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China Eager To Send Its Own Mission To Mars In the Wake of Mangalyaan

MarkWhittington writes The recent arrival into Mars orbit of both NASA's MAVEN and India's Mangalyaan Mars Orbiter Mission has not escaped the notice of China. The achievement of its Asian rival has especially proven galling to the Chinese. China has yet to successfully send a space probe beyond the moon. The development has elicited calls in Beijing to accelerate China's Mars program. China currently plans to send a rover to Mars in 2020 and, perhaps, do a Mars sample return mission in 2030. However, it feels that India, which China regards as its rival in an Asian space race, has stolen the spotlight and has left the Chinese behind. China is now keen to try to play catchup with its own Mars mission. One of the hold ups for a Chinese interplanetary exploration program is the delays surrounding the development of the Long March 5 rocket, which will be roughly the equivalent of the America Delta IV in its capabilities. The Chinese launch vehicle unveiling has slipped to at least 2015 because of the technological challenges it faces. The Long March 5 is also needed to launch the 20 ton modules of the Chinese space station, currently planned for later this decade.

84 comments

  1. Step one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Steal the design, source code and production plans.

    1. Re:Step one by sycodon · · Score: 1

      When the arrive, they'll plant a flag and claim the entire planet for the Worker's Party.

      --
      When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    2. Re:Step one by DigiShaman · · Score: 1

      Or Elon Musk can give all nations the finger by going to Mars in person and plant the corporate flag!

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    3. Re:Step one by hey! · · Score: 1

      China is a signatory to the "Treaty on Principles Governing the Activities of States in the Exploration and Use of Outer Space, including the Moon and Other Celestial Bodies", Article II of which states:

      Outer space, including the moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    4. Re:Step one by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      Also via an old treaty the western hemisphere is divided between Spain and Portugal.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    5. Re:Step one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The achievement of its Asian rival has especially proven galling to the Chinese.

      Really? Rivalry?
      At best this is India pissing into a tsunami.

      China versus India? For real?
      When the average Indian has to go outside to take a shit?
      Straight up there's absolutely no contest here. China>>>India.

      Steal the design, source code and production plans.

      I'd bet money that 90%+ of Mangalyaan is bought from foreign manufacturers.
      I'd also bet money that 100% of the microchips on Mangalyaan is bought from foreign manufacturers (does India even make semiconductors of any kind?)
      India is Israel of the east, most of Israeli/Indian tech are from foreign enterprises.

    6. Re:Step one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not western hemisphere.
      Whole planet was given by pope to spain and portugal.

    7. Re:Step one by somegeekynick · · Score: 1

      No need for a flag, it's already the Red Planet.

    8. Re: Step one by spkay31 · · Score: 1

      Lots of enforcement issues on that one, LOL!

  2. Conversion issues by tomhath · · Score: 4, Funny

    One of the hold ups for a Chinese interplanetary exploration program is the delays surrounding the development of the Long March 5 rocket, which will be roughly the equivalent of the America Delta IV in its capabilities

    They're not used to working from blueprints that use feet, inches, and pounds.

    1. Re:Conversion issues by rmdingler · · Score: 1
      Right. That's why the Americans have yet to embrace the metric system.

      Everything's national security over here.

      --
      Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.

      Ernest Hemingway

  3. Re:What about Africa? by Seumas · · Score: 2

    You mean, the entire continent?

  4. Re:What about Africa? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ha ha, they are so poor they don't have a space program, ha ha, I'm funny.
    Oh by the way, what did you do for the space program in your country ? Surely you must have done something or you wouldn't go around mocking people that did not.

  5. Re:What about Africa? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You are incorrect :-)

  6. How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by gtall · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Hey Chinese leaders, want to make your manhood look bigger? Give Tibet its freedom back. Renounce your insane claims to all of the S. China Sea, and stop threatening Taiwan. Until that happens, no amount of space funnies is going to make men out of you.

    1. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      How about giving the USA back to the native Americans?

    2. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by oodaloop · · Score: 2

      Tibet is strategically important to China, and I don't foresee them just giving it up because some hippies are holding protests. Tibet holds a huge supply of freshwater that flows into China. It has nothing to do with religion or politics, just natural resources. Similar situation for South China Sea. The US and countries friendly to the US control most of the shipping lanes and ports near China. South Korea, Japan, Philippines, Taiwan are all right in China's way. They desperately need North Korea and as much control of other shipping lanes as they can muster. They're not being assholes about Tibet and Taiwan; they're trying to defend themselves and stay alive.

