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Apollo 8 Astronaut Re-Creates 1968 Christmas Broadcast To Earth

Hugh Pickens DOT Com writes "AP reports that standing by a part of the Apollo 8 spacecraft he once rode, retired astronaut James Lovell read the 1968 Christmastime broadcast from the day he and two others became the first humans to orbit the moon marking the 45th anniversary of the orbit and the famous broadcast. 'The idea of bringing people together by a flight to the moon where we encompassed everybody in our thoughts is still very valid today,' says Lovell. 'The words that we read are very appropriate.' Millions tuned in on Dec. 24, 1968, when Frank Borman, Bill Anders and Lovell circled the moon. A television camera on board took footage of the crater-filled surface as the astronauts read Bible verses describing the creation of Earth. They circled 10 times and began reading from the Book of Genesis on the last orbit. 'It's a foundation of Christianity, Judaism and Islam,' Lovell said of choosing Genesis. 'It is the foundation of most of the world's religions. ... They all had that basis of the Old Testament.' Lovell says at the time the astronauts weren't sure who would be listening and how the broadcast would be taken. The famous "Earthrise" photo was also taken during the mission. Lovell closed with the same message the astronauts did in 1968. 'From the crew of Apollo 8, we close with good night, good luck, a Merry Christmas and God bless all of you, all of you on the good Earth.'"

93 of 152 comments (clear)

  1. Good thing they recreated it. by behrooz0az · · Score: 1

    It's become really foggy in my mind. Anybody can remind me which state it was they played the movie inside of?

    --
    Moderating "-1, Disagree" is simple censorship. Have the guts to post your opinion. -- Spazmania (174582)
    1. Re:Good thing they recreated it. by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Yeah, it was a long time ago. I didn't even remember it until slashdot jogged my memory.

      I'd get these pesky kids off your lawn but they keep handing me beers and hitters... damn, it's 1968 again! Are we still at war?

    2. Re:Good thing they recreated it. by plopez · · Score: 1

      Area 52

      --
      putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
    3. Re:Good thing they recreated it. by fustakrakich · · Score: 2

      Are we still at war?

      Yep. After the landing the following year, not much happened, except TV sets don't weigh so much anymore..

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    4. Re:Good thing they recreated it. by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      TV sets didn't start weighing less until this century, my 2002 weighs 215 lbs. And have you forgotten that there were few TV remotes (they were ultrasound back then and only on the most expensive TVs), no PCs, no internet, no cell phones, and my favorite technological advancement, the miraculous CrystaLens.

      I guess you also forgot the Voyagers, telescopes in space, probes to other planets, rovers on Mars... don't forget, NASA isn't about adventure, it's about science and technology.

    5. Re:Good thing they recreated it. by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

      I guess you forgot about sarcasm. It was a rip-off of an old National Lampoon bit. And I do remember the old 'clickers' which were actually piezoelectric crystals.

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    6. Re:Good thing they recreated it. by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      I still don't see the sarcasm. Looks like a case of Poe's Law.

    7. Re:Good thing they recreated it. by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

      You had to be there

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
  2. Most of the world's religions? No. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The book of Genesis is certainly not the foundation of most of the world's religions. There are hundreds of religions with more than a million followers each. In demographic terms it may be closer, with followers of Abrahamic religions making up close to half of the world population. However there are billions adhering to other faiths, especially Hinduism and Buddhism.

    1. Re:Most of the world's religions? No. by cold+fjord · · Score: 3, Informative

      ... followers of Abrahamic religions making up close to half of the world population

      More than half actually.

      The Global Religious Landscape

      The demographic study – based on analysis of more than 2,500 censuses, surveys and population registers – finds 2.2 billion Christians (32% of the world’s population), 1.6 billion Muslims (23%), 1 billion Hindus (15%), nearly 500 million Buddhists (7%) and 14 million Jews (0.2%) around the world as of 2010. In addition, more than 400 million people (6%) practice various folk or traditional religions, including African traditional religions, Chinese folk religions, Native American religions and Australian aboriginal religions. An estimated 58 million people – slightly less than 1% of the global population – belong to other religions, including the Baha’i faith, Jainism, Sikhism, Shintoism, Taoism, Tenrikyo, Wicca and Zoroastrianism, to mention just a few.1

      At the same time, the new study by the Pew Forum also finds that roughly one-in-six people around the globe (1.1 billion, or 16%) have no religious affiliation. This makes the unaffiliated the third-largest religious group worldwide, behind Christians and Muslims, and about equal in size to the world’s Catholic population. Surveys indicate that many of the unaffiliated hold some religious or spiritual beliefs (such as belief in God or a universal spirit) even though they do not identify with a particular faith.

      --
      much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
    2. Re:Most of the world's religions? No. by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Censuses, surveys and population registers are all hopeless ways of determining people's religion. In many countries they don't ask about religion on such things, and when they do it tends to get conflated with race and heritage rather than an individuals's actually belief. Many people claim their young children share their religion when they are too young to even understand it, and even adults often feel pressured to say they are one thing to avoid upsetting their families. It's almost like finding it hard to come out as gay.

      ln Europe church attendance is an order of magnitude lower than the number of people claiming to be Christian. In the UK it's something like 65% claim to be Christian, mostly CofE, but only about 5% go to church regularly.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    3. Re:Most of the world's religions? No. by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      The book of Genesis is certainly not the foundation of most of the world's religions.

