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The Pentagon May Retire "Yoda," Its 92-Year-Old Futurist

Daniel_Stuckey writes "Of all the weapons the Pentagon relies on to defend the United States, one of the strangest and most secretive is Andrew Marshall, a 92-year-old man who's spent the last 40 years staring into the future trying to predict the next big threat to America. Known fondly as "Yoda" to his many fans in Washington, Marshall heads up the Office of Net Assessment—the Defense Department's think tank tasked with taking a long view, out-of-the-box approach to defense strategy. In his role as the Pentagon's visionary sage, Marshall is credited with predicting the fall of the Soviet Union, the rise of China's global prominence, the role of autonomous weapons and robots in warfare, and even helping end the Cold War. Now, facing budget cuts, Secretary of Defense Chuck Hagel is considering reorganizing or possibly even shuttering the futurist think tank, Defense News recently reported."

41 of 254 comments (clear)

  1. Interesting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    He never saw it coming

    1. Re:Interesting by zifn4b · · Score: 5, Funny

      Let me re-word that for you: Saw it coming, he never did.

      --
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    2. Re:Interesting by Ransak · · Score: 4, Interesting

      In all fairness, he was busy being one of the men who stared at goats. That book/movie was closer to fact than fiction in many, many areas.

      --
      "Powers. I have them."
    3. Re:Interesting by RabidReindeer · · Score: 4, Funny

      Let me re-word that for you: Saw it coming, he never did.

      Saw it coming, he did not.

    4. Re:Interesting by ArcadeMan · · Score: 3, Funny

      Dyslectic I am, insensitive clods you are!

    5. Re:Interesting by ebno-10db · · Score: 5, Funny

      If you're a zillion years old, short, live in a swamp, and can raise starfighters with your mind, nobody gives a damn if you're dyslexic.

    6. Re:Interesting by MightyYar · · Score: 4, Funny

      Do, or do not. There is no spoon.

      I am a banana!

      --
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  2. off from left field with a tin foil hat by Balthrop · · Score: 4, Funny

    uh the title makes it sound like they are going to uh assassinate the nice old man

    1. Re:off from left field with a tin foil hat by Dexter+Herbivore · · Score: 5, Funny

      Nope, then the title would read: The Pentagon May "Retire" Yoda, Its 92-Year-Old Futurist

    2. Re:off from left field with a tin foil hat by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 2

      Usually not. Normally, it's broken up for scrap, although occassionally it's used for testing or target practice and then it does. The Pentagon is eco-aware. They recycle!

    3. Re:off from left field with a tin foil hat by OhSoLaMeow · · Score: 3, Funny

      Usually not. Normally, it's broken up for scrap, although occassionally it's used for testing or target practice and then it does. The Pentagon is eco-aware. They recycle!

      Soylent Green is Yoda!!!

      --
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    4. Re:off from left field with a tin foil hat by Quirkz · · Score: 2

      It's a ship. It ships itself.

    5. Re:off from left field with a tin foil hat by niftydude · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It's a ship. It ships itself.

      Here is a photo of a ship shipping ships.

      --
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  3. The Star War's influence by cold+fjord · · Score: 2

    So, now we know who Yoda is, as well as the Jedi Knights.

    --
    much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
  4. Well... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 4, Interesting

    He's been trying to predict the future for the last 40 years. Unless everything he writes gets stamped 'above top secret: incinerator's eyes only' surely we have enough material to evaluate his efficacy by now?

    How did it go?

    1. Re:Well... by Arker · · Score: 2, Informative

      It's not that great. He's credited with foreseeing the demise of the soviet union in the blurb, I have no idea how accurate that is, but it's no great feat as the libertarian/austrian thinkers did as well, but that would still be somewhat to his credit if he escaped the beltway groupthink enough to anticipate that. Otherwise he seems mostly to be focused on selling a much larger and more expensive military as necessary to win the future war he fantasizes about with China. Considering the size of the relative expenditures currently, his pitch of drastic increases in spending required in order to hold off a distant, relatively low tech enemy seem alarmist at best.

      But what do I know, I have only read a few articles on him. Research him yourself and post what you find out.

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    2. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      He came up with the concept of Air-Sea Battle, which is a new method to coordinate the Air Force and the Navy in a future maritime war.

      Likely with China, as he predicted their rise to challenge US dominance back in the 80's when they were still weak.

      He predicted in the 70's that the Soviet Union's economy was in terrible shape despite them seeming robust and strong at the time.

