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Microsoft Announces Windows For Raspberry Pi 2
jones_supa writes Microsoft is expanding their Windows Developer Program for Internet of Things by delivering a version of Windows 10 that runs on the Raspberry Pi 2. This release of Windows 10 will be free for the maker community through the Windows Developer Program for IoT. With an official partnership with the Raspberry Pi Foundation, Microsoft is bringing development tools, services and ecosystem to the Raspberry Pi community. More details will be shared in the coming months. You can already join the program and be amongst the first to receive product information and beta software releases.
...it's still two months to April Fool's day...
What you hear in the ear, preach from the rooftop Matthew 10.27b
I've been running internet-connected Windows desktop for 20 years, and have never gotten a virus. Surf smart, lock your door, and don't click on the damn .scr files.
They say it's free to the maker community, but what if you want to turn your creation into a commercial product? Especially for IoT devices it makes little sense to use an OS not known for its reliability, and encumbered by a non-free license. I see no reason not to use proven and free Linux instead.
If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
How can Microsoft justify Windows 10 on a less powerful device like Raspberry Pi 2 and not support on the Surface RT?
Seems pretty stupid to me to purposely screw over the people that bought the RT models that are perfectly capable.
"A plan fiendishly clever in its intricacies"- Homer Simpson
Just as soon as everyone recompiles there virus code to run on ARM....
Actually Windows 10 does not suck. While I prefer Linux and OS/X but Windows is not as terrible as it once was. Now Windows Users.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
The r-pi has an accelerated desktop now, thank goodness. It was all software on a dumb frame buffer at launch, but those days are far behind us.
Who knows, maybe Wayland support will come soon, we can hope.
a href="http://www.raspberrypi.org/preview-the-upcoming-maynard-desktop/">http://www.raspberrypi.org/preview-the-upcoming-maynard-desktop/
How stupid is this?
How stupid? Not at all. The Raspberry Pi is introducing people to Linux incidentally. People who have become accustomed to Linux on Pi are more likely to use it on their main PCs. Microsoft knows that Windows on Pi -- even if its performance is abysmal -- could quickly become the newbies' first choice thanks only to familiarity. The "gateway drug" for Linux defectors is thus protected against. (They did this with netbooks too, remember?)
For the RPi Foundation it makes a lot of sense, as Linux advocacy was never their goal -- they want to get more computing into schools, and one of the chief objections to the RPi is the fact that it doesn't run "industry-standard software"... i.e. Windows. Of course, once schools start realising that the version of Windows can't do everything they expect, they'll conclude that the Raspberry Pi isn't a real computer and stop using it. (They did this with netbooks too, remember?)
Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
So you build you IoT based around Windows...just how long do you think it'll stay free?
So you build your next home gadget around Windows...and it's an amazing success...and now you decide to Kickstart it...and Windows is only free to you as a developer...so just how much extra are you going to have to charge to have Windows on the final version?
Malware on IoT...um...not good. I'll leave it to your imagination.
*HOW MUCH* RAM and flash memory space does this behemoth take?
Nah..."Just Say No".
-- Steve
I see a lot of negative comments so far (actually they are all negative). You have a good reason to not want Windows on a Pi? Then don't put Windows on a Pi and you can live in peace and happiness. Personally, I think this is very cool, and although Microsoft may have some hidden agenda to take over the world by releasing a version of Windows 10 for the Pi, I still think this is a positive thing in general. It also further legitimizes the non- X86 / PC / tablet / cellphone niche kind of single board general purpose computer, that obviously a lot of non-mainstream users are very interested in.
Better known as 318230.
Everyone is part of the maker community. They are saying 1 in 5 developers are working on an IoT project and the definition of developer has become so loose that you are probably already a developer. If you aren't comfortable with calling yourself a developer, call yourself an engineer. Anyone can be an engineer too. If you are unsure if you quality, see if any of the following apply to you.
If you answered yes to these questions you are probably already eligible to be part of the illustrious maker community and may well be eligible to be part of whatever the next Web 3.5 community that comes up. The folks at Microsoft look forward to satisfying your development needs, which will likely involve using your Raspberry Pi 2 as a companion in a drawer to your PS/2 to USB adapter, VGA cables, two button laser mice that may or may not work, and other remnants of IT past.
