Ask Slashdot: Have You Tried a Standing Desk?

An anonymous reader writes: Evidence is piling up that sitting down all day is really bad for you. I work primarily from home, and as I grow older, I'm starting to worry about long term consequences to riding a desk full-time. We talked about this a few years ago, but the science has come a long way since then, and so have the options for standing desks. My questions: do you use a standing desk? What kind of setup do you have? There are a lot of options, and a lot of manufacturers. Further studies have questioned the wisdom of standing all day, so I've been thinking about a standing/sitting combo, and just switching every so often. If you do this, do you have time limits or a particular frequency with which you change from sitting to standing?

I'm also curious about under-desk treadmills — I could manage slowly walking during parts of my work, and the health benefits are easy to measure. Also, any ergonomic tips? A lot of places seem to recommend: forearms parallel to the ground, top of monitor at eye level, and a pad for under your feet. Has your experience been the same? Those of you who have gone all-out on a motorized setup, was it worth the cost? The desks are dropping in price, but I can still see myself dropping upward of $1k on this, easily.

Comments

Need to be adjustable

[DoofusOfDeath]

I worked for one year at a company which offers standing desks. I found them to be pretty nice. It was hard to gauge productivity, because it was also my only time in an open office, so there were lots of other distractions I wasn't used to.

I'm in my early 40's, and I'm starting to run into a variety of back problems from poor posture / poor back muscle tone, as well as carpal tunnel and medial nerve (funny bone) problems from the way I rest my arms on the desk when coding. A standing desk helps with pretty much all of those things, if it can be easily readjusted over the course of the day to accommodate you need to both sit and stand.

The biggest problem is that decent standing desks aren't cheap, and companies treat them like a luxury. I seriously think there's a case for OSHA forcing companies to offer adjustable desks to office workers. Unfortunately, national politics don't currently favor such actions becoming reality.

If I have enough negotiating power, I'll make a standing desk a requirement for any future job I take.

Re:Need to be adjustable

[spune]

Thanks to anti-worker or at best worker-apathetic politics and budget priorities, it's hard to get OSHA to force companies to even offer sufficient protection from hazardous chemicals like hexavalent chromium. The car parts factory in my town with several hundred employees on the shop floor was giving workers latex gloves and dust masks for protection while chroming bumpers until it was hit with a whopping $10,000 fine after many years.

The darkly amusing punchline to this anecdote is that the guy who owns the factory & built his fortune with it has given millions of dollars to the local university to help them put up a new building for their school of medicine.

Re:Need to be adjustable

[Demonoid-Penguin]

I think that the adjustable standing desks are on over complicated solution to the problem. Use fixed standing desk with a drafting stool.

I just put milk crates under the desks - perfect height to change the standard sitting desk to a standing desk.

I don't think either sitting or standing is better, or less worse. As others have pointed out, it's maintaining static positions that cause problems in the long-term. I first noticed this years ago when smoking was less frowned upon (but banned indoors) - the people who smoked seemed to complain less of sore backs and seemed to maintain better postures. The non-smokers spent longer continuous periods at their desks (and the labs had standing desks). It's also an issue of eye strain from continuous focus at a fixed length - and mental productivity (hard to think long and hard while at a keyboard).

These days you can have a standing desk if you want - I'll put it up on milk crates. Yes it's perfectly stable and doesn't affect the adjustable keyboard/mouse section or the adjustable monitor stands. The chair slides underneath the raised desk. I've gone back to the old separate room for printers which encourages people to move away from their desks (as does banning drinks and food at desks). One thing I found that also helps is close access to an outdoor area that isn't one, unbroken open space, with only one access door - so if you have your head full of something you're working on you can walk outside without having to break your concentration. (obviously I don't follow people with a stopwatch).

Gone the other way

[Jamu]

I've gone the other way. The couch desk. Actually it's more like just a couch.

Re:Gone the other way

[Anonymous Coward]

We had a guy here with serious back problems. He had a doctor that recommended that he be allowed to have a couch in his office. I eventually found it prudent to knock loudly and wait a bit for him to wake up before entering his office to talk to him.

A Soviet comic once said

[mi]

Sitting causes hypertension, standing — thrombophlebitis. Whatever you do to a human being, he stubbornly crawls towards cemetery.

— Mikhail Zhvanetsky

rocking shoes

[Immerman]

I've been dabbling with standing desks a lot, and am getting to really like them, except that I find standing for extended periods considerably more uncomfortable than walking. I've considered doing the treadmill-desk thing, but don't really have the space for it. What I did find helps a lot is "rocker-bottom" shoes with thick curved soles such as Shape-Ups. The instability encourages me to be constantly moving and flexing my knees, drastically reducing the discomfort of standing still without requiring any expensive space-filling treadmills.

Cardboard box

[jonathan.e.bell]

I have a laptop where I work, and I periodically stick a cardboard box under my laptop and stand up at my desk. Maybe it's not ideal, but for the price I find it acceptable. You could always try this before you decide to shell out the 1k+, it's not like your body knows the difference. Also, as far as frequency goes, I did the whole 20 minutes/5 minutes thing, though I often forgot to sit down after five minutes.

I just lowered my standing desk

[gurps_npc]

First, the reason the standing desk works is that it forces you to use your muscles.

This is called "PHYSICAL LABOR".

It may be a foreign concept to you. If so, keep in mind that some symptoms of physical labor are muscle fatigue and pain after extended time.

Most people use the standing desk on/off. Some of them mostly use it off.

