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Hacker Spoofs Track Plays To Top Music Charts

mask.of.sanity writes "Stand aside P!nk, Niki Minaj; you've just been beaten by a music generator. One Aussie security expert curious about the fraud mechanisms at play on streaming services like Spotify uploaded garbage music tracks and directed three Amazon virtual machines to click the play button 24/7 for a month, earning him top spot in online music charts and $1000 in royalties."

157 comments

  1. Beaten by a music generator? by Sockatume · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I thought that's where the tunes came from in the first place.

    --
    No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    1. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by spokenoise · · Score: 3, Funny

      Yep, all your tunes are belong to us!

    2. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yep, all your tunes are belong to us!

      In this case all your tunes are belong to ARSE.

    3. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by 91degrees · · Score: 5, Funny

      Hi grandpa. I think what you meant to say was "It's just noise! It all sounds the same and I can't understand the lyrics. And get of my damn lawn!"

    4. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Sockatume · · Score: 1

      In all seriousness, aren't most pop songs written by committee* before the performer gets involved?

      *Admittedly, usually a pretty talented committee

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    5. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Sockatume · · Score: 1

      By deus, why is this modded Insightful and not Funny?

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    6. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 1

      It's funny cos it's true.

      --
      systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
    7. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by They'reComingToTakeM · · Score: 5, Funny

      His name is spelt "Simon Cowell". It's just pronounced ARSE.

    8. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Thanshin · · Score: 2

      In all seriousness, aren't most pop songs written by committee* before the performer gets involved?

      Would you prefer the committee to sing their own songs or the average singer composing their own songs?

      I don't see much advantage in having the composer and the singer being the same person. I care about the final product.

    9. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by rusty0101 · · Score: 1

      "Joe" from Tom Petty. Who needs lyrics when you can find a good looking girl who can play a guitar lick?

      --
      You never know...
    10. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yeah me too, but I also like a bit of a variety. It's the same goddamn committee that writes everything, hence everythings sounds the same.

    11. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by fostware · · Score: 2

      Dammit! No Funny mod points to give :(

      --
      "We know what happens to people who stay in the middle of the road. They get run over." - Aneurin Bevan
    12. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Sockatume · · Score: 2

      Jim Steinman wrote Meatloaf's best work, but Jim Steinman wasn't twelve people.

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    13. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Jim Steinman wrote Meatloaf's best work, but Jim Steinman wasn't twelve people.

      Proof that you're wrong:

      * "Jim Steinman" is twelve characters.

      * Most people in the music industry could be described as "characters".

      * Therefore "Jim Steinman" is twelve people in the music industry.

    14. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Hognoxious · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Would you prefer the committee to sing their own songs or the average singer composing their own songs?

      I'd prefer them to all fall off a cliff.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    15. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by realityimpaired · · Score: 5, Informative

      Would you prefer the committee to sing their own songs or the average singer composing their own songs?

      I don't see much advantage in having the composer and the singer being the same person. I care about the final product.

      Since the advent of autotune, most pop acts are not chosen for their ability to sing, they're chosen for their ability to look pretty. There aren't a lot of singer/songwriters in *that* genre, but once you get out of it, you'll find the majority of the *really* good stuff is performed by the same person or people who wrote it: performances are more visceral when the performer has an emotional connection with what they're playing.

      So you can have your fake plastic people performing fake plastic songs. Personally, I'll avoid the pop music genre, and stick with artists who actually deserve the name.

    16. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by msobkow · · Score: 1

      Maybe so, but I have a lot more respect for a talented artist who comes up with their own lyrics as well as having the pipes to sing them.

      More at issue is "lyrics by committee", which produce the same results as any committee: homogenized crap.

      --
      I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
    17. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I think this has been true since the advent of MTV. "Video Killed The Radio Star" and all that.

    18. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by jones_supa · · Score: 2

      So you can have your fake plastic people performing fake plastic songs.

      There are occasionally some really good songs in the plastic everyday trash pop genre too. It might not be good art, but it might be good entertainment. You don't always need the steak with potatoes and salad but just the bag of candy (what an analogy...).

      My rules are only: do anything that you want, but stop this stupid overproducing of albums. Don't record 128 tracks in the DAW just because you can and then apply the kind of dynamic range compression of which only purpose is to fill the audio signal with energy so that it plays loud.

    19. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Talented committees? The days of Holland-Dozier-Holland are long gone.

    20. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      By deus, why is this modded Insightful and not Funny?

      Funny don't get you karma.
      The mod squad.

    21. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by mrclisdue · · Score: 2

      ...but Jim Steinman wasn't twelve people.

      No, but he certainly didn't miss too many meals!

      cheers,

    22. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by oobayly · · Score: 2

      So you can have your fake plastic people performing fake plastic songs.

      Nothing wrong with fake plastic trees though.

    23. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Kozz · · Score: 3, Funny

      Jim Steinman wrote Meatloaf's best work, but Jim Steinman wasn't twelve people.

      Proof that you're wrong:

      * "Jim Steinman" is twelve characters.

      * Most people in the music industry could be described as "characters".

      * Therefore "Jim Steinman" is twelve people in the music industry.

      I thought the first impossible phrase that jumped out at me was "Meatloaf's best work".

      --
      I only post comments when someone on the internet is wrong.
    24. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by FuzzyDustBall · · Score: 1

      In all seriousness, aren't most pop songs written by committee* before the performer gets involved?

      Would you prefer the committee to sing their own songs or the average singer composing their own songs?