Low power it may be, but with the newer quad core Acorn Risc Machine v7 processor @ 900MHz and a Micro SD Card with a Class 10 speed 128 Gb capacity, it's just like working a normal, but slow, tower PC with a proper keyboard and a proper mouse. As it is designed to teach British school children to write computer software, it will automatically sell Millions of units in it's home market. Just have one micro SD card per operating system!
The purpose of existence is to make money.
Loads of schools have bought and are buying iPads without much of an idea of what they're going to use them for, let alone a coherent educational plan. The end result? Expensive, distracting toys that have little, if any, demonstrable effects on learning outcomes in K-12 education. Then there's stories like this: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01... Developmental psychologists are less than enamoured of shiny, techy internet gadgets in classrooms and children's pockets.
Kind of. I taught at a school that issued MacBooks for lab sections (the loans began and ended with the lab period).
The MacBooks in question were running Windows.
The parent poster had already made the point I was going to make, by the way, that Windows, by and large is a "safer" choice for many, many people.
Some people don't believe in fairies. I don't believe in The Patriarchy.
The netbook thing was an "Embrace, extend extinguish" kind of deal. It ruined the market.
I would not like them
here or there.
I would not like them anywhere.
I do not like
Windows and Pi.
I do not like them, Sam-I-am.
So will Windows 10 have APIs for stuff such as GPIOs, SPI and I2C, along with pin muxing?
Will everything be possible without having to connect a monitor, keyboard and mouse?
People are getting all excited about this, but they are forgetting that this is *not* going to be a full featured Windows able to run their Office and what not. First of all, it is an ARM architecture, so regular Windows apps won't work unless they have an ARM version (extremely rare). The OS is most likely going to be the cut-down WindowsRT and running on an underpowered hardware - the new Raspberry Pi 2 is still much slower and has less RAM than even the first Microsoft Surface RT, which wasn't exactly known to be a speed demon ...
Microsoft is pushing this as "Internet-of-Things" platform, but I honestly don't see how WindowsRT presents any advantages there over a dedicated OS without the unneeded GUI bloat. And for education? Yes, there will be perhaps Office RT and few Microsoft's apps available, but that's all. What are the kids going to run on this? Visual Studio?
If open was their goal, why did they go with components which require closed source drivers and firmware?
From what I can see, Raspberry Pi's goal was to be this generations BBC Micro, nothing else. Something that is cheap to hack on - Linux was free from a license cost perspective, so that's what got used. The non-open components were cheap from a cost perspective, so thats what got used.
Sure, open is the policy. That must be why they used proprietory hardware mpeg decoding for which you need to buy a separate license.
iPads are just tools. They aren't magic. I've seen some interesting and innovative uses of iPads in education, particularly with kids with special needs. First though you have to have people who know how to use these tools and implement them into an overall educational program. Buying a bunch of anything without a plan makes no sense. This is what's special about the Rpi. They are primarily into teaching and building a community around this educational system. The maker aspect of the Rpi is just a big plus that helps build the community.
It is. It's interesting watching Microsoft thrash around and try to cope with things like this. The Raspberry Pi is the exact antithesis of what Microsoft stands for. Right now Windows Embedded 7 licenses are selling for right around $100 a pop. This entire system costs $35. The margins (if anyone were to try to make an industrial device out of this thing) aren't anywhere near what could make it worth their while, and all because that word "embedded" means something new now.
And yet, they have to try. This gizmo is seriously widening the Linux base, and they gotta do something. You know they're panicked. "You can already join the program and be amongst the first to receive product information and beta software releases." They don't even have a beta available yet, and they're already trying to get market share.
And just imagine how good those tools are going to be when you do get them. They'll be done in a huge hurry because this is a market driven decision. They know they have to get *something* out there super quick because they're losing market share. And the worst part is that they are trying to appeal to the engineer/programmer audience, and we're a pretty discerning audience. It has to be fast because this thing is launching, but it also has to be good because of the audience they are trying to target. And Microsoft is pretty notorious for releasing software when it isn't ready (Vista for example) simply to meet a release date. My guess is that these betas are going to be absolute crap released to make some bean counter's Gantt chart happy, and they'll fall back on the "but it's in beta" excuse when they crash and burn. Microsoft loves having the community do it's QA for them. It'll be a bumpy ride.