Also note that given that you are on slashdot during business hours. You might not feel comfortable using a standing desk - and the extra attention it brings - while looking at slashdot or other non-work related web sites.

A standing desk, if you use it consistently, will work in that it will keep you in better physical condition. But only if you are the kind of guy that will put up with PHYSICAL LABOR.

Most people that suddenly decide to try physical labor hate it and quickly quit. It's similar to a gym membership.

ikea hack for over a year, will never go back

[Ionized]

using the ikea LACK side table on top of my normal desk, which puts my keyboard and mouse right and hand-height. You can use a circular saw to cut the legs off to your exact specifications.
+ tall VIVO desk mount monitor stand, which raises the monitor & laptop to eye height.
+ hog heaven floor mat to stand on.

The rare times I need to sit, I just unplug my laptop and take it over to a chair. In theory, the monitor height is easily adjustable via a fast-latch, and the ikea stand can be removed, so within a minute I could be back to a normal desk - but i find the change of environment from disconnecting and moving to a separate space is more relaxing.

My lower back used to hurt CONSTANTLY, but since I've been standing it has been a night-and-day improvement. I can't recommend it enough. the transition period was surprisingly easy. I suggest taking your chair away completely for the first week or two - if it's nearby you will be tempted to cheat, and far more likely to give up, I think.

I use a Geekdesk Max

[Sycraft-fu]

Works very well. You can set it at any height you like. Not too expensive either, at least as compared to other motorized adjustable desks. I'm pleased with it overall.

Re:My back hurts

[gbjbaanb]

your problem is possibly down to sitting around too much, one day you'll be stuck in that chair 24/7. Not good.

the answer is to get up and start using those muscles that have forgotten what they're there for,

How real is the risk?

[Anonymous Coward]

I find it suspicious that sitting is suddenly mega-dangerous. I'm sure there are risks but they seem a bit exaggerated. Is this the new "fish oil" scam? A lot of the expensive standing desks and treadmills certainly look like a nice way to make money.

Re:If you're adding a treadmill, you'd better be $

[hjf]

My solution to the whole "not sitting around" bit has been to avoid long stints in heads-down dev roles. Instead, I walk around a lot talking to people, go for walks/runs/bikes, park a good half-mile or more away from the office, etc.

So... you became a manager?

Been standing for years...

[cplusplus]

Here's a previous reply I made on the same subject:

I'm a coder who stands all day ...and I've been doing it for over two years now. I used to experience back pain when I sat all day, but that went away after a month or so. I used to get sleepy after lunch when I sat all day... not so much anymore. You really do get used to it. A few suggestions for those who want to try it:

1) Make the switch the first day you get back from a longer holiday and are already out of your normal routine.

2) You *must* get a nice floor mat, preferably a dense memory foam mat designed for standing cubes. Working in your socks (if your employer will let you) while standing on said mat almost feels like a foot massage.

3) Another *must* - don't get a desk-height chair! At least, not for a while. You'll find yourself sitting way too often and never get adjusted to standing all day. Most of my fellow "standing" co-workers that have tall chairs sit at least 80% of the time.

4) It takes a couple weeks to get used to standing. Stick with it.

Re:Been standing for years...

[PPalmgren]

I'm a coder who stands all day ...and I've been doing it for over two years now. I used to experience back pain when I sat all day, but that went away after a month or so.

Interesting to hear your anecdote, but just wanted to make sure on something...do you keep your wallet in your back pocket? This results in a very significant percentage of men's back problems in office environments. My back pain went away when moving the wallet to the front pocket, no change in sitting/standing required.

Re:Yes, the $20 ikea hack.

[war4peace]

Agreed. I found that static positions (no matter which kind, standing, sitting, laid down) are harmful in the long end. What I did to alleviate the issue:
- Got a wireless headset. During meetings, I walk around all the time, except when presenting something, of course.
- Got wireless mouse and keyboard. I can now shift positions in my chair easily
- Got used to above-mentioned position shifting. For example, I rotate my chair 180 degrees and lean forward on the back support, etc.
- Developed conscious realization of my static position. I learned to pay attention to what my body tells me. Whenever I get those signals, I shift position.

Re:yes. tried one.

[Anubis IV]

This. The real problem isn't sitting or standing: it's being still.

As standing desks have become more of a fad in the last few years, longer-term research is finally starting to come out regarding their effects, and everything I've seen so far indicates that its users are basically just trading one set of issues with sitting desks (i.e. circulatory problems, certain spinal issues, heart problems) for a different set of issues with standing desks (i.e. foot problems, different spinal issues, heart problems).

In both cases, the research is indicating that simply increasing the amount of activity in your routine alleviates the worst of the concerns, which is why it's so important to build regular breaks into your day where you get up and stretch, walk around, or at the very least do something that gets you out of your usual position, whether that's sitting or standing.

Standing has the benefit of predisposing its practitioners towards more regular activity, which can be a benefit, to be sure, but if all you're doing is trading sitting for standing without otherwise changing your routine, you really aren't going to see a net improvement. At best, you'll see a temporary relief of the symptoms specific to sitting before you start to develop the symptoms specific to standing.

Re:yes. tried one.

[gfxguy]

Easier - include an elevated chair so that the desk does not have to be adjusted. I read recently (within past six months) that walking for five minutes undoes the damage of an hour of sitting. I probably read it here, in fact. If we just take a five minute walk break every hour, it wouldn't be so bad. Personally, I gave up snacking while working (yes, another fat computer programmer, reformed) and drink water instead... which makes me have to go to the bathroom a lot, which gets me moving a lot.