So data centers no close to people. It really does not work, latency is often a huge issue. This means data centers need to be physically close it's a physics issue. Sure if your DC is just say doing offsite backup sure you could put it on the moon. The biggest issue was gen sets / fuel flooding this was from a post 9/11 fire code that stopped them from storing fuel where they traditionally did.

      If your solely running in any DC or area you have a serious issue. Certain requirements might necessitate close (sync replication without serious performance loss).

      --
      No sir I dont like it.
    3. Re:Datacenter on the 17th floor by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 1

      I'm still using a NYC data center for my VoIP termination, because it's the lowest latency to me, but I'm also now prepared to move that termination to another PoP if a superstorm approaches NYC again. Though, frankly we got hit harder here by Irene than most people did by Sandy.

      I was even thinking about it this summer - I've been told to expect ever-worsening hurricane seasons and this year was rather disappointing in that regard. I was quite glad to not have to deal with it, of course.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
    4. Re:Datacenter on the 17th floor by hawguy · · Score: 1

      I wonder if anybody is thinking twice about having a datacenter on the 17th floor of an office building, in a city by the ocean? Unless there is some specific need for you to be close to Wall Street, It's probably a good idea to make sure your servers are hosted where there is minimal likelihood of natural disasters, and also in a place that is easily serviceable from the ground. Although having it on the ground would have likely been worse in some cases, being a lot further inland where flooding is pretty much impossible would be even better.

      Depends what that datacenter is for. If you need it for day to day operations in that building, having the datacenter close to the employees that use it probably isn't a terrible idea. Just make sure you have a backup datacenter for the assets you need accessible outside the company (or needed for a skeleton crew to keep the company alive during a disaster)

    5. Re:Datacenter on the 17th floor by Megane · · Score: 1

      It's probably a good idea to make sure your servers are hosted where there is minimal likelihood of natural disasters

      That's one of the reasons why Rackspace started in San Antonio. Too far inland for hurricanes to be a problem, far enough south from Hurricane Alley for tornadoes not to be a problem, not in a seismically active zone, and no large bodies of water to cause storm surge flooding.

      --
      #naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }
    6. Re:Datacenter on the 17th floor by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      The reason many datacenters are so close to Wall Street is to minimize the round trip time for high speed trading purposes on the NYSE.

    7. Re:Datacenter on the 17th floor by russotto · · Score: 1

      The reason many datacenters are so close to Wall Street is to minimize the round trip time for high speed trading purposes on the NYSE.

      The NYSE datacenter is in Mahwah, NJ.

  14. So American centric by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    So many worse storm disasters have happened in the last few years, and people get worked up over Sandy?

    1. Re:So American centric by epyT-R · · Score: 0

      I'm sure sandy was nothing to people living elsewhere just as much as other storms aren't interesting to people living in the northeast US. It's not like slashdot doesn't cover other events in the world.

      I'm about sick of people crying 'american-centric'. It's just a shitty ad-hom generalization implying americans as myopic, like other countries and cultures aren't also loaded with it. Hey, it happened here, so it's news here. Deal with it.

  15. No. by epyT-R · · Score: 1

    Because the problem lies above me, with the move towards centralized control of everything. Power wouldn't've been a problem if the system was more decentralized. Same with communications. Cellphones were designed as dependent devices from the beginning, no p2p mode to be found. Same with the data centers. A lot less productivity would've been lost had people taken charge of their data instead of trusting 'the cloud' for everything.

    The rest of it is really just a case of shit happens. Most of the time, hurricanes aren't a big deal up here.. They knock some trees down and create a ruckus that is recovered from in a few days to a week or so, but that's about it.

  16. Sandy was second year in a row for many by kannibal_klown · · Score: 2

    The week before Halloween on 2011 we had a freak snow storm on the East Coast. It came in the middle of a MILD Fall so the leaves were still green-ish. It was a a lot of heavy snow... so trees and branches went down all over the north-East. New Jersey was without power for a while... my town was without for a week, many longer. No power meant no heat for many, so it was a cold week.

    A year later, almost to the week, was Sandy... just before Halloween 2012. Obviously Sandy was a lot worse for the coastal cities because the water crept in and the wind tore up the boardwalk... but further inland it was the same s**t different year. No power or heat for a over a week, loss of many services, etc. This one was a big more wide-spread though, and getting gasoline was a BIG PitA. But otherwise it was the same pain for those more inland.

    As an ex-boyscout I try to be ready for these things anyway... I have plenty of flashlights and batteries, canned food, a couple gallons of drinking water, a lighter to start the stove, warm clothes on-hand, etc. I was able to deal with mostly everything fine except the gasoline situation. After a week most of us were running low.

    1. Re:Sandy was second year in a row for many by c0d3g33k · · Score: 1

      You forgot Hurricane Irene, which came in August 2011 and did more damage in many areas than the freak Halloween snowstorm. A fair chunk of Connecticut was hit pretty hard because of the winds, since foliage was still on the trees in August. Flooding impacted pretty much the entire state of Vermont. The October snow storm was just icing on the cake. Sandy represented the triple-whammy for many in these regions, and the last straw for quite a few.

    2. Re:Sandy was second year in a row for many by silas_moeckel · · Score: 1

      It's still astounds me when neighbors have 0 prep. 30 days of food is just regular grocery shopping.

      --
      No sir I dont like it.
    3. Re:Sandy was second year in a row for many by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In inland South Jersey, Irene was way worse then Sandy.

    4. Re:Sandy was second year in a row for many by kannibal_klown · · Score: 1

      It's still astounds me when neighbors have 0 prep. 30 days of food is just regular grocery shopping.

      LOL, yeh. A bunch of canned food will last a while, and some other dried food, and you're good for a while.

    5. Re:Sandy was second year in a row for many by kannibal_klown · · Score: 1

      Yeh, that's true. I forgot to mention that... 2011 was a bad year. Fortunately my town (and the surrounding towns) weren't too bad... only out of power for 2 days. But maybe 10 miles West got slammed pretty hard somehow; some friends and co-workers were without for a week during that one too.