      Wrong, skippy. A third of the world's population is Christian, a third is Muslim. Two thirds of the world's religious people read Genesis.

      AND, the Buddhist Thais have a "garden of Eden" story that is very similar to the version of the Abrahamic religions. In their story, people were happy and loving and sharing, and then the evil Cats taught people to talk and they've been arguing and fighting ever since.

      Note that in the Abrahamic version, the snake had legs and God took them away as punishment. Also note how snake eyes and cat eyes are similar. What was most interesting to me is that when two old Thai women are arguing, it sounds like cats fighting, and "Meow" is Thai for "I want".

    4. Re:Most of the world's religions? No. by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      ln Europe church attendance is an order of magnitude lower than the number of people claiming to be Christian.

      Church doesn't make you a Christian, accepting Jesus as your savior makes you a Christian. I haven't been to church since Easter, but that doesn't mean I'm not reading my bible or that I don't accept Jesus.

  3. Christmas by BringsApples · · Score: 1, Troll

    As divided as we all seem to be these days, Christmas still seems to be a time when we each can remove these mental boundaries and see humanity for what it is, regardless of our religious (or lack thereof) preferences.

    In nature, when it's summer time, and food is plenty, generally wild animals fight for food, fight for mates, and fight for whatever else they see fit to fight over. But when it's cold, food is scarce and everything seems to be fighting to live, even some wild animals share what is available.

    Merry Christmas everyone. I hope it was/is filled with the things that you love most.

    --
    Politics; n. : A religion whereby man is god.
    1. Re:Christmas by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Merry Christmas everyone. I hope it was/is filled with the things that you love most.

      See my sig*. Oh, and we're offtopic...

      *May not be valid after Christmas

    2. Re:Christmas by waimate · · Score: 2

      But when it's cold, food is scarce and everything seems to be fighting to live, even some wild animals share what is available. Merry Christmas everyone.

      Well, I've looked out the window, and it's none of those things. The sun is shining, it's hot, the grass is green and I think I might go for a swim. Oh, and by the way, it's also tomorrow.

      You hemispherist, you.

    3. Re:Christmas by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      As divided as we all seem to be these days, Christmas still seems to be a time when we each can remove these mental boundaries and see humanity for what it is, regardless of our religious (or lack thereof) preferences.

      ...a creature able to turn everything and anything supposedly "holy" into a cash cow?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    4. Re:Christmas by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      In nature, when it's summer time, and food is plenty, generally wild animals fight for food, fight for mates, and fight for whatever else they see fit to fight over. But when it's cold, food is scarce and everything seems to be fighting to live, even some wild animals share what is available.

      What? Are you totally retarded?
      When there is plenty for all, and life is easy, wild animals avoid fighting whenever possible - because there is no advantage to be gained, and everything to be lost. But when times are hard, and food is scarce, animals fight for what little there is, or else they will die.

    5. Re:Christmas by BringsApples · · Score: 1

      You and others (heh, I'm marked troll for wishing everyone a merry christmas) misunderstood my point. I never said 'christmas = cold'.

      Christmas is a celebration (for either hemisphere as far as I know) of winter solstice (the shortest day of the year). Some people will argue that it's about Jesus' birthday, but, to me, that's silly (What does a christmas tree, santa clause, trading presents, and a bunch of food have to do with Jesus?) The reason, as far as I know, is because it's cold, crops are dead, and generally the only thing that can be done in that time is come together and share. Obviously during the summer time, this isn't the case. What hemisphere you are in makes no difference.

      Do you guys do anything for winter solstice in June?

      --
      Politics; n. : A religion whereby man is god.
    6. Re:Christmas by waimate · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure what you're saying. I think you're saying christmas is a shortest day celebration, and that therefore in the southern hemisphere christmas should be observed in June. I think you're saying the southern hemisphere is doing the right thing on the wrong date.

      If you never said 'christmas == cold' (two equal signs, note), you certainly did say 'christmas == shortest day', and by virtue of physics 'shortest day == cold'.

      Seasons are local effects, but many inwardly-focussed societies don't grasp that. Whenever I see an ad that says "coming this summer", my immediate reaction is "when the fuck is that?". I'm not being obtuse for the sake of it, I'm just being tripped up by someone using a metric that is not appropriate for indicating time. I have to consider a) where I am, b) where the ad writer was, c) whether the ad writer has a global view (usually not), d) convert.

      What do you in the north do to celebrate the shortest day of the year in the southern hemisphere? I'm guessing not much (and rightly so) !

    7. Re:Christmas by BringsApples · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure what you're saying. I think you're saying christmas is a shortest day celebration, and that therefore in the southern hemisphere christmas should be observed in June. I think you're saying the southern hemisphere is doing the right thing on the wrong date.

      What I'm saying is that Christmas, as celebrated, came to be so because of how cold it is, and how many plants, that during the summer months bear fruit, do not bear fruit, food can be scarce, and life generally gets harder. So people came to take the evergreen trees, decorate them, share gifts, share food, all in the name of 'things will be okay soon, as this is the shortest day of the year, so now things will generally begin to warm back up'. Where you are in the world does make this winter-solstice-experience quite different, but that's only to what degree the coldness sets in - ie, how close to the equator you are.

