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US Agency Aims To Regulate Map Aids In Vehicles

An anonymous reader writes in with news about proposed rules regarding mapping technology used in cars.Many are in favor of rules that prevent texting while driving, but in-car navigation is a murkier legal area — how do you minimize distractions without limiting the ability to get from point A to point B? Like it or not, the US government may settle that debate before long. The proposed Grow America Act would let the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) set rules for dash-mounted GPS units, smartphone mapping apps and anything else you'd use for driving directions. While it's not clear what the NHTSA would do with its power, the Department of Transportation's voluntary guidelines ask for limits on eye-catching visuals (think videos) and interaction times; don't be surprised if these enter the rulebooks.

34 of 216 comments (clear)

  1. We want driverless cars TODAY! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This will all be wasted time once Google perfects the self driving car.

    1. Re:We want driverless cars TODAY! by darkain · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Much in the same way regulations for fuel efficiency are wasted because we have fully electric cars now....

    2. Re:We want driverless cars TODAY! by pr0fessor · · Score: 3, Informative

      We've had electric cars since the late 1800s they were even more popular than gas until cost outweighs the benefit.

    3. Re:We want driverless cars TODAY! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      We already have driverless cars today. Between women putting on make-up, men eating, and teens texting, quite a few cars on the roads today are driverless.

  2. What The?!? by realperseus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Our government has better things to do than waste MY tax dollars on such nonsense! Sigh..

    --
    "Trusting every aspect of our lives to a giant computer was the smartest thing we ever did.." Homer Simpson
    1. Re:What The?!? by i+kan+reed · · Score: 4, Funny

      There should be an exemption to disliking grammar nazis any time someone goes out of their way to emphasize a word, and uses it completely incorrectly.

      (or if your failure at grammar introduces serious ambiguity problems)

    2. Re:What The?!? by Ralph+Wiggam · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The rate of US car fatalities has plummeted 75% over the past 45 years, largely due to government mandates and the NHTSA. The hundreds of thousands of people who are alive today because of those actions probably don't consider it "nonsense".

    3. Re:What The?!? by sjames · · Score: 2

      So, when you're going down a crowded highway you're fine with it if the GPS app in the truck next to you goes to a commercial break featuring boobies?

    4. Re:What The?!? by Ralph+Wiggam · · Score: 2

      It's weird how Libertarians never cite any data to support their statements.

    5. Re:What The?!? by Dishevel · · Score: 2
      I like that argument. Let me break that one down.

      The government SHOULD waste our money on a thing because you found a thing that is even a bigger waste of our money.

      Perfect.

      --
      Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
    6. Re:What The?!? by Shakrai · · Score: 2

      My solution: buy a f**king map. Need detailed turn information to your destination? Look up the directions on Google Maps (or similar), print them out, and refer to them while you're at a stop light/sign or have your significant other read them.

      Because taking my eyes off the road to refer to maps/printed directions is so much safer than listening to audio directions and occasionally glancing at a TomTom that's mounted right below my rear view mirror, in a position where my eyes don't leave the roadway?

      1. Maps suck. Road atlases are only useful for the 20,000 foot view, i.e., which combination of interstates and/or state highways will get me to my destination city. Once I'm in that city I need a street level map if I'm going to find my destintion and I don't have the money to equip my car with street level maps for every city within driving distance of my house.
      2. Printed directions are even worse. You've got to constantly take your eyes off the road to refer to them, and god help you if you miss a turn either by accident or because of detour. Those directions are predicated on the assumption that you can follow them perfectly and there are no road closures. Once you're off the path they're useless.

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    7. Re:What The?!? by dnavid · · Score: 2

      (2] -- Call me old-fashioned, but I plan my auto trips so I don't have to have live directions given to me in real-time by something in my dashboard. My solution: buy a f**king map. Need detailed turn information to your destination? Look up the directions on Google Maps (or similar), print them out, and refer to them while you're at a stop light/sign or have your significant other read them.

      I generally keep printed maps as a stand by, but I find automated turn by turn navigation to be vastly safer than periodically glancing at a printed map while driving, and often far less stressful than having someone attempt to read a map and give directions verbally. Most people just aren't very good at that.