  17. Nothing serious... by OglinTatas · · Score: 4, Funny

    I still flirt with disaster, but I'm not looking for anything serious.

  18. I did stock my basement by GodfatherofSoul · · Score: 1

    I put a flashlight down there, batteries, a mattock to "break out" if necessary, and 2 cases of water. No food, but I figure if I'm down there that long, I've got bigger problems than eating.

    --
    I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
    1. Re:I did stock my basement by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Hint: Many disasters could mean up to a week without food. And said disaster may destroy your hours and not impact your basement, depending on what kind of basement you want.
      I would recommend getting some extra bean or chili and storing them down there. The bring up a few cans at a time. this way you have a rotation of things you are going to use anyways. Besides, two days without food will make you pretty weak and may compromise decision making.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    2. Re:I did stock my basement by hawguy · · Score: 1

      I put a flashlight down there, batteries, a mattock to "break out" if necessary, and 2 cases of water. No food, but I figure if I'm down there that long, I've got bigger problems than eating.

      A basement might not be the best place to stock supplies you may need after an earthquake or flooding.

    3. Re:I did stock my basement by GodfatherofSoul · · Score: 1

      Thanks for tip

      --
      I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
  19. Nope! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I live in tornado alley. Sandy was weaksauce

    1. Re:Nope! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sandy was infinitely worse. Wind is nothing compared to the damage of water.

    2. Re:Nope! by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Tornadoes can cause tremendous damage where they hit but they have a very small footprint compared to a storm like Sandy. Tornadoes will never approach the total damage of a Sandy but it still sucks if you happen to be in their narrow path.

  20. Winter Storm Atlas by Macgruder · · Score: 3, Informative

    Earlier this month Atlas struck the Black Hills of South Dakota. 4-8 inches of snow were forecast for the higher elevations (5000+ feet), but here on the foot hills at 3500', we got 31" of snow. It was a wet, heavy snow that snapped power lines and tree limbs. 60+ mph winds made for zero visability and took out a large number of power poles.

    Our little datacenter lost utility power Friday evening, and promptly switched to UPS, which had a lifespan of about 2 hours. Power was restored after 85 minutes, but the decision was made to power off all the servers in case we lost power again, with an eye towards starting recovery procedures in a day or two. The data center was restored to full functionality by Sunday noon, even though the businesses didn't re-open until Monday noon.

    We have a complete DR plan, so if the outage persisted for another day, we could have resumed operations at a sister site. The key takeaways here were backup validation for off-site replication, lines of communication between Operations and the affected managers, and validated, sequenced shut-down and power-on check-list. I was able to get on-site through the storm thanks to my big 4x4 and coordinate the shutdown and power-on processes. Without being onsite, we would have had some more challenges due to area wide loss of network connectivity.

    --
    I'm not crazy,I'm actively irresponsible.
    1. Re:Winter Storm Atlas by mjwalshe · · Score: 1

      You only had 2 hours fuel? of did the bad weather mean you could not have more tankered in. The standard for telecoms was 48 hours without power - from my 1948 era handbook of telecommunications.

    2. Re:Winter Storm Atlas by hawguy · · Score: 1

      Earlier this month Atlas struck the Black Hills of South Dakota. 4-8 inches of snow were forecast for the higher elevations (5000+ feet), but here on the foot hills at 3500', we got 31" of snow. It was a wet, heavy snow that snapped power lines and tree limbs. 60+ mph winds made for zero visability and took out a large number of power poles.

      Our little datacenter lost utility power Friday evening, and promptly switched to UPS, which had a lifespan of about 2 hours. Power was restored after 85 minutes, but the decision was made to power off all the servers in case we lost power again, with an eye towards starting recovery procedures in a day or two. The data center was restored to full functionality by Sunday noon, even though the businesses didn't re-open until Monday noon.

      We have a complete DR plan, so if the outage persisted for another day, we could have resumed operations at a sister site. The key takeaways here were backup validation for off-site replication, lines of communication between Operations and the affected managers, and validated, sequenced shut-down and power-on check-list. I was able to get on-site through the storm thanks to my big 4x4 and coordinate the shutdown and power-on processes. Without being onsite, we would have had some more challenges due to area wide loss of network connectivity.

      Let your UPS tell the servers when to shut down when the batteries get low -- you can script any shutdown sequence you need. Then you don't have only 2 hours to drive your big 4x4 through 31 inches of snow and 60mph winds and risk becoming someone that needs to be rescued.

    3. Re:Winter Storm Atlas by Macgruder · · Score: 1

      It wasn't an issue of fuel. We don't have a generator, just a large bank of batteries.

      --
      I'm not crazy,I'm actively irresponsible.
    4. Re:Winter Storm Atlas by Macgruder · · Score: 1

      In theory, that's exactly what should happen. In practice, it's a little more problematic as the servers are doing various things and we need to ensure that those processes exit gracefully before the server closes down.

      --
      I'm not crazy,I'm actively irresponsible.
    5. Re:Winter Storm Atlas by Isaac-Lew · · Score: 1

      Were the communcation/data lines down? If they weren't, why not shut the servers down remotely?

  21. I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by EmagGeek · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Sandy did not change my view of disasters. I still remain prepared for disaster, and when stuff looks like it is going to happen, I use my brain instead of burying my head in the sand and thinking things like "oh it won't happen to me" or "oh well Government will be there to save me," which is exactly what happened in New York.

    The entire city lived in a state of denial leading up to Sandy, and continued to live in that state for a week afterward, even having the nerve to attempt to hold the NYC marathon despite there being people in need of the resources that were being used for it. Marathon organizers had generators, clean water, gasoline, and everything they wanted, while thousands of people all over the city had no power, no water, and no means of transportation out of the city.

    Mayor Bloomberg is a disgrace.