      I'm just being tripped up by someone using a metric that is not appropriate for indicating time

      What about 'shortest day' is it that trips you up? No matter where you are on the globe, the shortest day is the coldest day. It doesn't matter what time that happens. It's either in June or December, you are left to pick which applies to you, not me. If you remove "b)" and "c)", then "d)" is also irrelevant. What I said holds true regardless.

      However now that we've had this conversation, when I'm swimming in June, I'm going to be thinking of you and hoping that you're able to have the things that you love the most with you, and not freezing to death, or starving.

      Hooroo!

      --
      Politics; n. : A religion whereby man is god.
    8. Re:Christmas by waimate · · Score: 1

      What about 'shortest day' is it that trips you up?

      It's that when the advert says "Jaws 12, coming to a theatre near you not far from the longest day of the year", I have no idea when to don my Jaws 11 T-shirt and head down to the multiplex.

      Anyway, happy Generic Solstice to you !

    9. Re:Christmas by BringsApples · · Score: 1

      Wrong, that's a human trait. Go out in the woods during the winter, see how deer behave. Then go watch during the summer. Then, go back the next winter again. Maybe look up "deer yard", see what that's about. Yeah, they'll fight a little bit over the last piece of food, but it's nothing like it is in summer.

      If you're to much of a pussy to get out in the woods during the cold winter, then simply toss out some bread into your yard, watch how the birds behave. Then, do that same thing in the summer, watch the birds then.

      --
      Politics; n. : A religion whereby man is god.
  4. Orders by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    China went to the moon. Now go dig out some of the cool stuff NASA did before we started funding useless wars for no gain instead.

    We can't look like we're second to china...

    Remind everyone what cool stuff we used to do.

    Oh. By the way. You can't spend any money to do it.

    1. Re:Orders by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I'm sure the American citizens who are homeless and hungry on this Christmas night really give a flying fuck about nationalistic ego-stroking. We've fallen. Deal with it. We sure as shit shouldn't borrow billions of dollars from the Chinese to try to one-up the Chinese in a pointless pissing match.

    2. Re:Orders by MobSwatter · · Score: 2

      Yeah, like back before some oil guy handed the NSA NASA's budget for the oil wa.. err ah.. war on terrorism. Yeah, like back when we still had a space program.

    3. Re:Orders by cold+fjord · · Score: 2

      Now go dig out some of the cool stuff NASA did before we started funding useless wars for no gain instead.

      You do realize that the US Apollo missions to the moon occurred concurrently with the US involvement with the Vietnam war, when military spending took twice the relative bite out of the economy as it does today? Maybe not.

      You should also be clear about how the spending of Federal tax dollars has changed over the years. (Don't like the source? Find another one, it won't really change if the numbers are honest*.)

      * Honest Federal spending will include both "mandatory" and "discretionary" spending. Some sites mislead by excluding mandatory spending to distort the burden of social welfare spending versus defense spending.

      --
      much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
    4. Re:Orders by FatLittleMonkey · · Score: 1

      Some sites mislead by excluding mandatory spending to distort the burden of social welfare spending versus defense spending.

      And some sites mislead by including the stand-alone SS Trust Fund as if it were a regular budget item.

      --
      Science is all about firing a drunk pig out of a cannon just to see what happens.
    5. Re:Orders by cold+fjord · · Score: 2

      It doesn't really matter.

      MYTHS AND MISINFORMATION ABOUT SOCIAL SECURITY- Part 2

      Starting in 1969 (due to action by the Johnson Administration in 1968) the transactions to the Trust Fund were included in what is known as the "unified budget." This means that every function of the federal government is included in a single budget. This is sometimes described by saying that the Social Security Trust Funds are "on-budget." This budget treatment of the Social Security Trust Fund continued until 1990 when the Trust Funds were again taken "off-budget." This means only that they are shown as a separate account in the federal budget. But whether the Trust Funds are "on-budget" or "off-budget" is primarily a question of accounting practices--it has no effect on the actual operations of the Trust Fund itself.

      RL33028: Social Security: The Trust Fund

      --
      much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
    6. Re:Orders by FatLittleMonkey · · Score: 1

      The expanded Trust Fund was intended to pay for the "population bubble" of the retiring baby boomers. That means it gained value for decades (something like $3 trillion), until the number of retiring boomers outweighs the current workers paying in, then it is intended to decline until the boomers die out. In accounting terms, it's an accumulating asset, but it's also a future liability (and it's a revenue item and an expense). Then the Trust invests in US Treasuries, so it's both an investment asset, and a debt liability. How you account for that clearly matters when discussing the budget. (And there are lots of games people play, and knots that people twist themselves into.) But how you account for the Trust in the budget clearly doesn't affect the function of the Trust itself. (Unless people make stupid decisions based of those accounting games. "Ohnoes, Social Security will be "bankrupt" by...2025...2030...2050...! We must cut payments, or else we risk possibly having to... ummm... cut payments!")

      The most honest thing, IMO, when talking about the US budget in general, is to simply recognise the Trust Fund as a stand-alone entity with its own revenue and expense streams, disconnected from the ordinary budget, and leave it out of the discussion entirely.

