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The Anthropocene Epoch Began With 1945 Atomic Bomb Test, Scientists Say

hypnosec writes: Scientists have proposed July 16, 1945 as the beginning of the Anthropocene Epoch. That was the day of the first nuclear detonation test. They say "the Great Acceleration" — the period when human activities started having a significant impact on Earth – are a good mark of the beginning of the new epoch. Since then, there has been a significant increase in population, environmental upheaval on land and oceans, and global connectivity. The group says in their article (abstract), "The beginning of the nuclear age ... marks the historic turning point when humans first accessed an enormous new energy source – and is also a time level that can be effectively tracked within geological strata, using a variety of geological clues."

154 comments

  1. Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Does anybody consider this science? Does it really matter what we refer to the current "age" as? Why is this shit on Slashdot?

    1. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by ganjadude · · Score: 2

      does it really matter? no, not to us, not right now. but generations from now it will be nice for the historians to have a name to go with the time frame (not like they wouldnt simply make one up as we have done with all other periods in time to date)

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    2. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by tyggna · · Score: 2

      All science is either mathematics, or stamp collecting. This would be printing a stamp and adding it to a collection of already printed stamps.

    3. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yes, why have words to describe things which have a significant impact on humans? Let's go further than denying the impact of our brains, and deny our brains entirely.

      Unf. NN grrr mgrgrlrgl. Snarf? Brrrp. Fapfapfap. Queeeeg! Ook.

    4. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by mspohr · · Score: 5, Informative

      Also... from TFAbstract, they chose the date because all of the nuclear explosions have left a clear marker of radioisotopes which can be easily located when tracing the geological record.

      --
      I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
    5. Re: Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You almost have a point but that if it's only important for future scientists, let them define it based on better informed notions. I'm positive that the radio or some industrial landmark would make more sense. E.g. first mass pollutions, which do have environmental impact. Medieval deforestation of Europe may be a candidate too.

    6. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by shadowrat · · Score: 0

      It's pure hubris to think that scientists in the future are going to go along with our stupid names for stuff.

    7. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by mythosaz · · Score: 4, Funny

      Yeah, it'd be like using Latin for scientific terminology today.

    8. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by seededfury · · Score: 1

      Everyone who takes ages serious knows we live in The Age of Pisces looking forward to The Age of Aquarius.

    9. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by ColdWetDog · · Score: 3, Funny

      Unf. NN grrr mgrgrlrgl. Snarf? Brrrp. Fapfapfap. Queeeeg! Ook.

      You sound like my niece.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    10. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by shadowrat · · Score: 1

      we use latin words to be unambiguous, but we come up with the latin names ourselves. the romans didn't name a rattlesnake crotalus atrox. They hadn't even determined the whole family genus species classification stuff.

      Now, if we described stuff by it's percentages of fire earth air and water and spirit...

    11. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by wiredlogic · · Score: 1

      It will provide the basis for lots of academic papers and the creation of new "anthropocene studies" departments at institutions of higher learning. What's not to love?

      --
      I am becoming gerund, destroyer of verbs.
    12. Re: Academic wankery at its finest by catmistake · · Score: 0

      You almost have a point but that if it's only important for future scientists, let them define it based on better informed notions. I'm positive that the radio or some industrial landmark would make more sense. E.g. first mass pollutions, which do have environmental impact. Medieval deforestation of Europe may be a candidate too.

      Considering even today, only about 13% of power globally is nuclear generated, and it is not clear we will still be generating nuclear fission power in 100 years, or any more than we are now, I agree. Though its easy to trace the bombs' effects in the future, the incandescent light bulb had a far greater impact on society and the population explosion, and industrialization of that time had greater impact on the environment.

      Then again, an argument could be made that the fulcrum for the advancement of our species occured with the invention/introduction of true perspective in art, which isn't even technology.

    13. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by CaptainDork · · Score: 3, Funny

      And like my knees.

      --
      It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
    14. Re: Academic wankery at its finest by Whiteox · · Score: 1

      Then again, an argument could be made that the fulcrum for the advancement of our species occured with the invention/introduction of true perspective in art, which isn't even technology.

      Almost. You can see true perspective in statues and facades in pre dark age Europe and the Mediterranean. The flat non-perspective that you are referring to signifies the importance of every object on a panel. That's why you get floating ships in the background much larger than they should be ~ people in the foreground smaller than the subject in the middle. You are really talking about renaissance realism which incorporated true perspective on panel work.

      The biggest change imho is the burning of masses of fossil fuels (including radioactive matter). That would be a measurable criteria.

      --
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    15. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Also... from TFAbstract, they chose the date because all of the nuclear explosions have left a clear marker of radioisotopes which can be easily located when tracing the geological record.

      I wonder how long (in geological terms) the signal will be so clear. For example, the increased rate of production and deposition of atmospheric Carbon-14 during the nuclear test era is extremely obvious at present. But in one million years, the level of carbon 14 will be been reduced (due to nuclear decay) by a factor of about 1e-53, so that this signal would become at that time quite negligible. Of course the exercise is rather academic -- there is no way to tell what additional factors, natural or manmade, may influence the hypothetical future geological record.

    16. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by samkass · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Also... from TFAbstract, they chose the date because all of the nuclear explosions have left a clear marker of radioisotopes which can be easily located when tracing the geological record.

      And importantly, this will be true globally. This seems to be what most posters here seem to be ignoring... A hundred thousand years from now you'll probably be able to dig into the ground and identify this epoch anywhere on Earth where the rocks are old enough by the distinct atomic decay signature, among other things.

      --
      E pluribus unum
    17. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Iamthecheese · · Score: 1
      --
      If video games influenced behavior the Pac Man generation would be eating pills and running away from their problems.
    18. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Scarletdown · · Score: 2

      Now, if we described stuff by it's percentages of fire earth air and water and spirit...

      shouldn't that be fire, earth, air, water, and Leeloo?