      He predicted the need for precision weapons in the 60's, back when carpet bombing in Vietnam was still the norm.

      In 2003 during an interview he discussed the use of predator drones moving from surveillance to a strike platform, which really began in earnest in 2009-10.

      Not a bad track record.

    3. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Octopi can predict world cup game winners; not the winner of the world cup. Ask any German or Dutch person about that.

    4. Re:Well... by icebike · · Score: 3, Funny

      I suspect he predicted his own demise, and to uphold his record, he has to go.

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    5. Re:Well... by TWiTfan · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I would be more curious as to WHEN he predicted this stuff. There is a BIG difference between sitting in 1970 and saying "The Soviet Union will collapse at some point in the future" and saying "The Soviet Union will collapse in the late 1980's or early 1990's." The former is pretty much useless information. The latter could be very useful.

      I would also want to know how much he got wrong. If the signal of what little he got right was drowned out by the noise of much more stuff that he got wrong, his information would also basically be useless.

      As I've never met a "futurist" yet whose predictions were worth much of a damn at the end of the day, I would be very skeptical of the usefulness of his office.

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    6. Re:Well... by icebike · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Not that impressive.

      Air-Sea had been a Navy concept since before world war 2. They believed it so much they built carriers, and coordinated land based planes with carrier based planes very effectively, even when the land based planes belonged to the army. Read about Midway.

      China was not weak back in the 80s. China was not weak in the 60s. They were an economic powerhouse even then.
        Douglas MacArther warned Never fight a land war in Asia".

      Everyone but weapons system planners knew that the Soviet Union was going down as early as the 70s, because economists had predicted it even earlier, just by looking at empty shelves in soviet super markets and the drastic cut back in Soviet aid to its over-extended empire. They hung Castro out to dry, in the late 60s.

      The need for precision weapons was noted in WW2. Some were even developed and uses back then. Dam buster bombs. The AGM-62 Walleye TV Guided bomb was in use in the 60s, conceived in 1958, and developed by the Navy, it was used in Viet Nam.. Carpet bombing works in Jungles, precision doesn't.

      In short, he seems to have convinced people to use what was already available rather than sticking with old school methods.

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    7. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Translation:

      He did what any dimwit with a brain could do: he realized that importing everything from somewhere else (e.g. China) would significantly increase the economic power of that somewhere else, and with economic power comes available funding for military power.

      This was obvious back in the 1980s when China was just beginning to crawl out of the dark ages of the cultural revolution? ... [citation needed]

      He predicted what lots of others predicted about U.S.S.R.

      Back in the 70s? ... [citation needed]

      He observed that snipers and assassins were around centuries before he was even born, and were useful, and would therefore probably continue to be useful.

      WTF does that have to do with predicting the fact that Laser and GPS guided PGMs would become a dominant weapons system when most others were howling about how expensive they were? And AFAIK snipers are still not the dominant form of infantry after all these centuries.

      He mentioned a plan for drones to be weaponized that took six years to complete.

      How many others mentioned that in 2003? I happen to know for a fact that the weaponization of drones was done in great haste by a few people in the post 9/11 period leading up to the invasion of Afghanistan. It was not a cleverly thought out plan that took several years to carefully execute, it was hacked together by a handful of air force personnel and a civilian armorer. Very few people were predicting the explosion in drone operations we have seen in the last six to seven years back in 2003.

       

      That's not a prediction.

      Let's call him "Captain Obvious".

      That's not criticism it's whining let's call you "Spoiled Brat Boy"

    8. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      They didn't say he was a fucking psychic. Why do people get so stupid over the idea of "futurists"? No one says he magically foresaw things that no one in the world could. Just that he was consistent enough for them to rely on.

    9. Re:Well... by Blaskowicz · · Score: 2

      No, the USA would rather choose to mine and process their own rare earths. China has a monopoly on it because it's dirty and messy, not because rare earth metals are actually rare. They're rare in the sense you need to crush millions tons of rocks and do whatever nasty things to retrieve a trickle of them, then deal with the garbage (i.e. let it poison the region's water supply, or whatever)

    10. Re:Well... by Solandri · · Score: 4, Informative

      Air-Sea had been a Navy concept since before world war 2. They believed it so much they built carriers, and coordinated land based planes with carrier based planes very effectively, even when the land based planes belonged to the army. Read about Midway.