      --
      Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
    3. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by CaptainDork · · Score: 1

      Or at least give the Native Americans back their religion.

      --
      It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
    4. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Flavianoep · · Score: 1

      Tibet is strategically important to China, and I don't foresee them just giving it up because some hippies are holding protests. Tibet holds a huge supply of freshwater that flows into China.

      Natural resources and freshwater, y'say? Thank you, I didn't know about that.

      --
      Linux is for people who don't mind RTFM.
    5. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Squidlips · · Score: 2

      Oh yes they are most definitely assholes about Tibet and they are so paranoid about the free press that they have dopes like oodaloop do their bidding on social media. This is like saying that the Soviet Union had to take over Poland and Baltic states for their own protection... Read Seven Years in Tibet to find about the genocide of the Tibetian people....

    6. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Thanshin · · Score: 1

      How about the sapiens sapiens giving Europe back to the neanderthalensis?

      Or is it too late for that too.

    7. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      People from France where in the Americas thousands of years before the "Native Americans" were. So lets play the game of who was there first and lets have the Native Americans give the land back to the Europeans.

    8. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Chrisq · · Score: 1

      How about the sapiens sapiens giving Europe back to the neanderthalensis?

      Or is it too late for that too.

      I think its in the works

    9. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by oodaloop · · Score: 2

      Right. Because I disagree with you, I must be a paid dupe or a stupid no-nothing schmuck. I'm actually an intelligence analyst and do this for a living, but good for you for having a read a book about it. I'll make sure I defer to your expertise in the future.

      --
      Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
    10. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by kilodelta · · Score: 1

      Way too late. Because if you pull your genetic sequence you'll find that most of us of European ancestry also got a couple percent of Neanderthal ancesty along with it.

    11. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In that case USians have vast possibilities to make their manhood reach the lenght of jump pole

    12. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm actually an intelligence analyst

      Sure you are, Sparky.

    13. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Doubtful, but in any case irrelevant. I think you failed to recognize irony.

    14. Re: How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by WindBourne · · Score: 1

      Yes, I am sure that all of you AQ and Isis supporters do hate the NSA.

      --
      I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    15. Re: How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by WindBourne · · Score: 1

      Not just china, but India as well. And China is getting ready to divert it upon their own needs.

      --
      I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    16. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by crunchygranola · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Tibet is strategically important to China, and I don't foresee them just giving it up because some hippies are holding protests. Tibet holds a huge supply of freshwater that flows into China. It has nothing to do with religion or politics, just natural resources...

      Because unless they subjugate Tibetans, imprison and torture them, and try to eliminate their culture the water won't flow into China anymore?

      Imperialists (and their apologists) always have these "reasons", even when they are tissue thin fig leaves.

      China could pull of Tibet entirely, and they would still get their water. If the Tibetans tried to cut it off in some way, for some god-knows-why reason, China could shut the project down with one short military operation, and make the Tibetans regret ever trying it.

      No need for maintaining a brutal occupation.

      --
      Second class citizen of the New Gilded Age
    17. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Squidlips · · Score: 1

      No, because you are a shill for China. Why? Ideology? Nationality? Since when has China earned the benefit of the doubt in its actions in Tibet? Let the free press into Tibet and open up the internet in China....

    18. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by deadweight · · Score: 1

      Someone is trying to kill them?

    19. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      |How about giving the USA back to the native Americans?|
      How about China give back Xinjiang back to the Uyghur, Han, Kazakhs, Tajiks, Hui, Kyrgyz, and Mongols.
      As a native American I have full rights as a Citizen of the US. The Uyghur, Han, Kazakhs, Tajiks, Hui, Kyrgyz, and Mongols are not full citizens of the PRC and need special permission to travel! The Chinese are also persecuting those minorities as well. No one is persecuting Native Americans! Unless you think giving 500 million to the Navajo is persecution.

      http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-navajo-nation-settlement-20140924-story.html

    20. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by oyenamit · · Score: 1

      Once that is done, how about stopping manipulating your currency so blatantly?

    21. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Comrade+Ogilvy · · Score: 1

      South Korea, Japan, Philippines, Taiwan are all right in China's way.

