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Downtown Project Suicides Shock High Tech Community
HughPickens.com writes Nellie Bowles writes in Recode that three of the most prominent high tech entrepreneurs involved with Tony Hsieh's project to build a startup city in Downtown Las Vegas have recently committed suicide, sending the tight-knit community into a tailspin. In January 2013, Jody Sherman, the 48-year-old founder of Ecomom, one of the most prominent Vegas tech-funded startups, shot himself while in his car. His company had been going south. In January 2014, 24-year-old Ovik Banerjee, who was part of the first Venture for America group in Vegas and an integral member of the Downtown Project team, leapt from his Town Terrace apartment in downtown. In May 2014, Matt Berman, the 50-year-old founder of Bolt Barber, the flagship shop at the center of the Container Park, was found in his home in an apparent suicide by hanging. Whether or not the suicides are statistically significant, the deaths have clearly shaken the entrepreneurs.
According to Alyson Shontell, in a social media age where word of success and failure travels fast, entrepreneurs say it's harder than ever to run a company — and it's harder than ever to fail. "It was a hell of a lot of work for not a hell of a lot of return," says Dave McClure, an investor in Ecomom and the entrepreneur behind investment firm 500Startups. "And then there are days when you sit in a corner and cry. You can't really do anything else. You don't have a social life. You don't really want to interact with family and friends because there's just not much context for them. Your world revolves around your startup and it's all about trying to survive and not look like an idiot in front of employees." "In the past, failure was very contained," another entrepreneur says. "When you failed, you felt bad around your family, the people you raised money from, but it wasn't as public. Failure in an era of social media and social video and global events is a very public thing. Jody [Sherman] put himself out there this time and became very respected for what he was doing. That possibility of very public shame is something that didn't exist before." Brad Feld writes that if you are ever considering committing suicide, reach out to someone and ask for help. "It's ok to fail. It's ok to lose. It's ok to be depressed. If you are contemplating suicide, get help. If you have an entrepreneurial friend contemplating suicide, do your best to get them help."
According to Alyson Shontell, in a social media age where word of success and failure travels fast, entrepreneurs say it's harder than ever to run a company — and it's harder than ever to fail. "It was a hell of a lot of work for not a hell of a lot of return," says Dave McClure, an investor in Ecomom and the entrepreneur behind investment firm 500Startups. "And then there are days when you sit in a corner and cry. You can't really do anything else. You don't have a social life. You don't really want to interact with family and friends because there's just not much context for them. Your world revolves around your startup and it's all about trying to survive and not look like an idiot in front of employees." "In the past, failure was very contained," another entrepreneur says. "When you failed, you felt bad around your family, the people you raised money from, but it wasn't as public. Failure in an era of social media and social video and global events is a very public thing. Jody [Sherman] put himself out there this time and became very respected for what he was doing. That possibility of very public shame is something that didn't exist before." Brad Feld writes that if you are ever considering committing suicide, reach out to someone and ask for help. "It's ok to fail. It's ok to lose. It's ok to be depressed. If you are contemplating suicide, get help. If you have an entrepreneurial friend contemplating suicide, do your best to get them help."
err... I mean, a sucide.
If someone is going to kill themselves because of the situation they put themselves into (presumably starting a tech company isn't about life and death) what made them stay and not just do something else ?
Professional hit men kill their victims by apparent suicide or accident: overdose, auto accident, ski accident, etc.
1 or more of these could have been suicided.
You're talking about Vegas here. I seriously doubt that three guys all decided they couldn't handle the failure of a project like this.
All three methods of suicide are suspect as well.
I lived in Vegas for years and it's a really shitty town. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find some corruption behind it all that was coming to light.
Suicide? Meh...
How does "providing eco friendly and organic products to moms who desire an eco-conscious lifestyle for themselves and their children" amount to being a member of the "high tech community"? How does real estate development or running a barber shop make you a member of the high tech community? All these people are businessmen, and their troubles seem to be due to bad business decisions. No "high tech" involved, except perhaps that they were hoping that they could sell to "techies".
1 or more of these could have been suicided.
That seems like a fairly natural thought, doesn't it?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
The summary does do a very good job of explaining what was going on...
All of these men are involved in the same project... "The Vegas Downtown Project" who's goal seems to be to bring a tech sector to downtown Vegas. Why that would be a good idea is anyone's guess.
The CEO has stepped down as well. http://techcrunch.com/2014/09/...