      --
      This space unintentionally left blank.
    19. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      GAH! It's Earth, Wind, and Fire....

    20. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nah, we will be remembered as the "age of oil".

    21. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by flyingsquid · · Score: 2, Interesting

      It's a bit like the iridium spike at the K-T boundary in that the use of nuclear weapons is an event that will have a worldwide signal, in fact it wouldn't surprise me if they got the idea from the asteroid impact. This would be a bit ironic because Alvarez, the guy who discovered the impact, was a Manhattan project alum who actually worked on the explosive lenses and triggers used in the Trinity implosion bomb. The issue with using Trinity is that from a biological/evolutionary standpoint its not that meaningful an event. The Chicxulub impact is a huge deal, it's the driver of the biggest mass extinction in 250 million years. The Trinity test has the advantage of being easy to measure but nuclear weapons have had pretty much zero effect on the biosphere. In fact, primitive hunter-gatherers running around with fire and spears have a vastly larger effect than nuclear bombs. After Homo sapiens moves out of Africa into Australia, Europe, and the Americas, we see massive dieoffs of the megafauna which, combined with the use of fire to alter the landscape, dramatically alter the fauna and vegetation on a continental scale. From an evolutionary standpoint, these migrations are important; they mark the first time the species began to alter the world on the level of entire ecosystems. So I'd argue that the migration of Homo sapiens out of Africa would be the defining event, but obviously that's kind of hard to date.

    22. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by khallow · · Score: 1
      There are longer lived isotopes that will be around a lot longer than a million years, particularly, uranium 238.

      there is no way to tell what additional factors, natural or manmade, may influence the hypothetical future geological record.

      Except through the usual tools of science and reason.

    23. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by khallow · · Score: 2

      we use latin words to be unambiguous

      We could use plenty of other schemes to get the same effect without having to use a dead language. The grand parent's point remains.

    24. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      In the terms of "Epochs" it's total wankery (or in American English, mental masturbation ;)

      It may even make sense to consider "the atomic age" as a new Epoch at some point in the distant future, but placing that date on it is pure politics, not science.

    25. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      Except it's not really using a *dead* language, it's using a popular academic language that was chosen back when people still LEARNED AND READ LATIN (and really, one with a structure that lends itself particularly well to the purpose).

      Your current perspective on it is about as useful as someone 150 years from now saying "why they hell did we standardize one the metric system when we could have used plenty of other systems of measure?"

    26. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by khallow · · Score: 1

      Except it's not really using a *dead* language

      Nobody speaks it. The closest anyone comes is "church latin" a near variant used by the Roman Catholic Church. That's what makes latin a dead language.

    27. Re: Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There are other such markers. They include things like increases in lead concentration as a result of lead smelting, and changes in the pollen preserved in sediments. These are commonly used for anthropology studies. The problem is, they're all local changes with their own unique timing, depending upon when forest clearing and industrialization began in a particular region. That's useful information, but not a global, synchronous marker.

      By contrast, once nuclear bombs started to be exploded in the atmosphere it's a globally-distributed event you can easily detect everywhere sediments were being deposited.

    28. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      And like my pants.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    29. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by epine · · Score: 1

      Nobody speaks it. The closest anyone comes is "church latin" a near variant used by the Roman Catholic Church. That's what makes latin a dead language.

      Applying the colloquial criteria of "dead" to a language that remained—however frozen—in widespread and specialized use over many centuries is a complete waste of time for the present discussion. "Dead" is really just a shortened version of "dead to the evolutionary fads of populism".

      One could argue that Perl is presently a near-dead language (it's evolution has become famously glacial) and then on this basis write a script routing all security advisories concerning Perl (such as DSA-2870-1 libyaml-libyaml-perl) straight into the round device.

      On the other hand, perhaps Perl isn't quite as "dead" as the idiom suggests. Perhaps Perl is merely catatonic, or just resting.

    30. Re: Academic wankery at its finest by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      The shift to accuracy and secular subjects in art is a useful milestone in terms of anthropology or history certainly. However, it's not anthropology that's really under discussion in this "Age of Man" thread. That would be more of a goeologic metric than an anthropologic one.

      +...and yes it is true that a lot of the Italian Renaissance was the re-discovery of principles that had been known to the ancients.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    31. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by khallow · · Score: 1

      Applying the colloquial criteria of "dead" to a language that remainedâ"however frozenâ"in widespread and specialized use over many centuries is a complete waste of time for the present discussion.

      Aside from being highly relevant to the discussion at hand. Keep in mind the original assertion was:

      It's pure hubris to think that scientists in the future are going to go along with our stupid names for stuff.

      Yet here we are going along with Latin names for things even though Latin is a dead language whose practical uses now only extend to specialized scientific labeling and rituals for a particular religious sect.

      One could argue that Perl is presently a near-dead language (it's evolution has become famously glacial) and then on this basis write a script routing all security advisories concerning Perl (such as DSA-2870-1 libyaml-libyaml-perl) straight into the round device.

      One can argue the Moon is made of green cheese. The obvious rebuttals are 1) computer languages aren't languages, 2) unlike Latin, Perl is in widespread use as far as computer languages go, and 3) nobody argued that a language was dead on the basis of it remaining static over time.

    32. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Sesostris+III · · Score: 2

      Nobody speaks it.

      I don't know. I think it still gets used on an ad hoc basis.

      --
      You never know what is enough unless you know what is more than enough. - Blake
    33. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by minstrelmike · · Score: 1

      I think the development of fire might be one of our defining moments but it may not be measurable in rocks an eon later. The invention/discovery of agriculture 10,000 years ago has been the common starting point and I think those changes would be measurable in rocks by paleontologists of the future.