      Coordination within a single branch of the military is trivial. Coordination between the different branches is a nightmare. Each branch likes to do their own thing, and doesn't want to bother with or be bothered by the needs and wants of the other branches. e.g. The Air Force has been trying to kill off the A-10 ground attack aircraft for almost 20 years even though it's the best ground support asset in their arsenal. The Army would love to take over operating the A-10, but federal law limits them to rotary winged aircraft in combat roles. (Ironic considering the Air Force began as the Army Air Corps.)

      The divide and interservice rivalry is so deep and entrenched that when I was working on a project for the Army, the higher-ups had mandated that an Air Force officer ride along with them in the Humvee to force the two branches to coordinate.

      China was not weak back in the 80s. China was not weak in the 60s. They were an economic powerhouse even then. Douglas MacArther warned Never fight a land war in Asia".

      China was an economic footnote in the 1960s and 1970s. They were in the midst of the Cultural Revolution and were busy lynching anyone who could potentially have contributed to the country's economic development. Their economy took 30 years to double from 1950-1980. From 1980 to 2000 it doubled every 10 years. They didn't become notable on the world stage until (1) Deng Xiaoping began adopting capitalism in the 1980s, and (2) the Soviet Union fell allowing China to emerge from its shadow.

      And MacArthur wanted to nuke several Chinese cities to discourage China from entering the Korean War.

      Everyone but weapons system planners knew that the Soviet Union was going down as early as the 70s, because economists had predicted it even earlier, just by looking at empty shelves in soviet super markets and the drastic cut back in Soviet aid to its over-extended empire. They hung Castro out to dry, in the late 60s.

      As someone who grew up during that time, nobody believed the Iron Curtain was going to come down during our lifetime. It was like the stars in the night sky - always there, always had been there, and always would be there. The Soviets were so secretive that even if they hung Castro out to dry, you couldn't be sure if it was because they were having economic problems, or if it was because Castro had insulted the Soviet Premier's wife about her cooking at a state dinner. The events of 1989 remain one of the most shocking and indelible in my memory - right up there with Challenger and 9/11. Like the millions of people who now claim to have attended Woodstock, plenty of people now claim to have predicted the fall of the Soviet Union in hindsight. But believe me, even in the early 1980s if you had predicted on TV that the Soviet Union would crumble within a decade, you would've been laughed out of the studio.

    11. Re:Well... by Hartree · · Score: 2

      You're saying you married your mom cause she was hot?

      Yeah, this really is Slashdot...

  5. What did he say about Iraq and Afghanistan? by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I'm truly interested. He either called it and they ignored him, in which case he's not useful, or he didn't call it, in which case he's not useful.

    I'm sure he costs less than a redundant engine for the F-35, but everybody who says that each of the thousands of useless programs don't need to be cut because they don't cost too much is ignoring the rest of those other thousands.

    If he's as smart as the ethos contends, many think tanks would be glad to hire him on. I only hope I'm fortunate enough to be in such a position when I'm 92. Also cool that he was already 60 before he picked up his nickname - most career military are outta-there at that point.

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    1. Re:What did he say about Iraq and Afghanistan? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      He either called it and they ignored him, in which case he's not useful

      No. In that case he'd be useful, it's just that they didn't use him. If you go out without an umbrella and it rains, that doesn't mean the umbrella is useless and should be discarded, it means the umbrella is potentially useful and you should consider using it.

  6. Stupid Move by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ugh, this is so stupid. This is the only long view think tank in the Pentagon, the only one who looks at the entirety of a nation and tries to predict what will happen and more or less gets it correct. One of the big complaints about the military is they're "always fighting the last war"; this group was specifically designed to try to predict what a conflict 20 years from now will be and start preparing for it. Marshall needs to retire; he's damned old, but the group's purpose is still relevant.

  7. Re:Got things right by somersault · · Score: 2

    The proposed move also has caught the attention of some in the think tank and consulting worlds. Dan Goure of the Lexington Institute, is as unimpressed with the idea as Forbes.

    âoeThe decision to eliminate [Net Assessment] might make sense were it an expensive endeavor, employing a large staff that might be better deployed elsewhere,â he wrote.

    The Net Assessment office is less than a dozen people, tiny when compared with the rest of the Pentagon sweeping bureaucracy, Goure noted.

    âoeIts budget is a few million dollars annually, much of that devoted to outside studies and analyses, he wrote. âoeYou wouldnâ(TM)t save enough from this action buy even one tactical fighter. Furthermore, the loss of the intellectual energy NA provides at a critical time for the Pentagonâ(TM)s future could have negative effects far outweighing the utility of the few dollars that would be saved.â

    Sounds ass backwards to me. I think the military need to do more thinking, and less invading.