      --
      Science is all about firing a drunk pig out of a cannon just to see what happens.
    7. Re:Orders by meglon · · Score: 1
      Lets get more to the point:

      Section 8:

      The Congress shall have Power To....

      To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions

      When exactly was the last insurrection or invasion?

      Further, it's immaterial what our GDP is, the only reason to compare spending as a percentage of GDP is to hide how significant the percentage of spending your number is. For 2012 DoD's budget was $651B, Veteran's Affairs $124B, and another $47B on DHS... for a rousing direct cost of $822B (22.2% of all spending); NASA's budget was $18B (.49%). Add in non-direct defense spending, and estimates go up to the $1.2-$1.4T range (32%-38%).

      So.. back to the big question: When exactly was the last insurrection or invasion? That's what our military is supposed to be for.

      --
      Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
    8. Re:Orders by cold+fjord · · Score: 1

      After declaring war on the United States in 1996, the international terrorist organization known as Al Qaida, which comprised elements of the armed forces and government of Afghanistan, conducted an attack on the United States of comparable magnitude to the attack by the Empire of Japan on Perl Harbor in 1941 in terms of loss of life and economic damage on 11 September 2001. They attacked targets in both New York City and Washington DC, having attacked American embassies and military forces previously, and many other targets subsequently. The conflict continues.

      --
      much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
    9. Re: Orders by cold+fjord · · Score: 1

      "Bin Laden determined to do something, somewhere, at some unknown time." That is not really helpful for security planning. It wouldn't have mattered if President Bush was sitting in NORAD at the time, little would have changed. You should really rethink your views on this, they are unserious.

      --
      much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
    10. Re:Orders by ganjadude · · Score: 1

      If I remember correctly, the president you are refering to had a plan for NASA to bring us back to the moon before 2020, and the new president scrapped that plan.... so maybe we should get our facts right before we blame a president who deserves alot of blame, blame him on something he actually tried to do right

      --
      have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
    11. Re:Orders by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      cold fjord: comparable magnitude to the attack by the Empire of Japan on Perl...

      -

      AC: You would think a self-styled "security expert" like COld Fjord(sic) would know how to spell Pearl Harbor.

      Nah, see, he's just learned Python and has had an epiphany about the incredible damage that has been done to our economy by Perl.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  5. Religions by LMariachi · · Score: 1

    'It is the foundation of most of the world's religions. ... They all had that basis of the Old Testament.'

    I know you can’t be a dumbass and make the astronaut corps, so I’m a little confused as to how he could be saying something so stupid. The Old Testament is the foundation of exactly three of the world’s major religions (and that’s counting Judaism as arguably major.) It’s irrelevant to half the world’s population.

    1. Re:Religions by Beeftopia · · Score: 4, Informative

      Pew Research report: "The Global Religious Landscape", with global numerical breakdowns.

    2. Re:Religions by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      'It is the foundation of most of the world's religions. ... They all had that basis of the Old Testament.'

      I know you can’t be a dumbass and make the astronaut corps, so I’m a little confused as to how he could be saying something so stupid. The Old Testament is the foundation of exactly three of the world’s major religions (and that’s counting Judaism as arguably major.) It’s irrelevant to half the world’s population.

      54% is still more than half. http://www.adherents.com/Religions_By_Adherents.html

    3. Re:Religions by mcgrew · · Score: 2

      Wrong. A third are Christian, a third are Muslim, half of the rest are other religions such as Judaism, Hinduism and Buddhism. You atheists and antitheists only make up 10% of everyone (the rest are agnostic).

    4. Re:Religions by LMariachi · · Score: 1

      We atheists and antitheists know that 54% != 2/3.

    5. Re:Religions by Jherek+Carnelian · · Score: 2

      Religion of ALL kinds harms humanity far more than helps it.

      That's an unfalsifiable claim, but I can try.

      The religious impulse seems to be an evolutionary adaption. Lots of "atheists" still exhibit other forms of faith like an implicit trust in ideologies like libertarianism, democracy, science, etc.

      I'm not saying those things are automatically religious, far from it. I'm saying that a lot of people are less than skeptical of them in the same way that 'religious' people are less than skeptical of their belief systems. At some point you have to put your trust in something because there just aren't enough hours in the day to verify everything from first principles. But even so, a lot of people go beyond trust as a matter of expediency and are unwilling to consider the possibility for error in the same way that religious people are often unwilling to question doctrine.

      So, if this religious impulse is such a wide-spread evolutionary adaption then it stands to reason that it has a net positive value to the human species.

    6. Re:Religions by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      Sorry, you are wrong. The problem is that no accurate statistics exist and it is difficult to even ask people. For example "Jew" is both a race and religious identify. Most parents will state that their children share their religion on census forms even if they are too young to understand it or simply don't believe.

      For example in the UK something like 65% of people put Christian on their census forms (or more likely had it put for them by the head of the household). Even so church attendance is about 5%, so it seems like the vast majority are not active members of their religion.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    7. Re:Religions by SuricouRaven · · Score: 2

      Religion in the UK is usually a much more private matter than in the US. Most of our believers do not feel the need to proclaim it from the rooftops as is a common practice in the US.