The whole thing seems pretty fishy. I don't go to Vegas for a reason...
Or easier to fail?
While the thought of loans from corrupt sources comes to mind as a catalyst, I believe there are other reasons. (this is Vegas, and while Corporations are now the Casino hoods instead of Cosa Nostra, hoods will still make you short-term, high interest loans featuring successful collection agents)
Business IS business.
These people were living their dream, too close to the bone.
1. Never Marry Your Business. That's like marrying your hammer or pocketknife, it is a tool. If it doesn't work , replace it. You are not there to serve it as a marriage partner. It will never fullfill this role and you will waste your life trying. If you spend your life trying and failing, you aren't interested in what you are doing. If you learn from your mistakes and others mistakes, you can't help but climb.Your business that you love is still a soul sucking vampire that will drain you and leave your husk to rot in a ditch. Avoid giving it priority above family, health and other dreams you have. Sacrifice is for chumps.
2. Build your BIG business from smaller businesses and investments. This gives you throwaways to practice your chops with and if they fail, you have learned with one of many baskets of eggs, not the whole hen house. Keep yourself the main investor in the Big One, sell off other ventures as your time and profits demand.
3. Avoid investors in the BIG one, unless you want to retire. Even then, keep a vast majority of it unless the rat race appeals to you less than that island you've been eyeing.
4. Short of transgressing ethics, take every positive break you can, incorporate with the government as little as possible and be honest in your dealings. You are only as good as your word. Even accomplishment is second to this.
5.Go with your intuition every chance you get.
*Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
I'm very confused by all of this. Is Downtown Project the same as Downton Abbey? Is Downton Abbey in Las Vegas and Downtown Project in London, or is it the other way around? Why would these two projects use such similar names?
There are rumors around that these only "look" like suicides. They were made to look that way.
Vegas is dirty. Real dirty. There are "lenders" who expect to be repaid on time and if you don't well let's say you might end up "committing suicide".
There's a lot of doubt around let's just say that.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Hmmm... Three linked "suicides" in Las Vegas. This sure would be a nifty bit of viral marketing for the new season of CSI... Just sayin'...
Chelloveck
I give up on debugging. From now on, SIGSEGV is a feature.
"It's Las Vegas, Jake. Of course people are killing themselves."
You are welcome on my lawn.
Silly as it sounds, they would have had much easier time raising money for next project than some unknown guy. Sounds like personal problems.
Man, my comment subject looks like it was written by a 14 yo. But that aside...
...I can absolutely relate to that. My biggest fear in life is rejection, I hate rejection, I have such a hard time handling rejection that last time I was rejected for something, it took me 3 years of my life just to recover. Many times I contemplated suicide, but I wussed out every time I tried (and that's a good thing).
That's the NO #1 reason I'm not starting up my company right now, I have experience and TONS of it, I've been a service tech for years, an elected official for large groups of people, teacher for all ages. And STILL - I am worried about failure. C'mon, who isn't? I read somewhere that most business executives are Psychopaths because running a business with no empathy makes for one helluva war machine hellbent on winning, thus increase the chance of actually getting there, no matter the costs of others...which definitively isn't me as I have deep feelings for anyone who suffers or goes trough hard times.
Heck, I even went trough a very expensive leadership assessment test (not online, this was with a bunch of professional coaches, psychologists etc.) and of the entire group I was elected the most likely to be a good successful leader. But would you believe I STILL DOUBT THAT?!
This is tough stuff, not easy for anyone. This is a problem that gets WAY too little attention, and I'm pretty confident that any country who paid attention to this, would have a lot more successful starter companies and thus a much lover unemployment rate.
What this world is coming to - is for you and me to decide.
It's evident from this and your other comment that you lack empathy. Try not to post on stories like this: you're too deficient to have an opinion worth reading.
They call this early retirement at Microsoft HQ. It isn't weakness.
Here 9 year old prodigy Arfa Karim working 14hr a day at Microsoft retires at age 16.
How Early Retirement At Microsoft Works:
http://youtu.be/OMyvRDYaq14
Someone has to get cream pie for this ;)
A Matter Of Cream Pie:
http://youtu.be/5LftvcaBLZk
End of sarcasm, retirement is another word for death.
depression is a terrible fate from which to suffer. only the strong-willed survive, as the weak kill themselves after depression has feasted upon their souls.
Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
Behold the price of trying to make something of yourself
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rp8xIWT6eFY
Thanks for the obligatory, "If you feel bad, reach out to someone or the suicide hotline." I thought I only got this PC bullshit from TV.
Once the blue aliens get their seed in you and harvest their spawn, make your time
Suicide, or suicided? When big money and big changes are involved, it's usually the case that people want to kill each other, than themselves.
It was a good idea, but they didn't want to play ball I guess. Too idealistic for reality.
There are literally millions of people that wish they could have the chance like that these folks had
So my mind was filled with wonder when the evening headlines read
Richard Cory went home last night and put a bullet through his head.
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
Chronic stress causes overt brain damage which reduces the cerebral cortex's ability to regulate the lymbic system. When you are too stressed for too long, you literally lose emotional control. This is a fact of neurology, and has nothing to do with your mindset or strength of will.
Once this has happened, something like depression is deadly. It isn't just feeling sad; it warps your perception of reality to the point where suicide actually seems to make sense. Simple clear rational thinking stops being possible because your brain is too damaged for it, at that point. The painful muscle cramps, panic attacks, and insomnia that go along with depression only make matters worse.
Running a business, especially in this cartel-dominated economy where it is nearly impossible to get your foot in the market's door, creates precisely the sort of endless stress that will cause this.
The only good news is that the brain damage is reversible; the brain will heal itself if given enough time (measured in months) without high stress levels. But an entrepreneur scrambling to keep his (or her) company afloat will not have such an opportunity.
Nope. It is the opposite. Depression is the sign that you have been too strong for too long. It is thought that depression is a natural reaction of the brain to make you stop banging your head against the wall when you consciously don't want to give in a hopeless situation. When one is only going to hurt oneself and maybe others when one insists that one should never give up. Then depression steps in to protect one from harming oneself and accept a low profile until the situation changes. When such a thing happens, it is a sign that it is time to stop and take a step back. If one doesn't accept this and tries to achieve unachievable, depression only gets stronger and one may commit a suicide. Other successful people who have gone through series of failures are probably more lenient to themselves. When they see a failure they admit it quickly. The motto of the Silicon Valley is is fail early, fail often. Basically it means: don't be too strong. Test new ideas, put some effort. But if it doesn't work, don't get too attached to them. Let them fail before they fail you.
I think I see what's wrong here. There's a severe water shortage around Vegas and they're trying to start up high tech companies in the middle of it in new towns. What could possibly go wrong? Talk about a short-sighted pipe dream. You can't just look at property values and taxes and say yep, that's where we should build. The air conditioning costs alone kill server farms. I mean who thought any of this was a good idea?!
That's not strong, it's stubborn. The inability to judge and turn loose of a bad situation isn't strength.
It is just how the brain works as conditioned by our evolution and education. "Never give up" is the very much glorified by different cultures. Whereas those who give up are vilified as cowards. The most successful men rarely want to admit aht there success is 95% of luck.
You can't even spell.... STFU.
"If any question why we died, Tell them because our fathers lied."
With marijuana being tolerated by the high-tech community, given that it has been scientifically proven to induce severe depression, perhaps these people had been smoking it?
Jesus F--king Christ, just walk away. Just do it, it works. And after a while, you look back and realize how silly the drama was.
now for the rest of these "founders". sick of hearing about all the fucking worthless startups and retards getting rich off them before they disappear.
We should make suicide illegal, that should stop it.
You die anyway, all your achievements are vain.
Life is pointless, it's short and full of suffering.
I'm a bit curious. Are you judging the suicides becuase you've been a similar situation? That is to say, worked absurdly hard to get a small business rolling, only to fail and be judged as a failure by many of the people you know (plus whatever contacts you have on social media). Or, are you just playing the "they can't handle that much negative stimilus, how pathetic" card?
You aren't curious, people like you don't get "curious" about people like me, you already have it in your head what I am, your comment is bait and nothing more.
But to address the naïveté of your "curious question", who in this life has not been judged? And if the people in your life judge you as a failure for trying let me give you some advice.
Find a better class of people.
"If any question why we died, Tell them because our fathers lied."
"You can't really do anything else. You don't have a social life. You don't really want to interact with family and friends because there's just not much context for them. Your world revolves around your startup ..."
This is an inherently unhealthy lifestyle, it's hardly any surprise it leads to unhealthy results. Doesn't matter what the business is, a poor integration of your work life into the rest of your life will cause problems.