      I don't see much advantage in having the composer and the singer being the same person. I care about the final product.

      The advantage is that the singer has an emotional connection to the words they write, they then emote those feelings through singing in hopes of eliciting an emotional response from you the listener.

      When one person writes and the other sings, there is a passing from the writer to the singer of the emotion, this is less good then coming from the singer them selves but some good singers can interpreter the emotion from the writer or apply their own.

      When lyrics are developed by committee there is no emotion just catch phrases and even the most talented singers would be hard pressed to put any emotion into it.

    25. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      There are occasionally some really good songs in the plastic everyday trash pop genre too. It might not be good art, but it might be good entertainment.

      Nah, it's still good art, it's just not as much on the part of the "artist" and more due to the efforts of technicians. Commercial art is still art!

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    26. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 2

      Except that all the really good music was written by the bands. Queen wrote their own shit. ZZ Top. Aerosmith. Scorpions (I don't like Scorpions personally, but yeah... okay, they're good). Sonata Arctica. Iron Maiden. Johann Sebastian Bach. Greenday. Lard.

      Compare that to, uh. Bieber. Or Beyonce.

    27. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Why is that impossible? For a car analogy, while all pintos suck, they do not all suck the same. There will undoubtedly be one that sucks less than all the others.

    28. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yay, the ever elusive "Equivocation Fallacy"...

      Now that you learned something, GET OFF MY LAWN

    29. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Nyder · · Score: 1

      Except that all the really good music was written by the bands. Queen wrote their own shit. ZZ Top. Aerosmith. Scorpions (I don't like Scorpions personally, but yeah... okay, they're good). Sonata Arctica. Iron Maiden. Johann Sebastian Bach. Greenday. Lard.

      Compare that to, uh. Bieber. Or Beyonce.

      You do realize you are comparing rock/metal groups ('cept for Greenday) with pop music, right?

      2 different types of music. Usually 2 different types of fans.

      --
      Be seeing you...
    30. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Half-pint+HAL · · Score: 1

      He says his name's reality impaired...

      But no-one knows he really is a (bum-bum) plastic man.

      --
      Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
    31. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      Michael Jackson.

    32. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 1

      Here's an amazing thing:

      * YOU are not required to listen to music you don't like.
      * There are MANY people who *DO* like the music you don't like.

      Are you saying that you propose forcing *YOUR* musical taste on everyone else?

      The simple solution is to quit BITCHING about the shit you don't like, and simply ignore it.

      Time to move on.

      --
      If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    33. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Whorhay · · Score: 1

      I think that the performance artist having a closer connection because they also wrote the lyric and tune helps but isn't absolutuley necessary. Just like in acting, a really good performance artist should be able to create that kind of emotional connection to a song when appropriate, even if they didn't write it originally. I get really annoyed when people complain about some band playing music that another composed, and playing it differently. Hell I knew a guy that didn't go to concerts because he didn't like that the bands would often play their set differently than it was recorded for an album. I see no reason that my love of a song should be tied to a single performer and in the same way my appreciation of a performer doesn't need to be tied to a specific song.

    34. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by realityimpaired · · Score: 1

      To be fair, the number of cover versions of songs that I like as much as or better than the original is pretty short... that's mostly because of nostalgia than anything else. I do agree that cover songs have artistic merit, and every now and then the cover is *way* better than the original.

      Or if you prefer a more serious example... Though the distinction between that and the original is less stark... part of what makes that particular performance special is that it's actually a duet with the original artist....

    35. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Atzanteol · · Score: 1

      You forgot "And they don't have the *meaning* that songs in *MY* day had..."

      --
      "Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge"

      - Charles Darwin
    36. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Music generator plus oversexed or overmedicated singer: professional music
      Music generator plus hacker: garbage music

    37. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by gandhi_2 · · Score: 1

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2q5L8kUOtA

      The guy at Subway is not trying to make you the best tuna sandwich you’ve ever had, he’s just trying to get through the day.
      -- Henry Rollins

    38. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Hognoxious · · Score: 2

      * YOU are not required to listen to music you don't like.

      I go in shops. I travel by public transport. So yes I am.

      * There are MANY people who *DO* like the music you don't like.

      One, argumentum ad populum.

      Two, I'm quite aware of them. They're usually in the same subway car as me, apparently with their headphones inside out.

      So yes, again, I fucking am required to listen to it, you fat nonce.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    39. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by mjwx · · Score: 1

      Except that all the really good music was written by the bands. Queen wrote their own shit. ZZ Top. Aerosmith. Scorpions (I don't like Scorpions personally, but yeah... okay, they're good). Sonata Arctica. Iron Maiden. Johann Sebastian Bach. Greenday. Lard.

      Compare that to, uh. Bieber. Or Beyonce.

      You do realize you are comparing rock/metal groups ('cept for Greenday) with pop music, right?

      Pretty much all good music is rock/metal, thats why he used those examples.

      Very few pop artists actually write their own music, even fewer can sing. All of the very, very rare exceptions I can think of are Latin and I think this is derived from the fact they had to start out as street performers (pretty much like rock bands doing backyard gigs).

      Nine people wrote Baby for Justin Beiber, it took 17 for "imma be" for the black eyed peas, How many did it take for Bohemian Rhapsody? Just one (Freddy Mercury). Which one do you think we'll still listen to in another 20 years. Yes I know that Bohemian rhapsody is nearly 40 years old, this is my point, how many people under 25 know who sung "the loco-motion" without googling it? and that was hardly an obscure song/artist. Pop music is mass produced and expires quickly.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    40. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by oreiasecaman · · Score: 1

      No I won't! If I did that, how I would be able to smugly deride other people's taste as inferior?