    8. Re:Religions by SuricouRaven · · Score: 2

      Depends on definitions. Speak to much of europe and you'll find a lot of people, a majority in some countries, who insist they are Christians very strongly - yet they don't go to church, don't factor the religion into any decision they make, have never done more than skim a few verses of the bible and can't state the most fundamental precepts of the faith if questioned. Do you call them Christian or not? Most surveys work based on self-identification. I don't know what the situation is like in other regions of the world, but I expect there is something of a similiar effect. Except perhaps for Islam - their frequent public rituals would make it rather hard to be a muslim without at least going through all the appropriate motions, especially in countries where failure to comply would result in conseqences ranging from social exclusion and loss of employment to execution.

    9. Re:Religions by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      Selective dumbassness. Just because someone is part of the world's elite in on field, doesn't mean they can't be ignorant upon a completly unrelated topic.

    10. Re:Religions by FatLittleMonkey · · Score: 1

      The religious impulse seems to be an evolutionary adaption.

      Dawkins and co generalise it as "magical thinking", rather than just "religion". It's a stage of childhood development, and we're all prone to elements of it as adults, but some people (a minority) see it as an type of mistake. Others see it as a positive and celebrate it.

      So, if this religious impulse is such a wide-spread evolutionary adaption then it stands to reason that it has a net positive value to the human species.

      You mean like our attraction to sugar/fat/salt? Just because something was appropriate when we lived in small stone age tribes, doesn't mean it works in a technological civilisations of 7 billion people.

      --
      Science is all about firing a drunk pig out of a cannon just to see what happens.
    11. Re:Religions by kanweg · · Score: 2

      "Religion has nothing whatsoever to do with evolution."

      I think it has.
      - people have a greater chance of survival if they cooperate. If there is a further possible bond (apart from being family), than that can help.
      - it can also help against power. Suppose the chief of your clan is a grumpy strong man. You could lose your life. But if you tell him that you're in contact with higher powers that will punish him if he doesn't alter his behavior, then that can help you survive.
      - it made for good stories in a time without internet. What have you been doing today? Herding the goats. Oh. Well, let me tell you a story (in the bible, there's a story about a well that was sealed off with a rock that required three people to move it. Or a bald guy who was yelled at by kids and bears came out of the wood and killed the kids. What do you think: It is something that god really wanted to tell us or was a good story at the campfire?).

      So, while only my hypothesis, I think that there may well be a genetic component to religion/the ease with which humans can be deluded.

      Bert

    12. Re:Religions by meglon · · Score: 1

      Depends on definitions. Speak to much of the US and you'll find a lot of people, a majority, who insist they are Christians very strongly - yet while they go to church, Jesus' teachings don't factor the into any decision they make, have never done more than skim a few verses of the bible and can't state the most fundamental precepts of the faith if questioned. Do you call them Christian or not?

      --
      Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
    13. Re:Religions by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      And for some people (like the parent post) the bashing of the concept of religion is their religion.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    14. Re:Religions by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      It is for most Americans as well. It's only a tiny vocal minority rying to shove it down peoples' throats.

    15. Re:Religions by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Apparently you fellows aren't very good at math. 54% is far less than 66%, and where did you get that 54% from, Richard Dawkins? I've looked up the statistics in a lot of places and atheists are fewer than 15% of the world's population.

    16. Re:Religions by LMariachi · · Score: 1

      The Pew source is linked upthread; Wikipedia and adherents.com say pretty much the same. 54 is (roughly) the percentage of the world’s population that claims adherence to an Abrahamic religion. You’re the one who pulled the 2/3rds figure from somewhere.

      Even if the OT were irrelevant to only 1/3rd of the world, is that supposed to be significantly better? And you appear to have a wild hair about atheism, but I wasn’t complaining that he used a religious text, rather calling out his ignorant statement as to its universality.

    17. Re:Religions by LMariachi · · Score: 1

      Oh, and != means “not equal to.”

    18. Re: Religions by Duhavid · · Score: 1

      There are many Christians ( not sure about other religions, they may have theirs ) seeking to help humanity.

      My Church, for example, collects and sends money and people to many places around the world to help.
      We have established hospitals and sent doctors and nurses many places.
      Many have given up successful careers in the western world to serve for a pittance.

      --
      emt 377 emt 4
    19. Re: Religions by Jherek+Carnelian · · Score: 1

      Every person brought up believing sky god bullshit is a person (usually) not solving actual problems and advancing the human condition.

      I think that if you left out any reference to religion, that statement would be just as true.

    20. Re: Religions by ganjadude · · Score: 1

      jews christians and muslims make up about 2/3rds of the worlds population, sources are in this thread.

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      have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
    21. Re:Religions by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Doh! Had a bit of a "senior moment" there.

    22. Re:Religions by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Hmm, it seems there are fewer Muslims than whatever I read said. You appear to be correct.

    23. Re: Religions by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      Whoosh!

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  6. How did they? by jfdavis668 · · Score: 2

    Did they orbit the Moon again?

    1. Re:How did they? by FatLittleMonkey · · Score: 1

      He was at the Armstrong Centre, Kennedy City, here at Tranquillity.

      Lovell was visiting to help open the new "giant baseline" optical array, at the Lovell Dark-Sky Park over on farside. On his way home, he apparently decided to do the broadcast from here. TFS doesn't mention but this month is also the 30th anniversary of our first permanent dome, so they made it a bit of a thing; and there were quite a few of the old-timers visiting.