    34. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by cyberchondriac · · Score: 1

      Is there a generally understood tolerance, plus or minus a century or two? Because I think it's fair to consider that humankind had transformed the planet before 1945 , with the industrial revolution, the span of railroads across continents, flight, building huge cities and skyscrapers and lighting them up at night with electricity (visible from space), etc..

      --

      Look back up at my post, now look back down, you're on the Internet. Now look back up. I'm a signature.
    35. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by cyberchondriac · · Score: 1

      I was thinking R2D2.

      --

      Look back up at my post, now look back down, you're on the Internet. Now look back up. I'm a signature.
    36. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And what about high levels of radiation? Certainly, there are all kinds of radiation. But perhaps you should get on a tourist bus to visit some of the sites, oh wait, maybe you already did. You tell me.

    37. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That was a case of internet wankery at its best.

    38. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by lucien86 · · Score: 1

      There's already hundreds of millions or billions of tons of U238 in the natural environment - where do you think it all came from?
      About 4 billion tons of uranium in the oceans alone..

      --
      Below the speed of light Special Relativity is one of the most accurate theories in physics - above the speed of light..
    39. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by lucien86 · · Score: 1

      Only trouble with aliens. - If an alien turns up that has FTL technology, nuclear bombs and missiles are not likely to be any more effective than wooden bows and arrows, or thrown rocks.

      --
      Below the speed of light Special Relativity is one of the most accurate theories in physics - above the speed of light..
    40. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by khallow · · Score: 1

      There's already hundreds of millions or billions of tons of U238 in the natural environment - where do you think it all came from?

      So what? It's not universally mixed throughout the environment. One will still be able to see a spike in uranium 238 in sediment from coal burning and enhanced erosion of certain forests.

    41. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by fxsoap · · Score: 1

      the chances are minuscule but collisions do occur out there in the Universe, and if one came our way and we had no tools like the Teller-Ulam designs, we'd be sitting ducks.

      Do you have any idea how dangerous that would be to fire a nuclear bomb at an incoming asteroid? What does the Hydrogen bomb have to do with it?

      Please watch any of Neil's stuff on this

      The kind that would cause us extinction:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fUgxmfgIlY

      What happens if you “nuke” it:

      http://youtu.be/vjdxuT8zhk0?t=3m37s

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-ReuLZ2quc

      Longer talk dedicated to this:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hi54HYX9pWc

    42. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by fxsoap · · Score: 1

      Your wit is amazing in this. Bravo! :)

    43. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      One can argue the Moon is made of green cheese. The obvious rebuttals are 1) computer languages aren't languages, 2) unlike Latin, Perl is in widespread use as far as computer languages go, and 3) nobody argued that a language was dead on the basis of it remaining static over time.

      Yet none of your points has remotely disproved the green cheese hypothesis...

    44. Re:Academic wankery at its finest by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      My point was people did use it in many applications (church as well as science) back in the 1600-1700s when it was first used to name species.

      And not speaking it in normal conversation doesn't mean it isn't or wasn't used. There are many thousands (tens of thousands? hundreds of thousands?) of scholars *now* who can read it in order to read and study old texts. And in the 1600's when the biological taxonomy was first established, Latin was literally the common written language between scientists of a dozen different countries who may not even have been able to communicate any other way.

  2. Anthropocene Epoch. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Anthropocene Epoch." Cross that out and replace with "The point of which humans started to have a global effect on the Earth."

    I had to look up those two words.

    1. Re:Anthropocene Epoch. by NoNonAlphaCharsHere · · Score: 1

      No, that was the Industrial Revolution: steam trains and burning coal.

    2. Re:Anthropocene Epoch. by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      No, that was the Industrial Revolution: steam trains and burning coal.

      No, it was when humans ventured out of Africa, caused mass extinctions, and began regularly burning millions of square miles of grassland to maintain better grazing for their prey.

    3. Re:Anthropocene Epoch. by sycodon · · Score: 1

      NO, it was when Porn because freely available on the Internet.

      Fuck'n Amateurs.

      --
      When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    4. Re:Anthropocene Epoch. by NoNonAlphaCharsHere · · Score: 4, Funny

      You're thinking of the Spankocene Era.

    5. Re:Anthropocene Epoch. by ColdWetDog · · Score: 1

      This. This (or shortly thereafter) was when homo sapiens started significantly altering the ecology of the planet.

      Now the nuclear age may introduce a specific inflection in the Anthropocene but so did the widespread burning of coal (the 'Industrial Revolution'). Just starting at ground zero, so to speak, seems really arbitrary.

      Perhaps millions of years from now when the Anthropocene layers are a few meters thick it might make sense to start dating from the beginning of widespread man man isotopes, but if there are anything resembling archeologists around at that time they will have found plenty of other bits of 'civilization' in that rubble.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    6. Re:Anthropocene Epoch. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Spankocene Era

      Mother Nature is suffering, but in a good way.

    7. Re:Anthropocene Epoch. by kwbauer · · Score: 0

      but that was the Native Americans, an indigenous population, so that is a good thing because they were so in touch with nature that every descendent they have 'til the end of time will also be totally in touch with nature and they could never harm it.

    8. Re:Anthropocene Epoch. by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      Meh. I'm sure there were many cases of species altering the ecology. It wasn't worldwide and (semi-)permanent until MUCH later. We didn't name an Epoch just because a particularly large population of predatory mammals reduced the population of prey in a region (which happens all the time).

  3. Remember the Maine! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think that incident marks a bigger point of change. It's when the US decided to become a more global empire, to help the Brits keep their hold. It was also much closer to the beginning of instant communications and powered transportation, two things which overwhelm the first A-bomb, which produces nothing but fear.

    1. Re:Remember the Maine! by sponglish · · Score: 1

      The first A-bomb produced fear and peace.