      --
      This is a UDP joke, I don't care if you get it or not...
    41. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by oreiasecaman · · Score: 1

      *rimshot*

      --
      This is a UDP joke, I don't care if you get it or not...
    42. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I care about it because it takes skill. I'm not going to waste MY time on some worthless hack who can't even write their own tunes.

    43. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That isn't saying much. Meatloaf's best work is still utter shit.

    44. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Nyder · · Score: 1

      Except that all the really good music was written by the bands. Queen wrote their own shit. ZZ Top. Aerosmith. Scorpions (I don't like Scorpions personally, but yeah... okay, they're good). Sonata Arctica. Iron Maiden. Johann Sebastian Bach. Greenday. Lard.

      Compare that to, uh. Bieber. Or Beyonce.

      You do realize you are comparing rock/metal groups ('cept for Greenday) with pop music, right?

      Pretty much all good music is rock/metal, thats why he used those examples.

      Very few pop artists actually write their own music, even fewer can sing. All of the very, very rare exceptions I can think of are Latin and I think this is derived from the fact they had to start out as street performers (pretty much like rock bands doing backyard gigs).

      Nine people wrote Baby for Justin Beiber, it took 17 for "imma be" for the black eyed peas, How many did it take for Bohemian Rhapsody? Just one (Freddy Mercury). Which one do you think we'll still listen to in another 20 years. Yes I know that Bohemian rhapsody is nearly 40 years old, this is my point, how many people under 25 know who sung "the loco-motion" without googling it? and that was hardly an obscure song/artist. Pop music is mass produced and expires quickly.

      funny you should mention loco-motion, seeing as the song was written by 2 people, and not by the original singer. If you bothered to do a little checking, Little Eva, who sung the song first, was the babysitter for Carol King, who along with Gerry Goffin (King's husband). So this song you are using as an example, wasn't writing by the singer, but was written for the singer.

      Nice example.

      Look, Pop music is different then Rock music. Always has been. Pop music is made to please the most people possible, thus why it's called "Popular" music. The most money is to be made via pop music, so it's no surprise that the various Record mafiaa's dedicated research to formulas & lots of people writing tunes for singers/dancers. Probably will not change.

      Rock music while mainstream, isn't the same sort of music as popular, doesn't usually have the same fans, and it does get the same sort of formula/lots of people writing shit for it. But unlike popular music, rock fans don't usually go for the canned rock music that labels try to pass, they prefer a better class of music.

      But all this said, taste is subjective. While I don't care for Pop music of today, I don't mind some of it from the 80's. Granted I like my rock old though (50+) and my metal hard. (Metallica sold out when they cut their hair, just sayin.) But that isn't all I like. I generally like good music. And I find good music comes in all types, even country western. (and I can not stand country or western, or any combination within, but Patsy Cline fucking rocks.)

      --
      Be seeing you...
    45. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Nyder · · Score: 2

      And here is how King & Goffin are typical music industry assholes, taken from the wiki:

      Another bit of the conventional lore is that she had received only $50 for "The Loco-Motion." However, although she never owned the rights to her recordings, it seems $50 was actually her weekly salary during the years she was making records (an increase of $15 from what Goffin and King had been paying her as nanny). In 1971, she moved to South Carolina and lived in obscurity on menial jobs and welfare, until being rediscovered in 1987.[3] She died of cervical cancer in 2003.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Loco-Motion

      Like I said, great argument to support your side.

      --
      Be seeing you...
    46. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Scorpions aren't good, but they do have the irritating qualities of being familiar and catchy. I hate their music, but still sometimes get one of their songs stuck in my head after hearing it on the radio.

      There's no one like you
      I can't wait for the nights with you
      I imagine the things we'll do
      I just want to be loved by you

    47. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Freddie Mercury wrote Queen's best work, which is inarguably better than all of the pop music churned out in the last decade.

    48. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 0

      You are a pathetic snob.

      --
      If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    49. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Again, you are NOT required to listen to it.

      If people around you are listening to the music too "loudly" ... move away from them or better, buy and use your own headset to play the music that you like. If you don't won't to listen to music, there are other headsets for simply blocking out the sound.

      Stop QQ, you sounds rather childish.

    50. Re:Beaten by a music generator? by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      If people around you are listening to the music too "loudly" ... move away from them

      Ever been on public transport? That's rarely feasible at rush hour.

      or better, buy and use your own headset to play the music that you like.

      It's an offense to bother other passengers, though it's rarely if ever enforced. And what makes a cunt like you think you have the right to order me what to do with my money, you fucking piece of self-entitled shit?

      If you don't won't[SIC] to listen to music, there are other headsets for simply blocking out the sound.

      I have more right to quiet than they have to enforce their noise on me, that's a matter of legal fact, not to mention common courtesy.

      Here's another two things you'll never understand[1]: one, I usually have the kids in tow, and they like to talk to their dad. Two, public transport - largely due to people like you - has a disproportionate number of criminals and loonies. Shutting off one of your warning systems isn't really a bright idea.

      [1] Because you're a faggot, and your mom drives you everywhere.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  2. OMG by Big+Hairy+Ian · · Score: 3, Funny

    What's James Blunt going to do now?????

    --

    Build a Man a Fire, and He'll Be Warm for a Day. Set a Man on Fire, and He'll Be Warm for the Rest of His Life.

