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French Version of 'Patriot Act' Becomes Law
Taco Cowboy writes: Thanks to the Charlie Hebdo massacre and other instances of terrorism, the French legislature has voted 438 to 86 in favor of the "Intelligence Service Bill," essentially a French version of the Patriot Act. It awards the French intelligence services sweeping powers to tap and intercept any kind of digital correspondence, including phone conversations, emails, and social media.
The bill decrees that hosting providers and Internet service providers in France must be equipped with a "black box" that can retain all digital communications from customers. "The new law would create a 13-member National Commission to Control Intelligence Techniques, which would be made up of six magistrates from the Council of State and the Court of Appeals, three representatives of the National Assembly, three senators from the upper house of Parliament and a technical expert. ... The only judicial oversight is a provision that allows the commission to lodge a complaint with the Council of State, but lawyers are doubtful that it could be convened on a routine basis." We previously discussed news that ISPs may leave France in protest if the bill was passed. Now we'll know shortly if those ISPs will live up to their word.
The bill decrees that hosting providers and Internet service providers in France must be equipped with a "black box" that can retain all digital communications from customers. "The new law would create a 13-member National Commission to Control Intelligence Techniques, which would be made up of six magistrates from the Council of State and the Court of Appeals, three representatives of the National Assembly, three senators from the upper house of Parliament and a technical expert. ... The only judicial oversight is a provision that allows the commission to lodge a complaint with the Council of State, but lawyers are doubtful that it could be convened on a routine basis." We previously discussed news that ISPs may leave France in protest if the bill was passed. Now we'll know shortly if those ISPs will live up to their word.
Now it seems France will learn the hard way as well that giving up freedom never buys you safety.
A bullet may have your name on it but splash damage is addressed "To whom it may concern."
Encrypt everything!
Only the National Assembly has voted; the bill must also pass the Senate. That said, given the multipartite consensus on it, there's not much chance that the Senate won't pass it.
You never know, though: given that the Senate is often deemed useless (in France, the Assembly has priority), sometimes it attempts to actually work on the bills, debate in more depth.
Also, the bill has been submitted to the Constitutional Council (which is unusual, before it's voted on). They too can veto it. We'll see.
So.. what you are saying is that having near constant surveillance on anyone the US government wants, internally and externally, has not worked out well for them (them of course being the state..)?
Or are you suggesting that the French government would not love to copy this political power grab to be able to monitor who/what/when they like for pretty much any reason?
I would suggest that these capabilities have worked out VERY well for the powers that be - there have been a few hiccups along the way, when the damn unwashed masses heard about it, and they actually had to get around to passing legislation to make it all look a touch more legitimate, however that is a small price to pay for absolute political power!
After all, what world leader would not want to be able to retroactively dig up huge masses of 'private' information on threats (to their political power of course..) when and if they need them! It revolutionises the process of both local and international negotiations! Think how easy it becomes to squash people who dont tow the line!
After all, they need all this power, as they obviously have only our best interests at heart.
Think of the children!
Thinking about all those people that fought in the world wars for our freedom. I wonder if they would have fought if they knew their children would piss every freedom they fought for away in a generation.
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." - John F. Kennedy
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
It has not become law and will not for a while. The current text has passed the lower chamber (Assemblée Nationale). Now it will have to go through the upper chamber (Sénat), which will modify it. After a group of 10 representatives and 10 senators will meet to try to find a common ground. After the lower chamber will vote again. Then there will be challenges to the Conseil Constitutionnel (including by people who have voted the law) to strike down some provisions of the law (and it is so outrageously excessive that there is a very good chance that little meaningful will survive). Then the décret d'application needs to be published, detailing how things will be implemented in practice. This can be challenged too. Then if all fails, France will be quickly sued to the European Court of Human Rights, and will be condemned (at least with the law in its current form, it is hard to see how it could escape a scathing loss given precedents by the court).
In the meantime I will switch my parent to Tor. They are the least dangerous people in the world, there is no reason to gather any data on them.
First they create the problem, then they generate the reaction, they they offer the ready made 'solution'
Perfect use of Hegelian Principle...
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
... everyone suffers
That's the price all of us have to pay when we, the majority, cannot and/or dare not to, control the action of the few
No matter if it's USA or France of Belgium or the Netherlands or Germany, as long as our society can not (and/or dare not to) confront those Islamists and get them to ditch their barbaric behavior, all of us will suffer
You guys saw what happened in Garland Texas just days before
You guys saw the length the government of Germany has to go --- including canceling at least two public events --- just to prevent the events becoming a bloodbath by the hands of the Islamists
And that's not all ... the Madrid train station bombing, the Boston Marathon bombing, the London Tube bombing, what happened to the World Trade Center of New York City, and so on ...