      --
      "I improvise. It's my greatest talent. I prefer situations to plans..." --Wintermute, William Gibson's "Neuromancer"
    2. Re:Remember the Maine! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, the second bomb and the threat of 9 more produced "peace".

    3. Re:Remember the Maine! by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Actually, the second bomb and the threat of 9 more produced "peace".

      Many have suggested that the second bomb brought hostilities to a close a day or two earlier than would otherwise have happened. It was taking the Japanese a while to get their heads around the problem of not being invincible.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    4. Re:Remember the Maine! by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

      Actually, the second bomb and the threat of 9 more produced "peace".

      Many have suggested that the second bomb brought hostilities to a close a day or two earlier than would otherwise have happened. It was taking the Japanese a while to get their heads around the problem of not being invincible.

      Others have suggested it was removing the clause to indict the Emperor for war crimes (and instead leave him be head of state) from the conditions of surrender that let the Japanese allow to surrender without losing face.

      --
      Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
  4. Asimov did it first by bosef1 · · Score: 1

    This reminds me of the classic Asimov short story, "The Last Trump"; you should go read it. Here's the Wikipedia link, but it's full of spoilers:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T...

  5. I don't think so. by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 2, Insightful

    We had access to coal and oil for a lot longer than nuclear, and fossil fuels today still represent 10x as much energy generated/used as nuclear. linky

    The figures are from 2008 - before fukushima, and nuclear plant construction is going nowhere, while China produces 1 new coal plant every day.

    --
    "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    1. Re:I don't think so. by SeaFox · · Score: 1

      ...while China produces 1 new coal plant every day.

      [citation needed]

    2. Re:I don't think so. by Ralph+Wiggam · · Score: 1

      They're not saying that nuclear power has the only impact. Just that since 1945, our overall environmental impact has increased dramatically- with China building 800 GW of coal plants being a perfect example. While our per capita impact in many ways has decreased, the huge increase in population has caused the aggregate impact to increase greatly.

      Also, while Japan and France may be scaling back their nuclear power generation, the "anti-nuclear" Obama administration has given the final approval for 4 new reactors. They're the first new ones since the 70s.

    3. Re:I don't think so. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      Yes, but they're talking about detectability of a time marker in Earth history. Post-1945 or so it is easy to detect radioisotopes in sediments being deposited world-wide.

    4. Re:I don't think so. by Immerman · · Score: 2

      True, but usage has been accelerating exponentially, and there's not really any firm date you can point to and say "this is where it started getting bad".

      If the first atomic blast lines up with the rough time period when we started having a dramatic effect on a planetary scale, and offers a convenient global geologic marker in global radioisotope deposits, then it seems like as good a boundary point as any, and better than most.

      That said, I've seen some good arguments that global desertification over the last 5-10,000 years can be laid at the feet of our ancestors' hunting, agriculture, and animal husbandry practices. Certainly there's plenty of evidence that there's been a massive extinction event over that time period, with fairly solid evidence that humans were directly responsible for at least a large portion of it. Seems to me that those would both qualify as " a significant impact on Earth"

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    5. Re:I don't think so. by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 0

      If you need a citation, why don't you just google "How many coal plants is China building?"

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    6. Re:I don't think so. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The reason is because it's easy to identify the precise geologic layer that corresponds with the first nuclear testing, not because that's the exact moment when humans starting screwing everything up.

    7. Re:I don't think so. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      your wiki link goes nowhere.

      and China has NOT been building a new plant a day

    8. Re:I don't think so. by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      The reason is because it's easy to identify the precise geologic layer that corresponds with the first nuclear testing, not because that's the exact moment when humans starting screwing everything up.

      So we fudge it? Sounds like bad science to me.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    9. Re:I don't think so. by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      Fixed linky Sorry about that.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    10. Re:I don't think so. by DexterIsADog · · Score: 1

      I tried your suggestion, so I could post something useful (rather than just post a useless, "well, why don't you..."), but neither Bing nor Google provided a good candidate to answer the question.

      I think your search term is useless, and a few minutes of searching variations didn't help either. Feel free to actually try to contribute.

    11. Re:I don't think so. by shadowrat · · Score: 3, Informative

      i get a statistic that in 2013, china produced approximately 1 coal plant a week.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...

      unless we are talking about may 17, 2013. for that time period, china did apparently produce 1 coal plant a day.

      i don't even know why i feel the need to argue this though. it has little to do with the topic. i just can't fight the urge to look up statistics. i think there's something wrong with me.

    12. Re:I don't think so. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You seem to have a skewed sense of what science really is then.

      This is good science in more than a few ways:
      1: geologic radioisotope dating for nuclear testing isotopes in the stratigraphic column is very precise, and more importantly reproducible.
      2: while determining purely by CO2 levels from the beginning of the industrial age is precise, it is LESS precise than radio isotope dating. That is really one of the only ways to differentiate timeframes in the column if we wanted to start from the revolution.
      3: this is the time that we really ramped up both resource consumption and procreation to almost exponential levels, meaning we have had more of an impact since '45 while still doing the same things we have been doing since the industrial revolution.

    13. Re:I don't think so. by ColdWetDog · · Score: 1

      Yes, but they're talking about detectability of a time marker in Earth history. Post-1945 or so it is easy to detect radioisotopes in sediments being deposited world-wide.

      As opposed to giant cities, garbage dumps, plastic in ocean sediments, weird chemicals in land and ocean sediments, carbon dioxide, aircraft carriers, AOL disks?

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    14. Re:I don't think so. by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      No, I think that picking the atomic age is purely arbitrary, ignores the fact that we still get most of our energy from fossil fuels, which renders their "marks the historic turning point when humans first accessed an enormous new energy source" invalid, because fossil fuels were, and still are, our #1 source of energy.