    1. Re:OMG by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 5, Informative

      He can always go back to preventing World War Three.

      --
      systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
    2. Re:OMG by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Become Sharp?

    3. Re:OMG by Charliemopps · · Score: 1

      You just blew my mind.

    4. Re:OMG by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 3, Informative

      Wait til you hear how Avril Lavigne negotiated the 2010 Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty.

      Note to mods though: "Insightful" does not mean "told me something I didn't know."

      --
      systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
    5. Re:OMG by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wesley Clark prime example of why we shouldnt give guns to Americans.

  3. Click fraud is possible! News at 11. by Joining+Yet+Again · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This sort of thing is so 1999, however.

    These days most sponsors just trust their ad broker to correctly report genuine clicks and withold payment for fraudulent clicks. Because there would be no incentive for an ad broker to under-report genuine clicks, and underreporting by even 100 clicks per sponsor when you have hundreds of thousands of sponsors won't gain you a couple of extra million dollars here and there.

    1. Re:Click fraud is possible! News at 11. by wvmarle · · Score: 2

      It is not that most advertisers have much choice than to trust their ad broker. Most web sites sell all their ad space to a single broker, and can't be bothered at all selling ad space directly.

    2. Re:Click fraud is possible! News at 11. by Joining+Yet+Again · · Score: 1

      I think it's absurd that sponsors don't demand a separation of roles of tracker and broker, with consortium control / a lot of auditing on the first.

    3. Re:Click fraud is possible! News at 11. by Charliemopps · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You've obviously never worked with Marketing people before. It's just one giant clusterfuck of lies. Marketing has to prove their department is worth keeping so they want to inflate the number of clicks they got just as much as the vendor does. Remember the "Got Milk" campaign? One of the largest and most recognized ad campaigns in history and milk sales went DOWN while it was going on. It did more for the stars that showed up in the adds than it ever did for the milk industry.

    4. Re:Click fraud is possible! News at 11. by Joining+Yet+Again · · Score: 2

      Oh, I've worked with them. They're far better at salesmanship than I'll ever be. I give the client the truth, and the marketing department gives them everything else.

    5. Re:Click fraud is possible! News at 11. by N0Man74 · · Score: 1

      Remember the "Got Milk" campaign? One of the largest and most recognized ad campaigns in history and milk sales went DOWN while it was going on. It did more for the stars that showed up in the adds than it ever did for the milk industry.

      But just imagine how much more the sales would have gone down without the campaign!

  4. Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headline) by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Hacker (n.) Spoofs (n.? v.?) Track (n.? v.?) Plays (n.? v.?) To (prep.) Top (adj.? v.?) Music (n.) Charts (n.? v.?)

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  5. Only Happy When It Rains? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I always likes that track anyway.

    1. Re:Only Happy When It Rains? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I always likes that track anyway.

      One man's Garbage is another man's rock 'n roll ;-)

    2. Re:Only Happy When It Rains? by jones_supa · · Score: 4, Funny

      Ditto. Garbage is an excellent band. :)

  6. Buying your posting .... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    Although a good take on the modern music services and how to increase your rank, go back 10 years and hoards of people were paid to buy multiple copies of CDs and prior to that Vinyl. It shows given enough thinking how a modest amount of effort could keep you in pop tarts and coffee.

    1. Re:Buying your posting .... by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      hoards of people were paid to buy multiple copies of CDs

      How can you buy CDs when you're in a big heap with a dragon sitting on top?

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    2. Re:Buying your posting .... by RandomFactor · · Score: 1

      Gold, Silver and Platinum CDs?

      --
      --- Mercutio was right.
    3. Re:Buying your posting .... by Dogtanian · · Score: 2

      go back 10 years and hoards of people were paid to buy multiple copies of CDs and prior to that Vinyl

      That's certainly true; it's been going on since the 60s, apparently. In the late-80s heavy metal spoof "More Bad News", they go into two shops and buy multiple copies of their own record.

      However, bear in mind that if they were caught doing this (something that they supposedly cracked down on from the 80s onwards) they were likely to be banned from the charts- something that was also parodied in More Bad News when their manager tells them they've been banned because "some idiot apparently" went into a shop and bought loads of copies.

      In fact, this post suggests that Spotify are doing pretty much that.

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
    4. Re:Buying your posting .... by camperdave · · Score: 1

      hoards of people were paid to buy multiple copies of CDs

      How can you buy CDs when you're in a big heap with a dragon sitting on top?

      Use a cell phone?

      --
      When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
    5. Re:Buying your posting .... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unless it's Christian Rock, then it's Gold, Frankincense, and Myrrh.

  7. Most interesting point by IamTheRealMike · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The fact that services don't have automated play de-spamming system should not come as a big surprise, given the pathetic earnings available. That's not research worth doing. But the outcome is - just $1000 for a track being played 24/7? No wonder artists all think Spotify is a sick joke. They won't have to automate anti-abuse systems until the amount they're dishing out to artists goes way, way beyond that paltry amount. It's not even worth gaming their charts right now.

    1. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      $1000 for just three "listeners" playing the songs 24/7 for a month. That's 3*30*24=2160hours, so about 50ct per hour played. 50ct is probably more than the royalties on a single CD which the buyers can play as often as they like. If I had 50ct for every hour someone used my software, I'd be a rich man.

    2. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or from the other point of view: work for a few hours to write the bot and "music", get $1000 net income (minus $100-200 for Amazon instances). I'd take that, TYVM.

    3. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      RIAA companies have been caught doing this too.