    1. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      butbutbut YES WE CAN!!

    2. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by geekoid · · Score: 1

      SO it's the Mayors fault people weren't prepared?
      Or was it his fault he didn't forcible take other peoples stuff to reallocate as he saw fit?
      Or is it his caulk some people want to continue with their lives, but then decided not to do the marathon?
      OR maybe you are a hater ass?

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    3. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by silas_moeckel · · Score: 1

      They are city dwellers, living that dense never makes sense.

      My disaster shopping lists have been crafting supplies for my GF and stocking up on gas. Mostly because neither of those two things will keep in my home. Crafting supplies get used up and gas goes bad quickly.

      --
      No sir I dont like it.
    4. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It is the Mayor's fault the city did nothing to prepare.

      It is the Mayor's fault the city did nothing to respond.

      It is the Mayor's fault for misallocating city resources to benefit the image of the City rather than the citizens of the city. The resources the marathon organizers had (generators, etc) were property of the city. They were the Mayor's to take as necessary.

      I am a New Yorker. I was there. The way the city handled it was criminal.

    5. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      I respond with popcorn and a TV on CNN. I like watching humanity get stunned when multi-century cities get clobbered with multi-century storms. Or flood plains. Or earthquakes.

      Welcome to Nashville, a city waiting to die, with crappy earthquake standards even though that's the region with the most violent earthquakes in the continental US.

      Ready to pop! (the popcorn)

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    6. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      Sandy did not change my view of disasters. I still remain prepared for disaster, and when stuff looks like it is going to happen, I use my brain instead of burying my head in the sand and thinking things like "oh it won't happen to me" or "oh well Government will be there to save me," which is exactly what happened in New York.

      This. Here in the Pacific Northwest, we face the risk of earthquakes regularly, we have our usual winter storms, we have our volcanoes... Sandy didn't change anything for me. I was prepared before, I'm prepared now. (In fact, my RV battery expires next quarter, so I'm off to get a new one when I go shopping later this afternoon.)

      New York, like most of the East Coast north of the Chesapeake, hadn't had a major disaster threaten in a generation or been hit with one in even longer. They don't live on the hurricane coast, or in tornado alley, or in earthquake country, or... well, they simply don't face the routine threats the rest of us do. That lulled them when it came to non-routine threats.

    7. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by WuphonsReach · · Score: 1

      NHC did a poor job of communicating, which led to city officials like Bloomberg playing down the storm as close as 48h prior to landfall. The problem was that Sandy didn't fit the classic definition of a hurricane, even though we had 75-80kt winds over a few hundred mile wide path. So while everyone is running around saying "it's not a hurricane", it still packed those 75-80kt winds and had a very large storm surge.

      We were without power for about 7 days on Long Island, and it took close to three weeks for gas lines to subside. Even with filling up my tank a day or two prior to the storm, I was having trouble getting gas 10 days later.

      Fortunately, we still had water & gas at home, so cooking / bathing was not an issue.

      --
      Wolde you bothe eate your cake, and have your cake?
    8. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Probably not his caulk. More likely it's his urethane foam.

    9. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sandy what? The OP is written as if there's something significant about a fairly generic name. WTF is wrong with /. lately...

    10. Re:I treat disaster exactly the same as I did by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The weather isn't that abnormal. Storms like those in Europe happen every twenty years or so. Sandy was such an unusual event that we don't have data on frequency but ordinary hurricanes will hit New York from time to time.

      The major changes are that cities keep getting larger so more people are affected. Assets increase in value so the damage bills and insurance keep going up. Our systems are more complex so the problems gets bigger. We have become more dependant on them working reliably all the time that we are at a loss when they don't and expect the government to take care of them. And we have been skimping on infrastructure maintenance for 40 years because governments are spending more money on welfare, health, education etc.

      After the bushfires around Sydney people were complaining that the government will no longer pay them welfare. Not because their houses were damaged in the fires but because they went and stayed with a relative for a night or the pizza and ice cream in their freezer spoiled while the power was off! The old government did and so the new government must too.

  22. Re:It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on ea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Summary is misleading.

    Was it really misleading, or did your ability to assume really stoop to that level of ignorance in thinking there are actually lung-breathers here on earth who think a storm is large enough to escape the very atmosphere it thrives in to damage an object in orbit...

    ...and that said lung-breathers congregate here.

    Thanks. Appreciate that.

  23. Florida Checking In by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We are totally befuddled that anyone is still even mentioning Sandy. It was a MINOR storm. Sure, New Jersey had a lot of flooding, but Sandy was nothing! Ask anyone in New Orleans, Sandy was NOTHING!

    The only indirectly interesting thing about Sandy is that there hasn't been a larger storm since, as would be normal.

    Meanwhile, has anyone heard about Typhoon Phailin? If they have, it certainly seems like no fucks were given.

    1. Re:Florida Checking In by gmuslera · · Score: 1

      If something of the dimension of Phailin hits US, it won't hit just one big city. We all live in only one planet, extreme weather will hit every place eventually. And most people don't care about the causes, there is profit still to be made, lets worry about that later.

    2. Re:Florida Checking In by hamburger+lady · · Score: 1

      65 billion worth of damage aint 'minor'.

      --

      ---
      Is this the MPAA? Is this the RIAA? Is this the DMCA? I thought it was the USA!
    3. Re:Florida Checking In by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      65 billion worth of damage aint 'minor'.

      It is not a minor loss, but it was a minor storm.

      The real issue is that there was an extensive failure to exercise due care. This resulted in massive losses to a MINOR storm.

    4. Re:Florida Checking In by hamburger+lady · · Score: 1

      if there was a loss that big, then it's a major storm. you can't point to its second largest cost in US history and call it 'minor'. storms are much more than merely the measure of their top wind speed.

      besides, at one point she had a windfield of roughly 1200 miles, the largest in atlantic basin history. right before landfall the total energy in her tropical storm-force windfield was higher than in any atlantic storm in the last 40 years+. that's a big fuckin' deal.

      come on. it was clearly a major storm.