      Those cute little people who are so rudely "in China's way" have been there for thousands of years, and they are critical trading partners.

      If rather than recognizing these many people co-inhabit the same area and need to get along, if China prefers to think of them as "in the way", China has a world of hurt coming its way. And when the disaster happens, it will be 99.999999% China's fault.

    22. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by the+gnat · · Score: 1

      The US and countries friendly to the US control most of the shipping lanes and ports near China. South Korea, Japan, Philippines, Taiwan are all right in China's way. They desperately need North Korea and as much control of other shipping lanes as they can muster.

      Why do the the Chinese need to control the shipping lanes? It's not like they have any problem exporting their products.

      They're not being assholes about Tibet and Taiwan; they're trying to defend themselves and stay alive.

      How is control of Taiwan vital to Chinese defense? And for that matter, if seizing Taiwan is seen as a matter of self-defence, shouldn't the citizens of South Korea, Japan, and the Philippines be very nervous right now?

    23. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Riiiiight, because giving in to what America wants and doing something stupid is sure to make your manhood bigger.
      Just look at how much the dicks have grown for all the countries that blindly followed the US into wars they had no reason to be in.
      No giving in to bullies does nothing but make you look weak, Giving in to Americans makes you look stupid.

    24. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you were really an intelligence analyst you would realise how non-free Americas press is. Owned by mega-corps infiltrated by the CIA. Everything on the Internet is spied on by the NSA, who can make things disappear, hand out 'secret squirrel' letters left and right.
      China can't have the version of a 'free press' that the US has because it's behind the curve, but catching up.
      Once they have all the pieces in place a 'free press' will be allowed to appear to be in place, just like the US.
      It's the same with anything else, once you are far enough ahead, pull up the ladder so other people/countries/whatever can't catch up. Can Chinese press/propaganda/media compete with the US? Of course no, so why would you expect them to? They aren't stupid.

    25. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They are taking it back one casino at time

    26. Re:How about giving Tibet back to the Tibetans? by oodaloop · · Score: 1

      So I'm a shill for China because I'm a shill for China? It's been really great having an intelligent conversation with you. Have a nice day.

      --
      Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
  7. Re:What about Africa? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    The Chinese have already been to Africa.

  8. The Chinese can just steal the specs of the Delta by Squidlips · · Score: 1

    Like they have for almost all their other space technology....except for the sleazy Loral Systems deal where they paid off US politicians to get the tech.

  9. Re:What about Africa? by rmdingler · · Score: 1

    Citation?

    --
    Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.

    Ernest Hemingway

  10. For all her Majesty by kilodelta · · Score: 2

    China is always behind the curve. They didn't get nukes until the 1970's. And they won't do a Mars mission for another six years?

    They may have invented gunpowder and pasta way back when - but they lost it after that.

    1. Re:For all her Majesty by IAN · · Score: 1

      China is always behind the curve. They didn't get nukes until the 1970's.

      In the interest of accuracy -- the first Chinese nuclear test was in 1964, and they exploded their first thermonuclear device in 1967. So no, not the '70s.

    2. Re:For all her Majesty by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Holy Cowboy Neal. Did that UID come with primordial ooze?

  11. Whip 'em out by GameboyRMH · · Score: 4, Funny

    It's time to measure SPACE DICKS again!

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    1. Re:Whip 'em out by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      SPUTNIK!!!!!!

  12. Pathetic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As they say in my mother tongue: Culo veo, culo quiero. China has to remind India that China has a bigger dick. It's sad to see governments behaving like immature teenagers.

    1. Re:Pathetic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Seeing as how both these countries are Asian, I don't think a dick-measuring contest should be something either one of them rushes into.

  13. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Monkey see, monkey do. Will we give them use of the DSN too? China and India are definitely the JV of space.

    1. Re:Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery by I'm+New+Around+Here · · Score: 1

      Monkey see, monkey do. China and India are definitely the JV of space.

      Great! Are they going to start beheading Martians now?

      --
      If you think I voted for Trump because of this post, you're wrong. I voted for Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party. Again.
  14. China did go beyond the moon! by cobbaut · · Score: 1

    China has yet to successfully send a space probe beyond the moon

    Wrong!
    The Change'2 probe went to the Moon, circled it for a year, then went to a Lagrange point, then flew on to the asteroid Toutatis and since then is flying into deep space.

