Intel and Micron Unveil 3D XPoint Memory, 1000x Speed and Endurance Over Flash

MojoKid writes: Today at a press conference in San Francisco, Intel and Micron unveiled 3D XPoint (Cross Point) memory technology, a non-volatile memory architecture they claim could change the landscape of consumer electronics and computer architectures for years to come. Intel and Micron say 3D XPoint memory is 1000 times faster than NAND, boasts 1000x the endurance of NAND, and offers 8-10 times the density of conventional memory. 3D XPoint isn't electron based, it's material based. The companies aren't diving into specifics yet surrounding the materials used in 3D XPoint, but the physics are fundamentally different than what we're used to. It's 3D stackable and its cross point connect structure allows for dense packing and individual access at the cell level from the top or bottom of a memory array. Better still, Intel alluded to 3D XPoint not being as cost-prohibitive as you might expect. Intel's Rob Crooke explained, "You could put the cost somewhere between NAND and DRAM." Products with the new memory are expected to arrive in 2016 and the joint venture is in production with wafers now.

Comments

Isn't electron based, it's material based?

[Burdell]

And what material are they using? Positronic unobtanium?

Re:Isn't electron based, it's material based?

[omnichad]

No - green marker on the edge.

memresistor?

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/tech...

"By contrast, 3D XPoint works by changing the properties of the material that makes up its memory cells to either having a high resistance to electricity to represent a one or a low resistance to represent a zero."

Sounds like a memresistor?

Re:memresistor?

[under_score]

A non volatile PC would be nice.

No it wouldn't. Not unless we go back to having hard reset buttons on the front of our machines. The distinction between volatile and non-volatile memory is useful since we still have such shitty software full of bugs and security flaws. I wan't to be able to "reset" my machine without having to erase my hard disk.

Re:memresistor?

[Archwyrm]

No, you can still soft reset. Once the kernel gets reloaded (by powering on/off and handled by the boot loader) then effectively everything in a section of your "disk" reserved for process memory ("volatile memory") goes *poof* because the new kernel isn't tracking any of it.

Additionally with a non-volatile memory the system could be "suspended to disk" / hibernated simply by syncing all pending writes and powering off. In most cases a 1000 ms operation. Resuming would have similar performance. The machine could also resize "volatile memory" dynamically. Think growing/shrinking your /dev/mem file. You wouldn't necessarily need to have it all contiguous or represented with a single file either. Certain applications would have an expectation of contiguous memory though.

Newegg

[Snufu]

As with any new 'pewter tech, I'll believe it when when it I see it on Newegg with >500 reviews, > 3.5 stars, and affordable for the average Jane/Joe.

Re:Newegg

[tomxor]

Usually i'd agree... there's been countless up and coming new types of memory that never make it.

But i'm cautiously optomistic here because

a) It's Intel and not some tiny obscure VC

b) they said they already have wafers and mention 2016 O_o !

no wonder they ditched their awesome SSD controllers.

Re:Newegg

[Anonymous Coward]

> It's DRAM that's in the crosshairs.

Only to a small extent. This would reduce the need for DRAM cache of SSD data. Computers will still need huge amounts of DRAM for workspace. Workspace memory needs trillions of times more write cycles than this provides.

Re:Newegg

[TeknoHog]

As with any new 'pewter tech,

this one is also based on alloyed tin.

Re:Newegg

[mr_mischief]

It honestly depends on how they measure endurance. If it's measured as 1000x the 3 million writes, then no. If it's 1000x the three-year estimated wear-out time under consumer conditions, then that's phenomenal.

A memristor or something else?

[cruff]

The press release is lacking a lot of details, but the storage cells are two terminal devices. Sounds similar to the memristor.

Re:Ohh Ohh

[ArcadeMan]

And I already know how we're going to erase that memory.

Re:Cost?

[duckintheface]

I don't usually bother to make negative comments, but this is too much. If their claim is true, then the memory would cost the same per bit of memory and 8 to 10 times as much per unit of volume. Got it? And it is not really important how much it costs per unit volume. It's just important that the memory will not take up much space. You really need to slow down and work on your critical thinking skills. /rant

bottlenecks

[peterpolle78]

At the end of the interview some guy asked a very good question. If it is really 1000 times faster you will end up with a bottleneck as even SATA 3 is nowhere fast enough. If this memory have to be used to its fullest for a normal consumer playing games for example, you need new kind of motherboards also.