      We already have a different name for when we started using nuclear material - the "nuclear age." This article is stupid.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    15. Re:I don't think so. by pavon · · Score: 1

      No, good scientists understand significant digits. As far as geological epoch go, the time elapsed between the start of the industrial revolution and the start of the nuclear age is insignificant. Furthermore, while the technology began at the industrial revolution, the impact of that technology didn't have global environmental scale until later on. We don't mark the other geological boundaries at the point where precursors to change appeared, we mark them when change became significant. If you look at graphs of human energy or CO2 output, the knee in the curve does occur at around the mid 1900s. The fact that there happens to be an easily observable geological marker that occurred at that time makes it a convenient dividing point, and as good as any other of the arbitrary dates picked to divide otherwise well-distinguishable geological epochs.

      If anything, I would argue they risk jumping the gun too early, not setting the date too late, as there may very well be a much bigger global change in the next 10's thousands of years of which the last millennium will just be regarded as a precursor to.

    16. Re:I don't think so. by Dutch+Gun · · Score: 1

      If they understood significant digits, they wouldn't have measured the changing of an epoch down to the day. That's like me celebrating my birthday down to the millisecond.

      --
      Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
    17. Re:I don't think so. by Dahamma · · Score: 2

      I don't disagree that coal has had more effect than nuclear on the environment, but your "fact" is completely wrong. Kind of sad, since if you had just kept to the facts it would have been a decent point.

      And yes, the top 3 Google results (as per your suggestion) say you are wrong. Feel free to find a citation that contradicts your suggestion, though.

    18. Re:I don't think so. by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      They're not saying that nuclear power has the only impact, just bringing it up disingenuously because people have strong feelings about nuclear power.

      There, FTFY. And for the record, I'm anti-nuke because I don't believe that humans are sufficiently responsible to handle them, as a group. Once politics gets involved, it all goes downhill.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    19. Re:I don't think so. by radl33t · · Score: 2

      This is a great off topic addition to the thread. One I try to add as frequently as possible. That often cited statistic is from a brief period many years ago. China's coal construction has seriously tapered off in the last several years... in favor of wind and solar. China's coal consumption and bogus factoids surrounding it are often used to justify all sorts of ignorant nonsense regarding GHG, grid modernization, economic competition etc.

      The real story is that China, not the US has driven down the cost of solar to 1.11 $/kWh installed. Cheaper than all other forms of energy on earth, including imported coal. The only remaining barriers have nothing to do with the technical or economic costs of solar energy. Its all about waiting for the institutional inertia to catch up with the pace of change.

    20. Re:I don't think so. by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      That's just it - most people aren't aware that human activity - specifically the shift to agriculture - may have had enough of an impact even then to avert a mini-ice-age. When things are in flux and can go either way is when you'll see the butterfly effect.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    21. Re:I don't think so. by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Butterfly effect nothing - we've been the invasive species from hell, upending ecosystems wherever we go. Usually starting with exterminating all the megafauna.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    22. Re:I don't think so. by Xest · · Score: 1

      It's called having a low tolerance for bullshit, and so no, there's nothing wrong with you.

    23. Re:I don't think so. by Ralph+Wiggam · · Score: 1

      The only other logical starting point for this era would be the beginning of the industrial revolution. But that happened slowly over several decades, so it's a lot more difficult.

  6. Nice for linux/unix users. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This could delay the y2k unix equivalent fuck up scheduled for 2038 a couple thousand years, so we can focus on getting stable wireless/GPU drivers in the meantime. :D

  7. Broken Style by 31415926535897 · · Score: 5, Informative

    The Anthropocene Epoch ended when the Bad Slashdot Style Epoch began after the following style code was introduced:

    #comments { clear:both; display:block; position:relative; padding: 0; margin: 0 0 0 122px; padding-right: 1.5em;z-index:1;}

    Get rid of the 122px left margin--it's wasting a lot of space.

    1. Re:Broken Style by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No shit. Wish I had mod points.

    2. Re:Broken Style by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I assumed that was a bug!

    3. Re:Broken Style by bloodhawk · · Score: 2

      They are trying to move you to the broken look and feel of the beta pixel by pixel.

    4. Re:Broken Style by decipher_saint · · Score: 1

      Also it completely breaks formatting if you zoom in to 150% like I do

      --
      crazy dynamite monkey
    5. Re:Broken Style by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Hey, that margin is where I put my drink.

    6. Re:Broken Style by linebackn · · Score: 1

      If this is part of the crap they changed a couple days ago, it also messed up viewing in some other browsers. I wish they would just go back to simple HTML 3, which used to view fine in everything.

      They couldn't get rid of enough of us with that awful "beta", so instead now they are breaking it one bit at a time.

    7. Re:Broken Style by lister+king+of+smeg · · Score: 2

      The Anthropocene Epoch ended when the Bad Slashdot Style Epoch began after the following style code was introduced:

      #comments { clear:both; display:block; position:relative; padding: 0; margin: 0 0 0 122px; padding-right: 1.5em;z-index:1;}

      Get rid of the 122px left margin--it's wasting a lot of space.

      Thank you I thought it was one of my script blockers acting up.

      --
      ---Saying gnome 3 is better than windows 8 not so much a compliment as it is damning with light praise.
  8. Rubbish, and reversed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Informative

    Incandescently stupid attempt at cloaking the usual climate alarmism in a layer of pseudo-science. And the propagandists who bring us this nonsense have it exactly backward - nuclear power could be the key to minimizing man's negative impact on the environment, if blinkered greens would allow it.