      I'm curious to see what the NHTSA discovers the risk factors are to having significant others attempt to give drivers directions. Or for that matter what the risk factors are for having car stereos, or screaming babies. I'm generally in favor of regulations like seat belt usage, or car seats for children, where the safety benefits vastly outweigh any inconvenience, but the risks should be weighed not as an absolute but against alternatives and other accepted risks. Dashboard GPS shouldn't be judged based on its distraction effect, but compared to using folding maps or just plain wandering around lost. For that matter what's the risk associated with taking one's eyes off of the traffic to look at highway signs. Audio directions should be compared to the distraction generated by listening to the radio, which I doubt anyone would allow the government to ban.

      In cars without dashboard GPS, I generally use my phone. But instead of just glancing at the dash, I'm sometimes glancing down at my phone, which can't possibly be better. In a world where dashboard GPS was eliminated from cars, I would switch to phone GPS, and which would be almost impossible to regulate effectively. That's not likely to be a better situation.

    8. Re:What The?!? by Grishnakh · · Score: 2

      Why not? The western European nations enjoy a significantly better standard of living than the US, so they're obviously doing something right. Their main problem seems to have been including some southern and eastern European nations like Greece with crappy economies into their union.

  3. Perhaps.... by pablo_max · · Score: 2

    Maybe they should consider getting all of the various other areas they "oversee" under control before they start trying to expand their power even further.

  4. Overreach much? by russotto · · Score: 4, Interesting

    They want to regulate mapping apps on smartphones, including those not installed in vehicles? Seems like more than a bit of a stretch.

    1. Re:Overreach much? by BasilBrush · · Score: 2

      I can understand the motivation. People who are entering a new destination to their satnav whilst driving are paying very little attention to the road and are a big hazard.

      But the only way to implement it on a handheld device is to restrict by speed. And I quite often like to monitor where I am with GPS when I'm on public transport. So I'd lose that. As would people who are navigating from the passenger seat of a car.

      Tricky one.

    2. Re:Overreach much? by mellon · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This latter bit is a real problem in our Prius: you can't enter a destination without stopping. It lets you do other things, just not that. Really annoying, because it's almost always the case that when we need to enter directions, we're driving somewhere together. It would be nice if the NHTSA rules allowed for passengers.

    3. Re:Overreach much? by tysonedwards · · Score: 4, Interesting

      They want to have the authority to regulate apps that after release have been linked to "safety related issues" that have an intended purpose of being used primarily while driving on a road. They're not asking to regulate all cell phones, or twitter, or Facebook use while in a car (yet), what they are asking for is the ability to bitch-slap developers after the fact who create apps that are designed for use while driving yet lead to distractions, ergo creating safety issues for those likely using said app while driving, presumably on a highway. To that end, is someone more likely to be using Navigon, Garmin, TomTom, or the multitude of other apps while going for a walk, or when driving somewhere?

      And if they incorporated a "Thank you for using MotionX GPS Lite, before giving your your directions, please watch this YouTube video and answer this quick survey!", should NHTSB or anyone else for that matter have the authority to tell them that that is morally wrong, and potentially unsafe behavior, let alone compel them to take corrective action?

      Their request for oversight over this area doesn't seem like a "major" stretch at this point, but it does set a quite unusual precedent that can be used to expand their powers in the future. And as we all have seen in the past, if Government has the potential to grow, it will do so.

      --
      Thirty four characters live here.
    4. Re:Overreach much? by BasilBrush · · Score: 2

      And not all driving is equal in terms of concentration.. an empty, straight away stretch of road is probably fine for sending a quick text or whatever you need to do

      And there you proved that you are not a responsible adult and so your opinion is worthless.

  5. see ya by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    So long speed trap alerts in Waze.

  6. Can they start regulating back-seat driving, too? by OSULugan · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'd love for them to limit the type and amount of distractions from my wife telling me where to go, too.

  7. Re:Can they start regulating back-seat driving, to by Enry · · Score: 3, Funny

    Wait, your GPS can give directions to Hell?

  8. always exceptions by MooseTick · · Score: 2

    There will likely always be an exception. The car doesn't know that you are the only person in the car, and there is no reason that a passenger can't input nav data while the vehicle is in motion.

    This will make for some great action movies though. Imagive the hero doesn't know where he needs to be, but can't stop the vehicle for GPS to work because there is a carload of mafia terrorists chasing him.

    1. Re:always exceptions by Jason+Levine · · Score: 2

      Don't worry. The plucky geek sidekick will - via phone - talk him through reprogramming his entire GPS operating system by pushing five buttons in the right order. The sidekick will then try to help more by remotely hacking into and reprogramming the mafia terrorists' car to disable the steering. The hero will berate the sidekick after the car nearly crashes into a bus filled with sweet, innocent children. Thankfully, the hero was able to aim his gun (which only had one bullet left) behind him and hit the tire of the mafia terrorists' car causing it to explode and flip up and over the bus.