Rather defensive. For what it's worth, I'm not out to get you. Though I could see why you'd think so since this is /. and all.
My thought preliminary judgement of you was "I hope it's the former." I can kind of get people who look down on others for not doing emotionally as well as them in similar situations (soldiers who look down on other soldiers who have PTSD for exmaple). But if you're just judging someone without knowing their situation, or at least their emotioinal state? Yea, that's being a smug dick. Like a civilian calling a soldier with PTSD weak I suppose.
I'll give you some advice as well. If you fail in a business venture of this magnitude, people WILL judge you as a failure no matter how much they care about you. This is especially true if you stressed your finances and your relationship for the sake of the business. Now those that do care will forgive and move on quickly, but you still hurt them. And finding a better class of people won't take away the sting that they're not the ones that made a mistake, you did.
Now, I imagine you'll point out that no matter how bad one feels, they shouldn't kill themselves (that's weak as you say). All I can say to that is, unless you truly appreciate how depression and stress can erode the rational mind, then judge if you must. But at the same time, be aware that you're judging from ignorance.
I didn’t read the TFA, but if these suicides happened within the same area, someone needs to zero in on the local LEAs as possible suspects.
"Rather defensive. For what it's worth, I'm not out to get you. Though I could see why you'd think so since this is /. and all."
Again bait, and the tired straw man argument, you first provide 2 equally appalling choices in your first statement for me to "choose which one I am" and in your next post you begin to label me as "defensive" and paranoid.
Grow up.
"If any question why we died, Tell them because our fathers lied."
I baited you (again) for saying that I'm not here for an argument (not "out to get you")? Only way you can call that me baiting you is if you think I'm lying. And yea dude (or dudette), that's being defensive.
There's really two choices available here. You understand their situation and you're judging them. Or, you don't understand their situation and your're judging them. You know, or you don't know. How exactly are these "appalling choices?"
Well, in any event, if you do wish to elaborate on your stance (besides the flippant "who in this life has not been judged") then I will read and try to be civil even if I end up not agreeing with you. But if you just want to throw more insults (ad hominem attacks since we're bringing out the fallacies) then that's cool too.
You are an idiot...
"If any question why we died, Tell them because our fathers lied."
Anne McCaffery, The Dune guy, The Ender's Game guy, and a bunch of others: Inertia from all their friends doing it.
About half of the nerdy books I read as a kid/early college were due to 'nerdy' peer pressure, where if you hadn't read the same 'seminal works' as your friends you were denigrated.
There were exceptions amongst the hard sci-fi authors, but most of the 'popular' ones were retired or coauthoring by then.
To be, or not to be, that is the question—
Whether 'tis Nobler in the mind to suffer
The Slings and Arrows of outrageous Fortune,
Or to take Arms against a Sea of troubles,
And by opposing, end them? To die, to sleep—
No more; and by a sleep, to say we end
The Heart-ache, and the thousand Natural shocks
That Flesh is heir to? 'Tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wished. To die, to sleep,
To sleep, perchance to Dream; Aye, there's the rub,
For in that sleep of death, what dreams may come,
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause. There's the respect
That makes Calamity of so long life:
For who would bear the Whips and Scorns of time,
The Oppressor's wrong, the proud man's Contumely,
The pangs of despised Love, the Law’s delay,
The insolence of Office, and the Spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his Quietus make
With a bare Bodkin? Who would these Fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscovered Country, from whose bourn
No Traveler returns, Puzzles the will,
And makes us rather bear those ills we have,
Than fly to others that we know not of.
Thus Conscience does make Cowards of us all,
And thus the Native hue of Resolution
Is sicklied o'er, with the pale cast of Thought,
And enterprises of great pitch and moment,
With this regard their Currents turn awry,
And lose the name of Action. Soft you now,
The fair Ophelia. Nymph, in all thy Orisons
Be thou all my sins remembered.
William Shakespeare's "Hamlet"
I sincerely hope that he stopped the car first. Otherwise, he could have hurt a number of other people.
Another consequence of the US's stupid attitude to guns. With them being so readily available, many people use them for suicide with a high rate of success, where if they'd had to try less effective methods they may well have had time for second thoughts.
How did Dorothy Parker put it?
Razors pain you;
Rivers are damp;
Acids stain you;
And drugs cause cramp.
Guns arenâ(TM)t lawful;
Nooses give;
Gas smells awful;
You might as well live.
Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"