      "Artists" should be grateful they have airplay, it's a bloody advert for them. Hoping to make it off a single or two suggests they're very far from being an artist. You make money on the road and out of merchandising, that's how you build a fanbase and following.

    4. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For three listeners, that is absolutely amazing... I would say it is more likely this is due to the number of started plays, not full plays, but I havent RTFAd.

    5. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If I had 50ct for every hour someone used my software, I'd be a rich man.

      Why would you want 50 Cent? His "music" sucks.

    6. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The fact that services don't have automated play de-spamming system should not come as a big surprise, given the pathetic earnings available. That's not research worth doing. But the outcome is - just $1000 for a track being played 24/7? No wonder artists all think Spotify is a sick joke. They won't have to automate anti-abuse systems until the amount they're dishing out to artists goes way, way beyond that paltry amount. It's not even worth gaming their charts right now.

      What the...? Three people listening to a track 24/7 is worth more than $1000? How much do 3 singles cost where you live, or 3 tracks on iTunes?

    7. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The fact that services don't have automated play de-spamming system should not come as a big surprise, given the pathetic earnings available. That's not research worth doing. But the outcome is - just $1000 for a track being played 24/7? No wonder artists all think Spotify is a sick joke. They won't have to automate anti-abuse systems until the amount they're dishing out to artists goes way, way beyond that paltry amount. It's not even worth gaming their charts right now.

      If you read the article, you'd have noticed that Spotify and MOG banned his accounts in the early stages of research. Spotify has generally very good anti-fraud protection and can blacklist evil or badly-behaving clients (like this one).

    8. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most likely his software suck too.

    9. Re:Most interesting point by somersault · · Score: 1

      An advert for what? For getting people to listen to their music? That they can already listen to on Spotify. Not that many artists are better live than on their CDs. I'm happy to go to shows when people invite me, but I don't look them out myself. Listening to music while I work/drive/chill is all I need really.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    10. Re:Most interesting point by MiniMike · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The actual amount earned in the study is arbitrary. He could have just as easily set up more virtual machines and multiplied the amount, if those were the only source. Also it's not clear if the payment was only from his clicks, or if it includes clicks from unsuspecting listeners who were drawn by the artificially high rating, so your calculation of 50 cents may be off.

    11. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or from the other point of view: work for a few hours to write the bot and "music", get $1000 net income (minus $100-200 for Amazon instances). I'd take that, TYVM.

      And if you have a job like I do (dozens of linux servers available with a few keystrokes) you don't even have to spend the money on the Amazon instances. It's free money!

    12. Re:Most interesting point by sootman · · Score: 3, Informative

      > $1000 for a track being played 24/7? No wonder
      > artists all think Spotify is a sick joke.

      Old news. Check out this chart from 3 years ago.

      Another fun fact: Spotify has 20 million songs. Twenty percent of them -- four million songs -- have never been played.

      --
      Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
    13. Re:Most interesting point by bob_super · · Score: 1

      "If I had 50ct for every hour someone used my software, I'd be a rich man."

      Me too, and I then could use the money to hide from the people who had to use my software for hours...

      Ask Bill G about people continuously buying software in the silly hope that it will stop wasting their time (Ok, not so silly anymore, XP and 7 are decent OSes for the casual user)

    14. Re:Most interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not sure if 3 machines equal 3 listeners. It's quite possible that there were lots of "listeners" on each machine, limited by CPU or network bandwidth.

    15. Re:Most interesting point by jovius · · Score: 1

      From our small indie label recent listings: Spotify stream play unit compensations go from $0.0004 to about $0.009. Spotify easily creates most of the plays however. Imagine artists who get only fraction of that because of royalty agreements... Spotify is a great site for music discovery.

    16. Re:Most interesting point by Massive146 · · Score: 1

      Assuming the average song is around 3:30 minutes, that comes out to 7.4 cents per play. This doesn't seem to bad, especially when compared to the rate of 0.1-0.2 cents per play for "pureplay" and "run-of-the-mill" webcasters [1]. This guy's songs seemed to be around 30 seconds each[2], but that would still be more than 1 cent per play. (It seems odd that the pay rate doesn't take into account the song length. This is probably just to keep things simpler.) And this is all ignoring the fact that this was only three "users" who were listening to the songs.

      [1] $2.5 Billion: The Big Number that “Big Radio” could owe each year if it paid music royalties at Pandora’s rates Info a little less than half way down the page

      [2] John Matrix

    17. Re:Most interesting point by pspahn · · Score: 2

      I've always kind of felt the same way. Then one day Michael Kiwanuka came to town.

      A few days prior I had found his album somewhere online and listened to it. I loved it. I saw that he was going to be in town in a few days so I got tickets.

      The show was wonderful, and afterwards he was meeting fans at the merch table. I waited in line behind girls and fanbois that just wanted his autograph or something... so I waited patiently. When it was my turn, I took $10 out of my pocket and gave it to him and he went to grab a CD to give me. I told him no, the $10 was for the album I already downloaded and that I didn't need a CD and I just wanted to thank him.

      Live shows are where you get to potentially have these kinds of moments. I'll never forget that.

      --
      Someone flopped a steamer in the gene pool.
  8. Complicated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    Avril Lavigne was doing this before it was cool.

  9. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by wvmarle · · Score: 4, Funny

    Learning reading comprehension helps, too. No issues for me understanding what they meant with that headline. And I'm not even a native English speaker.

    Now if it were a sentence like "buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo" I'd understand your problem with it.

