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Schizophrenia Is Not a Single Disease

An anonymous reader writes: New research from Washington University has found that the condition known as schizophrenia is not just a single disease, but instead a collection of eight different disorders. For years, researchers struggled to understand the genetic basis of schizophrenia. This new method was able to isolate and identify the different conditions (each with its own symptoms) currently classified under the same heading (abstract, full text). "In some patients with hallucinations or delusions, for example, the researchers matched distinct genetic features to patients' symptoms, demonstrating that specific genetic variations interacted to create a 95 percent certainty of schizophrenia. In another group, they found that disorganized speech and behavior were specifically associated with a set of DNA variations that carried a 100 percent risk of schizophrenia." According to one of the study's authors, "By identifying groups of genetic variations and matching them to symptoms in individual patients, it soon may be possible to target treatments to specific pathways that cause problems."

23 of 222 comments (clear)

  1. Then I guess you could say... by toonces33 · · Score: 4, Funny

    that schizophrenia itself has a bit of a split personality.

    1. Re: Then I guess you could say... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      You could also be referring to "multiple personalities," which is also known as Dissociative Identity Disorder. Neither Bipolar nor DID are the same as Schizophrenia.

    2. Re: Then I guess you could say... by sg_oneill · · Score: 4, Informative

      *rimshot*. I do realise your just making a joke, however it is worth noting that multiple personalities is not considered part of the schizophrenia spectrum, but rather part of the disasociative disorders spectrum. Its a ketamine disease rather than an Acid disease, to make a metaphor.

      --
      Excuse the Unicode crap in my posts. That's an apostrophe, and slashdot is busted.
    3. Re: Then I guess you could say... by linuxrocks123 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      No, he's thinking of multiple personality disorder, which is extremely rare and much different than schizophrenia. It's confused with schizophrenia because of the hallucinatory voices common in schizophrenia, but those "voices" aren't different personalities of the afflicted; they're just hallucinations. Multiple personality disorder is the split personality one -- the person is basically like Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde, although the personalities don't have to be good/evil or working at cross purposes to each other, and there can be more than two.

      --
      vi ~/.emacs # I'm probably going to Hell for this.
    4. Re:Then I guess you could say... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      I'm schizophrenic with mild hallucinations but I hear shit around the clock and it gets extremely annoying. I know it's not real, but there are days where I'm like leave me the fuck alone. I'd be cool with it if it were Ed Harris but everything I hear is abstract so I keep it pretty loud in my room to drown it out. Luckily my case is not too bad, but it's bad enough that I can imagine what people with serious cases go through. I feel extremely bad for people that have been drove out of their minds.

      The feeling of knowing what you're seeing or hearing is fake is indescribable.

    5. Re:Then I guess you could say... by Miamicanes · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I've always wondered whether someone experiencing audio hallucinations they couldn't distinguish from real sounds could use software as a prosthetic. Say, write a program to continuously sample sound, display the past 5 minutes or so of waveform history on-screen, do realtime speech recognition, and annotate the waveform display with a transcript of what it thought it heard... so if they thought they heard something really disturbing, they could look at the display to see whether there was an organized waveform a few moments earlier, and listen to it again if they wanted to be sure..

      If someone with schizophrenia did that, would it help? Or would it stimulate the development of new neural pathways & eventually make matters worse by inducing visual hallucinations on top of the auditory ones in an attempt to bring their physical perception of reality in line with their mental one?

    6. Re:Then I guess you could say... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That would likely help. For those that don't know if the hallucinations are real. However, the problem with hallucinations is that they'll drive you nuts even if you know they're not real. I remember the hallucinations would get so loud that I'd yell at them even though I knew they weren't real because I could barely hear anything else.

      The trick is that doctors need to stop treating schizophrenics like we're sick. They need to start treating us like we're real people that just happen to have a different sense of reality. Trying to force us to buy into a reality that's every bit as fake as the one they're trying to get us to give up is ludicrous. It's not curable per se, but if we're given the tools to evaluate things for ourselves, the brain will eventually rewire itself in a way that's more functional.

      Ultimately, people need to accept the symptoms as symptoms. Trying to fight the disorder is a losing battle. Eventually I got to the point where I missed the voices and started to intentionally cause the hallucinations. Before too long I was having trouble maintaining them and that aspect of the disorder was more or less gone.