      --

      ---
      Is this the MPAA? Is this the RIAA? Is this the DMCA? I thought it was the USA!
  24. Re:It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on ea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Summary is misleading.

    Was it really misleading, or did your ability to assume really stoop to that level of ignorance in thinking there are actually lung-breathers here on earth who think a storm is large enough to escape the very atmosphere it thrives in to damage an object in orbit...

    ...and that said lung-breathers congregate here.

    Thanks. Appreciate that.

    Go home Aqua Man you're drunk.

  25. Re:It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on ea by Rxke · · Score: 1

    even worse, Enterpise isn't even a real shuttle, it's a full scale glorified mock up, to do glider tests et. c.

  26. Not really by gravis777 · · Score: 1

    Disaster recovery was already part of our operations. When Sandy hit, it took out a couple of branches for a few days, but operations were just DRed over to other geographic areas. We have fiber cuts all the time, and traffic just gets rerouted or DRed to another area.

    Pretty much when Sandy hit, everything happened exactly as it was supposed to.

  27. disasters approach me differently by Zecheus · · Score: 2

    Since Sandy, disasters don't approach me at all, actually....Its been about 12 months now, I think, since I was last approached by a disaster. They have given up I think.

  28. Hurricanes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We have hurricanes (there is no such thing as a "superstorm") here in North Carolina all the time. When Hugo hit, we did not get a $50 billion aid package (We *only* got 1 billion). When Fran hit, we did not get a $50 billion aid package. When Floyd hit, we did not get a $50 billion aid package. All three storms were way more powerful and devastating than not-so-superstorm Sandy. By the way, since when did Alaska become part of New York since $150 million of that "aid" bill went to Alaska. We had less deaths too because people actually evacuate when they are told to.

    1. Re:Hurricanes by SternisheFan · · Score: 1
      With Sandy it wasn't so much the rain and wind that the New York/New Jersey area wasn't prepared for, it was the flooding, and power outages that devasted the area. 8-12 foot storm surge knocking buildings off foundations was commonplace. Some homeowners near the ocean are now rebuilding with 15 foot high foundations. Gas stations had gas, but no power for the pumps (no generator backup). Power was mostly back after 2 weeks time, though I saw near fighting over spots on gas lines as people in SUVs waited hoping a tanker truck would arrive soon.

      For this area it was an overdue storm (1938 was the last bad flood event here), and for decades people lived as if the area would never have high flooding again. The question is, will we be prepared next time, or will people forget the past?

    2. Re:Hurricanes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In NC, government aid is a no-no, no? Regardless, NC is not New York. To compare them is idiotic.

    3. Re:Hurricanes by damicatz · · Score: 1

      There was flooding with Floyd. Massive flooding.

      Gas shortages could have been dealt with by eliminating "price gouging" laws (which really amounts to government theft of private property) and letting the price adjust for the lack of supply. It would have discouraged people from buying gas they didn't need (and where, pray tell, are you planning on driving to when no place has power and the roads are all closed).

    4. Re:Hurricanes by SternisheFan · · Score: 1
      I can only speak to what I witnessed locally in L.I., and on the local cable news reporting. In the towns of Mastic Beach/Shirley, I saw guys selling 5 gallon cans of gas for $100 a couple days after the storm, with buyers who felt they needed the gas (They must not have known that there were unaffected towns north of the area where stations were open.), Some gas stations in L.I. and N.Y.C. were found and prosecuted afterward for price gouging. Then there was a local cable News12 story of one gas station owner in Deer Park who had his employees use a handpump to sell gas to his customers, not ever thinking of raising the price. So, some people panicked when they realized their normal routine was upset, most others realized that life would eventually resume normally.

      And the storm did seem to pick and choose areas to damage. In the beaches closer to NYC/NJ area there was devastation, while in L.I.'s more eastern town of Southampton, the storm actually improved Coopers Beach, adding sand and widening the beach area. (Coopers Beach was voted the best beach in the NY area for summer 2013 on websites that determine yearly beach quality, since beaches in NJ and NYC took such a beating from Sandy.)

      So, while some areas near to the ocean sustained major flood damage (NYC had major basement and subway flooding in lower Manhattan, subway tube 'plugs' and a costly levee system for lower Manhattan are being evaluated now), for the majority of the area it was like most hurricanes here, basically another windy rain, and some longer than normal power outages. Very little loss of life because of Sandy. If your home was affected, it's a costly and a difficult process to rebuild, an inherant risk to living near an ocean.

  29. A Subject That Robotics Can Help by LifesABeach · · Score: 1

    DARPA X-Prize Project, build a multi use robot that can dismantle a Red Tagged home. Not demolish, dismantle. Pile everything up, neatly. Personal items in a pile. Building supplies in another. Because everyone knows what's going to happen When OSH, Lowe's, and Home Depot opens in the morning. Why not make this a War College exercise. And how does one dismantle a home one nail at a time? I hear that Katrina, and Sandy may have some interesting test sites here and there.

    Another thing, with 10 million under employed, or out of work engineers in America; that they can't figure this out? One word, Blender3D.

    1. Re:A Subject That Robotics Can Help by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Another thing, with 10 million under employed, or out of work engineers in America; that they can't figure this out? One word, Blender3D.

      Holy crap! That many? Wow. Not to be rude, because I am actually curious, but source, please.

      DARPA X-Prize Project, build a multi use robot that can dismantle a Red Tagged home. Not demolish, dismantle. Pile everything up, neatly. Personal items in a pile. Building supplies in another. Because everyone knows what's going to happen When OSH, Lowe's, and Home Depot opens in the morning. Why not make this a War College exercise. And how does one dismantle a home one nail at a time? I hear that Katrina, and Sandy may have some interesting test sites here and there.