  10. Still calling himself a hacker by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Clearly, must be a criminal.

    1. Re:Still calling himself a hacker by realityimpaired · · Score: 4, Funny

      Since music was involved, would that make him a smooth criminal?

  11. The virtual world once more duplicates the real by Bruce66423 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Once upon a time it was possible to raise your position in the charts by buying the record in the shops that reported sales, and there was a small industry dedicated to this... Good to see certain traditions haven't been killed by computers!

    1. Re:The virtual world once more duplicates the real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Books, too! The Scientologists had a fascinating scam going where they'd go buy up all the copies of L. Ron Hubbard's new books (including the "new" ones after L. Ron was obviously dead but they wouldn't admit it( from the shops that reported sales. Then they'd return the books to the store before the return policy expired. It's why the bookstores would be so desperate to sell off the used books and excess stock, and we saw so many remaindered copies: Publisher and bookstore accountants who didn't know better would increase the print run and allocate more shelf space, and the bookstores would wind up with entire rows of unsellable books on their shelves.

    2. Re:The virtual world once more duplicates the real by fulldecent · · Score: 1

      (And then returning them to the stores that don't)

      --

      -- I was raised on the command line, bitch

    3. Re:The virtual world once more duplicates the real by MozeeToby · · Score: 2

      Don't forget the trick of packaging 2 copies of the music into one disc case, so that a single album sale counted as two. The "top seller" metrics have always been gamed one way or another. If anything is surprising about this research, it's that no one else was already gaming the system this way; if someone were I doubt he would have achieved the number one spot so easily.

    4. Re:The virtual world once more duplicates the real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How do you return a record/anything to a shop you didn't buy it from?

      In what alien world can you return products without a sales receipt?

  12. Garbage by jamesh · · Score: 1
  13. Gaining money by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Actually earning money by doing that is only possible because of a bad compensation model. Currently they just lump all the money from users into a big pile, and then divide that pile by the percentage amount of how much each artist was played. This screws the smaller artist over, because they get nothing, this leads to them dropping away from these kinds of services eventually.

    I pay spotify $5 per month. If I listen to only one artist, that artist should get all my money(minus spotify cut). If I listen to nobody, my money should be divided like it is now. If I listen to 5 different artists, my money should be divided amongst them. That way I would actually support the artists that I like, and not lady gaga and justin bieber and random hackers.

    1. Re:Gaining money by hairyfish · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Seems odd they they can't adopt your model, I mean they have logs of every song played by which users so it should be trivial to allocate each user's contribution directly to the artists. In fact they could take it a step further and have user charts to see who gave the most money to which artist, then fans could compete with each other to see who is the biggest fan by who pays their favourite artist the most. Then the artist could reward their biggest fans with a phone call or something or a back stage pass. The technology is there to make this work, fans win, the artists win, if only the money grubbers that own the copyrights had more interest in making it work.

    2. Re:Gaining money by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Those logs are for the NSA only.

    3. Re:Gaining money by blaisethom · · Score: 1

      I think the thing is that it comes to pretty much the same assuming everyone watches the same amount of music. Let's say there are three listeners, you each play 5 songs and each pay $5. If you listen to only one artist while the other two listen to the pop artist then there are two ways to do the payment:

      Your artist gets your money: $5
      Your artist gets the division of the total: 5 times played / 15 times total * $15 = $5

      Same either way. This breaks down when:
          a) Different people play different amounts of music
          b) Non-paying people's music plays are included in the division

      Your idea of people paying their artist extra would also break that of course.

    4. Re:Gaining money by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your payment model would prevent the exploit described in the article. But, consider the other side. Apparently if you are absolutely crazy about one artist and listen to them day in and day out, you can direct a lot more than the $5 / mo. you contribute to that artist! Even you you're the only person in the world who likes an artist, you can cause them to receive hundreds of dollars per month in royalties.

      If you don't think Spotify's model is fair. Do more to help your favorite struggling artists. Stream their music while you sleep. :-)

    5. Re:Gaining money by Bite+The+Pillow · · Score: 1

      That is exactly what they do, only rounding is involved. $60 minus spotify rounds to zero.

      Or are you saying a $45 payment for a year would make a difference?

      Depending on the people involved, it may take $1000 to $5000 to mean anything.

      The current method allows adding obscure and unknown acts, with a reasonable threshold built in naturally.

      Most importantly, the payments are not for services rendered. This is how all of the music industry works, and they run risks on angering the MAFIAA. Imperfect compensation or no spotify, which do you choose?

      Maybe in a few years they can change it, but now is a little early to make changes the industry won't like.

  14. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Neil+Boekend · · Score: 0

    There are 8 separate sentences. Note the capitol letters and note that these are not names.
    Seriously, why does /. use camelcaps for titles? It's almost as bad as all caps.

    --
    Well, I might have a way, but it only works on a semi spherical planet in a vacuum.
  15. Too Soon? by fostware · · Score: 1

    Was the sound from "Metal Machine Music"?

    --
    "We know what happens to people who stay in the middle of the road. They get run over." - Aneurin Bevan
    1. Re:Too Soon? by Bob+the+Super+Hamste · · Score: 1

      Maybe Stahlwerksymphonie

      --
      Time to offend someone
  16. Story by Barny · · Score: 4, Informative

    The poster should probably have linked this http://youtu.be/PomBYSELEPE which is the guy himself giving his talk on what he did and why.

    Some funny stuff.

    --
    ...
    /me sighs
    1. Re:Story by PPH · · Score: 2

      I didn't understand the part about "I'm never gonna give you up."