      Physics? Reasonable technology? A movie craves not these things.

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
  9. WTF by kwiecmmm · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So what if someone else in the car is looking at the directions while you are driving? Will their ability to look at directions be significantly hampered?

    It is a good thing that these Congress people don't have any important things to worry about so they can focus on this ridiculous crap.

    In the mean time my car might just drive on an interstate with failing bridges, or into a tunnel with ceiling tiles that could fall at any moment, but focusing on this is obviously the best thing for Congress to do.

  10. stupid by Charliemopps · · Score: 2, Interesting

    As stupid as this is, it will save more lives than any firearms regulation ever will.
    Keep in mind how you feel about this regulation, then re-evaluate your stance on gun control. You don't have to change your mind, just think about it long and hard. Cars kill far far more people every year than guns ever could. Why allow people to have cars? There's no constitutional right to drive... Banning them would significantly reduce global warming pollutants... Ban cars, force public transport and foot traffic.

    1. Re:stupid by jratcliffe · · Score: 2

      Sigh. Assessing a regulation requires you to look at the benefits AND costs. Banning cars would certainly save a lot of lives, but at huge societal costs. Requiring registration of firearms, and tracking transfers, to allow the sources of illegally used firearms to be determined, would have very modest financial cost, and place minimal burdens on the vast majority of law-abiding firearm owners, while making significant progress toward keeping guns out of the hands of people (criminals and the mentally ill) who _shouldn't_ have them.

  11. My Ford does it fine by kannibal_klown · · Score: 3, Informative

    I may have issues with my Ford, but I think they got it right in terms of Navigation. I have little-to-no reason to have to look at my media center. Everything is done by voice (including asking for an address) and the next-step-direction-guide is on my speedometer where I have to glance on occasion anyway.

    The only improvement I can think of is a really small projection on the windshield saying "Turn right in 0.7 miles onto Main st"

    All voice controlled, so I don't have to even try typing while driving (if I were so inclined). Click my tumb-button on the steering wheel and say "Destination Address" and then state the address when prompted.

    The system's voice prompts me on where to turn, and when. Including the street names and exit number.

    And instead of having to look too far down at my media player (which I COULD), instead there is a mini direction-reminder on my speedometer. Just saying the name of the next turn's street, distance, and a left-arrow / right-arrow / etc. Since I tend to have to glance down at that every couple of minutes anyway it's no big deal.

    No fuss, no typing, no looking too far away from the windshield.

    1. Re:My Ford does it fine by MildlyTangy · · Score: 2

      unless you miss hearing the last instruction due to external factors or voice text to speech mispronounciation....no nav unit ive seen allows you to just say "say it again" or something, and have the last voice instruction repeated without having to look at and physically interact with the nav unit while driving.

  12. Can this apply to billboards too? by MobyDisk · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Can we also get rid of animating billboards? Those slideshow transitions are distracting when driving since the brain pays attention to movement.

  13. First ever car video game by MobyDisk · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The NHTSA has finally caught up with me.

    Around 2001 or so I rigged a pair of laptops with GPS and Wifi (high tech!) so they relayed coordinates to each other and ran a star-trek esque battle game. The passenger would hold the laptop which showed the opponents position and shields as well as weapons fire. They would feed information to the driver who would dodge virtual torpedoes.

    A few friends of mine tested this out, but I abandoned the project because this surely would have killed people.

  14. Interaction Times by MildlyTangy · · Score: 2

    Please dont do stupid things like regulate that these devices must disable user interaction when the vehicle is travelling over a speed limit.

    Unless the device can accurately detect if there is a passenger or not. This "safety feature" of my cars factory nav/media unit drives me up the wall...the passengers! the passengers! why wont *somebody* please think of the passengers!

  15. Re:Cue Mr. Heston by aix+tom · · Score: 2

    Ah, but Mr. Heston could shoot people trying to take his gun. You could only throw your map aid/gps at them. ;-> (OK, Or possibly run them over with your car)

  16. Re:Dear federal government: GTFO by Walter+White · · Score: 2

    Your point would be better taken if you (and I mean the generic you, not you specifically) did not risk others lives by the actions that you take. I'd be perfectly happy to let you do whatever you wish in your vehicle but when a mistake on your part can kill me, then I'm happy to have the government interfere with your ability to do so.