      Interesting idea, not gonna happen, but still interesting.
      I think recycling lumber can be bad. You would have to change how you build with it as compared to new lumber.
      One nail at a time...i prefer screws partly because it can be taken apart easier.
      Do you think i could red tag the home of that neighbor i don't like, ya know, in theory.

    2. Re:A Subject That Robotics Can Help by LifesABeach · · Score: 1

      Various sources, in Google I checked "number of H1B visias", and "number of outsourced engineering jobs", the following data floated up:
      The number of H1B visa holders currently are 3,063,863, from the USCIS.
      Total number of U.S. jobs outsourced in 2011 2,273,392

      I'll stick with the statistic of "Over 10 million under employed, and out of work engineers." And I can't think of a single argument to bring these jobs back; except, supporting businesses that do business in america that do outsource is not helping americans.

  30. Preparations by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 1

    Over the past two years I lost power for about 4 weeks.

    The last two weeks were miserable because it happened in early November when the weather was cold.

    So I spent about 5k for a good multi-fuel generator and installation of a manual transfer switch. So now a prolonged grid outage will at least not leave me freezing in the dark.

    1. Re:Preparations by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Renewed my view the government help sucks and they will gather around any fix of damage to show how great they are, of-course for self-serving reasons like elections.
      Personal minor changes, just a few.
      1. All old flashlights history, now led, very low power so less batterys needed.
      2. My first generator and it's not run by gasoline, can't trust having gas stations open. No fridge for a week last time sucked.
      3. Got me a 12V DC cooler, good to use year-round.
      4. Car battery inverter to charge and run some small stuff if gasoline available.
      5. Wrote a note on generator box, in-case of emergency, buy 3X more beer, soda and goodies than last time.
      6. Still saving for small solar charging array, enough power for one car type battery.
      7. Heat ? Not sure yet what best to do.

    2. Re:Preparations by berashith · · Score: 1

      heat = gas powered water heater. I have done it before, in a different home than current, and it worked great. The water heater stayed available, so I would fill one gallon milk containers with hot water, and keep that under the blanket that I had wrapped around me while i sat. If you keep enough of these going, and hang blankets in the doors, you can keep a room far warmer than it would be.

      I realized this was working as I had a pet lizard, and was keeping his cage heated this way. He had a thermometer and I was keeping a close eye on it, and by the second day of freezing and no power I realized that he was living the good life, so I adapted it to me.

      I currently have a tankless water heater, which is likely a disadvantage in this scenario, and have the desire to put it on a small solar set up as it pulls a very small amount of power and having it never turn off would be a great help. I also have a gas stove/oven , and it uses electricity for thermostats and lighting, so I want to run it on solar also.

    3. Re:Preparations by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 1

      The thing I was most afraid of was the weather getting cold enough to freeze pipes.

      I don't think the hot water bottles would be enough in that case.

    4. Re:Preparations by berashith · · Score: 1

      yikes. I guess I dont have to deal with that often enough to really consider it in my plans. Im in Atlanta, and it may get cold enough 3 or 4 times a year that we have to let the water slowly drip to avoid freezing pipes. If there is no heat, then maybe 2 or 3 taps will be set to drip to make sure nothing freezes. Im not naive enough to think that this strategy will survive in places that actually get cold

  31. Reply to title by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No, I live in Florida, we live differently after Andrew.

  32. Re:It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on ea by CaptainLard · · Score: 1

    Not to mention, how many "storms of the century" have there been in the past 5 years?

  33. Datacenter Geography by neorush · · Score: 1

    I have several customers on long island, and my customers were some of the quickest to recover (they just had to get themselves back online) as all data and POS systems are in the cloud. I keep 3 separate geographic locations of server clusters and a fourth backup at our office. Those IT guys who think data centers / companies are infallible have not been around long enough to see a data center go under financially, or have servers raided because the police don't understand what a virtual server means. Much less an actual natural disaster. IMHO there is very little reason to be 'down' these days, with on demand services from rackspace and S3, it just takes proper planning.

    --
    neorush
  34. Re:It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on ea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Summary is misleading.

    Was it really misleading, or did your ability to assume really stoop to that level of ignorance in thinking there are actually lung-breathers here on earth who think a storm is large enough to escape the very atmosphere it thrives in to damage an object in orbit...

    ...and that said lung-breathers congregate here.

    Thanks. Appreciate that.

    Go home Aqua Man you're drunk.

    Of course he's drunk! How would YOU like to be a super hero that pretty can only swim real fast and get fish to school

    Super Villain: "Oh Look! Aquaman is getting a bunch of squid to school together! Oh no! Quick, get the Italian breading, hot oil and tomato sauce! He's going to kill us with Calamari!

    What next Aquaman?! Are you going to get Sea Squirts to squirt at us?! We're sooooo scared! Bweahahahahahahahahahahahaha"

    And he wears Orange and Green?! Not BLUE and green - ya know - SEA COLORS?!

    Poor bastard!

    At least the Invisible Man got to do it with Wonder Woman AND Superman at the same time!

  35. No. Move. by pla · · Score: 1

    No. No, I don't view disaster differently, because I choose to live in one of the majority of places in the US that don't tend to get life-threatening disasters.

    No, because I don't live in a backfilled coastal flood plain and then cry to FEMA when my McMansion gets washed away.
    I don't live in tornado alley. I don't live in earthquake central. I don't live on the downslope side of the Rockies.

    Once a century a hurricane will come close enough to tear a few shingles off the roof. Once a decade a blizzard or ice storm will knock out power for a day or two. And... That about covers the serious local disasters.

    If you can't say the same - Move. Simple as that, really.

  36. London by novium · · Score: 1

    The storm that hit London does not even begin to compare to Sandy or other disasters. I don't know about you guys, but I don't count a storm that mostly doesn't more than inconvenience people (yes, I know, a few people died from having trees fall on them, but c'mon, that's more of a freak accident than anything.) There was a lot of bitching about disrupted commutes- not even entirely disrupted, just made more difficult- but man, I'm of the opinion that disasters require major consequences. If it's just business as usual, it's not really a disaster. It's just a shitty thing.