    1. Re:Rubbish, and reversed by Ionized · · Score: 4, Informative

      the detonation of the atomic bomb is a perfectly reasonable way to mark the beginning of a new epoch, because there is a very real and easily identifiable geologic marker for that event (radioactive isotopes & plastic in the topsoil.) if millions of years from now aliens discovered our planet and looked through geological data, and wanted to classify periods based on that data, it's a safe bet that the sudden proliferation of radioactive isotopes and appearance of an entirely new substance (plastic) would be something that they noticed.

      as for the necessity of defining a new epoch - would you deny that humans have profoundly changed the planet? no value judgements being made here, just straight facts, the planet is WAY FUCKING DIFFERENT than it was 1000 years ago due to human population explosions and human construction. also, lots of newly-extinct species.

      but, i at least agree with you about nuclear power being the solution to a lot of our problems, if we would stop being such pussies about it. that has nothing to do with the topic at hand, though.

    2. Re: Rubbish, and reversed by Veritech_Ace · · Score: 1

      Nuclear power has nothing to do with the topic? The dawn of the nuclear age is the topic. Perhaps I am alone in seeing the irony in the story.

    3. Re: Rubbish, and reversed by Ionized · · Score: 1

      no, the dawn of the HUMAN age is the topic. the nuclear bomb just happens to be a nice easy geological marker for that.

      note that the epoch is called the anthropocene epoch. anthopo, meaning human.

      we aren't calling it the nuclear epoch.

    4. Re: Rubbish, and reversed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The airplane, Stainless steel, Penicillin, the photoelectric effect are all more indicative of the new dawn of man, and point to something much more revolutionary happening to humanoids rather than the latest novel way to kill each other since cain killed abel.
      Moreso, what will ultimately become more evident is transformation of ideologies into culture. For instance, the idea that all men are equal is not new. The idea that men should gather to be dedicated to the propostion that all men are created equal is a game changer. America may be just as brutal as Rome, but we elected Obama to prove a point. Even if it stings a little.
      I wanna see you be brave.

    5. Re: Rubbish, and reversed by Ionized · · Score: 1

      good luck finding a geological marker for any of those things you mention.

      the geological timescale cares very little for your opinions on culture or our ability to insert tab A into slot B enough times to create an airplane.

    6. Re:Rubbish, and reversed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If aliens came to our planet, it's probably because of radio signals

  9. Academic wankery at its finest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's going to matter in Civilizations 6, damnit. And that's pretty freakin' important.

  10. Industrial Revolution by Kenshin · · Score: 1

    If it's classified as "he period when human activities started having a significant impact on Earth", then wouldn't the industrial revolution mark the start of that?

    Or were coal-powered factories all over Europe belching horrible soot and smoke into the atmosphere not good enough?

    --

    Does it make you happy you're so strange?

    1. Re:Industrial Revolution by blue9steel · · Score: 2

      I'd mark it at the transition from when things were mostly muscle powered, and thus limited in total energy expenditure by food production, to when most things were powered by other fuel sources. Once that switch occurred our ability to radically reshape the environment leapt upwards by several orders of magnitude.

    2. Re:Industrial Revolution by ahodgson · · Score: 1

      Yeah I'd put it in the late 1700's.

      http://naturalpatriot.org/wp-c...

    3. Re:Industrial Revolution by Digicrat · · Score: 1

      The effects of the early years of the Industrial revolution (smog/pollution from early coal plants and unrestricted garbage furnaces) likely had a significantly larger and longer lasting impact on Earth than the first Nuclear detonation did.

      If anything, I'd think that the discovery of the light bulb / harnessing of electricity would be a better point to define the start of a new epoch. That corresponds nicely with the time the industrial revolution started having lasting impacts on the environment, and doubly sets (and lights) the stage for the rapid pace of technological evolution to follow.

      The only argument I can see for setting it to the first atomic bomb test is that perhaps those radiation markers are more obvious in the geologic record than rise in CO2 gases and pollutants are, but then again a difference of a century is largely irrelevant on the geologic time scale.

    4. Re: Industrial Revolution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Come on, oil coming from dead dinosaours and trees come from their food, right? Who cares that it was occluded by topsoil temporarily?

    5. Re:Industrial Revolution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'd go for 1775 when James Watt (Boulton and Watt) kicked off the industrial Revolution in Britain selling steam engines to replace pit ponies. As he sold his engines to replace ponies he gave them a power value in horse-power (continuous power of pit ponies) and he measured them to be roughly 745 watts (from his name).

  11. long story short: climate change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    get your shit in gear americans

    captcha: brothel

  12. Signed 64-bit time_t integers .. by lippydude · · Score: 1

    "Most operating systems designed to run on 64-bit hardware already use signed 64-bit time_t integers. Using a signed 64-bit value introduces a new wraparound date that is over twenty times greater than the estimated age of the universe: approximately 292 billion years from now, at 15:30:08 on Sunday, 4 December 292,277,026,596"

    1. Re: Signed 64-bit time_t integers .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't calculate time that much ahead because the Earth's rotation will have decelerated by that Sunday way in the future.

    2. Re: Signed 64-bit time_t integers .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't calculate time that much ahead because the Earth's rotation will have decelerated by that Sunday way in the future.

      Of course you can.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U...

      You should know what you are talking about. Definition of year according to POSIX is thus. Therefore it is just fine to calculate years even if Earth ain't there.

    3. Re: Signed 64-bit time_t integers .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Therefore it is just fine to calculate years even if Earth ain't there.

      Yeah, but without Earth being there, you're going to have a hard time finding a programmer from 292 billion years ago to fix all your legacy systems.

    4. Re:Signed 64-bit time_t integers .. by catmistake · · Score: 1

      "Most operating systems designed to run on 64-bit hardware already use signed 64-bit time_t integers. Using a signed 64-bit value introduces a new wraparound date that is over twenty times greater than the estimated age of the universe: approximately 292 billion years from now, at 15:30:08 on Sunday, 4 December 292,277,026,596"

      That's just great, right in the middle of the game. If this messes with the broadcast, they're gonna have some pissed off sports fans that day I can tell you.