      The rest is really psycho-social education. It's not that schizophrenics can't be treated or virtually cured, it's that the mental health establishment makes more money with ineffectual treatments than it does for treatments that would improve the situation. There's some very good work being done in the neurosciences that could make a huge difference. Unfortunately, it would put psychologists completely out of business as it requires work from psychiatrists and therapists, but not psychologists.

    7. Re:Then I guess you could say... by Vellmont · · Score: 4, Insightful


      The trick is that doctors need to stop treating schizophrenics like we're sick. They need to start treating us like we're real people that just happen to have a different sense of reality.

      In a sense, I sort of agree with you, in another, totally not. Depression is also another way of viewing reality. Is someone who's depressed "wrong" about concentrating on the negative aspects of living? No... but I think most people who're depressed would rather NOT be depressed. Obviously telling someone who's depressed to just "cheer up", and "things aren't that bad" isn't going to help much. But like a disease, it's an aspect of yourself you'd rather not have and aren't in total control of, and want to be "cured" of. So the disease model isn't too far from the truth. I don't see how scizophrenia is much different.

      You yourself don't really like your symptoms, wouldn't you rather they be gone? So I'm not sure I really understand your point.

      --
      AccountKiller
    8. Re:Then I guess you could say... by sound+vision · · Score: 4, Interesting

      From the people I've known with schizophrenia (three diagnosed, a couple others probably undiagnosed) the audio hallucinations can either be recognized as hallucinations, or accepted as real, depending on the severity of the disorder at the time. If they are in a less severe mode they usually recognize the voices are not real (not to imply they can stop or control them). The recorder would do no good there. In more severe conditions, they may be unable to tell the difference between the hallucinations and reality, and the hallucinations can be not just auditory but also visual and (most importantly) cognitive. With cognitive delusions, reasoning capacity goes out the window - any kind of "evidence" presented to them would be disregarded. In the really bad cases, when they are ducking out of view of windows so the snipers outside can't get a clear shot, you won't be able to get them to look at any computer program really.

  2. i knew that. by jaeztheangel · · Score: 3, Funny

    well, when i say 'I', its more of a consensus decision.

  3. Schizophrenia is not multiple personality disorder by mod+prime · · Score: 4, Informative

    AKA Dissociative identity disorder. There is a slight comorbidity between the conditions, but depression and anxiety are also comorbid.

  4. DNA? by sumdumass · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If it is embedded in DNA, is it hereditary?

    If it is, I hope it does not bring back Eugenics or the forced sterilization practices of the early 19th century. That didn't end well on several fronts.

    1. Re:DNA? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You will be amazed at how few babies people have once you give them (especially women) access to birth control (and the realistic ability to use it without terrible social stigma), as well as a livable income.

      The stats have shown this throughout history....high birth levels are associated with poverty, and also with the unavailability of (completely voluntary) birth control. The wealthy class across the globe generally has zero or one child per couple, whereas indigents generally have 5 or more per couple. And government funded birth control being freely given to the populace has also been shown to significantly reduce birth rates.

      Before you go sterilizing people, consider that there may be a much more just and humane way of achieving the exact same goals, and making everyone involved a whole lot happier about it.

  5. 5 Ridiculous Myths You Probably Believe by tepples · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I wonder if the depression and anxiety are more side effects of the medications used to treat schizophrenia, or effects of trying to avoid discrimination against people with schizophrenia due to its misrepresentation by Hollywood, as a recent Cracked article suggests.

    1. Re:5 Ridiculous Myths You Probably Believe by mod+prime · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Well - they make you feel a little sluggish, and quite drowsy for about 8 hours (more at higher doses) after they kick in (so don't take them for breakfast if you have plans), but not depressed. It is possible to feel despair because of your chronic condition and the prospect of long term sluggishness I suppose but

      Schizophrenics who seek help often do so for anxiety and depression rather than psychosis. There is often a history of these issues predating medication, but not always.

      It's not just Hollywood, it's everywhere. The psychotic=violent myth is in every media that has discussed the issue. Newspapers only mention schizophrenia if someone was hurt, furthering the association in people's minds. My current employer refused to let me work without supervision because I had advised them I have had psychotic episodes and am undergoing treatment until I gave them a psych's letter telling them they were being morons (small and new business, so I forgave and educated instead).

    2. Re:5 Ridiculous Myths You Probably Believe by dcollins117 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The problem with meds is that they aren't a treatment, they are at best a bandage.

      For the majority of medical afflictions being treated today there is no cure, so the best doctors can do is offer palliative care.