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
  17. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Joining+Yet+Again · · Score: 1

    Now if it were a sentence like "buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo" I'd understand your problem with it.

    Indeed - without the proper noun correctly identified, it's meaningless.

    I could parse it too, but that doesn't mean it's well written. Good communication is mostly the responsibility of the speaker.

  18. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Learning (v.? n.?) reading (v.? n.?) comprehension helps too.

    Gah!

    No issues for me understanding what they meant with that headline. And I'm not even a native English speaker.

    Well, good for you. Maybe it helps that you're not a native English speaker, and are less familiar with the alternate meanings of some words. I happen to have a very good handle on the written word, so maybe that's why I'm overly sensitive to these things.

    My point is not that the headline is more likely to be misread than read correctly (although I suspect this particular one might be), but that ambiguity can and should be avoided regardless.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  19. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Capitol letters? Are those coming from Washington?

  20. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    nvnnpvnn. Is it clear now?

  21. Cost/benefit -- could he make a profit doing it? by swb · · Score: 1

    I'm guessing the answer is "no", but other than running a zombie network, could he have actually made a profit at this? Or are the EC2 instances more expensive than the compensation he got for it?

  22. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Ken+D · · Score: 1

    So... all words that can take the role of multiple parts of speech should be banned? or what?

  23. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    "but that ambiguity can and should be avoided regardless"

    I thought you said you were good with the written word? Certainly you know that no native human language passes as a regular language because they're all horribly ambiguous and context sensitive. So much so, that it really is impossible to avoid. I mean, hell, anything can be turned into an innuendo if you add proper inflection. But on a less dirty area the word "lead", is that a collar, a position in a race, a soft heavy metal? Read, is that something I do to a book or have just done to a book. Spoken out loud, now is it red read, read or reed.

    One of my favorites comes in with "lead pipe" from the game clue. For the longest time I thought it was some sort of plumbing term, I thought "lead" was as in "I'm leading the race", because in my day and age, you'd never make a pipe out of the metal lead, because it's horrible as a pipe material as it's soft, doesn't hold pressure well, and poisons whatever goes through it. But no, it's the metal. I also wouldn't imagine bashing somebodies head in with something so malleable, I'd assume you'd want to use something a bit harder.

    This overly long post I guess is just a way of saying ambiguity in the written word, as long as it's spoken language is more or less unavoidable.

  24. Re:Cost/benefit -- could he make a profit doing it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    A "micro" instance is $0.02 per hour or $14.40 per month, default "small" is $0.06/hour.

  25. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

    And if you've some space left for dessert, check how despite is used in TFA.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  26. Ballot Stuffing by msobkow · · Score: 2

    You mean you can stuff an internet ballot box?

    The shock! The horror!

    You mean the internet can be full of fraud and lies?!?!?!

    Who'd a thunk it. :P

    --
    I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
    1. Re:Ballot Stuffing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Good day fellow netizen,

      Upon reading your posting here in the internets, I must protest by saying, I think you are lying.

    2. Re:Ballot Stuffing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think it was Hank that did it. You know, Hank, the Angry Drunk Dwarf.

  27. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 1

    Who said anything about banning? I'm just suggesting that people who write headlines for online news sites take a little more care and don't string potentially ambiguous words together.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  28. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Imrik · · Score: 1

    nvanpvan where a is adjective

  29. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So much so, that it really is impossible to avoid.

    Of course it isn't.

    Ambiguous:

    Prostitues appeal to Pope

    Less ambiguous:

    Prostitues make appeal to Pope

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  30. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by nightsky30 · · Score: 1

    They've infiltrated /. We're doomed.

  31. Re:Cost/benefit -- could he make a profit doing it by somersault · · Score: 2

    In addition to the other guy's comment, spotify pays around half a cent per streamed track. So currently the answer seems to be "yes". Which is kind of absurd, but interesting. There are lots of shady ways to make money though. Probably best not to think too much about them.

    --
    which is totally what she said
  32. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by InsectOverlord · · Score: 1

    My point is not that the headline is more likely to be misread than read correctly (although I suspect this particular one might be), but that (c.? a.?) ambiguity can and should be avoided regardless.

    Ambiguity fail.

  33. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 1

    Ambiguity fail.

    Sentence fragment.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  34. Taking out the trash by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    And the tracks by P!nk and Niki Minaj weren't garabage tracks?

  35. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by camperdave · · Score: 1

    For today's ten thousand, to "buffalo" means to bully. "Buffalo" is also the name of a city in New York, and a synonym for bison, so the sentence "Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo" means "Bison from Buffalo (that are bullied by other bison from Buffalo) bully still other bison from Buffalo", or "It's tough being a herd beast in Upstate New York".

    --
    When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
  36. Could anyone tell the difference? by damn_registrars · · Score: 3, Insightful

    All he needed to add was some random monologue (preferable to be very angry monologue) and it would fit right in with the top 40.

    --
    Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
  37. Who is Niki Minaj? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Seriously.
    Articles these days assume strange knowledge about things/people that just aren't even important.

  38. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    nvanpvan where a is adjective

    Wrong. "Track" and "music" are attributive nouns, not adjectives.

  39. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

    I would have gone for "underage prostitutes appeal to pope" but I guess that was more the last guy

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  40. Here you can hear some of his music by kju · · Score: 2

    At least his latest album is still available, and you can hear 30 seconds out of 31 seconds of each track here: http://www.7digital.com/artist/kim-jong-deux/release/a-kim-jong-christmas

    Maybe I'm crazy but I actually found the music not too bad. It's weird music but it seems to have something...