And I can't wait to see what bizarre arrangement they try to do when they try to monetize this Windows 10 release for a $35 computer. Because they will. The EULA for this thing is going to be a dadaist work of art.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
Why is this modded 'Funny?' This is still good advice.
The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
I suspect "free for the maker community" translates as "free for personal use but if you use this in a product you are going to have to pay". How much you have to pay will probablly depend on the details of the product.
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
(Due to slashdot's insistence that I not post short, proper poetic lines, I have been forced to jam all the response lines together into paragraphs. This is not by choice. Dice, in it's infinite wisdom, The bringers of Beta, The mobile site, and countless horrible advertisements that play even with the no advertising checkbox filled in-- has decreed that such must be done. If the literazis here have a problem, please address all complaints to Dice Holdings Inc.)
(No chairs were harmed in the making of this production)
I am new, it's not a lie!
I am Microsoft's new CEO guy!
-That CEO guy, that CEO guy, I do not like that CEO guy!
Do you like windows on the Raspberry Pi?
-I do not like it, CEO guy, I do not like windows on my Raspberry Pi!
Would you like it here, or there?
-I would not like it here OR there-- I would not like it anywhere! I do not want windows on my Raspberry Pi, I do not like it, CEO guy!
Would you use it in your house? Would you use it with a mouse?
-I would not use it in my house, I would not use it with a mouse. I would not use it here nor there, I would not use it anywhere! I do not want windows on my raspberry pi, I do not like it, CEO guy!
Would you use it on your box? Would you use it with FireFox?
-Not on my box, Not with the 'Fox! Not in my house, Nor with a mouse! I would not use it here nor there, I would not use it anywhere! I do not want windows on my raspberry pi, I do not like it, CEO guy!
Would you, could you, In your car? Check your Outlook near or far!
-I would not, COULD NOT in a car!
You might like it, you will see! This is totally not like Windows RT!
-I abhore WindowsRT, Not in a car, Now let me be! I do not want it on my box, I do not want it with FireFox! I do not want it in my house, I will not use it with my mouse! I do not want it here nor there, I do not want it anywhere! I do not want windows on my Raspberry Pi
-I do not like it, CEO guy!
A train! A train! A Train! A Train! Would you could you-- On a train!?
-Not on a train, Not Like WinRT, Not in a car-- CEO, Let me be! I would not, COULD not, on my box! I would not, COULD not, with firefox! I would not use it with a mouse, I would not use it in my house! I would not use it here or there, I would not use it ANYWHERE! I do not like windows on my raspberry pi, I do not like it, Windows CEO GUY!
Say, In the dark? Would you could you-- in the dark?
-I would not, COULD NOT in the dark!
Would you, could you in the rain?
-I would not could not in the rain, Not in the dark, Not on a train. Not in my car, Not like WinRT, I do not like it-- CEO you see! Not in my house, Not on my box! Not with a mouse, not with the 'Fox! I would not use it here nor there, I would not use it anywhere!
You do not want windows on the raspberry pi!?
-I do not want it, Microsoft CEO guy!
Would you could you-- On a boat?
I would not, COULD NOT on a boat!
Woould you could you-- With a GOAT?
(dramatic pause, and fishy look)
-I would not, could not on a boat; I WILL NOT, WILL NOT WITH A GOAT!(Seriously, slander Microsoft? Really!?) I will not use it in the rain, I will not use it on a train! Not in the dark, not like WinRT, Not in a car--- You! YOU LET ME BE! I do not like it on my box, I do not like it with the 'Fox! I do not want it in my house, I will not use it with my mouse! I will not use it here or there-- I will not use it ANYWHERE! I do not want windows on my Raspberry Pi, I do not want it, Microsoft CEO GUY!
Try it! Try it and you may! Try it and you may I say!
-CEO, If you let me be, I will try it-- You wil see!
- Ughn,, This is terrible! I think I will cry! This is why I dont want windows on my Raspberry Pi! It would be horrible on a boat It would more terrible with a goat! It would short circuit in the rain I not use it in the dark or on a train, Nor in the car, even if its not WinRT! It is so BAD, SO BAD you see!