      My apartment is nearby but I didn't go. Busy working at bójin kuàng. I had it on the crawler's radio, but honestly it's all so typically American, wallowing in the past while the rest of us are out here working -- then bitching because the magnetic flux from the big cargo launches are messing up their precious footprints. Gorram groundhugging báichi yóukè...

      --
      Science is all about firing a drunk pig out of a cannon just to see what happens.
  7. Profound moments by TrollstonButterbeans · · Score: 2

    Would have been exciting to be around back when Sputnik took off or men orbited or landed on the moon.

    Wonder how long it will be until another major leap for humanity.

    Perhaps the Wright Brothers achieving flight or Columbus discovering the New World fits in that category.

    These days, we have to settle for technological achievements like the start of the world wide web or the launch of the iPhone --- maybe New Horizons flying past Pluto will be a bit of a "first ever" moment for humanity here in a bit over a year.

    --
    Priest: "Universe from nothing, no laws of physics, sped up time"+ huge discrepancies. Creationism? No. Big Bang Theory
    1. Re:Profound moments by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      It's just a Shane that with all that scientific advancement they couldn't get away from a fairy story like Genesis. They tried to bring the world together with that reading but ended up demonstrating how it is divided by superstition and dogma.

      I imagine it was a bit of a poke at the godless soviets as well. I'm really glad they didn't do it when landing on the moon as well.

      --
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    2. Re:Profound moments by demonlapin · · Score: 1

      Travel back in time 20 years. Grab me. I'm a 19-year-old college freshman home for Christmas break.

      I can't check my email, because there aren't any commercial ISPs where I live and long-distance is brutally expensive (and the college's modem bank is only 2400 bps, anyway), but that's okay because almost nobody I know outside of a few college friends uses email. The WWW is still largely theoretical. Next summer, I'll be able to get free 2400 bps service from a local university by working in a lab there, but meanwhile my 14.4k modem is stuck checking the old local BBSes. I have a 66 MHz 486 with a 540 MB hard drive and 16 MB memory. Its monitor does 1024x768. I've got a Creative SoundBlaster 16, so I can record really short clips in CD quality and play them back, marveling at how good they sound.

      Now, tell me that in twenty years I'll be carrying a device in my pocket that has 2 GB of memory, 32 GB of storage on a chip, a 1500 MHz processor, built-in data and telephony (and data will be ~10 Mbit in good service areas), with better resolution. It works almost everywhere on earth. It has the ability to use GPS to map where I am and show me how to get places, and it can even translate languages for me (badly, but well enough to be understood). And it will be a year and a half old and I'll be thinking of replacing it.

      Those technological achievements are happening for everyone on earth. I couldn't even dream of this stuff when I was a kid. I mean, there was that science-fiction novel (from the fifties) whose premise was that on January 1, 2000, they abolished all long-distance charges for the entire world (along with all the flying cars and stuff). We're basically there, now, for those who know how to set up SIP. My grandmother was born in a world where cars were hand-built curiosities; she died just after Berners-Lee announced the Web. That entire time, we've been accelerating.

    3. Re:Profound moments by TrollstonButterbeans · · Score: 1

      It is nice to have something with about the equivalent of a 2004-2005 era PC in the palm of your hand complete with sound and wifi networking and OpenGL support. Modern phones are undeniably amazing devices ---- Agreed.

      --
      Priest: "Universe from nothing, no laws of physics, sped up time"+ huge discrepancies. Creationism? No. Big Bang Theory
    4. Re:Profound moments by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      Imagine? I'm all but certain of it. This was the same era when congress voted to add 'under god' to the pledge of allegence and change the national motto to 'in god we trust.' Both of which very much were ways to raise the national middle finger at the godless soviets.

    5. Re:Profound moments by MachineShedFred · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Part of the reason they didn't do it when they made the landing, was because of all the hell (read: lawsuit from an atheist) that NASA caught from this reading on Apollo 8. Buzz Aldrin was (is) a deeply religious man, and observed communion in the LM after landing on the moon, after making this comment on the public radio loop:

      "This is the LM pilot. I'd like to take this opportunity to ask every person listening in, whoever and wherever they may be, to pause for a moment and contemplate the events of the past few hours and to give thanks in his or her own way."

      He wanted the communion to be broadcast, but had the sense to ask first, and due to the lawsuit it was deemed to not be a good idea.

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      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    6. Re:Profound moments by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      I was thinking about all the incredible things that my grandmother saw happen in her lifetime - she was born not long after the first flight at Kitty Hawk, and saw the aerospace industry develop from glorified powered gliders to moon landings to jet airliners that everyday people can travel the world on. Automobiles from something only the rich had, into something that everyone had. Telegraphs to television to digital cellular phones on global communications networks. The Farmer's Almanac to weather satellites and phased radar. Actual ice boxes to modern refrigeration. Antibiotics. Organ transplants. Eradication of polio and smallpox. Computers you can fit in a bag that are thousands of times more powerful than the ones that used to take up whole rooms, which were amazing for their time too. High-rise steel construction. The list goes on and on.