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    which is totally what she said
  8. Nobody ever listens, also predicted by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 2

    "I also predicted this due to ever-growing social spending leading to increasing cost-cutting pressures on everything else. I'd like to claim authorship of this repeatedly successful prediction method, but I cannot."

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  9. Re:Predicting The Probable by rockout · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Envisioning the implosion of a corrupt, bankrupt police state? Brilliant! Most populous country on Earth is in the ascent? Wizard!

    The difference between someoldguy and "Yoda" appears to be that someoldguy is really good at predicting the exact same things in hindsight.

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  10. Re:Only things 92 years old can see is death comin by Khashishi · · Score: 2

    When 92 years old you are, less senile you will be not.

  11. Re:Got things right by ElectricTurtle · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Your 'economic warfare' is myopic. China doesn't want to hurt one of its most lucrative export markets, and Europe won't pick up any significant slack, especially since they don't have the same degree of combined consumerism and lax regulation. The US and China are very much codependent, and while each has to make a political show from time to time about how the other is the bogeyman, in the end they both want the status quo.

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  12. Re:Just one anachronism... by squiggleslash · · Score: 5, Funny

    That's how stunningly accurate were his predictions. Nobody at the time could figure out why he choose that name, but a mere 7 years later...

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  13. Re:philip k dick called by icebike · · Score: 2

    How's that working out for them?

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  14. Re:Got things right by FatLittleMonkey · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I'd dump all of my Treasury bonds on the market all at once, use my US currency to buy Euros, Pounds Sterling, Yen and various other currencies, and lastly, cut the prices for all home grown tech (like Lenovo computers) to the bone and crush US companies. Economic warfare baby!

    What effect do you think that would have on the US?

    Perhaps you think that dumping the bonds would harm the dollar and raise US Treasury rates (the cost of borrowing)? Then the dollar would fall in value against the Euro and GBP, and maybe against the Renminbi itself. That makes US manufactured good cheaper compared to other nations. That reduces imports into the US, while increasing both exports and import-replacement. That slashes US spending on Chinese goods, which would be compounded by an aggressive boycott of Chinese goods by angry US consumers. It would also reduce the effective value of existing bonds (since they are paid only in USD at a fixed yield) to foreign investors, while the higher yields of new bonds would make them more desirable to domestic institutional investors (about 70% of Treasury bond buyers).

    These effects would reduce the value of China's one-shot mass sell-off, both in absolute dollar terms and in those dollars' buying power against other currencies, effectively reducing China's real wealth. And that would reduce the size of the effect on the markets.

    Frankly I doubt the Chinese leadership is anywhere near that stupid.

    They are trying to displace the USD as a reserve currency, while building themselves up. It's a slow long term plan, not a pointless idiotic one-shot spasm.

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  15. recent predictions by MonkeyPaw · · Score: 2

    Of all the weapons the Pentagon relies on to defend the United States, one of the strangest and most secretive is Andrew Marshall, a 92-year-old man who's spent the last 40 years staring into the future trying to predict the next big threat to America. In his role as the Pentagon's visionary sage, Marshall is credited with predicting the fall of the Soviet Union, the rise of China's global prominence, the role of autonomous weapons and robots in warfare, and even helping end the Cold War.

    His most recent predictions included "damn kids on the lawn", the loss of a his pants, and "there are 4 monkeys in the attic - I'm sure of it"!

    Mr Marshall will be missed.

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  16. Safe bet by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Back in the 70s?

    Sure - it's a very safe prediction to make if you had his job. There were basically three possible outcomes: the USSR lost, the US lost or there was a nuclear war and we all lost. In two of these outcomes he's probably out of a job or dead regardless of whether he was right or wrong but predicting that the USSR will lose is the one scenario where he gets to keep his job and so the only scenario where he has to worry about being correct. So what would you predict?

    Cynicism aside what we would really need to know to see whether he is good at predictions is how many other "yodas" the Pentagon had making predictions and getting it wrong. If you toss enough coins you are likely to find one which comes up heads 10 times in a row.

  17. Re:Got things right by kaatochacha · · Score: 2

    That's silly.
    It kills one of their main consumers, and causes umpteen Chinese citizens to riot when their jobs suddenly disappear and they no longer have a promised way to attain that middle class life they've been promised.
    What we have currently is Economic MAD. Either side drops the economic bomb all at once, and kablooey!

  18. Re:tesla by Trogre · · Score: 2

    And nearly 30 years ago by James Cameron.

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