  37. Re:It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on ea by cold+fjord · · Score: 1

    It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on earth
    Summary is misleading.

    It is pretty "rare" for oceanic / atmospheric events to reach into space. Besides, all of the space shuttles are decommissioned.

    --
    much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
  38. Re:It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on ea by quacking+duck · · Score: 2

    Although that's what Enterprise ended up being, the original intention was to refit Enterprise to be fully spaceflight-capable, but changes to design specs during the late 70s meant a teardown and rebuild was too costly.

    So we have the irony where Star Trek fans successfully campaigned to rename the first shuttle, which ended up never actually going into space.

  39. Not here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I live in Arizona, this place is filled with datacenters for a damn good reason and any company who puts their DC in a place where natural disaster has a great chance of occurring is utterly stupid. The only thing we have to worry about is flash floods and an extremely, extremely unlikely tornado(never really had one here but they say it can happen).

    http://www.crisishq.com/why-prepare/us-natural-disaster-map/

    If you put your DC in a place that is at risk on the above map you deserve to be wiped out. Just poor foresight by upper level management for DR planning...

  40. A storm finally hits the folks on the east coast t by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You want to know if anything is going to change, now that you finally get what everyone else has been saying? Nope. Don't need to change, we are already prepared. Hopefully, people in the area hit by Sandy have been busy planning, drilling, and preparing.

  41. If you want a datacenter to be disaster-proof... by couchslug · · Score: 1

    Build an elevated, reinforced concrete shell around it. Have proper sump pumps etc for seepage, have doors you can seal, and bunker down. Build it tough enough and no storm surge will bother it, but you might lose your connectivity to the outside world.
    Bunker tech isn't rocket surgery. Lose the idea that conventional structures will protect your stuff, build bunkers with internal systems (such as ISO containerised data centers) you can upgrade relatively easily, and you are protected.
    Don't build weak support systems, or you get "Fukushima". There is zero reason that whole plant couldn't have been built like the German U-boat pens at St Nazaire except that it wasn't built for safety.

    --
    "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
  42. I never even noticed there was a big storm by tifkap · · Score: 1

    I Live in Amsterdam, and on this faithfull day I just looked out of the window to see if the weather was passable. So when I got on my bicycle and drove to the other end of town, everything looked more or less ok.

    Ok, a tree fell on the spot i was just 6 seconds before, but all in all it was no big biggy (I've seen much worse). People weren't blown from their bikes, and no dogs where blown in the river.

    Only when I arrived in the office did I found out that there was officially a 'code red', and that all my coworkers has decided to work from home. I still think people are overreacting.

    1. Re:I never even noticed there was a big storm by Anubis+IV · · Score: 1

      Having been in a number of large hurricanes while living in Florida (including Andrew, back in 1992, which was at the time the costliest natural disaster to have ever hit America), I can attest to the fact that your experience is fairly typical. That said, you always have to be careful. The situation can change fairly rapidly, particularly if you're at the eye of the storm. Every time a major hurricane would go through, you'd hear stories about people that decided to go outside and wander around as the eye went overhead, thinking the storm had passed, only to get stranded outside when the other side of the eye's wall slammed into them, sometimes with fatal consequences. While you won't get blown around most of the time, a relatively light object traveling at a decent speed can kill you instantly if it hits you just right, and there tend to be more and more of those sorts of things getting dislodged and moving around as the winds increase in speed.

  43. Re:No. Move. by SleazyRidr · · Score: 1

    Inquiring minds want to know: where exactly in the country do you live?

  44. Scheduled maintenance breaks first by fritsd · · Score: 1

    Well, for starters, Jared Diamond wrote a fascinating book about it called "Collapse". It's a more popular-scientific expansion of the scientific work of Joseph Tainter "The Collapse of Complex Societies" (but I've never tried to read that).

    Basically, IIRC, the first point where you notice that your society is in collapse, is that long-term regular maintenance of infrastructure isn't done anymore. For example, in Nîmes in a dry part of France, the Romans built a large aquaduct. But aquaducts need to be maintained, otherwise the kettle stone (limestone) and moss clogs up the flow over the years.

    Being in the periphery of the empire, Nîmes faired probably a lot better than central Rome, but when the aquaduct was no longer maintained, less people probably wanted to live there.

    --
    To be, or not to be: isn't that quite logical, Slashdot Beta?
  45. Re:It damaged a decommissioned space shuttle on ea by FatLittleMonkey · · Score: 1

    It's just been that sort of century.

    --
    Science is all about firing a drunk pig out of a cannon just to see what happens.
  46. Sandy meant very little to me. by pecosdave · · Score: 1

    After a human invoked disaster and then Hurricane Ike causing me to lose most everything I had of value twice in a five year period I approach life differently in general.

    I am adopting a less hard-core version of the Buddhist "we become slaves to our possessions" philosophy. I've always believed in durable, simple, usable things, I use a cast iron skillet for about 75% of my cooking for example. I used to have a lot of books and physical media. I'm starting to use digital media, if I lose all of my physical belongings I can buy a new Kindle and get most of my books back, buy a new just about anything thanks to Google Play and have all of my music back, I would still be missing 95% of my movies, the prevalence UltraViolet and Amazon video being included with a bunch of my new disks will save a few of those. I've been ripping my disk and putting them on a local hard drive for years, I'm considering a "disk to digital" service so I don't have to worry about movies anymore. I've actually been giving my books away over the past couple of years and even reducing my tech junk laying about that I'm not using.

    After the theft and the flood I'm now expecting the fire. When it comes I want it to have minimal impact. I want to buy new clothes, a few electronic devices and continue on. "The cloud" is how I intend to make that happen. My data is my most valuable possession. I need to get my pictures uploaded somewhere - thanks for making me think of that.