    5. Re: Signed 64-bit time_t integers .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Clerun-Gowph would disagree with you. Just ask Kilgore Trout or read Venus on the Half Shell.

    6. Re:Signed 64-bit time_t integers .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's just great, right in the middle of the game. If this messes with the broadcast, they're gonna have some pissed off sports fans that day I can tell you.

      That's OK. I talked to a time traveler and he told me that at 15:30:08 on Sunday, 4 December 292,277,026,596 the Packers are beating the Bears by 31 points at halftime. Everybody tunes out, anyway.

    7. Re:Signed 64-bit time_t integers .. by rubycodez · · Score: 1

      you are funny, plenty of software in use such as mysql has some functions with 32 bit time integers while others use 64 bit. it is NOT a solved problem

  13. No coincidence by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    That is the same day the Gojira was awakened.

  14. Industrial Revolution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The nuclear blasts produce more obvious changes in the geological strata than the coal and other industrial changes do, so it's easier to trace. When looking at geological timeframes, the 200 years or so difference is a blink of an eye. It's not especially useful now while both periods are so recent, but it will become more useful as time goes on.

  15. Who got the steam achievement by Crashmarik · · Score: 1

    And did the turns speed up ?

  16. Epochs have existed less than 1000 years by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because before that, there weren't ideas nor words for them. :D Deal with it, human civilization. You so puny.

  17. 2015 A.D. is 70 A.E. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So 2015 A.D. works out to be 70 A.E. Well at least after the new new year's (16 July traditional months).

    70 years is often held as the Biblical "one generation" (some say 40 years, etc). Could be an "interesting" year this 2015...
    70 A.D. was the end of the old Judaism as the Temple was destroyed and they had to reinvent the religion ("tradition, tradition" .. see Fiddler on the Roof).

    1. Re:2015 A.D. is 70 A.E. by RDW · · Score: 1

      Philip K Dick was right after all - 'The Empire never ended'. King Felix!

  18. The epoch began by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    January 1, 1970.

  19. Question: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    26 scientists on the Anthropocene Working Group published this. There are 38 people listed as members. Why did nearly a third of them not put their names on this?

  20. Scientists Think the World Revolves Around Them by ichabod801 · · Score: 1

    Film at eleven.

  21. I'm good with it ... by CaptainDork · · Score: 1

    ... I know when the Cretaceous period ended because the dinosaurs (except birds) went extinct and stuff, but I don't know when the Cretaceous period started or the Anthropocene period, either, but Bennett Haselton.

    --
    It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
  22. Farming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    When we stopped hunting and gathering and stayed in one place. Not bending to the earth but bending the earth to our needs. That's the beginning of the Anthropocene.

    1. Re:Farming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I like this talk of bending over the earth. ;)

  23. 1879 by johnrpenner · · Score: 1

    should really begin in 1879 - the year edison first lit his lightbulb.

    2cents

  24. WW I & II by bigtreeman · · Score: 1

    I'd put it down to world wars I & II which caused a massive acceleration in development of all types including land and air transport, computers, electronics, nuclear.
    The nuclear bomb coincided with jet flight, the transistor was 2 years later.
    And much of this development started with the industrial revolution in the 1800s.
    It was also a time when women were prominent in industry and the war effort, suffraget late 1800s to women's liberation 1960s effectively doubled the working population and changed society.
    Nuclear is an event which wasn't causal but only a useful marker.
    It's just another fuck-up by the industrial age but I'd feel the petrochemical/plastics industry has had a much more pivotal and destructive effect than nuclear.

    --
    Go well
  25. Time to reset the calendar by mysidia · · Score: 2

    Today is January 16, 69 AE (Anthropocene Era)

    Someone born in 1946 CE will now be referred to as: Born in 1 AE

    Someone born in 1945 CE will now be referred to as "Born in 0 AE"; the year of the Anthropocene Epoch.

    1944 CE will now be referred to as "1 BAE"; 1 year before the Anthropocene Epoch, etc

    In this manner, every year renumbered.

    And of course, tomorrow will be 1/17/69.

    1. Re:Time to reset the calendar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually tomorrow will be 69-1-17. We decided to drop raterded units and notation formats at the start of the AE too. No, we did not ask the Americans.

    2. Re:Time to reset the calendar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually no
      since 1/1/0 doesmt correspond to jan 1 1945, but july 17,1945.

  26. A million years ago +/- 500 years will be noise by davidwr · · Score: 1

    In a million years, the start of the industrial age and the start of the nuclear age will be a geological blur.

    Besides, if we have to put a date on it, 1970-01-01T00:00:00Z is about as good a time as any other time in the 19th/20th/21st centuries.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
    1. Re:A million years ago +/- 500 years will be noise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you a time traveler? Interesting use of tenses.

    2. Re:A million years ago +/- 500 years will be noise by khallow · · Score: 1

      Keep in mind that the point here is to find geological markers. You won't be digging up a running Beowulf cluster.

  27. Steel, E = mc^2" by David Bodanis, and Space... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I have the book "E = mc^2", by David Bodanis.

    In the notes accompanying the text there is (on Page 295 of the paperback) a note regarding a phrase on Page 191 of the main text), regarding steel production, Scapa Flow, and radiation monitors on stellar and interstellar instruments:

    In 1919 the Imperial German battlefleet surrendered to the British, and eventually the entire fleet was scuttled in the relatively shallow waters of Scapa Flow, Scotland. There's a lot of pre-WW2 iron in that watery graveyard.

    Steel-making requires a *lot* of air, and ever since the first atmospheric nuclear explosion, the air has been tainted with some of the radiation from these explosions... so it's uneconomical to make steel without these impurities.

