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Keurig Stock Drops, Says It Was Wrong About DRM Coffee Pods

Posted by samzenpus on from the worst-laid-plans dept.

An anonymous reader writes: Green Mountain (Keurig) stock dropped by 10% this morning after a brutal earnings report. The reason? CNN Money reports that DRM has weakened sales of their Keurig 2.0. CEO Brian Kelley admits, "Quite honestly, we were wrong." Last year Green Mountain decided to make their new coffee machines work with licensed pods only. The company says they now plan to license more outside brands, and bring back “My K-Cup” reusable filters.

27 of 369 comments (clear)

  1. Yep, they were... by FlyHelicopters · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I have been a loyal user of K-Cups for years now...

    I will never buy a DRM coffee machine...

    The whole idea is just stupid. I get that they are trying to make money from every cup sold, just like the razor model, but frankly that is a boardroom fantasy...

    ---

    The same issue with music happened... once Amazon started selling DRM free music, I started buying, now having a collection of hundreds of "CDs" all downloaded to all my devices.

    I don't pirate any of them, nor do I share them outside my family. Sell me a product I control at a reasonable price and I'll pay you money.

    Simple.

    1. Re:Yep, they were... by NoKaOi · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The whole idea is just stupid. I get that they are trying to make money from every cup sold, just like the razor model, but frankly that is a boardroom fantasy...

      Exactly why I didn't buy one of these machines. I thought they were totally a-holes for making this move, but I gotta hand it to them, it's a rare thing for a business to admit that they were wrong. Good on them!

    2. Re:Yep, they were... by PsychoSlashDot · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I will never buy a DRM coffee machine...

      Unless you're a prostitute, don't fuck your customer.

      You can get away with DRM on DVDs because consumers don't understand the tech. The phallus is invisible.

      You can't get away with DRM on a plastic cup with coffee grounds in it. The consumers UNDERSTAND that product, and KNOW you're fucking them. The phallus is very much visible.

      --
      "Oh no... he found the .sig setting."
    3. Re:Yep, they were... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Except it's not really a good lesson to the marketplace if all is forgiven.... "Try DRM, if it works, great. If not, your former customers will forgive you and all's good."

      They should not be congratulated for recognizing how stupid they are. Let's congratulate and support the coffee maker companies who DIDN'T try this.

      We need to engender fear in the heart of every executive who would even CONSIDER this insanity. So I say fuck them-- let their company suffer from their idiocy and let others learn from their failure.

      If this news makes you want to reconsider a keurig machine, re-reconsider. There are plenty of other great alternatives. And that goes for printer makers and anyone else who's thinking about going in this direction.

    4. Re:Yep, they were... by Wycliffe · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The whole idea is just stupid. I get that they are trying to make money from every cup sold, just like the razor model, but frankly that is a boardroom fantasy...

      With the exception of the DRM part, the rest of the 2.0 idea was somewhat sound. The idea that you could have a barcode which adjusted the brew temp, etc... depending on what was in the cup and have a larger cup so you could include creamer, etc.. If they would have just did that and made a better product and completely left off the DRM part then they might have actually had a sellable product and they could have even gotten the advantage of being able to hold off generics longer with renewed patents. By adding the DRM all they did was make sure that 2.0 was a complete flop.

    5. Re:Yep, they were... by NoKaOi · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Oh hell, I just noticed this in the article: Keurig plans to bring back the My K-cup accessory to allow customers to brew other brands of coffee. Okay, but what about "unofficial" k-cups? I like to use k-cups that don't have the DRM, and I rarely use my own coffee grounds in the My K-cup accessory. Noticeably absent is them saying you can use non-DRM k-cups. Then again, reporters are idiots so they may not have bothered learning the difference between the My k-cup which allows you to use grounds vs non-DRM k-cups. But if they still don't accept non-DRM k-cups, then fuck 'em!

    6. Re:Yep, they were... by EmeraldBot · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Except it's not really a good lesson to the marketplace if all is forgiven.... "Try DRM, if it works, great. If not, your former customers will forgive you and all's good."

      They should not be congratulated for recognizing how stupid they are. Let's congratulate and support the coffee maker companies who DIDN'T try this.