    Once I get to where I want to be data backup wise with the exception vehicles which have escaped the past disasters, $5,000 to $10,000 should be enough to get me everything I really want and need. I just got married last weekend to someone who does not share in my reduced physical goods philosophy - so my estimates are based on a few months ago thinking. (considering I adopted the mindset a couple of years after the last disaster I'm not setting a good enough example, I haven't been wiped out since Ike). We'll see where that takes us.

    --
    The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
  47. Re:If you want a datacenter to be disaster-proof.. by isorox · · Score: 1

    Build an elevated, reinforced concrete shell around it. Have proper sump pumps etc for seepage, have doors you can seal, and bunker down. Build it tough enough and no storm surge will bother it, but you might lose your connectivity to the outside world.

    Well you won't get flooded, but a normal data centre on the 17th floor won't get flooded (or if a flood does get 170' above sea level there's bigger problems)

    However when you run out of fuel, that's a lot of steps to climb with buckets of fuel.

    http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2012/11/se-podcast-36-we-got-hit-by-a-hurricane/

  48. Not so differently by timdubs · · Score: 1

    My company's email went from Exchange to Office 365 and we gave Amazon a lot of money for offsite backups. We also have a generator and a few hundred feet of extension cable now. At home, it just meant we bought some bottled water and Sterno. Aside from that, business as usual

  49. Re:No. Move. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If EVERYONE followed your advice, you'd suddenly have 200 million new neighbors...

    So where do you live exactly? (City or town level is close enough so I can start shopping)

  50. Betteridge's law of headlines by neminem · · Score: 1

    Obligatory: no.

    But seriously, no, I don't, and while I'm not in IT, I don't think my company does either? (But we're in a totally different geographic location - we've *always* had to worry about earthquakes, and to a lesser extent, fires, but not really hurricanes.)

  51. Re:No. Move. by pla · · Score: 1

    Inquiring minds want to know: where exactly in the country do you live?

    About 400 miles North of where Sandy obliterated. Within an hour of two cities. But my specific location by no means counts as unique.

    Most of the US doesn't have the problems we hear about in the disaster-porn loving news reports. Just an hour inland from the coasts, not in the 100 year flood plain, and not living on the banks of an "engineered" river protects you from most "wet" damage - Except, that relatively tiny sliver of land framing the country contains 39% of the population (according to the 2010 census). Not in "tornado alley" doesn't mean you'll never see a tornado, but the rest of the country gets much smaller ones, and only rarely. Not in California (really, only a small fraction of it) means you laugh about "the big (3.5) one" around the water cooler rather than having a reinforced shelter-core in your house.

    The US has a truly staggering amount of places with weather you would call "boring". People just seem to want to pack in to the places with the most volatile climates.

  52. Dumb AS A Rock by b4upoo · · Score: 1

    Usually i would advise people to avoid anything considered knowledge in Florida. After all, if you can't even run fair elections how smart can you be? But one thing that we in Florida do know is hurricanes. And having just watched national new showing Breezy Point in the area smacked by Sandy it is obvious that they are screwing up big time.
                          First stick built homes are no good in hurricanes. Any home in a storm zone needs lots of really good concrete. You do not put an overhang on a roof more than a few inches. In order too keep a roof on a home you simply must not have much overhang. Items like large double doors are a disaster as are large windows. The windows that you do have should be made of storm proof glass . Doors should be small and strong. The sand barriers they are packing up between them and the sea will often be as much of a negative as a positive. We see homes filled to the ceiling with sand after storms. With large waves the sand simply adds to the weight of the wave. If there is anything left of the sand barrier after a few waves it may well stop water from draining back into the sea.
                        The beach area is probably best built with a lower floor designed to blow out in a storm which leaves the second floor standing on concrete supports. I noted that several home owners elevated their new homes by 14 feet. Frankly 20 feet would be better and 30 feet better yet. We have seen storms where people floated out of third floor windows when a storm surge strikes.
                        I have lived in Florida for 60 years and went though many storms. One mistake is to think that you know about storms. Storms are each unique and can do things you would never think they can do. But i can tell you that the storm that hit Breezy Point was so mild by our standards that when younger I actually enjoyed motorcycling and even bicycle rides in stronger winds. Until winds get above 130 mph I rarely pay any attention at all and usually enjoy the heavy rains.

  53. European storm by manu0601 · · Score: 1

    European storms have nothing to do with US east coast hurricanes. The later appear in a warm ocean, typically in tropical zone, and move toward to the poles. Europe has no southern tropical ocean and therefore cannot ever have this kind of hurricanes.

  54. OK, this is damn epic stupid, and here's why... by HomerNet · · Score: 1

    Let's review:

    * November 7–11, 1913 – The Great Lakes Storm of 1913 claims 19 ships and more than 250 lives.
    * October 4, 1914 - The Burdur earthquake was centered near Lake Burdur in southwestern Turkey and the mainshock and subsequent fire destroyed more than 17,000 homes, and caused 2,344 casualties.
    * January 13, 1915 – An earthquake in Avezzano, Italy, registering 6.8 on the Richter scale kills more than 29,000
    * July 1–12, 1916 – At least one shark mauls 5 swimmers along 80 miles (130 km) of New Jersey coastline during the Jersey Shore shark attacks of 1916, resulting in 4 deaths and the survival of one youth who requires limb amputation.
    * May 21, 1917 – Over 300 acres (73 blocks) are destroyed in the Great Atlanta fire of 1917.
    * January, 1918 – 1918 flu pandemic: "Spanish 'flu" (influenza) first observed in Haskell County, Kansas.
    * January 15, 1919, - Boston Molasses Disaster: A wave of molasses released from an exploding storage tank sweeps through Boston, Massachusetts, killing 21 and injuring 150.
    * February 20, 1920 - Gori earthquake: An earthquake hits Gori in the Democratic Republic of Georgia, killing 114.
    * 1921 - Russian famine: Roughly 5,000,000 people die.
    * January 13, 1922 – The flu epidemic has claimed 804 victims in Britain.
    * July 10, 1923 – Large hailstones kill 23 in Rostov, Soviet Union.
    * July 10, 1924 – Large hailstones kill 23 in Rostov, Soviet Union.
    * February 28, 1925 – The 1925 Charlevoix-Kamouraska earthquake strikes northeastern North America.
    * October 20, 1926 – A hurricane kills 650 in Cuba.
    * February 14, 1927 – An earthquake in Yugoslavia kills 100.
    * February 12, 1928 – Heavy hail kills 11 in England.
    * November 18, 1929 – 1929 Grand Banks earthquake.
    * November 25, 1930 - An earthquake in the Izu Peninsula of Japan kills 223 people and destroys 650 buildings.
    * February 3, 1931 – Hawke's Bay earthquake: Much of the New Zealand city of Napier is destroyed in an earthquake measuring 7.9 on the Richter scale.
    * March 21, 1932 – A series of deadly tornadoes in the south kills more than 220 people in Alabama, 34 people in Georgia, and 17 in Tennessee during a two-day period.
    * March 3, 1933 - A powerful earthquake and tsunami hit Honsh, Japan, killing approximately 3,000 people.
    * May 11, 1934 – Dust Bowl in North America: A strong 2-day dust storm removes massive amounts of Great Plains topsoil in one of the region's worst dust storms.
    * April 14, 1935 - Black Sunday, a particularly severe dust storm, was one of the worst dust storms in American history and it caused immense economic and agricultural damage. It is estimated to have displaced 300 thousand tons of topsoil from the Prairie area in the US.
    * March 17 – March 18, 1936 – St. Patrick's Day Flood: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, suffers the worst flooding in its history.
    * May 6, 1937 – Hindenburg disaster: In the United States, the German airship Hindenburg bursts into flame when mooring to a mast in Lakehurst, New Jersey. Of the 36 passengers and 61 crew on board, 13 passengers and 22 crew die, as well as one member of the ground crew.
    * February 6, 1938 – Black Sunday at Bondi Beach, Sydney, Australia: 300 swimmers are dragged out to sea in 3 freak waves; 80 lifesavers save all but 5.
    * January 13, 1939 – Black Friday: 71 people die across Victoria in one of Australia's worst ever bush fires.
    * November, 1940 - The Armistice Day Blizzard (or the Armistice Day Storm) took place in the Midwest region of the United States on 11 November (Armistice Day) and 12 November 1940. The intense early-season "Panhandle hook" winter storm cut a 1,000-mile-wide (1600 km) path through the middle of the country from Kansas to Michigan. A total of 145 deaths were blamed on the storm.
    * April 15, 1941 - Colima earthquake
    * November 28, 1942 - Cocoanut Grove Fire
    * February 27, 1943 - Smith Mine Disaster
    * D

    --
    I have no tag line
  55. "In the time since, the U.S. hasn't faced..." by Anubis+IV · · Score: 1

    In the time since, the U.S. hasn't faced a storm with Sandy's combination of power and placement

    Am I the only one bothered by this line? The implication is clearly that Sandy was a monstrous storm that has gone unrivaled in the time since it swept through New York City. Sure, that's technically correct, but it gives the wrong impression, since Sandy was actually a fairly middling hurricane, and both the 2012 and 2013 hurricane seasons have been extraordinarily tame. Were the 2013 season ANY other season from the past decade, the summary's statement would be false, since we would have seen hurricanes of greater strength since Sandy. From 2003 to 2011 we had at least two Cat 4 or higher storms each year (except 2009, when we had just one), and then in 2012 we only had only two Cat 3 storms, of which Sandy was one, followed up by the 2013 season which has only had two Cat 1 storms (making it the tamest season in decades, I'd wager, though I only checked as far back as 2002).

    Sandy was remarkable, to be sure, but it was not because it was a powerful storm. It was a perfectly ordinary one like dozens of others in the past decade, with its only unusual trait being that it just happened to hit the wrong spot. A Floridian living in a house that's built to code wouldn't even bat an eye at a Cat 3 like Sandy unless the eye was heading straight overhead (at which point they might evacuate). New York is clearly not designed to handle hurricanes like Florida is however, and that's the only thing that made Sandy particularly interesting. It wasn't its power. It was simply its placement.

  56. disaster preparedness by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Since the two major storms mentioned that affected the northeastern part of the USA (derecho followed by Sandy) I've laid in extra fuel for the
    Yamaha quiet-run generator I bought 3 years ago, and installed a secondary water storage system with 350 gallons of water for showering and flushing. I use a deep well pump normally, which has it's own power drop a quarter mile from the house. It would take a substantial generator to power the deep well pump, 220V and 20 Amps. Plus being not visible from the house it would be very stealable.

    So now there's a plastic 350 gallon tank and a small pump in the sub-basement, which the generator can power when needed for a shower and flushing. You can't imagine what a luxery a hot shower is in the midst of a disaster! It gives you the strength to go on to accomplish what must be done! Not to mention flushing the commode!

    I think we're good for 3 or 4 weeks of independent comfort now, between the generator, the wood stove/pile of fuel, etc. I also plan to boost the cache of canned foods soon, to provide minimal nutrition while isolated from the national infrastructure. Actually, we can dip water from two unplumbed wells on the farm, which would be slow, but would provide long-term drinking and cooking water, even a shower if we run buckets of water into the reserve tank, although that would be a long hard task.

    Some neighbors have installed special carbs to run their generators off the natural gas system, which costs far less than gasoline, and the carbs are available locally. The manufacturer will install them on your generator if you bring it to them! I'm going to do that as soon as I get gas pipe run around to the back yard where the generator lives. That will reduce our dependence on refineries and trucking during a disaster.

  57. Re:No. Move. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sure! When are you sending the invite?

    Don't you realize that most cities are located where they are for critical economic and trade activity not simply for the safety and convenience of the residents?