      This new narrative of "OMG we don't do anything any more, not like we used to" is completely unfounded, but hardly new. In 15 years it's likely that today's bioscience research will eradicate major diseases like HIV, and the cause the survival rate of cancer to continue it's climb. And in 15 years, people will continue to bitch that we just don't do any amazing things anymore, like they were doing 30 years ago when they were laying trans-ocean fiber links and launching global positioning constellations.

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    7. Re:Profound moments by ganjadude · · Score: 1

      I was down at kitty hawk just this past summer and let me tell you it fits right up there with dachau and washingtons headquarters in places that I have felt magic

      --
      have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
    8. Re:Profound moments by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Would have been exciting to be around back when Sputnik took off or men orbited or landed on the moon.

      I was around. I think I was six when Sputnik orbited (1958, wasn't it?) and I remember how much it freaked out all the adults. They freaked out even more when the Russians sent a man up there.

      Now, the Moon landing...

      Perhaps the Wright Brothers achieving flight or Columbus discovering the New World fits in that category.

      Ever seen Apollo 13? There's a scene where Lovell is talking to his wife on the night Neil and Buzz landed. Lovell says "Christopher Columbus... The Wright brothers... and Neil Armstrong??"

  8. ...Three laws of motion, Two rad divisors... by VortexCortex · · Score: 2

    ... and the Discovery of Gravity.
    Happy Grav-Mass!

    Why not celebrate comprehensible laws of physics that got your astronaut asses to the damn Moon by honoring Isaac Newton? You know, someone who was actually born on December 25th?

  9. How do we define the progress of technology? by Mister+Liberty · · Score: 4, Interesting

    You can ask many a thirtysomething and younger nowadays, and even some fourtysomething, "Did humans
    walk on the moon in your lifetime" and most will know the answer and some will respond "Did they ever?".

    Yet these are the millions going down the street heads down, ears cupped, submerged into their own lives (and
    thousands of so called 'friends' waiting to hear if the corner they rounded just now was to the left or right), these
    lives totally and entirely framed within some 4x3 illumination.

  10. Re:There is no audio link. by davester666 · · Score: 1

    You must be new here. Nobody bothers going to TFA because we already know it'll be useless. You need to bing [to keep with the original astroturfing above] for the real article yourself.

    --
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  11. Re:What a pity by Opportunist · · Score: 1

    Depends on who you ask. :)

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  12. This is like some old guy on his porch by Opportunist · · Score: 1

    I can't help but picture Lovell sitting on his porch, reminiscing of how great we were and how good the times were and how much everything was better back then... ...and being one of the few people who're right when they say everything used to be better... even the future.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  13. Typical Judeo-Christian attitude by msobkow · · Score: 2

    If you're talking about the number of sects and splinter groups, then maybe "It is the foundation of most of the world's religions. ... They all had that basis of the Old Testament." But if you're talking about the population of believers, the Hindus and Buddhists might have a thing or two to say about that.

    --
    I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
    1. Re:Typical Judeo-Christian attitude by msobkow · · Score: 1

      More importantly, most of China follows various "philosophies". They don't even call them "religions."

      --
      I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
    2. Re:Typical Judeo-Christian attitude by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      because religions are illegal there.. ever thought about that?

      so they just call them philosophies.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    3. Re:Typical Judeo-Christian attitude by crimson+tsunami · · Score: 1

      Rubbish
      Your a few years out of date

    4. Re:Typical Judeo-Christian attitude by msobkow · · Score: 1

      I said "Judeo-Christian" for a reason: I've never met a Muslim who studies the Bible. While they are to live in peace with the Jews and Christians according to the Koran, their book is the Koran, not the Bible.

      It's as if you were claiming the US legal system is British because the original settlers were mostly from the UK.

      --
      I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
    5. Re:Typical Judeo-Christian attitude by msobkow · · Score: 1

      Believing in the same God isn't believing in the same book.

      --
      I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
  14. simple-minded atheist drivel by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Lumping all religions together and then assigning blame to "religion" for many discreet misdeeds committed by practitioners of various religions is like lumping together all secular thought and then blaming "secularism" for all non-religious bad acts. Sorry, but physics is not responsible for what some 1930's Germans did with phrenology, and Chemistry is not at fault for Stalin's massacres. Catholics are not responsible for human sacrifices by the Aztecs, Protestant Christians are entirely blameless for both the Crusades and the Inquisition.

    WHAT somebody believes and what ACTIONS that person takes as a result are FAR more important than whether or not a person HAS beliefs.... and that goes just as much for religious beliefs as for non-religious beliefs. You might like to slime "religion" but those same religious people have done more to feed, heal, clothe, and educate people than any atheist groups have ever done.

    Oh, and while the Apollo missions were great scientific and technical accomplishments, most of the people involved where Christians and/or Jews and the overall endeavor was a fantastic HUMAN achievement that also involved the human spirit, philosophy, art, culture, etc

  15. Most of the world religions? by manquer · · Score: 1

    'It is the foundation of most of the world's religions. ...

    Last I checked neither India nor China follow any of the Abrahmic religions dominantly. They constitute at-least 40% of world population? (even back in '68)..