      There is no cure for cancer, heart disease, athsma, arthritis, or even the common cold. So little is known about the human brain that zero percent of psychological disorders are effectively treated. Whenever I hear a doctor brag about how much they know about the human body or worse a psychologist remark about how much is known about the brain I always remind them how much there is they don't know.

    3. Re:5 Ridiculous Myths You Probably Believe by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Part of the problem is that some schizos ARE dangerous

      So are sociopaths and psychopaths. What you are trying to imply is that schizophrenics are more dangerous than other mental disorders.

      I never came near implying that. Not once did I mention sociopaths OR psychopaths. To the contrary, I wrote that if this finding lets us tell the dangerous schizos from those who aren't, this will be awesome. My answer presumes that many schizos are not dangerous. I even went further, posing the question of whether a tendency towards violence might still need an environmental trigger.

      A real-life example from one of my classmates in high school. Diagnosed as schizophrenic at 8 years of age, his father basically tried to "beat the devil out of him" for the next 8 years. That's akin to pounding on a bomb to see if it's armed. Even if he wasn't dangerous before, this course of conduct almost certainly lead to "arming the bomb." He beat his father to death right in front of me, and I was next on his list. He was found to be not criminally responsible, in part due to my testimony, and having seen and heard what he did that night, I believe the jury got it right.

      Does that sound like someone who's unsympathetic to the problem?

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
  6. Next deconstruction: autism. by macraig · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Next this needs to be done with what we call "autism". There's a reason it's called the "autistic spectrum"; it's a MUCH bigger but nebulous target than schizophrenia. There's so much symptomatic comorbidity that the diagnoses would be funny if the consequences weren't so depressing.

  7. Re:Eugen Fischer by nine-times · · Score: 4, Informative

    Are you joking? "Eugenics" comes from Greek. 'Eu' meaning good, like euphoria, euphemism, or utopia. 'Genic', dealing with birth, breeding, and production, like in genetics, generate, or hydrogen.

  8. Re:Helps explain a few things ... by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Dogs have had many more generations of breeding to tailor their responses to us than we have had to them - something like 10x as many generations, since they breed about 10x quicker than humans. So they can read us much better than we can read them - they've self-selected for that ability, since the ones that can read us best know best how to suck up to us and get us to feed and shelter them and pick up their poop. Todays dogs are specialists - and their specialty is humans.

    Given this, dogs are probably better judges of people than we are.

    --
    "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
  9. Old news by mescobal · · Score: 4, Informative

    Please stop repeating something like it is new. Since its origins the concept is called "the schizophrenias". We knew that 100 years before now: http://schizophreniabulletin.o...

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    La culpa no es del chancho...
  10. Re:Helps explain a few things ... by linuxrocks123 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That's an interesting hypothesis. But I don't buy it, certainly without some scientific testing (versus emotional, speculative anecdotes from people with dogs). Evolution doesn't work like leveling up in a video game. Once a local maximum is reached, further generations have no impact. I would also wager that, while there may have been some selection pressure to "read" a person's immediate emotional state, selection pressure for reading general personalities, etc. was likely much weaker. And, of course, the selection pressure for humans to "read" other humans would have been much, much greater. After all, we have to mate with each other. Dogs don't have to mate with us. They do, however, have to mate with other dogs, and interaction with other dogs probably dominated the selection pressure on dogs' social intuition faculties. So, I would speculate people are likely better judges of people than dogs are.

    What probably happened with the schizophrenic people was perhaps they were anxious, because of delusions or whatever, and the dog picked up on that. You probably also did. That you had a single negative interaction with one person your dog didn't like is not an important piece of information, if we're going to go about this scientifically. But, hey, I'm speculating too. Someone would have to research this. How and why, I have no idea. But my speculation can beat up your speculation :P

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    vi ~/.emacs # I'm probably going to Hell for this.
  11. Re:it is not, probably doesn't exist by Risha · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Do you actually know anything about psychiatry, or are you just going by this particular article about a study that you think is iffy? Because it's not news that schizophrenia is at least partially hereditary, they've known that for decades. The same is true of bipolar disorder and major depressive disorder. The only debate is to what degree they are caused by hereditary versus environment. You can compare it to how diabetes runs in families, but in general can be triggered or not depending on your lifestyle. But some people will develop the disease even if they treat their body like a temple. This study has made the news because they're claiming to have identified the specific genes involved, not because there wasn't already general agreement that there were genes involved in predisposing someone to get schizophrenia.