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Oracle Seeking Community Feedback on Java 8 EE Plans
An anonymous reader writes with this quick bite from Info Q: "Oracle is seeking feedback from the Java community about what it should work on for the next version of Java EE, the popular and widely used enterprise framework. As well as standardizing APIs for PaaS and SaaS the vendor is looking at removing some legacy baggage including EJB 2.x remote and local client view (EJBObject, EJBLocalObject, EJBHome, and EJBLocalHome interfaces) and CORBA."
I learned java as my first "enterprise" language in school. Oracle is 100% enough motivation to never touch it again.
Oracle doesn't usually give a damn about what people want.
If so, they'd already know we don't want that stupid Ask.com toolbar and they should stop trying to sneak it in.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
There I said it. I want an object database and with a standardized interface. Entity beans and JPA can screw themselves.
Everyone is thinking it but everyone knows Larry doesn't give anything away for free. Even his free software costs you money somewhere...
"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
Ive found several benefits to removing Java 8 entirely.
1. budget performance: by reducing expenditures on support contracts and Oracle licensing fees my budget has stopped looking like a Syrian casualty report.
2. maintenance productivity: developers have stopped hurling themselves nude through my expensive plate glass windows as they wail 'exception access violation!' This frees up maintenance to address more urgent concerns.
3. Environmental impact: We've reduced out environmental footprint by shredding our tear-stained contracts, and mulching them with our ancient blood-soaked documentation to create a spreadable compost that just brings out the absolute best in the landscaping.
4. Wellness impact: Thanks to removing Java our datacenter now runs closer to the temperatures the CRACS were designed to endure. While common HR functions like the weekly jboss report run luau-themed weenie roast have unfortunately been ended, the number of sysops that survive provisioning has improved. Analysts are also no longer permitted to refer to the datacenter provisioning process as 'the trip to mordor'
Good people go to bed earlier.
Put fewer security holes in it. Maybe just one or two.
Don't make it full of security bugs.
Don't include crapware in the installer for the package and EVERY subsequent update.
Speaking of updates... Don't make it so fucking hard to customize the installation! Having to create transforms with Orca which break installations preventing future updates is a bunch of shit.
I guess what I'm trying to say is, don't try to be Adobe.
The security track record for anything java-related is so bad that they make Microsoft look good.
Java isn't that big a program - for a company of Oracle's size & resources this isn't that hard.
Sit down & spend 4 months looking at the code and clean it up.
Maybe hire Theo de Raadt for help :) He can be difficult to work with, but he doesn't compromise on secure coding practises.
Ah, can't get Applets to function without a bunch of nonsense? Is that a tear in Oracle's eye? Does Oracle want its mommy?
I didn't know there was still CORBA support in Java EE. In 2014. Wow.
Religous speak to God. Insane are spoken to by God. When all shut up, one can finally hear Shostakovich in peace
Ooh, add the Ask toolbar again. That's always a load of fun.
So is Slashdot not capable of having any kind of informative conversation about one of the most commercially popular and long-lived everyday programming languages, because "Oracle, LOL" and "Java applets suck"?
Popped in here hoping to see some insightful discussion about the future of Java, to help inform my possible decision as to whether or not to spend a lot of time and effort becoming a Java developer. So far, sadly disappointed. Nothing but Java and Oracle jokes as old as the hills.
Then again, this is Slashdot. I don't know why I was expecting any kind of mature conversation about Java.
I didn't know there was still CORBA support in Java EE. In 2014. Wow.
"Now you know. And knowing is half the battle."
I haven't loaded too many java applets. The only applets that I can think of are Java based games.
I guess some web servers still use Java. It is a nice language. I found it slightly easier to learn than C++. I created a simple front-end database application with swing components in about a week or two. Don't get me started with Visual C++ MFC. lol. At least MS .net express (2005+) integrates nicely than the old studio versions.
At least the Java .class files can run on most computers without having to recompile the source code. ok, enough rambling from me.
Since JavaEE is a server application standard, cutting old stuff means that you can no longer run apps that still use said older features on a newer JavaEE server. So, expect everyone to continue using the crusty, old versions of JBoss (for example) or to have the server manufacturers outright ignore Oracle's changes to JavaEE 8.
GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
All I'm asking for in Java 8 is the integration of vectorization instructions in the jvm. Please, do something for that >10x time factor compared to C++ with a compiler using correctly SSE/AVX instructions. I know most of the business doesn't care, but for the few who are still doing some computationally intensive processing (unrelated to databases btw), it is a game changer.
Video of some good progressive thrash music
Java itself is open-source already- OpenJDK.
There are several JavaEE servers that are open source, Jboss and Glassfish are the biggest two. As far as I remember, Glassfish is the reference implementation. It's as open-source as it can be.
Or are you talking about Technology Compatibility Kits? Or Java trademark? Development model itself? Or what?
--Coder
I think if you do computations, these things should help as well. As far as I know, they should be on Java roadmap somewhere already...
--Coder
The auto keyword for declaring variables.
Apart from Oracle and one app in my company, I don't even see Java anymore. I've forgotten most of what I was forced to learn.
Who is using it anymore and for what and why?