    --
    European Linux user, living in Antwerp
  15. Collaboration by prasadsurve · · Score: 1

    Rather than competing, the 2 Asian giants (India and China) should collaborate in space exploration; after all progress in this field is not just better for the individual countries but for humanity as a whole.

    1. Re: Collaboration by WindBourne · · Score: 2

      U really have no clue. China invaded India just last year. They are building diversionary dams that will take Indian water when they want. China has more than 1 million troops on the Indian border. And u think that they will work together?

      --
      I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    2. Re: Collaboration by crunchygranola · · Score: 1

      U really have no clue. ... And u think that they will work together?
      --
      I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.

      What have got against the "y" and the "o" in "you"?

      --
      Second class citizen of the New Gilded Age
    3. Re: Collaboration by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The border problem is nothing to worry about, the countries get along fine. Neither of them want to make a big fuss about it. Did you not see the recent visit, China is investing billions into India and the Indians love it.
      The 'border problem' is just Americans trying to drive a wedge and spin the story to make China look expansionist so they have an excuse to try and 'contain' them.

    4. Re: Collaboration by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yup. Those pesky americans always causing issues. We force the Chinese to invade Tibet, as well as other nations.
      Likewise, we made Russia invade ukraine and Georgia. It goes on and on, and it is all America's fault.
      Hey, quit looking at the left hand. Go back to looking at Americans.

      Thank you. The Chinese gov.

  16. Good by aaaaaaargh! · · Score: 2

    Isn't it phantastic when science and engineering can profit from stupidity and narrow-minded nationalism? If only that were always the case!

    1. Re:Good by mossy+the+mole · · Score: 1

      Isn't it phantastic when science and engineering can profit from stupidity and narrow-minded nationalism? If only that were always the case!

      Well, if it gets a little more cash spent on actual science (sad that it takes an international pissing contest to get that done, but thats the world we live in)

    2. Re:Good by the+gnat · · Score: 1

      Isn't it phantastic when science and engineering can profit from stupidity and narrow-minded nationalism? If only that were always the case!

      Sadly, it's the case very often - just about anything that can be classified as a "dual-use" technology gets a great deal of funding when perceived to be strategically important. In addition to the obvious example of the space race, the development of radar and digital computers was heavily driven by WWII, and we've also made some major advances in medical care thanks to a number of wars that almost no one is proud of.

  17. Little sissies by Jonifico · · Score: 1

    Se they just got a little jealous and now they're going to make a tantrum by following their rivals. Let's see them do it for $72 million.

  18. Re:What about Africa? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why don't you enlighten us ?

  19. Re: What about Africa? by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    Actually, those of us who have worked on space programs rarely, if ever, mock anybody for trying. It remains damn difficult.
    In fact, had NASA not helped osc, blue origin, and esp spacex, they would all be still working with small rockets that blow up occasionally.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
  20. they can do it for lesd by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    Chinese economy is a mix if capitalism (west facing businesses) and communism ( for all other businesses, Chinese gov dictates where u can work at and for how much ). As such, Chinese gov simply tells their employees to make less money.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    1. Re:they can do it for lesd by cavreader · · Score: 4, Interesting

      China is quintessential corporatism in action. The total merger of state and corporate power controlled by a board of directors commonly called the "Party". The country has not been communist for a long time and there are strong arguments supporting idea that they truly were never communist in the first place. The Chinese citizens have absolutely no way of influencing any government policies and decisions. Even simple non-violent protesting is frowned upon and suppressed by the government if it threatens the status quo . The government programs aimed at benefiting it's citizens do just enough to keep a lid on dissent and mass protests, and China definitely contains a lot of mass. China built it's economy on cheap labor and a fair amount of currency manipulation instead of adding their currency to the international basket of currencies and allowed to float in relation to other economies. Theses two pillars of economic policy are not sustainable. There are other countries capable of providing low cost labor. The Chinese citizens uplifted by the economic gains are starting to demand higher pay and benefits which is a well established principle in nationalistic economy model. The country may have risen up to be a world economic power but their Per capita statistics are still far behind countries such as Japan and the US. It is possible for a state to have a high GDP but if that success doesn't translate down to the average citizens it is a pretty meaningless metric.

