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Gates, Zuckerberg Promising Same Jobs To US Kids and Foreign H-1B Workers?
theodp writes: Over at the Bill Gates and Mark Zuckerberg-bankrolled Code.org, they're using the number of open computing jobs in each state to convince parents of the need to expand K-12 CS offerings so their kids can fill those jobs. Sounds good, right? But at the same time, the Gates and Zuckerberg-bankrolled FWD.org PAC has taken to Twitter, using the number of open "STEM" jobs in each state to convince politicians of the need to expand the number of H-1B visas so foreign workers can fill those jobs. While the goal of Microsoft's 'two-pronged' National Talent Strategy is to kill two birds [K-12 CS education and H-1B visas] with one crisis, is it fair for organizations backed by many of the same wealthy individuals to essentially promise the same jobs to U.S. kids and foreign H-1B workers?
Its hard not to be cynical when this is how the wealthy use their influence in a society that actively caters to them. I'm glad Slashdot keeps reporting on these issues, and I hope we will support and punish as appropriate candidates who oppose H1B. I hope we will have our own movement and do our own work in as many different social avenues as we can to defeat attempts to make things harder for us for the sole reason of lining the pockets of the wealthy more than they already are.
"Nobody's going to hold you up and carry you around...If you're not going to work hard enough to be qualified to get the job...well then, you don't deserve the job."
And part of WORKING HARD ENOUGH is WORKING CHEAP ENOUGH.
Remember kids -- you got give us MORE FOR LESS if you want to make it in today's Globalized Economy. Just being a US Citizen doesn't mean you deserve to work in the US. Why should we "Carry You Around" if we can import workers willing to work for the equivalent wage they'd get in Bangalore while working in San Jose and will even offer to CARRY US AROUND the corporate campus in Rickshaws and Litters in their off hours?
This is why we need to revamp the educational system in America -- to train young thralls how to compete in the workplace of the future
As an actual economist, I can safely say that your explanation of labor markets is 100% bollocks.
You have no idea what you are talking about.
Bay Area hiring manager. New average college grads are paid $100K+ - H1-B, F1, or US citizen.
If ARE you in the Bay area getting paid 40K then look for another job, today. Those H1-Bs are **PORTABLE**. You can get another job as easily as anyone else, just gotta drop a FYI form into the mail moving the visa to the new employer. You can change employers immediately, you don't even need to wait for the change of employer form to be processed (just make *sure* it is filled out properly). The H1-B is not indentured servitude, you can compete for jobs with everyone else.
The H1-B does affect supply and demand, but not in the way you people all think. The supply is global. If there is no local supply. The demand moves offshore.
You know what happens when I try and try and try and fail to hire enough developers in the Bay area (for anywhere from $100K to $500K+ depending on experience)? The project gets done anyway, but the work gets moved to Canada or India or China where the visa issue doesn't restrict my ability to hire.
I'd rather relocate those people to the Bay area - pay them competitive local wages, have them pay local taxes, spend money in the local economy etc. But becuase of visa caps I can't do that. Having a distributed team across timezones causes a *lot* more problems than simply paying a competitive local wage. If I apply for a H1-B for them they have about a 30% chance of being picked in the lottery each year. I can't run my business with that level of uncertainty, so the jobs go offshore!!! I fail to see how that is a good outcome for the US.
Where the H1-Bs *ARE* badly badly abused is by Indian outsoucing companies, not by places like Microsoft. It gets abused in two ways:
1) They will bring in one barely qualified person as a local contact on a H1-B visa. That person will interact with the client and send all the work to be done overnight in India.
2) They will bring in barely qualified workers, train them (to replace expensive US workers), then send them back to India to continue for less money. The way the visa laws are written - the the visas are only for TEMPORARY workers - all but encourages this!!!
Tightening up on the above two would seriously improve the H1-B situation for legitimate US companies. It's not the current requirements, but the job should be for an *ongoing* position, not just temporary. If you've got a history of using H1-Bs for short term contracts then no more visas for you Mr off-shoring company.
I wouldn't worry. The truth is that you can't train someone to have an aptitude for something. There's a strong undercurrent of positivism in modern educational dogma: "You can be anything you want!" The sad truth is: no you can't. Everyone has certain aptitudes and certain potential. The current initiatives like code.org will turn out people who can put a few things together, follow recipes they find online, etc. But at the end of the day, it won't increase the number of people who have an aptitude to excel in the field. Also, there's the interest factor. Some people consider software development tedious and boring. These initiatives won't change that.
Completely true.
Let's give an anecdotal example to support this:
Me.
I am a glazier and ironworker by trade. Building large / institutional and commercial buildings is my experience and early background.
I live in Edmonton, Alberta.
In the 80's while running a commercial glass company, my hobby was mini and early personal computers.
In the early 90's there was more demand for my skills in computing than in construction, so I opened a business supplying and manufacturing mass storage devices.
In the mid 2000's I was faced with 2 crises:
First off the fluctuating exchange rates cost us a lot of money.
Secondly, the "Chinafication" of the industry killed off all the North American hardware companies.
Including mine. I am sure that low labour costs had nothing to do with that..
Fortunately for me, my original trades now pay over $60 per hour, due to guess what?
Shortage of skilled labour.
> That is, increasing supply lowers prices but it also increases volume, also for labor.
Except when it doesn't. "Supply increases volume" only when then suppliers _believe_ that there is a profit available, and excess supply often saturates the market. Otherwise, all the empty storefronts I see on one block on my way to work would be filled with active hair salons, unlike the three competing salons on that block that are all going out of business.