      We need to engender fear in the heart of every executive who would even CONSIDER this insanity. So I say fuck them-- let their company suffer from their idiocy and let others learn from their failure.

      If this news makes you want to reconsider a keurig machine, re-reconsider. There are plenty of other great alternatives. And that goes for printer makers and anyone else who's thinking about going in this direction.

      In other words, you're advocating to never forgive them for their mistakes. If you can lead a huge multinational business and never make a single mistake, ever, then congratulations to you, but the rest of us are only human. The idea may have been stupid, yes, but everyone screws up at some points in their life. If they continue to make these choices, then yes, I'm sure people will switch, but one failed marketing line shouldn't prevent you from ever using their coffee makers again. Seems a shame to lose a very convenient and otherwise decent coffee maker over a petty grudge - although, since I don't own one, I am admittedly only assuming it's convenient.

      --
      "Set a man a fire, he'll be warm for the rest of the night. Set a man afire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life."
    7. Re:Yep, they were... by jrminter · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Earlier this year our Keurig brewer needed to be replaced. Went to the store and got a new one. Got it home and our existing K-cups wouldn't work - they were the old version. Called Keurig - they told me they would replace my cups. Told them that wasn't good enough because I didn't want to worry every time we bought cups. The rep said there was nothing she could do. Told her she lost a customer for life.

      Took the brewer back, got a refund. Ordered a Mr Coffee version that is quite acceptable. Use whatever cups I want. Hope their management lose their jobs over this one. First rule of business is to treat your customers with respect or they (we) will find vendors who will. Interestingly enough, everybody figured out how to defeat their DRM. Keurig alienated customers and competitors found a workaround. Queue up Nelson Munch: "Haa Haa."

    8. Re:Yep, they were... by xevioso · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's not an issue of a mere mistake. It's primarily a bad business decision, but also a very cynical one. I can forgive the bad business decision...companies make those all the time. It's the TYPE of business decision it was, which was an attempt to hijack choice away from consumers, which affects people personally when they use this machine for their coffee. That's something people will have a hard time forgiving.

    9. Re:Yep, they were... by Imagix · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I have to disagree with you. This wasn't a case of "hey, let's try this new, innovative thing" followed by "whups, unintended consequences, we need to stop doing that". This was a case of "Hey, those printer ink guys can get away with this stunt, and the software guys can get away with this stunt. So what if the actual consumers of both of those things abhor the idea. We're gonna do it anyway because more $$$$!" followed by "Oh wait, our customers have a choice to do something else with their coffee, so they're not buying our stuff anymore. Well, lets put out a 'oops' statement, and perhaps let a few more people use our DRM thingy." There needs to be _punishment_ for this. A failed marketing line was New Coke. This is quite a bit different.

    10. Re:Yep, they were... by Shadow+of+Eternity · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This isn't just a "mistake", DRM is an abhorrent violation of the most fundamental consumer rights. The shattered and flayed corpses of companies that go down that road should be left impaled along the roadways as a warning to the next TEN GENERATIONS not to fuck with this.

      --
      A bullet may have your name on it but splash damage is addressed "To whom it may concern."
    11. Re:Yep, they were... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It was greed. The old saying goes: You can sheer a sheep many times, but you can only skin it once.

    12. Re:Yep, they were... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Exactly. Here's why: they were always this way (since their rebirth). I'm sure Tassimo and Nespresso are doing just fine. They started with a closed system and people accepted it.

      Keurig put DRM on their non-DRM product.

      The moral of the story? Open sourcing is a one-way street. Don't you open source your product, don't ever think of close sourcing it.

    13. Re:Yep, they were... by Spamalope · · Score: 5, Insightful

      They tried to screw us consumers, and we were able to stop them. They didn't think better of it and stop, it's purely that they couldn't profit from it.

    14. Re:Yep, they were... by penguinoid · · Score: 5, Insightful

      In other words, you're advocating to never forgive them for their mistakes.

      How about we forgive them when they fire the people responsible for "mistakenly" deciding to intentionally screw their customers?

      --
      Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
    15. Re: Yep, they were... by O('_')O_Bush · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Forgiveness works with rational humans who function under ethics, but corporations in capitalism aren't that. Corporations are psychopaths working to figure out ways to take advantage of consumers. That is their modus operandi.