Will the last developer on Java please turn out the lights when s/he moves?
And then maybe s/he and the last Silverlight dev can go for coffee..
I've been programming in Java since it first came out, and I never had any particular problems with it, other than the fact that it's rather verbose. I've been thinking there must be a way to accomplish the same thing without so much boilerplate code. Then I discovered Scala (which runs on the JVM and can easily integrate with existing Java libraries).
Mind you there are some things about Scala that are kinda weird, like so much optional syntax and type inferencing makes it sometimes hard to read. But I've been finding it a joy for new code I write, almost Java-like but much less verbose, plus you get the functional programming capabilities that Java lacks. Some of the library code that's out there is hard to understand because of the nature of the syntax, but after you study it a bit, it's not too bad.
I'd be happy if they concentrated their efforts on fixing the seemingly never-ending parade of security holes in the 6 and 7 before they move on to 8.
My Darling Oracle,
Please add as many bells and whistles as you can, throw in all the experimental features that are poorly tested and don't worry about security. If you would be so kind to do this, everyone would finally agree to uninstall Java and never ever use it again. You have sabotaged all the other things you have bought so why not Java? Come on, you know you want to.
Love,
Every Server Admin Ever
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
Millions of back end web application processes, millions of web applications, pretty much any site that has 1 million+ daily users. Java is everywhere and if you dont see it, you are in a rare niche.
Don't make a Java web plugin with it. That's everyone everywhere's advice.
Amazon, LinkedIn, Twitter, Facebook, etc., etc.
Java is very fast, sometimes faster than C++.
http://www.azulsystems.com/blog/cliff/2009-09-06-java-vs-c-performanceagain
You may be referring to startup times which isn't an issue on the server.
We at Oracle care about you and your data. Thank you for taking this opportunity to comment on . We will take your concerns into account, and will address them in our next release of the circular file.
arbitrary precision arithmetic...
I've been programming in Java since it first came out, and I never had any particular problems with it, other than the fact that it's rather verbose. I've been thinking there must be a way to accomplish the same thing without so much boilerplate code. Then I discovered Scala (which runs on the JVM and can easily integrate with existing Java libraries). Mind you there are some things about Scala that are kinda weird, like so much optional syntax and type inferencing makes it sometimes hard to read. But I've been finding it a joy for new code I write, almost Java-like but much less verbose, plus you get the functional programming capabilities that Java lacks. Some of the library code that's out there is hard to understand because of the nature of the syntax, but after you study it a bit, it's not too bad.
For those of us old enough to remember, Java is, in fact, the new COBOL. COBOL, like Java, was the language of choice for software engineers of a bygone era (the 1970's), and suffered from a similar verbosity, clumsy syntax, and prevalence of boiler-plate code (substitute copylibs for jars and you are halfway there). I wrote COBOL for a living for decades and never, ever, coded most of the mandatory code sections.
When I was engaged in my first enterprise level Java project (a JBoss app), I was amazed at the similarities between the two languages. Despite the fact that the syntax and structure are completely different we have the same slavish devotion to form and "correctness". Of course, most people alive and writing code now are completely unaware of this, having never encountered COBOL in an enterprise environment.
Not saying this is a bad thing. Just saying. COBOL was also more or less controlled by one company, and that company was IBM due to the IBM's complete dominance of the mainframe market.
Spot on. The Java browser plugin is the real life vector for getting pwned, not Java the language or the Java virtual machine. Malicious code written in C could do a lot worse with a lot less lines of code - it's just that we don't have browser plugins for running x86 code. Ok... with Google's NaCl, that may be changing!
If Oracle want to save Java's reputation they have to kill the browser plugin. Like you suggest, make it an optional legacy download and set a date for when it will be killed off completely.
Oracle - Stop NOW! PLEASE, JUST STOP!!!! The world of developers can't take any more over-engineered frameworks. J2EE is already an abomination. It's inhumanly complex as it is. Has anyone stopped and just considered the average J2EE program?
HTML + CSS + JavaScript + jQuery on the presentation layer, probably using AJAX. CSS and JavaScript have bizarrely different syntaxes, down to the , and ; placement.
JSP, JSTL, EL, and template languages and whatever other crud to emit the presentation layer. JSON, SOAP, and whatever else to emit the AJAX stuff. If you do it right, you can hide a lot of the emitting code behind a layer of tag obfuscation (at the expense of adding another language) but you still have meta-layers in the same file - is a line of a file emitting something, or is it what's being emitted?
Some sort of MVC thing - Struts, Spring MVC, or whatever - for workflow.
Layer after layer after layer of object model, Hibernate/JPA/whatever database access, JDBC drivers, SQL, and whatever else. Legacy interfaces.
Testing? JUnit, Jenkins, and scripts. Build? Ant, Maven. Source? SVN, Git - there seem to be several of everything to choose from, and every project picks something else.
This thing is collapsing under its own complexity. No one can keep this much stuff in their heads anymore. Just stop it NOW!
Please.
Have you had a look at http://ceylon-lang.org/ ?
I've been tempted to get into Ceylon, it runs in both the JVM & JavaScript Engines.
I think Red Hat are positioning it to replace Java in the long term...