Re:bottlenecks

[wonkey_monkey]

From the BBC:

Rather than pitch it as a replacement for either flash storage or RAM (random access memory), the company suggests it will be used alongside them to hold certain data "closer" to a processor so that it can be accessed more quickly than before.

Re:bottlenecks

[silas_moeckel]

M.2 is the desktop interface for this, it supports 4 PCI 3.0 lanes at 985 MB/s per lane that is nearly 4GB/s. PCI 4.0 is not to far off and doubles that.

Re:bottlenecks

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.overclock.net/t/1489684/ssd-interface-comparison-pci-express-vs-sata

It's almost like that problem has already been thought of. Go figure.

Re:bottlenecks

[Tower]

You just attach it directly to the PCIe bus with a dedicated controller like PCIe SSDs today rather than through the existing SATA ports http://www.engadget.com/2015/0... . Over time, the other interfaces will catch up. x4 Gen3 PCIe goes pretty quickly...

Re:bottlenecks

[Forever Wondering]

SATA 3.2 (aka SATA Express) is a connector change, but is actually PCIe. PCIe is already fast enough. IIRC, Apple hooks up some SSDs directly through PCIe.

And, PCIe can actually go "off board" via a cable (since PCIe is based on separate upstream/downstream lanes and differential line drivers). Also, PCIe 4.0 will have a transfer rate of 31.5 GB/s, yet be fully backward/forward compatible.

Intel already has a CPU package that has two substrates wire bonded together, one for CPU and one for memory. When I saw this, I assumed it would be to accomodate HP's memrister memory. But, now, it's [obviously] been planned for this new type of memory.

Re:Cost?

[Anonymous Coward]

I just bought 16 GiB RAM for $100, and 250 GiB nand flash for $100. This will put the price somewhere between $0.40/GiB and $6.25/GiB. So, taking an average, I'll guess that we can expect to see it priced at around $3.3/GiB. Or, about 8 times as much. :-)

Seems Not

[DumbSwede]

from the The Register

An Intel spokesperson categorically denied that it was a phase-change memory process or a memristor technology. Spin-transfer torque was also dismissed. Whatever it is, Intel and Micron have been developing it for about ten years.

Re:Seems Not

[Anonymous Coward]

They can deny all they want - intel has been filing patents on a new type of GST PCM left and right over the last 6 years.

Re:Seems Not

[mr_mischief]

Nanoscale slider switches? ;-)

Seriously, though, it's some sort of material change according to what little information has been released.:

These columns contain a memory cell and a selector, but the real innovation is that unlike other technologies, which store data by trapping electrons in insulators (and other electron trapping techniques), 3D XPoint stores data by using the property change of the material itself. This bulk material property change utilizes the entire portion of the memory cell, which increases scalability and performance.

-- Tom's Hardware

What's really interesting is the PDF with one diagram showing Xpoint sooner and then 3D XPoint on the 2018-2019 timeline at Semicon Taiwan that later has a diagram much similar to Intel/Micron's diagram. It appears to be showing a variable resistor (potentiometer) then a diode between the word line and bit line crossbars.

If they are building a materials-based variable resistor that gets written to be more or less resistive based on voltage what are they calling that process? It needn't be chalcogenide, but it sure sounds like some other sort of phase change to change the resistance. If it is memory that adjusts its resistance based on past voltages and uses that resistance for reading the value, that sounds like a memristor. (According to Chua all PCM, ReRAM, and MRAM are memristors.)

I think perhaps Intel and Micron are saying it's not PCM and it's not memristors just so people don't confuse it with other attempts at similar but different approaches.

Ram replacement?

[duckintheface]

There has been some discussion http://bit.ly/1SLtYAh that 3D XPoint might be a replacement for RAM in mobile devices because it is "ram-like" in speed and low power due to the fact that it's non-volatile. If this can replace RAM and NAND in phones and tablets, it will be a major milestone in the history of computing.

Re:Ram replacement?

[Anonymous Coward]

At "up to" 1000x the endurance of NAND? Who wants RAM cells that die after "up to" 300k writes?

Re:Ram replacement?