  16. Religion and wars by Akratist · · Score: 1

    I don't really see much point in getting involved in a religious discussion, but just to set the record straight -- most wars are caused by the personal ambition and greed of the ruling class, and seldom have anything to do with religious beliefs of one side or the other. Jonathon Kolkey's World Wide War Project (www.worldwidewarproject.com) contains a body of supporting material for his thesis, which is generally borne out by examining various wars in history. At most, religion seems to be used as part of a vague, cynical appeal to a wide range of values and emotions, including cultural differences, nationality, past grievances, logical fallacies ("they break the small end of the egg, so they're evil!"), and so on. Even the Crusades seemed to be as much about an epic land grab as anything else.

    1. Re:Religion and wars by Tokolosh · · Score: 1

      Historically, the ruling class is established by violence and conquest. Once ensconced, the rulers and their heirs naturally want to keep on ruling, because of the perks. However, the need for, and danger of, continued violence and conquest leads them to appeal to divine right. So their status is legitimized by god, which the peasants accept, and the status quo maintained.

      Read "The Collapse of Complex Societies" for an interesting treatise.

      --
      Prove anything by multiplying Huge Number times Tiny Number
  17. Re:Oh, good. by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

    Merry Christmas.

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  18. Re:They all had that basis of the Old Testament by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

    Except for non-Abrahamic religions such as Hinduism, Buddhism and Shintoism (which by the way encompass more people.)

    No, they don't.

    I know, why bring actual data into a quantitative discussion...

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  19. Re:The 60's by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

    In the fantastic HBO series "From the Earth to the Moon" there was an entire episode entitled "1968" that conveys exactly that point. The last bit of dialog is someone in Mission Control relaying congratulatory telegrams to the crew capsule as they travel back to earth, with one being a telegram from someone that simply says "You saved 1968."

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    Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
  20. Re:Oh, good. by mcgrew · · Score: 1

    Odd that you're modded up, but responses (many very good) were modded offtopic. So I'll take my my downmod too -- your comment is not only barely on-topic (you only used the topic to bash religion) and it's flamebait.

    What is wrong with a religious scientist using religion to celebrate a scientific achievement that caused him (and many others) to have a religious experience? Over half of the world's scientists worship in one religion or another.

    Your troll is especially offensive being posted on Christians' most holy day and your link about something that happened four hundred years ago was icing on your trollcake. Are you going to say the Holocaust didn't happen this coming passover? It's the same damned thing, asshole.

    Your bigotry is forgiven, though. That's what Christians do. That's what Christianity is about -- love and forgiveness.

    Now repent your damned trolling.

  21. Re: You cannot solve poverty with money by ganjadude · · Score: 1

    The facts are we spend more money on "poverty prevention" which does nothing to stop it. We could give evry poor person a hundred grand for all the cash we spend on "poverty" but we dont, and why not?

    --
    have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
  22. Re:You cannot solve poverty with money by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

    Jesus said "For ye have the poor with you always"

    Not if we don't see to it that they are fed and housed, we won't.

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  23. Re:Oh, good. by mcgrew · · Score: 1

    Christ, if he existed (there's no evidence for that), wasn't born on the 25th -- or even in December,

    Biblical scholars say that Dec 25 was the date of conception.

    Santa isn't a Christian symbol. The tree isn't a Christian symbol. Commercialism and gift giving isn't a Christian symbol.

    Very true. Saint Nicholas was a real priest, but he was a mortal man who died.

    contradicts itself repeatedly,

    Examples?

    lacks validation by even one direct, contemporaneous witness

    The 1st century Roman historian Josephus

    Every once in a while, one of you starts to think clearly, and that's the end of the magical thinking.

    And once in a while one of you finds God, although I personally know only one such person, who was raised in an atheist household and found God after a bout of homelessness.

    Of course religion can be misused by evil men, there is nothing in the world that can't be.

  24. Re:Oh, good. by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

    Biblical scholars say that Dec 25 was the date of conception.

    No, they don't.

    Examples? [of contradictions in the bible]

    Sure

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus_on_Jesus [given as example of contemporaneous witness]

    Non-contemporaneous. Josephus, AKA Yosef Ben Matityahu A.D. (37 ~100+). Not at all contemporaneous with the time Christ was reported (by the bible) to have lived. There's no overlap at all. Christ would have died before Josephus was even born. So he won't do -- he's in the exact same position of someone born after the Heaven's Gate UFO cult had come and gone, attesting to the reality of the UFO itself, even though he never could have seen it himself, even to the extent that the UFO probably never existed at all, just as there is no actual evidence for Christ -- so far -- except the existence of the cult itself.

    Of course religion can be misused by evil men, there is nothing in the world that can't be.

    Agreed. However, my point is that the vast majority of religion, and particularly Christianity, is inherently evil. Christianity espouses (and worse, imposes) many harmful ideas in the name of a constipated, selfish morality. I have said many times, and will repeat here for the benefit of this conversation, that if Christians kept their craziness out of the legal system and out of government, I'd have no particular objection to any adult practicing/believing. Or, if they eschewed the craziness entirely and simply quietly worshipped with no attempts to enforce those ideas on others. However, that's not the case. From blue laws to sex to words we can or can't say to bibles in the courtroom and 6000-year old planet myths as (supposedly) science in schools, Christianity is highly active as an invasive, harmful force. It is in that role that I object to it most strongly. It has a terrible, dark history of interfering with other people's lives; I take that as a strong cautionary note, one that can be seen still echoing and taking root in modern society.

    --
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