-I would not use it on my box, I would not use it with the 'Fox. I would not use it in my house, and I would not touch it with my mouse! I will not use it here or there! I would not use it anywhere! I do so Hate windows on my Raspberry Pi!
-Screw you, Screw you, CEO guy!
Remember WinCE? Microsoft's embedded products are not the same as their desktop products. And, no, WinIoT on a Pi will not run the same executables, it is an ARM platform which Microsoft just emphatically orphaned with their last go around. Remember the surface RT? That did not run any standard Windows executables, at the very least the executable would have to be compiled against the ARM build chain, and that isn't an option for end users of proprietary software.
Thinking about this I understand the point a couple (at least one) person has made that MS getting involved will help mainstream the non-x86 low power stuff, or at least the ARM branch, but then I remembered what happened to the exploding world of netbooks when companies started growing them to run Windows.
The netbook market disappeared, seemingly over night, and now we are left with ultrabooks, or whatever they are calling the MacBook Air class of machines now. Sure they are light and small, but they are a whole lot more than the $100 price point netbooks were approaching.
On the Pi there is a lot of similarity to the Android stuff, we have Java as an app platform. Is this new Pi really powerful enough to mix Java and ARM.net at the same time? Just the overhead of a Java VM plus a .net framework resident at the same time sounds a little bit much for any current ARM SoC with just a gig of RAM
Now if you are targeting actual IoT devices, just developing on the Pi, sure a single purpose embedded device will probably run on a Windows stack just as well as it will on Linux. I am a little concerned about MS attempting to be responsive to exploits, but then I think we will find that most people never update their thermostat or refrigerator regardless of what OS it runs, so I think the exploitability will probably be a wash.
I am more concerned that some inexperienced whiz kid, whether he be of the .net or Java persuasion, will manage to make an actually universally useful device, but not know enough about the actual requirements of embedded programming so it just works well enough for everyone to buy one, then all the non-techy people who buy it get their home netork pwned or it crashes in an untested but relatively common use case and has significant socio-economic impact on our tech dependent society.
So all in all I really don't think MS jumping into the fray is a bad thing. I don't plan on running it on anything I build, but think about it, according to the rumors Apple thought hard about buying Nest. Would you want your house controlled by software coming from 1 Infinite Loop?
Are you actually confident about running it on software coming out of the Googleplex?
The truth is everybody that doesn't read /. is gonna buy these connected devices just like they do blenders and dishwashers, and if they act up they will return them to Walmart or Home Depot or Best Buy and get their money back just like they do now with toasters, TVs, and computers.
Do you care who wrote the code embedded in that 386 running your microwave? Do you even know if it is a 386 running your microwave? Me either. I do know that at least at one point the embedded 386 family was often used for things like that, but I never bothered looking.
OK, I am down meandering and ranting.
"Proximity to wonder has blunted our perception and appreciation of it" --Tim Hartnell in 'Exploring ARTIFICIAL INTELLI
The decline in price of full laptops, combined with the increasing price of netbooks (more powerful hardware because windows needed it)...
http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
They were cheap, underpowered with low resolution screens and poor quality trackpads making them a race to the bottom competing only on price. They were only useful for the sorts of things that are easier on a tablet, everything else is better on an ultrabook which is why the market has expelled them.
I liked writing blog posts and student worksheets on the train. I wanted to code lightweight programs in Python and Javascript. I didn't need a heavy, full-sized laptop for that, but I certainly needed a keyboard. It happily played back the audio and video files I needed in class, and connected perfectly happily to any standard projector. That the market for netbooks is smaller than the market for tablets, I understand; however, the niche I was in was well-served by the eeePC, and in trying to embrace and extend customer appeal, they extinguished the netbook. That said, a reflashed Chromebook is an acceptable alternative.
Citation? Windows has been reducing its hunger for system resources
Windows has been reducing its hunger for system resources recently. Five years ago, when netbooks were the "next big thing", Windows XP's life was extended because they couldn't get Windows 7 squeezed into the specs of the netbooks at the time. Microsoft is shrinking the Windows footprint now because of the convergence of mobile and desktop, but that wasn't on the cards back then.
Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'