    1. Re:Here you can hear some of his music by kju · · Score: 1

      Addendum: And really, the "un-holiday party mix" is nearly on-par with some of the electronic shit popular these days. Rerecord it with better samples and maybe add some effects and nobody would think it is a troll track.

  41. All this proves is by Zeromous · · Score: 1

    People love Shirley Manson. She truly is talented and beautiful. What's not to like?

    --
    ---Up Up Down Down Left Right Left Right B A START
    1. Re:All this proves is by BLToday · · Score: 1

      Haha. But the last couple of albums have been absolute garbage.

    2. Re:All this proves is by Zeromous · · Score: 1

      Agreed, but I'm less angry and emo than I was 20 years ago.

      --
      ---Up Up Down Down Left Right Left Right B A START
  42. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Agent0013 · · Score: 1

    Good point all but for the lead pipe example. A little knowledge of history and you would know that lead was used for pipes back since the Roman days if not before. In fact, people used to grate a block of lead onto their food much like we might do with parmesan cheese nowadays. And the lead poisoning wasn't such a big deal. Well eating it would probably be bad, but for the pipes it wasn't so bad. The hard water deposits coat the inside of the lead pipes and then there is no more lead in the water.

    --

    -- ssoorrrryy,, dduupplleexx sswwiittcchh oonn.. -Quote found on actual fortune cookie.
  43. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Capt.DrumkenBum · · Score: 1

    "underage MALE prostitutes appeal to pope"

    FTFY. :)

    --
    If I were God, wouldn't I protect my churches from acts of me?
  44. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by Atzanteol · · Score: 1

    Ignore the trolls - this is indeed a *terrible* headline. I had to re-read bits a few times to make sense of it as well. "Track Plays" should probably be in quotes or hyphenated or something to indicate that it's a single "thing."

    --
    "Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge"

    - Charles Darwin
  45. Re: Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headl by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Like cheese? Er, why would they do that? Did they think it tasted good, or was it for medicinal reasons?

  46. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by mjwx · · Score: 1

    Learning (v.? n.?) reading (v.? n.?) comprehension helps too.

    Gah!

    No issues for me understanding what they meant with that headline. And I'm not even a native English speaker.

    Well, good for you. Maybe it helps that you're not a native English speaker, and are less familiar with the alternate meanings of some words. I happen to have a very good handle on the written word, so maybe that's why I'm overly sensitive to these things.

    My point is not that the headline is more likely to be misread than read correctly (although I suspect this particular one might be), but that ambiguity can and should be avoided regardless.

    His English is fine, the headlines English is fine. Yours is terrible if you cant understand context, which is central to the English language.

    Words in English have multiple meanings and connotation depending on where and how they are used, if you didn't understand what the GP meant by "Learning" and "Reading" then your English is just not up to the task. You seem to be treating English as a language free of ambiguity that only has one definition per word, this is horribly, horribly wrong. Context is important and you're taking words out of context to make a point, this means your point is wrong (because you had to remove context to make it).

    Now the headline uses colloquialisms that make perfect sense to anyone who understands western culture, so most people will read it correctly. Now whether colloquialisms should be used in headlines, that's an actually a real and quite valid debate but considering this is Slashdot and fairly informal it doesn't really apply here and it's not the point you're making.

    --
    Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
  47. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by mcgrew · · Score: 1

    If I had mod points you'd get some. An illiterate can't read at all, an aliterate has to sound the words out. Ambiguity is easy to avoid for the literate writer who doesn't sound words out when he reads as long as he's proofread what he's written. The aliterate can't understand this, not realizing that the literate not only don't hear the words unless they're in quotes, they don't see them -- they see and hear what the words convey rather than the words themselves.

    The spoken word is indeed ambiguous. Did the Beatles sing "Lets all get up and dance to a song that was a hit before your mother was born, though she was born a long long time ago. Your mother should know" or did they sing "Lets all get up and dance to a song. That was a hippie four. Your mother was born, though she was born a long long time ago. Your mother should, no?"

    The written word can be ambiguous (like the title, and like a lot of headlines in mainstream newspapers) but it doesn't have to be if properly edited.

  48. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 1

    if you didn't understand what the GP meant by "Learning" and "Reading" then your English is just not up to the task.

    Of course I understood it, but it still took me slightly longer to interpret it than some less ambiguous choice of words would have, just like the headline.

    You seem to be treating English as a language free of ambiguity that only has one definition per word, this is horribly, horribly wrong.

    I'm doing exactly the opposite of that!

    you're taking words out of context to make a point

    Yes, yes I am! My point is that the words don't have a context until you've successfully parsed them, which is made harder by the use of ambiguous words - especially multiple ambiguous words strung together like that.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  49. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by chrismcb · · Score: 1

    My point is not that the headline...

    You do realize that MOST headlines are written to be a play on words.
    You also seem to have forgotten that some words can also be adjectives.

  50. Re:Noun, verb, noun noun verb (or: terrible headli by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 1

    You do realize that MOST headlines are written to be a play on words.

    I'd dispute that. This one certainly wasn't.

    You also seem to have forgotten that some words can also be adjectives.

    No I didn't.

    Top (adj.? v.?)

    See? Admittedly I did forget it could be a noun.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  51. Nice profit by seas2day · · Score: 1

    Seems to me with his $30 investment and $1000 return, that is some nice ROI! Should have kept his little secret to himself.

  52. The new genre... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And now we have dubstep....