      We aren't advocating not forgiving the company, we are advocating making an example of the company so that the other psychopaths see there are real, severe consequences to this kind of behavior.

      Is that fair to GM? Maybe not, but neither is the rest of reality, and it is better for the rest of us that it is that way.

      --
      while(1) attack(People.Sandy);
  2. Plan to "license more outside brands"? by volkerdi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If their plan is to get more third parties to go along with their DRM, then they haven't really learned a thing yet.

    1. Re:Plan to "license more outside brands"? by sjames · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I would say if they haven't started shipping units with the DRM disabled at the factory, they haven't yet gotten the message.

      Really they should do that and provide existing customers with a freedom clip if they want to salvage their sales (and stock value) for the year.

  3. stuuupid by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Coffee is pouring hot water on ground beans. DRM'd Dispensers try to ignore that fact.

  4. I'd like to see the environmental nightmare die by msobkow · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Personally I'd like to see the environmental nightmare of the Keurig and Tassimo curl up and die.

    --
    I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
    1. Re:I'd like to see the environmental nightmare die by Wycliffe · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Personally I'd like to see the environmental nightmare of the Keurig and Tassimo curl up and die.

      I own a keurig and a half dozen reusable pods that I throw in the dishwasher. I actually waste less coffee, coffee filters, etc.. now that I own a keurig and I like that I can make a single cup of coffee in the morning without any waste. I used the 20 pods that came free with my keurig but I haven't bought any since. I don't understand why people continue to buy those overpriced pieces of plastic when the same exact coffee is a fraction of the cost. Are people really that lazy that they can't spend 3 seconds dumping the old grounds in the trash?

  5. I almost bought a 2.0 DRMed... by Ducho_CWB · · Score: 5, Insightful

    While looking for a coffee machine, I liked one of this 2.0 Keurig models.
    Then I learned about this "only keurig aproved" cups and actually bought an 1.0 keurig machine instead.
    And using this 1.0 model I can't see a reason for one buy a 2.0 model.

  6. They could have, if they were not stupid... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They could have gotten away with it if they had been smarter about it.

    K-cup is popular.

    The 2.0 machine will do things like espresso, and it needs the smarts to do it,

    If they had set the machine to treat K-cups without the chips just like the old machine did, no one would have cared.

    As more of the featurefull drinks became more popular, more drinks would move over to that.

    10 years out, when people are drinking a LOT more of the drinks that use the new features, your making a LOT more money.

    Oh, wait, that doesn't drive everyone else out of the market. But it sells a lot more machines and a lot more licences to make drinks using the new features.

  7. The best thing Keurig can do is die by TsuruchiBrian · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I am not even opposed to DRM per se. DRM as a means of piracy prevention is fair (although it's rarely implemented in a good way). DRM as a means of vendor lock in is completely unacceptable. If Keurig somehow remains successful, it reinforces the precedent that dabbling with vendor lock in is ok, as long as you apologize when it becomes a PR problem. What would be better is if a huge company goes bankrupt over it, and scares other companies from trying the same thing.

    1. Re:The best thing Keurig can do is die by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The fact that you can't think of a good way to implement DRM, doesn't mean that a good way doesn't/can't exist.

      No, it's the fact that no one can think of a good way to implement DRM. At least, it hasn't happened yet, and a lot of human effort has been spent on it.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  8. *Cough* Bullshit by mysidia · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The company says they now plan to license more outside brands, and bring back “My K-Cup” reusable filters.

    If they really believed they were wrong about the things they were actually wrong about, then they would Open-Source the DRM technology and make the interoperability specs public domain, and stop trying to charge licensing dollars.

  9. It's over now by bobjr94 · · Score: 1, Insightful

    People have found different brands they like better, they have no reason to come back. Licensing more bands of pods to work with your DRM machines is not the same as getting rid of it. People know that and will continue to avoid them.

    They had a good thing 2-3 years ago, every office and kitchen had a Keurig. they got greedy and lost it all. Like the story of the farmer killing the goose that lays the golden eggs, to try and get all the gold at once.