[duckintheface]

If we are talking MLC NAND, you are off by a factor of 10. http://www.anandtech.com/show/...

But since the XPoint cells are individually addressable bit by bit, the comparison is probably to SLC, in which case the relevant number of P/E cycles for XPoint would be 10E8 and you are off by a factor of more than 33,000.

Re:Ram replacement?

[omnichad]

The 1000x durability wasn't based on writes alone. In fact, they even say it's "not significantly impacted by the number of write cycles"

Re:Ram replacement?

[Anonymous Coward]

1 Performance difference based on comparison between 3D XPoint technology and other industry NAND
2 Density difference based on comparison between 3D XPoint technology and other industry DRAM
3 Endurance difference based on comparison between 3D XPoint technology and other industry NAND

They don't actually specify *what* NAND.
So assuming typical marketing weasels, that means it's 1000x the worst TLC they could find anywhere - and that's typically rated at 300 P/E cycles.

But since the XPoint cells are individually addressable bit by bit, the comparison is probably to SLC

Yes, they totally wouldn't write "1000x the endurance of industry-leading IMFT SLC NAND" if that were the case...

in which case the relevant number of P/E cycles for XPoint would be 10E8 and you are off by a factor of more than 33,000.

Would you like a bridge with that?

Re:Ram replacement?

[duckintheface]

Hmmm. You do have a point. :)

Re:Soooo you're saying

[cdrudge]

Wake me when they've actually gone plaid.

How does it compare to RAM, though?

[wonkey_monkey]

Intel and Micron say 3D XPoint memory is 1000 times faster than NAND, boasts 1000x the endurance of NAND, and offers 8-10 times the density of conventional memory.

How does the speed compare to conventional memory, though?

Re:cost per bit...

[mlts]

I can see this being used two ways:

A fast SSD.

A swap device/slow RAM.

This can make things interesting for SANs, especially because it adds another tier to the disk type hierarchy.

I'd like to see it used as a cache, as well for swap and the core OS files so booting is made quicker. However, it would be useful for database index volumes as well.

But is is crystalline?

[DarthVain]

But is is crystalline and available in pretty glowy colours? Because otherwise I don't want it. For too long we have been waiting for our 3D crystals that are memory devices in science fiction, and now we better get 'em!

Retention time?

[Tapewolf]

How long is it able to retain the data and under what range of conditions? Currently this is one of the big problems with flash, where small-process TLC memory is so fragile that reading it damages the contents, much like core.

Re:Crooke

[Anonymous Coward]

Too good to be true? The guy's name is Crooke...

Well, we don’t hold it against you that your name is Wanker.

Re:Looks Great, Beware?

[viperidaenz]

Of course it's a government conspiracy.
Who do you think they orchestrated the phase out of tin foil and replaced it with alunimium foil?

PalmOS

[DrYak]

However, current operating systems and programming techniques aren't up to this yet. It will take a long time.

PalmOS has been 100% RAM-only from the original Palm Pilot all the way up to Palm Thungsten III (Palm T5 with Flash, and Palm Live with a micro drive where the first to actually have a permanent main storage).
Everything is in-RAM, everything is stored in in-RAM databases. Data saving is immediate, etc.

(Also, although not so extreme:
lots of embed system, usually Linux-based, only have a minimal amount of ROM as sole storage and mainly work using RAM. Though they aren't completely in-RAM oriented and still use the concept of "files" and "storage", and thus make use of ramdisk (usually tmpfs) to hold files.
Still, that also machine which mainly count on RAM storage).

Thank me

[marciot]

You can thank me for this being announced now, because I *just* bought a SSD last week. You're very welcome.

MRAM?

[Taco Cowboy]

This '3D Xpoint memory' sounds very much like MRAM as described by the following article

http://spectrum.ieee.org/semic...

Last year (2014) Samsung reportedly was collaborating with 15 partners in developing similar spintronic MRAM memory technology

http://www.mram-info.com/samsu...

Hynix and Toshiba also partnered to develop their own version of MRAM

http://phys.org/news/2014-04-f...

In less than 5 years we might get to enjoy the fruits of the labor of the thousands of researchers who have been working very hard to make the spintronic dream come true, and I for one, wish to take this chance to thank them for their hard works!