As long as we, the majority refuse to, or are too afraid of confronting them Islamists straight on, TPTB will formulate stuffs like the Patriot Act, NSA, and whatnots, in the name of 'tackling Islamic Terrorism', and at the end of the day, it is US, the non-Islamists, lost the most
If them Islamists want to live in the West, they better behave like the Western people do
I am not born in the States, I am from China. But as long as I am staying in the United States of America, I respect the society, the people, and the culture of America --- even though I may not see eye-to-eye with everything that they do
If the Islamists insist on behaving like animals they can go back to where they came from --- they get to do whatever they like in the wide sand fields of Saudi Arabia, I don't care
I am sick and tired of them Islamists --- they create trouble EVERYWHERE
Not only in the United States, Europe, they also make troubles in Australia, in Russia, in Thailand, in Kenya, in China, in Nigeria, and so on, and so forth
The world at large has been very tolerant with them, but there is a limit to everything
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Despite of the Charlie Hebdo massacre, the French legislature has voted 438 to 86 in favor of the "Intelligence Service Bill"
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When George Bush said that the terrorists "hate us for our freedom" I had not been expecting that he'd suggest we try giving up our freedoms and see if we're any safer. But I'm not surprised now that the same has happened in France.
Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
That tired old appeal to "what they fought for"
You know, perhaps you and people like you who spout this drivel should go to a quiet room and consider the difference between mass genocide of jews, gypsies, gays and eastern europeans by the nazis (yes, hello Godwin) plus the indescriminate bombing of civilian populations in Britain and elsewhere, and the recording of your phone conversations and emails on a little black box. Which if you work in any large company is already done anyway and has been for decades.
GTFU!
I would not worry much until the conseil constitutionnel has a look. IIRC the council CAN also look *before* the law get into action, after it was voted as raised by various political organs. So it could very well be that the law will be rejected by the constitutional council if raised by some institution (IIRC, only 60 parliament vote are necessary to check constitutionality, less than was in rejection of the law - 86). Otherwise the process is the same afterward , it go to a higher court in case of judgement, and can be set before the council by a high court for example. Anyway I find it an utter shame as described and would break fundamental right, so obviously against constitution (privacy/freedom right among them). My guess is that the law is NOT as described on slashdot as it often happen.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
I seriously need to start contributing to Tor.
Now if Dice would stop completely blocking out most Tor exits, that'd be really nice.
You just start using tradecraft. Almost certainly, the terrorists already are. Encryption *already* makes you stand out as a weirdo, precisely because it's uncommon.
As a USAian, I am crying for 65 million people of France for what has just been done to them by those solemnly charged with protecting and serving those people's interest. I know what it's like.
Leaving aside all the political questions, I doubt blackboxes are _technically_ possible. The summary said "communications from customers", so that means upstream traffic. With cloud sync data (especially of photos/vids), that's _a_lot_ of data:
Say uplink is 10 MB/d per user. Over 40M users that is a manageable 400 TB/d, but these laws typically have retention periods, 6 mo being the shortest. That takes 73,000 TB which even over a few dozen ISP sites is a major undertaking. Metadata is ~1% so might work. Download is 50+times so would not.
(Just for information.)
So they are just following the US's then?
Time to offend someone
Reactionary was the word we used to describe this sort of behavior.
A man doesn't need anything but his hands, feet, eyes, and a gun to kill blasphemers. Surveillance is irrelevant. They're making the same damned mistake we did, confusing power and the all-seeing eye with safety. They'll use this to round up Muslims, same as the US does. Innocence or guilt is irrelevant. They'll go into holes for life or get blown up real good.
The questions remains: who will protect us from the people spying on us? The people behind the spy eyes will change over time. The may even become the people who want to shoot you for blasphemy. Ever think of that? In Saudi Arabia, the all-seeing eye will be on the lookout for women driving cars. In North Korea, they'll be looking out for anyone they damned well want to kill. In South America, for anyone challenging the wealthy's control. In America, straight up they're looking for anyone who dares challenge corporate power - no more draconian surveillance was used here than when Occupy managed to gain some attention. The US managed an unprecedented surveillance and pre-crime arrest sweep during Occupy, showing what secret surveillance was really good for: control of the status quo,.
Oh well, freedom was nice while it lasted.
...Terrorist attack that highlights issues of freedom vs. tyranny, leads to legislation that highlights issues of freedom vs. tyranny. Cue Alanis Morissette...
Downmodding is the refuge of the weak. Don't downmod, make a better argument!
Here's the one word rebuttal: Circumcision
HAND.
This is what the attackers want. They want to erode the freedoms of Western secular societies. The Charlie Hebdo attackers have won.
"this is how liberty dies with thunderous applause", Episode III
with https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
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