    If, however, you want an ultra-precise radiation monitoring instrument on the moon, or elsewhere, then the Scapa Flow iron hulks have proved immensely valuable in providing pre-atomic-age steel.

    So, Scapa Flow steel is on the moon, on Pioneer, on Galileo, and in other places where non-irradiated steel is vital.

    This is a one example where the first atmospheric nuclear test irrevocably changed the nature of human capabilities. This is a good case that supports the contention of the authors that the first nuclear explosion was a epoch-marking event.

    Bodanis references Dan van der Hat, in "The Grand Scuttle: The Sinking of the German Fleet at Scapa Flow in 1919" (London: Hodder and Stoughton, 1982).

    1. Re:Steel, E = mc^2" by David Bodanis, and Space... by rubycodez · · Score: 3, Informative

      nice try but coal from the industrial age also threw heavy radioisotopes into the air, starting centuries ago

    2. Re:Steel, E = mc^2" by David Bodanis, and Space... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      These isotopes are the same as natural isotopes and aren't present in detectably greater concentrations in sediments before or after coal started to be used. In terms of radioactivity, coal isn't notably worse than crushing up other types of rocks and spewing that radioactive dust into the atmosphere. What does show up during the early stages of industrialization are increased concentrations of (non-radioactive) metals, but those are usually due to metal smelting operations rather than merely burning coal. Lead is a particularly distinctive one.

      The output from coal burning is pretty innocuous and hard to distinguish from background compared to picking up artificial isotopes that haven't been on Earth in billions of years until we started making them. This is not a relative assessment of the importance of coal burning or artificial radioactive isotopes into the atmosphere. It's only pointing out that their detectability is profoundly different.

    3. Re:Steel, E = mc^2" by David Bodanis, and Space... by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      In terms of radioactivity, coal isn't notably worse than crushing up other types of rocks and spewing that radioactive dust into the atmosphere.

      Okay, but we're not doing that. So uh, coal isn't notably worse than something we're not doing? I'll keep that in mind.

      The output from coal burning is pretty innocuous

      Tee hee

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    4. Re:Steel, E = mc^2" by David Bodanis, and Space... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ack, why must I find your ignorant contributions everywhere. in that sense, you're a wonderful flag for the confirming the mediocre and less than advertised intelligence of moderating readers. You know just enough to add a incorrect one-liner on an inconceivable number of topics. Thankfully (or cursedly) I know just enough to spot the delusional thinking of a demented old man.

    5. Re:Steel, E = mc^2" by David Bodanis, and Space... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      what erks me most is the absence of humility, sadly usually also a marker of the phony intellectual.

    6. Re:Steel, E = mc^2" by David Bodanis, and Space... by rubycodez · · Score: 1

      So you obsessively follow my comments like some facebook addicted emo teen of a pop star? Get help now. Also, read up on coal emissions vs. nuclear power industry.

  28. I thought we already agreed that we... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...are living in the Age of Aquarius. lolol :)

  29. Answer: by thesupraman · · Score: 0

    Because it is a load of PC navel gazing pseudo-religious bullshit?

    Just a guess, but hey.

    Could it be any clearer that this is a bunch of 'oh my god the sky is falling!' anti nuclear scaremongers desperately
    trying to create a shred of link between unclear power (by FAR the least damaging base load power producer EVER)
    and some idea of 'mankinds rape of our our beloved earth mother'?

    Other than that particularly transparent attempt at politicalisation, the particular date seems basically stupid, it certainly
    marks no major change in behaviour, society structure, technical capability (hint, use of radioactives, or even fission
    didnt start then..)... Hell, the invention of the first computer could be considered far more important, or international public
    networks, or about 10 dozen other developments that have global impact.

    And if they want an accurate date marker, ffs, astronomy is well known as THE method, not BS approximate soil sampling.

    Or are they childish enough to think that with modern land development approaches (burying waste, earthworks for construction, etc)
    that soil strata are work a shit for any future research?

    Hmmm..

  30. enjoy your meal! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    40 years of electricity.
    10'000 years of mutagens.
    if your (nuclear-electrical) dinner lasts ~30 min then you would have to prepare it for .. uhm .. say 125 hours or 5.2 days?
    -or-
    one nuke-plant electricty lasts 2/3 of one generation (assume 60 years in one generation) and your great-great-great-great ... whatever 166th great grandchildren will thank you for the mess they see in the mirror : )
    you do the math.

  31. rise of woman vs fall of man by epine · · Score: 1

    Tying the antropocene epoch to the first nuclear detonation is a brazen attempt to smuggle the Garden of Eden / fall of man metaphor into this discussion under cover of a blinding fireball.

    How about using Madame Curie instead, and picking a nice round date like 1900?

    In 1900 Curie became the first woman faculty member at the Ecole Normale Superieure [/.sic] ...

    I also noted this passage in the Wikipedia article.

    Despite Curie's fame as a scientist working for France, the public's attitude tended toward xenophobia—the same that had led to the Dreyfus affair—which also fuelled false speculation that Curie was Jewish. During the French Academy of Sciences elections, she was vilified by the right wing press who criticised her for being a foreigner and an atheist. Her daughter later remarked on the public hypocrisy as the French press often portrayed Curie as an unworthy foreigner when she was nominated for a French honour, but would portray her as a French hero when she received a foreign one such as her Nobel Prizes.

    In 1911 it was revealed that in 1910–11 Curie had conducted an affair of about a year's duration with physicist Paul Langevin, a former student of Pierre's—a married man who was estranged from his wife. This resulted in a press scandal that was exploited by her academic opponents. Curie (then in her mid-40s) was five years older than Langevin and was misrepresented in the tabloids as a foreign Jewish home-wrecker.

    Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose. [/.sic]

    1. Re:rise of woman vs fall of man by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think you understand the meaning of 'man' in these expressions.

  32. Ultron by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Meh