    2. Re:they can do it for lesd by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What the fuck are you smoking and where can we all get some?
      I haven't seen anything so clueless since cold fjord opened his trap.

    3. Re:they can do it for lesd by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think you forgot theft. Lots and lots of theft. Maybe that thought was stolen from you? They are very quick......

    4. Re:they can do it for lesd by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 2

      LOL. State ownership of huge companies is indeed a hallmark of communism. I love how so many people are desperately trying to say China was never communist in the first place, because it didn't work out well. It's funny how many capital-C Communist regimes there were in the world - and yet not a single one was communist. It's the No True Scotsman fallacy in action.

      They are, in fact, communist. However, they are taking the capitalist road to achieve socialism. This is a heresy of communism, one Mao warned against repeatedly. Critical thinking led the Chinese Communist Party to take the capitalist road, and this lifted the Chinese people out of grinding poverty. Today, things are better than they've ever been before, and tomorrow will be better.

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
    5. Re:they can do it for lesd by the+gnat · · Score: 1

      The country has not been communist for a long time and there are strong arguments supporting idea that they truly were never communist in the first place

      I don't know, I think the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution are quintessential examples of communism in action, and had nearly nothing in common with capitalist systems.

    6. Re:they can do it for lesd by cavreader · · Score: 1

      Communism is a failed and impracticable ideology. It sounds good on paper but in reality it doesn't scale. It dampens motivations, incentives, and brings progress to a stop. The only equality produced by communist policies is when everyone are equally poor. Communist slogans and rhetoric preach equality of the masses while demonizing anyone who dares to succeed and attain wealth. But the harsh reality is that people are not equal. Some contribute more to society than others and they expect more for their efforts. The leaders of the countries espousing communism are just pandering to their populations to foster the impression that the state really does care about the common man. The only equality to be found in communism is making everyone equally poor. Meanwhile the leaders of these countries are some of the richest people on the planet. The Great Leap Forward was just Mao's way of consolidating his power while removing anyone who might challenge his rule.

  21. Re: The Chinese can just steal the specs of the De by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nobody was paid off for that. Loreal did that on own. Take koch bros cock out of your mouth. They have rammed your brain too many times.

  22. Say what you wil... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm so damn happy the space race has picked up again! Absolutely psyched! I just hope this continues on for decades to come... and not fizzle out as quick as it did back in the 70s-80s

  23. Re: The Chinese can just steal the specs of the De by Squidlips · · Score: 1

    Just because you are a foul-mouthed cretin does not make you right. I know that Clinton is a god to you, but he was just another corrupt pol (and rapist also). From the Washington Post, hardly a leftist org (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/campfin/stories/loral053198.htm): "Yet early this year, despite expressions of concern from the Justice Department, President Clinton gave the company permission to launch another satellite in China."

  24. Open up mission control? by Squidlips · · Score: 1

    Why doesn't China open up their mission control to western reporters during their missions? This is same paranoid crap the Soviet Union pulled. I am sure that they would also do the Soviet thing of only announcing their missions only if they were successful, but they cannot get away with it. Time to get out of the dark ages China; enough of this 1984 crap.

  25. Sharing is caring by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Open Source rocket design for a space faring tomorrow.

  26. This is stupid... by gwstuff · · Score: 1

    We should all pool our efforts together and build on each other's success, rather than treating space exploration in the same way as world cup soccer.

    1. Re:This is stupid... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yep, with the current generations of folks, we're all in High School. It is afterall all about social trends lately.

  27. India and China are not in a space race. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Despite what the summary states, China was actually quite congratulatory towards India's accomplishment. And the two space agencies have decided to try to work together on some space research (http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/India-to-develop-remote-sensing-satellites-with-China/articleshow/43022837.cms) . Totally opposite of what the summary states. In addition, during Xi Jinping's visit to India this past week, agreements were signed between China and India "to cooperate in peaceful use of space, to research and develop scientific experiment satellites, remote sensing and communications satellites."

  28. Re:What about Africa? by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

    They went there in June 2003. I've read all about it in The Martian Chronicles.

    --
    Ezekiel 23:20
  29. Re: What about Africa? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Actually, those of us who have worked on space programs...

    WindBourne you worked in the space program?
    You being the same guy who had problems comprehending simple English?
    What did you do? Janitor at JPL?